BPOP, May Ponds and Robert Riley

0:00Welcome to the Standard Sportsman Podcast where Duck and Goose hunting's hottest topics meet a mission to leave the resource better than we found it. Life long, Arkansas Hunter Conservationist, Case in Short and Brent Birch bring you thought-provoking conversations with insightful guests before, during, and after the season. Glide you're here. Let's get into it. Hey, it's Brent and Case and back with another edition of the Standard Sportsman Podcasts. We are in, I guess this would make week two of the two Duck Stamp campaign that we've pushed pretty hard and obviously gotten a lot of support within the waterfelling community for this movement too, but we're kind of taking it up a lot. Case and had a really good idea on how to perpetuate this thing and get it, you know, even some more momentum and carrying through until the season or even into the season. If people get wind of this late, but Case, you want to talk a little bit about kind of concept you've come up with and some of the people you've talked to that are on board and board to come.

1:10Well, I'll be very clear here. The same as the two duck stamp was definitely not my idea that was yours. I don't know that I'll take credit for this either Chris Harrell with Harold sons actually brought this up to us and was the first to offer up, but he suggested we get some brands on board and start doing some giveaways for people that have purchased more than one stamp and have, you know, picture evidence, whatever have the receipt so to speak. So yeah, Chris brought that up to you and I and we've talked to a couple others. I know John Adams at natural gear was was happy to get on board. I was able to talk to Jim Moron Quist last night with Drake. They want to get on board with it heavy shot as well. Wades you make her offer up their participation in it. Ducks unlimited as well wants to get in there with it. So sounds like we. Sounds like you and I are going to have to get off our rear ends and make this happen because there's some brands that are eager to be a part of it. Yeah, it's exciting. I mean, we've said it before it's a no brainer. I mean, it's truly the best $25 a duck hunter can spend. So it's good to see that the waterfowling industry rally around it.

2:22They realize the benefit. I mean, because without ducks that will obviously dial back our duck hunters and when no duck hunters, they don't have anybody to sell their their wares to. So it's good fit. They have the audience. They they can cast a lot bigger net than we can and it just makes a lot sense and I and you know with this kind of early momentum. Doing you know with this angle will reach out to some more because we have a lot of friends in this. This business that I think will be eager to get on to so as listeners and fans of the podcast, I be staying tuned. You might pick up some really good gear just by spending 25 bucks an extra 25 bucks on a duck stamp. Yeah, maybe the best investment you ever made. That's it. That's it. Just kudos to my brazier last night on that live deal. He was happy to plug that and the DU is involved with it, but I appreciate the opportunity to talk about it there. You know, again, there's a lot of brands and a lot of hands involved in this and it's a good example of what we can accomplish when we quit caring about what color came and we were.

3:28No, that yeah, no doubt about it. No doubt about it. So yeah, I appreciate that too. I did catch that part of it and we do plan to talk about you know your appearance last night by the time this comes out, it'll be a week ago, but you know the ducks unlimited live stream discussing the B pop and the Maipons and what all this means. I would love to jump into that and talk about last night a little bit and talk about kind of some of our observations and thoughts, you know, coming out of that we usually do an episode related to it and I think some of our listeners would be disappointed if we didn't talk about it, but I want to pull in our guests that we're going to have on today too, because he's got some pretty good takes. I speak with him quite frequently. We met a year ago at the ducks unlimited expo there in Memphis. I was there with some books in the Tom Beckby booth and came to introduce himself. And to share this really cool story about his grandfather that ended up in this year's greenhead, he actually wrote a piece for us in the magazine.

4:32And he is one of the few people that you could probably get on a microphone that actually has spent quite a bit of time hunting the famed Claypool Reservoir. So we'll get into that a little bit too on the back half, but at this front half I think the three of us will kick some of that stuff around, but I want to welcome to the show Robert Riley. Hi guys, thanks for having me on this morning. I really appreciate the opportunity and casing it is a pleasure to meet you, man. And I first have a question. So I have seen you or listen to the episode with with Mike on it before. Is he does he pronounce his name, brazier, because I'm related to some brashers from Calvin County Mississippi, but they pronounce it B-R-A-S-H-E-R. I've always heard of this brazier, but that's interesting. I know he can't remember where exactly in North Central Mississippi. He's from it can't be that far from Calvin, right? I mean, Calvin, it's kind of southeast of Oxford there, just a little bit, but my grandfather Johnny that ran Claypools, his grandmother was a brasher and their family was still down there.

5:43But it's that we're from now I'm from Cretan County, Arkansas. It's West Memphis, Marion, you know, so flat in watch your dog run away for three days. I grew up here, which is Memphis area, right? I mean, I grew up 15, 20 minutes from downtown Memphis, but my part of my dad's family is from down in that area, Mississippi. I'm a mom's family from that area of Mississippi, and then the other part of our family is from over in Tennessee. We're actually relatively new to Arkansas. We've only been here about 100 years, so we're not not that recent, but yeah. Yeah, well, I think it's going to be cool to talk about Claypool a little bit because, you know, we've all seen the fame picture we've all heard about the wild wild world sports video and all that. But you don't really get to talk to a lot of people that spend a lot of time on it. I know there's been some other episodes talking historical about the place, but I think it would be cool to talk about it.

6:49But before we jump into that, let's talk about this show. You run last night because I think it leads into discussing some of the B-pop and Maypon numbers and some of those things, but I got to watch bits and pieces of it. I didn't get to watch the whole thing end to end because it did run pretty long. And for anybody out there interested, you can go back and watch it. It's on YouTube, really available on Ducks and Limited's YouTube channel. But it was a good cast of guests, tables with some lives, some, you know, over Zoom. But I thought it was an interesting piece. I really enjoyed the parts where the Duck Hunters got to visit. Not taking away from the science guys, but I liked it when you guys got to kick it around in there. Yeah, I think that was part of their goal to get a little more, you know, kind of duck hunter discussion there. And obviously you have to unpack all the details on the front end because the whole thing is really about the numbers, you know. Certainly you and I enjoy those numbers look forward to every year. So it is fun to digest those. But just conversationally the back end of the show was really nice as well.

7:58Yeah, yeah. Well, I encourage you by the does like to hear kind of the ins and outs of all that. From both sides, the side and the waterfowl are sad to go back and listen to that. I don't know how many people they had watching it live. But, you know, the beauty of the internet, it's it once it's out there, it's out there. So you can go, you can go back and watch it. But let's let's talk about the numbers a little bit. You know, we're. Waterfowl management academy was built to turn passion into stewardship with over 75 years of combined wetland management experience at the private state and federal level. Our biologist team helps landowners build better habitat and hold more ducks from the management community and course library to one on one coaching. They give you clear practical tools to manage with confidence through every season. WMA is for landowners who believe their property is about more than just a place to pull the trigger. It's about building habitat that gives back to the ducks and strengthens the resource for everyone. If that sounds like you visit waterfowl management academy and become a member today. The standard sportsman is brought to you by perfect limit outdoors, the creators of the designated polar automatic jerk rig.

9:05This is one product creating motion throughout your entire decoy spread. Check it out at perfect limit outdoors.com and make the water move. We're all a little feeling funky about the the mallard numbers and and they're not great. There's I don't know another way to paint it. I mean, we're on a pretty long string of them not being great. I don't know a lot of people like to go back and say, well, we've lost 5 million in 10 years. So, but we also at the same time you have to realize those were hot hot water marks 10 years ago. It had a much more up and down prior to that, but still that's our recent memory and and we're really good at recent memory when it's convenient. We're really good duck country are really good about going way back when we need it to because we like to talk about you know, if we were to have these numbers back in the you know, whatever whatever year you want to say this would have been a 30 and 3 season.

10:11We kind of have selective memory about what we want to pull out of the hat to fit, you know, where we stand on things, but yeah, mallard's, mallard's not doing so great. No, they're not and I guess if if I could have changed anything about that episode, it would have been I would have enjoyed a little more discussion on the front end about, you know, kind of how the hunters and everyone on that on that panel is a duck hunter. I don't mean that I'm certainly not disparaging the science guys, but there was kind of two groups there it would have been a little better on the front end to hear you know some of our opinions and thoughts about what the numbers mean and what we see as hunters kind of on the front end of that episode because you know, a different little bit in an opinion on if these numbers are average and maybe they are I guess I would describe recent duck seasons is kind of being average.

11:11So maybe they are kind of average you know, but but I made the point last night because Scott Stevens you know it's got to pretty straight shooter. You know, sometimes it may be a little doom and gloom I think so I called it last night, but you know it would be easy to look at the Maypons being up a little bit and be excited about that, but then you need to remember that only once in the last 20 years have Maypons been lower than they are right now so it's you know there's some improvement. It's not much to celebrate like you're really grasping for for straws there if you want to celebrate that and I think if you you know you if you talk about what that means right because some people kind of misunderstand that we look at the B pop and we look at the Maypons and then we can kind of guess what production will be in production matters because that's what we're hunting right we're hunting juvenile birds the the mallard that's been to my farm the last six years is not likely to die to 70 years because he's gotten pretty good at surviving as it is so production matters right. But if you look at the decline in the last year in Maylards and then the uptick and ponds do they offset does it matter is it enough to matter is El Nino going to is it going to keep them all north they're all going to get consumed along the Canadian border right now and you know I you know for us in Arkansas I anticipate more the same and my big concern right now and I think Scott kind of expressed that on the show what is this El Nino is going to be a lot of fun.

12:39Yeah. I saw the Maypons thing coming out as up and full disclosure for anybody listen to this I am not a scientist but one of the things that popped into my head is you know is the number up because ducks are potentially more concentrated due to some of the loss of wetlands and how dry it's been up there I mean I know they're doing these surveys out of airplanes almost they're corporate drones but you know with the number of places for a duck to go being down. It may you know at least in my mind I'm looking at it like well shoot maybe maybe they're saying it's up because that's what they're flying over and they're seeing these numbers down there but that's just because you don't have the dispersion that you used to have the dispersal that you used to well I think a big part of it is what it was really important in all this is the timing and I know there's been some talk of some changes to how the surveys are done the timing of the surveys how they count.

13:57I you know Mike Brazier alluded to it last night he's he's confident there's going to be some changes in how these counts are made so we we could see some numbers kind of jump all over the place comparing these last handful of years compared to the next handful of years because they're going to change what they do I know there's been some talk of doing away with the assumption that if they see from the air if they see four mallard drinks or less by themselves they assume there is a hen tied to that Drake they don't see the hen but she's she's counted as such so you know it's sometimes you hear people laugh about paper duck paper ducks you know that what is this what is that even me well to me that's the the automatic counting of a hen just because you see a lone Drake that's a paper duck that nobody saw that in she might be in the grass but she might not he might do it. So I just be hanging out by himself or with three of his other buddies that kind of deal so I we're going to see some numbers change on that there's probably also going to be some numbers change because of the timing they're talking about chain timing you know the flights and when they do it because these ponds it's it's obviously an index to compare to previous years and it's the timing is everything because you when when they fly

15:26and they get a big rain a week later well there might have been a whole lot more water and landscape but but the window they flew in this is what they saw or the inverse of that all the water they don't get any more rain after they flew and it all dries up and the ducks don't have anywhere to go but I think what what they saw this year is the water wasn't there yet when a lot of the mallards came through and they pushed farther north that's why you know that's the way to do it. You know north Dakota's numbers were really low on the breeding population count they released their own and they released it much earlier. But then they commented that they had we're seeing better brewed success because they got some land the water on the landscape after the timing of their flights to do all that counting. So they felt like the ducks that did stop in North Dakota they did better and and that's what the that's all these variables that are out there for us to sift through it's not as clear cut as these these two numbers be palm and may ponds because it has a lot to do with timing.

16:32I'm guessing a lot of the ducks flew through all the way to the parklands which stays much wetter but it's also much less productive you got a you got a higher predator issue there. And if they push all the way to the boreal you know it's always wet but again productivity is really poor so where the ducks settled is just almost just as important as these two numbers and then what what precipitation did you get before after when they settled. So it's just a lot going on and really hard to put your finger on it as to you know how successful is this breeding season going to be and what are we going to see this fall when the seasons underway yeah it's so let's talk a little bit about the ins and outs of that. That survey right so the rubber to kind of answer your question they're not using drones yet that I think that technology is kind of on the horizon which could be great you know.

17:33It's not there quite yet and as far as dispersion and concentrations you know the transects that they fly every year should avoid any anomalies like that should but it is still. Up to the human eye account all that so there are some variables there so just kind of maybe kind of clear that air a little bit but you know it's very interesting i'm going to start by praising everybody involved in that survey because I think it's a it is a wonderful survey. It is done very well it's you know if you and they miss this in the show. If you study any species of wildlife on the planet that survey of water files probably the envy of everyone else it is very good. It is still estimates there are still you know factors that go into it and it's hard to be perfect and then all those guys admit that you know things that we thought were right. 20 years ago we're wrong and probably things that we think are right today are still wrong but it's evolving and it's getting better I think that's why you're seeing.

18:34You know kind of the review that Brent was talking about there in terms of sex ratio because I think that's. That is a very interesting thing and Brent and I've talked about it on here we talked about it with winter banding studies that talk about sex ratios and biologists down here that are not seeing. The same ratio that. That a gym had been accounting for. So yeah you do hear that coming here people talk about paper ducks and then I know the science community gets very very dismissive of anybody that kind of calls into question and I tried to look at that a little bit on the show. That you know we need to. We need to not be dismissive of those people that are in the middle right there there are extreme opinions that you you're not going to reach you're not going to deal with but there are people that. That have legitimate questions and we should try to learn and educate and work together versus just dismissing each other automatically so it's a great survey but. There are some limitations to it just like Brent mentioned you know assuming that there's a hand attached to every solo Drake under four right so.

19:38When you look at low populations like we have and if the sex ratio is off then we've got a lot fewer hands and we thought and then that comes into harvest and you know what point this harvest become. Additive and said a compensatory and it just opens a lot of questions and I think that's why you're starting to see. The review maybe that's not maybe it's just time to review a gym and see if it's working but I'm glad that. Those conversations are happening as a season changes Tom Beckley's fall collection delivers timeless apparel outerwear bags and gear built for cooler days ahead. For iconic wax jackets and the versatile layers to classic shirts and everyday essentials every piece is crafted with the quality durability and purpose that define the brand. Explore the fall collection at tombeckby.com or visit one of the five stores in Franklin Tennessee Oxford Mississippi Birmingham Alabama Middlework Virginia and Tuscaloosa Alabama. Situated along the renowned big creek flyway between Dewit and Ethel Arkansas this 162 acre two track hunting property offers an exceptional combination of prime waterfowl hunting and quality deer hunting in the heart of one of the most productive duck corridors in the region.

20:47The property boasts a diverse and dynamic wetland habitat featuring a rich mosaic of cat tails, willows, cypress trees and buck brush that naturally attract and hold ducks throughout the season whether you're chasing mallards or managing deer at this property delivers on both fronts. For more information visit law will state dot com or call us if I'm one three seven four thirty four eleven. Again not being a scientist is what I've observed on mine into the flyway and what I'm out of line but there have been times. You look at a I mean my uncle called them courtship flights but you would see you know eight nine ten drakes and there might be you know a hand in the wide and it's like I you know I figured by the time I got back to Canada they might be paired off so one for four. It definitely sounds like an assumption to me I don't know but that's you know down here I mean I've had the opportunity to look at some really really big groups mallards and. That's you know not that my word of science or anything close to that but.

21:51I don't know that I'd stretch it that far well yeah I mean what a hunter sees you know if if a hunter is truthful and and tries really hard not to be bossed because their season's going. Good battering different because you get boxes all all over the place if somebody seasons going great that I don't know I'm seeing plenty of hands there's hands everywhere every group comes in it's fifty fifty. And then you talk somebody that's having a poor season no I don't see any hands of I will have groups come in it'll be eight drakes and they'll be one hand with it or you know some you some ratio like that and they're seeing some of that to on the banding side it's always going to be boss towards males males are more aggressive to. To get in those traps and and things like that but doctor Osborne will tell you it's concerning how. Why the gap is even though it's always going to be skewed towards drakes. Because a lot of the paired up hands and drakes don't they don't fall into that trap they don't want to be by all the other ducks so there's always some some.

22:54Gap there but not like they've been seen so we do got to figure out what's going on these hands and we know we know a lot of it we know they they're very vulnerable during breeding season and all that but. You got to think about what happened what's the number going to be with if they remove this assumption that for loan drakes have a hand. And then and they come up in another way to count them that I would assume is going to be much more conservative we're going to see that gap widen in this from the statistical standpoint not just the anecdotal eyeball observation. And so is that is that going to kick us to you know reducing the handling and being more concerned that man. We don't have as many hands as we thought and we we didn't have that mean to start with even we were assuming there was one with a loan drake. Well, my presumption that it would hopefully wake some people up to that maybe yeah the handling needs to come down from from two to one and take that into account.

23:58I mean I don't know my personal opinion is two is too many anyways but we're subtle again make rules of regulations but yeah I mean if they if they come out and they say hey we're on. But you know 10% of what we thought our income was and it's actually lower you know that might actually open the eyes of some people out there that are you know. Shooting hands doesn't matter right that some people have that opinion. I'm on the opposite side of that not afraid to say it signs may say that i'm a nut for thinking that but you know well probably not the. So I've got a question for you guys um. Got into this topic on the on that show a little bit. And i'm probably going to lean more towards it matters more when you kill the hand and if you kill the hand. I brought that up you know certainly Jane with 31st is a lot more harmful than September 1st in terms of hand harvest but i'm curious your thoughts because this seems to be.

25:02Where where we're at with management right like the decision makers are scared that if we reduce opportunity or we make it more difficult to ID bars or you know more like that you have an infraction because you shot too many of this or that. It seems like the focus on our three is really driving the boat right now so. That's that's going to be part of my question and but i want to get into this as well. Would it would it change your would it affect how you hunt i mean we know. We know that we don't limit hands and basically any other species and it doesn't drive their population right catwalk blue into you. Geese like you name it you know there's no hand restrictions those are species that are kind of hard to tell depending on the time of the year and it has no effect on them so. The two I guess is two part question do you believe that hand harvest. Matters more for mallards.

26:03Because there is the distinction is easy to tell the difference and do you guys as hunters think if we went to a restrictive hand limit it would turn hunters away. Brent you want to go first you want me to go ahead because yeah I got I got a thought and i'm looking at something to see if i'm right so go ahead so case in your first question was. Would does mallard in harvest the only in harvest that matters i mean if you look at the i don't think so i mean you look at the the pentales to their they're not doing so hot right now. They're numbers are down and you look at some of the other species I mean is it so great that you could say oh shoot and hands is. Is a problem no for like grad walls I mean it looks like they were up you know long term average anyways they were up here recently down a little bit but I think mallards are at least in the Mississippi fly away and definitely an Arkansas right like that's the that's the the boon and crocket duck if there is sure. I'm sure you know this room an outfit but there's a lot of people that measure a hunt by how many mallards did you shoot you know what you're in you can.

27:14To show you heard the term scrap ducks right you got your four mallards and your two scrap ducks and. So I as it relates to your first question no I don't think mallard in harvest is the only in harvest that matters I think it's just the biggest. Issue as far as hunters in this part of the fly away at least that I can observe because if you're out there in the blind and there's a group of five grad walls that are working and there's a group of 10 or 15 mallards hanging out above them you know. Most people I've ever hunted with so let the get all skied out here and see if we can work out or dead and then you know they want to try and rain them out so. I think it's just kind of more more attention on that but no I don't necessarily think it's just a mallard issue it is it means more I don't know if that's the right phrase but I mean we just can't we shoot more mallards are impact on them from a harvest standpoint is. Is higher at least in Arkansas I mean I just looked at our harvest numbers that just came out from last year and side note they have made it very very difficult to go in and analyze harvest data.

28:24This is a new way that they're reporting they make it they've made it very difficult and I don't know if that was intentional. Because more people are paying attention and taking these numbers and breaking them down and making podcasts and making that you know social media posts about it but. It is not easy to go get snippets of information and try to make some dots connect but I did just look at our you know we for Arkansas a quarter of the ducks we shoot our mallards all the other species make up the rest so. Maybe that you know that that's why. You know the hen does have a some breaks on it versus the other species we just we just shoot a lot more of them but I and I would I would think that's pretty consistent in the Mississippi flyway I think mallards are the predominant. Duck you might see Louisiana with more gad walls and then well you I mean you for sure will now they're their their mallard harvest is pretty pretty poor.

29:27If you look at the statistics but yeah and I don't know that that's gonna. Drive people away I mean I agree with you some of the opportunity is is outweighing the experience in the way we're managing waterfowl. I think it's pretty clear what's what's being pushed and what we're hanging on to trying to keep people in the sport I mean you've seen the. The implementation of the three splash roll you shoot three of anything you want but when you shoot three you're done. But that's the that's to keep the lowest common denominator so to speak in the sport you know if you struggle to identify ducks or. You make some mistakes for the sun gets up or whatever. That that bells yeah you shoot three mallard hands if you want to but I would think the most people that would do that they're not really hurting the population. Significantly anyway I don't think a lot of hardcore hunters are going to pick the three splash rule in those states that are providing it so yeah.

30:33To your point about the opportunity if you lower the hand limit is that is that kind of drive people away I mean. Kind of step one day one of hunter education is you know you're target know what's behind it amongst other things but you know. Is it really going to hurt you is it going to make or break your day if you take the next group you know. Five or 10 seconds at gray light I mean if you got ducks coming in and you are a little more choosy and. You know other side of it is from a conservation standpoint you know. Kind of time this into the age old question of do you need more hunters we need more conservationist and we need more people that are conservation minded and so if somebody goes you know I'm getting away from this because they said I can't shoot two guns now I can only shoot one hand or you know. But if they want even more drastic than that. I don't know what that would look like but. Is there a way to keep that person in maybe maybe you sit down and have the concert you know conservation talk with them of hey look you guys need to focus more on on why this is going to affect as opposed to just what it's affecting.

31:43And I mean most guys especially. Most people that are our hunting public are not killing you know a full strap of malice every time they go out anyways it's not the you know. Not the early 2000s anymore and. You've seen a lot more mixed bag so. I don't necessarily know that it would drive people away but. Well I think you nailed it that would be more conservationist and I would argue when we're worried about people leaving the sport and we should be concerned about that could the way the. You know the North American management plan works hunters found conservation so we need hunters point blank that is. That cannot be can I be argued you might not like him so I don't yeah you may not like him in your part of the woods but we got to have him you know. Just so I don't just so I don't get sound lighted and and canceled I'm not saying that we need to diswade people from joining our sport we need everybody on board we can but. We need them to be conservationist to you know we don't just need somebody.

32:45Out there with the gun that's just there to you know kill me want somebody knows why they're doing it and kind of appreciate the history behind it and. Yeah and I would argue that you're a lot less likely to lose the conservationist as a hunter than you are the guy that it's just a hunter knows nothing of the sport you know that guy that cares enough to invest he's in it for the long haul so. Our our best bet is to. Convert hunters to conservationist and and that's my that's my stance on the in limit I think it sends a very good message about conservation. Does it make any tangible difference it's unlikely but it's a really good message and I'm with you guys 100% I think you could you I think mallards are different than every other species you hear that rebuttal all the time you know the oh well we don't we don't have a have a hand limit for anything else okay I get that but. It least our part of the world and probably everywhere in the US the mallard is the target species it is the species that we set.

33:49Aside from Pentales like we study them we set limits by them you know this is. The gold standard of duck so it's it is a little different and i'm comfortable with it being managed differently than then blue winged you. You just said there about doesn't make a difference maybe maybe not and it may not but it's something that the individual can control right when i'm sitting in a duck on in eastern Arkansas you know. I can control what I shoot or don't shoot I can't necessarily control what somebody on the prairie and Saskatchewan is doing with drain tile right directly but I can control you know if I pull up and decide whether or not I'm going to let it in have it. Which I will say full disclaimer I have shot plenty of hands in my life when I was a younger person I was I was pretty rough on when I was in the killing stage of you know one to. Want to get everything I could but as I've gotten over I've tempered way back from that so yeah well that so that's a that's a great point that you made right there about you know it is something that we can do right so we we hear them talk about must say them the science community.

34:55You know levers that we can pull. And we can't pull ever to increase more habitat we can't pull ever to make it rain we can't pull ever to protect more wetlands right like they've got to be for sale we've got to have the funding we've got to be competitive most all these things are outside of our control. And I'm going to preface this by saying I'm not advocating for less opportunity talked about that on that show as well but the only lever we have. Is our regulations in our framework and there is a huge appetite from hunters to see somebody try to do something and it may be for not but. Making some adjustment I guess would it would appease people is that worthwhile I don't know but again I brought it up I believe it was Taylor that mentioned. You know the last time we went to restrictive season we lost half of our hunters and I commented to him as well did we lose half our hunters because we went restricted or did we lose half our hunters because the population was so poor wasn't worth going you know all the opportunity in the world is worthless if we don't see ducks and we don't kill ducks.

36:07So which one do we want to manage for right you're a year long season would give you plenty of opportunity but you're actually not going to get in here July so. You know I get that but. You know one thing yeah you talk about it's it's something we can control my dad he was a pilot by trade and he used to do some road warrior flying he you know black little airlines all over the country before a transition to FedEx but he was living in Minnesota in the 80s. And those were pretty rough times for for ducks and duck hunting and there was a Delta campaign up there at the time called duck seasons in but not for me. You ever heard of that you guys ever heard of that no yeah so there was there was a bunch of hunters up in that part of the world and they just voluntarily abstained and I think it was Delta off to go back and look and see if that's who was promoted but. He was telling about that yesterday why told him was coming on the show is he yeah I was living in Minnesota in 1986 it was a big big push up there a lot of people you know had these duck seasons in but not for me hats and shirts on things like that just because.

37:1980s were were rough years for duck hunters duck numbers and farmers to you know it's yeah similar similar conditions for sure yeah. Go ahead bring yeah I was going to say it was interesting you you brought that point up because I was talking to Jason Smith who's buddy mine and been on the show a couple times and and kind of has puls on things and we were talking about you know how this is already been plotted next year. Not this come season the next season will be another 60 and 6 because of the way it plotted on the matrix and and he brought up a pretty decent point and now I've seen bits and pieces of this. And this might be an interesting you know kind of discussion to have amongst you know couple duck hunters is why don't we voluntarily if we if we have a problem with you know we need to cut the limits back or we need we need a 45 days not 60 days why don't we have the self control to say all right I'm making my season 45 days or I'm not I'm going to shoot three malerge I'm not going to shoot the four maler deal.

38:25And I my my response to that was it's really hard to pull back on the days that are good where you you're going to go out there and you and your your friends or family that you're hunting with it's you know it's a good day. It's hard to pull back and and not you know have the most success you can have on that particular day because those are so few and far between now. And he made the point well I mean you got all these people I hear complaining about fossil fuels and in all the you know everything we're doing to the earth but well why don't they walk everywhere they go with that mean they still drive cars and in everything else that pollutes the air and it's just our nature as humans I guess is it's hard to hard to put restrictions on yourself sometimes and you almost have to have it told to you but I'm not sure if you're going to have a problem with that. I'm told to you but I've heard of some clubs that have cut back that you can take I know one that's in my area a legacy club very historic place that you can take as many guns in there as you want but you can only shoot 24 mallards that's it so if you take a big group in there and sometimes that will have some groups of eight eight guns.

39:41That equates to three mallards a man you know simple math so you have seen some people throttle back you know we obviously see a lot of people with time restrictions they put on themselves you know privately and hunter can stay out there from dawn to dusk if they wanted to but they put some rules in place okay everybody's got to be out of the woods by nine o'clock or you know whatever it is or we're not we don't we don't do afternoon hunting or we only hunt this particular place this date this these days of the woods. I know some clubs like that too it's not open seven days a week so there is some throttling by some people out there but it's pretty few far between I grew up on one of those places right I mean it's it's never been kind of a new or irrational theory and I know I am in the extreme minority of hunters but when I was a kid duck hunting was three days a week it was Saturday some days and Wednesdays. You know now also I recognize I was just born lucky and I'm it was the Augusta National duck hunting right but I mean even even when Wallace Claypool started that place and you know we started building it actually in the 1940s acquiring land and building it he he recognized all the way back then that you know ducks needed a place to rest they need a time off and you know as far as most hunters would consider it was it was pretty draconian as far as you know.

41:08Mr. Claypool had it they didn't go out and they didn't start really hunting until eight o'clock in the morning and most people didn't carry more than a pocket full of shells and you know only hunting three or four guns per hole. I mean that was you know 80 years ago and then that's that's. Definitely something that that the larger duck hunting population probably doesn't. How to say this. You talk about the self control factor right seasons in gotta get them all the can I paid for the lease I paid for the waiters you know a pair of waiters is a thousand bucks now right or you know 500 to a thousand dollars and you get the shells and the gun and the lease and everything you're like okay well. I feel like I have to make the ends justify the means I've heard some of that in some of the local stuff here on Cretan County right. But the child I think people have a lot of hard time hard time imposing that self control at the same time I would say though and respond back.

42:13There are certainly a number of hunters that hunt all 60 days but it's not that much of the hunting population right most of your I mean less it's an outfitting service and you know those guys are kind of running a different racetrack than non outfitters but. I mean private hunters right or I say private I don't just mean private land I mean people that private and public. You know very hard to find somebody that that's truly able to hunt all 60 days. Duck dogs work hard help yours perform at his best with Purina pro plan outstanding nutrition with real meat as a number one ingredient pro plan sport is made to feel hardworking dogs like yours for increase endurance joint support and muscle tone it all starts with pro plan sport. Serious waterfowl management isn't about reacting day to day it's about making better decisions every season create the X is a waterfowl land management app built for the real work in the field. It's not meant to replace your journal or notebook it allows you to access your past management history and real time right in the field track water movement log field work and GPS overlays mark lines drop land damage pins and record equipment maintenance documented by location and date so nothing gets lost over time.

43:27Instead of flipping through pages you can reference past seasons directly on the map while you're standing there giving you clear management history to guide future decisions from your first field to the farthest fence line manage it smarter with create the X learn more at create the X dot com available now in the app store and Google play. So Robert I'm curious about your opinion on this because you know when you were talking about the 80s. It kind of occurred to me that maybe there's a certain generation of us or certain age group of us that live through all called the duck depression right like if you hunted if you remember those times if you remember the 80s when it was so dry and so poor. I feel like you kind of have a different outlook on things today. Does it make us better than anyone else just our perspective is different but I'm interested to see your opinion talking about clay pool and what they were doing my grandfather started in 53. And we were very very similar even even with guiding hunts for as long as we have you know we don't on every day we don't on afternoons we are very limited and and pose a lot of self restrictions on on what we do in practices.

44:37Do you think that's because that that particular generation actually did come out of the great depression like do you think that they remember some of those lessons learned and that kind of shaped how they were stewards. I definitely think that's that's the case. You know they. They got used to living without and they saw what was happening I mean you look at look at a man like all this clay pool ride he was born in the 1880s. He got to experience I mean even before there was any regulation whatsoever right he got to go experience some of the craziest most inconceivable duck hunting in the world where they're shooting. You know 100 ducks 150 ducks as many ducks as they could fit in the boat. You know out of the Wapenaka out in club. You know with a lead shot right and then to see those numbers fall to and to get to the point that. And really that's his whole motivation for doing the place is he got so enthralled with water fell conservation he's like I'm a bioplace for the ducks and of course he was.

45:43Not alone in his thinking he might have been ahead of the curve there but a lot of that was was passed on to those those that picked up the club after I mean when he sold the club you know clip will got out of it in the 60s. And sold it to a group of guys from Memphis and in the old clubhouse there was a picture. Not the famous clip will picture but a different photo purpose made quite a few photos out there but anyways. It was a picture had this little bronze plaque on it and said you know to my four friends and I had the names on it. I leave you my life's work right and and so to kind of see the resource go down to the point that they you know even the government got involved with you know some of the migratory bird act and. You know Pitten Roberts and feel as other things that to try to help conserve wildlife in general to to see that yeah I definitely think that shaped it and then I think it shaped the generation of stewards that came after them. And then you know people in my generation and I say my generation I'm 31 a lot of them don't remember anything about the 80s I don't I wasn't born but I was raised by people who did and that was kind of you know and instilled in me from a very young age and.

46:59It kind of goes to a bigger thing Britain I talk about some is is a lot of the people in the sport now I mean they weren't involved in the sport or weren't connected anybody involved in the sport that hunting through the hard times right. All they know is is 66 and all the person that got them into hunting knew is 66 or on the other side of that coin is you know maybe they got themselves into it through social media and they just have you know it's hard for them to do it. So appreciate a what they have now and be what they were missing back then because they just never you know don't have any time to it and I'm not saying that in a derogatory fashion at all it's just a simple fact right. Yeah we've we've kicked that topic around you know the mentorship that you know the who did you learn this sport from. And then who's who's mentoring you ongoing because it's a it's a factor and you can spot it pretty pretty quickly those that that had a mentor or a quality mentor versus those that haven't and that's not the point fingers and anything like that but I mean we're all aware there are people in the sport of duck hunting that.

48:14Man you almost wish they go do something else and in that's that's got to be a big factor in all that and to think that all that has been passed down to you because I mean you're significantly you know you might older son is the same age as you are pretty close but. It's interesting that you have that take and we reference screen hit again there's an article in this one to our interview a handful of guys a little bit younger than you most of. I think all of them are in their 20s but it was kind of getting their take on the sport and but what was interesting it was it was clear in there because a lot of my know their dad that's how I know the kids to contact them to interview and. You know they learned this sport from their dad and that's why the the thoughts that they emoted in the interview process was. Was a reflection of how they were introduced to the sport so yeah I think that that goes a long long ways and we need more of it that's for sure.

49:20I agree and I think that best thing to do is just have that conversation and you kind of it. It's very hard and it's something I avoided and have avoided for most of my life of having conversations with you know a bunch of people about. My take some conservation and duck hunting because people go you know. You grew up on clay pool right you don't you don't know what it's like to scrap it out in a boat race in the public temper and I don't or you don't know you know what it's like to spin 60 days in a bunch of rice fields and and I don't so finding that line of hey you know I'm not full-lear than now I'm not better than you because I'm not a really I promise I'm not I know. But you know I think we as stewards of the resource have to find some way to get those that are coming into the fold and kind of tie that back into the conservation thing right I mean it's.

50:22It's things that have worked in the past if they you know if they haven't worked the sport wouldn't be where it is today and if you're old enough to remember it or if you grew up with somebody who remembered it and taught it to you. You can you can tie back into it right. Yeah exactly and you just made a really strong point there you know there's a track record of places and yes location has something to do with it. But it's also how they manage it and how they treat the ducks and I think there is a contingency in the duck hunting world that could stand up to learn from that there's a reason why the ducks go there and there's several reasons why. But one of those reasons is how the people that hunt that particular piece of ground how they treat the ducks and and that's a. Some of that's missing out there and that's any wildlife too I mean that's that's dear that's true are you hunting I mean that's you have to be a steward of the resource and if you're you know if you're just all gas no breaks I'm going to go out and get kind of harken back to one big question right OK everybody wants to go out and get the duck.

51:30And have a good day of the woods and all that but what are you doing to to give back to the resource and if you're if you say ask yourself that question in the mirror when you get dressed in the morning but you know what are what are you doing right. I mean is it hey we got a lease and we're only shooting it three days four days a week is it you know I'm buying to duck stamps this year. You can't come up with any kind of answer that actually is OK that's sort of a positive trend towards helping the resource out maybe you need to work towards something that gives you that answer because I just yeah part of being a conservationist right that's right that's right. The standard sportsman is brought to you by Noah Perry financial advisor with Raymond James and associates like you Noah is an avid sportsman he was raised in a family where duck hunting tradition and conserving our natural resources runs deep like you he understands that success in the field requires proper planning discipline and patience and most importantly a high level of trust trust in your gear trust in your dog trust in your hunting partners as a financial advisor with Raymond James he brings that same.

52:43He's got a lot of understanding and partners with his clients to build tailored investment strategies and comprehensive plans delivering a personalized experience built on trust and around your goals call Noah today at 501 313 731 3 or send an email to Noah dot Perry at Raymond James dot com Noah Perry with Raymond James personal by nature trusted by design. In case you've been living under a rock lately and you had noticed sick a gear has launched their new line fishing gear everything from the radiant sun hoodie to rise or active shorts even sick the sandals look I'm a pretty big fan of flip flops in the summertime I got those last year when they first came out and legitimately like legit good sandals love them go check it out man from rain gear sunshirts you name it even fishing waiters their line is expanding greatly and definitely deserves to be a good one.

53:43Check it out. Let's say before we talk about some of your your claypote experiences just because you know that's obviously a very unique place that that you only hear a lot of old history about so I definitely want to talk about that but one thing before we get off of some of these numbers that just came out. By the time this comes out of the last week so but fresh data I wanted to talk about harvest data a little bit because you know there's there's a lot of talk about you know where ducks are settling and what's stopping them and migrations change and so on so I did look at some of the harvest data for for Arkansas and it did go down year over year as far as mallards go about half a duck per active duck hunter. You can't really look at the total number of harvest because I mean one year we could have had you know 125,000 hunters in the next year we could have done it so you got a you got to average it out and what the US Fish and Wildlife Service.

54:47Keeps up with is a statistic called active duck hunter so you divide the harvest by that and you get an average for the season but also looked at Missouri and Louisiana and this is just mallards and Missouri. When up almost to mallards per per active duck hunter per season they may they jump from 4.72 to 6.65 and of course you're going to say well that 6.65 I killed that me in a good weekend I'll shoot my eight and that's just a weekend not a whole season but you can remember there's a lot of people that come to these places and hunt only a handful of days it might be one trip a year that kind of stuff so the you know whether the data sorts out right I don't know. It's real confusing anyway how they collect harvest that on on something they don't count a single duck physically so Louisiana went from one mallard per season per hunter counted 0.68 so you know a dip there too but what was interesting was to go back and look at that the somewhat long term average back to 1999 which is when they kind of changed the methodology as to how they calculate harvest.

56:02So last year we were at 6.56 mallards per active duck hunter for the season our average should be around 9. So you know looking back to 1999 but the part of what skews that is 99 2000 we killed over a million mallards in Arkansas so you probably have to go back and kind of throw those out and you probably get a little bit closer so we're not crazy off of our modern day average. Missouri last year even though they jumped up almost two mallards they're right about their long term average dating back if you take back to 99 and Louisiana's down one mallard modern day compared to their long term average so you know no crazy wild swings where you can go well yeah they're killing way more now because that's where all the ducks are so it's a it's an interesting way to kind of back into where are all the ducks and I think it gets back to the beginning of the conversation and we talk about the breeding population is down we talk about May ponds or poor.

57:11It's because we don't have enough ducks that's it they're not somewhere else we just don't have enough of them and that's going to impact our harvest in our season success. Well I you know I listen to one of the your past episodes a couple of weeks ago and you had your your friend Lee I'm going to butcher the hell out of his last name but Lee Joe sir could you. Yep yep Mr. Joe's if you listen to that forgive me for what you're not saying but anyways you know he made a comment is like you know you put 10 million mallards back on the landscape and a lot of your issues you know go by the wayside and that definitely makes a lot of sense to me. First thing you said about Missouri's mallard harvest being up I was like oh god nobody tells Senator Kennedy about that but to joke. Yes just just just just kidding but kind of interesting to me that numbers of mallard harvest are around long term average for some of these states but mallard numbers are continually trending down and there is there anything you know any nuggets in that of heck.

58:20Well you know resources steadily going down and hardest to stay in the same that you. Yeah yeah yeah yeah there's all all kinds of ways you can crunch these numbers and probably pull something out that would fit what you're trying to point you're trying to make we've obviously seen it was some of the narratives out there. But that I mean yes you're right that's a you know we got a shrinking popular the problem is the hardest part is is we don't have a count of the fall flight anymore so we we kind of. Get some guest and it's on how production was based on. Yeah there was some water in the landscape or no there wasn't but we we don't count it there's no marker there's no index anymore and has it been for a while so. With not having something to measure the fall flight against we really don't know that. Yeah yeah B pop was down but you can have it you could start with a bad B pop and if it was say we were at six million ponds.

59:25The fall flight could be awesome but the B pop would look pretty because going into it we didn't have any but production was awesome because there was water in the landscape so it's. We're kind of missing some data points and that's a big one and that's. That's why you can't get so hung up on. The B pop number and assume that your season is going to be terrible y'all made this point last night. Okay the assumption that. B pop means the season is going to be terrible well it might it's but it's just one of numerous factors that influence that yeah real quick I want to mention you talked about Missouri being up. Two mallards I think it's very important that you mentioned a long term average because yes everyone south of us is going to you know freak out and it's corn it's whatever you know but yeah when you look at the long term average you know there's ups and downs and warm years and cooler years and all those things come into play but did you. I know you probably haven't been able to digest the whole thing.

1:00:27Did you catch the part where we talked about the brewed survey versus the midwinter surveys. No I did not so I brought that up because the brewed survey came up so I asked all the science guys on that deal like what is more valuable to you guys from a data standpoint a brewed survey or midwinter and without question they all said brewed survey now. Brewed survey went away because it wasn't being used as a data point for a jam and I get that and it's very valuable to us as hunters and it does give you. A good window from which to view. The year you know better than be pop and trying to extrapolate what recruitment would be because that's what we're doing now. But yeah I mean I'd love to see it come back now we'll say somewhere else brought up a very good point that they would rather to see all that money go to conservation efforts given that neither the midwinter nor the brewed survey went into anything statistically. I don't know yeah it's interesting.

1:01:28That would be a handy data point it would really give us a better idea but they but I if I recall now obviously those service are really expensive to do that was one reason they weren't really using the data point in anything so I keep paying. This huge expense for something we're not really using but it definitely gave us a marker but I've heard some of the science guys say but yeah it made people anticipate whether the season was going to be any good or not based off of what the fall flight index was. Without considering did you get the weather did you have water and landscape you know Arkansas this year it's going to be interesting with our rice harvest being down and rice being cut so early again so I mean there's all these other things but people were taking okay the fall flight is up season will be awesome and when it wasn't. They're like what the hell that's a lot better or the inverse of it's a lot better reference point than saying scalper up 99% in this one county in North Dakota. So that's that can set expectations yeah but but yeah this this came up on that show Jim or Robinson mentioned it and he and I've had conversations.

1:02:34You know all on the phone all the time about it and I think messaging matters and I think if we're honest with hunters and we tell them hey numbers are low it's going to be a tough season you go into that season expecting to be tough and you're appreciative of the days you get if we sell some unicorn fairy that it's going to be great because you know red net greaves are up. No one's going to have a good year because the green population is up I mean I know some people kill them and post them on Facebook and it happens every year but you're not supposed to so I just think we need to be brutally honest and messaging matters. No that no doubt about that I think that's what hunters are really struggling with is what they feel they're what's being message to them and that's created some use you you said the word honesty and I'm the same I'm not a loon to that either but they don't feel like they're getting told the whole the whole thing the whole picture you kind of got some smoke smoke mirrors let me worry about it when I'm in the block.

1:03:40Versus creating six eight nine months maybe it's 12 months of angst that that spills into social media and conspiracy theories and everything else because I don't feel like I'm being told the whole story. Yeah and that's just be just you just right and then I think it's also important that hunters feel like they play a role and that's another dangerous point to harvest doesn't matter you know and I think that narrative is starting to change certainly from from ducks unlimited and I applaud them for that because you know at a certain point harvest does matter now unfortunately the population is so low right now an average ducks per hunter or so low that they're correct we're like changing the limit to something else is really not going to matter because not every hunter is going out and killing a limit every day that's where we're at with the population but it's a very dangerous thing to make a hundred think that he serves no role at all in conservation.

1:04:40Since 1937 ducks unlimited has been the leader in waterfowl conservation with over 16 million acres of habitat conserved. De-use supporters and volunteers have led the charge to fill the skies with waterfowl today tomorrow and forever. You too can play a role in leaving a legacy for the future of waterfowl hunting to find an event near you or to join our volunteer team go to www.dux.org slash volunteer. Ducks unlimited conservation or continent. You sit there and I mean last year I personally shot nine ducks all season I also had a son December 3rd which definitely cut it. Give out a time I spent. Outdoors that'll that'll certainly do it and I think it was the continued wanting to hunt in the future. It's not leaving my wife at home with two small children cut back into that but you know to think that the harvest doesn't matter at some grand scale is is is.

1:05:47Call me a lunatic but I don't agree with that I definitely think it matters. Yeah well we've obviously made our stance clear on that on this show and and and we have a lot of conversations offline that would support that that blanket statement is highly inaccurate and you just got different beliefs out there but that's within the type of science I mean that you know you can go all over the place and we can we can wear that. It was really good though at that point I mean it's well yeah that's a messaging thing that's basically was was a gist of that that yeah let's change please change to some other slogan or catch phrase because that one's the hundreds just aren't buying it they just aren't. All right well we're we're edging towards time when I've got a hard stop but I definitely want to talk about your your your your years of hunting Claypool Reservoir just because it's a place that's so known not only in Arkansas but nationally it's just incredible history and legacy of that place so maybe talk about you know how your family is.

1:07:01It was was got tapped into that and then you know some some of your experiences there and absolutely I know it's pretty incredible it it truly is you know and and first of all I just as my grandfather would say luckier and a puppy with two Peters to to have grown up out there our family it's not a money thing you know we didn't get tied into the club because we you know it had enough money to get into it actually. My grandfather took over running the club his name was Johnny Robert Riley senior he took over run the club in 1966 he had he and his father who everybody called gander but his name was William. He and gander had had run a few club they run the pink willow around leaner and then they'd helped their cousin and nephew dig them run cany slew and willow back in the 40s and 50s and then they ran a pack of deer dogs and pop had a pretty good pack and he got tied in over to bring the plantation and that's working that snowed in boil senior who was one of the four guys that Claypool sold to and.

1:08:18You know it wasn't just hey you know he met these folks and you know we want you to come work for us Johnny my grandfather was born across the road from Claypools the the Riley family farm was just north of Rayburn Road there. Just a wiener I mean that's that's where he was born and he had actually been around that area and through that area his whole life before claypool you know came up there and got in there and in the 1940s you know my grandfather already been he was 10 years old by that time right it was born in 1930. He actually told me a story that when claypool was digging one of the one of the main ditches there my grandfather used to ride his horse down the Languia River go fishing and claypool was going to put a pipe in and my grandfather said he was like 13 at the time and he told Mr Claypool you know you're putting your pipe in at the wrong spot that's that's your you're at the high spot you'd have to push water up to that and to let your water out he goes out get out in the water.

1:09:23You know Claypool style get on either kid you know talk about low and behold my grandfather ran into him a couple much later and he was digging that pipe out to go move it and you know so the connection is is kind of always been there and so then my grandfather meets these people running his dear dogs down to the Brinkley plantation and they had just happened to have bought the club from Claypool and so it's kind of a natural fit my grandfather is kind of a rounder you know he had done a little bit of a lot of work. He had been a little bit of everything he had been a duck guide illegal market hunter he had a few arrests for selling ducks when he shouldn't have and he'd been a bouncer at the cotton club and Truman at the end of the liquor store to just barmed a little bit you know anything you talk to turn of time but he took over in 66. At the time my father was 10 years old and and from 1966 until about 2015 he ran that place I mean with an iron fist and then 2015 2016 my uncle Johnny Robert Riley Jr. who everybody in that area they called him gunny he was a 23 year veteran of the Marine Corps gunny took over running it but it was always a family affair.

1:10:41You know until a lot of people Claypool some of us with the duck picture but. You know my brother and I really did truly get to grow up out there was where we caught some of our first fish you know it's where I killed my first year. No turkeys out there sadly they tried that a few times but. Some of the best memories of my life out there and getting to grow up with people that had experienced. Hunting back then and I say back then you know in the 50s and 60s and 70s and then you know kind of getting to. Carry that in my own experiences in the early 2000s and and up into the last time I hunted it was in January 25 I mean it just. Just incredible. One of my earliest memories that I may not so there's a timber hole called browns hole was named after two brown one of the guys at both club and. It's really easy to get to turn it off the first main turn when you go through the gate and go down to the woods and you're pretty much there and one of my earliest hunting memories is being piggybacked out there my dad would take me out to the blind and I was so small.

1:11:51I'd have to stand on a milk crate and watch the hot I wasn't even carrying a gun at the time and to sit there and just watch ducks pour in the trees like that it's just. It's hard to explain there's some videos floating around on the internet of people with with big groups of ducks coming in but. I mean nobody's calling and shooting lights five minutes away and you've got ducks falling in you know in the not in the tens in the 20s but in the hundreds right just definitely not that way anymore certainly not even out there but yeah man so. I can tell you some Johnny Riley stories he he was. A character or I can tell you just some of my personal hunting stories which once do I want. Oath yeah yeah well so let me see one of probably one of my favorite stories at the time I was old enough to carry gun this was this was on a youth hunt.

1:12:53I was still standing in the blind brown total I wasn't big enough to stand out of water yet I didn't have a pair of waiters but my brother was. And so. We had these single shot a can are 20 gauges do you remember those oh yeah so so my patty had given us a pair of those and my brother was sitting on a board between two trees outside of the blind and my dad's you know standing beside the. I call this thing a blind it's nothing fancy it was you know. Maybe six feet eight feet long 34 people could get in there I say six to eight feet long it was longer than that it was 34 people could have got in it but. Preferred to stand outside of it if you could but anyway so I'm in the blind my brothers off the left and there's a big group of ducks at Mallard's you know work in the whole and this one. Green wing teal comes in and you know that little teal whistle they do or whatever and that teal hits the water.

1:13:57And I don't know if my dad saw it or didn't see it but this I mean this group of Mallard's just about to break the trees and all of a sudden. My brother had mountain top that teal with his little 20 gauge and I mean just as just as happy as can be and my dad I kind of got onto him there for a second he's like what do you know what are you doing but. As I got older it was it was just. Incredible to be able to go out there and being included in a lot of that you know there were some pretty high profile people that that own that place and our family was never shy about having us around. My grandfather when he was alive had membership privileges so he always got to bring guest with him which was usually my dad my brother in me and then as we got older we you know had relationships with those people and got to go hunt with them and some of their guests and so as a young teen. Major and teenager you know you're out there hunting with the members and you're sitting there you know you're riding out in the Argo going out in the reservoir right and there's you know 30 40 50 thousand ducks getting up.

1:15:08And these people are are you in an oggling at at that and it's just kind of another day at the office for us still appreciate it but. Learned a lot about a lot about shooting a lot about hunting you know having to shoot behind the members obviously it's their place you don't ever want to shoot ahead of them but i'll tell you so my grandfather. He was 80 at the time this was probably 2010 my brother and I had been over there hunting with him and he comes into clubhouse and he's got bloody knuckles and we're like pop what. What happened to you know what happened to you like all this this guy from Alabama. Met me at the gate and told me he was going to go in there and go hunting so I hit him. And i'm like he did what. He saw it and he he pop had some pretty verbose languages like i'm you know i knocked that subject knocked him down and I was like well pop your 80 years old i don't you don't need to begin at fights you know.

1:16:12But i mean. i'm just running back a lot of lot of memories in my head some of the best memories the more recent memories I kind of got to do a lot of freelance and out there when my uncle took over. And my uncle passed away sadly March of 2025 but. You know we got to go out there and do a lot of hunting when the members weren't around. Well as Quapal and the old the old bunch they hunted it three days a week and then there were some changes and they kind of got away from the three days a week model and they started just shooting it you know whenever. And so a lot of times my uncle would would invite us over to go hunting and sometimes I remember there and sometimes there weren't you know but getting the drive at place like I stole it was. It was a. Was a hell of a lot of fun I know Brent I sent you I think I sent you a few videos off my camera roll. But. Oh yeah i'm just i'm having a hard time to scribe and you know how it is to be sitting there under a group of you know 3000 4000 5000 bucks and all of them want to get you know right where you are.

1:17:23You didn't have to call a whole hell of a lot if you were where the ducks wanted to be you know and you didn't have to be perfect with your decoy spread I say all that to say i'm not. Any kind of a fishy and auto with with calls or decoys or or anything like that you know I had one guy in college asked me you know my opinion on his decoy spread because he knew I hunted out there and I'm like did you were asking the wrong person yeah. It's a totally different standard it is it is but we uh what's that I said I've been places like that you know they thought they're decoys that you know you know you're the guest and you see it and you're like what are we doing and then 30 minutes later we're picking them all up because you know the hunt was out of this world so I know I've experienced the same thing it's pretty special. Well we it was a designated rest area out there that didn't didn't get hunted but you know the place is 1300 acres and and kind of at the freeway it's an end of it when when my brother and I were getting to go out and hunt our way you know all we would carry is a jet sled with maybe a half dozen decoys in it if we needed them.

1:18:39And then you know a pocket full of shells but really it's just where the opportunity to get where the ducks are and that's something that that you know very unique right just to be able to see where the ducks want to go because I'm sure as you guys know if you're where the ducks want to be you do not have to worry about a whole lot else right you can tell them what bad men bracket. Yeah that's accurate that's accurate well you know talking about some of this stuff I wish we wouldn't have spent so much time on on all those numbers and stats but it was fun discussing that stuff too. You know case and I always do it and I think this is the first time we've probably had a guest involved in rambling through kind of all this statistical information that's somehow going to quite to what we see the stucces and so. Maybe we'll have to get you back on talk a little bit more about your clay pool days and and all that. Oh yeah there's this fascinating stuff I have more time I can sit down and I've started putting a lot of that to paper to you know my uncle.

1:19:43Who passed away last year when he was dying I went and spent probably two weeks off and on. In hospice with him and I'd sit there for you know hour to time and record. Stuff and then I've I've set there sit down with my dad you know because a lot of that that was he disappeared and I started put a lot of my own my own reflections on paper about it just because you know war for our world has certainly changed yeah it sure has it sure has. Robert man we appreciate you joining us and coming on here talking to that stuff and sharing some of your your experiences those are I can only imagine the number of stories and scenes that are that are in your head case and talk about all the time stuff. We've been so blessed and fortunate to see a field that there's no way you could you could ever explain some of those things to another person but. Cool to experience nonetheless having some trouble trying to you know trying to pick just one right it's it's hard to to pick back to it but I'll if y'all have me on again I'll make sure I have you know some good ones dialed up for you and definitely some good Johnny stories because there's.

1:20:50Caught her to be I have to be he sounds like he's quite the character. I appreciate you guys more than you know for having me on thank you so much and Brent I really do want to say thank you for giving me a chance to. To publish that that peace and green head that the yeah yeah it's good read I encourage somebody that don't don't glance over that article it's it's pretty crazy story that does work work the read but yeah we appreciate you listening. You can catch us online at these standards for some and don't forget to buy your second duck stamp most catch next time.