No Title Needed Episode 72 - Songs of Survival with Amber Maze

Hey everyone, welcome to another episode no title needed and today, usually I say, we

are at Feinstein's.

But today we are in the Paul Drescher room, we've been here before at the beautiful Hotel

Carmichael in Carmel, Indiana, USA, this is a new setting for us, it is, I feel like it

is going on.

It's going on.

I feel very important at the conference table, we're waiting for the chairman of the board

to arrive.

But before that person arrives, we have argued, Amber Mays, thank you for joining us.

Thank you for having me.

Oh my God.

Be here.

Gosh.

And we're doing a green theme today, obviously.

Yes, we are.

Except.

Yeah, you didn't get it.

For a certain person.

It's not.

You count because you made this.

Right.

So that's how we're taking, we're taking off our palette.

No, really.

Really wasn't supposed to create.

We're taking our palette off.

We don't tell anybody that.

Okay.

Don't avoid your secrets.

All right.

So you are many things, but you're with the J, the JCRC.

Yes.

Okay.

And you're also a documentary filmmaker, which I'm going to touch on it real quick when

we talk about it later, you and Philip Luzo are lovely, beautiful director and, you know,

head honcho.

He's awesome.

He is.

He is.

He is.

In my eyes.

You made a documentary, a new documentary, a sweet Lorraine in Auschwitz.

And we're going to talk about that later, but in our second half.

But right now, tell us what you do, do.

Yes.

I work for the Indianapolis Jewish Community Relations Council or the JCRC.

And mostly what I do is I, I'm our Holocaust educator.

I work on Holocaust Remembrance Programs.

I send second generation survivors into schools to share their family stories.

So history really comes alive to these kids who, and it's so important to make sure that

we continue to remember what happened during the Holocaust, and so they give the students

that chance.

You know, how did you even, like, were you interested in this time that I get the time in history?

I get that question all the time, because it is a little odd, right?

I totally get that, but yeah, so my interest started at it and a really young age as about

eight years old.

And my, I had like a teacher, and she just sort of offhand mentioned, oh, there's something

called the Holocaust, but you'll learn about that when you're older.

And I was like, um, excuse me, no, that doesn't seem right, like you can't just throw

this out there and then expect me to not question what you're talking about.

So I went to my elementary school library, and I asked for every book that they had on

the Holocaust, which was two, number the stars and Jacob's rescue.

So I, those are locked in there.

I remember two this day, exactly what I read, and it really just started me on this path.

I was not raised Jewish, so I did not, um, that wasn't part of our sort of family history,

wasn't part of our, you know, annual sort of conversations of what happened to our people.

And so my mom was very much like, well, this is strange, but we'll support her.

And yeah, it just continued as I grew older, and I learned as much as I possibly could.

And I, yeah, that's how I ended up wearing today, and you continued, obviously, excuse me,

that interest.

Yes.

I mean, throughout your whole school.

So finally, when you're in school, they're like, now we will learn about the Holocaust.

You're like, check.

Yeah, I was like, I was like, been there.

I've already done that.

You're teaching the class.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah.

You know, give me a PowerPoint.

Actually, I did.

I was asked when I was in high school by one of our teachers if I could come do a special

presentation on the Holocaust to a younger grade.

I was a senior, and so it was freshmen, and she ended up writing about it for her master's

thesis.

Wow.

Yeah.

Well, it's always, I think it's so fascinating, because it's just so unbelievably horrific.

Yeah.

And that you would think people would do this, you know, and have no, you know, no humanity

and do something like this, right?

So I think that is a constant interest for people, you know, because a lot of those,

well, let me ask you a lot, I mean, a lot of the survivors, if they were really small

kids, are dying at their gone now.

Yes.

I mean, it's like almost like the World War II veteran, they're dying, they're most

of all them who fought in World War II are dead.

Yeah.

Many of the survivors who could really articulate their story, like really remember, aren't

with us anymore.

So it really falls to us to ensure that their memory and their stories and what they went

through continues on.

Yeah.

And like you said, are there kids?

Yes.

You know, there are kids.

Well, I'm, so what schools, you've got to, you've got to schools and so what do you,

you know, like how do you spread the educate?

You said you, you were in charge of that.

Yes.

And how does that happen?

So a lot of times I partner with other organizations, like Candles Hall of Cost Museum,

or the Greater Lafayette Hall of Cost Resource, it's not center, but and it's a lot of just

actually cold calling, right?

It's a lot of just going to these schools.

Another program that we have with JCRC is called Student to Student and it's where high

school teens go into schools and they talk about just like what it's like to be Jewish.

And so a lot of times my colleagues will also say, you know, we can also have a second

generation Hall of Cost survivor come speak to your kids.

And so it's a lot of that sort of grassroots, grassroots movement.

Yeah.

Grassroots movement.

I have been, I've been asked to give presentations before to schools.

How do the, how do the kids, I mean, how do the kids react or how, what kind of questions

do they have?

They get it.

It really depends upon the age.

High school tends to be a little bit more quiet, strangely.

And middle school, they're the ones that tend to have most of the questions and they range

anywhere from, you know, why did Hitler hate Jews?

Which is a whole class in and of itself.

So it's very hard to answer to a, you know, seventh grader.

But then there'll be more thoughtful, especially with our second generation survivors of asking

questions of, well, how, how did your mom come back?

Wow.

How did your mom, how did your dad, you know, keep

living afterwards?

And you know, a lot of times it's, they didn't have any other choice, you know, what, what

were they to do?

You know, well, and they did survive.

So they're like, almost like, that's the best revenge they survive.

Exactly.

So they are continuing the lineage.

Exactly.

Right?

Yes.

I mean, that's their best, because there's nothing you can do to survive the war's over.

There's no kind of revenge.

I mean, you know, there were some of the Nazis got punished.

Very few.

Very few.

The Nuremberg trials.

Yeah.

And there were some other trials.

Yes.

There were some other trials besides that.

That was a biggie.

But really, I was, yeah, like I said, yeah, that was like the percentage was very small.

Very little, like everybody, what the, you know, the third Reich did.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

So, um, so it was almost like, yeah, I think it's almost like, well, you know, this is our

revenge.

We're survived.

We're living.

Yes.

We lived.

We lived.

We had children.

We had the next generation.

Right.

That is definitely right.

The survivor's revenge.

I'm sure you know Eva.

Yes.

The kid from Terroho.

She has passed now.

Yes.

But what is her last name?

Core.

Eva Core.

And of course, she did, they did a big doc on her for PBS.

Yes.

She has a museum is still there.

It is.

We did the first one burn.

Yes.

There was, it was fire bombed by like a neo Nazi.

Yeah.

Oh my gosh.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But then she rebelled.

Rebelled.

Rebelled.

Yeah.

Very interesting.

I talk about it.

Well, all the stories are interesting.

All of them.

From every survivor.

You know, you see so many.

All right.

But we're going to, we're going to get to, we have to take a break.

But we're going to get to that documentary, sweet Lorraine

and Ash Fitz when we come back.

We're just going to take a quick little break here

from our swivel chairs.

He's fantastic.

We're from our sponsor artist.

So thanks.

Hey, everyone, we're lucky enough to have artist

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And today, he's going to show you a few of his beautiful pieces.

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I think you're going to love this.

Hey, everyone.

Welcome back to no title needed with our guest Amber Mays.

We are in the Paul Drescher room at the conference table.

Ready to have our meeting.

I'm so kidding.

The only meeting we're having we're having is with you.

So, okay, here we go.

So we're talking about your history and how you are a kid

and interested in Holocaust and eight.

You are ahead of everybody at school.

And we're already giving presentations, right?

And then you, when you were in high school, right?

Yeah, I just graduated high school.

And I, so I always wanted to go to England

when I, from like the time I was very, very little.

And my mom made a deal that if I didn't get in trouble,

I got good grades.

My graduation gift would be a trip to England.

And I was ecstatic, obviously.

My mom saved up for five years to be able to do that.

So she was a single mom,

but she really wanted to make sure that I was able

to have that dream come true.

When I was a junior,

I was like, I really want to go to Auschwitz.

Like I really want to be a witness to that.

And so I, talking about presentations,

I did research and I made a PowerPoint presentation

and a whole like little report that I presented to my mom

about why we should take a site trip to Poland.

I had, you know, hotel costs and potential money costs

and all of these things that we could go and see.

And I said, I will pay for it all.

And I worked at Barnes & Noble of the time

and I will save my money and I will pay for that.

And so she's like, as long as you can pay for it,

we will, we will do it.

And so I graduated high school.

A few weeks later we were on our way to Europe.

We did a site trip to Poland.

Unfortunately, the morning that we were supposed

to go to Auschwitz, I woke up with horrible food poisoning

but I wasn't going to let that stop me.

And so like looking back, I can laugh at it now

but the entire drive there,

because it's about an hour outside of Kraków.

And I was just getting sick in the pack of this car

the whole time.

We made our way there.

We got there and I don't know.

I just, I felt like I was where I supposed to be.

And I know that sounds very strange.

So you know, just to be standing in a place of such horror

and to feel like this is where I meant to be at this moment.

I think because I really felt like

I am one of those witnesses.

I am now a witness, right?

I can now go back and I can say no,

I have stood on that ground.

I have seen for my own eyes everything that you fret about.

And but I turned to my mom and I was like,

I think we need to go to a hospital.

And our driver took us to this little hospital,

like talk about Cold War stuffing coming out of,

of chairs, like one like bulb hanging down from a wire.

And nobody spoke English, which you know,

I don't, I don't ever go to a country and expect them to.

But when you're sick, it really is nice

to have somebody that speaks your own language.

They gave me a shot, gave me some medication.

I was feeling better.

So then we went to Birkenau,

which is when you think about Auschwitz,

you really think about Birkenau.

It's that guard tower and the train tracks and all the barracks.

And I, we were able to be there for about an hour

before I started to feel ill again.

But there's one thing that we say in the Jewish community.

So I said I wasn't raised Jewish,

but I converted to Judaism.

And there's one thing that we say and it's called the shared.

And it means to be, meant to be, right?

When we were on our way back to London,

I was just sitting on the floor

and my mom struck up a conversation

with this woman in front of her,

asking my daughter's ill,

are you familiar with London?

Do you know where we could go?

And then they started talking about why we were even in Poland.

This is 2006.

People didn't really go to Poland.

That wasn't a vacation spot.

And she said, well, my husband's a survivor.

We come back here to visit the few remaining relatives

that he has,

but he goes around to schools in London and speaks to them.

And in the waiting area,

he came and he sat next to me.

And he started to tell me a little bit about his story.

And I instantly started to feel better.

When we landed in London,

we were able to find each other near the luggage

and he took my hand and he said,

please don't forget us.

Please keep telling our stories.

And I, unfortunately,

I don't remember his name

and we didn't think about exchanging information,

but I really sort of kept that charge with me.

Right.

That's intense.

Yeah.

Wow.

And then you went back like six more times.

Yes, correct, through grad school.

I have my masters in Holocaust and Genocide Studies.

And so through grad school

and then through working with Candles Holocaust Museum.

And one of the things I do for JCRC

is a leadership development program.

And we do a lot of Holocaust education

and contemporary decemitism education.

And our big capstone is taking them to Europe

and taking them to at least Auschwitz.

We also go to Midonic in October.

We'll be going to Terazine outside of Prague.

And so, yeah, I've probably been

to more concentration camps than your average person.

Yeah.

Right.

So let's talk about the dock.

Yes.

Sweet Lorraine and Auschwitz.

How did you meet Frank?

It was a subject of this documentary.

Frank Grenwald.

So he actually did a fundraising program for JCRC

to raise money for our student to student program.

And that's how I met him.

I had just started working for JCRC.

My boss said, you have this background.

He needs help sort of collecting his thoughts

for this program.

Can you work with him on that?

And what developed was this amazing friendship

that I will cherish for the rest of my life.

We would get together every few weeks to go through it.

And he did this live performance

of American jazz standards that he credited with his survival.

Because he plays the piano accordion.

Yes.

And that was interwoven with pieces of his story.

Not his full story, but little pieces of it.

And that's also when I met Philip.

He was hired by my boss to film it.

And so we had developed a rapport.

And in that moment, we sort of looked at each other.

And we were like, this needs to be more.

We had so many people come up to us afterwards saying,

I wish that this wasn't just a one-time event.

There's so much more to Frank's story.

I wish that there were more.

I wish that we could hear it.

And so that's when we decided to venture into my first venture

into filmmaking, the Philips and Old Pro.

But yeah, well, I think any information and education.

And like you said, what that gentleman said to you,

when you were in high school, you don't forget us.

Please tell our story.

And there you are.

You're doing it.

Yeah.

Call to charge.

Right?

Yeah.

And you're doing it.

And I've seen the documentary.

It's great.

He's very, Frank is very charming, man.

On camera.

He could be.

Yes, he is.

He was.

Yeah.

And that's not easy in itself, right?

Like making something like that.

How long did you take you guys to start to finish?

About two and a half years.

We filmed Frank first and then we traveled to Europe

and sort of walked in his footsteps.

We have our own sort of horror stories

from when travel nightmare stories from when we were there.

And then, you know, we had to fundraise at all sort of ourselves.

And so as money came in that we was sort of piecemeal

our interviews and the footage that we were able to get.

But I'm very proud of what we were able to put together.

And I think Frank would be too.

And as I mentioned, we had meetings.

We eventually had meetings every Friday in which we would just sit

and chat about life in the world.

And so getting his story right and sharing it

with as many people as possible has become a vital importance to me.

And now it's, and explaining that, the title, Sweet Lorraine and Auschwitz.

He and his brother were brought up with music.

And he played the recording, his brother.

And they would listen to these jazz standards.

American, like almost like the great American song book, you know.

And that's Sweet Lorraine.

So that was one of his favorite songs.

Yes. So that kind of, he would hum it in Auschwitz.

Got them through that, the horrors, you know.

And real quick, I'm sure old was he when he was in there.

He was nine.

Okay.

Nine through 12 is when he was in sort of the concentration camp system.

Yeah.

Starting with Terry's and then working, then he was sent to Auschwitz

and then other several other camps.

And he got some breaks though.

He was, you know, he, I'm not going to tell it.

But it happened with more than sometimes some people.

It's just Miracle that they.

Yes.

Somebody helped them even get a crust of brand or or not be sent to the gas chamber.

Absolutely.

Or, you know, it was like little tiny miracles did happen to you.

But yeah, so that's all in there.

Yes.

And so, yeah, Kudos to you.

I mean, it's not, it's not easy making.

And you know too, it's not easy making, right?

A project.

Right.

Right. You know what I mean?

And then creating something from that.

Yeah, he's right.

But you had all that history in your head and, you know, experience.

And then you had Phillip who knows how to make a film for crying out loud.

And then you had a great subject in Frank.

You know, so it seems like it's all came together.

And it showed.

Yeah.

Right.

Yeah, it really came through in the final project.

Right.

Right.

We have to wrap it up.

I know.

It's so interesting.

Time flies.

It's so interesting.

I'm sure you were just a plethora of historical information about this time in history.

But thanks for being here.

Yes.

Thank you for having me.

Right. Thanks for making the documentary.

Yeah.

And thank you to Phillip Palusso.

It was wonderful.

Yes.

Couldn't do it without him.

And, um, and we couldn't do this without him.

So, um, Amber Mays, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Good luck with the documentary.

I'm sure you'll be showing it here there and everywhere.

Yes.

Um, I know.

It's right, you know, trying to film festivals and all that.

Yep.

Good stuff.

So that's the next part of the journey.

Where's the, where's the best place to find the documentary ever?

So it just finished screening at the Miami Jewish Film Festival.

It's heading to the Chicago Jewish Film Festival.

So right now, we're only screening through film festivals.

Well, it's not available yet.

It's not available yet.

Yeah.

But a lot of festivals are doing online screenings that you can, as long as you're geolocated within the US, you can watch it.

So, um, we do have a website and you'll be able to keep track of any opportunities to view this.

Oh, that's the website.

In a sweet Lorraine-movie.com.

Okay.

We'll have that on this screen.

So people can see that too.

Yes.

Um, thank you again.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Thank you for all your...

What?

Well, whatever.

Everything you did.

I mean, you know, that everything you're continuing to do, you know, to keep the education with the younger generation alive with the Holocaust.

Thank you.

Yeah.

It's very important.

And thank you for joining us in the Paul Trescher room.

But...

But I'm sure we're going to be back at Feinstein's next week.

And it's a great place.

Yeah.

Go over there.

See a cabaret.

Come on over to a hotel.

Oh, my gosh.

Oh, my gosh.

Exactly.

Stay a night.

It's beautiful hotel.

And Feinstein's is a beautiful cabaret and a fantastic entertainment.

Oh, I enjoy meal at the Vante as well.

Oh, my God.

You're getting everybody in here.

I know.

You are.

I'm so proud of you.

Thank you so much.

You're going to stop talking.

Yeah.

Because we think we're hilarious.

But thank you for joining us for another episode of No Tone.

I'm Cynthia Collins.

And I'm Scott Ozzy.

Oh, my gosh.

I don't even know if we introduced ourselves in the beginning.

Well, we were so excited to have Amber here.

But you know what?

You know who we are.

So we'll see you next week.

Thanks.

Thank you.

We'll talk about that.

I'll see you next week.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye.

Bye!

Bye.

Bye.