Murder In Moscow: Bryan Kohberger, Madison Mogen And The Motive For Murder

0:00What's up everyone and welcome back to the program. As the Brian Coberger investigation was unfolding, one of the main questions that we had here on the podcast was how Brian Coberger ever met any of these girls. And once we found out about Maddie Mogen and her working at the Mad Greek and what people magazine had said about Brian Coberger going to the Mad Greek, I've always thought that that's where Brian Coberger had his first contact with Maddie Mogen. And I think from there, that's where things spiraled out of control. Now that Mad Greek restaurant is no longer open up there in Idaho, by the way. And when this was all first going down, there was a lot of people, including the owners from that Mad Greek restaurant who denied the reports that Brian Coberger had ever been there. But I had people reach out to me, people who had worked there saying that that wasn't the case that Brian Coberger had been in there multiple times. Well now there's a new book coming out by James Patterson. And in this book that was released on Monday, they're going down

1:04that same road. And according to the author of James Patterson, the most likely introduction Brian Coberger had to any of these girls or victims was at that restaurant. So in this episode, we're going to dive into an article from ABC News and talk a little bit more about Brian Coberger. This new book and the Mad Greek headline new book on University of Idaho murders Shed's light on Brian Coberger's potential motive. This article was authored by Cana Whitworth and Emily Shapiro. A new book on the University of Idaho murders attempts to lift the veil on the secrecy that shrouded the case, revealing what those closest to the students believe was the motive behind the admitted killer Brian Coberger's brutal crimes. And remember today, there is a hearing about the gag order. So we'll know a lot more about if the gag order is going to be lifted anytime soon or not. And at this point with sentencing being the only thing left, it's time to go.

2:07That gag order has to be dropped. And I thought that that gag order was way restrictive from the very beginning. And I still think so now. Look, I understand why they needed it, why they used it, but I don't like it. And I think they went too far with it. And then using that gag order in the manner they did created a bunch of fertile ground for a bunch of morons to come up with a bunch of bullshit. And as we all know, that's exactly what they did. Bestselling author James Patterson and investigative reporter Vicki Ward teamed up for a new book release on Monday, the Idaho 4 and American tragedy. The book not only poses a potential motive, but also Shed's Light on co-burger's life before the killings and follows multiple points of view of the timeline of the crime that sent shockwave through Moscow and skyrocketed to a national attention. And I remember waking up the day after and I looked out my girlfriend and I said this story is going to be huge. This is going to be a gigantic story, especially considering the circumstances in which

3:10this went down. We have this little sleepy college town. We have four college kids just sleeping in their house. They get murdered. For no reason. Yeah, that's going to be a huge story. Well, I had no idea just how huge it was going to become. For people who have followed this story, we wanted to give them closure. Patterson told ABC News. What he really means is he wanted to make some money, but that's cool. We'll take some closure. Rumate's Maddie Mogan, Kelley Gon Salvis, Zana Kernotl, and Kernotl's boyfriend Ethan Chapin were all stabbed to death at the girls off campus house in the early hours of November 13th, 2022. Patterson and Ward conducted over 300 interviews with people who have ties to the case, including family and friends who believe Mogan was the target. And I've said that now for a while. At first, I thought it was Kayleigh. And that's because we were hearing the reports about the damage that was done to Kayleigh's body by the killer. But it turns out that it was Madison Mogan. At least that's what it looks

4:13like. And the rage that we saw with Kayleigh was Brian co burger, bitch has Brian co burger, taking out his anger that Kayleigh ruined his time with Maddie. He didn't expect Kayleigh to be there. He thought it was going to be Maddie alone. He was going to be able to have whatever fucked up disgusting fantasy played out. But that wasn't the case. Kayleigh happened to be there and it threw Brian co burger's plan into chaos. And that's why you see the overkill when it comes to Kayleigh. That also led by the way to Zanna and Ethan being murdered because if it was just Maddie, if she was there by herself, co burger would have did what he did and he would have crept out. There would have been no FBI, no gigantic investigation like we saw and he probably would have got away with it. The problem for a co burger was that he wasn't expecting Kayleigh there. And when he saw her there and the fight ensued, things went south. But I think one of the biggest tells when we're talking about the crime scene and the state of the body is that there was overkill

5:14with Kayleigh. And that leads me to believe that Maddie was the target. There was consensus that it was Maddie that co burger was going for and the victim's family as I think would all agree with that word said. And I think that's probably the consensus with anybody who's followed the case at this point that Maddie Mogan was the target of Brian co burger. But obviously it's still speculation. We don't have confirmation one way or the other, but the evidence certainly points us in that direction. A Moscow police alleged co burger cell phone record show his phone appeared to be close to the victim's house on at least 12 occasions between August and the night of the murders. Almost always late at night. Yeah, because he was casing the joint. If you listen to my episodes from early on, I basically called all of this. This is what I said he was doing. Bro was casing the joint was making sure that he had the right, you know, pathway had the right house, knew their movements, knew what time they were going to be awake, what their habits were. That's

6:15what he was doing. And it reminded me of this shit that Francis dollar hide was up to in the book red dragon. If you've ever read the book or saw the movie red dragon, you know that he would go in, you know, stake out these houses. He'd sit out there for hours on end watching the families. And that's what Brian co burger was doing when it comes to King road. And I think that was relatively obvious from the beginning. And the reason he was always there late at night is because that's when he planned to commit his crime late at night. So he's going to go and make sure the whole scenarios right. Make sure the situation is acceptable. That way when the time comes to carry out his disgusting ass bitch made attack, he has all his ducks in a row. The book described what it calls a recurring nightmare. The victim friend Emily Allen had after the murders. Allen said she imagined that the now admitted killer went to the restaurant where Morgan worked, expressed romantic interest in her and was rejected prompting him to retaliate. When the friends are told that the guy who murdered

7:19their friend is this guy Brian co burger. They don't recognize his photo. They can't put it together. Ward said that's when Emily said the only explanation that she and her boyfriend hunter Johnson could come up with is the story that we tell as the story of her dream that Brian co burger targeted Maddie. And that he doesn't know the exact details, but that's her best guess. And yeah, I think that that's a great guess. I truly believe that Maddie was the target for all the reasons we discussed. But with that said, I surely remain open to any kind of evidence or any kind of information that leads us somewhere else. But as of right now, I don't think we've seen anything that would lead us to believe that anybody else was the target besides Maddie. And I think one of the tells is where did he go right away right to Maddie's room. And if he was staking the house out, then he most assuredly knew where Maddie's room was, what Maddie was up to and according to reports, one of the places where they think Brian co burger was watching the house

8:20from he had a direct line into Maddie's window. So I think that the evidence is overwhelming that Maddie was the target. But we just don't have that confirmation from any authorities yet. So of course, it's all still speculation. Prosecutors said Mogen was the first of the four killed, a knife sheath with co burgers DNA was found under her body official said. The book also delves into co burger's life as a criminology PhD student at nearby Washington State University at the time of the killings. Co burger, the criminologist had such training for this and he almost committed the perfect crime Patterson said, had he not left the knife sheath, he probably wouldn't have got caught. And that's the truth. This dirty rotten son of a bitch thought he was just going to kill Maddie and he would have got away with it. And we all know he would have went and killed somebody else. But knowing what we know if he didn't leave that sheath, bro would have got away with it. And that's terrifying to think about. In the wake of the shocking crime as police search for a suspect, one of the key sources of

9:21information was a surviving roommate Dylan, who told friends including a lot, what she saw on the night of the murders. It was really through Emily that we learned of what sort of roommate Dylan had gone through, Ward said. It sounded so surreal to them all because she said he had a black mask and he looked like he was carrying a black vacuum. And they're sitting there thinking, who could this be? And what on earth has happened? And we got a lot of questions answered as far as the motivation of the 911 call and when it was made and why somebody said that they were unconscious people there. So in that new documentary that's on Amazon, the Idaho documentary, it goes into the details of the kids who actually came to the house and made the phone call. And it gives you more context. So if you get a chance, I would say watch that documentary. It doesn't really add to much, but you get to hear from people who were actually there and from the kids who made the phone call. And that was the context that we were missing for all these years.

10:24Coburger was arrested nearly seven weeks after the murders. After maintaining his innocence for more than two years, on July 2nd, Coburger admitted to the quadruple killings in court and pleaded guilty to all counts. He'll be sentenced to four consecutive life sentences on the four first degree murder counts and the maximum penalty of ten years on the burglary count. Now as families prepare for next week's sentencing hearing on July 23rd, Patterson and Ward are hoping to give readers a true sense of the four victims. You will meet Ethan and Kaylee and Maddie and Zanna Patterson added. You will meet them and you will feel them as human beings. And that's great. That's what it should be on. Once this son of a bitch Brian Coburger is sentenced, we should forget about his bitch ass and never even think about him again. Unless there's a helicopter ride coming and if there is, I want to do the push in. I spoke to Stacey Chapin Ethan's mom and she did say which was wonderful to hear that she's so glad that this book exists because it means that

11:27they're not forgotten Ward said it's a tribute to them and their lives. And that's awesome to hear because it should be about the victims. From here on out, that's what it should be about. About Maddie, about Zanna, about Ethan, about Kaylee and fuck this piece of shit Brian Coburger. I mean, I'm sure everybody wants to take this guy apart piece by piece. So as far as I'm concerned, once we get as much information as we can get out of them, then his bitch ass should be locked under the prison and never heard from ever again. All of the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.