Midweek Fix: In the Home of Walter Williams the Legend | More Biden Racism

0:00Good thank you for letting us come. Okay, we sure appreciate it. We're fans genuine. I kind of feel bad at one sense because I feel like I got a backpack, a Santa Claus backpack of Legos. And I'm just about to dump them all out in front of you and have you put it all together. Yeah. When did you become a Christian? When? Yeah. Well, I've brought up in the Piscqual Church in South Philadelphia. And I think I was confirmed when I was 12. And I don't give a church that much, but, you know, I accept the doctrine. How is like your Christian faith kind of informed your economics? I don't know. I haven't given that much thought.

1:04I was just thinking maybe just a voucher not steal. That's all I'm thinking. That's not still. That's what it is. It's got so much about economics. You know, yeah, well, about Paul about the political arena. Yeah. Yeah. Because most of what government does is take the earnings of one American and give it to another American to whom it does not belong. Right. And most Americans accept that. Right. Right. And that's that's immoral. It's that. Yeah. Because if I did it privately, right, I'd go to jail. Right. So your money to buy for us to go help some farmers or poor people. I'd be accused of robbery. Right. As you. And so, so when the government does is just legalize robbery. Yeah. Right. As you have watched politics develop over your lifetime, especially the Republican party, which is supposed to be the conservative party.

2:12What's your take on the current state of the Republican party? Well, I always take positions with some of the government wallets. He said it's not down to earth difference between the Republicans and Democrats. Maybe that's an exact exaggeration. But both of the parties believe in taking your money and my money and giving it to other people. That is, I guess Democrats believe that it's okay to take your money and my money to give to cities and poor people. Right. Republicans think that is your or rate to take your money and my money to give it to farmers and bail out businesses. Right. That's right. They both agree on taking our money. They just disagree on what to spend their fortune. So, so how do you, I mean, did you vote for President Trump? How do you, how do you process who to vote for his president? I don't vote. Yeah. Really? Yeah. But I don't vote, but I'm not a bad person.

3:13At least according to my, my tax forms, I support, I not only by my share of the missiles, but I support former Republican families. Yeah. And they don't even send me father's day cards. Ouch. So, well, then how should we, I mean, should we just not vote? I mean, how? How should we? No, no, it's okay for you to have. Yeah. Do you ever vote in local elections, even for like local things? No. No, see, see, my vote does make a difference. And that is the probability of my vote changing the outcome of an election is probably 10 to the minus 100. Very, very small probability. Right. And some people might say, well, I suppose everybody felt that way. Yeah. Then, then, then I go vote. So it's kind of the rebellion.

4:13No, it's not everybody. I just said I just didn't. Would you encourage other people to be like you in that system? No. No, you encourage other people to vote. Just your conscience itself can't bring yourself to vote. No, it just, you know, it doesn't really matter. Hmm. So right now, I think, when Obama was running from president, one of the big things that they were pushing was so many people died for the right for you to be able to vote. Why would you waste especially as a black man? Why would you waste your vote not voting since? Well, the right to vote Includes the right not to vote. I mean that is it's you're talking about liberty. That is the right to vote And right not to vote in some countries is against the law or not voting right? You you have these Dictators and they they they they brag about getting a hundred percent of the vote right Because people are required to vote with the gun to their head. Yeah, wow

5:14And so so the freedom to vote it implies the freedom not to vote. Yeah when the freedom uh, I guess you know to to to be for Freedom you have to be a very proud very very brave person because you You have to accept the fact that some people will behave in ways that you think are improper. Yeah I mean the for example with the true test of one's commitment to free speech Does not come when he allows people to be free to say those things with which he agrees right the true test comes when he allows people to say those things They find it's despicable. Yeah, and the same thing with freedom of association Right The true test ones commitment to freedom of association doesn't come when he allows people to associate and ways that he thinks right They should they come when he allows people to associate and ways that he finds despicable. Yeah What grade would you give Trump in his first four four years as president? Well in terms of the economics I give him a

6:23I give him a B Oh, that's a high That's better than I thought well, I think in terms of a Advocating for the tax cuts Which has enriched our economy? Yeah made almost every American better off and then the the deregulation Right that have gotten government off our backs gotten a lot of government off our backs And where I give him a failing grade in economics is the tariffs on foreign goods going into our country Wasn't that strategic plan for him though Well, maybe I don't I don't think so that is the if you impose a tariff On let's say a car a Toyota coming in the United States Right what it means is that the American buyer of a Toyota pays higher prices Mm-hmm and a lot of people say well

7:23We we will allow we want tariffs on foreign goods because other countries don't allow our goods to come in there freely Right, they put restrictions and tariffs on our goods Uh, and so what that's in a sense is saying well, it's a we're going to screw Americans if other countries screw their citizens Right, oh, we're going to keep it in there. Yeah, it doesn't make sense Like is a the way I read Trump on the tariffs at is that he's using a short-term strategy For long-term changes with you know for example China Um for for the longest time we've really Created some bad trade deals with China where we're losing in China's winning or it's in balance at minimum And so Something you negotiate is you go you go in hard you go in strong especially with dictators schools you and I were in a boat

8:24In a robot at sea And I shoot a hole when you're in my end of the boat. What are you gonna do? Not shoot a hole in my end of the boat. Well, that's what that's what we're doing That is you we say their country Look if your government screws you We're going to get even by screwing our citizens. Yeah, for example, let's say the case in Canada Canada has had for a long time tariffs against American dairy products right and uh and and that forces Uh, Canadians to pay higher prices for cheese milk and other dairy products from United States right Okay, so so what should we do in response? That is what my lot of people say well Let's put in tariffs on Canadian wood and Canadian clothing coming out of the United States right and Americans who buy houses or buy clothing they have to pay higher prices right that's like saying if Canada screws its citizens

9:31We're gonna retaliate by screwing our citizens I'd rather the people say that um look we're going to be a free country open and free country If you want to screw your citizens go ahead we're not those growers right and and I think that One a lot of the confusion lies in the fact that Uh people think that one country trades with another That's not true. That is It's not the United States Congress Trading with the German parliament right or the Japanese deit right it's The American citizen it is me walled away them Through intermediate intermediaries trading with the German producer when I bought my Mercedes right right It's not it congress didn't buy them a say these right that's it's me. I Got in deal with a German producer right and so you have to have to ask the question

10:37What is the moral case For anybody else interfering with my Trading with somebody else anywhere in the world. Yeah, right what what case can you make? For that and I can't find it. I mean it's like what case can you make for my trading with you to for to interfere with My trading with the grocery store guy at an industry right What do you make of the current the China deal that Trump just signed and the current trade relations? Well, I don't know that much about it, but but whatever reduces tariffs I think is good for the American people and then also I think another thing that we have to realize Is that we are a huge country and with that is We depend on foreign goods though in foreign market much less than other countries because we have a huge domestic market

11:38And so we can afford We can afford to take risk that other countries can't take right and so I think that the That the that the basic principle involved is that Is that we have to be We have to do those things that support the liberty of the American people Not the liberty of Congress not the liberty of the president but the but your liberty and your liberty and my liberty Those are the kind of things that need to be protected and And that's the that's the vision of the founders of our nation right if you read if you read the If you read the through the Constitution right It was really a restraint on government not on not on people right I mean if you look at the language if you look at the language of the Bill of Rights The language says Congress shall not abridge Congress shall not prohibit Congress shall not disparage They're a little jumpy. Yeah, the framers say great distrust for me and I say it's Congress. Yeah

12:42And I've often often suggested the people that That when we die And if at our next destination We see anything like a Bill of Rights we know that we're in hell Because because a Bill of Rights in heaven Would be an insult to God. Hey, man. It'll be saying that we cannot trust God right Wow, you do need a Bill of Rights in hell Do you do and if you look at the At you take take the issue of the Second Amendment. Yes, the Second Amendment was not written the founders did not give us the Second Amendment So that we can go deer and duck hunting. That's right. They explicitly said if you read that to some the arguments about at at the 1787 convention in Philadelphia They explicitly said we want the emerging people to be armed as a last resort against abusive government. Yes, sir

13:43Yes, sir, and so and so the the the the the Second Amendment is to protect us against The Congress of the United States. Yes to allow us to have at least some semblance right of the ability to protect ourselves What why how did how did you get this understanding? I mean, I I somebody people at higher education higher academia Um are have all this trust in the government the government's gonna fix it the government's gonna fix it the government's gonna fix it Just trust the government with the new program. What what's your background and how did how did you How did you come to these conclusions I Well, you're an academic. Yeah, I mean academics. You shouldn't be talking like you should be talking so much sense Yeah, he is Pretty bad. He would just with Peter Bergotian and James Lindsay who did the Hulk's papers. I don't know if you're familiar with that

14:46um, they're basically uh the the journal what are they called the peer reviewed journals here review journals they wrote a bunch of fake journals and submitted them and And applying on all the intersectionality stuff and social justice stuff and they were accepted got them accepted There's just I write articles based off of those faux papers one one paper they they took Karl Marx's manifesto and substituted feminism language feminist language throughout just changed a few words Yeah, just changed what a couple words here and there and except and it got accepted. I think one of Hitler's too Yeah, I'm a paper by Hitler yet. Yeah, yeah, well, I mean, that's the state of modern higher education Where you can write these nonsense papers and peer reviewed journals to accept them I'm just trying to find a little bit about you know, what's your background? I mean, how did how did you uh Make it through that land, you know gauntlet gauntlet

15:48Well, unfortunately, yeah, I've always been a A radical troublemaker You know, if you be looking at autobi The I I had a lot of problems when I was in the military You know court martial and okay, that I that I won and the the civil investigation committees on me and then and people are traced were We're following my wife around trying to find out whether we were subversives, you know Because I was a troublemaker and and I think that um I Think that I one of the one of the uh the great things that happened my life is that As I tell people and maybe it's not nice in me to put it this way That I got um I received most more education before became fashionable for white people to like black people Yeah, and what that means is that when when I took a class and

16:51I got a I got a C That was a honest the god C that I earned oh and when I got an a honest the god a nobody was getting a damn about my yeah poverty or discrimination sub like this thing honest with me yeah and and I think that that was a great benefit I got my doctor from UCLA in and 19 I think 69 or 60 yeah, 1969 96 1968 I took the PhD I written exam at UCLA and UCLA is one of top 12 schools in their economic department in the country at the time and 14 people took the exam and I believe 12 flunk Wow and and I went and and I was among the ones that flunk and I went to the committee to see whether I'd be thrown out of the program and

17:54Axel Landford One of the professors in the committee. He said Williams your exam was among the words But we think that you can do better And so they gave me all kinds of reading assignments and next time I'm stuck the exam I passed but The point is is that they didn't give a damn about whether I was black or white polka die that et cetera et cetera And so they they had the same expectations of me As the other students now if I'd gone to Harvard Yale or Berkeley Those more liberal schools they might have felt sorry they might have felt sorry about the The racial discrimination Right, but I would not have been as good an economist wow wow and so I so I was I was fortunate as I say As I said earlier that I was fortunate in receiving virtually all of my education before it became fashionable for white people the like black people

18:54Wow So do you think that's culturally has hurt black people yes, yes, I think that That when you things like affirmative action uh A diversity and inclusion all these things Where you uh give people you you actually lower the standards For people I think that that in the long run that does them harm But when you look at the workforce now Compared to the workforce 30 40 years ago We have way more black people in the workforce now than we ever had before we have higher education black people than we ever had before So many of my friends would point to affirmative action as working really well and the only places that we see it Uh, where black people are is because affirmative action isn't working in those fields So it seemed like those have opened up more doors for black people than is actually Hurt black people well if you look at the uh

19:55If you just look at some of the statistics around and you look at um um The the very fact that uh black kids who have a high school diploma Mm-hmm Uh a large percentage and I think it's well over 70 percent Many of them cannot read and write at the six seven the nath grade level right. Oh, they're given fraudulent diplomas. Yeah uh and uh and if you look at at You know education in our country even for white people is nothing really to write home about you but It's a disaster for black people. I mean it and and to show you to give me an idea of the disaster is that it turns out that uh across the nation incoming college freshmen

20:56uh slightly under 50 percent require remedial English remedial math and remedial writing right So that says and and they're high school graduates So that says that something is wrong with the diploma that they got yeah If you look at a city like Baltimore Baltimore Maryland It turns out and I and this is in some of my columns and other and there's a research about other people it turns out that in Some schools some high schools not a single student tested proficient In math wow and in some cases only six percent Wow tested proficient in English But nonetheless 70 percent graduate And they're they're given their diploma Well that's because they're not giving us enough money to educate our kids

21:57What what what what Dr. Williams that followed for that More money we can have more money cheers. We have smarter kids right yeah, well, I think I think uh Baltimore and Washington and you see They're the cities with I believe they might in there to top five Uh spending jurisdictions when education I think Washington gets 20 my 29,000 Per kid oh wow 29,000 per kid Wow, and that's a lot and so I'm very sure That the people in the education department in Washington they see they're hoping that Mississippi does not succeed from the union And the reason why if they did they'd be they worse in the country in terms of academic achievement wow I mean, it's it's it's really it's really bad uh So so we're big proponents of Defunding public public education

22:58Basically I have no problem with public education. I have all the all my problems with public education is the government funding it And well, I think that we shouldn't call it public education as a government education Amen I'll give you often on that one and that and and and the reason is is that The public had doesn't have a whole lot to do with education is run by bureaucrats right right And uh it's a discipleship program too. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right Well, and yeah, not only are they doing a poor job in basic education English mathematics and so on but it's training them in liberal um indoctrination I'm when I sit down with the Republican uh, you know senator or legislator or candidate I ask them about why are you funding public education? Because what you're doing is Republican is you're funding a whole System that is teaching people to vote Democrat when they graduate

24:00You're you're you're funding something that's gonna vote you out of office eventually Related to some of this like affirmative action. Yeah um, uh, you know valuing diversity over Um competence this kind of thing um is um minimum wage laws You know over and over again people claim. This is how you help the poor You help the poor by minimum wage laws. You've written a lot on this um, why don't minimum wage laws actually help the poor Well, it's uh if you I think what had what one has the start off asking Is what is the effect of the minimum wage law? and And you you see the effect of the more minimum wage law if you put yourself in the place of an employer And you must pay seven dollars and 25 cents an hour. Right no matter who you hire right Then ask yourself the question. Will you hire that worker who is so unfortunate

25:03So as to have skills that would only enable him to produce four dollars an hour worth of value That is pay seven twenty five For someone who can only produce four dollars worth of value an hour because of poor education and lack of skills Right And so they for the that the uh a profit-making employer he's not gonna do that So the initial impact of the minimum wage law is to discriminate against the employment of low skilled people Now if you could pay somebody four dollars an hour Then that person would uh have a job he could get a job and Most of us get an upgrade our skills through on the job training Right And he could eventually learn things to make a more valuable worker in the future right And then also another impact the minimum wage law that people don't uh know people don't express at all and this that is The minimum wage law is the one of the most effective tools in the arsenal of races

26:08Oh threat mankind's history Wow look that out and I discovered that If you look at my book is called South Africa's war against capitalism, okay And a number of years ago I spent time in South Africa. I spent several times in South Africa and doing research in labor markets And it turns out that white races unions in South Africa were the major supporters of minimum wage laws for blacks And their stated reason is that we want higher mandated laws They call a rate for the job law there higher minimum wage laws to protect white workers From having to compete with low skill low wage black workers Wow for example on a construction project. I think in 1971 The average wage that a white worker got for For a manual labor just general labor right unskill labor was a dollar 91 cents an hour

27:14The employer could hire a black worker to do the same thing you 39 cents an hour. Oh Wow, so what was the employer's incentives to hire the black worker right but however If you could mandate that the employer paid the black worker and the white worker the same wage Then the worker would have reduced incentive right the employer would have a reduced incentive to hire the the black worker But that's South South Africa Weren't America and our minimum wage is kind and charitable no No, how's our minimum wage looking at first you look at our first minimum wage in our country As written in 1931 as called the Davis-Bacon Act and what the Davis-Bacon Act did It mandated it on all federally finance or assisted construction projects the prevailing wage must be paid and the prevailing wage

28:15The Department of Labor determines that to be the union wage or higher Okay, and you read through the the legislative debate On the Davis-Bacon Act Well in the mainly page 65-13 of the congressional record in March 31st 1931 just read that Where the congressmen are debating About them in a wage you'll see that congressmen are All good and sub-authors say things like see that contractor over there He brings cheap colored labor up puts them in cabins and his labor of that sort that's competing with American Whites, oh, and this is why we need a Davis-Bacon Act Wow, that was when the South construction workers were coming up to the north right? Yeah, that's right They were outworking them in the day and the night and the price was comparable. I remember that Yeah, that's right And so what what they and what what after Davis-Bacon Act blacks were virtually removed from

29:17The construction industry in the north. Yeah, wow. Yeah, there's the north so fast so fast forward how our minimum wage laws still racially connected Well because if you say well Who are the low skilled workers in the American labor force? Well the most for the most part they tend to be teenagers Teenagers of low skill because they lack the matured in experience of adults right Among the teenagers are black teenagers. They not only share the handicaps of teenagers in general But they also share the additional handicap of right in schools broken families poor neighborhoods, right? So they're going to be the lowest Of the low skilled workers Yeah, and so they meant if the if the minimum wage law is going to discriminate against The employment of low skilled workers it will have a heavier impact on black low skilled workers than white low skilled workers And so now that's not that's and that's just that doesn't have anything to do with the intention

30:23That and that's that's in addition to the racially discriminatory effect the minimum wage law Yeah, I mean if you think think about it this way. Yeah, if you have a mandated minimum price Or in anything It discriminates against the lease preferred you mean for example ashes of Suppose you suppose we had a mandated minimum price on stake. Yeah, and so you had to pay 15 dollars a pound for fill a manual And 15 dollars a pound for Chuck steak. Yeah. What would you buy? Oh And so that would discriminate against the less preferred stake right name lid shock steak And the only way the truck only way Chuck steak competes with filling money on today is that it goes for lower price right and if you can't allow it to go for lower price

31:26You can see it gone you you know you you you get it hand again or think of another way Um As suppose I would ask you Suppose you see a fat old ugly So gar smoking man married to a beautiful young lady What would be your prediction about that man's income He got a very dope mouthpiece you got You guess that's pretty high. Yeah, and so what is he doing? He's selling the beautiful he's selling beautiful young lady look I can compete for your hand on the basis of a handsome guy right so I'm going to offset my handicaps right by offering you more money Right And so suppose somebody say well look is it fair For a beautiful young ladies the charge fat old ugly cigars mugmen higher prices And you might say no, it's not fair. So you make a law That beautiful young ladies can't treat fat old ugly cigars mugmen any differently than handsome men

32:31Uh-oh then what happens to the chances of They fat old cigars mugmen marrying a beautiful young lady goes to selch. Yeah But all the money just rolls up to the talk though. By me all the guys with no money just rolls up to the top though. So it worked So a Kasia Cortez out you know who she is a OC yeah She was interviewed by Tonne Tahnhossi Coats Uh this last week and in the interview She was talking about how billionaires make money off their employees and how uh, you know The employees are actually the ones doing all the work the billionaires are sitting on couches While the employees are doing all the work and then yet they end up with a billion dollars and the employees barely in up with a A barely in up with a living wage as she would define it right and then she summarizes this by saying and so no one ever makes a billion dollars

33:34You take a billion dollars. So she basically summarizes by saying those those owners the CEOs of the company They're taking a billion dollars. They aren't making a billion dollars. It's everyone at the ground level who's making Should be making the money But instead billionaires the owners are the ones who are taking the money. How do you how do you process that how do you respond to that No, I think it's a it's summary it would be just plain nonsense you say well How do people become rich? Uh Well in a free market People become rich by serving their fellow man Amen by making your fellow man better off. Yeah, right you say well look How did Bill Gates become one of the richest people in the world? Yeah, it's great. He did he did he's did he do it Romantic people right no, he didn't he produced windows. Yeah, something that satisfies people. Yeah, he and and and what people did they are all around the world

34:36They voluntarily plunk down $400. Yeah For his windows. Yeah Uh Or matter of fact you can you can look at um You can look at income people get income by serving their fellow man That is you say look Suppose I I mow your lawn right and you give me $20 for mowing your lawn Well, what is that $20? Well, you see what it is when I go to the grocer and I say I would like to have a six pack of beer and two pounds of steak that my fellow man produced So the grocer and in fact says to me Well, Williams you're making a claim on what your fellow man produce What did you do to serve him? And that's when I plunk I showed the $20. Yeah, I served my fellow man by mowing his lawn and this is proof This is the evidence the $20 right

35:39Now the difference between government government can say to me Well, Williams you don't have to get out and hot sun and mow your fellow man's lawn We will take His beer and and uh and steak good to you. Yeah, and so So you've asked about the morality of it. Yeah I think it's it's it's a it's a good uh or a high standard morality That in order to have a claim on what your fellow man produce you have to serve your fellow man and and when and and and and and and with this whole business of of of income redistribution and taking people's money. Yeah You have to think that if you are a Christian you have to be against that because When God gave Moses the commandment thou shalt not steal right He didn't mean thou shalt not steal unless you got a majority vote in the United States Congress, right? You preaching

36:44You meant that you shall just your not steal And so people become rich By serving the fellow man look look at Walmart. Yeah, well he didn't rob anybody He went out there and see he can't matter if I he started out of there as a Delivering milk gets on his bicycle. Yeah, I'm running right wow delivering newspapers But he may he with his mind and his and his willingness to take risk He made it possible for his sir his fellow man to get a lot of good you you know You go into Walmart store it must be at least a hundred thousand different items. Yeah And or and to find out how to organize To do all that stuff that it requires No less than a genius. Yes, but but to your bill gate situation bill gates invent windows And then all his employees do all the work and bill gets all the profits and his employees don't get to share on the profits Well, my that's but that's not true though

37:45This is only people who work for for a win Microsoft they earn a lot of money. Yeah, there's janitors at Microsoft that are doing real good But they don't get to share the profits they just get they just get though but the wages Well, well, well, well, yeah, no there there are wages There's rent There's profit and there's interest there. There are the various forms of payments to factors of production That is labor gets wages land gets rent Uh employers, I mean entrepreneurs get profit and capital gets uh interest Against interest now if you look in the entrepreneur you look at the entrepreneur guy who owns it. Let's let's say I'm hiring you I run a country a company. I hire you Well, um I must I must you get your wage anyway regardless what happens to the country the company. Yeah, but I have to I'm the residual I get what's left over right and so thanks on goberry well, I don't get anything you're the one taking the risk

38:50Yeah, not him. Yeah, and so if you have a downturn year you're the one that gets you know the downturn you still get your way or you ask you ask the question look Uh, you take somebody like Drew breeze the quarterback of the saints. Yeah, the guy gets $40 million a year, right? And so the the the people who uh Who operate the uh the machines? They don't get $40 million a year Of many other people around that's involved with the saints organization. They don't get they don't get That kind of money, but Drew breeze does right. Yeah, so so Why is the how come the secretary working for the uh The norlean saints right how come she gets 60 or 70 thousand dollars a year right and Drew breeze working for the same kind of company He gets 40. That's not fair. That is not fair Referees running down the field just like the rest of

39:51And Drew breeze could be a quarterback without the referees well But you but you asked the question here. Yeah, you asked the question well If Drew breeze If you could get if the if the New York New Orleans Saints could hire somebody with his skills For a hundred thousand dollars a year. Why would they pay him 40 May right? That's right right. I mean eating them And if they didn't pay him 40 million They'd find that the New York Giants would have men's dead yeah, right and then what's their what's their investment now? So so So you look you you take a person um Shire think of the CEO of um Jack Welch of the uh of the general electric yeah When he came into when he when he started the company right I believe that they I don't have to figure right off hand But I believe that they might have been worth of five billion dollars and when he left

40:55He will worth hundreds of billions of dollars. Wow So So you have to ask the question well a person who Has the ability to make a five billion dollar company Uh A five hundred billion dollar company Well, he's worth something right Yeah, and so and matter of fact I believe he just he just wound up getting I'm not at I'm not absolutely sure but it's in a neighborhood of maybe a hundred million dollars Yeah, back to the aoc That's why it's nonsense though is that the difference in the company is Welch You know he's the one who thought What does this company need to do he was working? I mean, I think the answer the fundamental answer to aoc Point is the entrepreneurs are the ones doing hard work Yes, it's just not true that the day laborers are the only ones working You're not just sitting on his couch. You don't sit on your couch and magically turn a company from five to five hundred

41:58Billies and same thing with with with Drew breeze. Yeah, exactly. I mean The the reason why the secretary is getting 60 or 70 thousand dollar a year because of Drew breeze You He's making the He's making the saints operation very very profitable. Yeah, why is why does it seem like I mean it just over the last what Maybe 15 years I can think about I've seen Bernie Sanders and people like aoc rise to the top I mean a couple lectures ago when Obama was running uh Bernie Sanders was a laughing stock of the Democratic Party and now he's actually competing right now to be Possibly a nominee and then aoc is up here in New York. How did that? What's happened that this world view and this thinking is actually starting to permeate the culture well I think see the It's it's decline in morality of the merging people. Oh that is

43:01politicians We can't blame politicians for we can blame a little bit But the ball of the blame lies with the American people that is politicians are doing precisely What the people who elect them to office want them to do? and so They and and most people are politicians are elected to office On the promise that the on the problems they make that they will use the power of their office To take what belongs to one American and bring it back to them. Wow. That is And a politician not doing that he won't get elected office. Yeah. I mean if you have a question Suppose I were running for the United States Senate in the state of Pennsylvania And I go go across the state campaigning and I tell my fellow panes of anians look I know what's in the Constitution if you elect me to the Senate don't expect from me bring back

44:07highway construction money aid to higher education food stamps and prescription drugs Now then the question is because it's not in the Constitution right And so the question I have for you is that do you think that I would get elected to the Senate? from Pennsylvania nor I wouldn't and the read and and the panes of anians Would do be doing exactly the right thing by not electing me to the office to of the Senate because If I don't bring back as Senator Williams if I don't bring back billions of dollars to panes of anians It doesn't mean that panes of anians will pay a lower federal income tax All that it means is new juries you will get it instead. Yeah, right. And so right once legalized staff begins There's no stuff it pays for everybody to participate in it

45:08So everybody's aggressive and those who don't participate in it will wind up holding the brown and the stick How do you stop that? I don't think you can stop it Oh, somebody's gonna be able to put the brakes in this thing. No, no, no, no Otherwise you just keep grasping for just to get yours then don't you? That's what happens and and uh, so where does this end? Yeah Well a lot of people have asked me uh the question what can we do and you you have to ask question well I asked them Are Are the American people as human beings? Are they any different from the Roman? This Spanish the French the British these are great empires of the past right who went down the tubes yes, sir Are we any different from them as human beings and I say no no, I'm depressed so we're so so we we're headed in the same direction Yeah, it seems like the only other possibility is a is a massive

46:08spiritual Reformation right No, no, well Not and that can't happen because if you look if you look at the church Whether whether you're Catholic or whether the Presbyterian Baptist The the message from the pulpit is not that of telling the parishioners Don't take government money. Oh The it's the the the the message is you can stop that To take more government money. That's right. That's right. That's right and so so So what I'm saying there's not going to be a religious awakening and so the so you know the you know like think about this If you were around in 1887 in London at Queen Victoria's Jubilee And if you had suggested That Great Britain would become a third Great Nation

47:12Challenge on the high seas by a six-rate nation such as Argentina and almost lose Wow You would have been put into the Insana Sallan yeah because it was inconceivable That Great Britain would become a third Great Nation and it was inconceivable that anybody would challenge Great Britain on the high seas But nonetheless he did And matter-fag is kind of interesting tale At the me it the statement used to be that the son never set right on a British Christian right And you're one guy quit. He said well the reason why is because God did not trust the British in the dark So but great empires of the past have gone down the tubes yeah for doing and we're doing exactly the same things that they were doing Britain's services. Yeah, I just you know there's one thing just From reading the Bible understand how God works to There is this sense that there's a prophet that comes forth and God causes a nation to repent

48:16And if there's ever going to be a revival it's going to have to come from regenerated hearts Believing God what he says about the word and practicing those things and then all of a sudden it trickles up from just Basic fatleness obedience to the word of God and we've seen that so many times in the word of God I think you're right though if it's gonna happen it's gonna come from the first church is saying hey Let's be self-sufficient. Let's be self-sustaining and we see some of it happening. You see Samaritan ministries which is a Christian organization that is trying to figure out How can we take care of the people among us at health sharing so that if a person gets sick We send out an email it goes out and people give money To take care of that person without having to go to the government To get health care and so we see certain things little pockets. Yeah, you see little little thing But it's not big enough. No, but you know one thing about God though is I always use a small things You know he used David and David and Glide What a guy did not do anything for the Romans the British

49:17The friends there are judges. There are yeah, there are times where He will flatten a place and then take people out and rebuild again. We've seen that I'm just hoping that we're in the place where we have revival and that We don't get demolished. There's a point where judgment happens and I do think though that it almost it always happens though It in a moment where it's utterly impossible and the kind of reformation that God actually does is the kind where It really isn't possible. It doesn't it won't it won't add up. It won't make sense and and it could just as easily Completely go down the tubes. One of the things I find encouraging though is it and it's been in the short time probably Since the early 80s when homeschooling started really getting big um There's been Christians who have decided to take control of education One thing that they can really get their hands on and from that era up until now Christian colleges that have developed We've seen this kind of Christian uprising

50:18um and education That I don't think we even know what the outcome is going to be 20 years from now We're just seeing a generation of homeschoolers coming to The workforce um into Technology They're thinking about things about them even vote Yeah, some of you even vote We don't even know if the outcome is going to be yet of the Christian education has been developing over the last 20 30 years And so while we have a group of people that are kind of unplugged and aren't being faithful There's still this kind of Routing bunch of group of people who are not willing to give up Um on what it means to be a faithful father be a faithful mother To be a faithful daughter and son and and to be a faithful Christian all the way from their home to their work You know to their Kids and and we're seeing the fruit of that and I don't think that it's even hit yet. It's prime

51:19I think we're just seeing the Yeah, I think it's still you you go back to Your Your church or your parishioners and you say look The only way you get a social security check Is for the government to take the money of those who are working in the workforce and give it to you right That's this honest Let's stop it How much do you think I'm in support do you think you would get though? There's one church at least an Idaho that's doing that our pastor actually teaches that You know, there's only about a thousand of us But there's but he's been teaching that for a couple decades. I mean, but do but do the uh does the congregation obey Say do they say to the social of me Social security administration keep your money. Yes. Do they send the checks back? Yes, they don't

52:19Well, well, well, at least some of them are No, no, no, some of them the principal that our pastor's taught us is You know if you start collecting social security just um collect what they owe you and for taking your money and then stop taking check And then no, no, no, no, no, no, no, that doesn't work that way that is The the the social security system is a big Ponzi game. Oh, yeah, I know and so The only way That you can get any social security is for is for the government to take money away from people who are working today Right and give it to you right because The went when they when the social security administration started in in 1933 33 36 rather They said that Money that be taken out your pay It will be your money would be putting a special account for you right. Oh, yeah

53:21And and you could draw on it when you retire Look with that and that is not true at all right, right, right and so be so for sure you recognize That that a social security recipient a person 65 70 whatever The only way that he can get the money from the social security administration is for the Government to take right the earnings of somebody who's working now right that's right. Yeah So so it's it's not it's not getting back the money that you put in right Because because the money you put in is gone right right that that's that's true It's gone And the only way they can give you money is to take money from those who are paying in social security, right? So if if If this is going down the tubes Why have you done what you've done? Why have you written all the articles you've written written all the books you've written Taught for as long as you've taught Nobody's listening Apparently, what why do what you've done? No because it's fun

54:25This goes back to your uh your uh rowdy days, huh? You just stop you can't stop me and I want to ask you what what do you think of the the best time for black people in America? What's the best time? What would you mark as being the best time for that right now right now? Even with all the social structures that are there right now that are crippling us You say still right now is the best time well yeah well It all depends what you use as a measure Yeah, it says that like if you if you measure um Income and let's say material wealth Then clearly black people today In terms material wealth are much better off than they've ever been That is uh The kind of things that that black people even poor people black people Uh own or poor people in general Is much higher than Than years ago for example if you look at the

55:27If you look at the statistics from the census bureau 62% of people who are Defined as poor Own at least one car. Yeah, and 14 on two or more cars 14% wow um poor people today Of televisions micro waves wash regime air conditioning cell phones cell phones right And uh and matter if you're standing on a corner in downtown filled off here or downtown anywhere And someone says Uh, you're just standing there and just by their appearance they say to you Would you point out people who are poor walking by and the people who are not poor walking by You could hardly tell who yeah, and so but years ago you could yep. Yeah, there's the good Now so what so the in in in that sense

56:29There's no more poverty in America that is there's and I should maybe refine. I should say There's no more material poverty But there's a plenty of spiritual poverty Of the day that did not exist when I was a kid I'm i'll be you know, I'm i'm almost for 84 years old, but when I was a kid The kind of things that you saw people do in north philophium uh, it's 18 miles from here Uh, we're unheard of i mean the today yeah, I mean the Uh, my father uh, deserted my mother and sister and I went I was three and my sister was two And we live in the rich-owned housing project in north philophium and We were the only kids In our neighborhood that did not have a mother and father in the house two parent household. We were the only ones wow Today is exactly the opposite

57:31Yeah, that it would be rare to find the foot to the reverse right yeah, and it turns out that if you look at The statistics today among black Americans 75% of black babies are born Uh, out of wedlock if they're born at all 75% right and And in 1938 it was 11% Wow, illegitimacy among blacks and three percent among whites today is 30 overslight the over 30 percent of whites among whites The the uh again when when I was in in north philophium poor in april it's uh Of people a lot of people didn't bother lock their doors I had a friend uh, I just knocked on his door and walked into his house, you know, and Uh on hot human nights if we were well behaved Maybe we could sleep out on the balcony or sleep out and and on lawn furnished somebody's yard

58:36You won't do you can't do that today. Yeah, you can get robbed Well, yeah, that's not safe or or are things that people you I think one of the real tragedies is Is that Uh younger people today they think things that they see today have always been Mm-hmm. Yeah, and it's not true for example things Things like you just never think of I guarantee that none of you would have thought of this Is the idea at one time getting on the trolley car bus you did not have to have exact change And you gave your if it was quarter you gave you guy a conductor a dollar and give you back 75 cents Well, how come we have exact change now was because of all the robberies of uh Of trolley car drivers and bus drivers that have during the 60s and 70s uh the uh the the whole notion you know in in Baltimore

59:36um In in 2015 It's probably the same thing today That on each school day and average of four teachers were assaulted requiring medical uh And and when I was going to school I mean you you you would never dream of cursing to a teacher much less assaulting the teacher right um You you find uh You're out the guns in school Where people are shooting one another in school right And people say well gee we need to do something about guns well guns are in an in anemone objects They can't act on their own like to put a gun on table right It's not gonna do anything right. It's people who who do things and and and and and as evidence of declining morality

1:00:37Is that many high schools had had rifle clubs right now through you where kids would actually you know in the 1940s In fact these kids would get on trolley car With their rifles take him to the high school because they had rifle clubs yep Now any any principal allowing kids a rifle you come in school He would be fired some early if not arrested Say it there's question well have rifles gotten meaner No, no, no it's people yeah again We we blame it we a lot of times we blame in an in anemone objects for the problems and that's not true It's people all the time And so there's been a steep uh, I don't think is recoverable decline in morality yeah I don't think you can ever do anything about it. I mean if you ask the question Or just put it in the case of the other rifle club

1:01:39Do you see any hope on horizon whereby High schools can can once again have Uh rifle clubs and shooting clubs right Can you see can you see and can you see it anyway not humanly speaking no no but but We can that was traditional right It was traditional is sure and and the matter in fact If you look at uh, you go to sears and robot catalog in 2030. Yeah, I mean, I'm sorry in 1930 1915 I looked at one I think with the 1915 or 1920 and had 38 pages of Of advertisements for guns and rifles You just in mail order. Yeah Yes, send your money away and they will send the send you at your pistol or gun the rifle or you go to a hardware store to buy it And and that was at a time it wasn't all this shooting stuff like this and they were selling cocaine in those magazines

1:02:46That's right, you know, I mean think about it We have cocaine and guns right there in the same magazine and you still didn't have the same amount of violence And so again, yeah again, can you imagine that we can go back as a nation to uh Where sears and robot catalogs or we could we could just send in our money to buy a pistol Because that that's what we've always done as a nation right and and very often it was It was very very common for when a boy reached 12 years old As far as I would give him 22 rifles My son's getting one you know, and so so you say you say You see any hope on the horizon for that coming back where people were Are moral and self-discipline enough for that to become before that to be the case again But the reason why that environment was present in the first place was because the the the Christian worldview had a powerful

1:03:46Impact a century before two centuries before No, you know right and and the only way that that can get back Is through people trusting in Jesus again, you know Jesus we believe Jesus is King of Kings Lord of Lord And that his death and resurrection really does change the world And that we through the gospel being preached through the repentance of a nation We can't get back there, but it's not possible But we can't we can't make that happen. It's not human you you're right If I just looked at the world through the grid of What humans do? depressing If I look at the grid through through thinking that humans can fix themselves We're screwed, but if I look at the grid through the world of of the biblical lens what Jesus is doing in the world Sure, we go through times in our history where where things look really dire We go through I mean, you know the you look at the the history of the world

1:04:47Empliars do fall. Yeah, it's slavery actually ended peaks and troughs Right, look at the history of the world is peaks and troughs, but you do see a a continuous improvement over time through said throughout centuries Not necessarily for particular nations, right, but for the kingdom of God, right? I mean on the one hand art You know the West is in heavy decline But there's reason to believe that that there's other places in the world Where the gospel is actually turning things in a different direction And I don't know if you know following like the Hong Kong protests for example But it's been striking to us that like you know millions of people gathering Uh asking for freedom from China many of whom are singing Christian hymns in the streets And I don't know what's gonna come from that But that seems to me to be maybe the birth of something new over there Meanwhile, you know if if that happened here, you know, I mean, you know, you can imagine that happening

1:05:51Yeah, it is revostrange that the in Hong Kong The uh the people are the younger people are fighting against communism And here they're fighting for exactly right? Right, I mean, so I mean who knows you know maybe in in a 50 years, you know, it's it's Hong Kong or it's a A nation in Africa or in Asia where you have a world like you're talking about where the high school kids have shooting clubs And you can order your pistol off of a you know the internet no questions asked because The gospel is permeated more in that country But and maybe you know and maybe we're going through a dark age right here, but the the gospel disrupts Uh stealing you know the gospel disrupts envy the gospel disrupts agreed Um these gospel disrupts a society Um without without Jesus without Jesus working in my life. I would want to still I would want to be greedy

1:06:51I would want to You know hoard all these things for myself And I would take I'd take whatever power control and mechanisms I have to accomplish that But it and that really is a miracle though when when God does that it doesn't it doesn't add up But it's just as much as you know uh the virgin birth just as much as you know Um the Exodus through the Red Sea just as much as Jesus rising from the dead You you can't make that happen. We can't make that happen. Only only God can make that happen This is why I love you're writing so much is because all real economics is based in scripture All real good true economics is based in in how the Bible how God presents himself to the world And actually goes back to what you said earlier. I love what you said about The free market is just giving Serving I are you familiar with George Gilder? No Um he was the one that I remember him saying that in some of his writings where he just said the free market economics is just gift giving

1:07:51And and then and then gratitude You know when you know when you moment alone for $20 or whatever, you know, that's just you thanking me and uh but that's That's the gospel of Jesus. That's that's you know god so love the world that he gave And that kind of gift Creates gratitude in our hearts and makes us want to be givers and and that's you know god makes free men And then in turn free men make free cultures make free people free people free countries right but The slavery of sin creates more slavery more coercion more stealing more grasping Also too. I just as I was thinking about this man you've laid a foundation for what has now been known as blackset You know are you familiar with that You have leaving a black people leading democratic party. Yeah, I mean if you look at some of the people that are out there Between you and Thomas soul like you guys have been the foundation for a lot of black people waking up

1:08:55To just voting Democrat, you know, just in their mind because they think I mean so I can't look back This is part of what I know about you and what I read about you and complete disagrees with you Because I'm seeing the fruit of your work Come and start a revolt against the status quo how black people supposed to think and how monolithic we Thought that we are and so I see I see your work shaking some of the foundations of that and bringing up a whole new crop of people like Candace Owens out there. I mean you listen to her. He like wow, that's fresh Well, she getting that she's only regurgitating the stuff that you and soul have been putting out and so I know that because I've read you guys It's like I know you got that from And so I gotta say man, I think your own work disagrees with you. Oh what happened in here I think there is a turn that's coming and I think you've been a huge part of making that happen brother Yeah, I'm grateful for it and I think there's a lot I mean, I also wonder if if there's a little bit of an optical illusion between the big cities and the rest of the middle

1:09:57You know fly over America because there's a lot of us out in Idaho and Oklahoma and South Dakota Who you know, I mean in college I didn't lock the doors on my car or my house. I do now because I got little kids, but you know Um, but there's a bunch of people still in the middle of this country Yeah, right. Yeah, who I think you know, they whatever you want to call it red states or whatever But they're I think a lot of them. I mean we still need a reformation there. Yeah, but I think there's there's still a lot of people Who aren't going to go down without a fight? You know, and I think even even as you know wild and crazy as Trump is There's something about that whole phenomenon that a bunch, you know the liberals, you know We're crying on election night completely shocked. Yeah, and I think there's something there where you know a bunch of people said look We're gonna, you know, whether it's the middle finger the middle finger to the elites or whatever you want to call it uh Like I do think that there is a rising tide of something Now whether it will be enough

1:10:58Whether you know, we'll go down the tubes and goddles do something new. I don't know. Yeah, but I do agree that there's something going on when you have like I mean, even someone as crazy as Kanye West Where in I know you don't want that title. It's past to you, but you know, but you know, well, he's you know calling himself a Christian And and saying I'm a vote for whoever I'm gonna vote for. He's being a entrepreneur. Yeah By property by and a bunch of land and Wyoming yep Thinking through these things. I think something's going on. Yeah We're almost done with our time. So I'm gonna give you the last word, man. Just Maybe like what what what would you want a younger generation? That is is is read you listen to you. I don't know. What would you say to them? What do you think we need? What would you encourage us in? Well, I think in in In just a few words or two is that we need a moral Rejuvenation and

1:12:00And I mean not Not simply from a religious point of view But from a a human rights point of view that is to To to to to love and respect our fellow man and in order to do love and respect our fellow man We can't do things like we've done in the past that is we can't steal from him We can't use and we cannot abuse his personal liberties I think that To promote personal liberty Is the most important thing that one can do and to recognize what's at the heart of personal the personal Liberty I mean and where I start off in thinking about all many issues is that Each of us owns himself that is I am my property. Yeah, I belong to Walter Williams and if you start off with the notion of self ownership

1:13:05Then there's certain acts that are immoral and certain acts are immoral that is the reason why rape is immoral is because it violates private property Murder is immoral because it violates private property and so If you start off with the idea of of a self ownership Then I think that the the the very tough questions that people But what what are called tough questions really become easy questions. Uh that is If you start off with the idea of self ownership. It means that I have the right to engage in peaceable voluntary exchange with anybody around the world That is and anybody that would interfere with peaceable voluntary exchange is committing an immoral act That is If I want to if I want to work for you for four dollars an hour

1:14:09And you want to pay me four dollars an hour Nobody else has a right to interfere with that transaction because you own you and I own me right And so it'll be immoral for For him to interfere to say no that transaction cannot occur and so I think that the that the bottom line is to think of us of each of us as As self ownership At least here on earth that we own our self nobody else on earth owns us And that's and that that that that gives the rules of the other road, you know And then Another thing that if you if you think about man's relationship with man if you look if you look at Let's say if you look at the uh the upcoming Uh Superbow Now or you look at your football games

1:15:10Listen, let's forget about the superbowl look at football games in general Those guys are playing a hard game A lot's at stake Maybe money winning prestige And the game is over And they're shaking hands with one another come now one other And and why How can they do that will happens to be The the rules of the game That is the The umpires All that they do is enforce the rule of the game. They don't play favorites. They don't say well Since natty had a bad year that last year so we're gonna give it an edge we're gonna we're not gonna call pass in for Interference on them and so like that right and so But that does not happen right they they treat everybody equally And so the players can live in peace. Yeah

1:16:10While a whole lot's at stake right You know who own who wins and who loses right but nonetheless they can live in peace and And and that's that's why the The rules of the game or laws Uh need to be neutral and that the courts or the legal authorities Should be charged only with enforcing the rules right the Enforcing neutral rules. They shouldn't say well gee Because of slavery because discrimination you had to you had a bad life We're gonna put you ahead of these other people you don't do that What you do is to get rid of the impediments to liberty and then keep on playing the game And that's how we can get along with one another And that's what I would say to people that's good stuff Well, I got one more question for you. Can you sign my books?