Ep 281 | The Controversial Truth About Women Preachers | Allie Beth Stuckey | The Glenn Beck Podcast

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Well, I don't think that we need feminism. I think we need Christianity.

I mean, you're accused of taking a pastor's position because you're doing these big events.

Which of course, I'm not. I don't shepherd a flock. Peter Teal has been going around

talking about the antichrist. And for some reason, Israel has become the central question

that we need to answer on the right that has become like the defining feature and the dividing

line on the right.

How do people say you are the next Charlie Kirk? What? Is that good, bad? How do you react to that?

How do you feel about that? You know, I think a lot of people have been trying to figure out who

the replacement for him is. I've seen the media say it's Nick Fuentes. It's, you know, this other

activist over here. And the truth is is that he's irreplaceable and that all of us kind of hold

a fraction of what he was. I hope that I can kind of carry the torch of evangelism and apologetics

and things like that. But I don't see myself as a political activist or as a coalition builder.

Too many disagreements for that. He was so good at peacemaking through debate. I don't see that

as my role. So I'm just going to keep running the race that I'm going to run. Yeah, it's interesting

because I thought when he died, I thought, who is going to replace him? And I couldn't come up.

I could come up with like five people that could take parts of it. Right. But I couldn't come up

with one. And then I thought, why are we looking? Why are we saying who's going to replace him?

He was unique. He didn't replace somebody. Yep. He was just completely unique. Yeah.

And when we find unique people, and I think you're one of them, I mean, how long have we known

each other? Okay. So I started coming to Blaze Studios 2017. So now it's been nine years.

I think nine years February of 2017. And you were just doing, if I remember right, you were just

doing videos in your car. Yeah. I mean, it's crazy. Car apartment. Yeah. That's all I was doing.

And I was not here for a media opportunity. I was here to take a tour of the studio where

it going back was. And Dana and Dana Lash was. Yeah. And I threw like a series of strange little

connections, just got connected to Dana Lash's producer. And he was like, well, I'll give you a

tour. It's like, I just tour. That's amazing. And so I toured the studio and a producer said,

I think I've seen your stuff on Facebook. Do you want to do a Facebook live for us? And that's

how it started. Yeah. It's amazing, isn't it? Yeah. I remember really early on.

I've seen, I've met, I think I told you this once, I've met a ton of millionaires. And I've met

a ton of really powerful, famous people that don't have any money and don't have any fame,

because they're just not willing to do the one thing, whatever it is, the one thing that

you know, and sometimes it's just, I expect it. Yeah. I expect, well, I'm going to be, you know,

whatever. And they won't work for it or whatever it is. I, I don't know, I mean,

coming through the play store, we now have the Secretary of Defense, Pete Hague Seth. Yeah.

We've had so many people come through these doors. You are one who I think is, and I told you

this, I think at some point, a legitimate star is not the right word, a legitimate force to

be reckoned with. And I can't, I'm so excited for you. Well, thank you for saying that. We had a

lot of conversations early on. And of course, I'm nobody walking in and Glenn Beck and is like,

oh, he wants to talk to us in his office with Lawrence Jones. And I mean, very intimidating

situation. And I remember something that you said that I was like, I do not want to agree with

that. I do not want to believe that. You said, and this is paraphrasing, that you are never

going to be able to meet a moment that you did not prepare for. And you talked about the

importance of experience, preparation, and hard work. And here I am a few months in to my media

career. And I'm like, but I feel like maybe you just raw talent. I feel like you could just,

you know, you get there and you have enough just raw ability to take you over. But truly,

every single new opportunity I've had, it's not, I don't look and I'm not like, wow, I'm so glad

that I was so talented or I'm so glad that I just had that natural gift. No, I look back and say,

oh, that thing five years ago prepared me for this. Oh, that thing that I've been doing on my

podcast. That is actually what prepared me to debate 20 liberals in a circle on that

Jubilee video. It wasn't raw talent. It was preparation and hard work. So now almost 10 years

in. I can agree with Glenn. That's good. I wish more people felt that way. Can I talk to you about

that circle because I watched you. You were so good. So under Charlie had that too. I cannot do

that. I would lose my mind. I have you could totally do it. Oh, I don't think so. You could. You

could. But you know, it was such an interesting thing because I had watched Charlie's and they

were so ruthless to Charlie. They were so mean. They were personal about his appearance,

about his kids. And so that's what I was expecting. Now, this was the day before Charlie's memorial,

so just a couple weeks after he died. And I was expecting the trial. I even thought they might

bring him up in some kind of like attacking way knowing that we were friends. But actually,

I sat down and the first thing that this person said to me, his name was Gilbert was, I'm so sorry

about your friend, Charlie. And I don't know why they cut that out of the final cut. But that

really softened everything. So as much as I want to say, well, it was just me. It was my kindness.

It was my charm. Really, that softened everything from the get-go. And that kind of set us up,

I think, to have a productive debate. That is something that people don't do. I've done so

many interviews with people on the other side of the table. And I come in with a perfectly

great attitude. But if they don't want to do, if they don't want to have a great attitude,

it's over. It's just over. It takes both sides to sit down and go, I actually want to talk to you.

You know what I mean? I want to learn something about you. I want to understand something about you

without an agenda. And that just doesn't happen. Do you think that happened because it was

the day before the memorial? I think that was part of it. And a way I felt that that was a

weakness because I was so tired and I was so sad and all of these things. But God really used

something really ugly and dark to bring glory to Himself and actually create a good debate.

And also to your point, I saw it as my goal to persuade the person across from me. I was not

thinking, how can I clip this? Can I get this point in or what is this person going to think?

It's too many things to think about. I thought, how can I persuade the person across from me?

I don't know if I accomplished that. But I think it's a better mentality than just thinking

about performing for the camera. I wonder how you would react because I believe the only way

to persuade somebody is to listen to them and care about them. And I think you're saying that

when you're like, how do I persuade this person? You were like, you matter. We're so much of the

dialogue and especially what you see online. You're just an object, you know, and I'm just

performing on you for that. Nothing happens. Nothing good happens from that.

Yeah. I'm sure that you've done a lot of interviews where the person interviewing you

is not looking at you. They're looking through you. They're thinking about their next question.

They're not listening to you at all. And I just, I can't do that. That's not because I'm a good

person. But I can't, I just, I can't think about something else while someone else is talking to

me. So I think just the art of listening and then responding to what someone actually said,

not just saying what you want to say, it's something that's lost, but really important.

So where, where are we? Let me do one more question kind of on the Charlie Kirk thing. I think that

when, when evil showed up and sickness, whatever, whatever shoots Charlie. Yeah.

He knew there would be an equal or opposite reaction. I think he was hoping for everybody to

cheer him on and say, you know, what a great thing that is. But what happened was not an

equal reaction. It was opposite, but it was not equal. And I, I really feel like God showed up.

You were at the funeral. I was at the funeral. I've never felt anything like that. God was there.

And you could, it was like a, it was like an ocean wave. People started talking about politics and

it would withdraw. And then they would talk about God again. And it would come rolling back in.

It was amazing to feel it. But then we went into this period immediately where the right is

tearing itself apart. And I don't want to make this about personalities or any of that.

But the right is tearing itself apart. And people are starting to believe things that I believe,

I believe in equal and opposite reaction. Yeah. I think Satan came and saw what God was doing

and Satan came in and was like, oh yeah, watch this. Yeah. I mean, it feel like we're watching

the big boys play right now. And we're just ponds on a table in a way. Yeah. Because the

evil that is happening and being, we're just being poisoned by lies, I think, right now.

Yeah. You know, what was said about Charlie's wife and just all of this stuff.

It's just so bad. And we're fighting things like, you know, Jews don't run the world.

We're fighting things that are so anti-Semitic that I don't even, I didn't think we had to fight

that anymore. I knew anti-Semitism existed, but there's a difference between disagreeing with Israel.

You can do that all day long. And what is being said to take the Jew out of Judeo-Christian heritage?

Does that make sense? Yeah. Have any thoughts on where we're at on this? What is happening to us?

How is this happening so rapidly? Yeah. I have a lot of thoughts. One, I did not appreciate while

Charlie was alive that he gate-kept the crazy, that he was kind of holding back these radical forces

on the right, some of the people that, you know, truly hate Jewish people, not just those who disagree

with Israel. So there's nothing wrong with that. We didn't disagree with these. No. And I don't

even talk about foreign policy that much. And if you say something like this, they'll call you some

kind of radicalsiness. I don't even really talk about that that much. I don't really care what

someone thinks about Israeli policy one way or the other. But it, so he was kind of holding

back some truly radical forces and gate-kept that and built a coalition that excluded some of those

toxic forces on the right. And he also kind of cooled the tensions between those who disagreed,

especially about Israel, like he would bring someone like Josh Hammer and then Dave Smith and

have them duke it out on stage. And that was kind of his piece through strength strategy to continue

to build this broad coalition that will vote Republican and have Liberty Mighty candidates in office.

But then when he went away, those fights that were kind of maybe happening behind doors that were

not happening in public for the sake of respect for Charlie are now happening. And some of the

debates that were going on that were moderated by the moderate of Charlie Kirk are no longer being

moderated. The moderator isn't there anymore. And so now they're truly duking it out in a personal

and ugly way. So that's part of what I see going on politically. Now some people are demoralized by

that. I understand people watching Ampthast and being like this feels, for the regular person,

they're like, this feels like drama that I'm not really a part of and that doesn't really care

about me. But I do just want to say that on the right, we're trying to build something and on the

left, they're trying to destroy something. If you're trying to destroy something, you do not have

to agree on what tools you use. You don't have to, you don't have to agree on the materials,

you don't have to agree on a foundation. You can take Islam, you can take Marxism, you can take

whatever it is, and you can just tear down the edifice of Western civilization. But if you're

trying to build something as we are on the right, if you're trying to preserve Western civilization,

you have to agree on the materials, the tools, winning how you use them, and most importantly,

on what the foundation is. And so there's nothing wrong with a healthy debate that I'm going to

disagree with as long as it is a balanced debate with, you know, Hannity and Combs always killed

me because I know Roger. I remember Hannity and Combs and I was little. And I know exactly why was it

that that that combs right? Look to the way Combs did. I mean, Roger is a very visual person.

Yeah. He did that for a reason. I want to come in with both sides having equal power, equal,

you know, intelligence, and really having a strong debate with no straw men. There's nothing

wrong with that. No. But it seems like some people think there is something wrong with that.

And on both sides, I don't even know which side. I mean, because both sides are like,

shut up, shut up, shut up, shut up. Yeah. We're not going to solve anything. I mean,

unless you're wrestling with these things, and we can't stand up and say, no, this is where you're

wrong. Yeah. This is where I think you're right or wrong. Yeah. I don't know if we make any

progress. And I think that's what Charlie was trying to do. Yes. And I think that's what we are

still trying to do. We're trying to define our terms, but we lost our moderator. We lost our

gatekeeper. We lost the coalition builder. So we're just trying to find politically our footing.

And for some reason, Israel has become the central question that we need to answer on the right

that has become like the defining feature and the dividing line on the right. And so we are

trying to figure that out. And we can talk more about that. But on the spiritual level, I mean,

there's a reason it's called spiritual warfare. Yes. I believe revival was and is still happening

in post-Charlie Kirk. But it's not like Satan was going to be like, draught. I didn't see that.

Yeah. I know. Like, oh, dang it. Like, he, of course, was going to say, whoa, we don't want

unity among Christians. We don't want unity on the side of what is good and right and true.

Like, we've, we've got to tear that down as much as we possibly can and get them focused on

the wrong things. And that's not to say that people asking legitimate questions of the federal

government or the state government when it comes to Charlie Kirk or demonic forces, I'm not saying

that. But those purposely drawing our eyes away from Christ, away from what is true, away from

revival and into true conspiracy and slander in a lot of the stuff that we're seeing.

I do think that that is the power of darkness, rearing its ugly head against revival.

Yeah. Equal and opposite reaction. Satan shows up. It's God's turn.

Yeah. I mean, I think we're going to see a response to this. You know, there's a difference

between revival and an awakening. Yeah. And lots of bad things happen during revivals.

Awakenings are when you apply those things. When you start to look at, oh, I just, I just found out

about this Jesus guy and I found out about this and this and this and wow, I want to change my life

and then you go, but I like some of these things, but I'm not going to do them anymore because

they're not good. And you start applying the hard lessons. Do we have the,

you know, I remember hearing, you know, we're a fast food, you know, culture. Oh my gosh, fast food

is slow now, you know, do we have the stamina to do the hard things? Do you think that's a part of

those under 35? You know, my, I think my bigger question is like, I was studying the difference

between revival and awakening too. And what are some characteristics of them? One of them

is a widespread desire to see Christ glorified rather than the self. And that is what I wonder.

Like in our performance based culture, in our, everything is content culture. Are we interested in

the mostly unseen and unsung self denial that is required of all Christians that isn't pretty,

that doesn't get likes, that is really about repentance and letting go of things like vanity and

pride. I say that as a person who creates content, like I think that is an honest question that

is not even just about instant gratification, but like are we willing to like go all in on the

gory nitty gritty Christianity of our ancestors, you know, of those that have gone before us,

because if it is warfare, like it's not always pretty and it's not always. So what are those things?

Well, repenting of your sin and denying the things that you want to do in exchange for what God calls

you to do is individual. I mean, sin is an individual. We know it's defined by God's word is missing

the mark of what he says is go to right and true. But the individual call on your life, it might

mean leaving the current job that you're in. It might mean deleting social media. It might mean

taking the less lucrative path because it's the one that God calls you on. It might mean being

courageous and losing friendships and losing opportunities and losing comfort because you said

the true thing and shared the gospel. Has there ever been something that you've been really felt,

like, okay, this came from God that you were like, man, I'm glad you asked. I really want to do that.

You know, I don't know. That's a good question. I think that I can't always see the

end result of what God is calling me to do. It's definitely met with the tentative, like,

are you sure? Right. Right. I mean, because I don't know if, I mean, God doesn't have to tell me,

you know what, you should go on vacation. I got one down. You know, you just sleep a little bit more.

Yeah. God has to tell me the things to do with your life that I'm like,

oh, I don't want to do that. I don't want to be that guy. I don't want to, and I like this part

of my life. God, when he comes in, and for me, this is the struggle, and this may just be me. This

is the struggle for me is he's always telling me the things, not all of them, but some of the things

that I like to do. He's saying, you really should do this. And that's always less lucrative. That's

always the harder road. That's always the thing that I'm like, but I'll get killed if I do that.

Right. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. And it always works out to be better, at least personally,

once you get through it, you're like, oh my gosh. I can't believe I ever wanted to be that.

This is so much better. Yeah. But it's, I don't see a big movement towards that. Yeah. I don't know.

You know, RC Sproul, I'm paraphrasing. He was a theologian, and he died in 2017, I believe, but

he said, Christ, to not die so that you could do the things you already wanted to do before you

became a Christian so that you could get all of the things that your heart already desired before

that you were a Christian. He gives you a new heart with new desires that is different and

better and deeper and more difficult than the things that you desired before. And I do think it

is repentance that is the difficult part of Christianity. Like I read that there is this only

fan star who recently became a Christian. I hope it's genuine and got baptized and all of that.

One thing that she said in an interview, I think it was to us weekly, she said, I'm just not

a traditional Christian. Like I'm still going to keep doing what I'm doing. And there are girls

in the industry who will keep doing this. And I believe in all of these kind of progressive things.

And maybe she just, she's beginner, sanctified, she needs to be discipled and all of that,

all of us have been wrong in our beliefs many times. But I think that is the part, that's the part

of Christianity that do I really have to take up my cross? Like do I really have to let go of

this stuff? But that's what makes it worth it. That's what makes it so glorious in the end.

Yeah. It sucks. At the beginning, you think, this is, I don't know why there's so many things that

you have to like shed of yourself. But once you do, it's so much better. It's like it is a new life.

It's a new entire life, a new way of looking at everything. And I've just never known

the least with me. God to be the one that's like, oh no, you're good. Yeah. You're good.

Come as you are. Yeah. You know, I got you. You just keep doing those things. Yeah.

He requires us to step to the plate. And I guess, you know, there's always this thing about faith.

I mean, you know, nobody gets saved by works. Completely agree. However, for me,

your product is how I know. How I know. God knows different things. I know. You know, if you're like,

I just got baptized. And I'm sleeping with another thousand men in the next. You're like, oh,

yeah. You know, your works, it's not because you're trying to earn them. It's you want to change.

You want to be better. And so you start producing different things. Yeah. Good works are a product

of our faith, not a prerequisite for our salvation. And Jesus said a tree is known by its fruit.

It's got bad fruits, bad tree. It's like not that complicated. Like, Jesus makes it really easy.

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So as somebody who has been judged, I mean, the horrible things are said about you. These are

funny. You're too Christian, but also a bad Christian. Rider and Salon said, you weaponize your

gender to sell the idea of a cold-hearted Jesus. Yeah, I don't even know what that means.

I don't need I don't need time break in that. Right. I just spend some time and I'm like,

I don't even think I understand that one. You know, how do you, how do you decipher

not judging others, but correcting? Yeah. You know what I mean? Because I think the best

Christians are the ones who are changing all the time in themselves and are constantly,

am I here? Am I there? Where am I? You know? Yeah.

And are loving to those who are in error? Yeah. But that doesn't mean embracing it. Yeah.

How do you, how do you navigate that? My mind immediately goes to the first two chapters of

Romans. The first chapter of Romans is kind of the famous or infamous depending on how you look at

it passage about homosexuality and gender confusion. Look, these people are depraved in mind and

heart. They know God's righteous decrees and they not only don't do them, but they approve

of those who are sending. And they have given themselves over to these unnatural desires and

unnatural relationships. And then in the next chapter, it's a chapter about judging. Do not judge.

If you judge others who are doing the same things that you're doing, then you're a hypocrite

and you will be judged. So obviously, God through Paul is saying in the first chapter, this is sin

and you shouldn't do it. It's bad for your body. It's bad for your soul. It's bad for your mind. It's

bad for your heart. Also, you shouldn't judge. So how do we reconcile that? It's obvious that you

can call out sin and you shouldn't judge. To me, what we see in Jesus' command against judging

and the Romans too, command against judging is that you shouldn't be a hypocrite. Is that you

shouldn't say, I shouldn't say, you know what, you really shouldn't have a podcast glend

because all you care about is, all you care about is fame. Well, that would be hypocritical because

I also have a podcast where I want to have an audience too. And I think that we have to be

really careful about calling out behavior attitudes or whatever that we ourselves are guilty for.

I think God hates hypocrisy, but I don't think that precludes us from saying, this is what

God calls sin. And of course, the thing that covers a multitude of sin is love and the gospel.

Yes, that's a sin. Yes, that's wrong. Yes, you shouldn't do it. But I have really good news for you.

I've been where you are. I was also dead in my sin. And Jesus' grace can totally save you like

it saved me. That to me is how you wed those two things. You make sure you're not being a judgmental

hypocrite. And you're also being really clear about sin.

There is, there are so many great things happening. And at the same time, I'm so afraid that we are

confused by our day, that there is just enough fog in the air that if you aren't, do not have the

constant companion of the Spirit with you, you can slip so quickly. There are the traditional

family, the traditional wife, the traditional marriage. I think all of that is so essential to

civilization, not just Western civilization, any civilization. But there are those who believe

exactly what I just said. And then we'll say, Ellie, you should be quiet because you're a woman.

How do you know where the react just to that first? Because there's people who've said,

you're trying to take man's job of preaching and women shouldn't be preaching and you should be

quiet and pregnant and in the background. So how do you react to that first as a woman? And then

I want to expand that to what is that? Well, this is an unpopular opinion among a lot of

conservative evangelicals, but I agree that women shouldn't preach. Like I don't think the women

should be pastors. I don't think they should be behind a pulpit preaching to a mixed crowd on

Sunday morning. That doesn't mean women can't teach. It doesn't mean that women can't talk.

Traditionally, women have like to talk. We talk a lot. We like to communicate.

You're a big, I mean, you're accused of taking a pastor's position because you're doing

these big events. Which of course, I'm not. I don't shepherd a flock and women are allowed

biblically to teach women. I would say that those who say that women can't teach at women's

conferences that they can't have a podcast, that they can't wait into the culture wars. They are

going beyond what Scripture says. That might be their opinion and they might be able to say, well,

I kind of see it implied in this. And I'm fine with that if they want to have that opinion.

But it's not what the Bible says. Now, I do think that women should prioritize the home,

should prioritize being wives and moms and discipling. But there is also an opportunity to

prioritize that and also follow the call that a woman has on her life, which may or may not be

having some sort of sphere of influence in which they are teaching other women. I don't want to

be a pastor. I think I'm capable physically of giving a sermon and to actually have given a

sermon, but capable and called her two different things. And I think the Bible is very clear

that that is the man's all. We're in the Bible to say that a woman can be called to.

Well, you could look at first Timothy. You could look at Titus too. There are various places where

a man's role as both the elder and the pastor is exclusive to that gender. That's something that

Charlie and I talked about a lot because in our kind of like charismatic circle sometimes that are

conservative evangelical, we get some pushback on that. I think women have a big role in the church

and can play even a teaching role in the church for women and children. But not the office of elder

and overseer and shepherd. I know we go to very different churches, but ours is the same. And

some people have a real problem. And you know, we even will and will separate men and women at times.

And I didn't understand that at first. And then in my wife and I would talk to me like, wait,

you got the same lesson taught to you by a woman and I got it taught by a man. But it was completely

different, but it was exactly the same message. You know, there's there's this

we're different. We're different. Yeah. And those differences go all the way back to creation. Some

people will say, well, you know, Paul said that a woman shouldn't be a pastor because of cultural

things at the time, but he really goes all the way back to creation. He goes back to innate

differences. And I'm thankful for that. Like I'm thankful that my husband is the leader of our

marriage and the leader of our family and that I have a pastor. It means that he is the final

decision maker. He is the protector of our family. And at the end of the day, even though, you know,

we consult each other on everything. And we talk about everything. And he values me and trusts me

and all of that. But at the end of the day, I trust him to make the decision for our family.

I trusted him to when he asked when he said, okay, we need to move to Texas. That was not me. I

didn't want to move to Texas. I wanted to stay in Georgia where we were living. I had this Bible

study of girls that I wanted to see graduate from college and he knew it was the right time to move.

And I said, okay, and there are about a million different things that have happened like that

over the years, where I've trusted his wisdom. And I'm glad that at the end of the day,

the ultimate spiritual formation of our family rests on his shoulders and not mine. That he's

the one that gives an account to God for that. And so really, like, it's a relief of responsibility,

not this burden that feminism says that it is. You said, I think it's feminism is incompatible

with Christianity. Yes, I'm sure I have said that at some point. Tell me what that means. Why?

Well, I don't think that we need feminism. I think we need Christianity. And I think Christianity

is what gives us this, what was seen as like a radical view of women, this radical respect of women,

in that, you know, we see, we hear these critics of the Bible say, well, the Bible is just compiled

by these misogynistic men. And that's why it says the wife should submit to her husband. But if that's

true, the writers of the gospels didn't have to include all of these beautiful moments that Jesus

had with women, the woman of the night washing his hair, or his feet with her hair, the bleeding

woman who touched him to be healed. We didn't have to honor Mary. We didn't have to hear about Mary

Magdalene. We didn't have to know about the woman at the well who was brought to repentance by Jesus

paying attention to her. But we did. And we hear about all of these women who played a part in the

genealogy of Jesus and bringing the message of the gospel. And even in that passage that I

referenced in Ephesians 5 where it says, wife, submit to your husbands. It also says,

husbands love your wife's chrysal of the church and gave himself up for her. Wow, that was different

at the time. When men, the patriarchs, were given all of the rights, women were basically treated

as property, and their Christianity comes in and says, no, no, she's also an image bear of God.

She also is a vessel of the gospel. You have to love her and cherish her to the point that you're

willing to die for her, just as Christ died for the church. That was radical. That changed how

the world saw women, Christianity changed how the world saw children, all vulnerable groups.

I think we need more of that. Feminism, well, it may have had some good intentions and some people

say it had some pragmatic reasons. It's given us abortion. It's given us hormonal birth control.

It's given us transgenderism. It's confused us about the difference between a man and a woman

biologically, but also socially. I think it's done more harm than good. It's killed our birth

rate too. Right. It's convinced women that they can work the same way as a man can, and we can.

Why? Because, well, we could get into some physiology, but physically, I don't think that we have

the same stamina, mentally and spiritually. I don't think that we have the same drive for protection

and provision. I don't think that means that women have to have their feet up all day.

I actually think that both men and women are called to work in a particular way, but it's different.

I want to be able to have a podcast where I can talk, and I come in for a few hours, two times a

week, and then I can be at home with my kids for the rest of the time. Well, my husband wants to

be out and travel and work and talk and, you know, wheel and deal in a good way and, you know,

accomplish the things that need to be accomplished. I don't want to go out there. I don't want to,

and people are going to think that this is controversial, and it's fine if women like to know about

finances and their families. I don't want to manage the finances for a family. I don't want to

deal with that. So, I'm just like, I'm thankful that I don't have to be in charge.

I will tell you that there are women who will listen to you and go, well, I don't mind

finances, or I don't, you know, I think most women, it's natural to be the nurturer. It is

completely natural. And there is something about guys, and we regret it. Believe me, I'm 61 now.

My kids are out of the house. Oh, so much that I thought was true. And thought was, no, this is what

I have, I regret. There is a difference in drive in men, but not all men. Yeah. Not all men.

So where does that shake out? Yeah. Well, I think that anytime we talk in generalities,

there's going to be an exception to that. But in general, I do think men have a drive to

protect and create and to build. And that doesn't mean that women have none of that.

So, what do you think of, what do you think of, I've thought for a while that we are seeing

in its twisted form, we're seeing the natural man and the natural woman happen in some ways

in the youth right now, in 20 and early 30s. Guys are pulling back and going, this something's wrong.

Something's wrong. And their protection, they sense trouble on the horizon. They may not even be

able to identify it or know what it is, but they're pulling back from society going, something's wrong

here. Yeah. Okay. Women are the nurturers. And in this twisted way, they are the first ones to

hold and care. And the left has made, you know, transgender guys stripping in front of your

first grader into something where you should have compassion for the transgender guy. And

somehow or another, that has been confused. But they are being nurturers. They are trying to

protect what they now perceive as the weakest, not their own children. It's bizarre. But the

women are in that nurture role right now, just twisted. And guys are in, are searching for that

protection role. Yeah. It's so true. It's misplaced mothering. All of us, when we're young,

I say all of us, most of us like to play with those and dress up our barbies. And to take care

of something, whether maybe it's a pet, maybe it was a chia pet, whatever it was. Maybe you had a

garden, but women are natural nurturers. I have three girls. I have a ton of nephews. When I see

them playing together for my girls, everything becomes a family. It could be three forks, it's mommy

daddy baby forks. But for my nephew, everything becomes, everything becomes a gun. And so it's now the

fork is a gun. And there's a lot of building and a lot of destroying and a lot of nurturing and

caretaking over here. Well, that doesn't go away just because feminism exists. That doesn't go

away because you chased your marketing job. And I'm not saying that's always bad. Maybe that's

what God has for you in your life. But those instincts don't just go away. But how are they going

to manifest themselves if we do not get married and have kids? And I think for a lot of women,

why a lot of women, especially single women are liberal, is because instead of kids, they have a cause.

And so that becomes or a cat or dog. It's pet, profession, politics has become their

child rather than a child themselves. And when you channel that natural mothering or nurturing

instinct into something that is not a child, whether it's your child or a child that you're

mentoring, then I think we think we see things be perverted. And we see them manifest the way that

they are now. And it creates, I think, a lot of bitterness and resentment.

Works with the idea that Satan doesn't destroy, per se, he perverts. He's not creating something

new. He's just taking what God had set up and just perverting it. You're saying the natural

mother is coming out. It's just all perverted and turned upside down. Yeah, he does both. He comes

to steal, kill, and destroy. But he often does that by twisting things just a little bit. Yeah.

Like in the Garden of Eden, did God really say, no, no, no, you will be like God, which was kind of

true. You will know the knowledge between good and evil, but you'll die unlike God. And what does he

do to Jesus when Jesus is in the wilderness? He's tired and thirsty. He uses the word of God

against Jesus. Don't you know that if you bow down and worship me, I can give you all of these

things. And Jesus, what does he do? He relies on the real word of God in context in its rightful

usage and say, no, no, no, you shall not put the Lord your God to the test. And so that's what

we are tasked to as well. When something sounds kind of true, we have to ask, but is it fully true?

And I think that's a good guidepost for our whole lives, actually. This Christianity survive in

the next, I mean, what do you, I mean, look at, look at Europe. I mean, it's interesting.

10 years ago, I would say there's not a chance for Europe to be Christian ever again, but there

is this resurgence that is going on. What do you see globally for this? You concern that,

are you concerned at all that there's such a lack of understanding of the scriptures and such a

lack of understanding of hard work or any of the principles that go along with this? Yeah.

That it can be perverted and used in a completely dangerous way? Yeah. I mean, I'm really concerned

about that. Now, I'm thankful that Jesus promises that the gates of hell will not prevail against

the church. That in the end, Satan doesn't win. That it is not possible. But it's always, I know he's

always, people always say that I know how it ends. Yeah, but look at all the chapters before that

really suck we got to get through that. I know how it ends, but wow. Yeah, but I also think about,

I think about all of the times through history that the Christians must have thought this is the

end. Like, when Nero was beheading Christians and then putting them on stakes and lining the

roads of Rome and lining them on fire, I can't imagine that the Christians at that time thought,

okay, we've got a good 2000 years ahead of us. This is going to be great. We're going to have a

Christian nation one day. They were like, this is it. We're done. I don't even have any family

members or church members anymore. When I think about Christians throughout history, all the times

of persecution, Christians alive today in places like China or Yemen or Afghanistan, who,

they're like, this has to be the end times, right? Like, this is the tribulation. When I think about

that and that Christianity has persisted in much harder times. Yeah, it's scary. I don't like the

Islamification of Europe. I don't like the waning influence of Christianity because it's bad for

people because it's just bad for babies. It's bad for families. It's bad for people. But, yes,

I do trust that he wins in the end. And I love Psalm 37. It starts, do not be envious of

wrongdoers. Don't be envious of wrongdoers because one day they will soon fade like the grass

and wither like the green herb. And I try to remember that first every day because, as you know,

it seems like the evil doer is winning day after day. He's not. It just feels like that at times.

Let me talk to you about, let me just start with the antichrist. Peter Teal has been going around

talking about the antichrist. Yes. I figured that one out. Have you?

What the antichrist is or what Peter Teal thinks about it. Yeah. Yeah, I've tried to understand,

but he is much smarter than I am. And he is in a whole occupy a whole different world than I do

of technology. So I think the argument is that opposition to artificial intelligence

and greater technology is a form of the antichrist. I think that is the argument.

What is your thought on that? You understand that probably much better than me.

Well, I don't think opposition is the antichrist. I think blindness will lead us to the antichrist

when it comes to AI. I think I think AI could be used as the tool of the antichrist.

What do you mean by that? It is all knowing, all seeing instant. You know, you read the book of

Revelation about, you know, you're not going to be able to move anywhere, go anywhere, you know,

currency, all of it. That is what that is a version of what that could be easily.

And, you know, there wouldn't be a Jew left in the world if Hitler would have had

that this technology that is just on the horizon. I think there are people that are building it

that, you know, Sam Altman calls it Sam God. His version of ASI is... What's ASI?

Okay, so there's AI, which we have, artificial intelligence. It's really good,

better than you at one thing, okay? Yeah. Grock, Gemini, and Chachypt, and Grock, that's

leaning towards what's called a GI, artificial general intelligence, which means you're a

general intelligence being. I am. You can do a lot of things, and you're really good at a lot of

things, okay? You're not the master of everything, but you're good at a lot of things. That's general

intelligence. Artificial general intelligence, we are now approaching that line to where it can paint,

it can write music, it can write poetry, it can tell you how to build a building, it can tell you,

you know, how to build a bomb. It's great that a bunch of stuff. Yeah.

Artificial super intelligence is the equivalent of every brain that has ever lived,

and currently living, combined. It is a server farm today, and today's, you know, servers,

the size of earth. It is so far beyond man's understanding, man cannot understand. It's

in thinking so fast, so far ahead of us, it appears to be godlike, because we cannot understand it.

That's real danger. AGI, we don't know how long it'll take to get from AGI to ASI. That could

be overnight, that could never happen. My guess is, it's closer to overnight.

And what is the danger? Like you said, if Hitler had that, ASI, then no,

if you had just, if Hitler had just the technology that we have today, with all of the surveillance and

AGI or AI, it would know where you are, it would know who you're connected to, who your friends are,

where you've been, it will know where you're being hidden, it will know because it will also

have access to everybody on your list of friends, your friend tree, you disappear, whose power

outage has gone up, our power usage has gone up, whose water usage has gone up by one person

in your friend tree. There you are, you know what I mean, and it can find it that fast. So

just the technology we have today, if Hitler had, it would be horrendous. If we go dark, we will

make the Germans look like rookies at everything they did. ASI is like an alien life form.

If they said today, hey, we just spotted a spaceship, you know, just on the other side of Uranus,

and it's coming in, it'll be a few months, let's build a welcoming committee. I would want to

build a welcoming committee, but I would also say, should we also not prepare in case they're hostile

because we don't know how they think, we don't know anything about them, and they're obviously

way above us. So should, let's be cautious. People like Sam Altman are not cautious. He wants the

God. Yeah. Because he thinks strangely, I think he thinks he can control it. Yeah. You're never

going to be able to control it. It's everything we would do is a baby gate. I've been in places where

they have lots of babies. Yeah. I step over the baby gate. Right. It stops the babies. We're the babies

in that scenario. It will step over anything that we have tried. Yeah. We just have to be very,

very careful. Yeah. It really is just like the Garden of Eden. When Satan say, you can be like

God, and even though I can just take a bite and that'll be it. Yes. It's never it. And it's always

the search for knowledge, which doesn't make the search for knowledge evil or wrong, it just

should come with a price tag. Be careful. When you are looking for knowledge, that's great. When

you are looking to be like God, do not purchase that. But what are the moral limits that someone

like Sam Altman has? Because technology can't tell us what's right. It can take us from what's

natural to what's possible. But only those of us who have moral limitations will say, but what's

moral and what's good. Really Silicon Valley is only asking what's possible. And can we do it?

Not should we do it. And those of us asking, should we do it? I don't feel like I have enough

power. I don't feel like Sam Altman's going to listen to me and say, okay, you can go that far,

but no, farther than that. So what does it look like to try to reign in those powers and to harness

them for good? So I talked to somebody who is at that level. I've never shared this before. But

somebody at that level said to me, I said, how do you how do you stop this? And he said, well,

the governments of the world, China wants control. America wants control. Okay. We want these things so

we can increase our power and protect ourselves and have control. The minute you go past AGI,

you lose control because you are not as smart as it. So even in AGI, you're starting to lose control.

But guarantee you are not in charge of ASI. So his belief and the belief of people in his

world believe that the governments themselves will say as we get a little closer, stop. Not allowed.

And I said, well, that doesn't solve Sam Altman. And he said,

you don't think China, Russia, whoever that really understands, we lose all power. You don't

think that Sam Altman's of the world would just disappear at night, that they wouldn't just be.

So that's what we're waiting on? No, that was his opinion. Yeah. Well, the only way to stop it is

for states to say, to recognize, which they haven't yet, to recognize how dangerous this is,

for them selfishly, for them and say, no. And they just start offing people that are saying,

I want ASI. Is that the only way to stop it? Because that's a terrifying prospect. It's terrifying.

Terrifying. But we are, we're entering this time. And that's why I think the principles that you

preach, the principles that you talk about, the principles that you teach and share are so

critically important. Because without the Western civilization understanding of life and the

importance of life were doomed. Without the lessons of just Adam and Eve. Do not pick the fruit

of that tree. You're not God. You know what I mean? You're not God. Maybe the most important

three words for anyone, but especially those in Silicon Valley to realize and to really understand

because that alone puts limitations on what you can do.

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the Nordstrom app. My father said to me before he died, he was 85 years old and he said, I

can't wait to see what your generation does. And I was like, what do you mean, Dad? And he said,

Glenn, how much progress has there been in technology and in science since Christ?

And I said, fire to the moonshot. And he said, right, how much spiritual growth has there been

since Christ to today? We're exactly the same people. Exactly the same people. Yeah, except we're

now playing with toys that are, have God-like powers. Right. Right now, it's frightening.

Where do you think we are in the, or are you, I believe Jesus is coming in my lifetime,

assuming I live long enough? I think people have thought that since, I mean, the apostles thought

that. So probably wrong. Odds are and probably wrong. But it is a way that a lot of this is

solved. These problems are so huge and there are so many things that you see of signs.

Where are you on that? Do you think? Yeah, I don't know. I don't know, which I know is not a

fun answer. No, I'm not saying I know either. No, I know that you're not. I know. No one really

knows. But there are many people like you who expect it. They look at different biblical prophecies

and they seem to be fulfilled and they think that it's going to happen in our lifetime.

I don't necessarily have that feeling. I hope. I do hope. I hope that Jesus comes back.

And I actually, I really, again, it gives me so much hope that yes, Jesus might be coming.

And then you go like, oh my gosh, but the road between now and Jesus is so hard. I kind of,

I wouldn't mind that not for my children, but maybe great, great grandchildren or something like

that. It depends on what you believe about the tribulation and when that's going to happen.

But it is hard to imagine it getting much crazier and more confusing and more backwards. But then

you see things like Charlie's memorial and you're like, oh, he's still up to something. Like,

he is seeking and saving the last just as much as he ever has been. And if you had told me

in the summer of 2020, when things were so bleak and I just did not believe things were going to

get better. I thought we were going to plummet deeper and deeper into the abyss because you had the

COVID craziness. You had the George Floyd riots and you had the election and all of that.

And if you would have told me, okay, but five years from now, you're going to be in a stadium

with however many people, 200,000 people praising the Lord together and some of those people are

going to go to church and read the Bible for the first time. I don't know that I would have

believed it. So I am now more hesitant to think when it feels really bleak that God has done.

It's so funny. I would express it in a different way. I stopped, I schooled myself all the time now

on stop wanting it your way. Stop thinking you know, you know, the, the, because I felt the same way

after the 2020 election. I'm like, we are doomed. We are doomed. In retrospect, if Trump hadn't

have lost that, we wouldn't be where we are now. We wouldn't have exposed what we've exposed.

We are, as we said today, the entire Western hemisphere and assuming it goes smoothly,

may be transformed, Iran may collapse, may, I mean, there are so many things that are happening

now that you're like, what, wait a minute. What? How is this coming out of this? And it wouldn't

have happened in 2020. Yeah. And I was absolutely convinced. And, you know, I've come to this place,

and I struggle with this a bit, a bit. Stop trying to

do calculating. You know, stop trying to go. We have to do this, because then they'll do this,

and then you do this, and just do what you're supposed to do. Just that, just that, because

it's never worked. I see people, including myself, try to get things to work out a certain way,

and it never works out in a good way. Yeah. You know, I've had Justin Haskins on your co-authors

several times. And whatever I'm done talking to him, I'm like, okay, that was really heavy. And

that was really big. I remember before that, before Trump was elected, he was talking about this

European law that was going to insert itself into basically all industry everywhere. And they

just really didn't want Trump to win. And then of course, Trump won and changed things. And

that was hopeful, but sometimes it just feels like it's all too much. Like, I can't do anything

about Sam Altman. I can't do anything about ASI. And I say this phrase, which is the first part is

not mine, but I just added to it, just do the next right thing, and faith with excellence

and for the glory of God. That's the only thing you can do. Now, sometimes that might be a big

moment of public triumph. But most of the time, it's changing a diaper joyfully. Most of the time,

it's just saying the true thing to the grocery store clerk. And most of the time, it's just reading

a book to your kids. And all of those moments matter in eternity. Everything done to the glory of God

in obedience to God does something good. And the rest is up to him. And if I don't rest in that,

then I get really anxious, really fast. Yeah, I know. I know. You know, it's funny, is these little

things? Look how much social media has changed us. And it's just millions of five second clips.

Yeah. Scrolling. Yeah. You know, we're not watching them for more than a minute. And yet that constant

scrolling of the mostly negative things. I see stuff, you know, on social media, and I'm trying to

get my social media trained a bit to show me the good stuff, the triumphs and all of that stuff.

And when you just change that, but it's nothing remarkable. It's nothing, nothing is like that's

game changing. Yeah. It's just all of these little things of people doing either good or bad.

Yeah. You know, positive or negative. And how we consume it every day.

Yep. That's absolutely true. I always say that God's eternal plan of redemption is going off

without a hitch. Always. Even when Charlie was assassinated, even when we lose an election,

even when crazy conspiracy theories are dominating the internet, God's eternal plan of redemption is

going off without a hitch. And when I have conversations with people not on the internet and real

life, and I talked to someone who two years ago was an atheist, had completely rejected God and says,

you know, I think I'm going to get baptized because I started reading my Bible and going to church.

I'm like, that's it. Because God's work doesn't always make headlines. And when it seems like he's

doing one thing, he's doing 10,000 things that we don't know about. And if I don't trust in that,

and I'm only looking at what Twitter shows me, I'm in a really bad place, which happens. Like,

I also have to scold myself and get myself off of X because I get like really sad about the

state of the world. And if I don't retreat from that, I found it to be almost bone crushing sad.

Yeah, you're not like, I'm not even getting angry anymore. I'm like, it's just sad. Oh my gosh.

How do you live your life like that, believing that, feeling that? Oh my gosh, so sad. I know. And just

injustice in the world. And so you can't allow your mood to be dictated by the highs and lows

of Twitter, though. I mean, that's just no way to live your life. People ask me all the time,

like, you know, people who follow me, how do you not get just like depressed and anxious and

stay in this dark place? You can't be on social media all the time. And the fact that I have a real

family and real community and a real church and real friends who talk about things and care about

things in addition to what happens on X, that is like really what grounds me. And I do, you know,

all of this for them, for those real people who are just confused about what's going on in the

world, you know, when you focus on that, it makes things a lot clearer and your purpose a lot

clear too. I think you have such a huge future in front of you. I just think you're and

I hate this word, but a true influencer. You're not, it's not a, you're genuine and bigger than

what influencer means. Thank you.

For archive purposes, talk to yourself 20 years from now on hope, who you hope you are.

Hmm. Who you, what you hope you haven't forgotten.

Hmm, I hope that my husband and I can look back and say we built that together and we had so much

fun and we took our family, our kids along for the ride every step of the way. I hope that in 20

years, all of my kids love and like each other. That is like really big goal in my life. I want

them to love and like us. Yes, but I want them to love and like each other. I want them to be

friends. I want them to be there for each other. I want them to have each other's back. That is

what I spent most of my time as a mom doing teaching them to love God and love each other. And so

I hope I can have like these adult children that I love to hang out with and that love to hang

out with each other. And I hope that I always remembered the most important thing is faithfulness to

God, not big contracts, not money, not opportunities, not, you know, clips that go viral or any of that.

But the steadfast adherence to whatever God's calling is public or private. At the end of 20

years, if I can say that by the grace of God, then I will feel fulfilled. I have a feeling you'd

be happy in 20 years. Thank you.

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