Ep 1111 | NFL Free Agency News | NBA Cancels Magic City | Travis Steele & John Groce Talk to Jason

Rarely am I confused about how to start this show.

Two events transpired yesterday that have my attention.

There are massive news in the National Football League, the NFL Free Agency period starts, and it's about as crazy and as news breaking.

It's like it was the NBA Free Agency all over again with NFL owners cutting checks and my Kansas City chiefs signing the MVP of the Super Bowl, Kenneth Walker.

Running back Seattle Seahawks, 25 years old, in his prime, he's everything the chiefs need.

He's everything Patrick Wilholms needs.

That news broke right at the end of yesterday's show on my holy cow.

And then the next thing you know, Mike Evans is going to the San Francisco 49ers.

He's leaving Tampa. That's incredible.

John Hadley's blowing me up Baltimore Center lending bomb.

He's signed with Oakland for $20 million a year.

Jason, don't you understand how crazy this is or how big of news is.

He's the best free agent in football.

The Rams steal the chiefs entire secondary basically.

They're going for it.

The Super Bowl's in Los Angeles this year.

NFL Free Agency has been mind blowing.

But then there was something else that caught my attention.

And maybe it's only my mind was blown.

But Adam Silver, the commissioner of the National Basketball Association,

the guy that grovels at the feet of every NBA player and just wants to be cool with the culture.

He canceled Magic City night in Atlanta.

He canceled strip club night in Seattle.

I just had to clap for Adam Silver.

I just had to celebrate Adam Silver.

He did the right thing.

He showed up here.

This Magic City deal.

I watched a video this weekend where Michelle Beetle was going off on Luke coordinate

for complaining about this strip club night at in Atlanta and how dare he.

And I'm just looking at all the momentum seeming to go in the direction of,

hey, what what are you doing?

You're an old man.

Of course, there should be a strip club night at an NBA arena.

Then I look one of the rappers from Atlanta that goes on all the talk shows

and it's supposed to be this intellectual killer mic,

grown man calling himself killer mic, a rapper.

You know, these rappers all got silly names, but he puts out,

he's all upset because Adam Silver has canceled strip night with the Atlanta Hawks.

Puts out a statement.

Magic City has been a black owned business for over 30 years in my community.

That community has given entertainers that happen to be dancers a place to entertain.

Those women have went on to become business owners, moms, wives and more.

I didn't think Adam Silver had the balls to stand up to the idiocy and he did.

But I do think the idiots are only going to get louder.

That's Magic City, that's killer mic, a leader, a spokesman for Atlanta,

complaining that stripper night got canceled for the Atlanta Hawks.

This world is retarded that somehow, what do you say these women have gone on,

have went on to become business owners, moms, wives and more.

Yes, strippers have post stripper lives.

Congratulations, we all do.

And strippers get knocked up.

Yes, they do. What a surprise.

Many of them going to be moms while still stripping.

Yes, they do own weed businesses and maybe they sell Avon or Mary K.

I don't know or care.

Yes, many of them get married.

Congratulations, I'm not saying that's a bad thing, that's a good thing.

But as if the fact that post stripping, they have a career.

Somehow that's supposed to justify the Atlanta Hawks and NBA franchise.

An NBA franchise that is supposed to put on a family friendly event.

Somehow they have to celebrate Magic City and now somehow there's been a climb done

because Adam Silver and the NBA said, man, that's the same right for our brand.

This is silly.

So I'm confused about what's most important.

So I'm going to keep it real.

We're going to start today's show with Bucky Brooks and talk about the realness

of what transpired in the NFL, the player movement.

My belief that like man, the chiefs got Patrick Holmes just what he needed.

Other people's belief that the Rams have now become a super team.

And the Super Bowl is going to be in Los Angeles and they're going all in.

I'm going to ask Bucky Brooks about my contention that with the addition of Max Crosby,

all the pressure now is on the Mar Jackson.

There's far more pressure on the Mar Jackson.

There is on Josh Allen.

We'll get his opinion on what we talked about yesterday.

And what I still think is the biggest story in all the free agency.

And that's the pressure now on the Mar Jackson and no excuses.

And then I'll bring in Jason Gappernick and we'll talk about Magic City

night being canceled in NBA.

How surprised J.S., how surprised I am.

What it means for the National Basketball Association is sanity.

Is this what that means when it canceled Magic City night?

Is sanity returning to sports?

It's going to be a great addition of fearless.

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Bucky Brokes is going to join me.

We'll talk about this wild NFL free agency.

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As the NFL terms, starring quarterbacks Patrick Mahoe, Aaron Rogers, Josh Allen, Lamar

Jackson, with special appearances from Commissioner Roger Gidell, Anne Coaches, Andy Reed, Mike

Tomlin, and the Harbors brought to you by the Global Elite.

All right, as promised, let's get to Bucky Brokes.

One of the most incredible days in NFL free agency, at least for those of us that are

chiefs fan, for those of you that celebrate, Bucky, former NFL player, former NFL Scottworks

for the NFL Network, I think getting Kenneth Walker was the biggest story of the day for

my Kansas City Chiefs, getting that running back situation saw, but I have a bias.

What's the headline from a very busy day in NFL free agency?

What's the aggressiveness of everybody making moves, like for so long, gentlemen, just

to sit on their hands and not want to give out that money, but we're seeing on the heels

of New England Patriots spending big money last year and parlaying that into a Super Bowl

appearance that people are not afraid to write big checks.

And let's talk about the Kansas City Chiefs because everyone is already kind of poured

dirt on the chiefs grave and said that, oh my gosh, the Wicked Witch is dead.

But to me, this is what the team is needed for the last three or four years.

They've needed a big time running back to alleviate the pressure on Pat Mahomes, to force

defenses to play them better differently.

And what they've done in adding Kenneth Walker, they have someone that can score from anyone

on the field, someone that's good enough to lure extra defend in the box to create more

one-on-one opportunities on the outside.

And with Eric B. Enemy as the offense coordinator, even though he won't be the play-caller, I just

believe you're going to see a renewed commitment to the running game, which is going to allow

that passing game to get back to being explosive like it was back in the day.

Only 25 years old, I mean, I just love this.

I thought that the chiefs were picking up extra draft picks, because they were going

to try to move up and get Jeremiah Love.

That was probably a pipe dream.

But getting someone with experience, the rating Super Bowl MVP, I mean, this is, I don't

know if you could have done a better move, and they still have those draft picks.

They're going to, they signed Travis Calcy to one more year.

They are really going for it in 2026.

Yeah, and I think some of the moves that they made in terms of trading away, Trimic Duffy

said he didn't have to drop big money on him.

They cut Juwan Taylor, they're trying to kind of reshuffle the deck to put themselves

in a position to make a run at it.

And people don't want to hear it, but as long as they have number 15, they have a chance.

And 15 gives them a chance, but because he's coming off a neat injury, you just got to

make sure that you can balance out the attack a little more in case they have to play differently

than the way that they played before with a running back and toe in Kenneth Walker.

Now you can utilize a little more ball control, dominate time of possession, and have Pat

Mahomes maybe win the game in the end.

What we do know is, defensively, they're always going to be a team that turns the opponent

over.

They always play for splash plays, but offensively, maybe they can dictate the terms a little

differently because the running game will allow them to be a little more balanced.

A lot of speculation in Chiefsland that they will make a move for Trent Williams if he

gets out of San Francisco.

Do you see that happening?

You know, it's been contentious for Trent Williams in San Francisco.

The problem that you have with Trent Williams, he's 38 years old, but he wants big money.

He's still playing at a high level.

So where can you find that happy ground to the middle ground to be able to pay him what

you want to respect him for what he's done, but to also understand that he's in a twilight

of his career.

If the Chiefs are able to get that, man, you talk about a premier offensive tackle, a guy

who has been the gold standard at left tackle for years, someone who would actually bring

a little nastiness to that offensive line.

We'll see how it plays out.

I know this.

The San Francisco 49ers are not prepared to play without Trent Williams because you remove

him from their lineup.

They don't have a blue chip player on their front line.

I think they would be foolish to let him walk out the door, but we'll see.

Money makes us do crazy things sometimes.

Is the dispute in San Francisco just about money or is there something else driving Trent

Williams?

Right now, everything has been reported just about the contract, the money.

He is a highly decorated player.

He wants to continue to be paid at that level that he's played at.

But man, we're talking about 38 years old at tackle.

It's different in Tom Brady being a 40-ish quarterback.

We're talking about a premier position where you expect him to be able to snuff out the

elite past freshers.

He's been able to do it.

But at some point, you have to anticipate the fall off.

Where does that compensation kind of come in to anticipate the drop off that would

eventually happen for a player at his age?

All right.

I've obviously got my chief bias.

You probably got a little bit of a chief bias having played there.

Number two, what was the franchise or what was the what player was the most interesting

move beyond what the chiefs did?

I would say the move everyone was talking about Malik Willis and where Malik Willis was

going to end up.

Malik Willis going to the Miami Dolphins, three years, 67 million dollars for a quarterback

that only has six starts.

And in the first half of his career, those first two seasons in Tennessee, didn't look

great.

Now, he looked terrific with the Green Bay Packers, but you don't get the Packers play

call that you don't necessarily have their weapons.

I'm curious to see how John Eric Sullivan and Jeff Hathley build this out to allow Malik

Willis to have success.

I love the kid, positive upbeat kid.

I love what they're doing in Miami in times of trying to change the culture because I believe

they needed to have more of a hardline culture, kind of like the Miami Heat does in that city.

But now you have a humble quarterback taken over.

Can you surround them with the right pieces and can you exhibit the patience that you

need to to watch him grow into this role as a QB one?

45 million and guaranteed money, 67 million overall, as you say.

You think that's still maybe a little on the high side.

But I thought that seemed kind of affordable for what quarterbacks are getting paid.

And I know his resume is limited.

You know, look, it's reasonable then.

In fact, got him on one of the Baker Mayfield, Sam Donald type deals.

Now you have to find a way to make sure that he plays at the level that you believe he

can play.

Some of that is going to be Bobby Sloy trying to understand what works for him.

Here's the thing that works in their favor though.

Jeff Hathley and John Eric Sullivan got a chance to watch him work every day for two

years.

Jeff Hathley, the defensive corner, former defensive coordinator for the Packers, got a

chance to coach against him in many camps and training camp and understand this is what

he does.

Well, these are the struggles.

Let's make sure we build our offense to cater his strength, cater to his strengths.

If they do that, he can be fine.

But every quarterback has a struggle when they go from being the backup to the starter.

How do they help him navigate those struggles and how do they build a team to really put

him in the best position?

That would be the key for the Miami Dolphins going forward.

You mentioned Baker Mayfield and that made me think of Mike Evans leaving Tampa to go to

San Francisco.

Kind of surprised me.

I mean, he's had a hell of a career in Tampa.

He's a little long in the two, four wide receiver.

San Francisco make the right move here, pain, Mike Evans.

Now, it's the right move, but it's a risky move because you're talking about a receiver

that is over 30 years of age.

That said, when we think about the potential lineup that the Niners can try it out, Mike

Evans on the outside, George Kiddell at Titan, Christopher McAfry in the backfield.

That is a, man, that is a trio that is very difficult to defend.

McAfry commands a lot of attention as a runner and receiver.

That means that you're now dealing with one on one coverage on the outside with Evans

and Kiddell.

You sit back and play, saw it to take away the passing game, and then you got Christopher

McAfry, who was able to really carve you up as a runner.

The key is health.

In San Francisco, they've had a tough time keeping people healthy.

But if those three guys are healthy, the San Francisco 49ers are juggernaut offensively.

Mike Evans will be 33 this season, only played eight games last year.

Obviously, Christian McAfry's had some injury problems.

George Kiddell, he's George Kiddell's probably in his 30s probably as well.

They're banking on some, yeah, George Kiddell will be 33 this season as well.

That seems high risk, and their defense has had a lot of injury problems, and Nick Bolson's

no longer probably a superstar.

Is San Francisco a championship team?

If healthy, they're a championship team, but there are a lot of conditions and stipulations

that we have to put on it, everyone we rattled off her over 30 years of age.

And it's hard to be an old team in the National Football League and win.

That said, if they're all available, yes, they can go toe to toe with anybody.

We saw this year, and I felt like, oh, Shanahan did his best coaching job and taking a look

at a underman team and getting to the point where they were competing for the number one

seed in the NFC going into the last week of the season.

He has to make sure that they have young replacements in place to be able to jump in if those

older guys get hurt.

So a lot of them will be on what they're able to do with the draft, what they do developing

the backups, but they're counting on an old team to be able to get them there is risky

and it's unlikely that everyone will be available.

It just depends on which combination of those guys are available, whether the San Francisco

49's be able to buy for the title.

John Hadley, I was talking to him, asked, hey, what's the biggest, you know, free agent

move so far?

And he started talking about the Raiders and he starts talking about Linderbaum at 25

years old, the center that some people had him graded as the best free agent in the

draft, pound for pound, and do you agree?

Linderbaum Hadley selling it like Jason, don't underestimate how big this is for the Raiders.

They got a group of young people led by Linderbaum.

They signed a group of talented young people and the Raiders may be a surprise of this free

agency season so far.

Yeah, now they did a really good job getting young players, young players that embody what

Clint Kubiak and really more importantly, what Tom Brady wants, the Raiders to represent.

And Linderbaum, what they've done is they've set the table for Fernando Mendoza to be

the number one overall pick.

When you get a center and older center who understands how to play the game, now you obviously

can give him some of those protection calls and some of the adjustments that normally

will fall on the quarterback that allows Mendoza to play fast and to play without the burden

of having all the extra stuff that can come along with playing the position.

And it goes beyond that when you're thinking about a quay walk in the Kobe team teaming

up there, you're thinking about bringing Malcolm Kubis back, they made a trade for Johnson

to corner to man one of those corner back spots on the perimeter.

They have a nice solid core in place, but I feel like every time we've said that about

the Raiders, it hasn't gone according to plan.

We will see if Clint Kubiak and that coaching staff can maximize the talent that they have

because the Raiders have underachieved for a long time.

Can they rid the curse and get back to winning?

Look, that is a task that is challenging and we'll see if Clint Kubiak is up to the job.

They paid quite a bit for Linderbaum for a center around 20 million a year.

That's, and guys just 25, he's going to three years for now, it's going to be another

contract.

What are they going to pay him in?

Did they maybe have to overpay for Linderbaum?

Look, man, you can't overpay for good players and if they wanted to swipe him away from

the Baltimore Ravens, sometimes you got to go above and beyond what the market would say

that you should play a center and it's only a bad move if it doesn't work out and he

doesn't play well.

He's a good player, he's been well school first coming from Iowa, current parents, what

he did in Baltimore was solid, going to the Raiders will brick Dennis and then Clint

Kubiak are going to run that tried and true system, they used to frustrate us.

When I was with the Chiefs and the Broncos, when they used to run it and run the off-size

zone, they can do those same things.

To me, it's a great move because he's the centipede of that offensive line, he's the natural

leader and he is going to allow your young quarterback to play better.

The Atlanta Falcons are kicking the tires on to a tongue by over.

I'm not sure what that said, it's just a one year deal.

I think Kirk Cousins is still under contract with them, obviously they have the young kid.

Why am I...

Michael Pinnix.

Michael Pinnix, what do you make of Tuwa going to Atlanta?

Well, I would expect Kirk Cousins to be released, they talked about that happening maybe

on March 11th.

When it comes to Tuwa talking about Loa and Michael Pinnix, what you're doing is you're

creating competition and you have an insurance policy against Michael Pinnix returning from

his injury.

Kevin Stavansky has always worked with undersized quarterbacks and has success.

Going back to his work with Case Kingdom, looking at what he did initially with Baker Mayfield,

he had an affinity for Dylan Gabriel, so he is okay with an undersized quarterback being

his guy.

And Tuwa talking about Loa, he has a left-handed quarterback that can get the ball out of

his hands quickly.

They have a nice crew of weapons on the outside, B. Jean Robinson, Drake London, Cal Pits,

that works.

Now what you have in Michael Pinnix and Tuwa talking about Loa, you have two guys that are

off-endered, but you're hoping that one can stay healthy and get this offense up and

going.

I'm believing that Tuwa talking about Loa is going to be the starting quarterback because

he has a head start.

Michael Pinnix is recovering from that injury.

If Tuwa jumps out well, particularly in mini-camp and training camp, it allows Kevin Stavansky

to put his sister in with a veteran who's played a ton of games.

Tuwa, as a starting quarterback, that kind of blows my mind, and I would set the over

under at four games on when he's going to get hurt again on that astro turf.

I just, man, if that's Atlanta's plan for the future, it says something about Michael

Pinnix.

I don't know.

Well, here's the thing, Michael Pinnix has been hurt.

He had, but five season in injuries throughout his career, college in the pros.

So look, they're on a wing in a prayer either way with each quarterback.

They're banking that Tuwa will find a way to get it done.

Here's the thing about Tuwa.

When Tuwa has been surrounded by upper echelon talent, he's played well.

When he's protected by a subtle offensive line, he's been available.

They protect them and can those playmakers on the outside make the plays that are expected

of them.

If they do that, that's a winnable division.

I think the rationale behind that is Kevin Stavansky is looking at the vision saying,

Carolina, Tampa, New Orleans, they're all vulnerable.

We can get this thing going.

We can win right away and then jumpstart the program.

Los Angeles Rams.

They're always in win-now mode.

You have to be in Los Angeles.

Only way to get attention there is not really a football town.

They sign Jaylen Watson.

They get Trent McDuffey from the chiefs.

One paper, there are people's like, that's the best team in football.

Do you agree?

Look, I think it's them and Seattle Seahawks.

Last year they were one and two.

I think it comes down to the same thing.

This year by making a move to get two chiefs corners, which is kind of funny.

They go and get Trent McDuffey, Jaylen Watkins, those guys can play together.

That was the biggest.

That was the Albatross.

That's the thing that prevented the LA Rams from going to the Super Bowl.

The secondary.

Then you get experienced guys, guys, they play well together together.

Trent McDuffey, who has history with Jimmy Lake, who is in the building for the Rams, I like

the moves.

Now it's about making sure that Matthew Stafford can continue to play at an elite level.

You want to keep him protected.

But man, the MVP shows no signs of slowing down.

I expect the Rams to be right there in the end.

Okay.

Yesterday, I had a discussion about Max Crosby going to Baltimore and I was arguing with

Steve Kim that Max Crosby going to Baltimore means there's more pressure on the Marjacks

in next year than there is on Josh Allen, true or false?

Yeah, there's a lot of pressure on the Mar.

Whether there's more is debatable, but yes, there's pressure because right now, if you

are a Ravens fan, if you're in the Ravens organization, you can say, Hey, Lamar, we've

done it all the last two years, the last three years, we've talked about the Baltimore

Ravens having the most talented roster in the league and yet they have nothing to show

for it.

If they can't get it done with Max Crosby on defense, a new coach and Jesse Mentor, a new

play caller and all of the newness that's around the quarterback, people are going to begin

to look at number eight and say, what is going on with the Marjacks and why can't we continue

to go?

I'll say, last year, lack of availability in those things will get them a pass this year.

He has to be available and he has to play at a high level for this team to go where they

want to go.

And if they don't, then people are going to start looking at him as a, what's going on

with you?

Why can't you elevate this team?

They're close enough.

They're good enough.

Why on their Super Bowl team?

Listen, I agree, perhaps that the Rams have more talent.

They got Stafford, they got a complete team, but holy cow, when you're talking about

Lamar Jackson two time MVP, Max Crosby, second or third best defensive player in the league

after Miles Garrett, you got Derek Henry and he's still Derek Henry, maybe not King Henry,

but he's still Derek Henry at running back.

You got Zay flowers and why receiver, it's like they've given Lamar, and again, like

as you said, Jesse Mentor, young coach, something to prove, they've given Lamar everything.

There are no more excuses.

If it doesn't happen this year or next year, because I went and looked and saw like, hey,

Steve Young, they got Deon Sanders, won a Super Bowl, Reggie White eventually delivered

a Super Bowl to Brett Farve, Von Miller with the Rams in 2021, was brought in.

There's been a history of defensive players showing up with the right quarterback and

producing a Super Bowl.

That's why I just think Josh Allen will still have a lot of pressure, but he'll always,

at this point, still have the excuse, it's not like they've given him a Cadillac around

him.

They've given Lamar all the necessary pieces.

They seem to be like calling Lamar as bluff this entire off season.

Like, hey, you're going to show up for coaching interviews.

Do you really want to be involved?

Are you going to be at OTAs?

How committed are you?

Are you just happy with the money in the MVP's?

Are you going to do all the little things that help us win a Super Bowl?

Yeah, look, that's called a spade of spade.

He has to step up and make it happen.

We can talk about it because we talked about it on this show where the Office of Coordinator

and Sad, the basic card amounts, hey, man, we need you in the building to be able to

do what we want to do when it comes to OTAs and many camps and those things.

We need you to show A-plus leadership on top of A-plus performance that you've shown in

the past.

There's a lot on Lamar Jackson and it comes at a time where he is about to get a new contract

that's going to be a blockbuster and too much is given, much is required.

I think they want to require more from him in terms of his presence, in terms of his

production and his leadership.

Have I missed anything in free agency or in the past 24 or 48, that I should be asking

about or talking about?

No, I mean, look, it's so much going on, but I believe that we need to keep an eye on

the Y receiver market as it goes forward.

Alec Pearce signing that deal for it is $116 million.

Someone who came from out of nowhere to average over 20 yards per catch and in fact, he was

so good that they traded off Michael Pittman to the Pittsburgh stillers so that he could

be the number one.

What is going to do, Jason, when you start getting that kind of money for receivers that

some would say like they didn't know, now you're going to begin to have teams to look

to the draft to find their guys and you're seeing people move off of receivers now more

than ever.

Will we get to the point where people are saying, yeah, I'm not paying $30 million

plus for a wide out, I'll just continue to draft guys and see if I can plug and play

him behind or with a quarterback, there's an upper echelon quarterback.

Alec Pearce is going to be an eye opener that we'll look at dish in beyond to see if

the market has gotten out of control for past catchers.

I'm so glad you mentioned him because I should have.

This isn't a fluke, two years in a row averaging 20 plus yards per reception with Indianapolis

with shaky quarterback play, injured quarterback play, upheave with the quarterback position.

This dude may not look the part, but he plays the part, I mean, he's the best long ball

receiver in the NFL and he's a white kid and he's six foot three and you know, in a home

run hitter, I think that contract raises eyebrows because he's not like a household name,

but the numbers just don't lie, this dude is the real deal.

Yeah, dude is the real deal when you talk to coaches there, they talk about how deserving

he was of being not only elevated to the number one role, but getting the kind of

contract that he's gotten, hard worker wins consistently on one-on-one opportunities,

but then when you talk about the production, you've been around the league a long time

and when you average 20 yards of catch, that is an explosive playmaker all the time.

So he's able to get over the top.

I'm excited to see what he does, but make no mistake, that does change the market when

he makes that kind of money.

Imagine what the elite wide receivers are going to come in on the open market as we continue

to get down the line with the salary cap exploding with new contract deals and everything

hidden in.

Here's what, 22.3 yards in 24, 21.3 yards per catch in 25.

You just imagine what the elite receivers, you're saying he's not an elite receiver because

they're paying him and banking on him, becoming elite.

Yeah, they're banking on the come.

I can't say that he's the elite right now, like even though the production is the elite,

I can't put him in the same categories, we were put Jermar Chase and JSN and those guys,

I'm on my own, I'm saying Brown, but you definitely got to keep an eye on it.

You talked about back to back years, averaging over 20 yards per catch to me as a defensive

player.

Man, that is something that you're like, we need to pay attention to him because he can

get over the top of the defense, but now can he do it when he's the number one and everyone

expects him to do it?

It is different.

He's a different role going to the number one chair, as opposed to being the number two.

We'll see if he can handle it.

That's a great point.

He's going to see more coverage rolled his way, but listen, I got to give, you got to give

the Colts.

They took him in the second round.

It's not like they weren't, they expected him to be something and here he is in year three

and four, proving them to be right.

Bucky, thank you for the time.

Thank you for the conversation.

Great job, as always.

We'll see you next time.

All right, Bucky, great as always.

Don't go anywhere.

Jay Scappin' and Scappin' Tech.

Thanks.

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Alright, as promised, we had to bring Jay Scappernick in because there's big news in

the National Basketball Association.

So before we get to Travis Still, the head coach of Miami, the undefeated Red Hawks that

are 31 and 0 before we get to Travis's brother, John Gross, the leader of the Acker and basketball

team that's 17 and 1 in the Mac, and maybe just as good as Miami, we're going to have

both of those guys want to talk about the NCAA tournament, the Mac tournament.

Before we get to them, I wanted to break the news.

Scapp, I don't know if you heard, but yesterday Adam Silver released a statement, canceling

Magic City night in Atlanta, I know you had plane tickets and hotel arrangements already,

but Adam Silver has screwed you over here.

When we became aware of the Atlanta Hawks' scheduled promotion, we reached out to the

Hawks' leadership to better understand their plans and rationale.

While we appreciate the team's perspective and their desire to move forward, we have heard

significant concerns from a broad array of league stakeholders, significant concerns

from a broad base of league stakeholders, including fans, partners, employees.

I believe canceling this promotion is the right decision for the broader NBA community.

That's Adam Silver and I just want to, I didn't think Adam Silver had it any, but I'm

certainly going to celebrate him when he does the right thing, Jay.

I think he's done the right thing here.

Well, yeah, after a couple of weeks of deliberation, obviously, I like how in the statement, you

just read it was, we reached out to better understand, you've been talking about this

for like three weeks, they've known this was coming.

I think it's just been like a rolling temperature check and finally there's been enough pushback,

and finally half measure silver decided to do something at least meet, meet some of

the people that are opposed to this halfway because they are not completely canceling it.

They're chained, they're dropping some of the elements of it, but they're still doing

some of the stuff.

TI is still going to be performing and they will still be selling the wings that everybody

likes so much, what are some kind of lemon pepper wings of some sort that I read in the press

release, they will still be selling those, but yes, some of the merch and some of the

other things that were planned will not be, will not be going forward at this time.

And Jason, I actually, I think I texted you the, the story from espn.com, which you had

already heard of, but I read the, I don't know if you read the article, I texted you.

They actually, they dropped a name of a player in there, Luke Cornette, they named names,

a player, an active player for the Spurs that had reached out to the NBA and was urging

them to read, considered, I'm moving forward with this, with this plan promotional event.

So Jason, I'll leave it up to your imagination to decipher Luke Cornette, actually, I'll just

break it to you.

He's a white, leave it, leave it up to the whites to ruin the magic city stripper night,

Jason.

So espn mentioned Luke Cornette, not Adam Silver, not, yes, yeah, espn, yeah, that Luke

Cornette, yeah, but he's been the only guy in the public, which is sad, that one guy in

the NBA backed up by one other player, who, who are my, uh, long time, uh, Boston Celtics,

Big Man, nine, I think he's finishing up someplace else.

He kind of seconded, uh, Luke Cornette.

But Luke Cornette, the only guy that stuck his neck out there, and Spurs, uh, are you

thinking, is Al Hoerford?

Is that the name?

Al Hoerford, that's why I'm thinking of, yes, Al Hoerford backed him up.

But other than that, and what is there, 450 players in the NBA, LeBron James says nothing,

Steph Curry says nothing.

It's really embarrassing that it took some non-descript journeyman white boy that really

doesn't matter to be the voice in the black league, uh, that's why I give Adam Silver

credit, because I don't think this was popular with the players and with the culture, uh,

but, you know, here we are.

I did not expect Adam Silver to do this, but, but I do think that once people connected

the dots that Jamie Kurtz, the wife of Tony Restler, the owner of the Atlanta Hawk,

let's people figure it out.

Well, she did a documentary series on Magic City, and now they're doing a celebration.

I think that's what left Adam Silver no choice is people figured out, hey, this wasn't

the black community in Atlanta saying, hey, let's celebrate Magic City.

This was the owner's wife saying, let's celebrate Magic City and support my documentary.

Yeah, definite conflict of interest and just, just an insane idea in general.

Like, wait, I heard of this first through you, because you were taught, you've been talking

about it for a couple of weeks now, and I just can't believe like, who thinks that this

was a good idea?

Let's have a strip club promotional night in an NBA arena, like the NBA is, I think

still promoting their product to families and trying to, you know, get those husbands

wise, bring their kids to games like this, this just was never going to work in my estimation.

But like you said, Kudos to Commissioner Adam Silver, who generally this is, I would

say kind of the antithesis of what kind of move that we've come to know of him in his

tenure.

So I, you know, I guess he read the tea leaves, though, and maybe there are some, some

larger sponsors and predominant money people involved that were opposed to this, not just

the two players that were named in Al-Horfer and Luke Hornet.

I'm telling you, if you live in Atlanta and exist in Atlanta, this was no big deal.

I think the hawks are actually surprised.

There was any blowback at all.

And I do think there was some blowback outside of the NBA players community, I think among

average fans outside of Atlanta.

But if you live in Atlanta that, you know, I'm just going to keep it real.

It's chocolate city, it's gay city, it's single baby mama city, it's, what's the woman

Fanny Lewis, Fanny Willis, that tried to take Trump down, that she, she's some kind

of prosecuting attorney that talk like a gangster.

Like she was just as ghetto as any of the criminals there.

I think existing in Atlanta, this feels normal.

And the outside world just kind of invaded Atlanta's degeneracy.

And so it is known for strip clubs and rap music, profane and degenerate rap music.

And so in their mind is like, hey, this is what we do here in Atlanta.

Yeah.

I mean, well, Jason, perhaps maybe there's a movement in the opposite direction coming

now.

Like this could potentially be like a litmus test.

You know, like when, when Bud Light decided to stop using their transgender spokesperson,

that was a litmus test.

Now maybe, oh, look, the strip club celebration events for this NBA game has been canceled.

So maybe this is just good, good news for us moving forward that like maybe society is

correcting itself.

And we're getting back on the right track, potentially.

Scott, before I let you go, I know you're a fan of the NFL as well.

Seems like it was a crazy day in NFL free agency.

The start of NFL free agency.

Did you have a reaction to anything you saw in a disappointed seat?

Doesn't seem like your Pittsburgh steerers have been too active so far.

You have any reaction.

My reaction today was holy smokes.

Like every time I went to the internet, there was some new crazy story breaking.

Like I felt like it was early July.

And this was the NBA.

And we were, we were having this frenetic player movement kind of period going on like

and huge names like craze.

Like when I first, when I saw the Ken Walker, it was moving, it was going to Kansas City.

It was just mind boggling to me that Seattle would let him get away.

The Super Bowl MVP.

And then like two hours later, it's like, oh, yeah, Mike Williams, yeah, he's gone too.

He's going to San Francisco now, Mike, yeah, Mike Gavin, sorry.

So it was, to me, it was just, it was just a crazy frenetic day.

I'm hearing Kyler Murray now, to Minnesota, potentially.

They're, the Vikings have become the favor for his services, which makes little sense to me.

I would be trying to get, you know, maybe Aaron Rogers for a bridge year to see what they

have there in JJ, in JJ McCarthy.

But Jason, my major takeaway here is, and I listened to some of you and Bucky on his

way out.

So I listened to like the last 10 minutes of your conversation.

I love what the Rams have done.

I think the Rams have an elite David, maybe the best offense in the NFL last year already.

They have a first pro, a first team all pro, Pukin, the cool wide receiver now at this

point.

Kyron Williams made, I think he made back-to-back all pro second teams, like two and three

years ago.

And now they have the league MVP and Matt Stafford.

So the big issue for them secondary, well, they just gutted Kansas City secondary.

So the chiefs are going to, they're going to make all the noise, I guess, with the Ken

Walker signing, but they lose two starting cornerbacks and a first team all pro in his own

right in McDuffie because he, he's made, he was a first team all pro three years ago and

he was second team all pro two years ago.

So really the Rams addressed their, their huge issue.

And I believe Jason that the Super Bowl is in LA.

So I think that there's just going to be a huge push for the Rams.

I think they were the best team in the NFL last year.

They had like a two or three week stretch where they just choked away two huge games, one

against Seattle, which ultimately cost them home field advantage and what would have been

the home field in the, in the NFC championship game or whatever they would have met Seattle.

So I think there's going to be an attention to detail with the Rams all year this year.

They're going to be focused to get to that Super Bowl in LA.

And I think ultimately the Rams should be the big favorite to win the Super Bowl this

season.

Scab, thank you so much.

I got to go.

I got to talk a little college basketball.

I got Travis Steele and John Gross just around the corner, wish me luck.

Travis Steele, Miami, Red Hawks, 31 and O, next.

All right, welcome back.

And as promised, the head coach of the only undefeated team in Division 1 basketball,

Travis Steele, head coach of the Miami Red Hawks, the greatest story going in college sports.

They're kind of like the, they're a different kind of Indiana and what they did in football.

It's a different kind of Indiana built the greatest team in college football this year.

Miami has built the most successful team.

Without further ado, let me welcome in Travis Steele and Travis.

I'm not going to ask the silly question that everybody's been asking you about, should

you guys make the tournament if you lose?

My question is, should the Mac be a too big league?

Because I think you and your brother have done the greatest job in the history of Mac

basketball.

It's the greatest season.

I think both of you are qualified, Akron and Miami are both qualified to be in the NCAA

tournament.

Yeah, I couldn't agree more, Jason.

I think they've had, you know, it's, it's funny, we've gotten a lot of national publicity

and I'm happy for Miami, but Akron deserves more than what it's gotten.

They've had a great year.

I mean, they went 17 and one in conference play.

He's got them planted at a very, very high level.

As he always does, he's built a juggernaut up there at Akron, it's super, super consistent

every year.

They're right there either in the NCAA tournament or in position to be in the NCAA tournament.

So yeah, I think, you know, listen, the numbers games make it difficult for the mid-major conferences

nowadays to get multiple bits, right?

You know, all the Ken Pomeroy, the net rankings, everything is slanted towards the P5P6.

But if you just look solely at the results, the results still matter, right?

You know, do you, did you win or did you lose?

I think they could be a team, Akron, that could advance in the NCAA tournament, not just

make it.

And I think we can as well.

So it's just a great league, the max, an awesome league, a lot of, a lot of good coaches

talk, a wall chick, Rob Senderoff, Jeff Bowles, me go on and on.

There's some Frank Martin or some tremendous coaches in our league.

So to go 17-1 and 18-0 in league play is very hard to do.

So I've been following the Mid-American Conference since 1984.

I think that's when Ball State started recruiting me.

I joined the football team in 1985.

And so I've, I've from Ron Harper, to Dan Palembezi, to Gary Trent, the shack of the

Mack.

I know all the history of Mid-American Conference.

What you've done here at 31-0 is the greatest story in Mack basketball history.

And I think one thing that I just haven't heard discussed enough, people want to talk about

your non-conference schedule and what it quad won, quad two wins or whatever.

Winning 31 straight games.

And then in particular, the last 12 games when there's been a big target on your back.

Every game is a super bowl for the opponent.

And we really saw that in your last game against Ohio.

That's one of the great atmospheres.

It felt like you were at Cameron Indoor Arena and you're getting everyone's best shot

and people don't want to give you credit for getting everyone's best shot the last

five to six weeks of the season.

That's incredibly hard.

Yeah, you know, I probably didn't understand it, probably, until you go through it, right,

until your feet are in it.

And man, everywhere we would go, it was sold out.

I mean, it was just, like you said, we were, they're super bowl.

And all of a sudden, guys would play quite honestly a lot of times above their level.

You would see guys, all of a sudden, the guys hit one, three all year and league play.

He hits three, three, he's in the game.

It's like, man, what is going on?

But it felt like that happened almost every game.

You know, again, it's hard.

You got to be sharp and you can't let anybody take your mind.

You know, so it was difficult, you know, I will say that to get to where we are right

now.

But I give our guys a lot of credit, man, we are really resilient.

We've had to overcome a lot of adversity.

I know we're 31 and 0, but, you know, on the road, tough environments, the whole deal,

everybody's super bowl.

We've had multiple guys go down with injuries throughout the season, lost our starting point

guard at the, at the first game of conference play, who was a first team all-back guy.

I mean, how many teams could do that and still go undefeated?

But we have a lot of good players.

And that's the blessing of our team is strengthen numbers.

And like I said, our guys are tough.

They're built for that moment and they thrive in those tight moments.

You went, you won 25 games last year and I think you returned several of those players.

Did you know you were going to be really, really good this year?

Maybe not 31 and 0, but more than 25 victories probably made sense to you guys.

Yeah, you know, we set a single season record last year for wins, as you just said, the

five wins in the last season and we kept six of our top nine guys from last year's

team.

We lost the kid to Georgia Tech, lost the kid to Kentucky, lost another kid to Lyndon

Wood, that we didn't necessarily want to lose any of those three.

But you know, you're going to have some nutrition just happens in this landscape, but we did

keep the bulk of our team.

So I knew we had a chance to be really good then and there.

We lost a heart breaker in the match championship game, shoot we led Jason, probably 39 minutes

and 56 seconds of that game we lost to my brother and that championship game and you

know, to get everybody back that we got the six guys, man, I thought it really propelled

us into the spring because you know, always say big events call for big responses, right?

That was a big event when we lost.

It was hard.

It was a gut wrench or felt awful for our guys.

But the response that we had in the spring, the extra effort, the extra work and that

our guys were putting in was so noticeable.

It was the best spring I'd have ever been around in all of college hoops.

And I've been coaching for shoots since I was 22 years old.

So for a long time, so over 20 years of college hoops and I knew we had a real shot, how motivated

our guys were.

I mean, and that just carried over to the summer, to the fall and then obviously into the

preseason and into the season.

So I knew we had a chance to be really good.

So I've known Frank Martin now, I think for close to 20 years, however long ago when he

started at Kansas State, that's when I met him.

Very good friends.

He's an excellent coach.

And UMass hasn't had the season that they Frank wanted, but UMass is a very, very dangerous

team and you're going to get another super bowl like effort because this is the one

chance for UMass to salvage its season, make be all over ESPN and whatnot.

Tell me how difficult a task it will be Thursday morning to take on UMass.

Yeah.

Number one, Frank.

So he's a Hall of Famer.

I mean, his teams have an identity.

They play so hard or so tough.

It's almost football.

Jason, after you probably like that, you'll play in football, man.

I always say it's football with no pads and no helmet when you play Frank's teams.

He does a great job.

They got great players.

They got a couple of all-conference guys.

We know we're going to get their best shots.

The third time we'll have seen them.

We played them at our place and we played at their place and now a neutral site.

So we know it's going to be a great game and we got to be ready, man.

We got to create our separation with our preparation here during this week's practices

and film sessions and lifts to give ourselves an opportunity to get that win on Thursday

morning as UMass.

All right.

I don't want to avoid the elephant in the room.

The other part of this great story is just that your brother is coaching the other great

team in the match.

How close are you and John?

I know there's a 10-year age gap.

I think you guys have the same mother, different fathers, but walk us through your relationship

with your brother from childhood all the way through this coaching experience.

Yeah.

Very close, obviously.

Very, very close.

John, we obviously grew up in the same house the entire time.

He was 10 years older than I am, like you said, and same mom, different fathers, but in

a lot of ways, man, I was his shadow kind of growing up.

You know what it is?

When you get an older brother like that, you really look up to him.

And he loved hoops.

He was a, he played, you know, varsity high school basketball at Damville High School in

Indiana.

We grew up right outside of Indianapolis.

He went to Taylor University.

He actually coached me in AAU.

And I got some stories, Jason, on that now.

I, he probably won't tell us, that was back when he was a little wilder.

And so again, super, super close.

So when he would coach at North Carolina State using assistant coach under Herb Sendeck,

I'd go down every summer and basically stay the whole summer with him and work out and

be in the offices at a young, young age.

Man, I knew exactly what I wanted to do.

I wanted to do exactly what he was doing.

And listen, I would not be where I'm at today without him.

Now, there's no question about it.

And he's my mentor, look up to him.

I think he's the best coach in the country.

In my, in my opinion, I know I'm biased, but he does a phenomenal job and super proud of

him, man.

I just, I, number one, he's a great coach, but he's an even better person.

So on how he does things and how he does his business, man, really respect him.

Do you guys help each other out or?

No, you know, since we've been in league, it's hard, you know, like it so, you know, for

the longest, we were never in the same league, you know, I was a savior.

He was either at Akron or he's at Illinois, Ohio, you know, and so, you know, we were to

try to help each other constantly with just, you know, exes and O's and different things.

And now we're in the same league.

It's just so unique, you know.

And I want to see him do really well, other than when he plays Redhawks, right, other

when he plays Miami.

But it's probably hardest on our mom.

Jason, I think that she, she's, she takes it really hard, you know, like that's a, even

like this year, we beat them in the regular season in January, you win, but then it kind

of feels a little half empty after the game, you know, because I love him so much.

I want him to do it.

I said about, let's, we're playing the win, we're in that game, that's for darn sure.

But at the same time, man, I, I, I cheer for him.

I want him to just, I want to see him do really, really well.

So let's say hypothetically, you ran into some recruit that's like, man, I don't think

he's right for us here at Miami.

We already got a guy at that spot.

Would you call John and be like, Hey, man, I got, there's a guy that maybe you should

take a look at or is that like, nah, we're competitors.

Absolutely not.

I'm not picking up that phone and calling him at all.

Hey, listen, he doesn't need my help, Jason.

He does a great job.

He's got a great staff, you know, but it is like I, again, he's, he's won.

I mean, like, you know, he wanted to hire big back in the day when he was there.

It's the second go around in the Mac and he's crushing it at Acred.

I mean, yeah, he doesn't need my help, man, he's, he's good.

The playing styles, coaching styles, are there similarities or are you guys completely

different?

You know what?

Like, John's teams have changed the way that they've played the last year and this year.

It's more like us, if I'm being on like, very free flow, fast pace, a lot of threes.

And again, you play to your personnel.

That's what he does.

You know, like, when I first got in league, he had the kid and Ricky Freeman, who was just

a monster.

Right?

He's a double, double machine and you should throw the ball in almost every time down

the floor, right?

I mean, you got a guy like that.

So they played a little slower at that point and they were throwing it inside a lot.

Now he doesn't really do, you know, he doesn't do that.

Not that he has a really good big kid of Monty Lyles as a monster, but he's a different

type of big than what, uh, and Ricky was.

And that's where John does such a good job, man.

And as he, he has the ability to, um, make adjustments with his personnel to put his

personnel in the best position possible.

He's not too stubborn to say, hey, this is the way I'm playing and, and listen, I don't

care, right?

He will get the best players and he will make it work.

Um, and I think that's a sign of a great coach.

You know, he, he's willing to make adjustments.

All right.

So I'm supposed to interview John right after you.

So I'm going to ask him, you've taken credit for his coaching style.

I'm going to ask him about that.

You've changed his coaching.

And then the other thing that I, I can legitimately say you've done for him is because you guys

get all the attention being 31 and 0 and undefeated, he's kind of got to fly under the radar

this year, which is probably a bit of an advantage for him.

It's not a Super Bowl every time someone plays Akron and they've had an incredible season.

But you've, you've probably been an asset for him in that way in giving his team something

to shoot for and to shoot at and keeping the pressure and attention off of Akron.

Yeah, probably, probably from true to that Jason, I mean, like that's the, you know, yeah,

I mean, and, and, but listen, they've, his team, again, they've gotten a lot better

throughout the year.

You watch them play.

No, his teams do every year.

I mean, like they get those guys to peek at the right time, which that's what the elite

coaches can do.

Right?

I think that's the separator from, from the really, really good guys to, to the elite, man,

they have the ability to get their guys to peek at the right time and, and John's done

that, whether he was at Ohio, I know the Illinois thing maybe didn't finish the way that he wanted

it, but like, but look at Akron, what he's done there, man, just, I mean, Akron's role

in man.

They're a juggernaut.

So, yeah, I mean, they get, but again, like they deserve, they deserve more national headlines.

And I've been saying that, like, for the last month, as I don't understand why they're

not getting more love, quite honestly, because they should, because they're good enough

to be that, they're good enough to be in that large team, like they, not, not just make

the team, not just make the tournament, they get advance in the tournament.

And there's a difference, as you know, right?

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Well, look, both of you, well, I guess Kent State is regarded the 2001, I think Stan

Heat Team, I think they went to the Elite Eight.

When I was at Ball State, we had a team that took UNLV to the wire for a chance to go

to the Elite Eight with Rick, not Rick Majeris, Dick Hunsaker had replaced him, but one

of you guys is going to, somebody's going to be the greatest team, and you guys got the

best resume for that.

Let me ask you this about Miami's got some great alums from Ron Harper, to Ben Rothfuss

Berger, to Sean McVeigh.

Have you heard from all four of those guys, any of them give you more support or more

connected to the team than any of the others?

And they've all been great.

You know, we've had Ron Harper back to a game this year.

We've had Wally Zerbiac back for a game this year.

But listen, you just said it, I think the alumni base here is just so strong.

I mean, not even just the athletes, like you look at it from a perspective, like look

at all the CEOs that came from Miami, I mean, it's incredible.

Like a guy like Brian Nichol, who obviously is at Starbucks, I mean, like it's the outreach

has been awesome.

The support has been incredible.

I mean, we've went from having basically Jason 200 people at our games to now we're

10,640, you know, and as the season's gone on, and I'm hoping that we've connected

that past, you know, obviously to the president, and then that will help the future of the

university as well.

And I think, you know, we got a great president and president Crawford and our athletic director

David Salem, we're all pulling the same direction, so hopefully we can catch this momentum

that we have right now.

And because that's important, right, because the momentum is everything.

We catch things at the right time, and especially in this landscape that we are in in college

basketball, it's so unique and not just college, basketball, college athletics in general.

We're at the right place at the right time, man, I love being here, this is an awesome

place.

I love coaching in this league.

The Mac is awesome.

Again, that amount of great players that have played in all these universities in our league

and the great players that are currently in our league and coaches, man, it's a lot of

fun.

It is a lot of fun.

It's absolute wars every night.

And I think we'll end on this note.

I feel a little iffy, spotty about this question, but I got to ask it, there are, and I don't

want to speed you up too far, but there are people that will say, hey, the only thing that

matters, the only way for Miami to legitimize themselves is to win an NCAA tournament game.

That, you know, if they want to make this 31 and O season really meaningful, you have

to win an NCAA tournament game.

What do you say to people that contend that?

Yeah, I would say number one, the meaningful thing for me has been the journey.

Listen like all the early mornings, the conditioning, the lifting, the relationships, the experiences

are going to be last a lifetime.

I mean, everybody wants the results, but I'm obsessed with the journey.

I think number two, Jason, like I recruited all of our young men in our program, and I

sat them down in my office, and I said, listen, if I want to make sure everybody understands

what my goal is for this program is to advance to the second weekend of the NCAA tournament.

And if that's not your goal, then I don't want you to come here.

If you don't believe that can happen, then I don't want you here, right?

Because I do think we have guys that are built for that moment.

I think our guys are built for the big stage.

We have winners.

We have guys that have a huge chip on their shoulder.

We're hungry.

So listen, we want advance.

I don't want to shy away from that at all, but the biggest thing for me, I'm obsessed

with the journey.

I mean, I just, I can't tell you how good a young man we have and how fun of a group

it is to be around, and I'm just super blessed to be a part of it.

Of those 31 victories, any of them sweeter than all the rest?

Man, Ohio is pretty sweet, you know, like in the whole reason we haven't won there, I

guess, it's 2011, and I use the Kurt Signetti line when I think they beat Penn State as

far as the streak.

You know, hey, listen, this team just hasn't played at Ohio, and that's why I told our

guys, but it was a rivalry game, obviously, it was to go undefeated as well in the regular

season.

There's a great environment, awesome environment, what college athletics is all about.

That was a pretty sweet one.

Travis, thank you for the time.

Good luck on Thursday.

Good luck the rest of the season.

You've made all of us, Matt guys, proud, anyway.

Good luck, Travis.

I'm an old Indiana boy, C2 Indiana boys, like you and your brother just out here crushing

it.

Awesome.

Seeing you guys lift up the Mac, it's awesome.

I will be rooting for you in March.

Thanks for having me on, Jason.

All right, that's Travis Steele.

More fearless.

Thanks.

All right, welcome back and as promised, the other half of the brother combination, I

didn't mention this to Travis, but I have this whole thing that these are the clean game

brothers.

All right, watch Game of Thrones, Sandor and Gregor Clegane.

John, did you watch Game of Thrones, the Hounds and the Mountain?

I did not, but I've heard about it, obviously.

I'm not much of a, my wife and tell you, I'm not much of a TV watcher unless I'm watching

ball occasionally.

I'll get into a show.

I think the show's you how long ago I've gotten into a show, but the last show I got into

was ballers.

I look, and some reason I really liked that show and I was fascinated each week to

see the next episode, but that's probably the last one I've really, maybe Ted Lasso might

be the other one, Jason.

Ted Lasso's a great show.

Ballers is probably one of, that doesn't incorrect HBO's top 30 shows, I don't think.

It wasn't bad.

If your sports guy wasn't bad, obviously I'm a former football player, so I watched

some friends of mine appeared on this show, but the Game of Thrones, one of the all-time

great shows, at least for five or six seasons, and they had these two brothers that were rivals,

Gregor and Clegane, and Gregor and Sandor, and they were giants.

They were seven foot tall, muscleed up, blah, blah, blah, and they had this great battle

at the end.

That's kind of what I think about you and your brother.

The two giants of the Mid-American Conference, I played football at Ball State, been following

Mid-American Conference basketball since 1984 and 1985.

What you guys have done is incredible, but I have to think, if I'm you, I'm like, my

little brother, I've just gone 34 and two, in back-to-back years, have completely dominated

this conference, and no one even knows or cares because my brother goes 31 and 0.

And so, is there any jealousy that your little brother has stolen a tiny bit of your spotlight?

No jealousy, for sure, but I'd rather fly under the radar at this point in time.

In some ways, that's a little bit of a blessing, but obviously, congrats to them.

They had a phenomenal year.

We played them one time.

Unfortunately, Jason Opel has always been a fan, especially with us only sending eight

teams to Cleveland, speaking as a Ball State person like you are.

They were one of the teams that finished seven and 11, just like the seven and eight seed

and did not get in because of tie breakers.

The schedule's imbalanced.

Obviously, I love our league, Commissioner John Steinbrecker, Ricky, they really work

at it.

But I've always been a fan of playing each other twice, and just so happened, we didn't

get the opportunity to do that here this year with Miami and some other teams, but it

is what it is we can't control that.

John, I think you have a case, and I know you'll be uncomfortable bragging about yourself,

but you have a case to be the greatest coach in mid-American conference history.

You've done it at two different programs now at Ohio.

You had tremendous success in 2011-2012.

You guys go 29 and 8, advanced to the sweet 16.

You had taken them to the NCAA tournament two years before, and now you turned back

around and you've done it again here at Akron.

You've created a great program.

Has anyone, am I the, I don't couldn't imagine I'm the first person to say, this guy's got

to be the greatest coach in mid-American conference basketball history.

You know, it's interesting.

I get asked that here because I followed a legendary great coach, Keith Dombra, who had a

ton of success.

He's from Akron.

He's a friend.

He's a great coach.

But I always tell people that really does what motivates me, Jason, is I want to coach

the best teams that have ever played in Akron.

You know, I'm not, I don't get motivated, getting up in the morning thinking about being

the best coach that's ever coached here or someplace else or, you know, in a conference.

I want to coach the best teams.

And I think our team this year has been as good a team as we've had here during my nine

years.

And we've had an unbelievable run.

As you mentioned, three conference tournament championships in four years, five total championships

in six.

There's only been six other programs in all college basketball that have done that.

For 40 and two in our last 42 games against Mac opponents, I mean, that's ridiculous.

Obviously, we've had really good players, great staff, great teams.

But this team has a chance to be that team.

Obviously, we still got a lot of work to do this week, starting with Buffalo on Thursday.

So I'm someone and this isn't my Mac bias, although I'm sure it plays a little bit of

a role.

I think Akron and Miami belong in the big dance in the NCAA tournament, given Akron's

history, given your history, you know, I just don't see how everybody's talking about

Miami and whether Miami deserves it.

And I'm like, well, that's crazy.

They won 31 straight.

What we should be talking about is Akron.

34 and two in the last two years within the conference, the guy's record and resume

is unbelievable.

I don't even hear people referencing you guys as a bubble team, and it really drives me

crazy.

Yeah, I know.

You're right.

And all those numbers and the metrics, the way they design now with the net, certainly,

I think, obviously, I'm stating a fact here.

They favor the power for plus the biggest.

They do.

And it just is what it is.

But you're right.

We've got five losses and all five teams of 120 or more games, you know, Troy's getting

ready to play in the Sunbelt Championship, they've won 20 plus Miami's 31 and 0, produced

pretty challenging to beat in Macierina.

That's not an easy task.

We played them there.

Yale coach Jones does a tremendous job at Yale, you know, they won the Ivy League regular

season.

They're still playing in the Ivy League conference tournament and they won 23 plus games.

So yeah, we played a really challenging schedule purposefully to get us ready for Mac

play.

And you look at what our guys have been over to able to do your right Jason over this

two year window.

It really is when you start saying 34 and two or someone told me 40 and two the other

day in our last 42 games against Mac opponents and you just like shake your head.

I mean, it's like, wow, you know, I'm not sure there's enough.

Maybe there is another program in college basketball.

I have to get our SID to figure it out.

That's went 40 and two in their last 42 games against conference opponents.

I don't know how many of them are out there.

Who taught you and your brother how to coach?

Well we grew up in a basketball family, you know, my parents, my father and my mother were

from Newcastle, Indiana, which adds to the world's largest high school gymnasium.

They grew up on basketball ever since I was little.

I mean, when I was born, they have pictures of me laying in a crib at the hospital with

a basketball goal attached to the crib and I'm only days old.

And so it's a part of who we are.

I'm sure Trap told you that.

You felt that way talking to him like it's something that our families taking a lot of

pride in for years, whether it's my mother, my deceased father, my stepfather, my stepfather's

cousin played for the Portland Trailblazers and won an NBA championship back in the 70s

with Bill Walton and Jack Ramsey as the coach.

So there's a lot of who is your cousin when it comes to hoops?

Who was your cousin?

My guy named Larry Steele was my stepfather's cousin, and he was a college basketball coach

as well as obviously a great player at Kentucky for Joe B. Hall and for the Portland Trailblazers

for Coach Jack Ramsey.

So Travis did credit you, particularly I think he said, did you spend some time at Georgia

Tech as an assistant?

I think I think NC State, NC State, NC State, you know, said he came to me and said,

he came and visited you down there and soaked up, and that's where he'd like, man, this

is what I want to do.

Bob, he credited you with developing him, teaching him.

Do you still teach him or you see his own little engine now and doesn't need your help?

Yeah.

Travis kind of his own engine, right?

But at the same time, obviously, any time, and I think he's this way just like I am,

we like to always call ourselves lifelong learners.

I tell people like, hey, you know, I think I'm the best version of our staffs, the best

version of itself now relative to nine years ago because we've worked really hard over

the last nine years to get better every year, no different than we request of our players.

So, you know, I've really seen him grow and obviously he's done an unbelievable job there,

you know, developing that program and proud of him.

If he took a little bit here and there away from the experience he had, I coached him in

a U, I brought him down to NC State, we've been around each other, obviously quite a bit

growing up.

And, you know, I appreciate him saying that, but he's also developed his own ideals and

systematically how he wants to teach the game and how he wants his teams to play.

I'm saying this, you're going to think I'm poking you, but I'm telling you what he actually

said.

He said, and you can watch, he said that his style of play has influenced

your style of play and the Akron now plays the way that Miami plays, true or false.

Yeah, well, I love my brother, but I'd have to disagree with that.

Actually, the biggest influence for us two years ago in the shift was watching Alabama.

I've got a friend, Ryan Pannon, who's very bright, he's the head coach at Arkansas State.

And so I was fascinated a little bit with their style and really took a deep dive into

that two plus years ago and really started to think about how we systematically wanted

to play coming out of COVID as well was influenced by the European game.

In addition to obviously the, you know, how fast and free and conceptual Alabama plays.

Obviously, the NBA has went in that direction a little bit more as well with five out and

conceptual offense more than calling plays.

It's about players making decisions.

And certainly the way they play, they do that as well through a different system.

So there are some similarities there with what he was saying.

But you know, the biggest influence there was really kind of the NBA, the European game

and maybe even more so than the NBA.

And then obviously some influence from from Alabama and watching them play offensively

during Nate's tenure.

So as a Mack guy, I was under the maybe false belief that the current setup of college

basketball would prevent what I'm seeing with my own eyes.

This with you and your brother have done, this is the greatest year of Mack basketball

ever.

I thought it couldn't happen during the NIL era and just the transfer portal era.

I just thought like the glory days of Mack basketball from Ron Harper to Dan Marley to

Dave Jamerson to just shack of the Mack Gary Trent while he's urban.

I just thought, no way, am I right?

Is it much harder to do what you guys, what you guys are doing or has NIL actually made

it a possibility to do what you guys are doing?

You know, probably a little bit about that.

I certainly don't want to speak for Travis, but I can't tell you this.

I do think a big part of both teams being having a good year is retention.

And so they've been able to retain the majority of their roster returning from last year

to this year.

And we have been as well.

You know, on our end, obviously the winning, the culture, the player development, our guys

becoming pros, every scholarship player with the exception of one in nine years has went

on to play professional basketball.

I've got a friend who's at the power five level and he's just astonished by that.

He cannot believe, you know, obviously at Akron that we've been able to do that.

You know, every player that's exhausted their eligibility is graduated, some of them

with multiple degrees.

So we those things matter and they have impacted retention.

But as you're alluding to Jason, so as NIL, and you know, obviously we've been very

competitive with that near the top of the league here, I think it's something certainly

that is attributed for sure to retention and in our success in terms of how that's impacted

travel, you know, you'd have to ask him, but it's really a combination of all those things

for us.

So because Miami has sucked up all the oxygen in the room, people don't really know about

Tavari Johnson, Amani Liles, your best players.

Could you walk us through your roster and, you know, the strengths and weaknesses of the

guys on your team?

Yeah, I appreciate the question because it is about those guys and it's really, we've

got five seniors, which is unique in this environment, which is what you were alluding

to Jason.

I think you pegged it.

Tavari Johnson, obviously, is a guy that's in contention for Mac player of the year.

You know, at one point, he was one of the very few guys in America that was a 50, 40,

90 guy, two, three, three throws, 50%, 40%, 90%, obviously he's one of the great playmakers

in our league.

And I think nationally, because he has the ability to make others better as well as score

the ball.

We have another guy in Shema Scott, who was six men of the year last year.

And in my opinion, oh, I think she should earn it again this year.

It's basically a starter and it's what allows our team to be really good.

We have great depth.

I've got eight guys about every night.

I could start any of those eight based on what they've earned through preseason practice

in the season.

So we've got an opportunity to bring guys off the bench that are starter quality, which

makes our team really good.

Shema Scott spearheads that bow and hard men's a great shooter transfer from Ohio state.

He's as good as shooter as I've coached.

He not only shoots him well from a percentage standpoint.

He gets it off quickly, really creates a lot of gravity out there for his teammates.

Evan Mahafi, who's also another transfer, came into play with his brother, Eric, who has

a chance to be on the all freshman team and is really special on his own right.

But Evan's a guy that is a utility knife, and he affects steals, rebounds, block shots.

He guards the other teams one through five.

He has a capability of being a double figure guy in any given game.

And then Lyles is the fifth senior whose story from freshman who led the Mac in fouls

per minute played to all league, which I think it'll come out that he will be that at

some level here in the next day or two is incredible, Jason.

I mean, the maturity of this kid, where he's at as a person student and player versus four

years ago.

And he first got here, I mean, he's a poster child for development.

So it really starts with those five seniors, and then we bring, I mentioned Eric Mahafi,

the freshman.

Sharon Young was on the all freshman team last year, has started games for us this year.

He's coming off the bench currently.

Zach Alligan's given us quality minutes, you know, Marvin, the teammate Kamali has in

the front court.

And so has Chabi Baray.

So you know, we're rolling basically 10 deep, and that depth has been really good for us.

So you did it at Ohio, you're doing it at Akron is or I don't want to ask you a unfair question

or a silly question, but I kind of have to ask you, are you a, are you a, a Mac lifer

now?

Yeah.

Yeah, I just, it's a great question.

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, no, I got no problem.

I get asked it frequently.

Obviously, we've loved being here.

We've had an unbelievable run.

I like to be at places, Jason, where it's supported.

There's a commitment to excellence.

It's been that way to this point.

You know, we're trying to obviously take it one day at a time and enjoy this team.

I mentioned at the outset of our conversation, how special this team is, not only in terms

of talent, but the type of dudes that we have.

But some of those things when people ask her outside, you're control, right?

Some of them, sometimes you've got control, but that's sometimes you don't.

So, you know, for us, it's about getting lost in where we're at right now and what we're

doing.

But I, you know, I don't ever say never.

I think you can back yourself into a corner, you know, that way.

But, you know, I just love to be at that places where you're striving for excellence and

you're thinking about constantly, how do we get better?

How do we grow it?

How do we resource it more?

You know, those things are the most important to me.

I'm not a guy who's a standstill guy.

I think if you stand still, the other competition is going to blow right by you.

You know, you're either getting better or you're going backwards.

And our focus has been on getting better.

Obviously here, it's a big reason we've had success over the nine years.

But obviously, you know that sometimes that comes and goes with decisions that are made.

So just trying to enjoy this team as much as we possibly can.

But, you know, I don't, I don't ever, I'm a little different than most guys.

I don't ever say never, you know, I think that, you know, we're in an environment that

changes constantly.

You're also, I think, is it six or seven years, other than the COVID year, you've won

20 plus games virtually every season, other than the COVID year.

And so when you say this is my best team or the best Akron team ever, I have to go all

the way to like, are you saying this team is capable, potentially doing with your Ohio

team did in your last year at Ohio?

Is it that good?

I think we're capable, but you know, you follow it, Jason, you've been doing it a long

time.

So much of it is who, it's not an NBA playoff series where you and I are probably old

and up.

We remember when some of those were best of five.

Now they're all best of sevens, but it's not a best of five, best of three, best of seven.

It's who plays the best that day.

It's about matchups is so much goes into that, you know, it's interesting.

We've had so much tournament success coaches will say, Hey, what's the secret sauce?

And two thirds of it, they like what I tell them, but the last third is reality.

So I always tell them it takes talent.

You got to be good now first, secondly, you got to be really, really prepared.

And third, you got to be really lucky.

And obviously that last one, you can't control, I mean, it is what it is, you know, but you

can control the first two.

And certainly that's what we try to do on a daily basis.

So can, can I quote you back to Travis saying that he got lucky this year going 31 and

you know, is that what you're really saying is just, it's just luck and you're still the

better coach.

No, I don't know about that, but what I will say is this, it's hard to win every game

regardless of who you're playing.

I mean, I understand everybody knows that that follows sports and obviously you've played

it at a high level and you follow it closely on the daily.

So you know, that's not, you know, not easy to do.

You know, obviously I feel really good about our team and what we've done, we broke the

school record for most wins in the regular season.

You know, we finished on Ken Palm as the number one defensive team and the number one offensive

team in league games.

You know, so we've done a lot of really, really good things.

What's interesting is when you get in these tournaments, it doesn't matter because at this

point, everybody zero and zero.

And what you did previously isn't going to get you anything, whether in my opinion, whether

it's Miami or us.

So, you know, we've got to play the game that's in front of us on Thursday.

You don't want to get you too far ahead of yourself.

But if you were pitching to the guys on the tournament selection committee and you were trying

to make your case for, hey, why Akron, why should there be two teams from the Mac if we

don't win the Mac tournament?

What would your pitch be?

Well, some of what I said earlier, right, we played a really good schedule.

Our five losses are against against, I believe quad ones and twos.

One of them may have crept a three, but and that may be Troy, but Troy just won the semi-final

the sunbelt last night to get to their 21st win and their plan for the sunbelt championship

I believe today.

So we played a really good schedule.

We won the games, obviously, at this point on paper that you're supposed to do, which

is hard to do.

Our number one in DER, number one in OER and lead games, we've had an unbelievable year.

And I think we're older than five seniors.

We've got really good guard play as you know, Jason, I think that's so important in whether

it's the Mac tournament or the NCAA tournament to have good guard play.

We've got one of the best in the country in Tavari Johnson.

So I think we're equipped, obviously, as you said earlier, you think you're capable of

making a run like some of those other teams we've had previously.

We are.

You've got to be good enough prepared and you've got to be a little lucky.

But yeah, I think certainly we're one of those teams that is one of the best teams in

the country.

Well, John, I just want to thank you for taking the time and for making me.

You and your brother have made me pay more attention to Mid-American Conference basketball

that you know, I used to just strictly watch ball state games.

You guys have made me watch the entire league.

Frank Martin joined and Frank Martin, I've been friends for about 20 years, so I follow him

at UMass.

Yeah.

So, Frank, good coach.

Good human.

Yeah.

I just, I'm just astonished at just how good and interesting the Mac is.

You guys play Buffalo.

I think to open up the Mac tournament.

How difficult of a matchup is that going to be?

Anytime you play someone three times, it's hard, right?

Familiarity, I always say breeds contempt.

And so, you know, it'll be challenging in that regard.

Both teams are super familiar with each other.

We just played game two against them on February 24th.

So it's, this is a right around the corner game and, you know, we've got to be able to

step up and make plays.

Obviously, we've got to make some adjustments.

I'm sure they're trying to do the same thing.

You know, ultimately, it'll come down a little bit to, you know, who makes shots, who

executes the best.

I think in these conference tournaments, very rarely, if at all, Jason, do you catch a

team that doesn't want to play that day in a postseason tournament?

You know, that doesn't happen very often.

So it comes down to who executes the best and who plays the best that day.

Final question.

The Hurley brothers versus you and Travis, who wins if you played basketball, if you

too, you too played against each other.

And I'm talking about right now, not in your primes, right now.

And then I don't know right now, but primes.

But what I would tell you is that, you know, I think obviously we both played on our side,

but I also saw those guys play in college.

And I have to probably be a little bit realistic.

We'd fight them, but Travis a fighter, I'm a fighter, we'd fight, we'd fight them, but

I don't know.

You wouldn't have a size advantage?

I don't know if we'd ultimately get them on the scoreboard.

Those two guys are pretty good players, man.

Don't you got some size on the Hurley brother?

They're both mid.

I mean, Travis and I both are probably around six foot ish.

So I don't know what the actual height is of the, oh, yeah, you know, I'm about six

one, Travis probably similar, but I don't know how much of a height advantage we'd have

there, Jason, but that's a creative question.

I love it.

And obviously those two guys are super fiery and have had a lot of success as players and

coaches.

I'm going to admit, I have a, when I see bald white guys, I think tall, you know, because

you know, you got to be tall to be white and go bald.

You got to be tall and have that confidence.

I figured you were like six, two, six, three, I'm dead wrong.

You just got that Michael Jordan confidence.

So you just, yeah, anyway, John, thank you so much.

Jason, appreciate you having us on and a behind you there, is that a picture?

Is that an earth wind and fire picture behind it?

Yes, it is.

It is.

So that's my, that's my favorite fight could pick one on and be your soul band.

That's who I would pick.

I, I listened to them frequently.

So I noticed it right away behind your left shoulder.

That's the reasons, the reasons that you're in here, because you're 17 and one and you're

the best basketball, you and your brother, the best basketball story going right now.

Thank you so much, John.

Hey, appreciate you Jason, thanks for having us on.

Appreciate you guys.

All right.

That's John gross.

We've had both the, the brothers on the clean gangs, you guys have watched Game of Thrones.

You'll know what I'm talking about.

Thank you guys.

Thank you so much for watching.

We'll see you next time on Fearless.

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