Interview with Jeremy Lach, President of Empire Marketing Partners-From Annuity Producer to Recognized Retirement Expert

Welcome to Influential Entrepreneurs, bringing you interviews with elite business leaders and experts,

sharing tips and strategies for elevating your business to the next level.

Here's your host, Mike Saunders.

Hello and welcome to this episode of Influential Entrepreneurs.

This is Mike Saunders, the authority-positioning coach.

Today we have back with this Jeremy Latch who's the president of Empire Marketing Partners

and we'll be talking about how annuity producers can go from a record to a recognized

retirement expert. Jeremy, welcome back to the program.

Always great to be here, Mike.

You know, it's interesting that I think that a lot of times you think about like an actor or an

actress that gets typecast. Oh, they're just the love, you know, the romcom or they're just an

action. And then one day you see them like breaking out into something opposite and it's probably

because their agent was saying, you know, we don't want you to be only thought about as this.

Well, I'm sure in your in the industry, you have seen producers, financial professionals that

just produce and sell and provide annuities. But then when they start talking to their clients

about more detailed, holistic, hey, we need to talk about a holistic retirement plan or we need

to bring in some legal experts and texts. They start going, well, hold on, I thought you just

did my little and there's a little breakdown. So I want to really dive into this because I think

this is a powerful topic. What are you finding when you're working with your advisors?

What do you find that separates kind of like the plain Jane Vanilla commodity annuity

sellers to a true retirement income specialist? That's an excellent question. And you know,

we talk to them all. So, you know, in 25 years of me doing this industry, it's the commodity

seller is always talking about one thing, Mike. And that's products, right? You know, he goes right

into rates, caps, bonuses, all that stuff. That's the, you know, the unique details of a particular

product, whereas, you know, the retirement income specialist, he's going to spend his time talking

about outcomes, you know, and generally, that's where we spend our time. Mike is with advisors that

talk that way. I mean, everyone can offer an organization like Mike and offer products. But,

you know, we want to spend our time talking with advisors who like to talk about outcomes. And,

you know, that is like predictable income, protecting lifestyle, things like that. You know, I mean,

when you, I've got some firms that that we work with here at Empire that don't even really

use the word annuity, Mike, during their entire positioning process. It basically just comes up

later after they've agreed on their ideas and the objectives, right? So, you know, that is a,

a major difference between, you know, the commodity guy and their income specialist and,

you know, like a doctor, a doctor doesn't walk into the room, look at you, Mike, and say,

huh, you need this prescription. You know, they're going to run tests. They're going to ask

questions. They're going to understand the full picture for full picture first. That's the

difference of the commodity guy and the income specialist. Well, it's interesting that you, what you

said there, because it makes me think of a concept and a book I've read. And it's all reiterating

what you just said. But it's like you want to sell the futures, not the features, right? Because

if all you're doing is talking about it in the weeds of look at this annuity, look at this

product, but you're not really talking about the big picture. You want to talk about the

transformation someone will have, you know, the the peace of mind in retirement to know that you're

protecting their income. You can never lose money. You've got cash flow. There's no gap. All of

those things. And then yeah, we accomplished that by this product or this product list. Look at

some of those. But that's an interesting mindset shift that you're bringing up because if someone

is viewed as a product salesperson, you're a commodity. And guess what happens with commodities,

they get shopped. For sure. Absolutely. Yeah, I mean, how you position yourself in your services,

that makes a huge difference. You know, I mean, it's if you're, if you're, you know, again, a

specialist really those those types of advisors, they could feed more on clarity. You know, I mean,

and so, for example, like if the markets are really volatile, Mike, you know, an income specialist

clients are going to probably stay calm because they understand exactly how their income is protected.

They exactly, they understand exactly what they're utilizing structures for inside their portfolio.

They understand exactly what they want. And I view an income specialist to be way more

supporter from that standpoint versus the commodity guy where that client might freak out. And we've

heard those conversations before too. Well, let's also talk about another aspect that might make

an advisor freak out, which is, okay, I understand conceptually what you mean there. But

I'm not really well burst or an expert in this area, in this area, in this area. And I don't,

I don't want to bring it up to my client because I'm not really confident in that. So what do you

say to that advisor where it's like, okay, be used to that and start learning, of course,

but a line with some experts that you can bring in because obviously we're not going to give

tax advice or legal advice. So you need to bring those experts in. But there actually could be some,

you know, money management or some other things that you bring in some partners that are going

to run that kind of meeting, but yet still benefit the client and benefit the advisor. What do you

say to the people that almost have like a little imposter syndrome? Yeah, I mean, you know,

well, we'll comment on the ones that would actually do it in my opinion the right way. Yeah,

I mean, so, you know, I've seen some of the, you know, some of the top advisors are out there,

they're analyzing Social Security timing. You know what I mean? Like, do I know what, when do we

take these payments? And by the way, who doesn't have questions or concerns on that stuff? Right,

Mike? So, you know, I've seen advisors that are talking about that at the tax buckets, pension

options, income gaps, stuff like that before they even mentioned anything else with that with

in regards to their plan. So what really, really, the annuity inside of an advisor who has a lot

of experience or is more of the, you know, income specialist, their plan, the annuity is just one

tool inside of a comprehensive plan, you know, inside of that deal. So, you know, I look at,

you know, how they access that and advisors have access to several different options and tools

that are up in the industry today to compete in those areas that I just mentioned to you. You know,

whether it's Social Security and the tax buckets, pensions, all that kind of stuff, supplementation,

all that stuff matters, but the ones that have those systems and software and technology and access

to those and utilize them the proper the right way. Those are the ones that went.

So, I think that there's an interesting correlation there where you might have some

advisors that have really, you know, painted themselves in the corner and would recognize the

fact that, you know, I kind of have been focused on this one aspect, you know, like just annuities

and that's what I'm known for. And I do recognize that I need to bring that holistic approach and

I'm going to learn more. I'm going to bring in an expert and all of that and talk about retirement

income. That's, that's what my clients need. But what do you say to them about going, how do my,

how do I really establish myself as that authority, trustworthy, credible person rather than just

bring to my clients rather than just bringing it up in a conversation? Aren't there some ways that

you would recommend that an advisor can start to pre-frame and educate and teach like so that

people can recognize that they do have that knowledge about something other than just annuities,

like maybe speaking or, you know, thought leadership kind of stuff.

Absolutely. I mean, and you're a huge influence for me on that, Mike, you know, I mean,

positioning yourself with authority makes a huge difference. And, you know, ultimately,

you know, when I talk to advisors and especially if they're doing educational workshops,

you know, let's just use that as an example, Mike, you know, on advisors doing educational

workshops. If you're showing up and you're going to, you know, and really, you know,

and how we help advisors do that to where I mean, they're showing up and they're just basically

going to provide information, right, in education. So, but I guarantee you before that prospect

shows up to that workshop, they're probably doing what, Mike, they're probably googling you,

you know, and they're probably like, hey, who is this guy, you know, Jeremy Latch? That's going

to be doing the educational workshop today. I want to learn a little bit more about him. You know,

you've got to, when you could go out there and do things ahead of time to where they already show

up to that meeting and they view you as an expert, that is going to dramatically increase both,

you know, your, you know, closings, your conversions and probably your client quality. So, you know,

instead of having to spend, you know, majority of your first meetings with these, with these

prospects, just proving your credibility or trying to break down some barriers, now you can spend

it solving problems. So, yeah, that's a huge part of that. You know, and, and if we really were to

put the truth serum lie detector on some of these people that do what you just said, like, oh,

I'm going to go to see what they're all about. In reality, why are they doing that? Because they

are going, do I even want to show up to this thing? I signed up for this event and I don't know.

Or I'm on this guy's calendar and let me see what Jeremy's all about and I don't, I'm just going

to ghost him. But let me just check him out first real quick, just to confirm that, yeah, I'm not

going to go to that. And if they do those due diligence searches and it's like all they see is

your website and your LinkedIn and your directory listing is like, yeah, that says what I thought

it's all they got. But if they start looking you up and go, oh, that's pretty interesting. They've

been featured in all of the things you just mentioned. That trust is elevated. And guess what happens

then? They show up to the event pre-framed. They show up to that Zoom meeting with you. And so,

it's not just the mechanism of checking the box. Yes, I did these things. It's for a reason.

It's for that psychological impact that people have. And I think that we are creatures of, we're

busy. I don't have the time to waste on someone that is just not going to cut it for me. And I feel

like too many times we all are like, look, I just want to narrow it to the people that are on top.

I might have to pay extra or whatnot. But in reality, in the financial services world is not even

a matter of paying extra because, you know, advisors get paid by the carriers. So it's really just

do I trust this person? That's pretty big. And you're not going to scale past a certain level

if you don't have that going for you. Like that, that is exactly it. It's all about the trust,

right? And if that's established before you've even shaken hands with that prospect,

those decisions are going to happen faster with, you know, far less resistance, right?

You know what I mean? So we don't want to compete. How do you take, get yourself away from the

competitor? That's established that trust before even shake hands. You know, you almost want them

thinking in their mind, wow, I kind of hope that they'll accept me. They'll take me, you know, from,

from, you know, the perspective of that versus, oh, I'm just going to go to this sales pitch.

I'm going to have my guard up and I'm going to answer one word responses. Well, that doesn't happen

when you have been pre-framed and that trust and credibility is there. People are coming in going,

hey, let me ask your opinion of this. How would I? And as soon as you have a client or a prospect

asking you things like that, like, hey, let me ask your advice on this. I mean, I would have worked if,

and now they're on the same side of the table as you. And how is that kind of line of questioning

happening? It's because you're trustworthy. So let's flip the script here and talk about some mistakes.

What are mistakes advisors making that you see when they try to grow without strengthening brand

credibility? Well, my first, you know, my first thought there is stop wasting money on getting

more without fixing the issue of branding first, right? So, you know, advisors where they fail

is they start to increase all of their marketing money. You know, they're spending without

really clarifying their message or their brand. You know, and I've got advisors that I've had

conversations with who just say, hey, I'm going to double my mailers and I'm going to double my

business. You know, but guess what? You still sound generic, you know, and guess what generic messaging

does? It produces inconsistent results, right? So stop wasting your money and try to get more without

fixing the issues. So if your message isn't clear and different, spending more money is only

going to increase the confusion to your prospects, you know, in my opinion. That's pretty huge and

what you said about the mailer, it's like, okay, maybe logistically and literally you could double

production by doubling the mailing maybe, but how much leakage is happening there? You know, like,

you could have maybe doubled production with a 30% increase in your mailing because now you've

got the foundation more effective and it's, and it's really similar to when you were describing

that I thought of this. It's kind of like if you took a Ferrari engine and put it on a VWBug chassis.

You know, the chassis is not going to handle it. It's too much. You got to have a solid foundation

and that's key. So personal brand, professional brand, that is a big, a big piece of the equation.

And I think that that's what that mistake that you're talking about there, it ties into the

deeper problem, which is it's a foundational problem. It's not just an execution problem.

Well, for sure, and you know, and even with that too as well, I mean, even if you don't fix your

branding and you just try to be different by doubling your money and expenses and doing more

workshops, you're also doing something else. You're primarily relying on product differentiation,

right? So products are going to change all the time. If you're doing the exact same thing,

just use the exact same story, just some of the exact same products, these change every year.

You know, but if you build your brand and your your reputation's only going to get stronger,

right? So for example, you know, do you want to be known as the Retire Mini Cup guy? Or, you

know, that's in your community, right? If I'm in that, if I'm in a certain community and

where I'm working or I'm an advisor, I want to be known around the block as the guy that's

the Retire Mini Cup guy, right? You know, that again, maybe that's not whatever what's going for,

Mike. But ultimately, if that's something that you're known for versus the product guy,

yeah, I think you have a huge differentiation than that other guy, right? I mean, being that kind

of guy is going to, you're going to outlast any specific annuity features in your community,

right? You know, I mean, all those features can be copied by your competitors,

being positioned like that. That can't that can't be, right? So that's a that's a huge part of

your of the branding and I've learned a lot from you on that, Mike. Well, thank you. And I would

say this too. Here's a big misconception. People have about the word branding. It's people think,

oh, yeah, I hired my, my, my website guy to spruce up my website. Graphic person got me a new logo.

We updated our colors. Branding is not just your brochures logo website collateral. Branding

actually is ties into what something else you said. It's the clarity of your message.

It's the clear solution you have to a specific problem your prospects have. And it's all of those

things around that that increase credibility and trust around that message. Because if you're

trying to be all things to all people, oh, anything retirement, I can help you with Medicare and

the news and insurance and term and I you people are like, what this is not the the store where I'm

going pick one. You need to have that thing like you just said as an example, you know,

the retirement income expert. Oh, what is that? Well, I'm the, you know, cash flow in expert or

retirement income. The point is that's the ultimate far end transformation, um, um, arriving spot

that people want to get to in retirement. How do we get there? Oh, well, now that you understand

where we want to be with safety security, peace of mind, you know, income, cash flow, no gap,

never run out of money. All of those things. Well, here's how we can get there because in your

specific situation, so that's a big piece that I want you want you to kind of reiterate the fact

that I just said branding is not your logo, your colors, your website, it's all around the clarity

of your message. Clients choose you for who you are, right? Not just what you offer, your prospects

and your clients choose you for who you are. And uh, that's exactly what that is as you mean,

you can have all these different tools and all that kind of stuff. But again, the end of the day,

the clients choose you for who you are. And when they believe that you could be the guy that

could help them for something as important as, you know, retirement income, helping distribution

and all that stuff and mitigate tax consequences and social security, income and all that kind of

stuff. When they know that you're the guy that could do that, you win, right? You know, I mean,

they are going to call you because they believe that you solved that specific problem better than

anyone else. That's authority. You know, I remember years and years ago going to a seminar and maybe

you remember this person, do you remember the name Peter Montoya? I do. Yes. And he and the seminar

just has stuck with me for decades. It was called the brand of you, the brand called you.

And it was all on what we're talking about here, the personal brand. So yeah, you might work for

XYZ company. But in reality, if you are branding yourself as the whatever expert and you're

building relationships with your clients, they're coming because of you. And if you ever change

the name of your company or change the company that you work for or whatever, they're like, okay,

that's cool. So no, what would you, what were you saying about how we need to do? It's, it's your

brand of how they perceive you in their mind. So that's just so huge. And guess what? Yes, you

can spruce up your website and get a new logo and look at four options ago. I like that one click.

You check the box. You don't need to do it again for a long time.

Polishing up your messaging and the clarity of how you serve your clients. That is literally

an ongoing process because you're always watching for people that kind of cocked their head a

little bit and go, how does that work again? And then you explain it. But then maybe you make a

mental note to go, okay, I need to tweak my messaging on that because they didn't get it until I

said this. So that's, that's a big point. So let's, let's kind of wrap up with this thought. How can

being aligned with the right IMO accelerate an advisor's authority and visibility? Because as you've

said a few times, it's not just about, oh, we've got this product or this tool or this software.

Yeah. Well, Mike, having the right IMO is not just one that provides contracts. You know,

we're going to, we're going to also provide strategy and the infrastructure you need to be successful.

You know, so instead of building everything from scratch, and like I talked about

before on previous conversations, Mike, when you're an advisor and you're out on an island and

you're out to buy yourself, you need a partner. You need help. Otherwise, you're building everything

from scratch. You know, so, and if you've got to build everything from scratch, you don't have a

partner. You know, your IMO should help you roll out cold branded retirement income campaigns.

You know, and all that stuff is pretty easy. After a pretty basic interview with an individual,

trying to figure out what they're looking for and what they're trying to accomplish, right?

Yeah. We want to help you design materials and you know, build that clear message around your

brand. That is, that is, that is, that is a huge part of being aligned with the right organization.

If you don't feel that or you don't have that again, like I've always said, maybe it's time to

question those situations now. Maybe you don't have the right partner. You know, you know, I've always

kind of, you know, jokingly tongue in cheek been like, if all you're getting is a, you know,

spruced up PowerPoint presentation and going, oh, go give this to your local, whatever,

that's not marketing help. I mean, that's, that's old, that's 90s version. So you need something

that it's cutting edge, something that is really going to help, you know, amplify your message,

increase that trusty credibility. That's really, really huge. And guess what that does? That helps

take that a nudy producer only, you know, air quotes to being that recognized retirement expert

just like what you've been talking about. So it, with that thought in mind, if someone is, is,

maybe thinking, hey, maybe Empire might be have something that I'm looking for. What's the best

way that they can learn a little bit more and then reach out and connect with you? Yeah, I'd say

just start directly at the website, www.empiremps, that's matpalsam.com, empiremps.com. There you'll find

a lot of information on who we are, a little bit more about my background and what we do while

there's some advantages, but more importantly, it's got access to me and my email and my phone number

directly to contact me, by the way, to have a conversation with me and introduce ourselves and

have a 15 minute introduction call. Love it. Well, thank you so much, Jeremy. I really

appreciate you coming back on. Happy to be here, Mike. Thank you for having me.

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