377: The Man Who Claimed a "BLACKOUT" After Murdering a Police Officer...

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She was the one that people called when they were in danger.

But on September the 14th, 2015, when 36 year old police officer Catherine Campbell didn't show it for a 530 shift at work.

Alarm bells rang immediately.

Catherine was never unreliable. She wasn't reckless.

She was described as courageous, driven, deeply committed to serving others.

She was still outside her apartment.

Her cats had no food or water.

Her alarm was going off and her phone was dead.

At first, police said there was no signs of foul play.

Then investigators pulled CCTV.

And what they saw would haunt the city.

A man dragging a green compost bin through the streets of Halifax in the early hours of the morning.

Stopping.

Returning without it.

Inside that bin was the answer to what happened to Catherine.

Who was he?

What happened after they left it downtown bar together?

And how did a night out end in one of Nova Scotia's most disturbing murders?

I'm Emma Kenney. Welcome to Bang to Rights.

The deep dive crime podcast which takes you through some of the most heinous crimes the world has ever seen.

Let's talk about amazing Catherine Campbell.

She was 36 years of age when she failed to turn up for work in September 2015.

This was so unusual.

In fact, it was to some degree unthinkable.

She was not the kind of person that would ever relate.

She would never let anyone down.

She was considered an outstanding police officer.

She was a dedicated volunteer firefighter.

I mean, could she be any more community minded?

She was a dependable, courageous, deeply committed human being.

And when she doesn't turn up for work, immediately people smell something is off.

And as the hours pass,

concern basically turns to dread.

It's as simple as that.

This is a woman who was a protector.

She was a helper.

She was the person that people relied upon.

And the idea that she might be in danger,

which is genuinely what people started to begin to consider pretty immediately,

it was almost impossible to comprehend.

Christine was born on January the 15th, 1979.

Her parents were Susan and Dwight Campbell.

She was born in Stellaton, Nova Scotia.

She had a brother, Jarra and a sister, Amy.

And a father was the chief of the Stellaton volunteer fire department.

They're very proud that she becomes a volunteer fire person.

Demonstrates the kind of mentorship he must have had in her life.

I always find that really wonderful.

When you see a child following their parents' footsteps,

because it's not just about the job.

It's what the job symbolizes for the child.

It's a connection to their parent.

It's a way of saying that they're proud of the parent

and that they respect what their parent does.

And I think that really does symbolize what's going on in this family,

the fact that she wants to follow in his footsteps

demonstrates a closeness and connection.

Now, Katherine actually began spending time at the station,

apparently as soon as she could walk.

My own husband, his father, was a firefighter.

And he remembers exactly the same being taken there,

being given pens to draw with and play with and all the firemen around him.

And just he remembers those days with absolute joy.

So she's in that situation and again, that mentorship is there

and psychologically that's powerful.

And apparently it was very clear for a really young age.

She just wanted to make a difference.

She wanted to serve the community.

And a lot of us can imagine ourselves in lots of roles.

But certainly for me, being a volunteer firefighter is not one of them.

First of all, you don't get paid to risk your life.

And that might seem a little bit shallow.

But actually, when you are literally risking your life to save other people,

you would imagine you would get some money from that.

The very fact that she's willing to do that for free.

It demonstrates the kind of empathy that she has in compassion.

She has for her community.

But also that vocational connection.

She is somebody who wants to serve.

And she was described by people who knew her as being really adventurous,

really determined, incredibly strong, very sweet.

And apparently there was one time when she was eight years of age.

When Katherine had decided, I want to set up my own ice cream cart.

And it won't be known to her parents.

She'd actually called an ice cream company to try to set this dream in motion.

And that gain might sound like such a fun moment in her past that people can recall.

But it speaks to something greater psychologically.

It speaks to somebody who already a really early age knows what she wants

and is determined to achieve it.

Now, around 2005, this is when Katherine begins volunteering herself as a firefighter.

And she was also a member of the Stellaton Fire Department.

And it's around 2009 that that isn't enough for her.

She wants to serve her community even more greatly.

So when she's 30, she joins the Atlantic Police Academy.

Apparently she was an excellent student.

Although she's about five years older than the other recruits.

But then that's going to give her maturity and experience.

And probably a sense of reliance that people can have on her because she knows a little bit more.

She's a little bit more worldly wise.

And people who were younger than her there said she was really well liked.

She literally got along with everyone.

And she successfully graduated in the autumn of 2009.

And then she got a job working as a Toronto police service officer.

So everything is going in the direction that she has chosen to follow.

And she succeeds wherever she goes.

And on top of that, she's just liked by everyone.

Now, on September the 14th, 2015, this is the day

where Catherine completely out of character doesn't show up at work at 5.30 a.m.

Bear in mind, even if she had been unwell,

she would have called in that she was unwell, but she hadn't.

She hadn't called in sick.

No one could reach her.

Her phone was basically going straight to voicemail.

This is really strange.

She's not even late for work on a semi-regular basis.

She just never was late for work.

So police are really concerned.

They go to check her apartment and she isn't there.

But immediately notice that her car is still parked outside, and that is alarming.

Because you think to yourself,

if she has gone somewhere of her own volition,

the likelihood is that she would have taken her car.

If she's gone out because she was going to have a drink somewhere, for example,

fair enough, she'd leave her home, but she'd be home in the morning.

And the very fact that people can't connect with her on the phone,

that's out of character.

So even if she had been out somewhere,

she would have lightly had her phone charged,

so she could answer even if she was staying somewhere else.

So they're really concerned.

And her father said that there is absolutely no way

that she would have just up and left without mentioning it to anyone.

She said she'd never do that without telling her mother or me.

She's just not that type.

She takes everything too seriously.

So at this point, she's reported missing,

and her family and colleagues obviously have this dread about what might have happened to her.

But equally, even though you have the worst fears bubbling in your belly,

the reality is that you'll also hope for the best.

Oh, maybe she has just met somebody and stayed out.

She's a grown-up, she can do what she wants and so on and so forth.

And at this point, they're taking it really seriously in spite of those hopes.

They appeal to the public for information,

and they say they're just really concerned for her well-being.

Now, initially, they actually said that they didn't believe any foul play had taken place,

because when they're looking at the apartment, it's in order.

The cars there, nothing looks like a struggle has occurred in that place,

so they're not thinking to themselves that something true sinister could have occurred.

Equally, they must have in the background have been deeply worried that that's a possibility.

Equally, they don't want to worry a community if it could just be that she's out

and she's hanging out with somebody else.

And then she turns on the television and people are talking about her,

and it's kind of a little bit mortifying in those circumstances when you're in your 30s.

So they're playing it safe with that suggestion.

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Hi, this is Alex Cantrowitz. I'm the host of Big Technology podcast,

a longtime reporter and an on-air contributor to CNBC.

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Our police chief David McNeil said,

we are obviously concerned and upset.

It's personal for the police. They know her, they care for her, they like her.

She's one of theirs.

This police chief went on to say she is an outstanding individual

and outstanding police officer and an all-round good person.

This is completely out of character for her.

Now like I said, although there were no explicit signs that anything onto water

had happened to her, they had indications that something wasn't right.

Like I said, nothing without a place, everything was tidy,

but her two cats were in there with no food or water.

That's not the way that she acts.

Her alarm was going up, so she'd prepared to wake up for the morning shift.

Her bed didn't actually look like it had been slept in

and the television was left on.

So that does make you feel a little bit concerned.

That scene doesn't sound normal.

The very fact that she has an alarm that should have gone off.

If the bed was made, maybe you thought she got up early and left,

but again the car is there,

and none of that seems to play out when they think about the reasons why this scene exists.

And one of the big problems of course is the cats are there

and they haven't been fed, and that's just not how she operated.

Now they actually find that she'd left work on the Thursday.

This is a 10th and CCTV had shown her arriving home after this,

just after 6.30am.

At this point she's carrying a 12 pack of diet Pepsi.

She also got a couple of bags with her and she's wearing her police uniform.

She's also at this point texted a family member,

and actually that's the last time a family had heard from her.

Now they also have evidence that she's left the apartment in the early hours

of Friday's September 11th, it's around 1am.

After looking at her computer,

they also find that the last search she made was for Bob's taxi.

So she obviously is intending to go somewhere.

At this point the investigators contacted the taxi company,

and they find out that Catherine had indeed been picked up from her home

and she was dropped off at the ale house in Halifax at 108am.

And the driver who was interviewed said she was really upbeat.

She was really chatty on the journey,

and she said that she was a police officer

and that she was also a volunteer firefighter.

Again, it just speaks volumes about her, doesn't it?

So many people get in taxes and just put their head down,

go on the phone, don't speak to the person driving them somewhere.

But actually she's having a conversation,

she's talking about her life.

It just speaks about who she is as a human being.

She's kind, she's engaging.

She's a nice person to be around.

She also had told this taxi driver that her week had been stressful,

that she was going to the bar alone,

and she asked for his car,

so she could call him for a lift back home,

but she never called him back that night.

Now, a lot of women out there

wouldn't necessarily feel that safe going out to a bar by themselves,

no matter where they are.

Because at the end of the day, you're a female,

and you do know that because of that,

there are opportunities sometimes for people

with ill intention to approach you,

and that can just be something that's annoying.

It can also be something that can turn a little bit dark at times,

but this is a police officer,

and a volunteer firefighter.

This woman will be able to handle herself,

and obviously she wants to let loose, let off steam,

connect with other people.

She's obviously somebody who's good with the public,

so going out to a place by herself probably isn't a very big deal for her.

Now, please obviously go and visit the ale house,

and they obtain CCTV.

At this point, it's a needy at what they know is,

so they can see Catherine with a man,

and they've been kissing at the bar,

and this isn't the kind of kissing that you see when you've been together,

for example, for 14 years,

because you know, now at the end of the day,

you've had all the kisses that you need,

and when you're in public, it tends to be,

shall we say, less intimate than there being?

It kind of looks like people who've met

and got passionately involved with one another,

in the early stages of getting to know each other.

So it's very obvious that they're enjoying that passionate embrace,

and the footage then shows Catherine and that guy leaving together

just after 3.30 a.m.

Now, the staff at the bar,

they recognise the guy in the CCTV,

and the reason for that is he'd actually previously worked at the ale house.

He was called Christopher Garnier.

Christopher Garnier was born November the 30th, 1987.

He'd actually also worked in protective services,

so he'd worked as a paramedic,

also a safety officer at bars.

So all round good guy you'd imagine,

the type of person that's reliable,

the type of person that knows how to protect people,

also have to acknowledge the type of person

who's quite physically strong.

Now, bear in mind, this is the last person

that's been known to be seen with her.

So they're going to speak to him,

and that happens on September the 15th.

He said, look, I don't know anybody who's missing,

I don't watch the news, it hasn't been on my radar.

However, he did say that on the 10th of September,

he had actually been drinking with friends,

and he had gone to cheers and the ale house.

He said, look, it was just a bad night for me.

I'd been having problems with my girlfriend.

We'd actually separated the day before.

They actually patched things up in the following days.

He actually moved back in with her, but that point

there was this kind of issue between the two of them.

And whilst they were on that incredibly short break,

some would cynically say, not a break at all,

but just have an argument and throw some negative words

at each other, including, I don't want to see you again.

We're going to break up.

But in this tiny fraction of opportunity,

he had apparently met a woman at the bar,

but then he claims he didn't remember what she looked like.

Now, bear in mind, they've got CCTV.

I've been a very intimate clinch with Catherine,

and he doesn't look like he's falling all over the place.

He's not like a guy who's so inebriated,

he wouldn't remember what she looked like.

And I'm going to throw out that most of us can remember

who we get intimate with.

I appreciate somebody will be listening going,

oh no, there was that night in 1999,

and I remember very little apart from an awkward morning

when I was leaving.

But for the most of us, we will recognize

that we could absolutely say who we had been with

on a particular night when we've been intimate.

He does say, look, she looks familiar,

and he said, was she in a band?

Makes sense, a lot of us can see people

and think that we know them,

but actually it just means that we've seen the one television.

Then he kind of opens up a little bit more,

he said, you know what?

I did actually speak to her.

I do remember Catherine.

I spoke to her for around an hour.

I actually kissed her,

but I didn't leave with her,

and I didn't go anywhere else with her.

He said, in fact, I went to my friend's home

on McCulley Street.

This is after he apparently left the ale house.

He said, I woke up at 9.30 a.m.,

and then I went to my dad's house after that.

He said that he and Catherine didn't actually

swap numbers.

He did not know where she was.

He didn't have any further contact with her.

He was sad that she was missing, but couldn't really help.

He also said, look, my friend who I stayed with that night,

he actually got arrested.

So even though I was at his place,

he wasn't at his place.

He ended up being in the drunk tank, essentially.

So he even has a sort of alibi saying,

I wasn't my friends, and my friend contested

if I was staying there,

even though he wasn't present.

He was apparently in the drunk tank,

because he got so drunk.

And at this point, Garnier is let go.

But they put him under surveillance.

Bear mind.

This is one of their offices that I'm don't going to be wrong.

The police always want to find people who are criminal.

It's as simple as that.

No matter what we hear in the news,

and the negatives about the police,

the reality is, for the most part,

they absolutely want to bring people

who are responsible for crimes through the criminal justice system

and have them dealt with appropriately.

However, when it's one of their own,

they're obviously like a red rag to a ball.

They want to bring her back.

They want to know who's responsible.

So of course, they're going to put him under surveillance.

Now, police do attend McCulley Street.

They do speak to Garnier's friend,

who'd been a little bit worse for wear that evening.

And he told them that he'd known Garnier since the seventh grade.

He said, look, he's telling the truth.

On September 10th, we went out.

We drank, first of all, at my home.

And then, basically, he sorted a bed for Garnier.

It was a pullout sofa.

Had a thin mattress, apparently.

Then he said, you know, we went drinking at chairs.

We arrived there after 11 p.m.

But, treated told, I don't remember all after that.

I don't even know whether I went to the ale house.

Because when I woke up the next morning,

I was at the police station, and I then walked home.

So he kind of has that memory of being with Garnier to a point.

But then it's a blank, because he was obviously rather drunk

and rather disorderly to end up basically incarcerated for the night.

He said that when he gets back to his place,

that's about 9.30 a.m.

He saw that the sofa bed had been reassembled into a sofa.

Well, Garnier's a good guest.

He wants to make sure that the place is neat and tidy.

His friend's been so good to offer him a space to say.

And he said he found Garnier on the sofa in the living room.

Now, it turns out that Garnier left that place between 11 and 11.30 a.m.

But the next day, his friend realized that there is an issue with the sofa bed.

Very mind, he'd put the sofa bed out for Garnier

so that he could have some comfort whilst he was away from his ex

who's soon not to be his ex that night.

And when he kind of checks the sofa bed,

he realizes the mattress has gone from it.

So, he texts his friend, he asks him about it,

and Garnier replies,

ha ha, yes, so kind of got sick and didn't make it to your bathroom.

Apparently, I thought it would be good to dispose of your mattress

and order you a new one.

It will be here by Thursday.

Well, sorry, bro.

I didn't want to try and clean up.

It was soaking through.

Obviously, his friend's like, well, that's cool.

I've got a new mattress.

It was very thin.

It was a bit worn.

And my friend is up maximum on it,

but actually, I'm going to benefit now

because I'm going to get a brand new mattress for my sofa.

And he basically said, no worries.

And he said, I was so baffled as to why the couch

has all done back up.

I was like, am I crazy?

Did not set that up as I thought.

And he also asked Garnier,

any idea how or why I've got arrested?

And Garnier replied,

I feel pretty bad, man.

It's your new couch.

Ha ha.

And then fuck, I have no idea.

I remember talking to that off duty cop and you were at the bar.

So, he's basically now indicating

that his friend's at the bar.

He's chatting to the police officer.

And there's a reason of an explanation

as to why this sofa has been put back together.

You know, he was leaving.

He wanted to make sure it was tidy.

And also, we've made a mess of it.

It was a bit embarrassed.

His friend, interestingly also noticed that

it wasn't just the mattress that was missing.

There were blankets that were missing as well.

And he just assumed that this moment in time

Garnier's thrown them away too.

Probably was thinking,

I hope he ordered some of those for me on Amazon as well.

At the end of the day,

if you messed up my blankets, bro,

you better get me some new wounds of those too.

Now, apparently Garnier recalled him that day to...

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Let him know that he'd spoken to the police

because they'd spoken to Garnier.

And that his name had been given in

and that he'd probably get contacted by them.

And when he was spoken to by the police,

he tells them that Garnier had broken up

with his girlfriend for one night,

but they'd reconciled with her the next day.

Like I said, that's not a breakup.

That's just a little bit of a row, isn't it?

A row that he seems to have taken full advantage of

by a hooking up with somebody that apparently

doesn't really remember a bar.

Now, whilst at McCulley Street,

one of the things that the police notice

are drops of what they think of blood on the floor

coming from the hallway.

Now, they don't point this out to Garnier's friend.

Instead they say to him,

you know what, have you injured yourself lately?

And he's like, no,

no, I haven't injured myself at all.

And that's really clever, isn't it?

Because we know that certain people

have very strong relationships with other people.

No, I'm not saying for one minute Garnier's friend

would lie for him.

I'm not saying that.

I'm saying, however,

that when you have relationships with people

and you have a bias of belief in that person

that's very positive,

if you find out that they might get into trouble

and you just disbelieve there is anything

they would have ever done to anyone that's negative.

And then they say like,

please just admit that the blood there

is from a cut that you've had

because I don't want to get into any trouble.

Even if you're not told in the story

as to why that blood's there,

some, and I don't think a lot,

some people would actually cover for you,

particularly like I said,

if they think a crime is trying to be pinned on you.

But by just saying to him

if you hurt yourself there

and having that noted,

if they then deal with the blood afterwards

because they've now got a reason to look at that in depth,

understandably,

he's made it clear that it couldn't have come from him.

Now the search that happened later of that house

because clearly they want to know

whether anything has gone on that's on toward

where Garnier has been,

they take swabs from multiple areas of at home

and guess what?

They're devastating

where they are a match to Catherine's DNA.

Now police,

they also go around the neighborhood,

they find a neighborhood in agriculture,

and they have CCTV,

which had a view of the Garden of Garnier's friend's home.

So then the police watch with interest

and with horror

at the footage that comes up on September 11th.

So at 4.28 a.m.,

a man dressed in shorts and a t-shirt,

comes out of the back door at McCulley Street,

the address where Garnier was staying,

and walks down to agriculture street.

Now it looks as if he could be texting

and then he turns around

and comes back around 4.29.

Now at 4.42 a.m.,

he comes back out of the back door.

Very well, he's not wearing any shoes at this point.

Again, he walks towards agriculture street.

Again, going out of view of camera.

At 4.43 a.m.,

he comes back.

This time,

he's pulling a green bin behind it.

At 4.56 a.m.,

he's at the back of the house once again,

this time,

with a white mattress on top of the green bin.

Now he threw the mattress down near a tree in the garden.

He then drags the bin down the driveway to agriculture street.

He stops at some point,

picks up something off the floor,

then throws it towards the roof of a cafe.

Now at 5.29 a.m.,

he comes back to the house,

not carrying anything.

But at 5.40 a.m.,

he comes out with a torch

and then moves the mattress out of sight.

Now later in the day,

at 12.57 p.m.,

a man wearing shorts

and a hoodie who seems to be

the same person seen in the earlier footage,

he comes back,

looks around the garden,

kind of scans it,

and then leaves.

The individual in that footage

was later identified as being Christopher Garnier.

Now a nearby dumpster ends up getting searched.

At this point,

they find a car key,

a shirt,

and a good life fitness tag

with a membership number on it.

It's found that the membership number

was in Catherine's name,

and the keys were to Catherine's car.

They also go ahead and search

the roof of Fred's Café,

they find a silver chain,

and DNA on the chain

is later found to belong to Catherine.

Then on September the 16th,

a discarded green bin is found in Woodland,

it's approximately a seven-minute walk

to the address

on McCulley Street

from where that's found,

and around five minutes past midnight,

the body of a white female

was found on an embankment

in Woodland near an access ramp

under the Macdonald Bridge.

The remains were about five hundred feet away

from where the bin was discovered,

and sadly, as I'm sure you have all guessed,

that body was identified as Catherine,

and it was later found during the autopsy

that her death was homicide

with the most likely cause being strangulation.

Now, investigators at this point

were advised of Garnier's movements

since leaving his interview

with the police today before,

and in the early hours of that morning,

Garnier had left his home,

and had entered his girlfriend's car

with a small red bag.

He then drove to Halifax,

this is past McCulley Street

and towards the Macdonald Bridge.

There was, of course,

a very large police presence

in the area when he got there,

because there's a searching for somebody who's missing,

and people want to desperately bring home,

and it was believed by the police

at that point he was returning to the area,

he dumped the body,

and he was going to try to move her body

or clean up.

So, of course,

when he suddenly sees his huge police presence,

he's startled by the police,

and withdraws,

because obviously,

he doesn't want to be seen at that scene.

Now, at 1.19am,

this is when Garnier arrives back at his home,

he's arrested,

the Catherine's murder,

they're all waiting for him.

Now, in the car he's driving,

investigators find rope,

a top,

blankets,

and bags.

I mean, literally,

a disposal kit.

It doesn't look good for this guy,

who apparently met Catherine in a bar,

although he doesn't really remember it.

He doesn't really remember getting intimate with her,

but now has literally been seen,

going places,

that certainly implicate him,

and now, in his own car,

he seems to have a disposal kit to move her body.

This is a guy who fully

is intending to try to get away with murder.

And bear in mind,

he's been a paramedic,

he's worked in security,

he probably thinks that he can create a plan

that's going to make that possible.

He's then interviewed by the police after his arrest,

and unbelievably,

he starts to tell the most horrific stories.

So he basically says that he had punched Catherine

several times in the face,

and then I'd used his hands to strangle her.

Punching her,

several times in the face,

this is a woman.

This is somebody who's no match

with his physically dominant male.

One Earth, what's he doing?

Punching her so many times in the face,

what's that speak of?

That speaks of a rage.

That speaks of an attitude towards women.

At the end of the day,

he'd had a row with his partner

who he had apparently broken up with

for a very short amount of time.

He's hoarding resentment,

and Catherine represents females.

Maybe he represents females

that he feels in that moment,

he doesn't respect,

because believe me,

there are men out there,

there are men out there,

but if they basically meet somebody,

and that person agrees to be intimate with them

in that moment,

they have a level of disrespect

for that person,

because the expectation they have

from a female is not to do that.

I'm not saying that's the absolute case here,

but I'm saying it with lend itself

towards a reason why, firstly,

he allows himself to treat

this amazing woman so dreadfully,

and also equate that as well

with the rage that he's feeling

because of the fact that he's

fell out with his girlfriend,

and she's the perfect victim

in that scenario.

She's absolutely nothing wrong,

and yet for him,

she represents something

that he's decided deserves punishment.

He also tells the officers

that he heard her last gasp.

Someone knows why he's done to her.

He also admits that he was going to try to move a body.

This is, as he was arrested,

and that the items in the car were to aid with that.

He also said that he'd lost his chain,

that his girlfriend had bought him,

so he'd gone out and replaced it.

I mean, who has the wear with all

after punching and choking women to death

to actually go and get a chain

because you need it to be replaced

because you lost the one your girlfriend gave you?

Also, he said he had considered running away,

but he didn't want to leave his girlfriend behind.

Unbelievable.

Could he be any more egocentric in that moment?

He's saying it's about his girlfriend.

It's not about his girlfriend.

It's about him,

and it's about him fully believing

he would get away with murder.

Now, during his interrogation,

64 times, he actually comments

that he'd been told not to talk.

Who told him not to talk?

I guess maybe we could say legally,

but in advice,

maybe he had a conversation with somebody.

Maybe somebody who was close to him

had said, do not talk.

But we know he's sniveling

and he's sobbing throughout this particular interrogation.

Look, I get it.

This guy is in a very stressful situation.

He's admitting something absolutely horrific.

Of course, he's crying and sobbing,

but it's not for the person he's murdered.

It's because he got caught.

At the end of the day, he wanted to get away with it.

He's sniveling and sobbing for himself.

Now, an officer told him

there was no doubt in their mind

that he was fully responsible for her death,

and another officer says to him,

I know you did it.

An officer basically said,

I don't think it was your intention

for it to end up like it.

You're not a monster.

You made a mistake.

There's nothing you can do to reverse it.

Now, they do this all the time, don't they?

You see this in interrogations constantly,

but it's quite effective.

It basically is telling the person who's a perpetrator

who's done something entirely evil and monstrous.

We don't really think that monstrous,

even though we do.

We know that you could have made a mistake,

even though it's not a mistake.

But we're going to say all this

because we want you to feel

that we're kind of on your side

and understanding what your actions were about.

It was just a moment of madness.

Don't get me wrong.

It's never a moment of madness.

The idea that there can be a crime of passion

or somebody can lose it in the moment.

That's not possible.

You have to have the potential

of being a killer within you.

It's as simple as that.

That's why you act in this kind of outlandish way.

It's within you.

It resides within you.

They also, of course, say, you know,

there's nothing that you can do to reverse it

because she's dead.

They also said, look at this poor girl.

Her family deserved to know what happened good or bad.

And Garnie said, I worked so hard to try to make my parents proud

and to provide for my girlfriends

so I can start a family.

He also said, I didn't want to sleep with her.

I love my girlfriends so much.

Now she's never going to want to see me again.

Again, going back to what I was saying

about the psychological rage with them.

What's happened there?

He's put his girlfriend in the pure zone.

Oh, the girl that I want to spend my life with,

the one who I have children with,

she's the pure female.

And then, of course, Catherine, she's the harlot.

She's the person who's made in strength.

Can you see how he's projecting?

In that moment, it's all about her failing.

Not him, her failing.

And he's blaming her in this moment

for making his relationship with his girlfriend problematic.

It is unbelievably eccentric.

But it also speaks of why he feels so entitled

to be rageful towards an innocent person like Catherine.

He actually said that the fact that they're going to break up

is because of the fact that he's killed Christine

because he'd slight with her.

So it's the sleeping with her that's the issue.

It's not the...

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Hi, I'm Alicia.

And I'm Stacy.

And we make trashy divorces.

Everybody's favorite good podcast about bad relationships.

Looking for something true crimey without the gore or the body count?

We've been churning out funny, feisty, feminist episodes since 2019.

So if you're looking to put some scandalous stories

told well into your ears this summer,

check out trashy divorces.

Wherever you listen to podcasts, trust us.

We've covered someone you love.

Or someone you love to hate.

Urda essentially is sleeping with Catherine that's the issue.

That is just so outlandishly incorrect perception wise on his part.

And yes, you're right, Garnier.

A normal typical, well-adjusted, well-adjusted human being to be fair.

Someday with turbulence and issues of vulnerabilities,

they would feel exactly as you described that they didn't want to see you anymore.

Because not only are you a cheater, you're a murderer.

That's how a typical person,

someday with just some kind of grasp of empathy and compassion,

would react in his girlfriend's situation.

Let's just leave that hanging for a moment though,

because we'll talk about this a little bit more as I go through the case regarding reactions.

He's also, by the way, in this moment, just thinking of himself.

How he's affected his own life.

Not how he's devastated Catherine's life.

And the idea that he didn't want to sleep with Catherine,

do me a favor.

Do me a favor.

Just get through it out there.

There are quite a few steps before you end up in bed with a woman.

Please, leave your sub-story at the door.

You wanted to sleep with Catherine.

She's attractive, vivacious, fit, funny, intelligent woman.

Of course, you wanted to sleep with her.

And you did sleep with her.

And the reality is, it's not like she was so desperate to sleep with him

that somehow she could force herself on him.

It's ludicrous.

This man is so despicable, so pathetic,

so self-indulgent.

He is an excuse as far as I'm concerned for a man.

It's as simple as that.

He's an excuse for a man.

He doesn't deserve to be in the category of man per se.

He also wrote a note which read,

I don't know where to start.

I only hope this will give you some closure.

I never wanted this to happen.

Yes, he did.

Carried on with.

I've always been a caring person.

But this is my darkest moment.

I kid you not, guys.

He literally wrote this.

Also said, I don't expect you to forgive me for what happened,

so I won't ask for your forgiveness.

I do need you to know that I am sorry this happened.

If I could give my own life to get her back, I would.

I will carry this with me for the rest of my life.

I mean, this guy literally thinks he's noble.

There is written this note.

Firstly, I am glad that he will carry the fact that he literally

merged someone with him for the rest of his life.

And I also think it's so unbelievable that he's kind of saying,

you know what?

The thing about me is just I'm a really caring person.

I've always been a really caring person.

Yes, yes.

Why are you telling me that?

I mean, most people are caring.

Yes, but I've always been caring.

You sound like you're saying you've been caring to a point.

You know, something changed.

Well, I mean, possibly.

I'm just saying in my past I've been very caring.

Well, if he don't, I've murdered somebody.

That does not sound care.

If there was a descriptor of the caring,

that would literally be the opposite end of the spectrum.

I'm just saying, don't judge me on what I've done

and actually have obviously exhibited personality traits wise.

Judge me on all the other times when I hadn't done that.

Can we do that please?

Honestly, like I said, totally irrelevant.

He's not caring.

He's killed someone.

He's killed a woman who is amazing.

No one deserves to die.

Of course, even people who are the worst or the worst,

well, some of them do deserve to die with respect.

We don't have the death penalty in the UK.

But what I was saying is for the most part,

human beings, no matter where they come from,

they don't deserve to be murdered by anyone.

Of course, they don't.

However, she is one of those shining examples

of a great human being.

And it's devastating to imagine that he is feeling sorry for himself

in this moment.

And don't be wrong.

I am glad that he's sorry to some degree.

There is a level within his descriptions

and within his acknowledgement of what he's done

that suggests that he's not a hopeless cause

where empathy is concerned.

There is something there.

But it's very well with me.

It's very self-serving.

And it's almost pointless that he's saying sorry.

As he's trying to accept, literally at this point,

his little responsibility is possible.

He just wants to talk about what a good person he was

and how his life's been affected.

And the truth is, you have to accept that as a good person

you wouldn't do what he did.

He killed a woman.

And then even worse than just killing her.

Because you have to look at how he acts after the fact.

At the end of the day, if he had killed her

and then realized what he'd done and called the police

and turned himself in,

I would still think that he was a violent killer

and I would still be deeply afraid of him walking our streets.

However, he tries to cover it up.

He discards this beautiful woman's body

as if it's rubbish.

And that tells the very dark story about his true nature.

Now, Garnie's girlfriend is brilliant.

She's actually interviewed.

She said that the couple have met

on the all-romantic Tinder 30 months earlier.

They had moved in with each other.

They lived together on Chadwick Street.

And she was really annoyed with him the night that this all played out.

She'd found out they had lied to her.

She found out he'd been texting another woman.

This is the guy who basically is blaming the way

that this woman died because of her actions to some degree.

Very that in mind.

He's kind of trying to put the onus

on the woman that he's slept with.

But what we're actually finding out here

is there's a pattern of behavior.

He's actually been on faithful in other ways.

He's been texting other women.

They've broken up because of that,

understandably.

That makes sense.

I mean, why would you want a forlander involved with you?

And then very quickly,

they made up on set time of the 11th.

And she said he did seem a little bit anxious

when they met up on the 11th,

but she just thought it was because of the issues

in the relationship.

And she put it down to that.

Now on September the 17th,

there's a carry on the investigation.

Further CCTV 40 just found near the McDonald Bridge.

This shows a male pulling a bin at 5.08am.

When he's seen again, this is at 5.25am.

He's no longer dragging that bin.

All the evidence is adding up.

And don't get me wrong.

When somebody confesses,

when somebody writes things down, I appreciate.

That is incriminating.

But it's never enough.

You always want to have the whole picture bill

as investigators,

so that you can create a slam dunk case.

And like I keep saying,

this is one of their own.

The police want this guy,

because this is a police officer who's been murdered.

Now Catherine's funeral,

that people were obviously desperate to attend,

but were devastated that they had to attend.

It was arranged for Monday the September the 21st,

2015 at first,

Presbyterian Church in Stellaton.

There was a tribute walk and a ceremony

that was also scheduled for September the 19th.

That began at Victoria Square

and it ended at the Truro Police Station.

So you can just know that in itself expresses

this was going to be an opportunity

for not just family and friends to grieve,

but for a community to grieve a fallen hero, essentially.

She was also honored at the graduation dinner

at the Atlantic Police Academy.

This is where she trained.

And fellow firefighter Doug Dort said,

she was always the one

that was right in the middle of the action,

really digging and going.

She was a good girl.

Her obituary read,

anything Catherine pursued in her life.

She gave a heart with passion and integrity.

If you ever needed anything,

whether it be something small or large,

she was just always willing and eager to help.

She'll be deeply instantly missed.

She was a woman who wears so many hats.

She could be the caring, compassionate police officer,

the courageous and fearless firefighter,

a loyal loving daughter,

a special sister,

a caring friend,

a caring aunt.

She was like no other.

Now on December the 20th, 2016,

none of you are going to be surprised to know

that Garnier was charged with murder,

but also with interference with human remains.

But he was released under the conditions

of a reconnaissance order,

which is essentially a type of bail

but it doesn't come with a financial cost.

But the terms of this order included

being on house arrest

and coming to the door

when ever a police officer came to check he was there.

He was also able to be at his mother's house

in Millville, Nova Scotia,

and his father's house in Bedford.

Now if he didn't adhere to those conditions,

he would likely be re-arrested.

Now in February the 17th, 2017,

Garnier leaves a message on the answer phone

and it's informing the authorities

that he's going to be travelling to his mother's house.

However, that message does not get passed

on to the relevant people.

And when they do a compliance check

and carry that out of his father's home,

no one's home.

His father's apparently driving him

to his mother's at this point.

So then a compliance check's carried out

is mother's home.

This is just after 1am on February the 18th,

but no one answers.

Now another check was carried out

it's around 10pm at his mother's house.

At this point, Garnier is found to be there.

But then on February the 19th,

Garnier is arrested for non-compliance with that order.

Apparently they said he hadn't presented himself

at the entry of his mother's home at 1am,

and that was during the compliance check

therefore he'd failed it.

So he's then taken to prison.

This is until a hearing could take place.

That doesn't actually happen

until April the 4th, 2017.

So when that actually is heard,

the breach of that order is dismissed.

So it's found that he was just asleep

at the time of the compliance check

and the judge actually said he was satisfied

that at the time of Garnier's arrest,

the officers had reasonable grounds to believe

that an indictable offense had been committed,

because understandably he didn't come to the door,

maybe they hadn't got the memo about the answer phone message,

but Garnier's father actually went ahead

and made a complaint on behalf of Garnier.

And it was said that the implied rational underlying

that complaint was the conduct of the officers

was motivated by the fact that the victim

of the crime allegedly was a police officer.

And throughout that, I'm not personally that bothered,

they had to spend a couple of months in prison

when he waited for his trial.

I think he should have been free at all.

At the end of the day, he's murdered a woman

who just went out for a few drinks one night.

She got beaten and she got strangled

and then her body was thrown away like rubbish.

So him going to the slumber for a few months,

it couldn't happen quick enough for me.

At the end of the day, it blows my mind

that he's walking the streets.

What grounds does his father have to complain about?

Oh, you're picking on my son.

Well, we're not really picking on you son.

You are, you're picking on my son.

Why are we picking on your son?

Well, she was the police officer.

Who was the police officer?

You know, the woman.

What woman?

You know, the woman.

Do you mean the victim?

Maybe I mean the victim.

Do you mean the woman that your son murdered?

Ah, if you put it like that, it doesn't sound good.

I'm just saying you're very biased.

You know, come on.

He murdered a police officer.

I got to feel like, yeah, they're going to be upset

about that.

And now, regardless of my personal feelings,

it was later found that Garnier,

who was at the time innocent until proven guilty,

was apparently denied his liberty for two months.

Oh, I'm doing it wrong.

Maybe his father believes the best in him.

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Hi, I'm Alicia.

And I'm Stacey.

And we make trashy divorces.

Everybody's favorite good podcast about bad relationships.

Looking for something true crimey without the gore or the body count?

We've been churning out funny, feisty, feminist episodes since 2019.

So if you're looking to put some scandalous stories told well into your ears this summer,

check out trashy divorces.

Wherever you listen to podcasts, trust us.

We've covered someone you love or someone you love to hate.

Maybe his father doesn't think he's capable of this kind of crime.

Equally, maybe if you want to create a narcissist,

you just go as a head and just what they like.

Even if that costs the lives of all the human beings.

Well, bring them up with no responsibility.

Make them feel that their actions are always forgivable.

And let's see how it turns out.

Now, because of this complaint, there was actually a disciplinary to fall on two of the constables involved.

But it was said that there was no evidence at all that the subject offices were motivated

by anything other than to carry out the duties assigned to them.

So they're like, no, you know, we were doing our job.

Now, we get to the trial that happens in November 2017.

This is when Garnier, wait for it, plan, not guilty.

Not guilty.

Yeah, his dispense is like, you know what, Catherine's death.

It was just an unfortunate accident that was caused by rough sex.

That had been initiated by her.

I mean, it makes perfect sense.

I was like, you know what?

I drive the mud actually.

I have been through so many cases in my research where women have been murdered.

And the rough sex defense has been used in the UK now.

Nova Scotia, etc.

Maybe very different.

But in the UK, men who have murdered women, it's clear that the murder of the injuries are very clear.

They have literally got away with being criminally negligent.

Oh, I didn't mean it to happen.

But it happened.

It is on real and actually in the UK that should never happen.

We have brown ruling in the UK, which means that you can't hurt someone even if they ask you to hurt them

in a way that could be grievous for them.

There's actually a law that exists in the UK like that.

And I would imagine it's around the world.

But this is what the defense is going for.

It's Catherine's fault.

So let's just walk through that.

Okay.

Well, where the defense and we're saying that it's Catherine's fault.

She initiated rough sex.

So you're saying that if somebody initiates rough sex, that if they die, it's their fault, we're saying exactly that.

So anyone who's into BDSM, for example, if they die, they're the problem.

Absolutely the problem.

I fear there would be a lot of bodies piling up if your belief actually were held through and true.

Well, we're just saying it's the only defense we've got.

Even though he's written letters and he's basically admitted that he punched us several times and strangled her to death.

Before we have, we're playing that card.

Anyway, not only are they playing that card, they're blaming her like I said.

It was initiated by her.

She's like, kill me.

Kill me.

Said no female ever.

Now, Garnier obviously believes he's own BS and he thinks to himself, you know what, I'm a nice guy.

I'm a nice guy.

I'm a caring guy.

I've never upset people in the past like this.

I've always been so caring.

So I'll just take the stand and I will testify in my own defense.

He's a decent looking guy.

His thinking pretty privilege might hold out here.

His thinking, they'll just buy into the fact that I'm really nice.

And he basically provides this recollection of the day that he killed Catherine.

Let's remember that and he murdered Catherine.

And he says, you know what?

My memory of the events kind of spotty.

I'm not but convenient there.

Kind of spotty.

You know, pretty important to remember he murdered but just kind of spotty.

He said that she asked him if he was in the domination and then says, would you choke me?

You know, this is the first evening together.

Maybe they've had a few drinks.

Maybe the inhibitions are a little bit lower.

Let's just play with that idea that maybe she'd said, you know what?

I kind of enjoy a bit of choking.

It's not completely unheard of at all.

And he just, you know, was a gentleman, wasn't it?

He was like, okay.

I'll do this.

I'll oblige.

But he said, you know, I only choked to the 30 seconds.

And he said, I'm not trying to blame Catherine.

Sorry.

At this point, is it possible?

Anyone in the court to just throw heavy objects at this guy?

Seriously.

I'm not trying to blame Catherine, which immediately means I am trying to blame Catherine.

I'm definitely trying to blame Catherine for her own murder.

And he went on to say, she was nice to me that night.

Oh, so nice that you killed her.

He said, just because she wants you to do that doesn't make her a bad person.

This would be comical if we were not talking about the extinguishing of an incredible human

being's life.

So she has sinned to choke her.

When he oblige is, and he kills her, we all have to be understanding that she isn't

a terrible human being for making him do that.

He's so infuriating.

Now he's trying to deflect onto Catherine as being the bad person.

He's betraying himself as heroic for saying that she isn't bad.

W-T-F and someone to chew that on his head so that every time he looks in the mirror, he gets my reaction from this.

No one in the court is sitting there thinking, you know what I really need?

I need the defendant to tell me that the murder victim wasn't a bad person.

No one.

Only the delusional man who believes somehow he's defending his case doing this.

And also the delusional supporters who are deep in denial.

And believe me, he has some of those.

Now they bring into court Dr. Stephen John Hawker who's a forensic psychiatrist and he testifies for the defense.

He said that on that night, Catherine was killed, garnered your experience of feeling over and detachment from his body.

It's like he was in a trance and apparently they are symptoms of disassociation.

Now I know that some of you are listening to me now.

You will go through disassociation at times.

It's not a nice feeling.

You genuinely don't feel like you're in control of your body at times.

But you know what you don't do? You don't kill strangers.

Hawker also said that Garnier was not able to think clearly.

And he was suffering from acute stress disorder due to Catherine's death was he?

Was he?

When he's seen on CCTV disposing of a body and returned to the psych crime scene afterwards.

Was he really suffering from acute stress disorder? That's a bit convenient, isn't it?

Garnier told that psychiatrist that he had a noise that went off in his head similar to traffic at rush hour,

just ringing in his head and he also had tunnel vision.

Was that tunnel vision trying to get away with Garnier?

Was that it?

He also claimed that when he'd assessed Garnier in prison, he thought he was displaying the most of the symptoms of PTSD.

So these include type of vigilance, avoidance, memory loss.

Now to expand on those symptoms further it was said that Garnier had a poor recollection of what happened between September the 11th,

2 September the 13th, 2015, and his memory of the day of Catherine's death was patchy.

So it's got all these things that kind of work for him.

Oh PTSD, don't really remember anything but I'm very traumatised even though I don't remember it.

And it's convenient for everything that actually happened.

Dr Hawker also claimed that if Catherine had been fighting for her life against Garnier,

both of them should have had more serious injuries. Can we just take a breath?

I'm just going to go ahead right now and argue with this doctor here.

I know they're just such an expert but let me just tell you,

apparently remember they were having conceptual sex when Garnier suddenly punched her repeatedly in the face

and then strangled her to death.

What time would she have had to react and fight for her life? Just imagine that.

This guy's big, his working security is dominant.

He punches her once in the face, she ain't going to be fighting no one.

Just like if you punched me in the face. In fact, a guy half his size could probably do me serious damage.

It's as simple as that. At the end of the day, as a female,

I am going to be inferior than a male who is dominant physically to me.

And there are some women out there who can take on any guys again with a very, very rare.

For us, normal typical sized women, a guy half our size can really hurt us.

And I don't care what psychological symptoms he was experiencing due to the murder he committed.

At the end of the day, I think he should have some pretty serious symptoms because he killed someone.

You can call me coldhearted if you like or you can call me reasonable and sensible,

which I would prefer to be put in the category of.

And I do not understand doctors who sit in court and sympathise and literally try to make the jury sympathise with a killer.

With a killer who beat this poor woman and choke this poor woman to death.

Now, they bring in Constable Justin Russell, a colleague of Catherine who must have felt devastated having to testify.

He actually said that as part of their training, they had been taught how to make someone become unconscious

by using the right amount of pressure to push on the carated artery.

And he also said that if this wasn't done in the right way, it would cause death.

He also said to the court that she had training, which meant she absolutely,

effectively knew how to go out of a chokehold.

So basically, he's saying that the attack would have come from nowhere because she would have known how to fight the hell out.

And she would have fought for her life end of.

However, despite the defences, well, apparent arguments, but let's be honest,

it didn't stand up too much and they weren't very effective because there's nothing to defend.

I mean, it's horrendous what he did. You know, it's indefensible.

But I think it's quite clear that without them arguing full stop or with the best arguments in the world,

the evidence itself speaks for itself.

So the prosecution were very strong in this case and they said Garnier acted in a way that was manipulative and calculating

and he knew what he was doing as he disposed of the evidence.

Look, he disposed of numerous pieces of evidence.

Some of which were never found and he separated into different places.

He tried to conceal his crime quite effectively and also he bought that necklace.

He replaced the one that it lost.

So the idea that this was something that he didn't have a memory of doesn't make sense.

The prosecution also said that the sheer randomness of the murder should be taken into account because, of course,

when it's a random murder, it's often more difficult to find who's responsible.

And it was also commented on by the prosecution that his rehabilitation will be difficult

when considering his ability to return to his normal day-to-day life literally after killing someone

and his extensive decisions to try to conceal the crime again amplify the fact he's a danger.

Now after hearing all of the evidence, the jury could have chosen to find Garnier not guilty,

guilty of manslaughter or guilty of second-degree murder.

Now we get to December the 21st, 2017. Garnier is found guilty of second-degree murder

or so found guilty of interfering with human remains.

The judge, and I'm going to question the people who wrote these things, received 31 letters of support for Garnier, just 31.

You know, I get it.

People like people. People defend people.

And people don't want to believe that something they love is capable of something horrific.

But one of those letters was from his girlfriend. I get you not.

His girlfriend, you know what? Garnier's girlfriend, probably ex-girlfriend now, do better, pick her.

You are heading down a trajectory where you will be exploited by predators as as simple as that.

At the end of the day, they sniff people like her out and they will no doubt ruin her life in a long run

unless she works on reality.

And I'm not trying to be disrespectful to her.

Just a little bit of advice if you come across this video, please do better.

Make better choices, get some therapy, realize you deserve more than men like this.

But in that letter she wrote, I consider myself incredibly lucky to call Christopher my significant other.

He is truly the best kind of person inside and out.

He saved me from me and has given me something to look forward for the future.

Our future.

Oh wow. Look at you. Look at you.

Sounds like a top brass guy.

Only murdered this poor woman, meaning that she doesn't have a future.

You apparently have a future to look forward to with this murderer, but he took her away. Catherine's was taken away.

Does she not see the obvious irony going on? Does she not see that?

I really baffled by this woman.

She actually makes me feel a little bit on the nauseous side, but I have an empathy for the fact that she's probably fractured within her foundations.

That's why she seeks relationships that are this bad.

But she doesn't seem to mind.

Firstly, he jumped into bed with another woman immediately.

Basically, they weren't even on a break.

It was just a one-off argument because he's texting with the women.

And then he kills her.

It's wild to me that a woman would stand by a man who acted so awfully, especially as it only met around a year before all this happened.

Then there's another lesser written by Garnier's father, and it says,

Chris and her family think about Catherine and her family daily.

When Chris says repeatedly towards that he would gladly give his life to have her back with her family,

I know that he is truly sincere.

I was, and still am, so very proud of him, let that sink in,

with the utmost sincerity Chris was, and is my life.

Again, book 101, How to Create a Narcissist, as described in that statement by his father.

He also told him a list of goals his son wrote on a brown cardboard toilet paper,

and he was in close to the after-use arrest.

One was, OK, everyone, everyone, going to throw out that.

That's a busy job.

I mean, I-

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Hi, this is Alex Cantrowitz.

I'm the host of Big Technology podcast.

A long time reporter and an on-air contributor to CNBC.

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Spur, she's somebody who's known as the Hugging Saint.

She literally spends her life going around the world, hugging people.

Let me tell you, it's no easy feat.

But apparently, he wants to hug everyone.

Number two, help people.

Could you be any more vague?

Who'd you want to help?

Just everyone.

I want to hug people.

I want to help people.

Number three, show Brittany.

They came on trail.

Yeah, I want to go on a little trip with my girlfriend.

Four, restart my career.

Five, start a family.

He wouldn't want to dad like this.

Six, spend all my time with looked ones.

How are you going to do that?

You're going to be hugging everyone.

You're going to be helping people.

You can't be spending all your time with your family.

You've got a job to do, kid.

Number seven, see the world.

Oh, we've left our family now.

We're seeing the world.

Number eight, cherish every second.

How are you going to do that?

You're going to be very busy.

You're not going to be able to cherish every second.

It's going to be all our work involved.

Number nine, make a difference in the world and people's lives.

I mean, literally, that means nothing.

And I will say there is one person's life he made a difference to.

That's the life of Catherine.

And then all the lives that were affected and impacted because of her loss.

Because she was loved by so many people.

I mean, gosh, if I was his dad, I'd just agree.

What a guy to be proud of.

What a stand-up guy.

He beat and strangled an innocent woman to death.

She went out for a night.

She never came home.

He disposed of a body.

Thought I could get away with it.

Now, in 2018 in the August of that year,

Garnay was sentenced to life in prison.

But that means in this particular situation,

he will be eligible for parole in 13 and a half years.

At the sentencing hearing, Garnay I read a statement.

I never intended for this to happen.

But my actions contributed to Catherine's death.

I nearly swore that.

It began with death.

The second word with O.

Just a groan.

Let this sink in.

Let this sink in.

I'm going to say it again.

Because it drives me to the brink.

I never intended for this to happen.

But my actions contributed to Catherine's death.

And I accept responsibility for that.

I have a hard time understanding why I did what I did afterwards.

And still, I can't remember most of those actions.

I'm disgusted by them.

I am sorry.

Every day for the pain I've caused you to go through.

And I hope that you can one day forgive me.

It was said that he was softly spoken when reading a statement

and gave the occasional glance towards Catherine's family.

Now Catherine's family also gave a statement.

How do you put into words how our lives were forever changed

by the death of our child?

You cannot even imagine unless you've been there yourself

a month of that family the correct.

They went on to say the disbelief, the heartache,

the emptiness sorrow, nightmares, tears and the sense of loss

is consuming as we struggle to deal with our loss.

We know one thing.

There will be no forgiveness.

None.

Catherine was the victim.

And every day that we walked into this courtroom

she was victimized over and over again.

We are constantly reminded of the accused rights.

But what have we seen of the victim's rights?

It's our family that has been given the life sentence

with no chance of parole.

I so agree with every single sentence that.

I cannot believe that this man, this murderer has the goal

to say that his actions contributed to the death.

You're killed.

You can't accept responsibility for doing that.

Instead, you repeatedly try to blame her.

You consider yourself the nice guy who just acted in a way

that she wanted.

And now she's dead and it's her fault.

Actions speak much louder than empty words.

You're a killer.

You're a killer.

This was never Catherine's fault.

It was never her asking for anything.

It was you with that internalized rage that you have within you

that you projected in that moment on this woman.

And you stole her from her family.

And you deserve to burn bright where you will end up no doubt.

It's diabolical to me that he is supported by all these people

who basically want to drown out the gravity of this conviction.

It's an awful case.

Because Catherine's reputation has been affected here.

Imagine your loved one being killed.

And her killer claiming that she liked to be choked during sex

that's how she died.

Having to sit in court as a family and hear about the sexual encounter

which ultimately killed her, that's what no greeting family

should ever have to go through.

You just think that everyone would remember her only

by her sexual preference, which is likely not even true,

rather than all her wonderful achievements in life.

That would be the fear of the family.

If this was genuinely an accident, then it's incredibly unfortunate.

But it wasn't.

It wasn't an accident.

I knew it had been an accident.

It had occult the emergency services.

But, you know, conveniently, he doesn't really remember what happened

even though apparently he does remember that she asked for it all

and she kind of deserved it.

That's what he's saying.

Fortunately, because the jury have sense they saw through his lies.

And I see through his lies.

At the end of the day, why did her is offensive and horrific and tragic?

But why did after the fact, after killing her,

really does speak volumes about his lack of character?

And what he's put Catherine's family through is shameful.

And I find it unbelievably shocking that his girlfriend supported

him through the trial.

She was seen holding hands with him.

I don't know what happened with their relationship after

who's found guilty, but the fact that they separated for one night

because he'd been lying to her and texting other girls.

And in that one night, he'd not only been with a little woman

but murdered her.

Yet she still wanted to be with him.

It's really hard not to be overly judgmental towards her.

You don't know what goes on in other people's minds,

but at the end of the day, I think that she needs therapy

and she needs to work through whatever it is self-esteem-wise

that makes her feel that she deserves a little.

Don't you be wrong?

She'll have been told and manipulated by him that it's an accident

but to know that your boyfriend was capable of disposing of a body?

And actually, like, nothing happened afterwards.

I'm afraid, just on a very minimal level,

that would be a deal breaker for me

and pretty much everyone else in the world.

Also, in an unbelievably shocking revelation,

it was found that Veterans Affairs Canada,

who support veterans, actually helped to cover the cost of PTSD treatments for Garnier.

Why? Because we so traumatised he'd murdered someone?

No, because he was so traumatised that he'd lost his freedom.

That's the truth.

Now, the reason he got that covered is because,

although Garnier never served in the military, his father did.

And that means the benefits extend to the families.

Now, just to clarify, this is the PTSD he claims he developed

from murder and Catherine.

And someone rightfully commented,

how is it that veterans are waiting a year

or a year plus to get treatment?

Some of them never do.

But we are a guy who has committed murder

and is now getting treatment on behalf of veteran affairs.

Now, veteran affairs Canada said that they were unable to comment

on individual cases due to confidentiality.

Honestly, after I did the research for this case,

I nearly submitted a complaint to them about this

because it is just unbelievable.

This guy never served anywhere and he murdered a woman

and he got post-traumatic help for that.

When veterans who've actually served in wars failed to get that,

it's insane.

It's insane.

Was it the same psychiatrist who wrote the report

saying that he was just kind of a guy who blanked out

and now is struggling and at the end of the day

isn't really that guilty?

Maybe he was a guy who was running the organisation.

Who knows?

Why do you know is this?

He is a stone cold killer

and I won't have anybody tell me otherwise.

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