Leafs Hour: Matthews Injury Fallout

All right. Let's get her going here. Brand new week. Real Kipper and Bourne show.

We're live on sports at 360. If I have 90 to fan in Toronto, streaming always on sports

that plus also available Spotify Apple podcast and YouTube. Nick Kipper-O's Justin Bourne,

Sammy McKee, Jake The Snake Shultz, Derek Brandale with you for the next two hours.

Toronto Eight Beliefs climbing in the standings. Awesome.

Which isn't I think music to Sammy's ears or you JB. And I think we're going to have a discussion

on that. I think we are. I'm ready. Toronto Eight Beliefs with a big win. Oh,

Gays the Minnesota wild. Three out of a possible four points over the weekend. Buffalo and

Minnesota. Minnesota. Two pretty good hockey clubs. Yeah, leaves going toe to toe with them.

The pride is back boys. Where do you begin? If you're talking about a tank perspective,

it was going so swimmingly. Yeah. Oh, it was set back to back against many and everyone

else behind you. They were fast asleep. Even in the ducts game, they were getting

filled in as usual. The shots were out of whack. Everything was going perfectly. No one was

competing. No one was trying. And then public enemy number one, Radco-Gutus, came in and

ruined the leaf stack with one knee. What an observation. It's true. What happened? That's

no way you thought when you saw that when he's I'm going down, it was like, oh, this is really

good for the tank. If they're over mad, it was. We won't play the rest of the year. They've lost

their best players being out. Definitely for me, I was like, that is it. That's going to help

the loose game. Everybody said that. Yeah. Everybody said, oh, now record without them. Yeah, okay.

I mean, you don't actually think they're so. Yeah, so they're so. Oh, no, no, no.

Explain yourself. They are a better team with him out of the lineup. That's what you're saying.

They played differently without him out of them, without you sure about that.

And what is it? Just that we don't have the guy to score goals for us anymore,

so we just got to try harder now.

Is that what happens? I'm looking to say I think it's a stupid thing to say. I think

that they are a little less too cool for school when he's in the not in the lineup.

I think there's a little bit of a vibe that comes from him that permeates from him,

who is very cool for school. And that when he's not in the lineup, they play a much different

brand of hockey. I'm not saying it's better. It's not maybe better from the standings or whatever,

but it's definitely different and maybe a little bit harder now. That's my that's my

of the how many games he's missed in the last 10 years. That's how I feel they look. And they

are about 20 games about 100 was better with Willie out of the lineup and Matthew's out of the

lineup and Mitch out of the lineup. And they should take them all. They should play with all

American league guys and they'll have their problems. I'm not saying they're better. I'm saying

they're different and sometimes difference better. No, I do think that there is a short-term

burst and I've long said this that comes from superstars being down. Guys getting elevated. That's

what you're seeing right now in general is you're seeing Bo Grul push to prove he's relevant. Jacob

Quill and pushed him. He's proved he's relevant. You're seeing Dakota Joshua try to keep his job.

Matthias Michele try to keep a job. You're seeing everyone going. They all got something to play for

individually. Last night on the broadcast. You said I do. These guys are private independent

contractors and they're all working and they're and they're scrapping for sure. Now the question is

is like if you're Brad tree living, let's just assume he's back next year and the decision maker.

How much stock do you put in the last 15 games? Zero. Yeah, as you should put in almost zero. I

agree. I agree. It's great that you can pad your stats maybe and if you're in a position to

convince other teams that you got a chance to go and do some great things. Yeah, just let me know.

But I can't go back with this group. I can't go back on my thought process that is heavily skewed

towards the last 15 games of the season. I can't. I think the other aspect of the Matthews without

Matthews last two games that cannot be overstated enough is that they are totally playing guilty

and they are full of shame about what happened against the ducks. They're finishing every check.

There's every scrum like they're just in the mix. They're playing harder. They're trying to look

aggressive like they just they have a look that they haven't had all year because they feel guilty

about what happened. They're completely shame. Shouldn't they have felt guilty that they took one

of the easiest schedules in the NHL for any team and like flushed it down the toilet by November.

They weren't getting publicly where was the guilt. So you're saying that the the Toronto media

that everybody claims runs people out of town was actually too easy at that time. Yeah. Yeah,

I think that there's a real case to be made. What's happening right now is there's plenty of stories

of famous athletes being unfaithful to their wives and then buying them giant diamonds shortly after.

And then if you cut your vision off here, you see an athlete going, oh, he buys her diamonds. What a great guy.

Or you could remember how you got there in the first place. And that's these leaves. They're buying us diamonds.

But we know why we're here. You're the relationship guy on our show. Everything always comes back to a relationship.

Yeah. Well, listen, it's bangles. So they're they're buying themselves out of this thing.

This is their attempt to be like, Hey, I'm we're I'm a hard worker. I'll fight. I thought Luke Shen.

Oh, it's not great. Great. Great. I'm sorry, buddy. What was that? Look what I can do. Look what I

want you for you. Right off the bench. I just not want to do that all year long. And off the bench

fights. One of the tougher guys in the league and Luke Shen for just no reason seemingly. What is happening?

Look what I can do. It's just near round. And this is what it's like. This is the new me, baby.

And they're clearly really not talented right now in the bottom half of the lineup. They've

called up a bunch of minor league guys or whatever. But they're more talented at the bottom of the lineup.

Well, I mean, I like wow a lot of like lot and a lot like those guys played a ton of guys that are

okay. That's what I meant. Okay. They're just you can't tell me they weren't not not trying

so harsh. But then that stretch before Matthew got hurt. They looked so awful. And people are like,

they just have no talent on this team or whatever. They weren't trying as hard as they've tried

the last three games. I'll fully say that. They were not locked in like they're locked in the

last three games. Is that unfair? No, I agree. It seems like forever since or lots happened between

our last show and today. Gord Selic was nice enough to fill in for you for Friday. So we have

not been together since all the three of us since Thursday. All that's happened now is

Matthew's has been lost for the season. Gouda's gets suspended five games. The Leafs are winning

like right. So where do you want to start just on again that the whole you know Gouda's

situation? Where do you want to pick up? I'll I'll show it out. Hey guy, you guys know I read

Anthony Petrille quite a bit. It may believe hot stove. He made an analogy, cut it back to

do you remember when Milan Luchich ran through Ryan Miller? Sure. And that was I believe it was 2011

or something like that. And no one did a thing about it. They just let Luchich skate off the ice.

Paul Gostad was on the ice. And after the game Gostad said it was embarrassing. And they said to

Lindy Paul Gostad said this was embarrassing. And Lindy goes he was on the ice. You know it's like

and then after that Buffalo kind of ripped itself apart internally. And this is a big moment for

the Leafs. This Matthews thing is a big moment. It is Will Matthews himself be upset that there

was no support from the team? Will the does it change the perspective of how you feel about some

of the tough guys? The follow up to Matthews be upset is like when Matthews have done that for

anybody else. That's, you know, I've seen that a few places too. That's out there a lot. Well,

that's like, I mean, doing the hockey dressing room test. That's the not like that's the number one.

Like Neelander gets a knee and Matthews is on the ice. He's going to fight. That's good. And

I'll stand by that when you talk about whether you're you have decent culture or bad culture,

it's it's not the guy inside the jersey you're doing it for. You're doing it for the jersey.

And that's a big difference. And that is that's non-negotiable. What do you mean in this instance?

What do you? I mean, you're saying I'm saying regardless if it's Austin Matthews regardless

if it's a guy that doesn't do it for you. You still have to have the right. Right.

The make up, the fabric that that's what you're supposed to do regardless of who it's for.

Yeah. If that guy is wearing the same uniform that you're wearing,

getting in there is non-negotiable. So it could have been bull grew. And you still should have

been flying in there because it's one of your hundred percent. Yeah. And that's that's where I

begin and end whether or not that, you know, Matthews wouldn't have done it for you. So you shouldn't

do it. No, no, you do it for anybody that is wearing that jersey. Yeah. That's what you do. Yeah.

And now you want to go deeper on, did they really feel that way? Maybe you've got some sort of

conversation to say, was there anything that led to that moment where they just don't feel close

enough to each other to have a natural instinct to get in there? I'll tell you that to me is a

conversation. To me, I am someone. So, Kip, you and I are wired differently. I am someone who is

more hesitant to get into that sort of stuff and was as a player and wish I wasn't and something

I tried to as I got older, I felt more confident in those situations. But you're always kind of

looking at it and you're looking at Willie and you're looking at Mo and those guys who aren't

fighters and going like, was it on purpose? You know, like, I don't really know. I didn't really,

you know, when all of a sudden the moment kind of passes as opposed to you where you just go and

I listen to the Kitchuck brothers on their podcast today, talk about how if it's your best player,

if it's whatever and a guy gets bumped, you're going flying in there or whatever. I think the

least have a lot of guys who just aren't wired like that. I got no problem with that in terms of

it's not good. It's not great, but that then now it comes back to Brad tree living. Yeah.

Because you were the guy that was going to fix the DNA. You're going to get those guys,

the snot, all of it. And when push came to shove, you're telling me they're the wrong guys for

that situation. Yeah, I am. And I'm sorry. It falls on Brad then. Yeah. Brad tree living. That's

your responsibility that those guys, you don't have the right guys out on the ice. Yeah.

No, that's not. And that's not an ostomatious thing and it's not a mocheli thing and it's not a

willy thing. It's just maybe a little bit more snot to our game. Maybe they may made it clear

a long time ago. I'm not that guy if you're looking for it. Yeah. I will sit here and continue to say

that I am stunned that Riley did nothing. Yeah. Riley, the one to me of all the guys in the ice,

I am still surprised to this moment that he, like he's not a tough guy. He's not a fighter,

but he's always really great thing. But there must be something there because there was for Greg

and Ottawa. There was something there. He's always been sort of willing to get his nose dirty in

these situations. Like he's been in tons of scrums. He's willing to do this. And to your point

about them, maybe not feeling connected or them being like a true team, a huge part of it is,

they're just until that moment, they had been fast asleep for three weeks. They're not playing

competitive games or getting filled in every single night. Yeah. And when the moment called

for them to come together as a team like any playoff team would or any team in a race would,

they just didn't have the capability. And I'm not excusing it. It's horrible. But I just don't

think they were locked in at that moment. No, they weren't locked in. They weren't paying attention.

They weren't focused. Totally agree. We mentioned tree living. That's baroubi to me. You know,

if you are you trying to win games or not. And if your team isn't locked in, that's that's

partly on the coach that we're just sleepwalking through games and you're not ready to react accordingly.

We heard from Craig Baroubi on our show last night. And he's any reference that he's been trying

to tell them this all season long. That was in him. That's stood out. That stood out for me.

Okay. So if you're Craig Baroubi and I just said you got the wrong guys,

that statement is kind of lending itself towards. I don't have the right guys. So he's like,

I'm pressing the button. There's not responding. And it's not connecting. So that in itself to me is

a bit of a red flag that maybe is between Brad and Craig.

And you know, freeged his headlines on Saturday. And I love that because it was all about the

Leafs, which really made me love it. But he was talking about how big of a deal that was.

And like how much people have talked about it or whatever. And I've seen some push back to it

being not as big a deal maybe as people have made it out to be or whatever. But

it's a signature. That's exactly right. It's a cherry on top of what's been a pretty crappy

Sunday for 10 years here. I got to think that if we look back 10 or 15 years from now to that

core four or whatever you want to talk, whether it's Mitch here or not, Mitch, that's the number one

thing that people are going to remember is that your captain went down and you guys did nothing.

I think to me, it's almost like the ribbon on the finished crap gift. It's a defining moment.

It's it's over now. To me, you call it the final nail. You know, this thing is is done.

So I don't know, like by the way, the fact that the agent put out that strongly worded

response, I don't think he puts that out if the client doesn't feel strongly about it too.

Oh, and then it gets followed up by another client who happens to be regarded as the best player

and the most powerful voice in the game, Connor McDavid falls up. So I think there's

there's certainly a game plan. Let's just say between the agent and the two stars to say,

and I don't mind it. You know, I don't mind it because they're not coming out pissed off. They're

just coming out as maybe we should revisit the way this thing works. No, no, he is no question.

But Judd, I appreciate him, but like his voice doesn't carry anything compared to Connor coming

out the other day and just saying that we need to maybe look at this. Do you want to, I mean,

probably going to play it in the national hour. Yeah, play it. We'll play it a couple of times.

It's big. Derek, if you could put the Connor McDavid clip I put it in there, if you could play that for us.

Yeah, you know, I think I think the player safety has done their best. It's not an easy thing to do.

You know, with that being said, I think that there is reason to take a look at how the whole process

works, you know, if every time there's a suspension, everybody complains about it, well, why don't we

take a look at the process and figure it out if there's a better way to make sure that both parties

are happy because it seems like there's a lot of frustration there. So we'll pick it up in the

national hour when it comes to McDavid and how it may affect him moving forward. But in the mean

time, you know, from a leaf perspective and Austin Matthews, how do you think he views of it?

How's where do you think his view is today on whether it's the league or the way my teammates

responded or didn't respond? Yeah, so I think it's that part that he'll care about. Like a

does Matthews care if Gouda gets five games or eight games? He plays for Anaheim and the other

division. They're not going to see him, you know, maybe I guess there's one more game with them

on the 30th. But like, do you think he actually hears about that? Do you think McDavid? I don't

so how about that suspension? If it's a guy who's not red co-goudist, do you think it's more than five?

Definitely not, right? Like it's just definitely not like it's just any other player. It's it's like the

Goudis amplifier. It should be more than five. Definitely should be more than five. I don't disagree

with that. I don't. And I'm not saying that he needed to get 10 or 12, but I think the league missed

a bit of an opportunity to send an easy message to a guy who's reckless. He's hurting that stars.

You can't take our best players. People pay a lot of money to go see these guys and you can't

be reckless. So here's another three or four games. Give them eight or nine. And we're good.

Everybody's good. No one's going to come back and say, oh my god, that was crazy. Yeah,

don't, but it kind of treated them like a first time offender. Whether it's three, four, five,

we're in the ballpark of first time offenders. Yeah, three, four, five. Yep.

We've been coming in here for five years doing this show and you've managed to keep me guessing

those five years, Kipper. And I'm stunned to hear you say that. Why? I thought you would definitely

we're going to come in here and say that. That was an appropriate suspension. I'm stunned by that.

I agree. It's good. I know. Good is who put out Sydney Crosby in the Olympics and then

did the same thing to Austin Matthews. But do you also agree that that's not nearly as much

of an impact on Matthews, whatever the number is, just get it somewhere appropriate. And then

it kind of doesn't matter. Like to me, it's way more about what the Leafs did, what the Leafs do

now. Like the actual suspension thing, that's a totally separate issue to me. That is okay.

Are we redoing department of player safety? Fine. But this Matthews thing is separate from

department of player safety. That's a team thing. That's a who relationships leadership. Do you

think he wonders today? Austin, where were they? I don't know. Do you think there's some guilt in

his part? Because he's like the fact that Eastern County tied the four foreign fights. I hope

there's a little bit of Austin going before I judge my teammates for what have I done

at this point or not done to maybe put myself in a position where they need to second guess coming

in to help me. And you know, like it's just I can't get over the fact that it hasn't come up

at some point. You saw Rasmus Dulley in fighting recently. See Eastern Cowan's and gets in their

Jackson LeCone. Like over your course, you're clear. I even talked about how that's not my thing.

But I did it every year just because I felt like I should and your teammates expect you to

and that's kind of part of the thing. It's crazy to me that there was never a moment where Matthews

had to do it where, you know, we did do it once. But it was horrible.

McDavid kind of fought whoever it was the other night. Yeah, got the heart of the last

and the Dallas stars player. Like, there's just moments where it comes up. But it's never for

Willie. It's never for Mitch. Yeah, never for Tavares. The one thing. My biggest complaint

on Austin Matthews. And you guys have heard me from day one is it's never been about his talent

or his inability to not be as great of a playmaker as I would have liked to.

My biggest thing with him is he's non-confrontational in a confrontational game. Yeah. And

all the stars are willing and it's not fighting. It's not dropping your glove. It's not wrestling

with anybody. It's just having that aura that when you go into a room or you go on the ice or

you go into a scram that you're you've got a presence. Can I make a comparison? He has no presence

in any type of situation other than shooting a puck in the net. And it's not enough when you

wear a sea. You got to get in there. You got to tell a guy on the other team. You know,

we're coming after whatever it is. Conor is confrontational. He's willing to stick his nose in

there. He's willing to say stuff in the media. He's willing to yell at his teammates as he did in

the playoffs. You don't get any emotion out of Austin at all. Two guys who don't fight who could

be what Austin could do is Leon dry, Ciddle and of getting Malkin dry, Ciddle just about

slashed petrangelo in half with this hockey stick in a playoffs game. A few coming out of their

you know why he's not going to fight anyone either, but he's also got don't touch me. Just,

you know, like just F off. And that's good enough part of what has been missing for Austin and

maybe just maybe if it kind of connect the dots, it led him to this situation. Yeah. Yeah,

I mean, maybe it's it could be part of it. So now I guess the question is like, you know,

Elliott's talking about now they can talk to him and talk about. No, they're always going to

talk to him. I thought they were going to talk to him now. Please, the conversation with or without

this environment is where is your head? Do you want to be here? Look at our team. Look where we're

at. Are you want to you with us or against us here? But you know what's crappy is that if you have

good solid leadership that's going to be here, you can go to him and say, what are we getting for

our money here? Are you going to be better next year? Do you have more to give us? I guarantee you

that ain't happening. I know it's that conversation is not happening because it'll only screw you

over and it'll take less leverage out of your situation. But this is the core for all along where

you've had to lay down and say, tell me tell me what you're going to do. I know. Tell us what

we get from you, please. Instead of being able to say, here's the way you were doing your way

where you said, just, you know, what are we getting for our money's worth? It won't lead you to

anywhere except it's too late for that. You know, it's too late. But it could have been something.

Oh no, you're 100% right. You're your instincts on that. And it should have been part of the buildup

in year two, three or four. And you could have used any example either on the ice off the ice,

the way you treat your negotiations. What does this do to Mitch? What does it do to Willie? What is

it? It's your team. Do you guys want to sit there and be jealous of each other? Do you want to

challenge each other on who can get what? For how many years? We're never going to win. And

Brendan kind of did that five or six years ago when he kind of came out in public and said,

you know, we're going to all have to take a little less. And they snapped on them. Austin,

you know, that's what an agent's are for. You remember that? I don't remember that specifically.

That's what Brandon's part. That's what Austin told basically Brandon. Yeah,

and the media. Yeah, but that's what agents are for. And it's like, but Brandon was also talking

about a time when you could just spend as much money as you want it with no salary. It was

like, it didn't like, it wasn't a perfect situation. It wasn't perfect. Yes. But it kind of showed

their cards a little bit. All of them on where this thing was headed. And, you know,

both Willie and Mitch holding out for different lengths. They didn't get here by accident, right?

It was there was there was a there was a trail. Yeah. All right. Anything last night.

Well, no, I mean, where? We didn't exhaust this. Have you heard anything on the extent of

the injury from Matthews? Because not only what's the matter? He's done. He'll be ready in

September. What do you need to know? I want him to train. What do you need to know? Well, I just

I know it's just it's gone really poorly here. No, this is what you're worried about.

This is what you're worried about. It's just the season from hell. Like, it's just really, really

a just a franchise changing horrible season from hell. Wait, there's more. Like, they're not

going to get a pick. Here's them somehow trending towards potentially getting into the top five.

Okay. Right? Oh, yeah. Where they were playing like crap. They were fast asleep.

Then having a moment that maybe makes your superstar center question his teammates and

not just ability to train. And doesn't want to be here anymore. And not only does that happen,

it galvanizes the group to the point where now they're like starting to try hard and may win

some games so that they get out of that position where they're able to get a top five pick.

So that you give that number seven or eight pick to your division rival who you have lost every

single trade with and have really lost every playoff series too. I can't imagine a worst.

Like, you can't just have a stock bad year. It has to be the worst possible year ever.

It's crazy how bad it is. And people don't make no sense. What do you mean?

What I just said is make it. He said no. How how we got here, right? Doesn't make any sense.

It didn't seem likely. You can't win when you're supposed to and you can't lose when you're

supposed to. No. Anything on the ice. By the way, Matthew's a surgery. Do we think it's likely

or not likely? Again, it doesn't matter. Well, if he has it, if he doesn't have it, he'll be fine

for September. Can I say something? It wasn't exactly picking up pace as his career went on here.

I don't love knee injury at age 38 or 38. It's old. I look 30 age 28. It feels like

I've aged to be 38. They'll be fine. You think he's in a prime of his life right now. 28, 29,

prime. The knee's going to be fine. Okay. I'm just saying you're in these like

you think slide down the mountain like Lindsay in the Olympics for goodness sakes.

Wow. Okay. This is these probably fine. They were just open a tank. Yes. Yeah. I mean,

there was pretty interesting them. The guy who was the most secretive ever with. And

you're not playing when they drop that like right before they gave it. It's just hilarious.

Something tells me that actually Craig Brewery might be enjoying like his coaching style a lot

better with a lineup like this. Yeah, he's like, listen to me. They're thrilled to be here. Right?

Yeah. Maybe that's got something to do with it too. You got some hungry guys out there.

Do you want to break? And then we can get to the guys and get in on. Are these guys viable?

Help. All right. Did you want to mention that Bobby and Gana's five points in his first two games

as a Seattle Kraken? Five points. Yeah. Eight shots playing 18 to night. As Seattle said that

we would have given them a first. I mean, definitely going to wait till the last possible minute

and get a second for them. That's a good move. Just like that. We've sold nothing. Nothing

and we're not even halfway through yet. Well, we'll talk. Well, we're definitely halfway through.

We'll talk about the, we'll talk about both grew after the break. Okay. Groozy,

more when we return. Real Kipper and more. Hey, it's Matt Marquez and I'm Mike Fuda. We're

discussing the top stories of the day across the NHL and the hockey world weekdays at noon.

It's the fan hockey show on SportsNet 590 to fan and wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome back to the program. Nick Kipper is just in born. Sammy McKee. It's the leaf

hour edition of our program. We got some sound, Sammy. Yeah. So, I guess the biggest story

over the weekend was Bo Grue, I guess. JB given me a job next year on our telecast last night.

Yeah. I mean, how could you not? How can you not? Yeah. 15 meaningless games

that he's been gifted 19 minutes and I don't know. Do you judge it? Do you just sit there and go,

okay, we just said earlier, like 15 games really means nothing for other guys. How much can it

mean for Bo to make the team next year? Well, I mean, it doesn't mean nothing in terms of you

get to see him against NHL competition. And can he do things that other

fourth line guys make an $812,000 can't? The answer is that most of the Leafs in the bottom six

can't shoot it past a goalie from distance. Okay. This is where man, you are going to disagree.

Yeah, that's good. Okay. Oh, that's a snapper by boat. I'm not looking for Bo to snap it in.

I'm 30 feet out playing on my fourth line next year. You know, it totally depends what identity

you're looking for. So I would love pace and physicality on a fourth line too. What do you mean

you would like it? Then get it and demand it. Never happened. No, no, no, that's again,

that's got to change. Michael Pazetta has been here the whole year. He's got to call it up for

what two games and hits everything the moves and gets in a fight and they're like that. So don't

just fall into the same trap of having these fourth liners that go out there and think that they're

really second and third liners just waiting to buy time. Like it's enough. I look at the fourth line

over the last little while. And now I'm seeing Quillen, Lorenz, Yarn Crock. I'm like,

what do you think a fourth line does? I know. What do you like nice guys?

But like I'm watching, I'm watching Nashville. Who's that? Ozzy? Ozzy?

Why is black? Why is black? Do you see what he did to Leon dry side last night?

Smack them like a bug. All right, along the wall. I don't know about that. No, what do you mean

you don't know about that? That's like a bug. He kind of caught him in an office. He caught him

off. He is a pest. He is annoying and he's a guy. A lot of guys don't like to play against.

Okay. And he's got them all the way to three points worse than the Leafs.

That's one of four. Who on the four, who on the, excuse me? Nashville's worse than the Leafs.

But they got 67 points. The Leafs have seven. They came back. They made a they made a fight

to apply off spot. Listen, you're missing the point, Sam. All right. He's he's value. He's got value

to Nashville because he's annoying and he's a pest. Totally agree. That's your fourth line.

Okay. I think you and I are on the same page. It's the same guy that took out eastern

calendar. I do them into the post and you were so upset. And guess who did nothing about it?

Same guy. Same guy. What was the last time a Leaf guy on a fourth line did anything to annoy

anybody? Yeah, totally with you. I, you know, for years watching Keraly and Boston do it.

You know, that a charlie here who's a refrigerator of a man. That was a fun moment.

But yeah, I love that too. This is why is Bo is Bo going to do that? No, can Bo be your third line

left way where Bobby McMahon has been over the last couple of years. You're going to have to have

some guys make it eight 12. You're going to start him with your on your third line based on 15

games. I started. Robertson, Michele, Domey and Cowan on my wings this year. I'll take Bo with

any and you miss the playoffs by a country mile. Yeah, absolutely. So instead of paying one of

those guys three, let me get Bo for eight 12. Spend another two on someone. Is he going to piss

anybody off on the third line checking his job? So why would what's his job? Third lines check.

They check. They check other top players. They, they, they piss people off. One, I need one center

who can check. It's not Austin and it's not to Boris. I understand that. I want a fourth line

center that checks to I don't need a third and a fourth line and a third line left winger and

the third line right winger and I don't need six guys who run around and don't play hockey.

Some point someone's got to make a play. The leaves can't make any place. This guy's a smart player.

He's got some offensive upside. I don't love him. He doesn't play 15 minutes a night and the

third line situation. He's been. Anaheim said, no. Then he goes to the New York Rangers. He

doesn't get a sniff there. He said, no, then he got hurt this year. He went to the rangers.

He's leading the American league in points. Rangers said, no. And now he's on his third team at 26.

Yeah. I'm not saying that there isn't potential value there. Could you turn him into a valuable

everyday player that could potentially get you a third round pick maybe next year or fourth year?

Maybe. I'm not writing him off, but I'm like, where are the expectations now for him to come in

and maybe be a fourth line guy. He's not. He's a little sandpaper in his game right now.

Is your calling guys up to see what they are? This guy has 70 playoff or NHL games at 26 years old.

He's come up and he's looked really good. Can he give him some run to make sure you don't let

Alex steves go? Can we just make sure? Yes. And if you can turn him to an Alex steves, Mike.

Sure. Good on you. Yeah. Steve's isn't punching any one of the face to be an Aussie one player.

Can you turn him into a 12 to 13th forward? That's what you're telling me. Sure. Something.

Okay. Something that you don't have to go out and buy on the free agent market. I just, I don't

know. I also think I'm okay with that. I'm all right with that. I'm just saying that that's

not those those aren't moving the needle, right? Why can't he just be like be your guy that plays

maybe 50 games and mixes in and out of the lineup and plays 12 minutes some nights and plays

eight minutes some nights. I heard them say he's like the coach of son who is a, you know, he's a

defensive conscience. He knows where he is. He's smart. I'll take one guy who's listening to this guy

talk. Okay. I cut two bow grew clips. Two. Okay. Two knows clips. Oh, no, it's clips. Listen to his

on a how about clip one. Please Derek on it. Yeah. I felt really good. I thought I had a really

tough first beard. I was behind the play. I was, I got, I was surprised by their, by their speed

on and seeing their execution and came back in a second and I know how to regroup and first one

was pretty lucky. Stitchman, I had a really good shot to the net and they hit my skate and I

get it. I didn't even try to tip in honestly. So I got pretty lucky in the second one. Lucky bouncing

this lot and usually down in the American league, those, uh, those I like to shoot especially from

that area and was pretty fortunate. It went in but, uh, obviously to get the win like they scored

two really big goals off to start in the third and and we, we locked it down in the third. We had

some big block shot, big moments in these zones. Totally was really big for us in the third. So,

no, it was all around a great effort from everyone. Oh, he says all the right things. All right.

How about, how about clip two, clip two? Play clip two. Oh, no. The locking down part in the third.

Yeah, I didn't go in. Uh, clip two. Yeah, I think it's like I think I have a really good IQ and

I think in the first that I was just too slow, um, like on the ice of like my awareness wasn't

really there and my anticipation wasn't really there and I came back in a second. I was like,

all right, like, you gotta wake up and I and I woke up. I read the play really well. I just

settled down a couple of breath work and I was good to go. He's a thinker. A couple breath work.

He's a thinker. If he, if he could turn into a great story, absolutely. And I'm not saying it's

impossible, but he be careful with expectations. Yeah. Yeah, you know, he's not little. He's not,

I just think he's fine. I am curious to see. So, um, the, this, uh, sorry, this weekend,

they signed, uh, Actium of to a three year contract. Uh, this year is a, the first year is a two

way. And then after that, it's a one way contract, I think like 900,000 or whatever.

We'll have four guys under contract on one way. Is this what you gotta get rid of one? Yeah,

September. By September? Sure. That's when you, when they all have to clear waivers to start the

season. Yeah, I think hill to be is no longer waivers exempt next year. So who's, who's the odd man

out? That's the question I wanted out. Who is the odd man out? We, we did a segment last night with

Carolyn about, uh, Stolars looking absolutely terrific last night and the sole purpose of, uh,

two points. Yeah, great. And I can, no one will ever, ever question his talent or Joseph

Wall's talent, meaning, okay, what's left to question? And that is, are they reliable? Right.

So I think all three of us here don't have hill to be as the one out the door.

Is that safe, safe gas? Yeah. Yeah. I just think it's such a dangerous game to play with these two

guys. If one of them disappears, then it's like immediately you're at an act of hill to be

goal-tuning duo, right? Where if you keep these two guys, you just hope that one of them's gonna

be healthy for an extended period of time. And if you get rid of one of them, the other one's

gonna disappear immediately. That's the worry for me. Hill to be has to stay at 24 years of age.

Has to. Yeah. To me, between Stolars and Wall, if you next, I'm thinking of the next two seasons.

I don't not think you know this is a long-term play. I'm trying to get the next two seasons of good

and goal-tending. Stolars to me is competitive and wants to, wants to play and be in those moments.

I don't. And never ends up in those moments because he is, he can't trust him.

Played seven, played the first seven games of the series last year. Can't trust either.

I think that's fair. You know, on Joseph Wall too. Yeah, I mean, it's really fair.

Joseph Wall and that Boston series really let me down.

Hey, disappeared for games, Evan. And that'll always stick in the crop a lot of

and it was a, it wasn't a, it was a sore back or maybe it wasn't.

Again, I don't know where the value is out there. I don't know how teams feel about

Stolars or Joseph Wall moving forward. What kind of value out there? Who's gonna sit there and go

based on their career, based of them, you know, spending 10 years of never being healthy or never

being able to string along 50 games that someone's gonna go, I'm trading for that. That's my guy.

So who's your guy? Well, I look, read the room in terms of who's got more value in the off-season,

who's looking for if not a starting goalie, a great one B and call your shot and get the best you

can for him and move one out. I also am still skeptical, not sure what hill to be. I just, if one

of the three has to go, I guess it's one of the guys that you'd feel like you can't trust,

but I don't know that hill to be is an NHL. I definitely don't think he's an NHL starter.

Um, just a quick note on Wall. He has no, no movement protection this year and next year.

And then it kicks into an eight team, modified, uh, no trade list. And I think

Stolars has some protection. He is a list. I think he's half as any Stolars.

So you'd be able to shop, uh, I'll tell you right now, 16 team. Yeah. When they're both at their peak

and in net, I think Stolars is a better goalie. Yeah. So I mean, Stolars is as good as any

on the league when he's healthy and it's a really big gamble to make and you probably have to

bring in somebody else. I don't, I don't, I don't know who would be, but I guess maybe they

just trust hill to be. But if I'm trading one of these two guys, it's well because he probably

has more value and he's got to know, no, no trade protection. Yeah. Is there a world next year

where if you even brought those two back and even if they were to stay healthy all year?

Is there a world where, uh, you think that they make the playoffs next year just based on that?

Yeah. Well, I mean, you look at the last couple of games or it's like they get some good goal

tending and this how they won. It went 108 or took underneath point. They were better. They were

better than this. No, not marginally. They were better. They were better at protecting the

middle of the ice and, uh, they were deeper. And they had Chris Tanov and they had his best.

A lot, a lot of things went right. Their lineup was way better. That went wrong this year.

I think even if you made the decision to bring those two guys back together, it still won't be

enough to get them in the playoffs next year. Well, that alone might not. Well, to be honest,

the two of them playing like they did last season is probably enough. But the two of them playing

like that plus some other things going better. Now he's taking the step count, taking the step

10 of being back. Hopefully Matthews better. You know, it's really frustrating when you're

cheering for this team to lose. These guys are going to miss a game down this. They're going to be

red hot. They're going to be as pictures of health playing every single night, every other night

standing on their heads. Like, let's talk about the tank here. Wall was legitimately fan. Sorry,

Stolars was a legitimately fantastic last night. And wall was unbelievable against the Sabers,

like two back to back elite goalting performances. But, you know, you can't keep putting that stress

on them guys, right? They break down just alone. When the ice is tilted like that, you're

they're the worst teams in the league for giving up shots on goal. And it made, you know,

you may not be, you know, put a lot of value just in shots on goal. But it does lend that

you're the pucks in your own zone constantly. And it's like, you can't just win games like that.

It's just, it's just impossible. They will break. Of course, they'll break. Of course,

you can't. It was that's why last year's school. It's, and next year, unfortunately, let me,

it might have to be another year of full school. That might be part of it. You look at all the

teams that are on the cost of playoffs or not. And on the other side of being 30 and injury prone,

get out, get out of these deals, guys, when you can just another year old or where if he breaks

down again, you go from some value to no value. Can you go get rid of both and have hill to be

acting off or get another goalie? Are we safe to say that this is the goal-tening era where we

have the least amount of trust in any of them around the league with the exception of five guys,

maybe. This is what Caroline has been banking on forever, one of these guys.

So let's see it up, right? Yeah. So Rokin, like, there's only like three, four, five guys at the most,

the rest of them. Man, you could just totally throw all their jerseys in the middle of the ice and

pick one. The analytics guys are like, don't spend a ton on a goalie. And one of these years,

you'll just have someone figure it out. And then Nebraska plays 250 games in two years,

Neuro and wins back to back cups. So it's the best player for a lot of those games. Totally.

What do you want to talk about? Thank you. Should they commit to it here? Should they lean in? I mean,

okay, that means play acting off a couple of games. That means, you know, maybe sit out.

I got no problem with that. I got no problem with them in the 15 games saying, let's have a look

with them or let's have someone else come up. That I have no problem with. What I have problem with

is when they look for two weeks, you know, earlier, but like, can you tolerate that for a month

to get a top five player in the draft? I would throw up. But so what? You have to be logical enough to

be like, but I need to change the culture yesterday. I cannot wait another month

where people may look in here though. None of them. It doesn't matter to me. It doesn't matter

who's here, who's not here. It goes back to the Jersey and what it represents. We are the Toronto

Maple Leafs. We don't do it that way. Yeah, but you're, you're talking about

creating something that is nontangible, whatever, when you need better players, you don't have

good enough players right now. You need better hockeyman. I'd rather go get the Marley that'll

try really hard like bow. Then we do not agree. Then have them set, then have them set the culture.

You're not getting mechanical. I mean, sure could. You're not getting mechanical. Well, you're

definitely not going to get them if you keep winning games. You're one of the bottom five teams. Your

odds are pretty good for that lottery. I mean, I'm looking at the standings here. And the fifth

worst team in the league right now is the New York Rangers. No, this weekend killed the Leafs.

They killed them. They have 64 points and the Leafs scuts have 70 now. By the way, tied with

the San Jose Sharks, who are the knocking on the door. Great story in the league. They're right

there about to make the playoffs. It seems to lose a lot. It's crazy how bad that division is.

No, this weekend killed the Leafs. Yeah, they legitimately have to win three or four games or

if they're at fault, they didn't get rid of enough players at the deadline at the deadline.

Totally. Okay. That's because they've had no direction. That's no plan. That was,

that was an issue. Is that they, they're, they're still probably too good to lose a lot here.

Three weeks before the deadline, I wrote start tank. So Michele is a guy that's suddenly looked

better than he has all season long, right? Cut him loose. Yeah. Great.

So I think there's value there. Yeah. And I don't know. I'm not saying it's necessarily

for the Leafs next year. But like, I don't understand how there's

20, 15 teams that either in the playoffs or just outside of the playoffs couldn't

to use that for, I don't know, a fourth or a fifth. I don't get it. It is weird.

You know, you, you look at, and now there's a story that they're going to buy him out today.

Who? Chelly? Yeah. Michele, you're, I don't know. Do you see anything about that? No, no,

that, that they would let him walk. It was just not qualify him. Yeah.

Because he's his contract. Yeah. So that's not happening. No, you think give him a qualifying

offer and then. Brad tree living is not going to watch him walk out the door for nothing when

you just gave up homeberg. Yeah. And you just say to one of these teams, hey, Columbus,

you need a guy that's going to score you 18 goals next year. Ever since those games

have stopped mattering, he's turned it to sin. So is this the way it's going to be these

conversations for the next month? To an end tomorrow for the exact same combo. We'll see you then.

I was, uh, leave talk. Horrible.

All right. Not horrible here. We go national next. Gary Galley.

When we return, real Kipper and Born.

Yeah.