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Christina returns to the show to help me dissect and break down the different elements, trials and tribulations between Mary
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There's a place to be living in a distance of three
One round for one, there's a place to be living in a distance of three
I'm supposed to, I saw, it's me, I saw the prairie
We're chasing us to watch the day
Hello, this is Mark and we're listening to one of
Crave cast. I'm on today returning to the show Christina. How are you Christina?
I'm doing well. Thank you. How are you doing? Right? Things we have things we good good
Not great. Not great
It is
So I really like this idea. It's a little bit of a departure from doing episode discussions where we
Choose a couple of characters at first. We were going to tackle. I think I was just feeling more ambitious the other day
And to tackle a for some of Mary Adam Laura and Almanzo
Why say for some I'm not being disgusting like this fan fiction things. I'm talking about
Just a two-sum, which is totally normal and Christian
No judgment. No judgment
But I mentioned this in a previous episode with somebody that I
Really want to do something with the fan fiction that's out there because it's twisted and don't google it
No, if you're under 18 don't google it
But I'm archive I'm currently archiving at all because I've a feeling it's going to vanish, but I really I
Really want to make it's going to be like a rated R maybe even like a rated NC 17
type of thing
for standing over 17
I am over 17. All right, so you're okay for conversation
But I know you but I know your limits
So I'm not going to like push them
But there are things in these writings that exist and right now people like I would never
read that but
There are certain things in these writings that are beyond any limits, I think like I'm like one kind of sick mind
comes up with
ancestral
storylines
Or G's tentacle sex a lot
Okay, the over abundance of a discussion of both control
It's a very
interesting
Collection of fan fiction that's very poorly written. I would say it's written on maybe a 4th or 5th grade reading level if that
Or is it written by AI?
No, it's written by that guy Lennel
I'm leaving his name in it's it's written by that creepy guy
We'll see the guy who has like orders of protection with other people
Like seriously, they you know, he's to the point where
Cast members would do appearances and they get nervous if he shows up and
Other times where there have actually been like physical skill but
It's anyway
But I do want to do something in the future possibly some type of dramatic reading
Which I think would be really funny. I'm talking to court your race about this and she's in
I think it's one of those things where you just have to like
And just read it
I'll keep you in on the loop on that and see if we can find a
Less disgusting role for you
Thank you, but that's not what we're discussing further today
We're discussing a discussion between Mary and Adam and the relationship between these two and how they met
What they think of each other and
And all of that kind of stuff, you know, it's really a loosely based discussion about these two characters
Yeah
That sounds good
As we know Mary
Will she was like the pretty one, right for almost almost a total of four seasons. She was always a pretty one
But you know, it's she was always considered like
The prize. Who's the appellator of teacher's eyes?
Yeah, and she would lose her vision towards the end of season four
Yes, and all of a sudden she you know lost all
Thinking of a better word than vision. She lost all hope I think
I think that's that's one of the sad things about Mary is
Yeah, it is
You know one day we're you know moving forward and we're doing this and
And then the next day something happens and you feel like you're really kicked down and you're like I can't I can't get up
And I think that the characters
um
Rock bottom moment
We get to actually witness and I think it's I think it's a really phenomenal. So I think it's why a lot of people
Why it's resonated with so many people
Where you have no choice you have like you can sit here and wallow and die or you can get a redo something about it
Yeah, we've all had those moments. I certainly have oh yeah
Um, and then of course with any sort of physically limiting disability that suddenly comes upon you
I can't imagine it you know trying to get over that I try not he have to go through this
uh
Like out of maybe even depression and hopelessness and all this other and then you got to try and push through the other side of that
has there ever been
Another that you recall you watch a lot of old TV like I do
Has there ever been a moment where
Intellivision a character has
Gone through a disability. I call it disability people might criticize me on that one
But they go through the through something that's life changing like this
And the public cares, you know like it's all of a sudden. It's the storyline
I mean, I could think of like who shot J.R. That might be way before your time
Yeah listeners know what I'm talking about Larry Hagman who shot him
Um from the TV show Dallas
So and I didn't even watch the show in it. It was it like I knew about it
Yeah, and I think I think of people were to list their top five
Like moments where
Something tragic happened. They actually give a crap about I think Mary might be on that list um
Good times you had the the loss of the father Johnny um Amos
Um, he had a heart attack or yeah, I think he had a heart attack and died. He's a heartbreaking moment
Uh, but there are there are moments where
Shows
Do
Do things like this and people care, but I can't think of the time where somebody goes blind and people care
Um, it's a newer show, but in uh, it's a show called Heartland. It's a Canadian show
It's like a west type of show, right
Yeah, the main character works with horses for a living and she gets kicked in the head by one and loses her sight for
I don't know if it's like a couple three four episodes
See, and that's another thing. So when Benanza Michael Landon's character little um, little Joe
He
He lost his vision in a similar way. He got kicked in the head by a horse
I actually have a clip here. I have to dig through it of where he's struggling to learn he has to relearn and care
I don't need you and I know what you you here
So you lay this clip because it's ridiculous, but he goes to run he trips over a chair and it's like
Silly and he regains his vision by the end of the episode spoiler and
But yeah, I can't think of too many times where people care they actually give a crap that
somebody um is sick of course and dr. Quinn reverend would lose his vision
But it's not it didn't become like a thing. It wasn't like a point a plot point where
We know that the character marry angles
Based on a real person is going to lose her vision
We know it's not going to come back at the end of the episode or next season
Right, so it's kind of crazy when you really think about it like that
It is
Um, and then you wonder like they've taken so many liberties. Are they going to give her her vision back?
I mean, they're going we know that they're going to give her a husband, so
Well, I didn't when I first watched this show I didn't read I hadn't read any of the books
So I didn't know that she was prominently blind. I didn't know you know
I didn't know that maybe she wouldn't get her sight back
When I was watching this for the first time
Yeah, and you watched it when you were much younger when you were a kid, so it's almost like
You know, what am I going to go read the dictionary to watch the show?
You know, I'm not going to look it up and do you know a historical study that's much for future Christina to do
Right
Do you do that? I
Almost ruins shows for me
Like I'll be an IOTB and I'll miss the whole plot point because I'm doing a search on like
Whether this is factual, you know
Like we started watching Twin Peaks the other day from the 90s
and
I don't know if you ever watched it, but Twin Peaks is a really out there show and
I'm like, oh, I wonder if Twin Peaks is a real place. What state is this taking place in and I
Next thing you know, I'm a few minutes into it. It's a fictional town, and I've missed a complete plot point
But now I know it's not real
Who killed Laura that was another thing from that show who killed
The character and it is murdered and they don't know killed it
So
Going to Mary, you know, Mary
Had some relationships throughout her entire life. Um, I'm not sure how many boyfriends Mary would have just maybe three
I mean like the major one of course was John Jr
I like there was one or two others before she met Adam and boys already seem to like Mary, you know
Yeah, which is pretty smart and
Yeah, tall and developing
As Laura would compare herself to her in the future
Right one of the sadder things in the books. I think it's sad anyway is even in the books. They would refer to Mary as
Like Laura kind of craps on herself a bit and they're in a mercantile in
Sleepy. I don't I don't remember where they were in the book, but you know positive trading
Pelt and stuff like that as one doesn't and
Do you have any do you have many pelts in your house? I don't have many pelts
No, I don't have one belt one. I don't know if it's a belt, but I have one lime skin. Oh
Well, there you go
Not that I did not procure myself
Maybe all of you're like all of a sudden like
Yeah, I'm gonna make her sheep
I'm gonna make I'm gonna share my sheep and make a rabbit coat
Yeah
so
The mercantile owner
Basically comments how pretty Mary is and everything kind of a creepy old manway and
How cute Lynn L and
We
I don't know and then just kind of looks at Laura and goes oh yeah, you too. Yeah, that type of that
Oh
But doesn't um in I don't know if I don't remember because I read the books a while back, but
Doesn't Laura ask could her parents or something about
Like what they love her more of shoes blotters really bad or something along those lines
I don't remember that line, but uh
You know, I just read the books a couple years ago again, and I still I mix the
Show in with the books like I really have meld them together plus having this show
I'm always discussing this and then I read the fan fiction and my head's just elsewhere
So
So yeah, I mean it's
Mary grew up like having this, you know, she's pretty and she was always the pretty one, right? I mean
It was almost like they cast her as this and successfully
But maybe people who knew a little bit better and I would say that was probably 30% 40% of the audience
knew that eventually Mary's has to go blind
Right, and I wonder if they thought that a number of times because Mary gets sick remember she gets kicked by the horse
We're just talking about that storyline being used with Michael landed and using it
Um, then she had scar did you have scarlet fever on the show?
No, I'm on the show they they say when she's starting to lose her sight the doctor the eye doctor asks Paul like
Did she have any you know, was she sick or whatever and then she he mentions that she had scarlet fever
And of course, I think that we at least I grew up kind of connecting that directly to her loss of it
Even for us, you know like there's always been this
connection then with
Like foreshadowing
You know her hating her glasses and then the glasses starting a fire you know
Yeah, which is kind of a weird
Um, but yeah, we get that one episode where we get that blood curling screamed don't worry. I'm not gonna play it
Oh, I can't see I can't see and she's all upset um and then the angles do one of the weirder
Um things they set up her bed in the
Um living space. Yeah
And I just still don't understand why they didn't put her in carry's bed
Right and swap them. Let's be real here with Mary in carry's bed and carry upstairs
My mom finally have a little privacy
You know, nobody's stay I mean they might look at her and she could be staring right at them, but
What do you say?
They would still have grace baby grace. Yeah, we'd be down there. Yeah, we're in a great sleep
I'm between them
This is a good question. Where the where the hell do grace sleep? We're on a crib like at the end of the moon
A whole life in a crib? No, no, not a whole life, but I don't remember
I know carry would eventually graduate to the loft
But Albert you know had come in by that point
Yeah, I think they when they get like all the kids like James and this I don't know what they're all up there and then graces dance
I don't know I get I don't know where grace slept
kitchen
Mary's old living room bed
Yeah, they pulled out extra trundle bed. I don't I'm not sure
You know, I'm really dumbfounded. I bet you there are people like no she slept here
I mean, maybe she slept at the foot of their bed
I think at least when carry goes up to the loft and then she has that bed with
Cassandra and they have the divider with the boys on the other side. I feel like
The grace would might have taken over carries on bed at the yeah, but they're we're talking a couple of seasons at least
Where Albert's living there now we're up there with Laura
Yeah, where they have their like blanket
fort
Yeah, hey, if you if you know
I have to go and look now it's one of those things. It's like
A fern it's like you have to like pay attention to these things sometimes and
Yeah, it's where grace just kind of appears everyone. Maybe she slept in the high chair. It's about the only place where I ever really saw her
Right
I mean
all right, so
So like I was saying in the in one of the weirder choices they set up a trundle bed
I think it was a trundle bed in the living room
Which I just don't get like I really at least you know squeeze it in behind the chimney or something
um
But don't you have to be all out in the open
It's very very odd and we have that like John Jr comes over to be like hey
What's it? It's not yeah, you're right. I'm sorry
John Jr. is gone. Yeah, John Jr. never really
Um
Yeah, like what when did Chicago air
That wouldn't be until season six or something much later. No, no, no, um season eight eight or nine eight
I think it's season eight
So like
John Jr. gets caught two timing and then they just split up
We never hear from when we hear from him, but it wouldn't be until years later
Yeah, when Victor French returns
I think I should have rooted that a little closer to
To this season because it's like really far out and people maybe are like who's Joe Jr
You know, I don't know. Oh, yeah, yeah, oh the guy in the sketch
Yeah
Um, I still think one of the craziest things was where Rodamus
Para went to
the set
Right after they finished wrapping and
Michael Landon's laughing because we just killed you, you know
He was hoping to get back on the show
And I guess unless you're gonna be nobody one can no be ghost you're not gonna really get back on the show
We're gonna be part of a flashback or something
right so
So Mary loses her vision. Of course everyone is like holy crap. You know, like this is crazy
Um, everyone's trying to help. She's really really rejecting all help which is a lot of self-pitch
Involved which is exactly what I would personally probably be in line with. I don't know about you
Um, I don't know. I say to people. I've had a number of blind people on the show reviewing
Show with me
I said right to them. You know, it's one of my fears
It is one of my fears
But I think when I talk to blind people and I hear about their life and everything
It doesn't give me hope that I've got forbid something like that were to happen
It would be a path to
Yeah, overcoming it
And that is there's so much um, like there's so many aids and technology and things like that
I mean, it's not like you know in the 1800s
Going blind man, you just it's not
What would you have done? You sure enough
Well, I guess what you would have done is you would have um headed over to independence, right?
All right. Oh, no, no, I wasn't aiming independence
I don't think I was a blind. No, I wasn't a man. Oh, yeah
The Burton School for the Blind in Iowa. That's Iowa. Yeah. So what is that distance? I would want to grow up to Iowa
I don't I'm terrible with
Anything outside of New York for the most part
Are you like you know, like you know, you're on place, you know, you know, yeah
Like in Norway like do you know like where a certain
Town is if it has less than like 50,000 people
Well, there are probably a lot of towns that have less than 50,000 people
You're right
Actually, I mean, it's far, but it's not
Painful. I don't know if there would have been a train at the time. It's roughly 300 miles
It's probably like 550 kilometers
Won't they they took a train they took like a train or like where they took a wagon
Then they took a train and then they took another wagon
I'm looking to see if there's a current
train route that
Because those two locations and there's no one
One pod drops her off and they say he gets he has to catch in early because they tell him not to stay around
Just go because it's easier or something and then he says oh, I got to take an earlier train
I'm going by I mean, I think that that particular you know, it's interesting that
Yeah, I thought that there would be a train line that existed
Maybe not like direct, but maybe he took like you know the stage to
Another town or a place where they had a train that goes
You know to sleep the eye or whatever
And then take another stage. Sleepy eye is only like a few miles away from one a grove
Missy so sleepy eye
is literally
Oh
Take 40 miles from one a grove
Yeah, that's a good wagon ride, but yeah, it's
Let's see if you're walking I tend to like if you double the walking time
I tend that's my new calculation
If you're going to go maps and put the two things in the amount of time that it would take to walk I double it for a wagon
All right, and that's 14 hours to walk. So I would say seven hours by wagon
Yeah, you have the time, you see it again
You have for the time not double. I have it
I double it's 28 hours to
I'm sorry
Um
Oh wait, no, I would have to double it so be
Yeah, I have it all right still early people
So going back to the Mary and Adam discussion
Of course, this all happens in a crescendos into the episode um the two-parter, which I think is a series this season finale
Yeah, I'll be waving as you drive away, which is beloved episode, right?
Where she goes and we're introduced to Adam Kendall
She thinks you can see at first
She thinks he can see well, it's interesting because it's
I think we also think that did you
No, I thought he was blind really right off the bat
Yeah
Somebody who I would like to refer to as observant
Because like he was like like feeling that feeling
But like you know
Touching the wall for guidance to get to the room
I think if you watch it again
Right
When they first introduce Adam
I don't believe we're supposed to believe he's blind there are indications like you could see even running his hand on the wall
Yeah, there are certain things
But I think that we're supposed to be slightly fooled, but you know what I can also be completely wrong you were not
I just assumed he was
Maybe you watched part two first
So yeah, so we all of course know this
Back and forth. I mean
She's also a bit younger. I mean, this is like an angle's trend right with how do you think he is when she first made to
Was she's 15 right?
Yeah, yeah, she's 15, but how old is he now I'm trying to think so I'm gonna say he's like 21
22
And then when I have this amazing quote from Adam when she turned 16
16 years
Yeah, so it is there's a big age difference of course
The it's not brought up. I don't believe it's brought up how old he is
No
But he certainly carries himself like like an adult
But for some like at least for me
But there's not as big an age difference between Mary and Adam and I know we're not gonna talk about more than all of it
Just as
Because to me like more still seem like a little girl compared to
Among so even when she's transitioning into like leaving her hair down and whatnot and then putting it up into the fun
Whereas when Mary and Adam meet it seems more like
Reasonable or like the age gap is not reasonable then I wonder if it's because we are always
Having a younger person to compare Mary to that we think but then she kind of
She looks older you know like when you watch those first two seasons you're like oh, she's like a baby
But she does grow up pretty quickly and I think that her look by the time we get to season three or four
Doesn't change much in terms of she doesn't get too much older looking
No
She grows her hair goes to hell
Oh, yeah, yeah, I'd all ignore that
Some are like in terms of
Like facial features and whatnot
What do you think of the way that Adam approached her with teaching her
The basics of like eating remember like it was like based on a clock
And not eating with her hand that type of stuff. I mean, I think it
I think it's good that you learn that from the ghetto. It's must you know if he feels difficult maybe but
Um sort of like tough love type of thing. Yeah, just do it. I think that's exactly it
And that he you know when he she threw her plate or something and then he said well you clean it up
You make the best you clean that up. Yeah
Um
You know, it seems maybe harsh, but I think it was good. You know, you got to snap the person out of this
Like swallowing
Because they got it, you know, she's young so she's got her whole life to live so she's got to snap out of that and just get on
You know, I mean, not get off. Where's this you know tragedy? They like, you know, you know, it is what it is and it's kind of like this
These are the cards who are dealt. I think that's the kind of
Attitude he kind of went and I wonder if they would ever revisit that in the future
You know kind of like hey remember when you first came in and
Wasn't he he was much younger when he lost his sight wouldn't he he was like
I want to see because he's over 13
Yeah, a little younger
I was he kicked I forgot what while he was jumping on the rocks in a lake or something and then he slipped and fell in his head. She's
Um
Which is why he has that fear of water wouldn't he have the course right which is kind of cringy. I don't I don't really
Um, but I guess I get it
Um, and of course all right, so
We end with them kind of like the sparks are flying like we have
Um, Mary, you know, basically learning that Adam is blind of course and we
We just have two episodes of I think a really good connection between these two characters and the actors
I thought we're really good
I like the storyline of course this is probably the biggest up to this point of little house in a break the biggest work of fiction
Mm-hmm, right. I mean, this is diverting a crazy plotline like I think we can we can maybe
Have delusions that the mercantile had a gossipy wife, but there was a mercantile of course
Um, we can do a number we can
We leave we go or broke their storms all types of crazy things
Um, and Mary of course goes blind, but to have her in a relationship now and it's like blossoming
Is just a complete work of fiction because the real Mary. I think she wouldn't she would not marry
I believe yeah, she was mostly at home when she like they she didn't go to
Well, she got all plants on her life. Well, she found the mariongles um blind school
Which I reached out to years ago and they've yet to get back to me
I wanted to find some stuff the Iowa College for the blind
Um, no, that's where she originally went
I kind of sworn there was
Because I feel like when she goes blind in the books she just
Is at home
I could I know that there's some blind school that has
Some connection with her and I don't see it here
So let's see um, so moving on we go we come back into season five and we have they're established
They're like, you know, the new you know, um hot couple of of welcome
They both have really grown they're they're flirting like crazy, right? I mean they have really
They are genuinely
Onscreen
seemingly to have fun, you know like
these two characters are really being developed really seamlessly and
Kind of organically
Yeah, I think
Um
We finally will get to the middle of season of um, yes season five
And it seems as though Charles doesn't really have much of an issue with Mary getting married young
All right, well, I mean he didn't have an issue with her getting married at with John junior at what 13?
Was she?
But that had been 13
I think she was 13 or four. Yeah, because it was season three
So that was 14 maybe but still
Still, yeah, 40 younger than Laura was when she wanted to marry um
But I guess um, do you think Charles is like well, you know what
He seems like a nice guy
She's blind. Let's put this all aside
Um, the episode the wedding of course is a lot of
Chaos going on because we have that crazy dust storm
Susan gets lost. She's like, I'm
Susan the flower girl like dropping the flowers and running off and they all kind of hide basically the equivalent of Albert stairs
That's basically what it's hitting head with a glass thing or something and then she would be in
It would have been interesting if she
Oh my oh, she went blind. Yeah, yeah, one episode, you know, yeah, just for one
But there are moments where I'm not sure you know, we were kind of
Going back and forth of whether they're even going to
Get married, right? Yeah, she's worried about what if they have children what are they gonna and the children are cited
How are they gonna handle that situation?
And there's no reason why they wouldn't be cited, you know, it's probably the odds are that they would be cited
Yeah, cuz Mary and Adam both had sight
Before you know, they weren't good. It's not a true redditary thing
Yeah
So yeah, I mean these are all things that I'm sure are genuine
Issues that would come up with a blind couple
You know, what do you do? What do you know? How do I do this? How do I do that? And of course later on we learn
That tragedy does strike
unfortunately
Um, and I have to wonder that if
Even though they had a few cited people in the blind school during the fire
Would it have helped and I think it would have
Yeah
So that's really really dark to really think about but
It's really
Like maybe their bedroom should have been I mean, I guess you could say now like your bedroom should have been on the main floor
No, right, but no one had a bedroom on the main floor or all upstairs
The main
Miss or sort of mistake there is not grabbing the baby right away and going
Yeah, like if they grab a baby and then go out with the baby and then go back in to help the kids or whatever
How did it play out?
So Mary got up and ran past the baby to help the kids, right?
Yeah, I think so
It's been a while since I've seen that episode, but they me to help the kids get out of the
of the um
of the school
and
Then they
Can't go back in really because there's too much fire and Alice is left there
So she tries to grab the baby and then get stuck because there's fire at the door now at this point where you know the
um
The kendals aren't established couple
You know like all right, they met at the end of season four
Throughout season five they would you know do all their stuff and they get married during it
Um, and she gets
Sading up once she gets pregnant once the husband is carriage
You know, I forgot about that
Yeah, they're throwing every tragedy at Mary and then she thinks she's gonna see again, but she doesn't
Yeah, like
Which is a which is ironic because when later on when
Adam would
Get regained his sight she definitely has this kind of
I don't know fits
Maybe just envy
Yeah, well, I think it's um, I don't worry because they see it a bit in this episode where she think she's gonna get our side again
Adam goes through that
I think that he's worried that when she sees maybe she sees he's not you know both
Visit like physical appearance and then also she can see and do so much other stuff now. She doesn't have to be a teacher of applying school that type of thing
um
Those types like thousand fears since self
lack of like self-confidence or something like that
And of course, of course
Professionally marrying Adam do very well with the school from when I can tell like they the maybe not do of well
But they certainly make a living doing it and it's their profession
but it's really the
Um all of these tragedies that follow them
Like you brought up the miscarriage
There there would be the wagon fire right there that's later
But of course having the baby and having this joyous occasion of um, what's the Charles junior? What was the name of the baby?
It's a well-known name. I think it's like
Charles yeah
Yeah, it's something
Kendall
I can flip it up. Like well, I'm gonna ask um croc
Are you typing? All right
Adam Charles Holbert Kendall junior. I knew it was Adam
um
Holbert after Caroline's
Parents, I guess it's a freaking long name
so
Yeah, having him and
All of this stuff. It's kind of like working out for Mary and everybody's so happy about this
And everyone else is growing up and then
we have the
Well, I do want to mention in the beginning of series. I mean season six
We established the blind school where we have the herodos in school of the blind which is um either near or
in Walnut Grove
And we bring Hester Sue in which of course she becomes a completely important part of the whole storyline even having her own storylines
and
So I mean right now we're telling the you know timeline but
So I say we finish up the timeline quickly. Of course this the
The blind school fire um ends up with Alice and Adam
Both perishing in the fire
So that of course makes the Garvey's move away
We have
um
Old was oh yeah, the baby is only a month old
Yeah
Yeah, which is pretty crazy
And I don't was maybe we make them proud was that that was not a season finale, right?
No, it was in the middle like it was a two-parter in the middle
What was the season finale for little house seasons?
Well, that was he loves me. He loves me not when they rebuild the blind school
That's interesting
Or like we're trying to rebuild them and they move to sleep the eye right
All right, then Laura then we introduce Houston
Yeah
so
when
They're they are established in Winoka right and
In the middle of season seven a little bit of blast in oil goes off and Adam regains his sight
What's so interesting about Adam is
I don't know I feel like he was well-educated um
Before he went blind
But he wasn't you know everything he learned was through the time when he was blind
Yeah
And he decided to follow a career in law we have that moment
Where um he has to take the exam and marry convinces him you know to make an exception for Adam
Which is really interesting
Yeah
And finally, you know, we have
Moments where they're barely on the show we they finally show up in season eight
Of course, I do want to mention blind justice. We get the
the attorney episode where Adam is
Defending this property salesperson
We're selling swamp land, I believe
Yeah
But then episodes um
Season eight episode 11 we have a Christmas they never forgot which is genuinely a throwaway episode
Even though we reviewed on this podcast often
Right where it's a flashback episode and
Yeah, we we have Mary and Adam together
They never have another kid
Which is kind of interesting
They kind of adopted it like why wouldn't they have adopted a blind kid or something
Right, I mean, I mean, it would have been it would have been in line with the Ingalls way, you know, yeah
Don't I think I mean imagine losing two children
Yeah, no, I couldn't you know, it's it's terribly and then
Yeah, I guess choosing not to and I guess the blind kids are in a lot of ways of replacement for them like they're very close with the blind school kids
And vice versa the kids are very close with them
Even Susan
What are your thoughts in terms of the whole dynamic so we have we have Adam
Who's really kind of fairly well put together and we're guessing early 20s when they first meet
And we have Mary who's completely unhinged because she's so upset over the loss of revision
And then it kind of there's um
There's an equal like she quickly picks up
This you know, she becomes a teacher for the blind and she kind of fulfills her
Life goal. She always want on the show. She always want to be a teacher. She wants to teach her
You know, I mean we have the misspeel moment
Where she um we we see she could be tough when she needs to be tough
She can be um
Speak up time
I wonder they should have misspeel say you know put a curse on her that she goes blind
I mean women at least someone interesting, but
The misspeel character's such a dark woman like she's so horrible
That I almost think that that would have been like whoa, that's crazy, you know
Yeah, she maybe she was a witch. Yeah, you look back. Yeah, like what maybe she was a work
Thank you
She put um some type of voodoo on it
So at that point Mary kind of regains her own self worth in a lot of ways and she becomes more the Mary we know
and
But we do have those you know very powerful moments where
um
Like for instance where Adam can't take the exam
So she goes and she makes a case for him to the professor and he
agrees
You know these are it's interesting dynamic to have the the wife
You know in the 70s are actually probably 80s when that aired it
It's really a role reversal where the woman's like well, let me give you a piece of my mind
And it's not probably not something you'd see
At all really in a relationship like that in the 19th century. I don't believe
No, I don't think so either. Yeah, like I don't think um
They had as much moxie as
Or they were allowed to where we have that much moxie
Yeah, I think they have they could be tough and strong in other ways but not in terms of like standing up for
Other people particularly up to men
And of course that's written into the show, you know
It's really fun to watch that type of stuff where you help you know you have Mary help him achieve his goals
And he gets to take the exam again and I believe he passed
I'm guessing he passed
Even though back then from what I understand like you do a little bit of research into this
I don't think that there was an established bar exam until like the 1890s or even later
And you could just call yourself a lawyer kind of like on doctor Quinn medicine woman where
You you literally as long as you
Can I think it's where the whole point in the states where you're given the option to represent yourself
I think that's where it kind of comes from like you know it well enough. All right, you represent yourself
Or you can go to a professional. It's kind of like you can install this
Um operating system on your computer yourself or you can go to the
Geeks squad and spend like 10 time, you know
Like five hundred dollars for them to do press update, you know
All right. So is it our attorneys technically
The Geeks squad. Yes, I think so
They just have they passed a few exams
I'm not encouraging anyone to represent themselves
That would be so scary
Yeah
So yeah, I would have to have my clips if I'm just gonna represent myself
It's reputable
That's the most terrible thing I've ever heard
So
Um, but Mary does become a bit of a muted character
Yeah, I mean that yeah, I think like
At first she's a very strong character and then she can get very um, I think she's very
Like she has like deep emotions about things and gets you know deeply upset get deeply happy
You know, but then after like
I think even before I don't get to sit back she becomes kind of just like oh, she's there
You know like oh, yeah, there's Mary
No, to get on the relationships of these two characters
Do you think like Mary would I mean she of course would disclose
What you know John junior and the relationships of other people and
All of these things to Adam and I'm wondering you know Adam
I would guess that would have had some relationships as well
So it has a great personality
Yeah, I mean I am
Wondering um, I think that
Adam
Seems like mature enough to have been engaged at some point
Like it's almost like he's worldly that's why I think he might even be younger than I'm saying
But I'm gonna look up how old lindwood boomer was
During the airing that could we just go by that
Yeah
Um
I mean if Mary had a failed one failed engagement. I'm sure he must have had at least one
Failed engagement
What year would he be on Little House, do you know
He's one of 55
He would uh, it would have been I'll see you soon. Yeah, it's
37 77 28
Is age right now? He's 78. No, no, no
He was on Little House in the year 19
Oh, I see I'm 1978 something like that. All right, so they make him 23
Mm-hmm. So yeah, I think we're we're kind of on the money when it comes to that
Um, how does that make him now that makes him 68? I ride
No, six, what was he born 55
So 45 plus 25 is 70
Yeah
Linwood boomer 70 is that right? Yeah
Added to 70
Yeah, how's that possible
It's my math wrong. All right. I want that's right because my my dad was one of 56 and he's gonna be 70 next year
So
Well happy birthday to um
Linwood boomer who just turned uh 70 years old on October 90
Well, we're all getting old all right
Not you though
So
That's just crazy to me when I think of Adam as being in today 70
Well to me he's always that the age that he was in the show
Yeah
At the very least like the one in the Christmas episode
Yeah, but that's not too much, you know older but you think Mary would cover up like you think Mary would be like well
I'm not going to
Um
I want to disclose all of my personal stuff like that. I was gonna get married and we have a little bit of an an Alice Garvey moment
Oh
Who are you talking to um
The like
I was talking about John junior. Who's John junior
So a little bit of a story about a cattillion
I feel like she would have disclosed
That if if if not anything else she would have disclosed that because that was a key
There's a lot of cover-ups in the world of little house in the prairie
We have i mean Harriet
Harriet has hers, you know, she was engaged. Everybody was engaged. Yeah
Nelly was you know nelly was married then it was an old
Um, I know the piece of paper was done up
Yeah, I don't know if that's an old but yeah, it's an old enough, right
Think about that that's technically I mean
There's there's a little bit of polygamy right there
Because it would have to be a legal action right you would have to
I wonder
But what if they didn't consummate I think that that also allowed it to be an old I think that's the
That we're aware of anyway
they
I think if you don't consummate it can be an old but otherwise it can't be I don't know enough about this stuff
What now it is yeah
Oh, I don't know I don't mean anything as possible now
Um
I think if anything should have disclosed uh
John Jr. Yeah, yeah, I agree
Because they feel like we share you know a lot of
You know background and history and with each other and in that Christmas episode we don't get
Um and Adam's story
Oh
Which is really sad because he's one of the few people we don't have a backstory on I mean we got Hester Su's back story and she didn't exist
Um yeah
What have been the end there also would have been nice to have him more because
When the story of going blind or something. I don't I mean not exactly Christmassy, but
Well, yeah, but we get that story in blind journey when he crosses
Um, but the I think that it would have been nice to have him and very more presence or have seen more
interaction with them and for example a monsollum mora because they are there
At least for some time and want to grow
Um, then they're nearby you know, they're in sleepy eye
But when a monsollum mora get together and his whole law thing does kind of falls flat
Yeah, you know, it sees we want to see him work once work one case. Yeah
Like he's like going to be a lawyer one case stuff. Bye
And then now I tried it, you know, not really for me
Um, did they move to New York? Was it?
Mm-hmm, I know that the um
Yeah, John, but it's still there's New York farm
So they moved with uh, Nellie and personal to New York. Yeah, so they establish, you know um
A Caroline's franchise
Can you picture those two those four in New York?
You know like
That'd be kind of interesting. I mean because Mary's still blind
Yeah, that would have been very interesting to get to know a new place
Um
Like well, I guess like it helps to have like Adam has his sight back right so he can be like look after
Uh, in a sense
Um
But that must have been really disorienting to like move to a place
Yeah, especially about them. Yeah, it was definitely going from
Going from like um, even like what they consider to be a busy city to New York, which is a real crazy city
Um at the turn of the and you know living there at the turn of the last entry has it's pretty bananas
There all that pizza
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Any sort of nice that we'll go back to the show
I think that the end of being one of the more memorable couples which is
fictional
Yeah, but I think it's nice that what we what we walk away with is
A celebration of the Mary person like the human
And we celebrate her with a really beloved character and we give her this you know of course fictional
And dramatic life that is just a black cloud over her the whole time pretty much
Right down to like being a four eyes and then
And
Can't kick by horses and
Yeah, mom's cheating on her death
Almost
And she's yelling at Gil Gerard and the ending man
And her sister's imaginary and gone sister
Yeah, she's
Yeah
Grace doesn't even have a bed
We don't even know where she is
Yeah, but you know there's a lot of tragedy with Mary
Individually like that has nothing to do with all of them
Yeah, definitely
It would have been interesting to see them come back like Mary and Adam
Come back or have they gone yet um or appear anyway and like one more and a wands ago through those
That tough time where you know where he gets like when he gets a
He gets diphtheria and then a stroke and then
Or gives birth and then all that like the thing if they had come in
Because they were still in sleepy at that time what they yeah, I mean they're really not that far
So it would have been interesting to see them come in and try and help out
I also think you know it would have been so interesting if
We had more of a connection of Mary in the telephone
Because
Obviously it would be a great way for her to communicate over a distance and it would be
It would be a great way just because she's blind, you know, it's like the same you know and
I don't know I just feel like she would have actually ended up being like she could have run like a switchboard
Maybe she did at the blind school. I doubt it she'd have to like
Be grabbing all the levers and stuff. I don't know if you'd be able to control that if you're blind
but
I don't know I just think um we could have done more with these characters and I feel as though once they
Once we got to about season five they just thought all right, we need to like start phasing these
This character
Yeah, but after season six, it's more focused on more in a manzo and not so much
I'm marrying Adam and I wonder if that was dictated um ahead of time or whether it was dictated by the fans
um
Yeah
If they wanted to see more of because we know that
Or if you had read the books before you saw this then you would have known that or I would get together with a manzo eventually
um
And maybe they wanted to
Where was it dictated by something that wanted to go back to more source material
I also one of the things I think it's really kind of an oversight with all of this is of course finances are discussed here and there
But for the most part
they're really not like
All right when Mary needs to travel somewhere they're like all right how are we gonna pay for this and we're gonna like you know
Do kind of um or go fund me or type of thing which is essentially what happens but
When it comes down to it
we don't know how
Mary and
Adam kind of
Pay for their life
Yeah
Because from what I can tell the school is like they're not paying to be in the school right
But maybe they are
Do you think there's like a tuition
Like I don't do the angles pay to have Mary that's out there maybe
I think they did there's no discussion really
A little bit like we have the owner
He says he's kind of like Lee he's not gonna do this anymore
And he wants to give the school to Adam
Yeah
But he's even broke too like so I mean that's it really um
They're doing it for the goodness of of um mankind not really for profit
Right and then when they move to one that growth they have to ask
To borrow or to loan a couple horses and they give them those
Remember they buy yeah they buy this creatures they're going to standish is
Yes, saloon
Um but I think I
May like I maybe it was enough to cover
Like the students maybe they paid enough to cover
Like for expensive like you know food costs and like
Textbooks or you know like I mean a Hester Sue has to be taking the salary right
I mean it's not too much for free
Yeah
So
It must be there to have a budget remember we did talk about like this is how much it would be to
I don't know whether they were gonna rent or buy the
Blind school they were gonna rent it right so yeah you're right
They must have been paying tuition. I don't believe government was giving grants to blind schools at this point
Not at that time. No, I don't think so um because they were when they're discussing the rent part
I think they can ship in some and then like
Laura chips in you're trying to ship in not the carol and chips in
You know family chips and you know everyone chips in
Um a bit for the rent but they have to have had some kind of income to cover that rent after those two months
But they prove
And we also have this like turbulent relationship between Adam and her his father
Mm-hmm, and then he dies leaving
nothing right yeah
He leaves yeah because he he has owes
Money so they have to use whatever he had to pay the debt
But I don't understand that like you shouldn't be like you're not responsible for someone else's debt
Well, no, no, but the father's money whatever was left of it
All they had to use to pay for his debts first before they can inherit anything right right and they don't end up inheriting
As much as they hoped we should have had that episode called the inheritance too
Spoiler it's gonna be all fall
All right
It's a story that happens to often in real life and in um fiction is the
How much are you gonna have left nothing?
Let me count not say negative
Yeah
But then they have the father
He comes in the first time I think we see him as when she's gonna have that first baby
And then she ends up having a miscarriage and then he leaves in a hurry. I don't remember why
But I think initially he's interested in having this you know air type of thing
Um, and then when he finds out he's not gonna have one he like leaves
Yeah, he's like by and then that's like where you leave me
We're gonna come with you to New York and he's like no, no, you stay
It's better that you stay lots of difficulties in New York. It does seem like a real jerk
Yeah, yeah
Which is kind of amazing that you know Adam turned out as um balanced as he ended up being
I know right um
And then he would meet a
But I guess you know when I do compare Mary's past um relationships
Which really just probably at the very most was kissing right like we're not right um yeah
We
To Alice you know where it was a marriage. So we have I think we can presume that you know they did the deed
Yeah, and I think that's it. I think that's the um upsetting nature the difference between these two things
But I wonder if Alice was that same age like very young
I forget the age that she was young
Because she's still when she's living it out like great because her parents or mother is running the boarding house
Yeah, like that whole situation is really crazy
You know that's a discussion for the future because the whole Alice
Getting married young and her mother having a boarding house almost seems like a madam type of situation or
Some type of financial understanding
Yeah, something sketchy about that whole thing because that dude was a lot older
Yeah, yeah, he was way older. He's old enough to me or the way they
To trade out who's old enough to be your father
Like he he should have been dating the mom
now
Yeah, it's crazy, right
But now don't for pretty little Alice
Well, Christine, I think that kind of sums up what we wanted to talk about
I appreciate taking the time this morning to discuss it
Yeah, of course
No problem
If you're listening at home and you have any suggestions of other pairings or ideas or things we might have missed because I'm sure we missed a whole lot
This is just about a casual conversation about two characters
Um, this one, you know, this one's a little bit closer. So
um discussing two characters that for the most part we're in every scene together after
Season five
Sorry
I remember that one episode where these escape prisoners or whatever take over the bindings line school
Adam is not there for that he goes off on some
Yeah, I will be it would have been interesting to have a little coverage about
After like when he comes home and he realizes oh this thing happened
Yeah, what would my child and my wife would have happened had you been there
Yeah, what would he have done and those type of issues? Yeah, I can believe you forgot about that
Yeah, which is a strange storyline
Doesn't really do so was there either she was was she also like she was also the way I think
Yeah
So it would have been interesting. I mean Laura's there
Yeah, I think the whole point was that Laura was going to
Stay there or she was gonna help out
Yeah, but then things take a quick turn
That's crazy
Yeah, the kidnapping um or kidnapping or home invasion type of things
I always felt as though they kind of felt flat
Yeah, but like um, but that particular episode does have a couple of really dramatic moments
Yeah, she uh, she was
Taken sort of hostage by one of the names remember in season two
Yeah, the two
before yeah in that same house
Um
So it would have been interesting to tie those
Together or something and then have her and I have a discussion wasn't the blind school handsome house
Yeah, but the building anyway was used
Yeah, as that other building where they go and they rent the place
And then she's working for them and then she's yeah, so caught up in all that
And then it's
Yeah
So it would have been interesting to have some kind of post discussion between her and Adam or something about
Yeah, those two and it's really the one incident the one reason that's it
It would have said something stupid and like 70s style like
Well, I got to be there next down or like yeah, well, it's so bad doesn't happen again
And then it's like
I feel like they do give Adam like little tiny
Goofy comments sometimes like to say stuff like that to end it
Um
Like what would he say in that thing at the end um
So
They will marry next time you're coming with me
I don't have so stupid yeah
But um, thank you so much
We better put a bell in on the door
Well, that's it. Yeah, put a bell like when you walk in belting
But Christina, thank you so much. I do appreciate it. Maybe she had an open a walnut Grove cast calm
To find all of your
Special
Episodes and um, yeah, thank you so much and um just stand on it
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The Little House on the Prairie Podcast: Walnut GroveCast

The Little House on the Prairie Podcast: Walnut GroveCast

The Little House on the Prairie Podcast: Walnut GroveCast