Is Jasprit Bumrah the Best Ever? India Beat England & Harsha Bhogle Joins | Stick to Cricket EP 35

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Oh, have you got it?

No, no.

So that's the leaky?

Yeah.

There's a wrong one.

Yeah, and that's the...

Oops, sorry.

Bent arm.

Bent arm.

Yeah, there you are.

That's all right.

Yeah, like that.

Oops, that is too full.

Should have driven it.

That's the one.

It just goes through.

Let's say the star of the front.

Oh, not that one.

Jeez, that's the one.

No, I used to go leaky's but the ball never came slowly off the dick.

I'm causing chaos.

You got to harsh you ball one more.

One more.

Nice, nice.

I don't know what this room is usually used for.

I can mini ball room.

It's a banquet hall.

Banker, so you could do a bit of dancing in there.

No, I've done enough for my son's wedding.

No, your son's wedding was very kind of you to invite me.

I went to one evening.

How many evenings did you have?

We had two evenings and...

Well, three, there was a music evening.

Yeah.

Two receptions and a wedding in the morning.

Right.

A little puja, a little ceremony at home in the...

What's the puja, what's...

It's a religious ceremony.

Anita wanted a religious ceremony at the start.

So we had a religious ceremony in the morning with lunch for all the relatives.

A dinner with a lot of music.

Yeah.

Just family turning up, doing dance,

singing, thinking, what a very amateur stuff.

But for which there was a choreographer.

Right.

Who had to tell you the steps because none of us...

Oh, so you had to all learn a dance.

Yeah, two of us.

The four of us, Anita, me and the two boys.

We did one four-minute item.

My cousin's four minutes to remember all the steps.

Well, two of them started with two of them.

Yeah.

And then us, yeah.

So I got all my steps wrong, where it was fun.

And at the dance, what kind of...

And there was a stage, there's a big stage there.

What, and you have to do it in front of everybody?

There are about a hundred people.

So I strict the commencing.

Yeah.

And the food, what food do you have on that?

So we had that.

During the wedding, it's vegetarian food.

Yeah.

But at the function that you came, there was everything.

I have to say, the evening that I went,

it was that cold.

That was just a reception, because...

That was the party.

Yeah, because we didn't want to...

The two completely different sets of audiences.

Right.

So we didn't want them to merge, so this was a different...

So basically kept the riff raffle away from...

No, that was family and relatives who'd come from all over.

I was a part of the...

The Crick was a riff raffle.

No, no, that was...

That was a different audience here.

Because there were people from...

Some people from the movies, some people from films,

a lot of corporate people.

There was some...

What was the very famous singer that was...

Shishinde, who is our boss at Crick was...

He was obsessed with.

He told me, there are...

He said, 75% of my life is now full-fueled.

There were two of them,

two of our top singers,

the guy called Sonu Nigham.

Fantastic.

And the girl got Shreya Goshalji's.

He was...

Shishinde was trying to...

So I was trying to say, come on...

You know, I've not been ignorant to Indian say...

I didn't know who he was.

But I could say he was a superstar with his glasses.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He looked at the star,

and I said, come on, give me an indication.

Are we talking Liam Gallagher?

Are we talking Roger Stewart?

Are we talking Paul McCartney?

And he said, he thinks he's a Roger Stewart.

But India's different in that...

You sing for the movies.

For the part of the movie.

You don't have any albums outside of the movies.

Hardly any.

For sure, they don't release albums.

No.

They're all movie songs,

and they're all sung...

It's called Playback.

There's someone miming it on screen.

There's an actor.

Right.

Apparently, singing on screen,

there's actually a singer behind.

So you've got this actor,

so suppose you're singing Sound of Silence.

Yeah, but...

And there's actually someone else singing.

A proper singer.

A proper singer, and the soundtrack is played.

You mime to the soundtrack.

It's been going on that way for 70, 80 years.

It's not right.

Yeah.

I love that.

So the movie started with singing stars,

because you had to have music,

and you didn't have this whole playback thing.

Playback started in the 40s.

30s, 40s.

Wow.

They're after, they've been very, very few

sing their own songs.

No one.

Well, I have to say,

he clearly was a superstar,

because when he goes to his concerts,

there was a very man in the room that you had.

There was some rather large names of Indian cricket.

Yes, some of them don't know.

But there was this one singer that everyone was up,

straight to.

And then when she got out of it.

And thanks for the bar.

It was a lovely bar that you saw.

So you'll make Diashoek's.

Yeah, you'll put it out.

I mean, I paid for it.

Yeah.

The...

Well, the cocktail...

Picante.

I think it was called Don Picante.

Don Picante.

Manistar Vashiv.

Yeah. Thank you.

That's good.

It might be just for my Northern accent.

It's not me.

At least, these special machines there, Arsha, that you've got.

Okay, I've just been Googling England A Cricket Team

toward India and Bangladesh in January and February 1995.

That's right, yeah.

Led by Alan Wells.

Yes, Sussex.

With notable performances from Mark Ramprakash.

Jason Gallian.

Yes.

Aussie, the first of those needs to play for...

Yeah, he played Australian under 19s, I think.

And in Salzbury.

Salz is like it, yeah.

Yeah, that's right.

I do remember it.

Anybody else who's name's the name's the name's the name?

Glentiapple with Dave Keith, part with...

Let's see, I'm going Wikipedia.

What would be do without Wikipedia?

The India part.

Okay.

Okay.

David Hem.

David Hem.

Yeah, left hand, if I'm wrong.

Amol Muzumdar played.

Sayaraj Bahutile played.

WD Balaji Rao, the leaky.

Yes.

Okay, let's...

Oh, no, I'm going to one.

Let's see if we can get us a go-kart of that game.

India Youth 199.

Dominic Koch?

Dominic Koch, yeah.

Rahul Dravid, Sword of Ganguly, Vikram Rathord.

All played against you.

Wow.

Yeah, good save.

Ah!

My friend, Jay Kamal Jitsing of Spina.

First time I ever played on a match on a turf weekend.

I guess so.

He had just been picked for Hyderabad.

This was early when I was still playing.

When I was playing Senior Division Krieger in Hyderabad.

Right.

I played the Inter College Final.

I've gone out to bat.

Opposite me from batting at number three is a player called Arshad Ayub.

Played 13 test matches for India thereafter.

80, 89, 90.

As I'm going out to bat, he just came up to me and said,

have you ever batted on turf?

Because we all played, we'll get all the Krieger on matting.

I said, no, I wonder why he's asking.

I said, no, why?

Why are you asking me?

He said, you've never batted on turf.

I said, no.

He said, OK, we are 60 for five.

This guy's fizzing his off breaks.

He said, close your eyes and play forward.

I said, OK.

First ball, I'm here because you don't use your feet on matting.

You don't need to use your feet on matting.

I'm here and I hear, luckily, it's not the off-stum going.

It's the ball in the keeper's gloves.

The keeper went on to become chief in the stir of my state.

Right.

He came down and said, you did not hear what I said.

You said, close your eyes.

Even if you bolt it at his feet, play forward.

So next ball, I've just gone up.

And I'm surprised it's gone off the middle of the bed.

We put on 67.

Yes, you know.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nice knocking.

Are we all set?

Is that...

Well, good now.

We'll recall it.

OK.

You mentioned David Beckham.

Yes.

And you had David Beckham and Gary Neville.

Yes.

It was a fire around the fire.

Fireside chat.

Fireside chat.

How did you find that?

Because Gary obviously, you know,

how he owns this company that kind of...

They got along really well, as you'd imagine.

So I didn't have a lot to do.

But even in the...

They didn't know me, obviously.

But that didn't come in the way of them pulling my leg

as the program went along.

Oh, it's good fun, though.

Because Manchester United and Beckham

and Neville, that whole generation of Beckham gigs,

schools, I'm not a big football follower,

but I know that generation, the captain, outspoken.

David Beckham, Gary Neville, Roy Keene.

Roy Keene.

Roy Keene, Gary Neville.

Outspoken.

So, yeah.

But they were fantastic.

Yeah, they were really, really good then.

And joyfully.

Beckham's got...

I think I'm on the wrong side.

I hosted football, you know?

You hosted football, didn't you?

I hosted the World Cup of Football in 2006 for star.

2006.

The rights were only for India.

So they wanted an Indian face.

I also had to host games like Togo versus Poland.

So, all right.

The World Cup in 2006 was...

That was...

That was in...

That was a headbutt.

That was a headbutt.

So, we were in Singapore.

Zidane. Zidane.

And many years later, when the Indian football league started,

I was in a studio with Marco Materazi.

So, you've done a few things there.

Wow, that was cool.

Hello and welcome to Stick to Cricket,

brought to you by Betfurt.

Today, I'm hearing Mumbai.

You can hear the noise outside with the hoots of the horn,

and I'm delighted to say I'm joined by Harsha Bogley.

Enjoy the show.

Rahul Dravid, VVS Lushman, Saurav Gangoli,

Sachin Tindoka, Ranil Kumbhli,

not once did a player in their generation come up to me

and say, I didn't like what you said on air about me.

Why aren't you dominating everything?

I know why, but why isn't the Indian team

dominate test, 50s and T-20s?

Before the game, I'd got the job for Arjun to shake him.

I'd just shake him up, make him angry.

The coach is saying, forward, done.

That's all they do. There's no ball.

Where do you see Basmacolum?

I think he liberated English cricket.

I look at the last three and a half years and think,

you know what, I've really enjoyed it.

But I've now got to the stage of, what are we one?

One of the great joys in my life is watching Bumra grow.

I think he's an absolute genius.

Will we see India versus Pakistan in a test series again?

Well, I start the show properly then, Harsh.

I think we're ready to go.

There's a little bit of action still going on in the corner,

but there will always be action.

The first thing you learn as an anchor in this country

is ignore everything that's around you.

It's to be honest, Harsh, it's exactly like the studio back

in Altingham.

There you go. There's a lot of going on.

There's a bar going to the right.

There's generally people hustling around the back.

Tough as he's usually doing a demo in the corner.

Bumble was meant to be here.

Yeah.

Because of the problem with the release.

Bumble's flight and three of the crew were coming.

So unfortunately, really, we've got a new crew here

and you've just caught me.

But I must, I must stand on a few.

I know Michael Vaughan, the cricketer.

I know Michael Vaughan, the broadcaster.

Today was Michael Vaughan, the impressario.

He's just looking around supervising everything.

Are the windows clean?

Sorry, get the windows clean.

Sorry, it's the floor all right.

The cameras are going.

He's found some director.

We've found some cool, we've found some nice

cuts, which are the colors of our show.

It's trouble.

Strawberries, which I've got to show you.

We've put some tissue underneath.

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Hi, morning after the night before.

Yes.

England lose narrowly to India, in a semi-final at the 1K.

In my opinion, the 1K is the best venue in India.

This is the atmosphere.

This rises up tall, doesn't it?

Crowder.

You know why it rises tall?

Go on.

Because there's no space for it to go as a saucer.

A lot of cricket grounds are like saucers.

That's right.

This one can't go up because it goes up

because there's no space on the sides.

So when they redid it for the 2011 World Cup final,

they just had to get it to go up

because it's building on one side

and a railway track on the other.

I guess if it was a saucer, it hadn't been the sea.

There you go.

It's a close-stream marine drive.

What is your recollections of last night?

What was it that India managed to do

that just got them over the line?

I think they said before it started, they'd be fearless.

And you saw Sandu Samson, obviously.

I mean, me and Bish have a little private Sandu Samson

fan club for the last few years.

But the innings that Ishankishan played.

You've lost your talisman player who suddenly can't score a run.

And India just went on.

Go boom, boom, boom, boom.

At one point, I'm telling myself,

I think they'll get it to 20 to 30.

And at one point, I said, it's 250 going to be enough.

But this Indian team just plays fearlessly.

And what I love about T20 cricket

is what India embodied.

It's not about one player.

It's not about landmarks.

It's not about whether you've got a 50.

It's not whether you've got a 100.

In the time that you have, did you make an impact?

Hardik Pandya made an impact.

Dilakwarma made an impact.

Shivam Dube made an impact.

Even Surakumari, other 11 of six.

He's played six balls, but he's not made three of it.

He's made 11.

I thought that is what I enjoyed the most.

And I mean, cricket in India has always

been incredibly special, yes.

I guess the topic of still everyone's conversation.

But this Indian side just seems to,

I mean, they're now, obviously, they've

got a chance to retain the T20 World Cup.

The one in two years ago in the Caribbean.

They're the ICC 50 over champions.

So they have a chance of winning.

Champions trophy.

Yeah, a champion trophy.

So you're looking at potentially winning three on the top.

Yes.

The women.

The women, champions.

So are there this juggernaut that are going

to be very difficult to stop in white ball cricket?

I think in the white ball game, yes, definitely.

In T20 especially, even though T20 is a lottery

on the day anyone can win it.

Finland has a great day.

And South Africa has been the best team in the tournament

in Vietnam.

But there was a time when parents would go to coaches

and want their sons to play for India.

Now they're going to coaches and they're saying,

make my son an IPL player.

It's slowly starting to happen with the young girls

starting to come into line.

And parents are now saying, because a lot of rural India

is very traditional, very difficult for girls

to come through there and play cricket

and they're all now saying, oh, if Smriti Mandan

I can do it, if Shafali Varma I can do it.

Jamie Roderick's can do it, Harman Priet can do it,

why not my girls?

There's a revolution happening at that level just below.

I hope this saying, can you play test cricket,

but I wouldn't be surprised if they're not.

I mean, we're going to dissect into last night's game.

But most mornings I walk from the hotel

and I go around the back and I go down the street.

I'll get a brew.

And I always have a walk around.

Are you back to your favorite side?

I am, yeah.

It's the love of the place to stay.

And I walk down to the Oval Madan.

You know, he's just a historic place for cricket.

And every morning there's games, there's nets

and there's all sorts going on.

There's games with harbour, there's games with those

rubber balls that fly everywhere, they go on the roads

and I have to say for the first time,

and maybe I've missed it in the past.

But it's the first time I've walked around the Oval Madan

and I've seen lots of girls playing cricket

as well in the morning.

And I look to that thought fantastic.

When I first came to Mumbai,

I came from Hyderabad to Mumbai.

And I had to play cricket in Mumbai for two years

because I was working in advertising.

There's inter-company matches.

So I had to play for a couple of years.

So we'd go to Shivaji Park, we'd go to all these places.

And the coaches there would be training kids

in forward defence.

Do I have space to move?

Yeah, yeah.

Well, surface use, it doesn't matter.

Come on, Hasha.

It used to be like that.

Just imagine there's a bat.

And there's about 15 kids standing in a row

like this, 20 sometimes.

And the coach is saying, forward, down.

That's all there to do.

There's no ball.

Low, sniff the leather.

That's what we thought it would get stiffed the leather.

Then they'd move to cover drive.

There's no ball.

You're just practicing your movements.

But the whole thing was about defence today.

Where's your foot going?

Is your foot going to the pitch?

Is your foot going away?

It's changing, but you know, that's how it used to be.

I did see, it was last Saturday morning,

where most of the kids, because they schooled in the week.

And there was that kind of session going on.

They had little cones with it,

but they did have a ball and kind of put in the head

and play in the shot.

But that's why you'd see a lot of young kids coming through.

Looking very correct.

I like a bit of chaos.

Computer going in the corner, doing a bit of work.

So this semi-final, the batting from India

is exactly the last three games.

The Zimbabwe, West Indies, and now against England.

I mean, they had that blip against South Africa,

earlier in the tournament.

And I actually said straight after that game,

I thought they've had the blip.

But they might need a little bit of fortune.

They needed the West Indies to lose to South Africa

and the suprates.

And then it gave them that opportunity to beat Zimbabwe.

And obviously, it was a quarter final against the West Indies.

From there on in, it was almost that performance again,

particularly the batting performance against South Africa.

It was the jolt that the Indian team needed, perhaps.

And it was like, oh, and you go about two years ago

in the 50th of a World Cup, I hate to bring it up again.

But they played the perfect tournament.

And they had the one blip in the final.

And I just wonder whether that blip against South Africa

is their one blip.

I just wonder, people say when you're playing Wimbledon,

it's much better to have tough games in the third, fourth round

and the quarter finals so that you're ready.

If you're just sort of sailing through in straight sets,

you might struggle in the semi-send the final.

But I think this Indian team, I don't know how good they

are playing 161-70 games.

Because the art of playing spin with the ball

stopping turning in its very home is now reducing.

Ah, so you say?

I think India is a very good playing 2-20 games, right?

When the pitch is flat.

Flat sea, the line hit the line.

They play power games beautifully.

And they have two gun boilers who give you 8 overs.

One of them is struggling.

Varun Chakraverti.

And Bumra.

So when you're playing Bumra, you're saying, OK,

I've got 20 overs.

The opposition's got 16.

And I think they just back themselves to keep going.

That's why it matters.

You know, the New Zealand probably

part of the batting with 9.

I would think Maconshire bat at number 9.

And number 9.

But New Zealand have a lot of players

in the top order who boil India don't.

India's stuck with five boilers.

So they have to score that many runs.

They've got a bit of a shift in Dubai.

It's been hit for 68 and his last three overs.

I mean, I'm not worried about the last three-sixes

of the game was over by then.

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Stick to cricket is brought to you by BatFa.

You mentioned a couple of really interesting things there.

You go back probably five, ten,

particularly 15 years ago.

If the pitch is spun,

you know, seen from the southern hemisphere,

the UK had no chance.

You look at this World Cup.

Indeed, I've kind of scratched the way through

with the West Indies losing to South Africa,

and they're in the final, you know, the best team.

You know, Pakistani struggle,

Sri Lanka struggled.

You know, 15, 20 years ago,

I think all four semifinalists

would have been from the subcontinent.

There's a,

a huge change in the way that

teens are playing spin.

And people that are bought up playing spin

don't seem to play as well as they used to.

Is that fair?

It is.

And you'll notice there was a time

when it was all the ristis were doing well.

When the ball stops and turns,

it's always the finger spinners.

So you see,

Ruchin, Ravinder,

a ball well,

satner, a ball well,

Philips will come and ball a little bit.

You only got a ball two overs.

But it is true.

When the ball is stopping and turning,

even in our run,

you're going to get,

India have lost test matches

when the ball stops and turns.

New Zealand.

New Zealand too.

New Zealand.

And South Africa.

Yeah.

Lost to whom?

Simon Harmer.

So the art of playing spin bowling

is slowly going out in itself.

Why is that?

I think,

I don't know if it's because

of the pitches in run,

you told me,

cricket?

You're not getting the same bowlers

and there's a lot of T-20 cricket around.

Yeah.

So,

I guess that they're setting themselves up

to strike and smack.

We're even there,

the ability for...

I mean, you come and watch the IPO.

You see,

the names that you've not heard of

will suddenly come and hit

34 of 16 balls in an IPO.

So the primary goal is,

is playing IPO.

I mean,

back to last,

I looked,

you know,

Sandu Sampson got playing the match.

You could easily have given it,

Jacob Beth,

or that,

anything we'll talk about in the minute.

Maybe even Bumra.

I was just going to come to that.

Okay.

Just a bit Bumra 4-1-133.

But I think I could go on a stage

as a...

as a...

as a...

as a speaker.

It's a very strong case

of why Bumra should have been

man of the match.

Interestingly, on social media,

last night,

there were a lot of people saying,

why not Bumra?

Because you see,

he comes on gets the number one threat.

I know Bethel got the runs.

The number one threat is Harry Brook.

How on earth he was betting

number five, I don't know.

I'm not a former player.

I'm not this expert.

I'm looking at England

and saying,

what is Brook doing at five in a T-20 game?

Oh, you're right.

There you go.

But Brook was the number one.

It's a threat.

And Bumra comes in for Brook.

Then he comes in.

There's 45 of three, Michael.

There's 45 of three, you're betting.

Would you play out an over?

And say, I'll get the runs of the last two.

But I won't attack Bumra.

And I think that's what they get.

They're happy.

I think...

To Sam Karin's defense

and Jacob who faced a couple of balls

in that Bumra over,

I think he pulled such a good over

that it was Lyon's hit.

And there was a start that came.

We both work on CrickBulls.

And straight away after the game,

we looked at the Yorkers.

And it's like,

it's a skill that's gone out the game.

How dare you mention the Yorker?

It's such an old way of ball.

And you can't bowl the Yorkers in this year.

It doesn't work.

Well, England bowl three Yorkers yesterday.

They went for six runs.

India bowled 15 attempted Yorkers.

And they were hit for 22 runs.

You could, again,

make a very strong case,

is that the Yorker

that India delivered more

and better won India the game.

And that's a very fair call.

I can see why people are not bowling the Yorker

because you miss it by three inches either way

and it's gone out of the ground.

So it requires a very special baller

to be able to bowl that Yorker.

And Bumra is just a...

One of the great joys in my life

is watching Bumra grow.

I agree.

I mean, I said it a few years ago.

I honestly feel it's the best ball

that I've ever seen.

And, you know, you always get...

A few talking about those back in the day.

I didn't see those back in the day in the 20s, 30s, 40s, 56s.

I didn't see them bowl.

20s, 30s.

But the old talk about SF Barnes.

You know?

You know, he's not as good as SF Barnes.

But in my time watching and playing the game,

I've not seen anyone better.

And that's across all three formats.

I just think he's got this amazing ability

to read the game as well.

You know, not only does he deliver all the skills,

or it's in swing out, swing slow ball,

bounces, pace, off pace, whatever you want to bowl, Jasper.

We'll find it.

And you kind of look at spinners.

And we talk about spinners when they bowl on a wicket.

They've got to find the pace for that pitch.

Bumra seems to find the skill for that pitch

quicker than anybody.

So last night in the semi, he knew

he'd seen the England, you know,

Joffa Archway for 61,

bowled into the deck, just gets, you know,

the one Katie, you know, you just get picked

up, it flies into the stand.

And that's what happened against Joffa Archway.

He probably looked at Jamie Everton think

that bowled to Yorker, straight, hard to hit.

He saw Joffa Archway, bowled Tillett,

palm with the Yorker, bowled him.

And I reckon he sits in the dugout in the first innings,

not thinking about, do I need to go out there

and striker free with the bat?

He's thinking, right, what are the hardest balls to hit?

And then he takes that out to when he bowls.

I think he's an absolute genius of what he delivers.

And I've not seen anybody in my time better

than Jasper Bumra.

I saw him in 2013,

playing for Mumbai Indians against RCB.

You know the visit of Oz?

There's a character called the Tin Man.

In the visit of Oz.

He's on hinges.

So he comes as a Tin Man.

And here's this Tin Man coming,

going, why do the crease slanting it in?

And I said, yeah, just another bowl of beer action.

All young bowlers in India these days slanted in.

No one bowls the out swing hardly anyone.

And he got Virat Kohli out.

And I said, yeah, he knew this factor.

But with every year I saw Bumra.

I saw a new delivery.

The straight one came.

The out swinger came.

Worked a lot with Lassid Malengar at Mumbai Indians

to learn to bowl the Yorker.

The IPL is like, it's not just the best cricket in the world.

It's also the best thoughts in the world.

The best minds in the world come here.

It's like the equivalent of going to Davos maybe.

Where all the minds in the world of business and finance are there.

And just to see Bumra grow.

As you said, he picked up so quickly.

Very intelligent man.

Mother's headmistress in school.

Is that right?

Yeah.

Is that right?

And all these boys, Mike.

I don't know if it's well known in England.

The hunger comes because they've all had very, very difficult upbringing.

And I sometimes say, I say England in Australia.

And I said, there are two words that I would love them to have.

Hunger?

Just a desire.

Well, you said they were lacking that?

Yeah, life is too easy.

Yeah.

Life is very easy.

I mean, what is failure?

Failure is you go to Nooza and have a drink and get come back.

Your failure is you forgot?

If failure means you're forgotten.

If failure means that you go back and get a job that gives you hardly any money.

And your whole life is a struggle.

That is what failure means.

And a lot of these boys, Risha, Pan, Jaspreet, Bumra.

A lot of them single parent families.

All of them.

Cheteshwar Pujara, Virat, Koli.

A lot of them come from single parent families.

And the hunger.

They just practice six hours, eight hours a day.

Because that is their passports to everything else.

Our generation, education was the passport to everything else.

Our parents didn't give us any inheritance.

They just gave us education.

This generation, they just work so hard.

The hunger is incredible.

Do you think that's a kind of global fail

in potentially what England are?

Because they don't desperately need it.

I'm with you.

Because I think I had a little bit of that.

I think I had a little bit of that in my career.

Once I'd done X and Y, it was like, OK.

Because I kind of knew that I was going to be OK.

You say the Indian players are worried about being forgot.

In the UK, I don't think there is that worry.

I think it is a comfortable environment.

It's a great environment to live in the UK.

It's a cricketer.

That inner drive, that inner kind of whatever it is.

I think there's something in that.

But how can England get that?

I mean, they have it.

If you look at the 21st century,

England have done some special things.

They've won actually a series of home in a way.

They've won in India in 2012.

They've won a 50-year-old World Cup.

The men's team, two T-20 World Cup in Barbados and in Australia.

So they've done OK.

They've done it many times.

You know, my fear, and I think the fear of the global game,

is that India have got, I think, India's second team

that they would have put out for the T-20 World Cup

and potentially a 50-year-old World Cup or Champions trophy.

I think potentially that would be the second best team.

There's no choice but in this team.

There's no shubman guild in this team.

There's a lot of people who could easily come into this side

and you'd be absolutely fine.

I don't know.

Look, you beat the Aussies playing like the Aussies.

When you won the 2005 Ashes,

you beat the Aussies playing like Aussies.

The reason you're liked in Australia is because Aussies love people

come harder than them.

But I think it's important.

Why was Jimmy Anderson different?

Came from the same background.

So maybe there's that hunger inside.

And I sometimes wonder, it's too easy.

I'm either bad at letting me go to the pub.

That option doesn't exist in India, doesn't exist in Pakistan,

doesn't exist in Sri Lanka.

So you fail your lives with you.

Your whole family plays the game.

So just you, your whole family,

your whole community is playing the game.

When you do well, the whole community celebrates.

Rinku Singh is a fringe player.

With his IPL income, he goes and sets up a school

where people can't afford to get all their gear and everything else.

There's Natarajan.

You know what Natarajan?

Yeah.

Comes from a small town outside of Selam,

outside of Chennai.

Comes to Chennai to play league cricket.

But he can only play for a team that gives him shoes.

Because he doesn't have a pair of fast bowling shoes.

So he can only play for a team that gives him that.

Can you imagine the hunger he has?

And then when he goes back with his IPL money,

he trains people, gives them the kids.

So they can come and play senior division cricket in Chennai.

So that hunger, I think, is never up.

When I went to England, I worked on Test Mad Special

for the first time in 96.

I was telling myself, do well because you're representing India.

If you do well on Test Mad Special,

people will think that an Indian can come and broadcast

on an English channel.

So that hunger, it's very different with us.

Yeah, it's fascinating.

I mean, you kind of look at what India have now.

And the structure, the pathway,

the facilities here in India now,

the performance center up in Bangalore is seconds and on.

I mean, Mumbai, I've got one here in Mumbai,

which is state of the art.

You kind of look at Indian cricket.

And in whiteboard cricket, I fear.

But I look and think, why is the test team struggling?

So I generally think with the talent that India have,

the players that they have, and the structure that they have,

I'm staggered that they don't dominate everything.

Because they've got billions that watch it,

billions that play it.

And every 15, 20 years ago,

did they have a baseball in Cartel now?

They have that now in abundance.

And you kind of go, why aren't you dominating everything?

I know whiteboard, but why isn't the Indian same dominate test?

50s and C20s.

I think that's happened in the last two or three years.

If you remember, 2018, 2021, India, win in Australia.

2022, in COVID, India, go to England,

the 2-1 ahead and don't play the last game.

I never got my head around there.

You're leading 2-1 against England.

In England, you don't play the last game.

By the time you come back,

England's a different side.

The series is 2-2.

But India were beating England in England, almost.

So till about 22, 20, I think India was doing that

because there was a very powerful fast bowling core.

To some extent, you've got to give credit to Virat Kohli for that.

Kohli always wanted to play with fast bowling.

And Isha and Sharma's revival came with Virat Kohli,

but it was all boom-run.

Shami, really.

We forget Shami very quickly.

Boom-ra, Shami, Siraj.

Now, boom-roundly plays a little bit.

And you look around India.

Every time I meet former players,

I say, is there a spinner that gets you excited?

I said, no, I'm not sure.

No?

Not sure.

Not sure?

Yeah.

There's a couple of beautiful left-down spinners coming through

but they all have to bat.

Well, it's 20 years ago.

They've been everywhere.

Yeah.

Everywhere, everywhere.

So yeah.

So Ashwin's gone.

So if you see India's great run at home,

from 2014 to 2023,

coincided with Ravi Ashwin's career.

Yeah.

Suddenly, Ashwin's gone.

J.A. just moving on.

Yeah, I must admit, there's something about Ashwin's power

and that is wonderful.

Street cricket came up from street cricket,

but mind it, always ticking.

He told me the story once about how to bowl to Steve Smith.

You're doing a program together like this.

And he said, I was just watching Steve Smith

every single moment, watching Steve Smith bat.

And my wife thought I had a man crush on him.

And he said, I'm wondering, how do I stop Steve Smith?

He said, and then I realized his game was all

about the speed with which the bat comes down.

He said, if I can play around with the speed

with which his bat comes down,

then maybe I can get Steve Smith out.

Now, how do I get him to get confused about his bat speed?

He said, that's what I kept thinking about all along.

He's an engineer.

They're all, huh?

A lot of the players from the South are.

Is that right?

Prasanna, Venkat Raghavan.

I remember sitting with Prasanna in a lobby once.

And I said, how does the ball drop?

How do you guys get a ball to drop?

Because when we bowl off spin, when it left the hand,

it went in a perfect parable.

I landed exactly where it was supposed to.

And he took out a napkin and a pin

and said, this is the force with which it is being released.

This is the force, gravitational force pulling the ball down.

The resultant of two forces will get the ball to drop over here.

And for that, the ball needs to have that much spin on it.

We call it reps, the ball.

It's not reps.

It's rotating.

And it falls there.

So do you think a lot about the game, these spinners?

That's that.

I've never heard the terminology of force on force.

Because that's what it is.

That is how the ball dips.

If I bowl off spin the ball.

And that's when it got it to dip more than, yeah?

If I bowl off spin, it would never dip.

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From your perspective, I look at England now.

You have to identify the last few months of English cricket.

All the talk will be what happens from here.

The ashes were poor ashes.

It was a disaster.

Everything just didn't go right.

There wasn't that one game in Melbourne.

The C20 World Cup played one day and the C20 Series in Sri Lanka

before the World Cup.

Good preparation for the conditions that they've played

and don't want to go back through.

The lack of preparation for the ashes.

From a perspective from here in Mumbai,

where do you see Bhasmakulam and his position as the England coach?

I think he liberated English cricket.

I loved watching how England were playing because he liberated them.

But I think I was watching from a distance and I thought

you needed to take seven wickets only.

You didn't need to take ten because you got three sometimes.

That's the feeling we got.

England came to India.

England's best player is Joe Root.

By some distance, England's best player.

And he's getting out reverse sweeping caught at backward point.

And I thought you didn't earn that cricket.

You got it.

And you see when Root goes back to playing the way that comes naturally.

It means the best batter in the world again.

I got the feeling that you only needed to get seven wickets.

But if you look at England now,

they've got a wicket keeper who's going to be around for a very long time.

Serious batter.

They've got Brooke.

They've got Bethel.

You've already got the batting around whom you can build a side.

But I still think it comes too easy.

That's my view.

I'm not an expert on the game.

But I just...

When you say it comes...

The praise of this England regime has been the culture that's been quite relaxed.

It's given the players the freedom to run towards the dangers of a term that's been used.

Do you think there needs to be a tightening up and a little bit more of it?

It's not going back to the old days of, you know, you have to be here on that day and that time.

I agree that players need a bit of freedom.

But I do think the disciplines.

Because I look at the last three and a half years and think, you know what?

I've really enjoyed it.

But I've now got to the stage of, what if we won?

Yeah.

And I heard Basmaculamon sky last night after the game.

So we've had some cool moments.

Cool moments are great when you're starting out.

But once you get to that journey of three or four years deep,

I want those cool moments to be that...

That's cool for me, lifting a trophy.

Yes.

And so far in this last few years, we've not won a national series, we're not beating India.

We haven't won an ICC event.

Would you change that or would you allow Basmaculam the chance to reflect,

get home, reflect over that, because he's, you know, he's had a busy winter.

He's been on the road.

Get home in a couple of weeks' time and reflect.

Because if I hear and again, I listened to his interview last night,

it came across in a way that he felt that they didn't stick to their values in Australia

of what they'd done for the previous three years,

which was running towards the danger.

And I would say, do you know what?

I actually think they did stick to their values in the first test in Berth and it cost them.

They stuck to their values against India at the Oval last morning.

It cost them.

The second test at Adelaide, they stuck to their values.

It cost them, so the 2-0 down.

The first things in Adelaide in them went aggressively, got balled out for a lot less than they should have done.

They lost that game.

I reckon they did play the expansive game at the wrong times in Australia.

And then they started to play a little bit differently.

I guess the Melbourne victory was a bit of a free hit.

The Oval, I cannot imagine how they lost that Oval test.

I mean, Surajable beautifully, that's all right.

How can you lose that Oval test?

But this is the point, Harsha, that the making is that I can't have the excuses

that they weren't true to their values,

because their values have actually lost them big moments of the Oval.

Their values have made them go 1-0 down, 2-0 down in Australia,

and the first in Adelaide.

So if I start hearing that the England set-up or maybe the captain or some of the players

didn't quite play true to their word, which has been the case for the last few years,

I have to say I'm sorry, but winning away in Pakistan and winning away in New Zealand is not a legacy.

It's actually a series, Indian series, Harsha is the events of legacy in moments,

and they haven't won any.

So Basis is willing to accept and move forward and say,

okay, yeah, we've just got to go up and down in the gears at the right time,

which is what test cricket is.

I'm actually fine with him carrying on.

But it would have to include a little bit of a change in the back room,

because I look at Barcelona football, I think Barcelona football have the best model,

where they kind of always promote from within.

Yeah, they kind of always, they lose their manager, they're someone from within.

I look at our system at the minute and go, that's not in place.

So you feel they've won, though.

It's like a management group, the whole lot has to go.

You have to start again, and you can't keep starting to fresh every three or four years

and clearing out everybody.

That's just not going to help.

So I'm really happy if Bath carried on that, he learns and he moves forward.

I'm happy with that, but I think he has to involve the English game a little bit more than he has done.

For a savvy investor, let me give you an investment parallel.

You invest in debt, 100% safe sovereign bonds, you invest in equity markets,

and sometimes you take a punt on startups.

There are people who play the hedge funds, there are people who play the equity funds.

I think sometimes you've got to have a balanced portfolio,

and say the turbulent times, I need 40% of my portfolio in safe debt.

I think that morning at the over, if England played like a debt portfolio manager,

saying, I've got the time, I won't take a chance.

I'll just play safe.

I'll play with my...

In India, we say six, seven percent returns, maybe two, three percent returns in England,

because there's no inflation.

It's got to be tied to inflation anyway.

And I'll just play, I'll take my two, three percent returns.

I don't need 20 percent returns today, and I'll win the test match with two, three percent returns.

So I still think England need to have that balance, and who has it right?

It's your route.

I love that, because you're absolutely spot on, because every moment that I look at,

that has been pressure, which is the last day at the over, win the game, win the game.

The second afternoon in Perth, which is played, win that day, you win the game.

The first thing is in Adelaide.

The way that they played in Brisbane.

You kind of look at that and think, the terminology, a startup investment is a huge, huge risk.

You're basically, given a bit of money, and realistically, you're thinking, it's probably gone.

But I'm willing to give you that money, and you know what, if it comes off, you're getting a big return.

I think in investing startups at the wrong times.

Well, the startup of the keeper is worked.

The startup of the Bethel is worked.

Individual players.

Individual players.

I'm talking about the moments that they're getting.

But I still think.

And the way that they play at certain moments, it's like all in risk.

And you're right, I think I'll draw this guy.

Just put a little bit in that funnel.

In debt, in debt.

But there's a bit of money.

Maybe they're safe today.

You've done the work to get to that.

You've invested in the startup to get to that moment.

Now just put the money in debt.

I'll tell you what else India do, right?

It's not that India does everything, right?

India's under 19 coach for a long time.

It was Rahul Dravid.

Rahul Dravid is teaching them cricket, but he's teaching them life.

Hardik Pandya talks about how Rahul Dravid told him,

you had a bad spell, yes.

But when you get to international cricket,

this is what will harm you.

Come back.

Who's teaching them, who's with them now, is VVS Lakshman.

Not a soul in the world speaks a bad word about VVS Lakshman.

Very traditional, but very intelligent.

Got into medical college on his own merit, but chose to play cricket.

But he's teaching these young people about values and about sport.

And I think at the under 19 level, if you've got your finest human beings,

this coach, I think that just sets it up.

That's just my view, little old-fashioned.

Well, obviously the under 19s, from India being in Nepal.

I'm so revengey with that 170 times.

I was just a cook talking about Surya Vantya on the program.

Well, he's...

I asked Lakshman about him, and he says,

I said, is he really that good?

He said, that's all.

So that means we've got another one coming through that's going to be...

But he doesn't block a ball.

At some point he's got a block of balls.

Yeah.

I see him in Wibble Cricket.

I'd be interested to see how it goes in the world.

Because of him, Rajasthan Royals have let Sanju Samson go to CSK.

Because they've got Jaiswal and Surya Vantya opening for them.

Stick to Cricket is brought to you by Betfair.

Let's move to the final.

Yeah.

I mentioned earlier about 2023.

It was a Southern Hemisphere team on that day.

Pat Cummins made the call the day before.

Want to silence the crowd?

They'll be 100 and what?

10,000.

Surely.

Surely India get over the line.

2019 New Zealand Stop India.

2016 on a turner in Nagpur New Zealand Stop India.

Everyone talks about Australia, England.

You know who's been India's bogie side over the years?

New Zealand.

Over the years, it's been India's bogie side.

It's just that we love New Zealand so much.

But India, based on four, one in the...

Bilateral.

Bilateral series, which count for very little these days.

Nothing at all.

Bilateral series and tournament player, two different beasts.

Tournament player, knockout tournament player.

So South Africa.

South Africa against New Zealand.

I'm watching South Africa and I'm saying,

what have you got led in your feet?

I can't say that on air.

I don't have the credibility to say that on air.

But they just looked at it in the background.

What a play.

They just looked...

Tournament player.

I think New Zealand have nothing to lose.

Beware, the person's got nothing to lose.

Well, yeah.

They've also got...

And I said it on the show.

I do think of the best team in the world for what they have.

Yeah.

You've got the pedal of the box at injured.

For what they deliver.

They're just incredible.

And they have an opening partnership that if they get going...

So I've got an finale on them.

I saw them in the Big Bash, both of them.

I mean, we talk about that Crowley and Ben Duckey.

You know, you left hand right hand, but it's little and large.

You know, the ballers have got to come and change the length.

And I think Siphon and Finale.

I mean, Finale is...

He reminds me of...

When Matthew Hayden was in his stand.

Yes.

He was a monster.

Yes.

And I could only imagine...

I didn't get the chance.

Thankfully, I didn't bowl too much.

But I could only imagine running up to bowl until that Matthew Hayden.

You just see this big brute.

And I think it's the same to Finale.

He must be running to bowl going.

And we mentioned that about the Yoke.

Have you ever missed anything?

It's a Finale.

It's out of the ground.

Is he going to go into bad thinking?

Oops.

What if I get a top edge?

If he thinks that way, he'll get out.

But they've got nothing to lose.

They're bad deep.

They've got players who just come in.

It's very...

It's not fair to New Zealanders, isn't it?

We keep saying they're over-delivered.

But they've done it so often.

I think they're unfair to say that.

They like that.

And again, it's because of people like Kuzu Talks so much about the game.

That we do mention that.

But I think New Zealand love being under the radar that no one talks about.

They know how good they are.

The stealth bombers.

They know how good they are.

Again, you look at South Africa, a wonderful T20 team.

You look at New Zealand.

You look at their players from 1 to 11.

And you look around the franchise leagues around the world.

They're all sorts after.

Yes.

All of them.

Work ethic.

You're guaranteed work ethic.

Hunger.

Hunger.

Also, New Zealand have been very pragmatic.

Right from the day the IPL started.

New Zealand said we can't match that money.

So we'll adjust our schedule.

Go and play the IPL.

It doesn't matter.

So they finish their cricket and march every year by sort of end-fabre march.

Go and play the IPL.

We can't match the money.

But we don't want to lose players.

So we won't come in your way.

And see how sought after there.

Because you get work ethic.

You get fitness.

You don't always get work ethic with everybody.

And so they're very and their team players.

Yeah.

They've got, they mean Santa's.

Santa's.

Wonderful spin and good captain.

I always liked the one player that missing his brisk was.

He would have completed the side.

So Walters is the coach there.

But over the last eight years,

well, they've had some good success.

You know, the one that will touch Jamshit Farm.

They're always there.

They're about in the Whiteboard game.

But the coaches never stand down.

They're always under the radar.

Yeah.

And I think there's a little bit in that.

You know, I look at the two,

you know, Andrew McDonald in Australia.

I love the way that he operates.

He's just under the radar.

You know, Gattongam, we've passed my call and call them.

They're so well known because of their careers.

So well, they're the two coaches that get talked about more than any other.

And these under the radar coaches,

the South African coach under the radar.

Yeah.

The coaches that provide that.

The coaches support stuff.

It's interesting.

I don't know if you know this story.

But when Indian players, after they were,

I think of the T20 World Cup or one of them,

when they got a big bonus for winning it,

the players and the coach got the bonus.

And it was slightly lesser amount for the support staff.

And Rahul Rabid said, no, I'm support staff.

And he refused the higher amount because he said the coach is support staff.

The coach is not a lead.

The coach is support staff.

So I should get the bonus that the support staff get,

not what the main player gets.

Right.

The coach is always support staff.

And I get along very well with Gattongam actually.

For some reason, we get along.

I mean, I messaged him.

I said, God, there was not your fight anymore.

Does he smile?

No.

No.

It must be behind the scenes.

It must be like persona.

All his heroes are from the armed forces.

Left to himself who'd have joined the army.

Is that right?

Yeah.

That's all his heroes are.

I mean, I messaged him.

I said, it's not your fight anymore.

Got them.

I have to say in, you know, what he's doing at KKR.

Yeah.

In the IPL.

You know, look at what he's doing in T20 cricket.

You get it.

He gets it.

He complains.

The LSG auction.

Fantastic auction.

LSG big, just the right players.

You want one.

You want eight batters and six ballers.

Yeah.

The team of 11.

Yeah.

And that's what he's put together there.

Yeah.

He's a smart operator with the white ball stubbornness.

He's got plenty of talent to work with.

Right, let's just prediction for the final word.

I'm sorry for that.

I just can't see anyone.

I just got to be.

I just say, with no chance to be beaten.

With New Zealand, I thought the England game was the final.

But with New Zealand, you never know.

I'll tell you why last year.

Are you happy with another final being in the Medved?

Or should it be in Chennai?

Should it be here in Mumbai?

I know it's political.

No, I love it to be in Mumbai.

It's just that there's 120,000 people who turn up there.

But the atmosphere that Mumbai gives you.

Or even the Chinaswami in Bangalore.

Yeah.

There's not a lot of games.

But the atmosphere that it gives you.

And I think the players just feel empowered by that atmosphere.

It can be intimidating.

I remember talking.

Do you know what they call Luke Ronkey?

Yes.

Luke Ronkey played his first season for Mumbai Indians.

He's walking into bat at the Wankei.

He said, I was in a days.

I was just looking at everything.

I was in the Mumbai Indians for the first year.

And he said, I was just in a days.

I think it can intimidate the opposition when you come in.

Even if they've played before.

Yeah.

But I think India have to start favourites for that one.

And again, I'll ask you in the final.

And it's a much talked about debate here.

And is it going to be red soil?

Or is it going to be black soil?

Black soil generally is a bit slower.

And spins red soil is a road.

What we're going for?

India want a road.

Indian.

That means it'll be a red soil.

The Indian team is structured.

So you're selling me India won't get what they want.

No, they'll get what they want.

That's all right.

I know it's an ICC tournament.

But I mean, if you're playing a final at Lawrence.

And England are playing against somebody.

And England have a very good seam attack.

You'd expect there to be.

I agree.

I have no issues with the home advantage.

Next year, the World Cup in South Africa.

If it's an India South Africa final, I'm not complaining.

If it's a lovely, if it's a seeming track.

Because home advantage is legitimate.

Is it anything wrong?

Stick to cricket is brought to you by backpack.

Hasha, we finished these shows with some community questions.

Hello.

You're good?

Great.

That's cool.

I love how he just goes off and does these conversations.

I'll just lie on these.

And that's going to go on there.

You'll be on there too.

Come in and say hello to the camera.

Just come in and say hello.

That's fine.

I'll write you a train as I've got some of those.

Yeah, that's pretty cool.

Some community questions, Hasha, to finish with.

Who do you think has been the player of the tournament ahead of the final?

I've been so many great individual performances.

But how many players have consistently taken their team over the line?

Look at Will Jackson.

He's taken you over the line.

Even yesterday, he comes in and bulls those off breaks.

Will Jackson.

Sanju Samson, two in two.

Two in two.

Sanju Samson, two in two.

When it's mattered most.

Normally, you look at the team that have made the semifinal.

I guess you're looking at that.

But if you cannot pick a player of the tournament,

it means it's been a good tournament.

I have to say, Will Jackson had a fantastic semifinal as well.

If I had to pick one player who's been the consistent player across all the group stages of suprates,

and obviously semifinal, it took a great catch to get him out in the semifinal.

It did.

And you can't look at Will Jackson.

The IPL auction was this week.

And what he's done in the last four weeks, his number.

I didn't know.

I mean, Jacob Bethel is a generational player.

He's incredible.

He's now got 100 and all three formats in the space of six months.

If I was in the England camp, before the game, I'd go up the job for Archer and just shake him.

And say, Archer, can I get you angry?

I don't want you to bowl those doubly, doubly slower ones.

I don't want to be played for Mumbai.

I just overheard this.

I don't know whom I allowed to say it.

The presentations over Roy Chalmers, captain of Mumbai Indians, they've lost Archer's been hit.

And he's telling someone in our language.

He said, yeah, he bowl so fast.

Why does he bowl these slow ones?

Can you please tell him not to bowl these slow ones?

Well, I reckon he's slower bowl has gone for plenty in this world cup.

I just shake him out, make him angry.

But it means a wonderful talent.

He bowls some tremendous spells in the ashes.

It's great to see him back playing.

But I just don't think he hits the stumps often enough.

You know, bummer, what does he say?

I know he's a different cannibal, but always ever stops.

I think Joffra bowls good Yorkers.

You know, every time I get him, just continually ask or tell about it.

By the way, I can still eat his stumps.

You're the captain.

Get into his mind.

Yeah.

Get into his mind.

Generation.

What a play.

Anyway.

So, maybe I'm still actually going for Bill Jackson.

Yeah, Bill Jackson, I think, is my choice.

Best bowl in performance.

I've been so many games.

I should have prepped before coming.

So, best batting, best bowl in, I mean, I would say...

Best batting, they've been so many.

Sandhu Samson, there's been Fin Allen.

There's been Harry Brook going up to number three.

There's been Patumni Sanca.

Yeah, yeah.

Who got that brilliant 100?

Yeah.

So, they've been so many great batting performances.

It's a batting game.

Yeah, it is.

I would choose...

I'd choose Harry Brook's 100 against Pakistan on that pitch.

Yeah.

I thought that was a special in things.

It was a tricky wicket.

You know, the rest of England, but...

Was he Shankishan against Pakistan?

Yeah.

77 or 40, but that had...

Yeah, 100 on that pitch.

That Harry Brook under.

In that moment of the World Cup, when the rest of the bat

was what was 64 for eight.

Yeah, and that for me is this time in Jake.

Jake had best of Fin Allen in semi-final, the pressure.

But two really good pitches.

So, I'm just going to choose Harry Brook.

Best catch.

Philips.

Axe and Patel took two.

There's always a match.

There's always a pitch.

And a drop catch in the semi-final.

How on earth did he drop?

Maybe he got there too quickly.

I reckon he went for the mayo.

The soup of...

Yeah, couldn't be.

What I remember this though...

It's a number of catches that have been dropped.

But yeah, the...

The Occupatel catch to Harry Brook.

Will go down in Indian cricket folklore

like a couple days catch of Viv Richards and 83 Finals.

This is a good one for you, Ash.

So, we've covered the T20 World Cup.

You've been around cricket, as I said before, for over four years.

In five years...

So, you've got eight five year blocks of your casting career.

Which has been your most favorite.

2001 to 2005 by a long margin.

Really?

India coming out of all the match-fixing troubles.

Yeah.

And I remember...

I've told this story before.

I remember getting an email from somebody saying,

please tell me such an is not involved.

If he is what's left.

And then we saw these outstanding individuals bring trust back.

Raul Dravid, VVS Lakshman, Saurav Gangoli,

Sachin Tendoka, Ranil Kumbhle, great human beings,

great people, very secure in who they were.

Not once did a player in that generation come up to me

and say, I didn't like what you said on air about me.

You were invited to their weddings?

Because you knew there was trust.

And that was the period India started the turnaround

of competing overseas.

Through the 90s, India didn't compete overseas.

Whereas in that generation, they started to compete overseas

and laid the base for the next generation.

It was so much fun, that generation.

Is it hard to get trust these days?

Yes.

Because of social media.

Yeah.

Impossible to get.

Because the players are social media entities themselves.

Yeah.

Well, it's their brand, isn't it?

Yeah.

It's...

I mean, Asia Cup Final, there's a gentleman with a trophy waiting there

and the Indian players are making reels for Instagram.

Yeah.

Their share price value, which is their individual brand,

goes up with the more following.

Yes.

So it's very difficult to get trust anymore.

Because each of the journalists is now being measured on likes

on how many mentions.

So they're looking for anything that is salacious.

So it's very difficult to get trust.

Yeah.

I guess that's only ever going to get worse, isn't it?

It's not going to go back to the old days.

I fear.

Yeah.

I fear.

And with the AI, there'll be a lot of figs coming through as well.

How do you do?

I mean, in India, I come all the time and I go on crit bulls and chat

and then suddenly I wake up the morning after.

And I look at some quotes that I've supposed, some of the quotes are true.

And obviously I'm not scared of safe.

But then you suddenly read some quotes.

You know, I didn't say that.

Yeah.

How do you deal with that?

It's happened a long time ago.

It's happened to me as well.

You never get into a scrap with such people.

Because that is what, that is their oxygen.

They want a scrap.

And then they go around in their colony saying,

you know what, Michael Vaughan got back on me.

I got after Michael Vaughan and that is their wild thing.

So you just never let...

In social media, there's a ship passing by every 30 seconds.

And their ship will pass, too.

Just let it be.

Put on a coat of skin on you every day and just let it be.

But it can't be easy.

You know, it's tough.

It's tough.

Those in India more than...

It's very, very difficult.

More than in the UK or Australia or New Zealand.

I miss reading my mentions on Twitter.

But you can't anymore.

Have you cleared that out?

No, I just don't read it.

Because a lot of it is falsehood.

A lot of it is personal attacks.

Twitter has become a very, very difficult medium to be on.

You need it.

But it's...

We've now got to a stage.

We've got to use social media the way you want to use it.

I love the way you do it.

You just start a fire and then you sit back and watch.

I love that.

I love how you're able to do that.

I get a few hours in Mumbai where I'm a little bit bored.

So long days I try and just trigger a little bit of something.

But it's very, very difficult social media now.

Last, next Indian superstar thing we've spoken about him.

Wave of?

Yeah.

His challenge will come not on the field but off it.

Do you worry about that?

Very much about what?

About the number of friends he'll suddenly discover he has.

The number of relatives he'll discover he has.

The people falling all over to give him money.

To give him a sense of power.

Give a man money you've discovered how good he really is.

Give a man power and you find out who he is.

And in Indian cricket we give money and power in abundance.

I hope we don't lose him to money and fame.

That's a genuine risk.

It is the biggest challenge.

It'll be a bigger challenge for him than the challenge of an opposition bowler.

We've lost pretty sure.

I hope he comes back.

Young kid.

I hope he comes back.

But we lose players to fame.

They're mega stars.

And is it because they lose the hunger?

It can happen.

Of course it can happen.

If the conversation is about solidaires.

If the conversation is about private jets.

I liken it a lot to English football.

Great players.

Great players.

They're earning what?

At one.

340, 500,000 pounds.

A week?

That's not there.

Yeah, he's going to be relaxed with that.

I feel as a premiership.

Yeah.

He's spun.

Last two.

This is quite a political one.

Will we see India versus Pakistan in a test series again?

No.

Never.

You never say never in our part of the world.

But the emotions are very raw and very deep.

But even if say Australia hosted the series or England hosted it,

it's still the emotions are very raw and very deep.

But even though they play each other in a...

Because you've got to play in the ICC tournaments.

Yes.

But the ICC will test champship finals and ICC events.

They'll play that.

But they won't be a bilateral.

No.

No.

I'll say sure.

And that's the one thing that I would love to see happen.

And I think India should play it.

Because the longer the game India's got a better chance of winning.

I could just see a series in, you know,

Laws, the Oval, Birmingham.

You can sell out everywhere.

You play India versus Pakistan in Ulan Batur.

We sell out.

Harsh, brilliant for join.

I'm going to finish with one and I kind of prime on it yesterday.

Okay.

I want you to...

And you've been around the block.

I want you to pick your greatest ever test 11.

From people I've seen.

People that you've seen commentate on.

Home in a way not just India.

Because otherwise you don't know how would Vinuman God was.

Yeah.

You have no idea how would Vijay Merchant was.

In a rein-affected English somewhere in May 2000 runs.

You know how good...

No idea how good Vijay Merchant was.

We only read about them.

Even Bishan Bedi and Prasanna.

We've read about them rather than actually broadcast them.

I'll start 83 onwards before spinners are gone.

Yeah.

Gavaskar.

Gavaskar.

Suni Gavaskar.

We're in the Sevag.

Sevag.

Sevag was pushed...

You know that there was a combination.

There was a combination.

Yeah. Gavaskar in Sevag.

Ganguly told Sevag,

Your far too good not to be in my team.

Your far too good.

He said, but where are you going to get in?

He said,

How are you going to make the side?

But your far too good not to be in the side.

2002 in England.

He goes and opens the batting in test cricket for the first time.

So, Gavaskar Sevag.

Drove it.

Tendulkar.

Koli.

Are you putting any overseas players in this?

Oh, I thought you said Indian team.

That's so far.

We'll get in there.

In there.

Koli 5.

Koli 5.

Yeah.

Rishappan 6.

Rishapprika.

Yeah.

Koli 5.

Koli 5.

Yeah.

Rishappan 6.

Rishapprika.

Rishappan 6.

Everyone tells me what a great keeper Kermani was.

Lovely and such beautiful soft hands.

I love Rishappan.

But Dhoni.

Or Rishapp.

I think invite ball cricket.

No comparison.

In test match cricket.

So, it's as cricket we've got.

Rishapp.

Before you go down.

Left-hander 6.