Nobody Does MTB Like Nicholi Rogatkin

0:00Hello everyone, my name's Rob Warner. And I'm Elliot Jackson. And this is just ride the Cycling Podcast from Red Bull. That's right. Rob, today we've got Nicolay Ragek and who rides everything from the MX Bikes to Downal Bikes. That is correct. The winningest rider ever on the free ride mountain bike world tour. World's first along the way, the 1080, the 1440 of both is. And he is the first ever rider to deliver a triple crown in Sleipstow. She did back in 2018, Elliot. On top of that, he is now as well as shaping riders on the course, coming for our job a little bit, turning into a pretty decent commons, I say. You know what, Rob? I think he... I want to see what he's got. I want to see what he's got. Let's get him on. Let's see what he's here. Welcome to Just Ride, Nicolay Ragek, and thanks for coming in my hour. Thanks for having me. Stock to be here. Nicolay, I thought it would be interesting to start how you would describe yourself as a rider. Like I know you have the MX background, but I think you've pioneered so many different things.

1:05Like when you get on the course, when you get on the Sleipstow course, or when you get on your bike, what are you trying to achieve? How do you like to ride? How would you describe your style? Paul, that's hard to say. It's interesting to say this. I think I'm a pretty unpredictable rider. There's days out there where I could be the guy that's testing the jumps and looking smooth and doing some of the biggest moves, but there's some days where I explode out there. Looking sketchy as can be, blowing up 10 tires in one day. No style, things like that. So I'm like daily back and forth super unpredictable. Yeah. That I feel like comes from a lifetime of competition because, yeah, basically ever since I was seven years old, I was thrown into competitions first for a competition on my BMX when I was 12. Then basically ever since starting slope style, soul competition focus, like over video projects, over things like this, competitions. Competition sometimes your body is messed up, sometimes your mind's not in the

2:09right place, but sometimes you're firing, sometimes you're on. So I feel like that's led to style of riding that's like unpredictable, like I'm saying. Sometimes soul competition, what you're starting to do, sometimes soul on. You've just lived in a pressure cooker of riding almost right. It either makes you really good or exactly. What was it that made you move from from BMX to subside? Because I remember that, and you like you said you were really young too when you came over to mountain biking. Yeah. I mean, I think I was 16 years old. I did both for a while. Yeah. But I started in skate parks when I was young, but then as I got older, it was more dirt jumps and more high flying. That's what I loved. I just loved to fly. I just love to push the trick limits. So I just saw slope style and some of those competitions were so iconic. And some of the guys I was riding shows with, Andrea LeCondigy, Martin Sautistram, Yonic Greniery, Sam Reynolds. I would always watch them compete in slope style. So it was like this big dream to

3:10compete in these events because they just seemed so unreal and seemed like the type of thing that I would drive in. Where were the levels there between like were you looking from BMX up to slope or I mean, it was ahead between BMX and mountain biking. Because I always thought that BMX is, but it's just that's hard to say because the bike size is such a different thing. You can keep like, um, yes, like what does that mean? Like can you do a lot of stuff on a BMX that you really couldn't do on your on your heart tail? Well, yeah, because there was a lot of like tail whip scenarios going on and the mountain bike is just bigger, bigger wheels, yeah, bigger base. Like I feel like now over the last couple of years, there's really similar tricks. If you watch X games, these last couple X games would BMX those, those guys are kind of going unbelievable. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of not like there's there's still a little more character and uniqueness rider to rider than gymnastic, I feel like. Yeah, for sure. But yeah, BMX and mountain bike, it's not really always been like a battle of who

4:14can do bigger tricks, but it's always been like a couple more tell ups on the BMX, but maybe a way bigger jump for the mountain bike that allows for like a more entertaining, insane looking maneuver. But I feel like those sports go hand in hand. We've seen riders switch over, successfully, unsuccessfully, long career, short careers. If you think about guys like Ryan Nyquist, Drew Bessanson, Anthony Miserie, or just like some guys that have switched over and stayed around and some guys that have switched over and just hung out for a bit and kind of gone back to BMX or into a different, different part of their life. So yeah, when you switched over, I remember watching you at crankworks and I would love to just like have you talk me through adapting to like the bigger jumps, the format, like what you saw the opportunities because you've also innovated a lot throughout your career. Yeah, that's hard to even think about. Because I feel like I was just so stoked on the opportunity to be in these big competitions.

5:15Yeah. And I feel like I had a lot to prove to gain the respect of the mountain bike world, because I came in with a kind of different style on the bike and with myself in general. Yeah, that wasn't too well received. Yeah, because it was like before it was like, oh, like everyone's super laid back and they were like, who is this guy? He's like, he gets a good run and he's like running around. He's yelling. I thought it was really, I thought it was cool. Like, you did it your way. I guess I just didn't know any other way. I just wanted to be myself, but then I realized that that wasn't being that well received. So I feel like I was just trying to push the riding as hard as I could, like new trick at every event and the celebrations, which were kind of different, I guess. They weren't faked or anything. That was like just me being genuinely so fired up to complete these runs because I would go out to these competitions on these missions of like, I want to do this trick and this run because

6:16maybe that will get me a good result and get people stoked. So when I would complete that, sometimes after the hell is missions in practice, big slams in practice, like times that you're on the start, start gate like, oh man, like please, let's have this adrenaline kick in so I don't feel this anymore. I just can get this run done. So I feel like sometimes when I would finish those runs, I would just be so relieved. So much dope. Yeah, I mean, I'm like, I'm like a person that from Boston, like Boston, like lives on the sports. Yeah. So I grew up watching guys like Tom Brady and just sports in general and like in other sports, celebrations are you don't have to finish your run and win the comp. You can make you can make a three-pointer or touch down by 20, but you're going crazy. You're doing cellys. You're doing a crazy dance. So I feel like that was normal, but that was kind of different, but I didn't realize that, but that was just natural energy from me. Yeah. Do you think that the like the slow style community has almost embraced your

7:20style a little bit? I mean, like I feel like, you know, it took people a little bit, I think, to understand that. Like, no, no, that is genuine and like, you are stoked. And it's almost like, oh, it's okay to be stoked, you know what I mean? Yeah, I think they have embraced it a bit because I think they went from thinking like, who is this kid to like, man, this kid is passionate and he loves it. Yeah. And I feel like there is so much passion and love for the mountain bike community just for writing and being out there and riding with your friends and pushing yourself. So I feel like eventually that was just embraced and people were like, you know what? Like, we all just love it and we're passionate and we want to do the sickest possible things with our homies out there. And he just wants to do the same. So I feel like that's why it's, it's kept me around. And as you come over from BMX, I mean, it's beyond it. It's probably the mountain bikers are like, yeah, we don't really like this. Yeah, it's just smoking. There's a look at him showing up about it. I mean, it's, yeah, but there is less so maybe nowadays, but there's always been a bit of a rivalry between mountain bikers and BMX. I mean, you know, yeah, that's right. I want to talk a little bit about you

8:25winning the triple crown at the crankwork's world tour. Not many, what, it's you, Siminock and Reader? No, Reader had a chance a couple times, but the most consistent competitor ever and the only comps he messed up, I feel like we're those triple crown years. Okay, even once I didn't mess up, ML just did an unbeatable run. Yeah, yeah. So he had opportunity a couple times. Didn't do it. David Godjik did it a couple years ago now. Said it's just me, David and not Brandon either. I don't think brand. It was even available for me. Okay. Just me, David and ML. Okay. Yeah, ML did a three times in a row. He did the triple triple bro. That's great. Triple triple. No, why? I mean, he's done it more than once. That's that dude. What sort of a level is that? That's incredible, huh? Unreachable level. That's what it was. Wow. I didn't actually know that. Yeah. Mad, didn't it? What did was that kind of a, was that something that you had aspired to? And like, I guess it's because in Slope style, yeah, especially in that moment, like crankworks was kind of the pinnacle

9:28Slope style event Slope style series. Is that something that you had on your list where you're like, I really want to get a triple crown under my belt. To be honest, I didn't think it was possible. Really? Yeah, because the first year that I actually had the chance to win it, it was before I had even won crankworks. And I had really good success at like, not smaller events, but events that weren't crankworks level, highest level. And then I went into 2017 and I hadn't won a crankworks yet. And that was like when they, when the triple crown had been introduced like the year before. And so I didn't think it was possible. I was like, three events in one season. Man, I can't win one of them. So then I won Roto. Yeah. And then that was a big confidence builder because I was like, oh, damn, like I can win these events. So then I just tried to keep that going. If I have my memory right, it was in Brooke that I also won in that season. And then we were in Whistler. Yeah. And I was like, what is going on? Just one Roto, and I won Innsbrook, and now I have

10:33this triple crown chance. And then Brandon was still around. And he was obviously like the king of Whistler. Yeah. So I kind of, again, was like, it's not possible. Like even if I do my best run, I won't get it. But then I was like doing practice and stuff. And then some of the fellow riders were, I don't know if they were lying about this, but they were like, hey, man, like I think if you do this run that we're seeing you do like you could get it. So I was like, oh, amazing. Like let's go, let's go for this. How much pressure do you feel? Because it's like, like you say, you've won two, and then you're here. Yeah. And it's like, you know, let's not forget how many people are at Red Bulls. Yeah. It's like the maddest thing ever. And it's not I've never seen anything when I sat eyes on that. I was like, for sure. Like God, and you're doing it. Yeah. Yeah. The first time I definitely felt in that year, 2017, I felt a lot of pressure. Because that's all people were talking about. And then like I was saying, Reader, who is the most consistent, unreal competitor I've ever seen, he had the opportunity of the year before. And he never messed up a comp, comes to Whistler with the chance to win the triple crown and completely messed it up.

11:35So I was like, this pressure is just, yeah, go over, you know, but I just tried to stay level headed and just tried to get the run done. Because in slope style, like can't think about those out of factors, the run that you have to do just has to be the main focus. You just have to keep replaying that in your head again and again, manifesting it. Can I just ask him, so you turn up here now, like you know, how long does it take you to know that run, like that you want to put together? And then is it just a case of working to get every trick that you want on each jump as you go down? Is that like that's what you say, by putting a run together? And you won't really change that. You're like, I need to do this. I want to do that. I want to win. I need this. So you stick with those tricks, even if you keep crashing them or do you soften up and go, right, I ain't going to get that. And how is it? Because you know, that is a dream scenario, which never occurs. You see that you see the course, like even before you do, they show us like a little course drawing or a course map or someone sends you a little course photo or something. So you see

12:35it start like, oh, maybe I can get this little course 720 going over here. Maybe a little cash roll over here. I'm going to a triple tap over here. And then you arrive. You see the course first course walk. You're like, well, that's not going to work here. But maybe that could work here. So you kind of like start changing it. And then again, you ride the course and then again, it changes. You hit you hit a certain jump and you're like, no, wow. And then you hit another one and you're like, well, you know, this trick that I didn't think was possible could maybe go on that jump. So you're consistently trying to find a strategy of a run that's as high level as you can make it, but also not stupid. Because sometimes if you put a run in front of you and commit to it when you can't do it, that's how you run yourself into a wall, you know, like it's almost like, like, it's almost like a game plan in football. Like if you have like a coach is like an American football, if you like have a game plan to like run the ball, but you can't run the like the defensive stopping it, you can't just keep running the ball. Like you got to change the game plan. He kept

13:38trying he could not land it right exactly. Yeah, like his casual and twisters. He knew he knew that trick would get him on the podium. Sometimes it was not the right. It's up to me to try it. Totally. That's right. I remember seeing it. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But sometimes, but sometimes it pays off, which is also a crazy thing to think about mentally. Sometimes you're like, no, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this trick. I'm going to do this run and I will not take no for an answer. And then that attitude can also be successful. That's why slope style is so difficult because it's like the end result you like hindsight is crazy because you're like, I sure just done that. It's almost shit. Everyone else is going to do either. Well, that's another hard thing is you cannot let the other riders influence your own riding. And the person who's always going to be most critical of your riding is yourself going to be watching practice. I'm going to see someone double flip over here. Someone from flaveration crazy over here. You're like, man, my riding, not my riding, not enough of this competition, but you can't. You got to be like,

14:38no, like, my riding is going to keep that strength that mental fortune all the way through. I mean, it is the same in down a bit, but totally. It was like yours is more graphic because like you say, you see someone do a double back. We've talked so much to so many other athletes and other disciplines about like that flow state. What is that like in slope style? Like talk me through the interesting to have you talk us through like one of those one of the wins that you've had at a competition. Like, yeah, the flow state is dreamy in slope style. It's almost when you feel like everything is happening in slow motion. The worst thing in slope style is when you drop in and you feel like everything's happening a million miles per hour. That's when it's so easy to mess up. You know, like you drop in case here, like, oh, I can't pedaling too far in the next one. Oh my god, the jump is already here. What trick? Oh, I forget what trick. Like when everything's happening a million miles per hour, that's when things get sketchy. But sometimes you drop in.

15:42You land the first trick like more smooth than you could imagine. You're like, oh my god, I'm on. You come to another part of the run that you're nervous for. You're like, oh, let's hope this one goes. You land perfect again. You're like, oh, now I'm really on. And then it's just happening so slow. You know, you're reaching, it comes down to the, it's crazy. I don't know if it's the same as in downhill. It almost comes down to the breathing. Yeah, you feel like you have the perfect feeling of self-readiness. We need the jumps, you know, everything synced up. Everything. Yeah, you're like between every feature, the pumping. You need to do a pedal here. You need to pump here. That's so interesting. Like if you reach that state, then, then that's when the best runs possible happen. But in a way, sometimes those hectic ones that feel like a million miles per hour, sometimes those are exciting and get you the win too, but that's rare. That's rare. Is there a run that you're like, that was a perfect run that you've had throughout your career so far? For me, the best one is the triple crown year when I did win. Yeah, because there's a few things

16:45that factor into it. So before that year, I was one for eight in Red Bull Droid runs. I had eight Droid run opportunities up until that point. And I had landed one of them. And I was like, no, I got a triple crown at and I'm one for eight. That's terrible. Yeah. You know, and in that competition, I had already, I came down and landed my first run. And then I was, and I got like, I don't know, a 90 or something. So that was already a huge win for me. I was like, this is the most important event in our sport. Win, triple crown or not, win this competition or not, I did this run that's been my nemesis for all these years. And then Reader went in front of me, I had to clutch up and be the last one to come down. But it already felt like a win. And this is like after the year before that I had messed up the triple crown opportunity. And the Reader had messed up the one the year before. Then I messed it up 2017. It never happened at this point.

17:46No, no, it seemed unwinnable. And then for me, it was already like, the triple crown is impossible anyway. For me, today has already been a big win. Yeah. I'm the last one to drop with a huge opportunity in the palm of my hand. Let's go out there and seize this opportunity. And I felt like I just dropped in and I found that flow state. Is that already done the first one? I just had to upgrade a couple little things. So I was like, okay, I'm on with this. Let's keep going. Like, and then it just like, and another thing I feel like I said this in a couple of interviews, Eric Fedko is his first joyride. He dropped right before me and he had done the same, not the same, but same vibe. First joyride, he was guaranteed a third place. Pink T-shirt, no red bow yet. He turned around at me and he was like, go in this shit. So I had the support of my peers. It felt pressureless. Yeah. And I just felt like that was when I really felt like I had the best run of my life. And up until this point, it's like still the one that resonates with me. So yeah.

18:46That's so cool. I like, so you can feel it. You can feel it. You can feel it. You're talking about it. And like, you can feel it. It's one of those sports where you can see all of it as well. And like, we can see you're so close to the action. Like, I've watched so many Slops Out of Events at the crank works and like seeing you guys drop in, like seeing the camera on you, you know what I mean? There's just like, it's such a pressure cooker. But we were talking about it before this and it almost feels like Slops Out of it. Like, you guys don't really get to be that comfortable because the format changes. And I don't know if it's because, like, it's more of a young sport. But like, you know, you've have like a best trick. You have like, you just went to Red Bull District ride. There's like the Slopestyle Super League now. How do you feel about that? Like, is that something? And it almost feels maybe correct me if I'm wrong. But is it driven by the

19:47riders? It's hard to say what it's driven by. It's such a interesting sport in that sense. Because there's almost no perfect format. Certain events are so exciting because the courses made for it and everyone is doing awesome runs. Sometimes it's the other way around. The course is kind of like limiting and it feels like we can't do the best runs we can. During the ML reign of Domination, I feel like he would do this run that was instantly unbeatable and then people kind of didn't even want to watch anymore, which is crazy because it's not even sure. It's not always about wins. Like, the rest of the field is also doing insane runs. Who cares that this guy is doing? You know, who cares? But this guy is doing 97, like watch him admire him. But also like, there's a battle that's below him. And I feel like that's one of the reasons why there's been these tries for format changes. Competition is like district ride. It's not possible to do a normal two run format because we got to go up elevators. We got to ride three different courses. It's just got to be different. I feel like

20:49that's interesting in a way because we're not stuck to one exact format. Like downhill is like, you know, I mean, I guess that's like one. The conditions are different, but it's always one. I mean, not no, not even because you're still have you're always like and for the last 20 over 20 years, it's a finals run. Totally. One person on the hill passes person down and like, you know, there's no kind of outside fact, even from the judging perspective or something like that. You don't we don't have to ride one course over here and then another course over here. Yeah, I honestly, I was talking to someone with other slope style guys earlier this year. And I feel like eventually or like if it's possible, it would be cool to have a world tour that has like all these different kind of events. Even sometimes I feel like it'd be sick to have an event that's one big air. Like in a snowboard snowboard. And so we're the king. They just have one big air. BMX X games,

21:50they have their company. They also have best trick on whatever jump they want. Like, so if we have these events that sometimes it's a traditional slope style, sometimes it's slope style with the new shootout format that we've introduced. Sometimes it's a big air. Sometimes it's a district ride. I feel like that also keeps the fans engaged because it's not like downhill. We don't have a world tour that has a bunch of events that matter so much for the overall. We have these events that are related because they're on the same tour with the similar athletes. But like it'd be sick if you have just a different vibe of competition because then you can have a different winner every time. And all the different riding skills can be shown because everyone in slope style comes from a different background. Some people were coming from BMX like we're talking about. Some people rode bike park as they were kids. Some people. So yeah, totally big mountain free ride. And then some of the guys like actually grew up dreaming of this slope style dream. And then now they're here. So some of them come from down. It's still time. Yeah. I'm never sure. I literally I've never done a 360.

22:55I've never done a straight and zinc. We're going down. I've never done a back flip. Like, I forget it. Me neither. Anybody else. Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Unfortunately. Every time I see Greg Greg, Manard has this thing where he needs to do a back flip once a year. Yeah. And so I was here last year and was riding behind him on Dirt Merchant. He pulled out, did a back flip. Flip on Dirt Merchant. Which jump? So it's the one is like new Dirt Merchant. So it's the one you do a drop. It's like kind of a step up. And it's before like you before the bigger drop, bigger step up like near the bottom of it. You know that step up? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Crazy to just pull that out in a train as well. Nick, like, yeah, maybe explain what the format is now. Like, how does the Soul PSYP Super League work? Because I know you're doing, you're doing super well right now. Yeah. The season's been going all right so far. Kind of messed up a district ride. Kind of pulled it back with the seventh place finish. But Soul PSYP Super League, we just thought that the overall tour because of the

23:58lesson number events kind of stopped being significant. So we decided on this Soul PSYP Super League that has five regular season events. The last one is going to be Whistler, Soul PSYP. And then we have the playoffs. The one round of the playoffs is Silver Star. And then, so let me explain, the regular season is like a normal season in its points rankings. And the top three will get a buy into the Super Bowl of Slope style, which is going to be in Mont Saint-Anne, which is going to be sick. And then the playoffs for him is in Silver Star, where the top 18 athletes that are not in that top three get one last chance to make it into the top seven to then get added into those three for 10 final competitors for basically a big Super Bowl World Championship. Eventually, I think we want to have more regular season events, more playoff rounds, like traditional sports, you know, not just one playoff round, more playoff

25:00rounds, so the buys almost matter more. And then so that last event really seems meaningful. And like we're having that one last battle for the World Championship. You think you could ever put it in like a stadium or something like that? GM style? Yeah, like I don't know if we have had these conversations so many times, if we just had the audience of something like a supercross, it would work amazing. Because the weather, first of all, we always are complaining about the way. And I guess like the rain sometimes, but the stadium element would eliminate that. It would be enough to say so visually pleasing, the big screens. It would obviously be less mountain bike because we go from the mountains to the stadium, but I think this could allow for such an entertaining tour. Those stadiums are just huge. Yeah, the huge. So unless we have a Whistler crowd or District Ride crowd, it's hard to fill, but that would be the dream. We've sat around brainstorming stadium style for years.

26:04So thanks for suggesting, bro. Yeah, hey, hey, get them in the stadium. Yeah. I feel like the other thing I know you know you from a lot of people know you from is just spinning. Like the Twister is a 1080, which you've gone way past now, which you feel. No way past, but one more rotation past. That's crazy. That's actually crazy to me. I mean, that's five, right? Not a four for four. Four. Okay, 10 a.k.a. 10 a.k.a. I wanted to ask you this. So like when you're riding up, they all ramp there. All that speed and you like you kind of you kind of stole the bike, right? Like you're basically like force yourself to yet. And that's it. But it feels to me that everything you do in your is set up in a micro second on the face of that ramp. And it is almost like you kind of like you turn the bars and it creates the spins, right? That's how you like I watch it in absolute all my I can't believe what I'm seeing and

27:06that you have that precision to know what you're doing. Obviously thousands of hours of practice get you there. But like, yeah, that's how it is. It's like it's it's it's madness. It's crazy. Do it. Yeah, it's snowboarding in a way because I am using the takeoff kind of anti-carve alley-oop style off the takeoff. And then I turn so much in the takeoff and then I kind of use my legs and arms to pop off of both wheels to avoid the end of the takeoff. You know what I mean? That's why I'm like you've stowed it out there because I've got it. Yeah, I've got to cheat the first part because you can't just go off and then start you will never make it around. I have to start rotating on my bike so far before the end of the takeoff and then I have to pop up because if not, then I will just case my back wheel on the takeoff. I have to like avoid the takeoff. And then I have to come around that fast. Yeah. And then I also have to extend my body because if you stay, if you stay bent arms and legs, then you will not accelerate your spin. You have to almost

28:11spin like a top, you know? So spin like a top. And for the twister, it's more chill because you just like kind of spin a couple of times and then you come out of it. But the 1440 feels like you're in it until you can't be anymore. Honestly, the, this might, this might sound crazy, but when I was trying to perfect my 1440s, I had to close my eyes because I would just, you would just see blurring as you would see different things around that would make you feel like, oh, this one's not coming around or this one's going to be over rotated, which is impossible. You cannot rotate more, like I'm barely coming around, you know? So I would like be looking and be like, whoa, whoa, so when I was perfecting these on airbags set up at the masses of dirt shows, I would try and get the takeoff perfect and then I would just close my eyes. One, two, three, four. And then at the very

29:12end, when I would feel myself, I don't also have to count at the very end. And yeah, like to know roughly where you are, just to know how many rotations you've done. This is quite a lot to take in for a midnight. He's down in our eye. I can tell you. It happens so fast that sometimes you're like, wait, have I done two or have I done three or is that the four? So I'm actually sort of, you just, you just come out of it after the third, three and a half kind of. And then you can't change it. You can't like, no, that's why I think about it. You just have to like instant off the lip, right? It's between that first initiation and staying in it. Hold it in it. Yeah, because if you don't stay in it, everything stops. And as soon as you stop it, then see you later. You'll let it backwards. But it feels like it's going bad. The last thing you want to do is stay in it, right? I suppose is that what you mean? No, no, no, no, the last thing you want to get out. No, no, no, no, no. The last thing you want to do is get out of it. Once you initiate the 1440, you must stay in all costs, whatever you think's going on. You must stay right. The car is

30:16yes. That's why the closing the eyes works because it doesn't matter what you, it doesn't matter what you see. You've got to stay in it. Just staggering. It is, man. I imagine you're up there with your eyes shut. What's going on? That's how I would feel if I did a, did a backflip where a 360. That's a, I've tried to be a 60-inch head of clothing. I get it. I do understand it, but I just point what you'll do it. It's so big as well. You know what I mean? Like the consequences, you had a massive. So this interesting to me because you are the only person in the world doing a 1440. But then you, but then you're in this sport where you are being judged. And like the judges have never done a 1440. How do you reconcile with that as an athlete, I guess, to just be able to say like, well, what do I think a 1440 is worth? Like, how difficult is that? But you're the only one that knows maybe how difficult that is. Honestly, judging in slope style is one of the most difficult things. So it's hard for me to ever be pissed at the judges.

31:18Like sometimes you feel like you got underscored, but sometimes you get overscored. You know, you can do a run that you don't think is that good. And suddenly you're up there. Sometimes you do a run that you think is awesome. And it's not as good as, as you expect it score wise. But it's tough. They don't have time to do it with the 14. Like you were asking, luckily they've rewarded me pretty well. For over the years, because I was the only one doing it. I feel like that adds a lot to it. They kind of seed that. And they're like, well, there's guys doing 1080s. And there's David Gudget doing 1080s with no handers and stuff like that. But no one's at an extra rotation. So I did it in a slope style running big white a couple years ago. I got a 97 and one that comp. Just now at district ride, I won that big air district with the 14 and they gave me a 96.3. So it seems like they think it's not really. You know, I think so. I'm going to great. And I guess like, how does that, how does that compare to like a Red Bull rampage for you? Like personal experience. Oh, that's so different. Yeah.

32:23I did a rampage when the event was different. I feel like it was part of FMB World Tour. There was more of us. It was over 10 years ago. That's why I'm motivated to potentially try and get back in and experience this new wave. Because when I'm in the commentary booth or there at rampage, I can kind of be like, I know exactly what these guys are feeling right now. But like, kind of not really because it's going to late to that. I've been up there before. But over the years, it's gotten gnarlier. The builds have gotten better. The bikes have gotten better. The knowledge of everyone, including the builders and the athletes have gotten better. And that has led to scarier riding, scarier features, more insanity out there. So it's different. When I drop in for a 1440, I feel risk. I feel like, hopefully I land this because if I don't, I'm probably going to explore both explode, both tires simultaneously. And that always feels

33:25feels pretty bad. But rampage is like, is savage, you know, you never know what can happen. Like we've seen some horrible stuff there over the years. So you always got to keep that in mind. Because rampage is the type of event that someone can become a legend from or someone can end their career on. So that's always really one of the only events in the sport that that risk is really prevalent there, you know, in hope style. It always feels scary for sure. But we are more scared to mess it up. You know what I mean? Talk a little bit about that because I think, especially for me, thinking about doing tricks, it seems like the most gnarly thing ever. But I think everyone can kind of relate to that feeling of risk. And like how do you deal with that level of, I guess, risk like that. I would have just, I can just feel that feeling in my stomach right now. You know, like how do you, how do you deal with that as a slow-pest rider? Because I think

34:26mentally it's one of the places that you guys are really, really like super, super high level in sport in general. Yeah, it's a tough thing to deal with that. I feel like it comes down to really trusting yourself and your feelings. Like I was talking about earlier, the visualizations and the manifestation has to be there. You have to in practice, in the competition, the day of the competition, you have to replay every trick in your brain, seeing it go perfectly. If suddenly that trick in your brain is replaying, like you casing and going over the bars, you got to get that out. You got to get that out. How do you do it? You got to like change, you got to switch the video, you know, you got to swipe over and play a new video in your brain, you know? Because because usually like what you visualize will happen. Because if you have a part of your run that you're super nervous for and you just visualize, oh, I'm going to mess that up, I'm going to mess that up. I'm scared to mess that up. Then it probably is going to happen. But if you're like,

35:30no, I'm going to stomp this, I'm going to go to the next feature, I'm going to stomp this. Right. I'm going to take couple pedals. Yeah, yeah. I'm going to pump. I'm going to go for this. It's going to go perfect. Yeah. Then like that's when that slow-mo, flow-stay can come to life. Otherwise, it's just impossible. Yeah. But also you got to trust yourself because you get these crazy feelings during your runs. I don't know if it's the same downhill in certain sections. Sometimes during the run, you're like, I got to ease up here. I got to ease up here. I get in the lot of control. Yeah, massively. So you know, and then you're like, you kind of downgrade a certain section to then upgrade or, or at least change the ability. Or you don't like a jump. Yeah, say minute, yeah. Or like slip a pedal. Yeah. Suddenly then you got to do a bigger trick somewhere else to try and make up for. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that's right. You think you're going to have a chance on another bit of the track. Exactly. How hard is it for you to come back from injury? And this takes me back to Australia when I was compensating or attempting to compensate on a slight style. And you over that bridge, you know, what was that trick? And you went down. Those two are those 1080. Yeah. And you got up and you ran down the track and you

36:32looked up and looked like the camera got your eyes and I was like, he is really hurt himself. Like your eyes were on stalks. It was actually a renders. I didn't like it. But like, obviously, you bust your wrist. Yeah. Yeah. Like that's something. I don't know how you get over that in Cypestyle because anytime you fall, which isn't difficult to do, I mean, that's, that's, is it mentally a big, big problem that come back? Or you just, for me, that one was hard at first because I was really lucky and blessed to be injury free with so many hard crashes and slopestyle over like 10 years basically. I would smoke the ground. I'd be like, wow. Yeah, that's a man. But I know like I think I'm good. Yeah. And then that one, I land my first run. I go back up. I'm like, you know what? I'm going to 1080 over this, this massive over gap. Case go over, hit the ground. And then once again, I was like, ooh, like, maybe I'm good and then I look down in my, my hand is just pointing the wrong way. Is that what it was? Like my hand was, my hand was pointed this way and then I see the bone sticking out. And you're all like, you're like, you're

37:33not like, it wasn't like sticking out, but it was definitely deformed in, in a way. And then I was kind of like, oh, no. I have a GoPro video of it. And then like one of the medics or marshals is like, are you okay? And I was like, no, I broke my wrist. I broke my arm. I was like, honestly, forensic mode. Like I couldn't believe that I was injured. And it was dislocated too. Dislocation is like this burning, horrible feeling. And I was like, oh, this is the worst thing ever. And then the hospital experience was good. The game of the green whistle. I still felt the pain, but I didn't care about it anymore. I remember I think like Ben and Paul Kuderk were like, man, the ambulance, like you were saying some funny shit. Like, oh, I broke my wrist, but I don't give a shit, man. I remember like the pain still being there, but I didn't really care about it anymore. They took me to the hospital. They put my wrist back into place, put me in a sling. And then I remember those first moments after because I hadn't been injured ever. I kind of had like some horrible thoughts. I was like, I risked it all. And I'm never going to be able to do it again,

38:34man. Well, you know what I mean? Because like, you're like so in pain and you're like, you feel like you took this chance that was so dumb. And like, we still had events to go on the season. I was like, I've ruined my season. I'm not going to be able to do this. I'm in doubt. But then like, that's just, yeah, you get it. Like it's just like, there's more going to go. But you go and it goes wrong. And you like, that's it. Yeah, it's the worst show in ever. And you're hurt, which is also another it's right. I didn't it. So it's, but like, as it started getting better, I never experienced that either. I was like, not never, but it had been a while since I had experience getting back. Yeah. Rehabbing, I felt pathetic. I was in the hospital doing wrist curls like this. It's barely. I was like, what is going on? I'm doing, I'm doing, I'm doing, this is legs and whites. Like pathetic, you know, but just had to be on it, playing with these weird wrist things. I try to get the wrist back. And then I remember getting on the bike the first time and like, jumping

39:34again, epic feeling. Yeah. I was like, I am back, man. You know, yeah. And I had never experienced, not never once again, but it had been a while for me, for me to experience. And then it kind of also made me, it was thankful for it in a way, because it made me realize how much I love it. True. I was like, I was down and I wanted to get back. And now I'm back in this, this is the best feeling in the world. This is like what I live for you guys probably had that same, same feeling. Like you're like, I love this. And I'm this is what I want to do. Like, I'm willing to go through that pain, that agony, those bad mental thoughts, you know, that's right. It's just an inconvenience in it. And I it is, but you're somewhere near back. Yeah. That was nothing. Right. Nikolai, too, you've, you've really come into your own as a presenter, commentator. Like, it's amazing to see like you are so articulate. And yeah, can you relate to the riders? You still look at ride it at such a high level. Is that something you enjoy? Oh, I enjoy it so much. And I

40:41feel like I've been giving so many opportunities for it, which I'm so thankful for. And it's awesome for for me that I enjoy it. Cause I've talked to some other people that have been on camera that don't enjoy it. Like, obviously you guys enjoy it. And I feel like that probably took a while. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like I, I, it definitely like, I think as an athlete, I always felt like you are more prepared for it because you, you obviously are an expert at your sport. And you kind of are used to being interviewed and things like that. But there's like a lot more to it than just, you know, being comfortable or knowing what you're talking about. Well, you're not yourself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. As an athlete, you can't already go wrong. But then as a presenter, yeah, like find your, you have to find yourself. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. I just, I feel like I was, because the cameras were put in my face from the time I came into slow style, always doing interviews after the run. And that helped me be comfortable on camera and be, like experience

41:43enjoyment being on camera and then getting some opportunities with hosting and commentating for Red Bull rampage. Yeah. Um, were you nervous? Yeah, definitely. It's a different types of nerves. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, uh, it's not nerves that you're scared to try it or go down. But yeah, you want to like do a good performance and you want to be able to tell these stories, because I feel like in mountain biking, storytelling is so key. Like that's why we're sitting here right now to tell these stories. Yeah. So I feel like telling the stories is so key. And to tell the perfect story on the day when the camera is on and the your mic is on, you got to be locked in. Yeah. So you're kind of nervous to have your facts straight, be able to have your words right. And I feel like you can always improve. It's kind of like with writing. Oh, yeah. There's never, never a day that you can't get better at something. And with presenting and stuff, it's like that same new challenge. You can always sound better, tell a better story, have better vocab. It's always that improvement. So I feel like I just been enjoying the process. Yeah. It's mad. I like you. I

42:50absolutely love trying to do a lot of real. And you know, we do. Yeah. We love trying to do a perfect broadcast. I mean, that's fun, isn't it? I mean, working with you is crazy because I remember during Castle ride, you've like been so experienced and done so many events over the years, but you're still rehearsing your intro to make sure it's on point. The right energy, the right words, you know, and I was like, man, this guy, like if I never worked with this guy, I would think he would just knock it out first go, but you are like, you know what I mean? You care about it. And that's a nice thing. It keeps me sharp at my job. No, I think it's actually that. Yeah, it's a thing because I love it like you so much. I don't want to do a bad one. I don't want to not come back. I love it. You know, it's like that, man. We you got a performance. You got it's the same as being an athlete. Yeah. You got to be good. Sure. That's right. It's cool, isn't it? Where do you see yourself going? Like the mix of things you want to like, obviously, you also have a YouTube show, you do some recap stuff. I mean, you do the presenting commentary. You're a top flight athlete. Like do you want to keep that bundle or you really want to focus in on your riding? Like where do

43:51you see yourself going? Man, it's so hard to say because I still feel very motivated to do more riding. I still have more tricks that I want to put in contest runs to do on dirt. These young, these new young riders are motivating me so much because they're so fun to hang out with and they remind me of that fire that I had when I was a younger rider. You got everything to prove. You're so motivated for it and you're just like enjoying all these new experiences. So being able to live that with them with guys like Kaden and yeah, like in me and like all these young bucks that have everything to prove. It's just so motivating to still be riding with them. Like I was just riding with Tommy G and district ride. Yeah. And he was riding a little proud. He was judging district ride but he was riding practice and he was like, dude, I look at the start list from 2014 district ride. You are the only one left bro. Yeah, I'm still here. You know, it's so it's unreal for me to still be here.

44:57Having the opportunity to compete. Still right. Yeah, and like having a have a chance to still do some good results. Yeah. But super pumped on hosting doing things like this. Like you were saying that after the run slope style show, I feel like there's so many good personalities in slope style which don't get talked about. Totally. And if people were to just discover those personalities, they would become so much bigger fans of watching these competitions because these guys are epic. My homies that I compete with. The whole crew of us is just a bunch of funny ass guys and girls. So it's honestly. Yeah. And then and then I now I get put on a fifth alternate rampage. So now I got to go out to Utah and try harder to get a to get a real wild card and get back into that. Like that's also motivating in a way. So I just trying to really live in the moment. I feel like living in the moment as what as kind of like what has made me continue to love it and have this passion. Yeah.

45:58Because if you look too far into the future, sometimes like things get confusing but when you live in the moment, you kind of can just love it. Yeah. Everything. I mean, it's been so amazing to I feel like we kind of seen you in parallel like, you know, riding at crank works and then commentating and stuff. And I feel like you've elevated the sport in so many different ways from like you said, through other people, through yourself, the riding. So yeah, I really appreciate it. And congratulations. Thanks so much. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that's right. Hey, he's absolutely right. But you, you know, you've worked for him. It's not. Yeah, it doesn't just happen. Yeah, that's right. Amazing to see you. Well, thank you so much for coming on. It's been great. Thanks for having me. That was fun. Come on. Really cool. That was really great. Yeah, that was sick. I think it goes. You know, Nikolai, Rob, I feel like is is this unique talent, you know, to be able to have these world first, to be able to push the sport, but then also to be on the media side to have this big personality like I do remember him running around after his runs, throwing his helmet. We were all

47:01like, what in the world? Like, but it's so it's so cool for him to bring that level of hype. Like, it's so real, isn't it? Totally. Yeah, that's what that's exactly that. He lives. Yeah, he lives. Yeah, the sport, whether it's on the bike or in the commentary box or being around his peers, like he absolutely genuine. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he absolutely loves what he does. And you know, it's amazing in it that when one opportunity being so good at the biking is like created this other opportunity and he's perfectly stepped into those shoes as well. Yeah, I can't wait to see him out at Red Bull Rampage either in front of the camera or behind the mic. I will never wait that way. Well, it's either position he's going to work. So it doesn't really matter, you know, he's going to be amazing whether he's riding or whether he's comming, you know, that's the fact in it. Yeah, there's no there is no other Nikolai regatta. It is actually so true. The same is not two of them. So we're going to have one on track and one commentator, and that would be perfect. To be honest, I think that may be a little bit too much. We hope you enjoyed this one as much as we did. So make sure you follow, like,

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