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Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence and is not intended for all audiences
Listener discretion is advised
Shit happened it shouldn't happen and anyway, um, I just wanted to be known that I didn't kill John
Welcome to season 13 episode 342 of Sword and Scale
Show that reveals that the worst monsters are real
Let's talk about something most people don't think about until it's too late
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In the early hours of May 18th, 2017, in Parma Heights, Ohio
A working class suburb 20 miles south of Cleveland
Which sounds like a lovely place I might add
Like the rest of the state
Pearl Road cuts through the town and a long stretch of strip plazas and small storefronts
Haresalons, nail studios, pizza shops
You know the kind of useless strip ball that inhabits pretty much every city in America
While those shops are usually owned by locals in these businesses
Open early close late and know their regulars by name
The strip is dark and small shops are locked up for the night
The early morning is calm except for one thing
A burglar is ready to do his thing
He grabs a landscaping stone, hauls it up and hurls it at the front door of classic hair studio
The glass explodes, the stone breaking apart in the chucks across the floor
He doesn't hesitate, he ducks inside head straight for the counter
And he yanks the entire cash register loose
The drawer jerks free
Cords snapping
And he's out in seconds
Inside the cash register, he finds almost $300 in cash
And the machine itself is probably worth a couple hundred more
Where's your emergency?
Hi, it's in Parma Heights, I'm not going to say it's an emergency
But I was driving to work and I noticed that the door on a beauty shop is totally smashed
On pro road
The address is 6412
It's called classic studio
And their front doors is totally smashed
I mean anybody can go inside at this point
Okay
And I noticed it and I turned around and went back thinking
Did I really see that and sure enough I did so
Okay, we thought I'd report it
A few doors down, he does it again
Another front door smashed this time at the nail studio
Instead of taking the whole register, he opens the drawer
This one has $50 inside
But it doesn't matter
Any amount of money is worth it
He's desperate
The glass crunches under his boots as he walks away
Leaving two shops and ruins behind him
And I'm the store manager here at Discount Truck Mark
Right next to us, there is a, it's $64.88
Your code
There's the spot in the old place right next to the drug mark here
You know, I'm in charge of
There's the glass is broken out on the front door here
At the nail and spa place
Right, I believe we just cleared there
Oh, okay, I'm sorry
I just, I didn't know if anyone was out or anything
$64.12, I believe the address is
Um, must have $64.88 on the door here
Okay, then that's a different one
Oh, okay
It's called spa in nails
By sunrise, both storefronts are cordoned off with yellow tape
Patrol officers sweep glass into piles while the owners pull up the surveillance video
A white male
Short with a bald spot and tattoos on his arms
The time stamp on the camera is wrong but they already know the crimes happened overnight
The owners are terrified and one vows to shut down the business
She wonders how this could happen in such a family friendly town
Parma Heights has one of the lowest crime rates in the nation
At least that's what the statistics say
Whoever the perpetrator is he probably should have worn a mask
His face is front and center on the surveillance camera
Not only that the outside cameras catch him speeding off in a white Jeep
It doesn't take long to bring in Thomas Nuff
For questioning
Okay, all right, get me to deal with Parma Heights is here to speak with you
No
Well, I had a couple breakings in my city at a spa nails and then another
Classic hair studios, you know anything about them
No
Nothing at all. All right. Why I got surveillance video of the vehicle and the person breaking into their business
Okay, so let me pull this stuff up here recognize that person
Looks like it could be me
All right, so let's do this
Recognize them tattoos
Ha
Yeah, do you remember doing this or no
Tom seem like your average guy next door
He just didn't have that typical criminal look about him
If they're even is such a thing
He looked more like a dad sitting on the bleachers of his son's football game
And Thomas didn't have a son
A good kid who unfortunately had to be raised by Tom's sister during the last 15 years
He was in prison for aggravated robbery
So looks can be deceiving
That's what they say anyway
You're running if you take the cash register from the one place is the cash from the second place, okay?
Um, and then you're in a white Jeep that looks like a blowing to your your son, but registered to your sister maybe okay this
Okay, but I'm more more recent photo of the
Of you this
What the hell happened to it
Yeah
Smash the window. Did you do that or
Yeah, okay, what happened. I mean
Just went off road
It was the truth branch. Did you mean to go off road? It was a kind of yeah, okay try to hurt yourself or what no just
Just uh
Went off with
Off road in a spot where we used to go off road. Okay, so we're just gonna go out there and like my heart what?
No, no
I mean, I appreciate you being honest
Tom tried to be a good dad
Well, maybe not
But he really did love his son
And old habits die hard
That included going on benders robbing businesses and off roading
This time it just happened to be that he had no vehicle. So
He took his son's Jeep
And damaged it how messed up for you during this time
I don't know sir. Okay, all right
By what there's you know what unfortunately you don't do to this and the video and stuff like I have you and then uh
How it got to you is we actually uh
The news kind of hold it because I put some on our Facebook page
And then your sister did actually want to call and said hey listen
That's my brother in my car you know me so kind of let us see you
But I had some previous things to let you look like you had a history of bronzewick
Bronzewick immediately called me says hey listen. I know that guy
You might you might want to give me call everything he did is what he used to do and uh thanks to deal with you a lot, huh?
So um what happened with you were you were in jail for a little bit you get out and what happened?
I just I don't know man. I just
Got out of them
Things weren't like it. I thought it was gonna be you know. I had nowhere to go. Okay. No family was helping here or what?
My mom passed you know like a lot had changed in the 15 years. He was on the inside
Y'all seen Shasha, right?
Think about how smartphones didn't even exist in 2002
Everybody was still using a flip phone
There was no social media at least not like today
Facebook launched in 2004 YouTube in 2005 and Twitter in 2006
Instagram came around in 2010 and uh, I won't even mention TikTok
In 2002 when he went into prison
People were still using aol instant messenger and my space wasn't even a thing yet
If you wanted to go somewhere you couldn't just tap on your phone and have directions show up or even read out to you
You had to
Print something out from a site called mapquest. I shit you not on your ink jet printer and hope that the directions
We're accurate
Kids nowadays can't even figure out what gender they are. Could you imagine if you took GPS away from them
If Tom repeated as little heist today, he'd be lucky to find one dollar in the cash register
People don't even use cash anymore
Just their clarina debit cards which they have no intention of ever paying back
Another big difference since 2002 is that we weren't all spying on each other
No one was lurking nearby to film you on their phone
Waiting to post it somewhere for the world to see
Security cameras existed, but we're reserved for big businesses
No wonder Tom didn't wear a mask
Not only was he too shit-faced to even think about a security camera
But he just wasn't expecting these tiny businesses to own one
In 2002 voicemail was still a thing and people actually checked it
Tom felt like he'd been swallowed up by time, but it wasn't just the tech that had left him behind
While he was on the inside his world fell apart
His mom died. She was the family anchor
There were some rough years between him and a stepdad, but
His mom was always there for the kids
Probably almost too much
My mom struggled for the last
That three or four years before she passed
Trying to keep the house afloat and still help my sister with bills and with her kids
And as soon as my mom dies
You know, I told my sister we'll here take my money
And
Paid a bank note off on look bar one money guessing keep the house
Over the corner husband they allowed it to go into such disrepair that she didn't want to talk with it
And so she let the bank have it and uh
Yeah, I told her I said you know, I feel like you you know, sit on their graves
You know, I mean you should have let him you should have let the bank have it four years ago
And instead of looking them out and roll the stress she then trying to
She was the only one that ever had a solid career and I'm working a steady work
You know, I mean with good money, so you know, she's paying like everybody's cell phone bill everybody's bill
Baby said a certain 80's since you and you since you got a good relationship or no
His sister took over the money and according to Tom, she
mismanaged it
She also failed to get the car Tom had wrecked from the impound because it was too much trouble
Tom was pissed because the car belonged to his son Tommy and still had some of his personal belongings in it
According to Tom his sister helped raise Tommy and had been a good influence, but
Ever since their mother passed she was all about herself
His sister of course had a different story
There was a time when they partied together as teens and acted more like friends than siblings, but
Then Tom got a girl pregnant when he was 19
And things changed
This sister had lost a baby boy and now she found herself stepping in to parent Tom's son
Tom continued to party and went to rehab at least once
It was like usually every time he went to rehab this stuff would come out missy gets everything
Well missy has a job missy went to school. I paid for it
He always I guess felt like
I got everything but in reality
My grandparents were draining their bank account for him
And our whole life revolved around
And then what was going on
But he always and he still will
And recently when my mom died he wrote Tommy letters the same old stuff like missy got this and
His sister missy remembered that their mother practically enabled him
I chose always our farm. No
And even if he stole from her could still come home
I don't remember backward. I think I told you when I found out when she died that she had all these
Check cashing was and stuff and I found all the
receipts
Commissary and adventure and to people like Latasha, McLeishan
And so my brothers grow out you know and agron and youngstown and you know wherever
And it was always well he needs
Hygiene products. It's like he doesn't need three hundred dollars
We've all experienced someone in the family like this, right
It always seems like the one who gets in trouble the most or as the least productive gets all the attention
Doesn't it? Yeah, fuck the productive one who pays his bills and
Minds his own business
Let's focus all of our baby bird attention on this idiot over here that can't get their shit together
Tom was about 25 when he went to prison and now he was 42
With no home to go back to no mommy to run to and a son who was almost an adult now
Ready to live his own life
He had a lot to figure out and even more to make up for
And yet
Here he was back at the police station
Since he got out he'd been looking for a place to stay, but his parole had restrictions
No guns no drugs on and on
His anxiety was increasing in the previous night's drunken binge was going to land him in jail
again
Things we're about to get worse. I don't see your son wanted to be bashful against you at all
You know, I mean, I think you just want to stay it around
You know, I mean, unfortunately like I said, I mean this mom was letting me stay there
And until I got a place and that didn't work out for a girl
and
Then she kind of wanted to start a relationship again and then when I didn't because I had a girlfriend
She kind of flipped on me. Okay, and then like I said my sister, you know, she and her just we said girlfriend a girl
We were looking for that was missing
Oh, I don't know. You don't remember anywhere. Do you know where she's at by any chance?
Just a old friend of mine. Okay, I've still never heard any contact if anything works you could be
I don't know she was like when I was writing her from jail. Okay
We lost contact was she stayed in touch with my mom. Okay, so when my mom died
She kind of come back in a picture than her mom died
Then she took off the taxi and came back and her and her friend actually picked me up from jail. Okay
But who was it who was her friend that came with you a whole small guy John John man
Yeah, in that clip they were talking about the mother of Tom's son
When he got out of prison. He was hoping to stay at her house, but
That didn't work out because she wanted to rekindle the relationship
And he had long since moved on with two different women
49-year-old Regina Capo Bianco was one of them
About 15 years earlier she had signed up for a prison penpal program
Where she met Tom
Yeah, she was one of those weirdos
They constantly rode each other and promised they would meet up once he was out
The problem for Tom at least was that he was looking for stability
And before he even got out he started to see that
She had issues. I wonder how he found out
Could it have been maybe the fact she was writing inmates
Maybe that was it their Tom
Maybe that was the whole problem
Anyway, Regina had been living at home with her mother
But at some point in their friendship her mother also tied leaving her without a home
Her life took a downward turn into alcoholism
This was the last thing Tom needed and besides
He had already started seeing someone else
These inmates can really pull some pus if you know what I mean
When Tom was released Regina was living with a partner
An older man named John Mann
This was a quid pro quo situation if you know what that means
A friends with benefits sort of relationship
Where she would help take care of him in his house and exchange for you know a place to stay
She was a house whore basically
Regina and John had generously offered to let Tom stay there too
Until he got on his feet
But Tom could already see the writing on the wall and
New this would be the worst environment possible for him
It was true that he accepted Regina and John's offer to pick him up from prison upon his release
But he told him he planned to find his own lodging
The last he'd heard of Regina
She was about to celebrate her 50th birthday
I'm one one what's the address of the emergency
So we have a neighbor across the street and they just got home
And there's a lady that's like on the ground and can't get up and they're like hovering over her
So in the front yard in the front yard. Yeah. She's an older lady in her 50s with dark go brown hair
Wait, you know, they're picking her up and carrying her into the room into her white female
Wife female
She can barely stand up so they're walking her and carrying her
Now it's one thing to get a little carried away or your 50th birthday
But when was the last time your neighbors called 911 on you
Because you were passed out in your yard
And I hope you weren't in your 50s
Tom remembered warning Regina to get up that day
But when she wasn't able to he and John literally had to drag her into the house
All right, if you get birthday she got trashed and was puking up her fake teeth and I'm like come on Regina
I'm like
And all lady and saw that and I told her to I'm like, please get up
You know, you're laying in your puke. I'm like it's a nice area. So I was gonna call the police
No sooner than I said the coming couple are there pops and yeah, so
And it looked crazy like you got a older guy and you got this guy
That's who's dragging this girl in the house. I mean, especially with after all that shit that happened in Cleveland
With them girls being born for all that years. You don't know
She's always been like that. She's a good heart good girl. Mm-hmm through writing like for as much as we wrote in prison
Regina may have had a good heart, but she was a wild card
Though he did stay at Regina and John's a couple of times since he got out
He mostly bounced around hotels with his current girlfriend
He was right to steer clear of Regina as much as possible
The last thing he needed was to get roped into another bad situation
But Tom the guy just trying to keep his head down and reconnect with his son
Was about to be pulled into something
A lot bigger than a stolen cash register and erect jeep
Something that would change his life
Forever
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All right, let's continue
It was late June 2017 in Parma Heights, Ohio
A Cleveland suburb with a reputation for safety
Not violent crime
In the last few weeks, police responded to a string of late-night burglaries
The suspect Thomas Nuff was quickly caught
He admitted to everything saying he was broke and desperate
Hotels were getting expensive
Thomas just been released from prison after serving 15 years
Since then he bounced between hotels, old girlfriends and temporary stays with people willing to help
Including a penpal named Regina Capobianco
She and her boyfriend even gave him a ride from prison
He stayed at her place a couple of nights, but mostly kept his distance
She had a good heart, but she was a little
Unpredictable
Then Regina stopped answering her phone
Her sister worried
I miss her every day
I miss sending her pictures of the girls of my grandkids and calling her
That was all taken from me and for if we can't do that anymore
I call Regina Reggie
Reggie had a contagious laugh
If you would ask anybody what they remember about Reggie, it will be her laugh
The police had been to her house already, but they didn't execute a full search
Neighbors had seen stickers on the door about a potential foreclosure and just assumed John was evicted
Now weeks had passed, they go back
And what they find inside is worse than anything anyone's imagined
What they walk into is a hoarder's nightmare
Trashbags boxes rotting food
The air is thick and sour
The kind of stench you think is garbage until you realize
It's not
Specialized agents are called in along with cadaver dogs
But even the dogs refuse to go inside
But the odor of decomposition is
Overwhelming
They stubbornly sit outside like
No way man, I ain't going in there
We ain't touching this
That's kind of what I imagine dogs sound like
You can get another head
Yo bro, we ain't going in there
That's all I'm saying dog
The search stops here
I think it's kind of cute
Imagine a doberman talking like that
Anyway
Fortunately agents
Come prepared with full protective masks and oxygen tanks
This is a full hazmat situation we got going on
They enter through the back door of the ranch home past the shattered window
Dead flies carpet the floor
The second bedroom is by far the worst
Fly swarm in the air
The stench pools in the room
maggots wriggle in a disgusting puddle at the foot of the bed
A puddle they trace to a mound of trash and blankets
When they start to move it
They see skin
Then bone
Then
What looks like a leg
Then a skull
The hallway carpet has been cut away and blood stains
Stretch from the kitchen into the living room
Where the carpet has also been removed
Under trash and clothing in the second bedroom
They find John Mann's body
A mire of decomposed rotting flesh
Unrecognizable
And behind him
Up against the wall they find a second figure wrapped in a wet Harley Davidson blanket
The blanket is form fitting
They can see the outline of Regina's head before it's even pulled back
She's face up
Sweater rolled up above her eyes
One foot exposed and the rest of her body hidden beneath layers of filth
A purple condom wrapper is found near her head
At first Tom wasn't the obvious suspect
Even though he had a criminal background
His crimes didn't involve violence against anyone
And he had a son he desperately wanted to reconnect with
Why would he risk throwing that all away
He already messed up by getting stupid drunken breaking into the salons
Stupid and sloppy but
Not murder
But because he was one of the only people who had a connection with both Regina and John
They started to dig
Where else had Tom been staying since he got out
Who else was helping him
And that's what his current girlfriend came up
Alicia Stoner
She wasn't just his girlfriend
She was a social worker at the prison
Imagine that
Information today most of it
Alicia was working at the same prison that Tom was serving time in
Tom was attractive to her for some reason
Probably for the same reason why some women
Write to inmates
Some particular crazy bitches take that extra step and get a job at the prison
It's one hell of a world we're living it
I'll tell you
Maybe it was the bad boy prisoner thing maybe it was his
Charming gift of gab who knows who cares
Whatever the case he was writing to multiple women including Regina and they were all
Falling for it
With Alicia
He had the added pleasure of interacting personally
That is until she quit due to an obvious conflict of interest
She chose Tom over her job
And they continued the relationship
Imagine choosing a criminal over your job
These two lovebirds wrote poems to each other
Long handwritten love letters
They were soul mates
When adictives interview to Alicia for the first time
She didn't want to say much
But after she realized that she could be implicated
And ultimately serve time
That's when she started to talk
I just want to clarify some things that I wasn't direct with
Okay, okay
But maybe this dream of minimizing some of this so that it's
Oh I did
It was her issue
I avoided I minimized I rationalized
I did all the defense mechanism I know
It just comes down to telling us the truth
On paper Alicia didn't look like the kind of woman who'd ever
Be connected to a double homicide
She was a mental health worker
And she was married
But somehow she was charmed by this asshole
After his release in April 2017
Alicia became more than just his girlfriend
She was his driver
His banker and his safety net
When parole rules barged Tom from living with her
She paid for his motel rooms
When he needed money she wired it
And when he called her in the middle of the night
She came
On May 12th 2017 Alicia drove to pick him up
After he made a desperate phone call
She remembered his left index finger was badly cut
A fresh wound he couldn't easily explain
When we discuss about initially me getting the phone call from Thomas
And he called me and he did say to me
Just by every meet you with health
And I know he gave me
This is where I'm going to tell you just
Okay, I know he gave me directions
At some point
And here's what I see when I'm driving
And I'm crossing over me under
I'm on the phone with him
And he tells me Regina and John are dead
Okay, that helps far some
memory of the conversation
Then help him telling you when you got there
Was there anything more than
There's more
Okay
So it's accurate with him with the hood coming out
And he gets in my car where I tell you
And we park where I tell you
And
Just let me say this
The story I was supposed to tell
Was that he got into a bar fight for the finger
Because he says to me all you all you know is that I got into a bar fight for the finger
Okay, so that's what I want to do
Tom's version started with his relationship with John
He felt sorry for John because Regina was taking advantage of him
What started as a partnership had turned into a one-way street that ended with Regina being the only happy partner
She came and went as she pleased
She took John's money and dead little in exchange
She even started seeing other guys and bringing them back to the house
So
When I met John, you know
He might've been dirtbagging a lot of things but
I just took him as an old hippie nice guy
He was gonna get kicked out of the house soon
But he needed some of the motorgrass and
First of all, you know, I want everybody to know that you know
I've never had any such relationships with Regina
We met in
2005 as pen pals and for about a year and a half we kind of were writing a lot and had
Ideas of getting out me and together
Of course, then I felt a lot different than I do now about what I wanted in life and a woman and
She's always been super wild told me a lot of crazy stories. I never
Realized of course. She's probably progressed and got worse. You know what I mean?
So I never realized you know
Like until her 50th birthday
How she was drinking if he wasn't convinced at her 50th birthday party that she was an out of control
Party or
An incident that happened at a gas station
Confirmed it
She'd been drinking
He says she came out of the restroom with toilet paper hanging out of her pants
When he politely brought it to her attention. She says watch this
And she pulls it out and plasters it on the chest of a little old lady who's walking to pie
gross
So
We didn't talk for a while, you know a few weeks and I ended up on
When I needed a place to stay and I knew that you know, they were still entertaining that idea when I was in jail
So I called her up and she said well, you know, she was mad at me, but I said hey, you know, what are you mad for?
You know, I mean the way you were at then and I can't have that
Well, so I've met John a few times and he had confided in me
That he kind of wanted her out
But she told them like why get mailed here. So you got to pick me
And then he was kind of like well, I've known her for a while. I kind of love her
But at the same time he's like, you know, she don't suck my dip no more. She don't do this
And for her, you know, she I'd seen her drunk like, you know, you can't get it hard right real nasty
You know, it means I'm like I feel bad for him, you know
He felt bad for John. So he started coaching him on how he could get rid of Regina by a victinger
It would be a bonus that he'd get to live there with John
In effect, he planned a replace Regina
Tom said he didn't have much, but he would help him in any way he could
Just not sexually
John wasn't getting that anyway
I ended up, you know, taking some of my stuff there because
You know, she didn't know at the time, but John was gonna try to so after the 15th birthday, he took some stuff there
Mm-hmm. Okay. Sorry
So I took my blue bed and they had my clothes in it. Okay, and I had it like a duffel bag
They had like my little homemade tattoo sheet and it moved brown tan back
And you know, I wasn't like move trying to like
Move in or nothing yet. So I didn't know what the status was gonna be as far as John getting her out of the house
I kind of was like I'm not gonna
Light you I said, you know, I can get you good bud
I'll keep you smoking. I'll give you 50 bucks a week, but I can't live here with her
And another reason why I really blame myself is just for entertaining the idea and telling him that about the stuff about being elderly and being able to
Victor that that's why I guess why she bugged the fuck out, you know what I mean? And
You know, I hear them outside yelling and arguing and the dogs are barking and the little you know, they're loud
And I'm like I could hear it outside
So the day this all went down John had confronted Regina
She laughed it off and said she was gonna go out and meet a guy at a bar
And they might come back to the house
While she was out John had fallen asleep. So she texted Tom asking him to put the dogs away because
She was bringing this guy back
Tom didn't want to be around for that. So he says he left
Well, I just chose to leave, you know, I took a walk in the neighborhood
We decided to want to be there listening to him as sets whatever was going on
well
I had come home and whoever the guy she had there was gone in her job and we're partying
and she's
drunk
I mean probably didn't take her much to get drunk anyway. She's such a little person, you know, I mean
And they're fighting and I'm outside in the backyard dogs are going crazy. I'm surprised nobody called it police, you know
And something just changed in the tone
And I come in, you know, I mean, I died. I didn't come in. I really thought I didn't want to interrupt
No, I didn't know what was said and I came in and Regina was attacking him with a knife
And I stopped her um, I actually got pictures
It took me it believe me as little she is she was pretty strong, you know, I mean hand
I had a little mark here where I had a little comic night out bunch of cuts on my hands trying to pull the blade from
And that's actually how I ended up cutting my finger so bad
This is when the lies started
Every person he saw got a different explanation for why he got this cut on his finger
From his own son to his ex at the house with his son
To his girlfriend Alicia
And finally to the police who interviewed him the night of the burglaries
By that point his finger was barely hanging on after he tried to superglue it
Gross
But he knew it was bad because it was turning green and starting to smell funny
You know what I mean? I know
Shit happened. It shouldn't happen and anyway um
I just want to be known that I didn't kill John
The one part of the story that always stayed consistent was that he didn't kill John
He freely admitted he killed Regina
Just like he freely admitted several weeks later that he robbed the salons
But he was adamant
He didn't kill John
And none of this shit was planned or premeditated or anything, but
I ended up ripping the knife from Regina and I threw a pint of chair and she took off and I went night check John
And he was still making sounds and on the floor
And
She ends up coming back with another knife and I don't know the regular steak knife
Whatever from the kitchen and that's when she ended up, you know, stabbing at me and cut my finger real bad
Again, I'm tussling with her and uh
I get it to the ground and I'm trying to hold her down and you know, or other and she's clawing at my face and my eyes
And I've had no given knife and using time, you know what I mean and I don't
I'm having nightmares about it. You know, I mean so much the fucking live with you know and
I wish I would have ran out of the house, you know, I mean because I got livid if she was a friend, you know, I mean and
I mean, I'd be stupid to even tell my pro officer I'm about to stay here at this house
Tom maintained he never met for any of this to happen
He just wanted to get out of prison and start over be a good dad
continue his relationship with Alicia
Except she was still married
And get back to what he loved to do
tattoos of course
But he also loved drinking and talking
Those two traits somehow led to him committing crimes and
Then involved the very people he loved most in the aftermath of those crimes
Even his young son
Tom's son thought he was helping his father
But every time
Tom took more
The next morning, Tommy's phone is jeep
And even his trust
were gone
When he did move there, he cut his finger open
And he said it was from the hedgehog with my mom and my ampoule said it was too clean of a cut to be not a hedgehog
But like hedge clippers and my mom and my ampoule said it was too clean of a cut
They think it was from a knife or glass or something. What do you think?
I'd like to believe him, but I don't know. I haven't seen a cut like that before. It was cut pretty bad
Yeah, it was like hanging off and stuff
Yeah, he said he was going to try to glue it back together
But when he was in the hospital, they just took it off for him
Tommy Jr would later learn the truth
If he didn't already suspect it
The story was shady
So was his story about why he needed Tommy to buy him duct tape and garbage bags for the finger
Poor Tommy
Since his dad got out of prison, he was
Invading all aspects of his life
And Tommy let him because he loved him
Yeah, since he's been out my it's my life's been so stressful
Like I've been afraid at my house
Why do I need you afraid?
I don't know if like he got dropped off by someone and he owes them money
And they're gonna like come inside or something. I don't know
Okay, I just don't know like I thought I knew him a little bit, but I guess I didn't
Okay
Tommy had a right to be afraid
His dad was a criminal
murderer
The only thing the police didn't know
Was exactly why he murdered
We think you know more time
Someone's telling us that in that conversation things were brought up about what your dad did that were pretty serious
And if he told you what he did then we need to know time
He did tell me he heard two people
Didn't say he would kill anybody he said he heard him now tell us what he told you
He said that he heard him and
He said he cut his finger on the hedge clippers and that he was trying to find him back
and
I was dead he told me that
He took Regina
They got her a hotel and then two black people came and we're beating them up and that he was trying to defend themselves
Say that again when was this didn't give you any time frame on one this happened you said it happened late at night
Late at night, they're sitting he was in the he said he was in the basement cleaning
And uh, he heard John yelling and he went upstairs and he started like
Trying to fight him with him and then they left and that's what a black males. He said to black man
He didn't he didn't use those words to use the bit like
The racist chance for them. Okay, and then he was fighting with these black males
You said that's how he had a scratch on his head. He said that's how he got a scratch on his head was from them
This was just one more version of Tom's lies
And when he couldn't cover his tracks with his lies, he simply told Tommy not to look
Like the time he asked Tommy to pick him up at John man's house
This time it was to get rid of the dogs inside
Went back to the house. He went and grabbed the dogs. I didn't see the dogs
He told me not to look and we drove out there
He had me pull around the side of the street and he shoest them out
Yeah, he just told me they were John's dogs and that he didn't want him anymore
That John was gonna hurt. I really
Kill him and get rid of him
So he was gonna give him a chance at life and just let him go
The detectives didn't want to have to press Tommy
They knew he was a good kid
In fact one officer had also been Tommy's rugby coach and had nothing but great things to say about him
Somebody did something right, but it sure wasn't his dad
And the last thing I want to see is is anything and this isn't trying not trying to pit you against your dad
But you're in this position sadly he put you in this position
He did and it's sad and we feel for you. You know I do you know what I think of you
And it's wrong
But I just want the truth 100% and you walk out of here and you know you're conscious is clear
If I tell you guys now tell us now and you're not in any trouble. He said he killed him
Kilvigina job just Regina
He said he was in the basement cleaning and he heard John upstairs screaming saw Regina stabbing him
Tried to get in the knife away from him and then he said he took the knife and stabbed her
Tommy's story matched the version his father gave police
That Regina had attacked John
That Tom wrestled the knife away and stabbed her
There were no other people at the house that day
Black white or otherwise
If they could just get Tom to admit to killing both Regina and John
It was their gut feeling and the coroner's reports backed it up
John man's body was pierced with multiple sharp force injuries including
To the neck ribs collarbone and defensive wounds on his hands and arms
Regina stood under five feet tall and didn't way much
Besides Tom's version was that he intervened after only one or two stavings
Then there was the elaborate cover-up including commissioning a guy named
Delugo to burn the house down after he'd removed the dogs and the carpeting
He used Alicia for contact because he was already in jail
Delugo said no, he wouldn't do it
And the defensive wounds on Tom indicated a serious altercation where Tom lost control of the blade
Not to mention the lies
The overwhelming number of lies
So detectives had one more card to play with Tom
the polygraph
And when the subject turned to John man
Tom's story started to crack
So
It was May of 2017 and a suburb of good
old Cleveland, Ohio, the home of the Browse, and a whole lot of killers, and even worse,
Ohioans. Thomas Knuff had been out of prison for just a few weeks. He was drifting between
motels, borrowing from his sons, and leaning on his girlfriend, Alicia Stoner, who drove him,
gave him money, and even picked him up. The morning after he killed at least one person inside the
house, Unnelwood Road. So yeah, you know, Tom was just living his best life. John Mann lived in
that house with his partner Regina Capobianco. By then, Regina had long since given up her part
of the bargain for living there, and was dating other men. She had also been writing to Tom while
he was in prison. In fact, it was Regina and John who picked him up on the day he was released.
Regina may have expected to carry on a relationship with Tom, but he already had Alicia,
and he also realized that Regina's drinking and other bizarre behaviors could land him right
back in prison on a parole violation. John was fed up with her too. He wanted her gone,
and Tom was all too happy to help. If Regina were out of the picture, it meant Tom could move in
and finally have a stable place to reconnect with his son and have a girlfriend. On the night of
May 11, 2017, something violent happened inside that house. John and Regina were both killed.
Their bodies hid in the way. Police wouldn't discover their decomposed remains until June.
In the meantime, Tom was getting rid of evidence and roping his loved ones into helping him cover
his tracks.
He actually ended up doing were two vastly different things. By May 17, his life was spiraling.
He was walking around with a finger that was barely hanging on, and his freedom was also
barely hanging on. In the weeks that followed, Tom didn't lie low. He went right back to his old
ways. He broke into two salons, leaving a trail that would put him back on police radar.
At the same time, he told everyone a different story. He told his son, he told Alicia, he told the police,
a story about a drug dealer, a fight. Regina stabbing John and Tom stabbing Regina in self-defense.
But there was one part he never changed. He swore he didn't kill John Man.
You know how you've heard that polygraphs are unreliable?
Well, police departments across the country insist they yield a success rate of 86 to 100%.
And Brunswick police were counting on its reliability.
The people we found in the house.
Okay. I told him the black people, and then when I ended up telling him the truth
after the truck incident, I told him what it was, and I told him I was just embarrassed,
because I had killed a girl, and that's when I told him the truth of the matter.
No, I want to bring this thing back up in this machine, okay? It says you're being
your failed. I'd say a day you'd stick up, all right? So I want to talk about some similarities
in some stuff in the injuries of those. We'll talk about that later.
Right.
Um, let me talk about that.
This is going to be exactly what I was told.
Okay. All right? Yep.
Okay. Regina stabbing in the back. Two stab wounds to the right side of the neck.
Crushed Adam's apple. Right carotid artery was cut.
Her left hand, your index finger, the webbing was cut.
Caused it down through two defensive limbs.
I know. I caused a sharp force injury in the Crushed Adam's apple, neck compression,
strangulation.
All of these injuries included or were in addition to the stabbings,
and the polygraph had confirmation.
Didn't you mention that, uh, you know, you know, several times that John was over there making
her going was like getting stuff like that. Okay. This machine says that you had stabbed John.
Yeah. Okay. Let me ask you something. John hit one stab on right here. Did you
help him stop everything by doing that? Is it the one? Did you do one stab on in the
John to help him out to put him on a measure? If you did, it's, you put him on a stab.
Detectives kept giving Tom an out. They told him maybe it was an accident, an act of mercy,
self-defense, and maybe things got out of control.
Any of those versions could have given him a softer landing, even a shot at claiming self-defense.
But Tom wouldn't take it. He stuck to his one line over and over.
I didn't kill John. You've got to help yourself out of this. You've got to tell us
what the hell happened in that house? You know, he, he brings up a good point. I'm going to let you
explain and have to do about it. We think something happened in the argument. I'm going to let him
go ahead with that. You know, brings up a good point as we talked.
You don't like when they get beat up to you? Yeah. Tell me a little bit about your, your, your
stepfather. Right? Right? Your mom? Yeah. Be used to relationship? Yeah. Something about
that happened quite frequently? Well, when we were younger, you know. Where's your feelings on that?
I just loved my mom and I hated him at the time. You know, even though there were times where he
was a good guy and I liked him, you know, for certain things. He would drink and use drugs and
you know, he took all his aggression on her and you know, she's just such always a good person
and being a kid, you know, I really heard, you know, and to see her go back to him, you know.
I don't think you feel it hurt me, you know, to make you angry. Well, sure. I mean, who wouldn't be
angry? You know, I was angry that, you know, she put up with it, but I mean, obviously she felt that,
you know, she loved them and worked through it, you know, and it separated for like a year and
we got back together and what do you think should happen to somebody that beats their, their wife
or their girlfriend? I mean, I don't feel like they should, you know, I mean, I could understand why
some women do that, you know, because they feel like there's no other way out. Did you trip? Yeah,
you know, I feel like, you know, women even deserve that to when a man does that, you know what I mean?
They should be able to. So, so what was John doing in Virginia? What was John doing in Virginia? He
wanted her out. What really happened? He wanted her out. He wanted her out. Was he here in there?
I don't know. Was he here in Birmingham? I don't know. Did you see him? I've never seen him,
but did she tell you he was here? No, she told me many stories about
punching on the boyfriend, you know what I mean? She never said John heard her, you know, she
said he was dirty and never changed his clothes and I think you know that he heard. I think she
could fight any of you. And you're trying to protect her. And then she'd get angry with you for
old as going on with your job. Is that what happened? Listen man, I get it. This was their best hypothesis.
It was the only time they'd seen Tom get this emotional, other than when he was talking about a
son. They had tapped into his past to find a trigger. John was abusing Regina.
And Tom was going to stop him. But Regina was used to the chaos and abuse, so she tried to stop Tom.
You're going to give a press conference Monday morning before your rainman or telling everybody
you're here, you're being a rain. The news is going to be there. How's it going to be?
I mean, did you sit in this chair with us? Did you talk to the tankers and you tell us everything
that happened 100% to the team, which right now I don't believe. And your son is going to watch
his news conference. You know what I mean? Your son is going to watch his news conference.
Pretty soon, he may be watching it with you somewhere else because the trouble he's in.
And the list shit as well. They're both in trouble right now with this. Too much is going on
because you put them in this position. The only way for you to help them and not paint yourself
as a monster. I mean, come on. I know that you love your kid and your kid does love you.
Okay, he does. But he's going to get to live with this cloud of the media painted my father
as a monster. People know that you're his father. Would you rather just have them
him be known as it might might might might have been a mistake. He confessed up to it. He did
he did. He did. He did. He did. He did. He did. He did. Who he is. I still talk to my dad and
jail. Do you want that? Or do you want everybody going? Look, your kids are monster.
If Tom had accepted their version of what happened, what do you have gotten away with it?
I mean, there was no way he wasn't going back to prison. He robbed two salons and killed a woman.
These were indisputable facts. But was it chivalry gone way wrong? Or was it a premeditated attempt
to secure a place of his own? It's possible no one will ever know, but the jury would seal his fate.
No matter what, Tom would probably spend the rest of his life in jail. But Ohio also has the
death penalty, which is a good thing, but they should use it a lot more. The relationship Tom
wanted with his son was never going to happen, at least not outside of prison walls.
Thomas E. Nuff Jr. was convicted of two counts of aggravated murder for killing John Man and Regina
Capobiaco. Along with multiple other charges, aggravated burglary, gross abuse of a corpse,
kidnapping, conspiracy, tampering with evidence, and theft related offenses.
There was, of course, a jury recommendation that the sentence of death be imposed.
The court finds, by proof, beyond a reasonable doubt, that the aggravating circumstances the
offender was found guilty of committing outweigh the mitigating factors. Therefore, on count two,
the sentence of death will be imposed upon the offender.
This meant Tom's son lost a father.
Because of Tom's actions, he would never get the chance to go to one of his kids' games
and walk him out onto the field. But his son wasn't the only one who suffered.
Two lives were lost. Regina may have been a bit of a wild card, but she mattered to her family,
to her friends. She was a person. And no matter what her life choices,
she didn't deserve what happened to her.
This monster took my sister from me.
My heart is broken. I don't know if I will ever repair.
I miss her every day. She would not get to see her sons get married. She would not get
call grandma. And it is all because of trying to help somebody that I told her that I thought
she should stay away from. I have horrible visions that I hope someday will get out of my head
of the murder. And no one should ever have to have these visions of a family member.
I am glad he has the death penalty. I think he deserves the death penalty.
He's had a chance to plead for his life. And I'm sure my sister pleaded for her life
that he chose to ignore.
John, man, son and sister both gave incredible heartfelt statements. And
John's son spoke for more than 10 minutes.
My dad was a goofy, bright and sensitive man. He loved the Cleveland Browns,
watching mash reruns and doing community theater. He had a full scholarship offer from
Heidelberg University of Astrophysics. He ended up floating into electrical contracting
for his interest in solar power. He loved the idea of cheap renewable energy.
He even studied to be an architect because he thought it would help him develop solar power
cells. Later in life, he became a computer programmer. He truly had a gifted mind and could do just
about whatever he wanted to with properly motivated. People tended to like my dad.
He had a gregarious and colorful personality with an oddball sense of humor.
You took my dad from me. You robbed him of the golden years of his life and the time we had
together. I miss him terribly. He proceeded to lay out how Tom had failed as a man, as a human being,
and as a father. He sympathized with Tom's son and thanked him for his bravery and enduring the
trial and doing the right thing by testifying against his own father, whom he loved. But then
he surprised everyone. You do not deserve to live. You do not deserve a human death. You butcher
two people for reasons I cannot begin to comprehend. I have wanted you to die, yet I am faced with a
reality that it will not and cannot be enough. In order to heal, I must accept this and find a way
to reconcile it against my own feelings. I will continue to beg for his life to be spared,
however, or possible. I want you all to hear it from a man that wanted him dead. As a son
to a man whose life was I did. His father, I will beg to anyone who will listen to spare his life.
I don't think we should do it for me or him. I think we should do it because it's the right thing
to do for our society. Of course, Tom is appealing and the legal fight will go on for years.
But what lingers isn't just the courtroom drama and appeals. It's the contradiction. Tom wanted
to be a good father. He wanted to prove he could do right by his son. He stayed in touch,
leaned on him, even dreamed of settling down in a house where they could reconnect.
But instead, he fell back into every pattern he swore he'd left behind.
The lies, the violence, the selfishness that burned through everything in his path.
And maybe the hardest part to make sense of is the question of whether Tom could have been
telling the truth about John Mann. Maybe John was abusing Regina, like the detectives had suggested.
And it triggered a traumatic reaction from Tom. Or maybe what happened is exactly as Tom
described. John tried to evict Regina and she went at him, so Tom intervened. Even if parts
of his story are true and noble, all of his following actions say the most. Tom's choices after
that night spoke the loudest. He hid the bodies, tried to hire someone to burn the place down,
dumped the dogs in the someone else's neighborhood, manipulated and lied to those he loved,
dragged them into something horrible, and most importantly, never called police.
Whatever happened in that house might have started with good intentions.
But what followed were really, really, really bad choices and only a complete fucking idiot
would make. Then again, this is Ohio. At the end of the day, we all have to be accountable for
our choices. We all have to be responsible for what we decide to do. Otherwise, what the fuck are
we doing here? Today, Tom's enough son is grown. He's built a life that has nothing to do with
parma heights or with the crimes his father committed there. He's well-adjusted, stable,
and in 2023 he got married. Whatever cycle Tom was trapped in, his son has escaped it. Good for him.
And maybe that's the real ending here. Not the death sentence, not the deaths,
not the appeals, but the fact that even if something so violent and tragic,
like a phoenix rising from the ashes, a different kind of life is actually possible.
That's going to do it for another one. Thanks for joining us. If you'd like to show head
on over to swordenscale.com, get the app, get plus. We'll see you next week's day, say.



