Elliotte Friedman & Jason Bukala Tee Up Deadline Day

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This afternoon the coverage starts at 10 o'clock on sports net and sports net plus Jason Bucala will be a part of it.

Former director of scouting with the Florida panthers. He joins us online right now. Jason. Good morning. What is this day like?

For directors of amateur scouting? Is it like a scary day where all their other precious, their precious prospects are going to be sent out the door?

No, I love that fourth round. Oh, you guys joke, but I mean you work so hard to find players and then you know something happens to them.

Yeah, it's to be honest, it's exciting these types of days. I've been on both sides of the ledger where we were rebuilding in Florida and trying to

stockpile as many assets draft capital to be frank as possible and then clearly towards the end of my tenure in Florida, it was it was starting to turn the other way where we were able to start to spend some of those assets and try and make the team more competitive and yeah, it's an exciting day.

It really is there's a lot of stress involved. Clearly you've got athletes that some of them have, you know, wives and children and there's a lot going on on the personal side of it.

Everybody is a, anybody is a fan of the game. You see it from the outside looking in and you want your franchise to improve one way or the other.

And but there's, there's that emotional moment behind the scenes as well, but a lot of things are kind of going on. So it's a lot, but it's fun. It's sports, right guys? So it's part of the process.

Yeah, it is fun. It is sports. That's why I'm here as opposed to like, you know, a real job. But okay, before we get into like the weeds of like trades that have happened, trades that could happen.

I think that this is an important thing to kind of reset when you're looking at and you know, I'm sure you've done a little homework for years beyond this, but specifically with this year's draft, what are the like kind of tears?

Like so, okay, you know, I think of that Mackenzie Weeger trade, right? It's like the flames get three second round picks. One of those is probably going to be basically a first rounder with the way the Rangers year is going here.

Like what are the kind of like tear drop offs from players? Like is there if it's a mid second round pick versus a late second round pick? Is there like an expected drop off from like 40 to 60 in this year's draft?

Like how do you kind of have it slotted in terms of the value of of these picks as opposed to kind of in other years past?

Yeah, so it's a great question, and this is exactly how it goes. So at the top of the draft class for me personally, I've got it.

It was my line in the sand, if you will, was that three and not included in the Kenneth Stenberg and Keaton bear off to the fence in North Dakota.

But I've expanded that to Caleb Maholatra and number four, who's the centerman playing up the road here in Branford for the Branford Bulldogs.

After that, there's a run from five to call it around 12. But when you get into the back end of the first round here, I have to be honest and tell you that there's a lot of similarities.

I'm splitting hairs between kind of 23 to 45. And I know that's a long run the players, but there's a lot to a lot of kind of there's a lot of equals in that in that range.

And so what that means is that if you own a pick, call the late first round pick, or you own multiple picks in the early second round.

Are you the Calgary Flames do right now? Yeah, there might be value in trading up, but there might be more value in just sitting tight and drafting where you're at if you have volume.

So for example, today if the Toronto Maple Leafs go out and acquire more draft capital of which they desperately still need to do.

But they acquire more draft capital and it comes back in the form of, you know, two second round picks, let's just say just spitballing here.

You're probably going to want to sit tight and go for volume there instead of trading up to get from call it.

For example, pick 33 and pick 36. If you own those two picks, that would get you up to around 18 in the first round.

Is that the guy you got at 18? Is it going to be that much of a difference maker compared to those two players at 33 and 36?

On my draft list right now, guys, you draft for the volume. You don't draft at 18.

If it were me, I'd rather draft in the fifth round, which is now where the Leafs, they have two fifth round picks in this upcoming draft, none in the first obviously.

But now they have a first round pick in 27 courtesy of the avalanche in the Nick Awaw trade.

It's top 10 protected, of course, because everybody learning from Bradford, living some mistake.

But what did you make of the return on Nick Awaw?

I can't imagine you've gone too far down the line of looking at next year's draft class either.

Unless you want to give me the details on what could be like the 20th or 25th pick in next year's draft.

But yeah, what kind of a return does it feel like the Leafs got on the Nick Awaw deal?

Well, again, let's just go back to the beginning. They need as many swings at the plate as they possibly can accumulate.

They just in the in the next 10 rounds of the draft before this just trade in the next 10 rounds of the NHL draft.

The trial may have please had four picks in 324 out of the next 320.

So they need as many picks as they can as many swings as possible.

I don't, I don't have that type of a crystal ball.

My staff around the world of accumulating to 65 kids that we've identified.

But I'm definitely not going out on a limb to tell you who that's going to be.

But having said that the return, I thought the return was great.

It's curious because Nick Awaw, he's going to fit in there in the, he's going to do the same sort of things he didn't Vegas in Colorado.

He was fine here in Toronto.

He didn't, he didn't produce the offense that, you know, that I thought he could like five goals is just not enough.

And, but the team's been uneven all, all year long. And he was a plus player, or at least hovering around a zero.

And, and he can play in all situations and he's big and he's ranging.

The one thing with Nick, why and I think you guys saw it is that the curious thing for Colorado, they play so fast that they are so fast.

Nick, why does not play fast like he's not fast. He's a, he's a guy as you know now that he's he'll extend some plays and he'll do some of the.

The grinding around the, the hard areas, but it's going to be slow.

I'm watching from a distance while that fit is going to work in Colorado just from a speed perspective, because there's such a quick straight team.

But listen guys, keep it going.

If I'm Brad tree living today, that's, that's my message is money.

As much as you like last night was an absolute disaster again, hard to watch.

And it's reality stinks, but they are what they are.

And, and they need as many assets as possible.

Cowan shot it in the net again. That was, that was good. I, I suppose I don't know how, I don't know that Shesterkins put that one on his highlight reel.

But yeah, that's, but all the highlights I, I can give you there.

In terms of the trades we've seen, do they tell us anything about what maybe the Leafs could be, could be looking for?

You know, I'll start with OEL, because the defenseman was traded so early this morning in, in John Carlson, they're going to the docs for a conditional again to just protected first round pick and a third rounder.

I can't tell you anything about the kind of value for OEL, obviously different situation, right?

One guy's rental, I think Carlson, the high end has obviously been proven to be higher throughout the course of the career.

But, you know, I, is there anything you can glean about what maybe return the Leafs can get when you look at that, that Carlson trade to, to the docs?

Yeah, well, if you look at the McKenzie Weaver trade as well, so let's just pigeon, like, let's take a look at those two for my range and Carlson.

You know, older guy is going to run the power play still there, and he's having a hell of a season so offensively really good season in Washington for his age.

I think that somewhere in between those two returns there, if that's what they do, and if the buyer is a team that's got, like, it depends on the buyer, the Anaheim, who's got tons of draft capital, tons of money to spend, they might not be done.

You know, they might be willing as well to, you know, further provide more depth to Quenville there in Anaheim, and go after someone, like, go, yell.

And if that's the return, now you're looking again at multiple seconds instead of a first, because they burnt that.

But I think you could, you could mine something close to the Weeger deal just because of the term.

So he else played really good hockey. I thought that he was, he was bottoming out in Vancouver a few years ago, and then he went to Florida and was rejuvenated, he came here.

He's been their best player, arguably he's been Toronto's most consistent and best player this year, and the return could be pretty happy now.

I have been on record, I am on record that I am torn about this so, and this is where my contradiction lies, because his number is so good, guys, at 3.5, I believe it is or whatever it is.

There's 3.5 million. That number is so good that part of me wants to keep them, because you know what's going to happen.

As soon as it goes up the door, they're going to go shopping and spend bad money on something else in the summertime.

It's going to be way more expensive than that.

Yeah, it is 3.5 for the next two years beyond this one, Oliver Eckman-Larson.

It does feel like the docs would be one of those teams that's not on the 16 team, no trade list, and maybe why we haven't seen any reports of anything being brought to him.

When would those conversations start happening, or maybe, like I said, they're deep down the line with one of those teams that's not on the list.

We saw the Colton Paraco thing play out yesterday with St. Louis, and maybe you want to weigh in on that on how much do you think that was a leaked report to put pressure on the player didn't end up working out.

But yeah, what do you make of what the Leafs should be doing with this 16 team, no trade clause that Oliver Eckman-Larson currently has?

Well, you can with the whole league for the interest in the player for sure, and it's your responsibility to take it back to the player no matter what.

That 16 team, when they sign these contracts, that 16 team list is what it is at that time, and yes, they can make some changes to it along the way.

But you still do the homework, and you can with the league, and you take it back to the player, and you keep it in-house.

And yes, he's been scratched from the line up the last couple of games for this exact reason, potentially, to get moved.

But we don't know where that is. And I like that. I think that's exactly the way it should be. That should be buttoned up that way.

The Paraco situation, I don't like that at all. I've been in the rooms where we've been talking trades, whether it be draft capital or actual players going out the door.

And if anybody in the room were to leak something, it's a firebox, if I said my estimation, you just can't do that. You just do not do that.

I don't like it, and I don't like it's fair to the athlete. I don't like it's fair to the organizations for sure.

Look at Buffalo. Buffalo, they've got off now and added a whole bunch of more.

But at the time that they're staring at Paraco, waiting on Paraco, they might have been losing momentum on other opportunities, like other trades.

And it's not fair to the teams. It's not fair to the player, though. He's he's earned that right. So, oh, yeah, I'm sure there's tons of conversations going on behind closed doors right now.

He's being communicated with professionally, and we'll see what happens.

Okay, so switching gears to some of the other guys that the that the Leafs are looking to move here, Bobby McMahon probably chief among them.

You know, not that Scott Lawn won't be important. I'm sure we'll get to him in a minute here, but it does feel like McMahon is kind of like the must go.

Like there's talk about like maybe they've engaged in some contract discussions. I just can't imagine a number that makes sense for kind of either side there.

Again, looking at some kind of similar moves and these guys are not exact perfect comps for McMahon.

But I mean, you see Connor Garland goes for a second and a third. You see Bunting goes for a third.

Garland is at least the UFA this year, obviously an older player longer track record.

But to those comps kind of tell you anything about what the Leafs can be looking for for McMahon.

It feels like the the pipe dream of first round pick a few weeks ago is a that ship is I don't know if it was ever built let alone sailed.

Yeah, that should might have sailed, but you know, Michael McCarran, you know what for a second round pick, which was.

It just speaks to the buyer is going to assess the value of the asset that they're bringing in and they're going to say that listen, this is this is where we have a we have a void in our lineup.

And this is our ceiling of what we're going to spend to acquire it. It's curious to me. I think it's still going to be a second round pick.

Hopefully for the Leafs it's going to be, you know, again targeting a team that has has a relatively.

A team that has multiple seconds this year, that would be great for the Toronto Maple Leafs.

And you want to try and get the obviously the highest value second round pick and return in that type of equation.

I think you can get a second and a third. I think in the first round or might have that might have sailed fine, but I think you can get a second and third.

That has to happen. Bobby McMahon's for me personally, guys, at his age at 30, like I'm not doing the key for sure.

Somebody said to me yesterday, well, he's going to get key for sure with money. Well, here's the difference.

Keeper sure where the fit in San Jose with the trajectory of that team right now. His value is going to be different to them, even when he's not scoring goals with his physicality and what he does there in San Jose going forward.

Right now, Bobby McMahon, if you were to extend a Toronto, this team is in retool mode. Like they need to really add quite a bit.

I don't think he has the same sort of trajectory value wise with Toronto where the franchise is going.

So I'm not spending over $5 million on Bobby McMahon, or at least I'm not recommending it.

I'm more in the four million dollar range to be frank and that's not going to happen. He's not going to sign here for that.

So we'll see what happens, but that's definitely a second and a third. I think is what you can kind of keep an eye on there for for him.

Now as far as lot goes at $1.5 million in money this year, it's very attractive. It hasn't fit here for whatever reason.

11 minutes a night, guys. Let's be honest, 11 or 12 minutes. It's just not enough. That's the reason. Yeah.

You know, there's not a fit. And so when people start talking, well, why is he going to resign here?

I don't think that he resigns here knowing if if Craig Rubey continues to be the coach, I don't think he resigns here.

Like he wants to play more than that. And so I think that that's the one that he gets traded out.

And then he might want to come back in the offseason. And I'm good with that. He'll just want to see what management and coaching looks like here.

And we'll see it. But spotlight and he's another guy that will he'll be surprised what they get in return for him because face offs, defense or zone coverage is different things like that.

That matters at this time of year.

Feels hard to believe, though. The Craig Barube is going to be the head coach of this team.

Brad, you're living maybe not the the GM of this team as well, but it seems pretty clear.

Yeah, I understand the like the games are meaningless. And maybe it does be who this team even more to lose the games, but my goodness.

I got and I know we're only a year removed from them winning the division and pushing the eventual cup champs to seven games.

But I don't know you I you voluntarily watched that hockey game yesterday. So good for you, Jason. Yeah, it was horrifying.

And the the type of of reaction he's getting from his players. It does feel like he's on borrowed time right now. No?

Yeah, it does. I've been around all three of us have been around long enough to see this type of thing. It doesn't matter that it's Toronto. It could be anywhere else in the league.

When he came out after the game, like I was in a studio, I say, watching and then he comes out after the game. I'm thinking myself, what else can you say?

Like, you know, it's redundant now. It's just repeating itself. And when you when you hear the coach start to say things where he has been saying things like the games in front of us.

And we have an opportunity to knock out our opponent, but we just don't have the will. We don't have the heart.

We don't have the push back the commitment to get it done. When he starts saying things like that, that's when you know that the team just is not getting it done for the coach.

Never mind for themselves, which is embarrassing, by the way, like there's no excuse in sports. You can be bad. You can be bad, but you can work hard to be bad.

And people will always accept that. They walk away. We're just on a very good team right now, but they're giving everything they have.

And you're going to people are going to say, well, it's human nature to not be at the best when you're not when you're miserable. And there's stress over the trade deadline and blah, blah, blah, blah.

You know what? Stress guys stresses the guy going down at a local hospital today performing brain surgery.

Right.

Yeah.

You know, compared to some guy caching million dollar checks playing a sport. So they need they need more commitment out of everybody, but the coach sounds like it's falling on deaf ears to me.

And it's inevitable in my opinion. And that's going to have an effect on some of these decisions.

Yeah, don't I know it. No, don't I know Jason as my wife who's a, I mean, still a nurse, but no longer in the emergency room.

And I'd be like, yeah, tough day at the office. You take that literally anywhere else, literally anywhere else. So yeah, I know that all, all, all too well.

Where are you out on the teams? And I think you can throw a few of them into this bucket. Obviously the sabers have no team in the history of sports is deserve the trade more than the sabers.

And they've kind of done some of their work here, but the red wings, the Canadians, these teams that have been working hard to get into this position.

Now they're there. How much is their impetus on the front office that even if it's maybe not the perfect trade to make one to show you that like, Hey, your hard work is paying off.

And we're going to try to give you a little more ammo heading into to a postseason here. Maybe Montreal's in a slightly different boats.

I was kind of them last year, but what about, you know, the red wings or even a senator's team that's kind of scraped and clawing to try to get in.

How important is it for those teams to try to make trades at this time of year?

Yeah, so, you know, starting with Ottawa, I don't anticipate Ottawa's going to do much more than what they did in adding fogal yesterday.

You know, a pair and going back to Detroit is a veteran that goes out the door that doesn't he's coming off. I are eventually here and he doesn't play as fast as the rest of the team does.

He's a savvy guy that trust me. I like, I love this guy, David parallel, but.

The full goal coming in as that speed element, it wasn't a fit for him in LA. It's going to be a better fit for him in Ottawa.

I don't see Ottawa doing much today just because I just think they are what they are for now.

Now, having said that, Montreal, this is curious isn't it a year ago? If you recall, it was almost like people were talking about should they trade out some people and then can't use and Jeff Gordon.

They rewarded the group for their hard work and Suzuki apparently went into the offices last year and said, listen, we love each other here.

Can we just keep it together? I don't trade out David Savard, for example, and they kept it together.

Now they're in a different situation where they look like they they definitely need a two C having said that they've got all kinds of assets to do it.

Yes, they've got tons of draft capital. They don't want to upset the apple car too, too much as well with the chemistry that they have there.

But I do think they're going to be trying as far as it can to be in on like a cadre or even a Robert Thomas, depending on the cost there.

To the trade red links, there's all kinds of pressure on them, all kinds. They're going in.

As of this September, guys, it's the ninth anniversary of the opening of a little Caesar's arena in Detroit without one playoff game.

When I was in the league, trust me, our teams, when we went in to play in the in the Joe back in the day, it was it was just impossible to win games in there.

They knew the boards, the environment, yada, yada, yada, good teams, but you know, Detroit, the pressure is on and I think that they're going to swing big today.

That's my anticipation. I'm not free. I don't have that insider information, but I can tell you that behind the scenes, I would be pushing Steve Irons with a fuse my GM to make a splash.

And I think they're going to circle around Pederson in Vancouver. That's just my gut. I don't know that for sure.

I just feel like they feel like they can reinvent him and and he'd be motivated to be a Detroit red wing if that ever happened.

Yeah, it's cool to see Detroit back in the playoff picture and Buffalo back in the playoff picture a couple of places that like they're hockey and will be absolutely bumping.

No question. Maybe maybe famous last words, but bring me Elias Pederson in the Atlantic. Please honestly like prove me wrong.

I guess shame on me, but yeah, I'd be okay with any team in the Atlantic, it's in the wagon of that personally as long as they don't wear blue and white.

Yeah, that's the thing, right? Listen, I don't think he's long for a Canadian market right now.

Like he's he gets a front of camera and it's had enough. Yeah, it's tough. It's tough to watch for sure. So we'll see it up.

Yeah, we have NHL teams on the moon. I feel like you might sign up for that right now.

Yeah, 11, 11 points, something million. I'd be okay with playing anywhere. Thank you very much.

Agreed. Jason, always a pleasure, man. Enjoy what should be a wild day today.

Yeah, thanks, fellas. You guys enjoy two fingers crossed. Let's let's get after it here.

Absolutely. Jason Bucala, former director of Scouting with the Florida Panthers. I think, yeah, you're going to have volume if not the quality of a player that you had moving.

Yes, or last year, I would also just say I would also just say with Bucala, that sounds exactly like the pep talk he'll give to everyone at 501.

He's like, all right, good day, hard day of work. Let's get after it here. Yeah, he's knowing him. Yeah. Yeah.

I've been an establishment at that time on trade deadline day. It is a fun like release for everybody.

Uh-huh. The work is done and it's the weekend. Yeah, I'd say.

Interesting to hear his perspective on the pressure exerted on cold and paraco.

Yep. With the, the, the reported and hey, I guess it's, it's possible that wasn't the intention, but it seems unlikely.

It seems like the point was, hey, we know you've got a full no move, but let's see how steadfast you are. Yeah.

And holding on to that, when we release it to the world, John Hams mad at you. Maybe I think they maybe did some poor calculus there as to how mad the fan base there would be to get rid of the Stanley Cup champion team Canada defenseman who's under contract for years beyond this one.

And I know that we're going to get a first round pick a huge defenseman in return. But yeah, no, I think they made the poor calculation there.

And, and maybe I had nothing to back this up, but I'm just going by my own feels.

I feel like I was 50, 50 on it and whether I would accept or not. And I felt like the organization was trying to pressure me into something.

Like it might embolden me even more to be like, hey, how about this? No.

Oh, knowing you, that is exactly the way it would go. I feel like I got to be honest with myself. I'd be like, oh, you don't, you don't want me? Okay, fine. I'll show you by going to Buffalo.

I hate the way that played out for me in that hypothetical situation. But yeah, I do feel like I'd go the exact opposite of like, you don't, you don't even love me anymore.

Alright, fine. I'll leave Doug Armstrong. But yeah, no, it is this is the thing like, you know, NFL like ruthless, right?

Like just cut throat cut throat cut throat. It does feel like guaranteed contract. No, no, it totally, but it does feel like with it does feel like with like hockey.

There is this sense of like, well, that's kind of rude to do that to the guy. And it's like, yeah, I hate to break it to you.

What would the golden nights do? Right. Be rude is the way they would go about it. Well, they what they would do and what they've done again is putting Mark Stone on IR.

They, were they not the mystery team quoted in the machines?

Yeah, they should know. Like they go do whatever they want is just not going to help them at all. They're going to, they're going to have a trade go through and the league is going to be like, guys, you forgot to carry a zero here. They're like, no, LTIR.

Yeah. Okay. Good luck in the playoffs. I don't know what to tell you, but yeah, it is, I mean, honestly, someone should tell Sam McKee that happened because he's the guy most like, get me to spring.

And here she blows, because Mark Stone's on IR. No, I, yeah, I'm on Twitter with the best or sorry on acts on it with the best tweet of the day. Oh, disagree. Actually, the quote, tweet of Mark Stone has been placed on IR. This is the real indicator of spring, which is correct.

No, the one I saw that, that, that hit far, far too close to home was the years 2006, the Maple Leafs are captained by a river, they said, or by a Olympic gold medal winning center.

Domey is getting too many minutes and McCabe is on the top fair and they will not rebuild the years 2026. There's an Olympic gold medal winning captain centering the team.

Domey's getting too many minutes and McCabe is on the top pair and they will not rebuild.

Yeah, good stuff. All right, we took 20 years to get back to where they started. That's true. So Jason Bucala, he said it. He's not Elliott Friedman. You know who is Elliott Friedman?

Is it Fried himself? Elliott Friedman is Elliott Friedman. He joins us next as the fan morning show continues. Ben and his friend getting sports and 590 the fan.

Ben and his friend got it. It doesn't feel like Fred deadline is often on a Friday. And he's not a deadline day. Like am I making that up? No, I feel I feel like it's been a Friday several years in a row.

Maybe I have holes in my brain. It's also possible. I mean, I won't discount the possibility, but you could still be right. And I still would believe Swiss cheese up there. Yeah, yeah.

Anyways, three o'clock this afternoon sports net broadcast starts at 10 o'clock sports net sports net plus let's bring on the star of today's festivities.

Elliott Friedman, who I was tweeting at one o'clock in the morning about the John Carlson deal. I get it. The decks playing California. That was rude though.

I have to say like last year, rant and was it to I think. So I actually consider that I got to sleep it. I got extra sleep an hour.

So I'm not complaining too much. By the way, that's on the intro song. Yes, my son loves that song. He listens to it all the time. Yeah.

I love it too, because it indicates it's the final segment of a Friday. We have 20 minutes left to work. So you can try to be good. I will try to be good.

Oh, I mean, you can't be bad on deadline day. It's like you say anything. And it's like, look at this. Look at this piece of info. We've we've got here.

Okay, Friedja. I mean, let's let's kind of start with the Carlson there. It was the breaking news overnight. What does that tell us about the market for?

I don't know, like maybe a veteran defenseman. There might be one here in Toronto named Oliver Eckman Larsen. Like how, how does that move kind of impacts what prices are looking like on on deadline day here?

Well, I think this was a bit of a unique situation because I don't think the capitals were going to move Carlson and less. They really have reason to.

You know, it was a bit of a weird situation. Carlson was asleep last night when the trade happened. And one of the things I heard was the capitals made it deal the other day with Nick, Nick down to Vegas.

And apparently they had it done the night before and before they could complete it the next day. It got out.

Yeah, we're kind of like, Oh God, like what are our choices here? We either make the trade and we and we and we wake them up with the news or we don't officially make the trade and what if it gets out and Carlson wakes up to like a billion texts and you've been traded, but he hasn't been told.

So it was a tough thing. It's I mean, and I guess I was responsible for this as much as anything else. So I got to take some blame for it, but you're fall.

So I think I think in this particular situation, it was we're only trading John Carlson if someone forces us to do it. And it's a great offer like you.

I think that when the fact that the capitals were willing to say no until they got somewhere where they absolutely felt they couldn't say no, it really helped them in this situation.

And I don't know like I heard the least we're asking like a first and a second for Akman Larson, who has a bit more term than Carlson does.

So I like to me, the only thing that really affects it is to the least feel that they can get that price. And if they don't feel they can get that price, which they were asking, which was like a first and a second they heard, then they'll have to just adjust the price or keep up.

So OAL has six more teams on his no trade clause than Carlson, who had a 10 team no trade list. And I imagine the ducks weren't on it. So they didn't have to wake up.

They did not ask him to wave. And I actually I heard one of the things I heard it was that they weren't going to ask him to wave. Like it had to be a team. He couldn't block.

Okay, so maybe the same thing is happening with Oliver Akman Larson, who's obviously been held up because they're having these conversations.

Do you do imagine those are with teams that are of the 16 that are not on his list or are there constant conversations with him about the potential of waving.

As far as I know, as of yesterday, they hadn't asked him to wave for anyone now.

I think he knew Edmonton was on the radar. I think he knew Edmonton was interested and Edmonton was on his no trade list.

But it never got to a point where the leaves actually went to Akman Larson. I think he knew because all of us were talking about it.

But I don't think it ever went to a point where Akman Larson was asked and vetoed. Like I don't think it ever got that far.

So I would say that as far as I know, he hasn't been asked to wave. Although he never know that we could find out that something was kept from us.

But I will say this. He has indicated that he would like to stay and his preference is to stay. But the Maple Leafs have to take care of business.

Yeah, they do. And obviously, you know, I think again, I should mention Brent sorry to interrupt you. I think Detroit has been in there.

And I think San Jose has been in there and San Jose only has two defensemen signed me on this year.

So it doesn't surprise me in the least that they would be one of the potential teams.

Hey, I know it's not a, you know, easy situation like I just recently had a pregnant wife.

So I know like trying to give them like, hey, I have some news for you.

It's like they don't necessarily like that at the best of times.

But I mean, playing with McLean Celebrini would be really, really hard to pass up on if it were me.

Okay, kind of moving on to some of the Leafs, other targets.

How concerned should the Leafs be that some teams are doing their wingershopping?

I mean, the senators go get fogal, the stars get leaf legend, Michael Budding, Connor Garland goes to the jackets here.

How concerned should the Leafs be that maybe there's a little bit of the drying up of the market for McMahon specifically?

I don't know that I don't know that there would be a drying up of the market.

I think that there's still teams out there who are looking for wingers.

I just think the biggest thing is it's like, okay, you know, they did very, very well in the Nekwai deal.

Very well. That's a good deal for Toronto.

But if you guys just look at the math, look at all of the teams that have already traded their first round picks this year.

I think there's seven playoff teams that have already traded their first rounders this year.

I just think that they're harder and harder to find these things.

So not impossible, but harder.

And now, sure would went for two seconds.

I think Toronto would do that for McMahon.

Look, I think they'll be, they'll be interest.

And I really do think a lot of what today is about is poker.

And it's people waiting to see who folds at the deadline.

Who doesn't.

And I think the Maple Leafs, I think some teams are trying to squeeze them.

And I think the Maple Leafs are trying to wait until they get what they want.

You mentioned Sherwood there.

Do you think the contract that he signs for impacts what teams are willing to trade for McMahon?

Because I'd imagine teams fall into two camps.

And there's teams, I'm sure they're looking at him as a parental.

There's teams that maybe look at it as getting a jump start on getting to sign him.

Sherwood, the number like, and hey, never begrudge the player getting his money, especially when it's not on the list.

But that's a big ticket for for for Sherwood, especially given like, you know, the lack of kind of big track record that he has there.

Do you think that that price on the extension would maybe scare away some McMahon suitors if they were looking at it as almost like a sign and trade situation?

Well, first of all, if I was McMahon's agents, I would absolutely be using that as a comparable.

I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

You know, I think that when it comes to Maple Leafs, I've heard there's a line that they've gotten to.

And it's not that. I mean, I can I can tell you that it's not that I've heard that Dave's kind of have an offer out there that's that is not that not really close to that.

I don't think like I've been told all week there is a deal to be made there.

It's just not in that particular ballpark.

And so ultimately, again, I think it comes down to, you know, today's the kind of day where everybody really shows their cards, right?

So we'll see what it brings.

Look, one thing that's definitely happening with the cap going up, the $8 million players are becoming $10 million players.

The $3 million players are becoming $5 million players.

Like Bobby McMahon is hitting the market at the exact right time and good for him.

We waited a long time to get in this kind of position.

But I just think in Toronto's particular case, I think that he's like, I just I think they'll I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't find a taker.

And but I think when it comes to his contract, I think the Maple Leafs have decided there's a line we're at and we're not willing to go over it.

Matthew Nies doesn't have a no move clause and you put him on our radar yesterday.

Is that anything more than just, hey, Brad, you're living text calls on everybody and throwing his name out there or maybe somebody came to him with with that name.

Does it indicate anything about Matthew Nies' future with the Maple Leafs?

What are we to make of this Matthew Nies report?

Well, this is this is what I believe about about Matthew Nies.

If he goes anywhere, we're going to look at the trade and say, uh, I get it.

Like, you know, I mean, you guys are on every day.

We talk about the lease every day in this market and it's all we all know that they need to replenish the coverage, right?

I think that he is potentially available only to do that.

That if like, you know, for example, like you take a look at New Jersey.

Nemwich is out there now, right?

Like, you know, that like I'm not saying it's one for one.

Nemwich for Nies, but I think that is the kind of thing that we're talking about here.

That if he goes, he brings back some impact players or player that you look at and you say,

okay, I understand.

That is what I think is going on here.

And I think, and like I heard it from a couple of places yesterday.

And I just think like it's not like they're saying we want to get rid of Matthew Nies.

I don't believe that at all.

I believe what his name is out there for is, is there something that we don't have that is kind of sexy that we can use.

That's what that's what that would be about if it ever happens.

God, he's made a granite, not kind of very sexy, Elliot.

In terms of the three of us combined, that's for sure.

Absolutely, but the lowest bar you could possibly clear with that one.

Because my read on it and you're right, like it could go either way, right?

It's like, hey, if you're looking to replenish the coverage, what better way than a 23 year old power forward

who in a down year has 60 points already in his sign to what is only going to be a better contract

year over year here in terms of the way the cap's going.

But I kind of looked at it with the second party said there of like, and I'm just spitballing here.

But like, you know, Robert Thomas's name has been bandied about.

I think that's, I think that's a very reason.

I think that is exactly the kind of thing we're talking about here.

Like if he goes, it's something like, it's something like that.

Maybe not that, but something like that.

Okay, so we saw that the Golden Paraco give the Sabers the Heisman yesterday.

So I expect at some point in the offseason, the Morgan Riley conversation to be more prevalent.

But if that's happening in the offseason, has like a conversation happened with him now?

Like, where are we with Morgan Riley?

Not as far as I know, not as far as I know.

I mean, and look, I think right now the only true untouchables on the roster are the captain,

Newlander, and the former captain.

I think that would be it.

But I just think that they're in a position where they feel like as I wrote yesterday,

what they feel is we need more.

We need more young players.

We need more picks.

We need more prospects.

We need more assets.

And I don't like, I think they're kind of looking at it like.

I think the Maple Leafs are still determining where they're going to go.

Like how big is this moving tool or whatever you want to, I hate these words.

Whatever this is, how big is it going to be?

And I think one of the things that they're looking at it right now is if we can accumulate some pieces,

do we keep them for ourselves or do we use them to get something else?

And I think that's, I think they're kind of going, I think that's the process.

And we're really early in that process.

So I just think as we're in a situation where the Maple Leafs are just starting to climb into this hole

or begin this voyage and see where it takes them.

Yeah, they've got a ton of cap space this year.

They've also got a ton of cap space available now.

Could you see a world where, and I don't think this would be like the outset of the plan

right now for Brad Triliving, but as the day kind of goes along where they become,

because the trade I keep going back to is the Manchipani Dickinson Oilers black ox trade there.

It's like, could they not be a team that are taking on contracts that are maybe not negative or positive assets now,

but could become at best kind of possibly neutral for them?

Like the idea of them being the landing spot for some of these contracts,

the teams need to leave the Leafs?

Yeah, the Leafs, yeah.

I think that's a really good question.

Like one of the things that kind of wondered about yesterday was,

it's like I was going through a list of things that could happen.

And one of the things I was kind of wondering about was,

let's just say a guy like Dougie Hamilton, okay?

One of the Leafs become a team where he gets,

but they get incentivized to take him.

And it's not like a shot at Hamilton as a player

that's not what I'm trying to do here,

but that's the kind of thing that New Jersey might have to do to move the contract.

And it's the kind of thing that,

like I think if the Maple Leafs wanted to, they could be that team.

Yes, I think you make a very good point there.

And that's actually, and again, I want to stress,

I was spitballing that, I was making a list of players who that could work for.

And that Hamilton was one of the names that jumped into my head.

That was just my own thinking though.

I don't know that that's happening or anything like that.

Okay, where are we with Robert Thomas?

And the progression or lack thereof,

of a potential move of him from St. Louis as a total no trade clause.

Well, where are we with that and the likelihood of that happening today?

I don't know what percentage I would put on it.

I have always believed that Utah was the team that was probably the best position to do it.

And all I heard about them was that they felt the price was too prohibitive.

Look, we know that they tried with Buffalo,

and eventually it was just too much, too complicated to deal.

I never, like, Eiserman doesn't tip his hand,

but I believe Detroit's been in there.

I think there have been other teams.

I think there have been some other teams that have done it too.

I don't know what percentage I would put it at.

All I've been told is that the Blues have not been given up trying.

All right.

We'll be watching and listening today.

Thanks, Elliott.

All right, guys.

Have a great day.

You too, Elliott Friedman, the broadcast starting in about an hour and 10 minutes

and Elliott is in the building.

I imagine probably getting all dolled up, getting ready to go on television.

I didn't like doing pushups, burpees, just getting ready, getting the blood flowing.

That's what I'd be doing.

Yeah, hopefully our conversation didn't inhibit him from looking at his phone.

I imagine it didn't.

Okay, so the magic night.

I feel like AirPods looking at the phone probably.

Let's be honest here.

And honestly, good.

Like, please don't let a conversation without standing the way of doing work.

No, for the good of hockey fans everywhere.

Yeah, keep grinding.

Can you imagine what hell it must be to be Elliott of like, he just is like,

like you and I are like, hey, there's no idea popped into my head.

It's like he said, Dougie Hamilton's name.

And like before he was finished the sentence.

And I think this is very smart of him to do to throw the caveat of like,

that is not reporting.

This is a thought exercise, like to have to throw in those caveats of everything.

God, this what happens when your words hold so much weight.

Yep.

People love to aggregate.

Anyways, I think.

And he gave you credit.

That's an interesting thought exercise.

The only part I didn't like about it.

And you kind of made a face to me when it is like, honestly.

And it's like, you don't need to, you do this all the time.

You're like, I got a hand at you.

A good idea.

You don't need to sound so surprised when one comes out of my mouth.

Yeah, but honestly, you had an idea that was not the worst.

So honestly, the fact that the Leafs have over $7 million in cap space.

I want to swear at you so badly.

They have honestly, like normally your idiotic opinion.

No, now you're going too far.

Elliot didn't say that.

He did not say that though.

Maybe like half of that.

Not the whole thing.

The idiotic opinions.

Honestly, you.

Honestly, maybe shocking.

Honestly, no red liquid coming out of my ears after hearing what you.

Most recently had to say, which is kind of a departure from normal.

But anyway, it's trying to you want me to swear at you on a Friday here.

You do.

Seven point one.

Seven point one million dollars in cap space this year.

And over 20 million dollars.

This off season.

And if they don't move all over Ackman, Larsen.

I'm not saying this is a good situation.

But factually, a whole blue line you could conceivably bring back next year.

Side of threat.

Yeah.

Right.

So like you could be the landing spot where somebody dumps a contract that allows them to do something else.

Yeah.

You've also got three salary retention spots as well.

Like maybe there's.

And there's enough time to do this.

Retaining and then I know we can't do double retention.

Yeah.

Or you could do single retention and sending assets out the door.

Like there's.

The opportunity to get very creative for Brad's for living.

Who.

My God, I would hope that.

In the months and months and months that he spent not doing a whole lot.

And I know there's probably so much that goes into being the general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs outside of transactions.

But the transaction thing is the big thing.

Much of that at all.

I know like he did acquire Troy Stetcher.

What a waiver wire edition that was at the time.

Sure.

But I would hope that in this time that he's, you know, spent between transactions.

He's thought about every possible scenario, including the one that he finds himself in now.

Yeah.

Where it's okay.

Yeah.

Trade your pending free agents.

No, duh.

You better.

And not signing Bobby McMahon to a five times five million dollar deal.

Right.

But also, okay, that's like the bare minimum today.

Can you, can you really wow us like Nick?

Well, all right.

Getting there.

Yeah.

Can you really wow us today with something?

Nobody was thinking about that was on nobody's radar that all of a sudden.

Oh my God.

Maybe you're recouping a, maybe it is a, a Dougie Hamilton where it's like a, a diminuted or a, a diminished asset that you're rehabilitating.

Yeah.

A useful player, but also getting some draft capital.

Like, can you do something outside the box that really, really changes the outlook for this team going forward?

I had to look this up because I was unsure just a little wrinkle on the retention stuff.

You need to have a player on your roster for 75 days if you retain, retain salary to trade them.

So you can't, like they couldn't take somebody that's not retained and then retain it.

And then trade it out the door today.

That, that again, it's like we've only been clamoring a fragile living to make trades for the entire year.

So it's not to say there was no world where that could have happened.

It just can't happen today.

But yeah, the, the Hamilton thing.

I think he is like the poster child for that.

The only problem with that is like God has anyone fit in more with the Leafs.

It's like, well, this guy's got some skill.

Is there some bite or some bark?

It's like all of Reckman Larson.

He is not.

So I mean, hey, this was a conversation that's had earlier in the year.

The idea of how do you get the good player?

I mean, generally speaking, you have to give up something for them.

You need to take the distressed asset and turn them into asset.

This is why I keep going back to the Mangia Pony trade.

Like I know Leafs Oilers may be hard to consummate trades between those two teams.

But man, the idea that Mangia Pony couldn't come in here and have one year left on his deal

and play half decently for 20 games.

And then you have them on your roster to start next year.

You do need some hockey players on the team.

Those are all the types of moves that make sense.

I just, I love this day.

It's borderline my favorite day of the sports calendar.

I love it.

I love the transaction.

I love the rumor.

And I don't have to watch the Leafs play hockey.

So honestly, like win, win, win.

The way it's been going has a late.

Yeah.

You know me, normally I love all Leafs hockey games.

But they are, they are testing my, my desire to watch Leafs hockey this year.

I'm a pro.

I'll do it.

I'll show up for work every day and then complain to my nurse wife about how hard it is.

But yeah.

And that's what, that's what we'll do.

It's a rarity that Leafs aren't playing considering.

They had six games between the return from the Olympics and today.

They did also do some homework.

The last three deadlines at least have been on Fridays.

Okay.

Okay.

Way off.

Yeah.

Way off.

Anyways.

Yeah.

The Matthew and I is saying Robert Thomas.

I don't understand that from a blues perspective.

Obviously the Leafs are adding more to the bucket than getting, you know, the top line center for the

maybe top line winger who is making slightly less.

Yeah.

Okay.

No, I got nothing for you on that one.

I mean, unless they're planning to be bad forever.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We'll react to everything that happens before 3 o'clock today on Monday on another edition of the

fan morning show, Ben and a spring gunning sports and 590 fan.

Good morning.

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