Character Discussion: Mary and Adam

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1:01Hello, this is Mark and we're listening to one of Crave cast. I'm on today returning to the show Christina. How are you Christina? I'm doing well. Thank you. How are you doing? Right? Things we have things we good good Not great. Not great It is So I really like this idea. It's a little bit of a departure from doing episode discussions where we Choose a couple of characters at first. We were going to tackle. I think I was just feeling more ambitious the other day And to tackle a for some of Mary Adam Laura and Almanzo Why say for some I'm not being disgusting like this fan fiction things. I'm talking about Just a two-sum, which is totally normal and Christian No judgment. No judgment But I mentioned this in a previous episode with somebody that I

2:02Really want to do something with the fan fiction that's out there because it's twisted and don't google it No, if you're under 18 don't google it But I'm archive I'm currently archiving at all because I've a feeling it's going to vanish, but I really I Really want to make it's going to be like a rated R maybe even like a rated NC 17 type of thing for standing over 17 I am over 17. All right, so you're okay for conversation But I know you but I know your limits So I'm not going to like push them But there are things in these writings that exist and right now people like I would never read that but There are certain things in these writings that are beyond any limits, I think like I'm like one kind of sick mind comes up with ancestral storylines Or G's tentacle sex a lot

3:02Okay, the over abundance of a discussion of both control It's a very interesting Collection of fan fiction that's very poorly written. I would say it's written on maybe a 4th or 5th grade reading level if that Or is it written by AI? No, it's written by that guy Lennel I'm leaving his name in it's it's written by that creepy guy We'll see the guy who has like orders of protection with other people Like seriously, they you know, he's to the point where Cast members would do appearances and they get nervous if he shows up and Other times where there have actually been like physical skill but It's anyway But I do want to do something in the future possibly some type of dramatic reading Which I think would be really funny. I'm talking to court your race about this and she's in

4:07I think it's one of those things where you just have to like And just read it I'll keep you in on the loop on that and see if we can find a Less disgusting role for you Thank you, but that's not what we're discussing further today We're discussing a discussion between Mary and Adam and the relationship between these two and how they met What they think of each other and And all of that kind of stuff, you know, it's really a loosely based discussion about these two characters Yeah That sounds good As we know Mary Will she was like the pretty one, right for almost almost a total of four seasons. She was always a pretty one But you know, it's she was always considered like The prize. Who's the appellator of teacher's eyes? Yeah, and she would lose her vision towards the end of season four

5:13Yes, and all of a sudden she you know lost all Thinking of a better word than vision. She lost all hope I think I think that's that's one of the sad things about Mary is Yeah, it is You know one day we're you know moving forward and we're doing this and And then the next day something happens and you feel like you're really kicked down and you're like I can't I can't get up And I think that the characters um Rock bottom moment We get to actually witness and I think it's I think it's a really phenomenal. So I think it's why a lot of people Why it's resonated with so many people Where you have no choice you have like you can sit here and wallow and die or you can get a redo something about it Yeah, we've all had those moments. I certainly have oh yeah Um, and then of course with any sort of physically limiting disability that suddenly comes upon you

6:15I can't imagine it you know trying to get over that I try not he have to go through this uh Like out of maybe even depression and hopelessness and all this other and then you got to try and push through the other side of that has there ever been Another that you recall you watch a lot of old TV like I do Has there ever been a moment where Intellivision a character has Gone through a disability. I call it disability people might criticize me on that one But they go through the through something that's life changing like this And the public cares, you know like it's all of a sudden. It's the storyline I mean, I could think of like who shot J.R. That might be way before your time Yeah listeners know what I'm talking about Larry Hagman who shot him Um from the TV show Dallas So and I didn't even watch the show in it. It was it like I knew about it Yeah, and I think I think of people were to list their top five

7:19Like moments where Something tragic happened. They actually give a crap about I think Mary might be on that list um Good times you had the the loss of the father Johnny um Amos Um, he had a heart attack or yeah, I think he had a heart attack and died. He's a heartbreaking moment Uh, but there are there are moments where Shows Do Do things like this and people care, but I can't think of the time where somebody goes blind and people care Um, it's a newer show, but in uh, it's a show called Heartland. It's a Canadian show It's like a west type of show, right Yeah, the main character works with horses for a living and she gets kicked in the head by one and loses her sight for I don't know if it's like a couple three four episodes See, and that's another thing. So when Benanza Michael Landon's character little um, little Joe He He lost his vision in a similar way. He got kicked in the head by a horse

8:23I actually have a clip here. I have to dig through it of where he's struggling to learn he has to relearn and care I don't need you and I know what you you here So you lay this clip because it's ridiculous, but he goes to run he trips over a chair and it's like Silly and he regains his vision by the end of the episode spoiler and But yeah, I can't think of too many times where people care they actually give a crap that somebody um is sick of course and dr. Quinn reverend would lose his vision But it's not it didn't become like a thing. It wasn't like a point a plot point where We know that the character marry angles Based on a real person is going to lose her vision We know it's not going to come back at the end of the episode or next season Right, so it's kind of crazy when you really think about it like that It is Um, and then you wonder like they've taken so many liberties. Are they going to give her her vision back? I mean, they're going we know that they're going to give her a husband, so

9:29Well, I didn't when I first watched this show I didn't read I hadn't read any of the books So I didn't know that she was prominently blind. I didn't know you know I didn't know that maybe she wouldn't get her sight back When I was watching this for the first time Yeah, and you watched it when you were much younger when you were a kid, so it's almost like You know, what am I going to go read the dictionary to watch the show? You know, I'm not going to look it up and do you know a historical study that's much for future Christina to do Right Do you do that? I Almost ruins shows for me Like I'll be an IOTB and I'll miss the whole plot point because I'm doing a search on like Whether this is factual, you know Like we started watching Twin Peaks the other day from the 90s and I don't know if you ever watched it, but Twin Peaks is a really out there show and I'm like, oh, I wonder if Twin Peaks is a real place. What state is this taking place in and I

10:30Next thing you know, I'm a few minutes into it. It's a fictional town, and I've missed a complete plot point But now I know it's not real Who killed Laura that was another thing from that show who killed The character and it is murdered and they don't know killed it So Going to Mary, you know, Mary Had some relationships throughout her entire life. Um, I'm not sure how many boyfriends Mary would have just maybe three I mean like the major one of course was John Jr I like there was one or two others before she met Adam and boys already seem to like Mary, you know Yeah, which is pretty smart and Yeah, tall and developing As Laura would compare herself to her in the future Right one of the sadder things in the books. I think it's sad anyway is even in the books. They would refer to Mary as

11:38Like Laura kind of craps on herself a bit and they're in a mercantile in Sleepy. I don't I don't remember where they were in the book, but you know positive trading Pelt and stuff like that as one doesn't and Do you have any do you have many pelts in your house? I don't have many pelts No, I don't have one belt one. I don't know if it's a belt, but I have one lime skin. Oh Well, there you go Not that I did not procure myself Maybe all of you're like all of a sudden like Yeah, I'm gonna make her sheep I'm gonna make I'm gonna share my sheep and make a rabbit coat Yeah so The mercantile owner Basically comments how pretty Mary is and everything kind of a creepy old manway and How cute Lynn L and We

12:40I don't know and then just kind of looks at Laura and goes oh yeah, you too. Yeah, that type of that Oh But doesn't um in I don't know if I don't remember because I read the books a while back, but Doesn't Laura ask could her parents or something about Like what they love her more of shoes blotters really bad or something along those lines I don't remember that line, but uh You know, I just read the books a couple years ago again, and I still I mix the Show in with the books like I really have meld them together plus having this show I'm always discussing this and then I read the fan fiction and my head's just elsewhere So So yeah, I mean it's Mary grew up like having this, you know, she's pretty and she was always the pretty one, right? I mean It was almost like they cast her as this and successfully

13:43But maybe people who knew a little bit better and I would say that was probably 30% 40% of the audience knew that eventually Mary's has to go blind Right, and I wonder if they thought that a number of times because Mary gets sick remember she gets kicked by the horse We're just talking about that storyline being used with Michael landed and using it Um, then she had scar did you have scarlet fever on the show? No, I'm on the show they they say when she's starting to lose her sight the doctor the eye doctor asks Paul like Did she have any you know, was she sick or whatever and then she he mentions that she had scarlet fever And of course, I think that we at least I grew up kind of connecting that directly to her loss of it Even for us, you know like there's always been this connection then with Like foreshadowing You know her hating her glasses and then the glasses starting a fire you know

14:44Yeah, which is kind of a weird Um, but yeah, we get that one episode where we get that blood curling screamed don't worry. I'm not gonna play it Oh, I can't see I can't see and she's all upset um and then the angles do one of the weirder Um things they set up her bed in the Um living space. Yeah And I just still don't understand why they didn't put her in carry's bed Right and swap them. Let's be real here with Mary in carry's bed and carry upstairs My mom finally have a little privacy You know, nobody's stay I mean they might look at her and she could be staring right at them, but What do you say? They would still have grace baby grace. Yeah, we'd be down there. Yeah, we're in a great sleep

15:44I'm between them This is a good question. Where the where the hell do grace sleep? We're on a crib like at the end of the moon A whole life in a crib? No, no, not a whole life, but I don't remember I know carry would eventually graduate to the loft But Albert you know had come in by that point Yeah, I think they when they get like all the kids like James and this I don't know what they're all up there and then graces dance I don't know I get I don't know where grace slept kitchen Mary's old living room bed Yeah, they pulled out extra trundle bed. I don't I'm not sure You know, I'm really dumbfounded. I bet you there are people like no she slept here I mean, maybe she slept at the foot of their bed I think at least when carry goes up to the loft and then she has that bed with Cassandra and they have the divider with the boys on the other side. I feel like

16:47The grace would might have taken over carries on bed at the yeah, but they're we're talking a couple of seasons at least Where Albert's living there now we're up there with Laura Yeah, where they have their like blanket fort Yeah, hey, if you if you know I have to go and look now it's one of those things. It's like A fern it's like you have to like pay attention to these things sometimes and Yeah, it's where grace just kind of appears everyone. Maybe she slept in the high chair. It's about the only place where I ever really saw her Right I mean all right, so So like I was saying in the in one of the weirder choices they set up a trundle bed I think it was a trundle bed in the living room Which I just don't get like I really at least you know squeeze it in behind the chimney or something

17:48um But don't you have to be all out in the open It's very very odd and we have that like John Jr comes over to be like hey What's it? It's not yeah, you're right. I'm sorry John Jr. is gone. Yeah, John Jr. never really Um Yeah, like what when did Chicago air That wouldn't be until season six or something much later. No, no, no, um season eight eight or nine eight I think it's season eight So like John Jr. gets caught two timing and then they just split up We never hear from when we hear from him, but it wouldn't be until years later Yeah, when Victor French returns I think I should have rooted that a little closer to To this season because it's like really far out and people maybe are like who's Joe Jr You know, I don't know. Oh, yeah, yeah, oh the guy in the sketch Yeah

18:48Um, I still think one of the craziest things was where Rodamus Para went to the set Right after they finished wrapping and Michael Landon's laughing because we just killed you, you know He was hoping to get back on the show And I guess unless you're gonna be nobody one can no be ghost you're not gonna really get back on the show We're gonna be part of a flashback or something right so So Mary loses her vision. Of course everyone is like holy crap. You know, like this is crazy Um, everyone's trying to help. She's really really rejecting all help which is a lot of self-pitch Involved which is exactly what I would personally probably be in line with. I don't know about you Um, I don't know. I say to people. I've had a number of blind people on the show reviewing Show with me I said right to them. You know, it's one of my fears It is one of my fears But I think when I talk to blind people and I hear about their life and everything

19:51It doesn't give me hope that I've got forbid something like that were to happen It would be a path to Yeah, overcoming it And that is there's so much um, like there's so many aids and technology and things like that I mean, it's not like you know in the 1800s Going blind man, you just it's not What would you have done? You sure enough Well, I guess what you would have done is you would have um headed over to independence, right? All right. Oh, no, no, I wasn't aiming independence I don't think I was a blind. No, I wasn't a man. Oh, yeah The Burton School for the Blind in Iowa. That's Iowa. Yeah. So what is that distance? I would want to grow up to Iowa I don't I'm terrible with Anything outside of New York for the most part Are you like you know, like you know, you're on place, you know, you know, yeah Like in Norway like do you know like where a certain

20:52Town is if it has less than like 50,000 people Well, there are probably a lot of towns that have less than 50,000 people You're right Actually, I mean, it's far, but it's not Painful. I don't know if there would have been a train at the time. It's roughly 300 miles It's probably like 550 kilometers Won't they they took a train they took like a train or like where they took a wagon Then they took a train and then they took another wagon I'm looking to see if there's a current train route that Because those two locations and there's no one One pod drops her off and they say he gets he has to catch in early because they tell him not to stay around Just go because it's easier or something and then he says oh, I got to take an earlier train I'm going by I mean, I think that that particular you know, it's interesting that Yeah, I thought that there would be a train line that existed

21:54Maybe not like direct, but maybe he took like you know the stage to Another town or a place where they had a train that goes You know to sleep the eye or whatever And then take another stage. Sleepy eye is only like a few miles away from one a grove Missy so sleepy eye is literally Oh Take 40 miles from one a grove Yeah, that's a good wagon ride, but yeah, it's Let's see if you're walking I tend to like if you double the walking time I tend that's my new calculation If you're going to go maps and put the two things in the amount of time that it would take to walk I double it for a wagon All right, and that's 14 hours to walk. So I would say seven hours by wagon Yeah, you have the time, you see it again You have for the time not double. I have it

22:55I double it's 28 hours to I'm sorry Um Oh wait, no, I would have to double it so be Yeah, I have it all right still early people So going back to the Mary and Adam discussion Of course, this all happens in a crescendos into the episode um the two-parter, which I think is a series this season finale Yeah, I'll be waving as you drive away, which is beloved episode, right? Where she goes and we're introduced to Adam Kendall She thinks you can see at first She thinks he can see well, it's interesting because it's I think we also think that did you No, I thought he was blind really right off the bat Yeah Somebody who I would like to refer to as observant Because like he was like like feeling that feeling

23:56But like you know Touching the wall for guidance to get to the room I think if you watch it again Right When they first introduce Adam I don't believe we're supposed to believe he's blind there are indications like you could see even running his hand on the wall Yeah, there are certain things But I think that we're supposed to be slightly fooled, but you know what I can also be completely wrong you were not I just assumed he was Maybe you watched part two first So yeah, so we all of course know this Back and forth. I mean She's also a bit younger. I mean, this is like an angle's trend right with how do you think he is when she first made to Was she's 15 right? Yeah, yeah, she's 15, but how old is he now I'm trying to think so I'm gonna say he's like 21 22

24:58And then when I have this amazing quote from Adam when she turned 16 16 years Yeah, so it is there's a big age difference of course The it's not brought up. I don't believe it's brought up how old he is No But he certainly carries himself like like an adult But for some like at least for me But there's not as big an age difference between Mary and Adam and I know we're not gonna talk about more than all of it Just as Because to me like more still seem like a little girl compared to Among so even when she's transitioning into like leaving her hair down and whatnot and then putting it up into the fun Whereas when Mary and Adam meet it seems more like Reasonable or like the age gap is not reasonable then I wonder if it's because we are always

26:00Having a younger person to compare Mary to that we think but then she kind of She looks older you know like when you watch those first two seasons you're like oh, she's like a baby But she does grow up pretty quickly and I think that her look by the time we get to season three or four Doesn't change much in terms of she doesn't get too much older looking No She grows her hair goes to hell Oh, yeah, yeah, I'd all ignore that Some are like in terms of Like facial features and whatnot What do you think of the way that Adam approached her with teaching her The basics of like eating remember like it was like based on a clock And not eating with her hand that type of stuff. I mean, I think it I think it's good that you learn that from the ghetto. It's must you know if he feels difficult maybe but

27:03Um sort of like tough love type of thing. Yeah, just do it. I think that's exactly it And that he you know when he she threw her plate or something and then he said well you clean it up You make the best you clean that up. Yeah Um You know, it seems maybe harsh, but I think it was good. You know, you got to snap the person out of this Like swallowing Because they got it, you know, she's young so she's got her whole life to live so she's got to snap out of that and just get on You know, I mean, not get off. Where's this you know tragedy? They like, you know, you know, it is what it is and it's kind of like this These are the cards who are dealt. I think that's the kind of Attitude he kind of went and I wonder if they would ever revisit that in the future You know kind of like hey remember when you first came in and Wasn't he he was much younger when he lost his sight wouldn't he he was like I want to see because he's over 13 Yeah, a little younger I was he kicked I forgot what while he was jumping on the rocks in a lake or something and then he slipped and fell in his head. She's

28:09Um Which is why he has that fear of water wouldn't he have the course right which is kind of cringy. I don't I don't really Um, but I guess I get it Um, and of course all right, so We end with them kind of like the sparks are flying like we have Um, Mary, you know, basically learning that Adam is blind of course and we We just have two episodes of I think a really good connection between these two characters and the actors I thought we're really good I like the storyline of course this is probably the biggest up to this point of little house in a break the biggest work of fiction Mm-hmm, right. I mean, this is diverting a crazy plotline like I think we can we can maybe Have delusions that the mercantile had a gossipy wife, but there was a mercantile of course

29:11Um, we can do a number we can We leave we go or broke their storms all types of crazy things Um, and Mary of course goes blind, but to have her in a relationship now and it's like blossoming Is just a complete work of fiction because the real Mary. I think she wouldn't she would not marry I believe yeah, she was mostly at home when she like they she didn't go to Well, she got all plants on her life. Well, she found the mariongles um blind school Which I reached out to years ago and they've yet to get back to me I wanted to find some stuff the Iowa College for the blind Um, no, that's where she originally went I kind of sworn there was Because I feel like when she goes blind in the books she just Is at home

30:11I could I know that there's some blind school that has Some connection with her and I don't see it here So let's see um, so moving on we go we come back into season five and we have they're established They're like, you know, the new you know, um hot couple of of welcome They both have really grown they're they're flirting like crazy, right? I mean they have really They are genuinely Onscreen seemingly to have fun, you know like these two characters are really being developed really seamlessly and Kind of organically Yeah, I think Um We finally will get to the middle of season of um, yes season five And it seems as though Charles doesn't really have much of an issue with Mary getting married young

31:16All right, well, I mean he didn't have an issue with her getting married at with John junior at what 13? Was she? But that had been 13 I think she was 13 or four. Yeah, because it was season three So that was 14 maybe but still Still, yeah, 40 younger than Laura was when she wanted to marry um But I guess um, do you think Charles is like well, you know what He seems like a nice guy She's blind. Let's put this all aside Um, the episode the wedding of course is a lot of Chaos going on because we have that crazy dust storm Susan gets lost. She's like, I'm Susan the flower girl like dropping the flowers and running off and they all kind of hide basically the equivalent of Albert stairs That's basically what it's hitting head with a glass thing or something and then she would be in

32:18It would have been interesting if she Oh my oh, she went blind. Yeah, yeah, one episode, you know, yeah, just for one But there are moments where I'm not sure you know, we were kind of Going back and forth of whether they're even going to Get married, right? Yeah, she's worried about what if they have children what are they gonna and the children are cited How are they gonna handle that situation? And there's no reason why they wouldn't be cited, you know, it's probably the odds are that they would be cited Yeah, cuz Mary and Adam both had sight Before you know, they weren't good. It's not a true redditary thing Yeah So yeah, I mean these are all things that I'm sure are genuine Issues that would come up with a blind couple You know, what do you do? What do you know? How do I do this? How do I do that? And of course later on we learn

33:18That tragedy does strike unfortunately Um, and I have to wonder that if Even though they had a few cited people in the blind school during the fire Would it have helped and I think it would have Yeah So that's really really dark to really think about but It's really Like maybe their bedroom should have been I mean, I guess you could say now like your bedroom should have been on the main floor No, right, but no one had a bedroom on the main floor or all upstairs The main Miss or sort of mistake there is not grabbing the baby right away and going Yeah, like if they grab a baby and then go out with the baby and then go back in to help the kids or whatever How did it play out? So Mary got up and ran past the baby to help the kids, right? Yeah, I think so It's been a while since I've seen that episode, but they me to help the kids get out of the

34:21of the um of the school and Then they Can't go back in really because there's too much fire and Alice is left there So she tries to grab the baby and then get stuck because there's fire at the door now at this point where you know the um The kendals aren't established couple You know like all right, they met at the end of season four Throughout season five they would you know do all their stuff and they get married during it Um, and she gets Sading up once she gets pregnant once the husband is carriage You know, I forgot about that Yeah, they're throwing every tragedy at Mary and then she thinks she's gonna see again, but she doesn't Yeah, like Which is a which is ironic because when later on when Adam would Get regained his sight she definitely has this kind of I don't know fits Maybe just envy

35:23Yeah, well, I think it's um, I don't worry because they see it a bit in this episode where she think she's gonna get our side again Adam goes through that I think that he's worried that when she sees maybe she sees he's not you know both Visit like physical appearance and then also she can see and do so much other stuff now. She doesn't have to be a teacher of applying school that type of thing um Those types like thousand fears since self lack of like self-confidence or something like that And of course, of course Professionally marrying Adam do very well with the school from when I can tell like they the maybe not do of well But they certainly make a living doing it and it's their profession but it's really the Um all of these tragedies that follow them Like you brought up the miscarriage There there would be the wagon fire right there that's later But of course having the baby and having this joyous occasion of um, what's the Charles junior? What was the name of the baby?

36:27It's a well-known name. I think it's like Charles yeah Yeah, it's something Kendall I can flip it up. Like well, I'm gonna ask um croc Are you typing? All right Adam Charles Holbert Kendall junior. I knew it was Adam um Holbert after Caroline's Parents, I guess it's a freaking long name so Yeah, having him and All of this stuff. It's kind of like working out for Mary and everybody's so happy about this And everyone else is growing up and then we have the Well, I do want to mention in the beginning of series. I mean season six We established the blind school where we have the herodos in school of the blind which is um either near or

37:28in Walnut Grove And we bring Hester Sue in which of course she becomes a completely important part of the whole storyline even having her own storylines and So I mean right now we're telling the you know timeline but So I say we finish up the timeline quickly. Of course this the The blind school fire um ends up with Alice and Adam Both perishing in the fire So that of course makes the Garvey's move away We have um Old was oh yeah, the baby is only a month old Yeah Yeah, which is pretty crazy And I don't was maybe we make them proud was that that was not a season finale, right? No, it was in the middle like it was a two-parter in the middle

38:28What was the season finale for little house seasons? Well, that was he loves me. He loves me not when they rebuild the blind school That's interesting Or like we're trying to rebuild them and they move to sleep the eye right All right, then Laura then we introduce Houston Yeah so when They're they are established in Winoka right and In the middle of season seven a little bit of blast in oil goes off and Adam regains his sight What's so interesting about Adam is I don't know I feel like he was well-educated um Before he went blind But he wasn't you know everything he learned was through the time when he was blind Yeah And he decided to follow a career in law we have that moment Where um he has to take the exam and marry convinces him you know to make an exception for Adam

39:32Which is really interesting Yeah And finally, you know, we have Moments where they're barely on the show we they finally show up in season eight Of course, I do want to mention blind justice. We get the the attorney episode where Adam is Defending this property salesperson We're selling swamp land, I believe Yeah But then episodes um Season eight episode 11 we have a Christmas they never forgot which is genuinely a throwaway episode Even though we reviewed on this podcast often Right where it's a flashback episode and Yeah, we we have Mary and Adam together They never have another kid Which is kind of interesting They kind of adopted it like why wouldn't they have adopted a blind kid or something Right, I mean, I mean, it would have been it would have been in line with the Ingalls way, you know, yeah

40:35Don't I think I mean imagine losing two children Yeah, no, I couldn't you know, it's it's terribly and then Yeah, I guess choosing not to and I guess the blind kids are in a lot of ways of replacement for them like they're very close with the blind school kids And vice versa the kids are very close with them Even Susan What are your thoughts in terms of the whole dynamic so we have we have Adam Who's really kind of fairly well put together and we're guessing early 20s when they first meet And we have Mary who's completely unhinged because she's so upset over the loss of revision And then it kind of there's um There's an equal like she quickly picks up This you know, she becomes a teacher for the blind and she kind of fulfills her Life goal. She always want on the show. She always want to be a teacher. She wants to teach her You know, I mean we have the misspeel moment

41:39Where she um we we see she could be tough when she needs to be tough She can be um Speak up time I wonder they should have misspeel say you know put a curse on her that she goes blind I mean women at least someone interesting, but The misspeel character's such a dark woman like she's so horrible That I almost think that that would have been like whoa, that's crazy, you know Yeah, she maybe she was a witch. Yeah, you look back. Yeah, like what maybe she was a work Thank you She put um some type of voodoo on it So at that point Mary kind of regains her own self worth in a lot of ways and she becomes more the Mary we know and But we do have those you know very powerful moments where um Like for instance where Adam can't take the exam

42:42So she goes and she makes a case for him to the professor and he agrees You know these are it's interesting dynamic to have the the wife You know in the 70s are actually probably 80s when that aired it It's really a role reversal where the woman's like well, let me give you a piece of my mind And it's not probably not something you'd see At all really in a relationship like that in the 19th century. I don't believe No, I don't think so either. Yeah, like I don't think um They had as much moxie as Or they were allowed to where we have that much moxie Yeah, I think they have they could be tough and strong in other ways but not in terms of like standing up for Other people particularly up to men And of course that's written into the show, you know It's really fun to watch that type of stuff where you help you know you have Mary help him achieve his goals

43:44And he gets to take the exam again and I believe he passed I'm guessing he passed Even though back then from what I understand like you do a little bit of research into this I don't think that there was an established bar exam until like the 1890s or even later And you could just call yourself a lawyer kind of like on doctor Quinn medicine woman where You you literally as long as you Can I think it's where the whole point in the states where you're given the option to represent yourself I think that's where it kind of comes from like you know it well enough. All right, you represent yourself Or you can go to a professional. It's kind of like you can install this Um operating system on your computer yourself or you can go to the Geeks squad and spend like 10 time, you know Like five hundred dollars for them to do press update, you know

44:44All right. So is it our attorneys technically The Geeks squad. Yes, I think so They just have they passed a few exams I'm not encouraging anyone to represent themselves That would be so scary Yeah So yeah, I would have to have my clips if I'm just gonna represent myself It's reputable That's the most terrible thing I've ever heard So Um, but Mary does become a bit of a muted character Yeah, I mean that yeah, I think like At first she's a very strong character and then she can get very um, I think she's very Like she has like deep emotions about things and gets you know deeply upset get deeply happy

45:47You know, but then after like I think even before I don't get to sit back she becomes kind of just like oh, she's there You know like oh, yeah, there's Mary No, to get on the relationships of these two characters Do you think like Mary would I mean she of course would disclose What you know John junior and the relationships of other people and All of these things to Adam and I'm wondering you know Adam I would guess that would have had some relationships as well So it has a great personality Yeah, I mean I am Wondering um, I think that Adam Seems like mature enough to have been engaged at some point Like it's almost like he's worldly that's why I think he might even be younger than I'm saying But I'm gonna look up how old lindwood boomer was

46:48During the airing that could we just go by that Yeah Um I mean if Mary had a failed one failed engagement. I'm sure he must have had at least one Failed engagement What year would he be on Little House, do you know He's one of 55 He would uh, it would have been I'll see you soon. Yeah, it's 37 77 28 Is age right now? He's 78. No, no, no He was on Little House in the year 19 Oh, I see I'm 1978 something like that. All right, so they make him 23 Mm-hmm. So yeah, I think we're we're kind of on the money when it comes to that Um, how does that make him now that makes him 68? I ride No, six, what was he born 55

47:49So 45 plus 25 is 70 Yeah Linwood boomer 70 is that right? Yeah Added to 70 Yeah, how's that possible It's my math wrong. All right. I want that's right because my my dad was one of 56 and he's gonna be 70 next year So Well happy birthday to um Linwood boomer who just turned uh 70 years old on October 90 Well, we're all getting old all right Not you though So That's just crazy to me when I think of Adam as being in today 70 Well to me he's always that the age that he was in the show Yeah At the very least like the one in the Christmas episode

48:53Yeah, but that's not too much, you know older but you think Mary would cover up like you think Mary would be like well I'm not going to Um I want to disclose all of my personal stuff like that. I was gonna get married and we have a little bit of an an Alice Garvey moment Oh Who are you talking to um The like I was talking about John junior. Who's John junior So a little bit of a story about a cattillion I feel like she would have disclosed That if if if not anything else she would have disclosed that because that was a key There's a lot of cover-ups in the world of little house in the prairie We have i mean Harriet Harriet has hers, you know, she was engaged. Everybody was engaged. Yeah Nelly was you know nelly was married then it was an old

49:57Um, I know the piece of paper was done up Yeah, I don't know if that's an old but yeah, it's an old enough, right Think about that that's technically I mean There's there's a little bit of polygamy right there Because it would have to be a legal action right you would have to I wonder But what if they didn't consummate I think that that also allowed it to be an old I think that's the That we're aware of anyway they I think if you don't consummate it can be an old but otherwise it can't be I don't know enough about this stuff What now it is yeah Oh, I don't know I don't mean anything as possible now Um I think if anything should have disclosed uh John Jr. Yeah, yeah, I agree

50:57Because they feel like we share you know a lot of You know background and history and with each other and in that Christmas episode we don't get Um and Adam's story Oh Which is really sad because he's one of the few people we don't have a backstory on I mean we got Hester Su's back story and she didn't exist Um yeah What have been the end there also would have been nice to have him more because When the story of going blind or something. I don't I mean not exactly Christmassy, but Well, yeah, but we get that story in blind journey when he crosses Um, but the I think that it would have been nice to have him and very more presence or have seen more interaction with them and for example a monsollum mora because they are there At least for some time and want to grow Um, then they're nearby you know, they're in sleepy eye

52:01But when a monsollum mora get together and his whole law thing does kind of falls flat Yeah, you know, it sees we want to see him work once work one case. Yeah Like he's like going to be a lawyer one case stuff. Bye And then now I tried it, you know, not really for me Um, did they move to New York? Was it? Mm-hmm, I know that the um Yeah, John, but it's still there's New York farm So they moved with uh, Nellie and personal to New York. Yeah, so they establish, you know um A Caroline's franchise Can you picture those two those four in New York? You know like That'd be kind of interesting. I mean because Mary's still blind Yeah, that would have been very interesting to get to know a new place

53:02Um Like well, I guess like it helps to have like Adam has his sight back right so he can be like look after Uh, in a sense Um But that must have been really disorienting to like move to a place Yeah, especially about them. Yeah, it was definitely going from Going from like um, even like what they consider to be a busy city to New York, which is a real crazy city Um at the turn of the and you know living there at the turn of the last entry has it's pretty bananas There all that pizza Hello, this is mine and I just wanted a quick moment to thank all the people who make this project Merchants because of course support. I am able to produce this podcast create stickers and trading cards and all types of If you would like to support I think that the end of being one of the more memorable couples to your mailbox and please visit patreon.com slash one of the

54:02Any sort of nice that we'll go back to the show I think that the end of being one of the more memorable couples which is fictional Yeah, but I think it's nice that what we what we walk away with is A celebration of the Mary person like the human And we celebrate her with a really beloved character and we give her this you know of course fictional And dramatic life that is just a black cloud over her the whole time pretty much Right down to like being a four eyes and then And Can't kick by horses and Yeah, mom's cheating on her death Almost And she's yelling at Gil Gerard and the ending man And her sister's imaginary and gone sister Yeah, she's Yeah Grace doesn't even have a bed

55:05We don't even know where she is Yeah, but you know there's a lot of tragedy with Mary Individually like that has nothing to do with all of them Yeah, definitely It would have been interesting to see them come back like Mary and Adam Come back or have they gone yet um or appear anyway and like one more and a wands ago through those That tough time where you know where he gets like when he gets a He gets diphtheria and then a stroke and then Or gives birth and then all that like the thing if they had come in Because they were still in sleepy at that time what they yeah, I mean they're really not that far So it would have been interesting to see them come in and try and help out I also think you know it would have been so interesting if We had more of a connection of Mary in the telephone Because Obviously it would be a great way for her to communicate over a distance and it would be It would be a great way just because she's blind, you know, it's like the same you know and

56:09I don't know I just feel like she would have actually ended up being like she could have run like a switchboard Maybe she did at the blind school. I doubt it she'd have to like Be grabbing all the levers and stuff. I don't know if you'd be able to control that if you're blind but I don't know I just think um we could have done more with these characters and I feel as though once they Once we got to about season five they just thought all right, we need to like start phasing these This character Yeah, but after season six, it's more focused on more in a manzo and not so much I'm marrying Adam and I wonder if that was dictated um ahead of time or whether it was dictated by the fans um Yeah If they wanted to see more of because we know that Or if you had read the books before you saw this then you would have known that or I would get together with a manzo eventually

57:14um And maybe they wanted to Where was it dictated by something that wanted to go back to more source material I also one of the things I think it's really kind of an oversight with all of this is of course finances are discussed here and there But for the most part they're really not like All right when Mary needs to travel somewhere they're like all right how are we gonna pay for this and we're gonna like you know Do kind of um or go fund me or type of thing which is essentially what happens but When it comes down to it we don't know how Mary and Adam kind of Pay for their life Yeah Because from what I can tell the school is like they're not paying to be in the school right But maybe they are Do you think there's like a tuition Like I don't do the angles pay to have Mary that's out there maybe I think they did there's no discussion really

58:14A little bit like we have the owner He says he's kind of like Lee he's not gonna do this anymore And he wants to give the school to Adam Yeah But he's even broke too like so I mean that's it really um They're doing it for the goodness of of um mankind not really for profit Right and then when they move to one that growth they have to ask To borrow or to loan a couple horses and they give them those Remember they buy yeah they buy this creatures they're going to standish is Yes, saloon Um but I think I May like I maybe it was enough to cover Like the students maybe they paid enough to cover Like for expensive like you know food costs and like Textbooks or you know like I mean a Hester Sue has to be taking the salary right I mean it's not too much for free Yeah So It must be there to have a budget remember we did talk about like this is how much it would be to

59:19I don't know whether they were gonna rent or buy the Blind school they were gonna rent it right so yeah you're right They must have been paying tuition. I don't believe government was giving grants to blind schools at this point Not at that time. No, I don't think so um because they were when they're discussing the rent part I think they can ship in some and then like Laura chips in you're trying to ship in not the carol and chips in You know family chips and you know everyone chips in Um a bit for the rent but they have to have had some kind of income to cover that rent after those two months But they prove And we also have this like turbulent relationship between Adam and her his father Mm-hmm, and then he dies leaving nothing right yeah He leaves yeah because he he has owes Money so they have to use whatever he had to pay the debt But I don't understand that like you shouldn't be like you're not responsible for someone else's debt

1:00:24Well, no, no, but the father's money whatever was left of it All they had to use to pay for his debts first before they can inherit anything right right and they don't end up inheriting As much as they hoped we should have had that episode called the inheritance too Spoiler it's gonna be all fall All right It's a story that happens to often in real life and in um fiction is the How much are you gonna have left nothing? Let me count not say negative Yeah But then they have the father He comes in the first time I think we see him as when she's gonna have that first baby And then she ends up having a miscarriage and then he leaves in a hurry. I don't remember why But I think initially he's interested in having this you know air type of thing Um, and then when he finds out he's not gonna have one he like leaves

1:01:26Yeah, he's like by and then that's like where you leave me We're gonna come with you to New York and he's like no, no, you stay It's better that you stay lots of difficulties in New York. It does seem like a real jerk Yeah, yeah Which is kind of amazing that you know Adam turned out as um balanced as he ended up being I know right um And then he would meet a But I guess you know when I do compare Mary's past um relationships Which really just probably at the very most was kissing right like we're not right um yeah We To Alice you know where it was a marriage. So we have I think we can presume that you know they did the deed Yeah, and I think that's it. I think that's the um upsetting nature the difference between these two things But I wonder if Alice was that same age like very young

1:02:28I forget the age that she was young Because she's still when she's living it out like great because her parents or mother is running the boarding house Yeah, like that whole situation is really crazy You know that's a discussion for the future because the whole Alice Getting married young and her mother having a boarding house almost seems like a madam type of situation or Some type of financial understanding Yeah, something sketchy about that whole thing because that dude was a lot older Yeah, yeah, he was way older. He's old enough to me or the way they To trade out who's old enough to be your father Like he he should have been dating the mom now Yeah, it's crazy, right But now don't for pretty little Alice Well, Christine, I think that kind of sums up what we wanted to talk about I appreciate taking the time this morning to discuss it Yeah, of course

1:03:29No problem If you're listening at home and you have any suggestions of other pairings or ideas or things we might have missed because I'm sure we missed a whole lot This is just about a casual conversation about two characters Um, this one, you know, this one's a little bit closer. So um discussing two characters that for the most part we're in every scene together after Season five Sorry I remember that one episode where these escape prisoners or whatever take over the bindings line school Adam is not there for that he goes off on some Yeah, I will be it would have been interesting to have a little coverage about After like when he comes home and he realizes oh this thing happened Yeah, what would my child and my wife would have happened had you been there Yeah, what would he have done and those type of issues? Yeah, I can believe you forgot about that

1:04:33Yeah, which is a strange storyline Doesn't really do so was there either she was was she also like she was also the way I think Yeah So it would have been interesting. I mean Laura's there Yeah, I think the whole point was that Laura was going to Stay there or she was gonna help out Yeah, but then things take a quick turn That's crazy Yeah, the kidnapping um or kidnapping or home invasion type of things I always felt as though they kind of felt flat Yeah, but like um, but that particular episode does have a couple of really dramatic moments Yeah, she uh, she was Taken sort of hostage by one of the names remember in season two Yeah, the two before yeah in that same house Um So it would have been interesting to tie those

1:05:37Together or something and then have her and I have a discussion wasn't the blind school handsome house Yeah, but the building anyway was used Yeah, as that other building where they go and they rent the place And then she's working for them and then she's yeah, so caught up in all that And then it's Yeah So it would have been interesting to have some kind of post discussion between her and Adam or something about Yeah, those two and it's really the one incident the one reason that's it It would have said something stupid and like 70s style like Well, I got to be there next down or like yeah, well, it's so bad doesn't happen again And then it's like I feel like they do give Adam like little tiny Goofy comments sometimes like to say stuff like that to end it Um Like what would he say in that thing at the end um

1:06:41So They will marry next time you're coming with me I don't have so stupid yeah But um, thank you so much We better put a bell in on the door Well, that's it. Yeah, put a bell like when you walk in belting But Christina, thank you so much. I do appreciate it. Maybe she had an open a walnut Grove cast calm To find all of your Special Episodes and um, yeah, thank you so much and um just stand on it Well, it looks as though you've made it to the end of another episode if you enjoy this podcast Please consider supporting us head on over to patreon.com slash one at Grove cast or head over to buy me a coffee calm slash our podcasts any support is appreciated You