Crossover episode with Jacob Milham

What does Jacob Millham of the Royals run down podcasts think about the Royals this

off season?

We'll get his thoughts next on Lockdown Royals.

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Well, Jacob, it's been a little bit since the last time we talked I'm pretty sure the

last time we talked it was pretty early on in the off season.

So we had our thoughts.

We had our opinions on what was going to go down, but now that you look back, is there

any move you, you kind of wish the royals would have made or you glad that with the abundance

of pitching they had, they decided to hang on to him for the immediate future.

So here's the thing.

We're already seeing a little bit of the impact with that with colic on the shelf, right?

Thankfully, the royals don't have to sweat that too much because they have guys waiting

in the wings ready to go.

I mean, there's, there's always going to be the move that like, hey, I wish the royals

had made this move or made that move.

I, this, this is a political answer, Jack, I'm, I'm sorry, man, but I do, I feel like that

as royals fans were at the point right now where we had where we need to accept, hey,

this, this is what it is.

This is what the team is going to look like heading into the season and not, that's a lot

of mental energy on things that are going to change the on field product right now.

And you know, frankly, looking back on it, there were a lot of things that we took as dead

giveaways heading into the off season that didn't happen.

You know, Jerrand Ray and he's still wearing a Boston Red Sox uniform right now.

He's still, he's still sooting up for them.

They still have that stacked out field.

There were several players I felt like were going to go elsewhere via trade that moves

that were going to happen that simply didn't happen.

So I think there was kind of a tone shift behind the scenes with the front offices that

we weren't aware of, but we'll, we'll see how it plays out after opening day.

Yeah, I think it's a little bit different when you have a trade target.

And then by the end of the off season, that trade never happens to any team, right?

With Jerrand Iran, it's very apparent the asking price was high, not just for the

royals, but for everybody, the one that I keep circling back to.

And mainly it's because this guy was linked to the royals for like 10 years it felt like.

It was Taylor Ward at the beginning of the off season.

The reports were that I think the royals were kind of close.

But when it was all said and done, the angels wanted a young starting picture with multiple

years of control.

My mind immediately went to it was Taylor Ward for Noah Cameron.

And the royals didn't want to do that.

And then they said, okay, we'll go with Grayson Rodriguez because Baltimore is trying to go

all in for this particular off season.

Does that make you feel differently about certain trades when at the end of the day, that

guy ended up not going anywhere.

So that asking price never went down.

We're with Taylor Ward.

They could have made it happen, but they're really counting on Noah Cameron or maybe Ryan

Berger.

He could have been included.

I'm not quite sure.

They're really counting on these guys to build on what they did last year.

Yeah, that's a that's a good way to frame it.

And yeah, the royals and the angels for a long just in general, you know, Taylor Ward

or not.

It feels like they've been linked in trade talks for years now in one way or another.

And at the end of the day, Ward specifically, I'm looking at these new voids.

The places they brought in the hitting coaching, right?

Connor Dawson, Arcus Tame, they, which also happy birthday to him while recording this,

they had some clear targets when it came to even the most minor free agent additions,

right?

It was a lot of guys who were very disciplined at the plate.

That's not what Taylor Ward is.

That's that's not what he's known for.

And, you know, that's a man, I'm sorry, like it's, it's, it's just tough because I would

have loved that would have done a lot of things for royals fans out there, right?

Bringing in Taylor Ward.

And I'm sure the comments are going to reflect that.

I'm sure that, you know, later on this season, if it goes as well as we think it is, we'll

probably be talking about the royals.

Hey, go chase down Joe Adele and bring him to the royals and let's go get this post

season bid.

It's tough with Taylor Ward because I don't think that he fit the current mold that the

royals are going for and the lineup construction specifically that they are looking for.

I'm sure he's going to go to Baltimore and probably be a very good player.

I think he is going to do great things for that team and one that a lot of folks are

looking forward to do what they do in 2026.

I just don't know if he fit with the, with the royals, even for one year, you know?

Yeah, absolutely.

And J. J. Bacolo has been very open about wanting players with years of control.

Taylor Ward is going to be a free agent at seasons end.

So who knows, Jacob, maybe next off season, they go out there and give him another one

year dealer, two year deal based on what he does for the royals this year.

Want to get your thoughts on down the road here.

So they hang on to all these resources.

They've got all their pitching.

They have their farm system intact.

If the royals are in it, and I'm talking just a playoff spot at the trade deadline,

we've seen the last two years, it's improving the team within the margins.

It's getting Lucas Er sig for the back end of the bullpen in 24.

It's getting Mike Gistremsky and Adam Frazier and Randall Gritchick last year.

A cheap trade deadline, but they tried to better the roster for one last push.

If they're in it this year, do you see it being this kind of 2015 feel where it's we're

putting the chips in here?

If we're neck and neck with the tigers, we got to find a way to better this roster

to beat the tigers and not just sneak into October, make a deep run into October.

Is that the year to do it?

Or do you have to kind of fall back and say, well, let's see where they're at.

I'm not going all in if there are two games over 500.

But if they're 20 games, 15 to 20 games over 500, like it is confirmed, they're going

to be in a postseason spot.

Just matter if they win the central or not, do you go all in or is it just kind of, let's

see where they're at at that point in time?

No, I would absolutely go all in personally.

You look back at history, 2025 was not the year to go all in.

There were too many question marks at that point at the trade deadline.

If you could go back and do one over, I would go all in at the 2024 trade deadline, especially

with how healthy that pitching rotation was at that point.

One or two massive additions to the lineup would have cost you a lot in the farm system.

But man, how different would that team have looked instead of a low scoring affair against

the Baltimore Orioles?

Could they have hung with the New York Yankees?

They might have been able to, especially with Bobbie with junior in that lineup.

If we are looking at a healthy Royals rotation heading into the mid-summer classic, a little

bit after that.

They're still rolling and the Royals are kind of this high at, or sorry, excuse me,

low 20s, high teens scoring lineup.

But the rotation is, you know, top five, well, then why not bolster that?

Why not be aggressive about this?

And the Royals do have some room, I guess, to move on from pitching resources still.

If the rotation is healthy, right, you still have Lugo under contract for one more year

after 26.

But the margin there is not huge, and I feel like the Royals knew that this offseason.

That's why they weren't quick and easy to move on from their, their pitching guys.

And I do want to say the other trade target was Brendan Donovan.

And you know, everyone peaked up their ears when we were talking about Brendan Donovan

to the Royals.

And you know, that was a crazy final prospect package that the Cardinals got for not a lot

of Brendan Donovan.

So I think that just goes back to, hey, you have to pony up a lot, at least in upfront

value, to make a trade happen.

And you know, that's harder with so much more analytics in the, in the fold, you know,

you're getting a better picture of what you are and aren't getting in a trade return.

So it's, it's tough even to go all in and it's going to be tougher unless the Royals

make some big improvements down on the farm.

Yeah, last one I want to get your thoughts on before we take our first break.

It's interesting now about what it's going to take for the Royals to get to the postseason

and what they might need to upgrade at come the trade deadline.

Look, if this team is 15 to 20 games over 500, like we're talking about, I'd imagine

Jack Hagley owns playing pretty well.

I'd imagine Isaac Collins is playing pretty well.

And to some extent, Kyle is Bell and Lane Thomas might be working well with that platoon.

I start to wonder then, how do you upgrade the team?

Because on the infield, you're not trading for anybody to replace somebody there.

Even if they are underachieving, you're counting on them to be your core for a final push

into October.

With the outfield, is it center field where, like, how many available center fielders are

there?

Because that would maybe be where I'd turn to, but it's just not that simple where for

years, Jacob, it was go get a corner outfield back.

Well, if Isaac Collins and, and Jack Hagley own are thriving, you're not getting an outfield

bat that's taking every day at bats from them.

So would it be like center fields where we're looking to?

Is it let's add to the bullpen?

Let's add to maybe second base, but I'd have to imagine too.

Jonathan India is probably playing pretty well.

They're that far over 500 probably so.

And I think that on paper, it would be center field like that's the spot where you could

stand to upgrade it, especially from a controllable talent standpoint, you know, Lane Thomas

he's only under contract for one year.

Kyle Isbelly is heading into his third year of arbitration in 27.

So he's only going to get more expensive.

And how much do you really want to pay for a glove for center fielder right now?

I'm sure, you know, we're seeing a lot of guys in camp right now.

And there's a lot of good gloves that can hold down center field if need be.

So I think that would be the spot to upgrade and, you know, second base is still kind of

in that same, same vein, Michael Massey, he's not just a second baseman anymore.

He's more of a, he's molding more into this utility player role.

And you only got one more year, Jonathan India on the books.

Why not upgrade there?

And you know, the bullpen is a good way to go as well, though, because especially if you're

in the post season hunt, you don't want that to be your weak point.

It gets exposed every single time it feels like.

It's the royals, they're a little shallow in the relief core.

I feel like I feel like they have a few good, good swing guys, right?

Like they have guys that can eat up innings in the bullpen.

But you know, if, if things falter back there, it's, you need to, you need to upgrade there.

So I think center field will be the top, top priority for me.

But yeah, that's a really niche way, really niche spot to add to.

Yeah, and it might be foolish for us to be discussing where they can upgrade.

We don't know just yet, right?

But no, I have always thought that if they're in first place and they're that far over

500, clearly something is working well in the outfield and somebody has turned a corner.

Okay, let's take our first break of the show.

When we come back, let's get Jacob's thoughts on what's been going on in spring training

and a couple of those position battles.

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We're on the segment number two of lock down royals here on the lock down podcast network.

I am your host Jack Johnson.

This is the host of the Royal rundown podcast in Jacob Millham.

We are very appreciative that he took time to pre record this episode with us.

And before we continue our talk about spring training, want to tell you about the every

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We got a couple of position battles to go over Jacob.

And the good news is the roster is is all but almost sent, I would say.

There's maybe two to three spots.

We could debate a little bit.

So I want to start with the bullpen here.

We talked to pants Libo yesterday.

His takeaway was Alex Lane is going to get that final bullpen spot.

My pick would be Ryan Bergeritt.

You also have Louinda Ovela you could choose from.

They could keep three lefties and have Bailey falter.

How do you see all the pieces in the bullpen falling when it's all said and done?

This is first off, this is a good problem for the royals to have right now.

This was, you know, so many years we were looking for them to just have bodies in the bullpen.

Right now they have so many what I would call locks to be in that opening day bullpen that

it's a good problem to have.

Lane, I think I like him making this this opening day roster.

Ovela is tough because I loved what he did as a reliever in 2025.

Like it was awesome.

We saw that hammer curve ball really baffle batters and it was awesome.

But you know, you gave him a ringing endorsement as a starter this spring.

That was very specific and I would hate to, I would be interested to see what Bergeritt

looks like as a reliever, but I would like to like him to stay as a starter personally.

Um, I don't like frankly, I don't like falter as a, as a, as a bullpen option.

I, I really don't, I think that you have strong, you have Lynch who has looked really strong

this spring.

I think that's a good start for the left handed core there.

And I don't know.

I think falter might be a guy who goes to waivers, he might be a guy who you try to get

a minimal trade return for and just move on to another team who needs starters.

That's who he's been for most of his career.

I, I think more folks should be looking at Mason black as a, as a bullpen opening day

option.

You know, he's the current royals bullpen does not have a true bulk option, right?

It is, it is a lot of single inning guys and that's, that's good.

That's what you want, but it's nice to have that true bulk option.

That's what Daniel Lynch felt like.

100 points, but that's, that's not what he looks like right now.

I, I feel like they're going to get the most out of them as a true three outs guy.

So Mason black, he's kind of a, kind of a swing guy.

They have been tooling his arsenal a lot.

Annie Rogers, MLB, MLB.com had a great piece talking to him about how he's approached

things differently since coming from San Francisco.

Um, yeah, I don't know if that answers your, your question, Jack, but I had, I, I like

laying right now.

I, I really do.

I like laying a lot and I was more so concerned about what his velocity was going to look like.

We see guys come back from arm injuries, whether it's elbow or shoulder and they might have

thrown 95, 96 pre injury and then it happens and now they're 90 to 91 and you go, okay,

they're not going to be in a big league bullpen.

The stuff looks good and when we talked to Alex down in spring training, he had said

that it's really the only injury he's ever dealt with and he feels great.

He's as good as he's ever felt and he does have that major league deal.

He's got a minor league option.

When the royals gave him that, I kind of thought this was somebody they could have given

a minor league deal to.

I'm not sure there was that much of a market.

So maybe giving him that big league deal was kind of the nod of no matter what you look

like in spring training, we think we can work with you to become a really valuable reliever.

Now for the position player group, you've got your starting nine, three of the spots

on the bench are going to be taken by Michael Massey, Lane Thomas and the newly acquired

Starling Marta.

When it comes to the fourth option, now they could carry if they wanted to an extra position

player which would mean one less reliever.

So maybe our point becomes moot, maybe it being 13 and 13, you just have that even balance

of four bench guys and then you have your collection of eight relievers.

My pick would be Josh Rojas if the season ended today.

I know the royals like Nick Lofton in his versatility.

It's also an extra right handed bat Tyler Tolbert can steal a lot of bases.

But to me, I go to the body of work.

I'm not going to completely fall for Josh Rojas' spring training and the numbers he's posted.

But in 2024 with Seattle, the numbers were fine.

He was a gold glove defender or a gold glove caliber defender.

He was an all right bat.

And if the royals can get that again, that's way better to have on the bench than maybe

rolling the dice that Nick Lofton finally figures it out offensively or Tyler Tolbert

can figure it out defensively being as versatile as he is.

I'm going Rojas.

I want to say that Joel Penfield shares that sentiment, but I think we might be on an

island to you.

I'm pretty sure everybody else has said they go with Nick Lofton.

What say you?

So I, frankly, I have been convinced on Josh Rojas.

This has been such a strong spring from him.

And everyone can talk about this down in the comments.

Everyone can crucify me for this.

I get that counting stats in spring training are personickity, right?

You don't want to put a whole lot of stock into it.

However, Rojas is getting a good amount of work this spring.

He's getting a lot of at bats, like his number that he is the rate that he's getting

is that of a major league player.

You know, he's up there with Bobby Wood Jr. with Cags with Massey, like the Royals want

a good look at him for a reason.

I don't think that they would just give him all this work if they were just going to

stash him and triple A Omaha and say, Hey, I hope for the best.

Maybe we'll see you later on this season.

I think he has gotten his opportunity.

I think that he has proven that he can fit into this role.

You know, frankly, it's, it's tough also because what we have such a limited, limited,

I say, look at what Q likes in a roster, right?

He does, he does have some tendencies, though.

And he does like having that pure base stealing threat.

We have seen that.

So Tolbert might end up getting the nod, but I think that Rojas should get it.

And you figure out the base stealing situation at a later date, especially if you

got, you know, if you're cycling through guys on the bench, you will have options.

Yeah, you'll absolutely have the options.

And the way I viewed it is, look, it's nice to have a base stealer on the bench.

It's also a very specific spot in the game.

Like if you're up six to nothing, it doesn't matter to have a base steal on the bench.

If you're down six to nothing, it doesn't matter where you want to have those upgrades

as a pinch hitter as a defender.

And for Tolbert, if you are going to steal bases, you got to be more aggressive than he

was last year.

And I thought there were too many times he was brought in and he wouldn't steal second.

That to me is not maximizing your value.

Let's take our final break of the show.

When we come back, I want to get not necessarily some hot takes, but what has to happen for the

royals to reach their ultimate goal?

We'll get Jacob's thoughts next on Lockdown Royals.

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Jacob, I want to get your thoughts on this fun little hypothetical game because we did

hot takes with chance in yesterday's episode, but I didn't really center it this way,

which would be what five things have to happen?

Like, bar none, 100% have to happen for the Royals to win the American League Central.

We don't need to play the game of what needs to happen to get to the World Series that

might be shooting a bit high here because where they have to start, in my opinion,

is simply beating out the Tigers and the Guardians to win the Central.

So, let's start with thing number one.

What has to happen for the Royals to get to that 90-win mark and top the Tigers and

Guardians for first place in the Central?

First thing that comes to mind is the outfield at the plate has to at least be,

in terms of WRC plus, they have to be in the high teams, I would say.

They hovering around League average would be a good spot to be.

And frankly, it would be a huge improvement over what we've seen in recent seasons.

I think that it sounds like such a low bar, but it's been one that previous units have not surpassed.

That's the first thing that comes to mind.

Second thing, Michael Garcia needs to live up to the extension.

That's the truth of it.

2025 was awesome.

It was great to see the Venezuelan do what he did in such decisive fashion.

It was awesome.

But we're still at a point is 24, the expectation is 25, the expectation is that somewhere

in the middle, I think he needs to be closer to that 2025 mark than 20-24 if the Royals

want to get to that 90-win mark.

Also, I need full season of Bobby with Junior.

Bobby can, you know, a bad season for Bobby at this point looks like a 5-4 season.

Like that's something that so many teams would take in a heartbeat,

and that's why the Royals are paying him so much.

But you don't get that if he's not available because he brings that value in so many aspects of

the game. So, need a full season for Bobby with Junior.

I also, I need Salvador Perez to get some luck.

Okay, that is he has been a little unlucky at the plate over the past two seasons.

And I have a feeling that he is not going to catch the most innings for the Royals this year.

I still, I hope, I'm trying to manifest that Carter Jensen has that.

I think that Salvi's going to see a lot of play, whether it be catcher or first base,

doesn't need it. But he needs to be a notably above average force at the plate again for the

Royals to get to that 90-win mark. Last thing that comes to mind, Seth Lugo needs to bounce back.

Like that's the, if there is one move from 2025, I'm still uneasy about it's,

it's keeping Seth Lugo in Kansas City. I'm well, I need to get be convinced on that a little bit.

And, you know, the track record says, hey, this is the right move.

But he did not close out the season strong at all. It was not a, not a good look.

So, if he, he doesn't have to get back to the 2024 heights, he doesn't have to finish second

in AL-SY young voting. But we need a, we need a better version of Seth Lugo than we got last year

in 2026 that the Royals want to get to that 90-win mark.

Yeah, you bring up such a great point and, and to wrap it up, I would just say

that this rotation, I mean, the ceiling is, is pretty dang high. I mean, I, you, you have a guy

like Cole Reagan's potentially returning to form. Chris Boobitch, if he could stay healthy,

Noah Cameron, fourth and, and, and rookie of the year voting, Burger, Colick,

Lewinder Ovel, maybe down the road. To me, where you can just have calm waters is if

Walker and Lugo are serviceable. Because last year, the tail end, they weren't. And that's

what kind of torpedoed that rotation at the very tail end of the season. And I said this

when the offense was in that tailspin in April and in May and you're hoping it's not the same

to begin 2026. The rotation had to be so perfect so many times where you might get six shut out

from Lugo, but it's still zero to zero. And then it would take one inning of giving up two or

three in the games over. You bring up five excellent points. My main take when my one input would just be

man, if this offense is 15th in the league, maybe they're 10th in slugging, it changes everything

about how you view the royals. And maybe the fence is coming in help that maybe doesn't,

maybe it's Connor Dawson and Marcus Tim's, but that just has to happen if they are to compete with

the Tigers and Guardians. You can't do it with a bottom five offense again. Jacob, thanks so

much for your time again. Anything you're working on on on royals rundown that you want to let the

fans know so they can go over to your page and listen to your content. I appreciate that, Jack.

We got a couple more interviews coming up before opening day. So please just go follow the podcast

and stay tuned. Jeremy and I, we try to try to give you all a good thing to listen to twice a week.

And I know Jack does the same over here locked on royals. Yeah, guys, Jacob and Jeremy do

phenomenal work. They are great, great, great, great guys for royals content. Let's just call it

like that. They have phenomenal interviews and now is the perfect time with the season right

upon us. We're so close to it. Go and get them a follow and check out their content. But that's

going to do it for another edition of Lockdown Royals and the Lockdown podcast network. I've been

your host, Jack Johnson. That's been the host of the Royal Rundown podcast and Jacob Milham.

You missed any of the show. You can check it out pretty much wherever you get your podcast. But

until tomorrow, you take it easy Kansas City.