Nolan Wells Update: Family & Friends Speak Out

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1:20And restrictions visit hymns.com. Hello everyone. Welcome to Hot Topics at Don Lemon Show, 10 a.m. Eastern Time. I can't say New York today because I'm actually not in New York. As you can see, we're in a location that we will tell you about later that you'll find out. But we're in South Carolina and we're starting off our midterm wave of election coverage right now. 2026 and possibly 2028 will tell you about why we're here. I can tell you basically it is a get out the vote campaign that some major Democrats and major political operatives and politicians in the country that they are doing before the midterms. And so we'll kick that off. We'll let you know sometime throughout the day if we can do that or because we're being

2:21very low key about it because some of the folks don't know what's about to happen here at this particular location that we're at. So welcome everyone. Thank you for joining us. Let us know where you're streaming from. And the first order of business, of course, is to hit the like and thumbs up because that does affect the algorithm more people become aware of our conversation and our channel. Make sure it's pinned to the top of our chat too as well, team. So thank you. Sophie, I got in at midnight, got to bed at 2 a.m. and here we go. We have two guests who are going to help us discuss this and that is the death of feminist and women's rights icon Gloria Steinem who as we woke up this morning, we found out passed away. Another one of our legends, one of our icons, one of our leaders, we are losing so much of them lately. Here's a report and we're back with two women who are very familiar with her. They knew her and one of them's mom knew her as well and was part of this movement. Here's a report on Gloria Steinem. Gloria Steinem, the feminist icon and celebrated author, has died.

3:26Steinem was one of the most visible symbols and potent voices of the women's movement in the US and a fierce advocate for feminist causes throughout her life. She was born in Toledo, Ohio and attended Smith College in the 1950s at a time when she said women were being educated to be mothers and wives. She began her career as a journalist but later spoke about the frustrations of not being taken seriously when she wanted to write about politics. In her 30s, she joined the editorial board of New York Magazine and her writing became more political. She credited covering and abortion rights hearing in 1969 for triggering her career as a women's rights activist. At a time when feminism was largely viewed as a white middle class movement, Steinem didn't shy away from the intersectionality of feminism and racial equality. It's a kind of blue collar working woman who needs these reforms the most, I think. And also poor women and welfare women.

4:28But I think it really is going forward on all levels that want and it's an important bridge between black women and white women. She co-founded the National Women's Political Caucus in 1971 and a year later co-founded Miss Magazine in response to the lack of journalism produced by and for women. Her activism continued well into her later years. In 2013, she was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Barack Obama for her dedication to advancing civil rights and for changing her women thought about themselves. Four years later, she spoke before thousands as the keynote speaker of the historic women's march on Washington. Just this march in Washington today required a thousand more buses than the entire inauguration. A thousand more. Steinem went on to say that it was less important that younger people listen to her and more important that they listen to themselves.

5:31And that was a report on Gloria Steinem, a true icon. I want to bring in two women who I think are true icons as well. And that is Monique Pressy who is an attorney. And as I said, an icon also Molly Jungfast, writer, thought leader whose I say your mom was the second wave of the women's rights movement. I believe the third phase or maybe the fourth phase or whatever that is. So Molly, why don't we start with you since your mom knew her. They had a relationship and your mom was part of the second wave. And by the way, before I even get to you, I want to thank you because I was watching a report that you did and you mentioned the civil rights movement and how the women's movement in many ways or in large part was based on the civil rights movement. And women like Shirley Chisholm, you said and Angela Davis were also part of that and it should not be forgotten as well. Yeah, for sure. And actually, I was just rereading a piece that one of the Gloria wrote, which was called,

6:32it's from New York Magazine. It's called After Black Power, Kamma Women's Liberation. So she was very much, you know, she worked with Angela Davis. She understood that you can't have women's rights with that civil rights and that civil rights, women's rights. And all of this is inextrable tied to each other. And Shirley Chisholm was, you know, just part of this, you know, a big part of how this movement started. So Gloria was, I knew her a little bit too. And she did, and she really did, I think, devote a lot of the end of her life to activism and to, you know, she didn't have children, but we were sort of all her children. And I'm sure that you can speak more to that, but that there was a sense in which this was about the carrying on this activism, right? Carrying on, because remember, if we think back to the time that these women started, right,

7:36women couldn't have credit cards. They couldn't have, they're on bank accounts. They couldn't- You can get bank loans without a man signing a signature of a man. It's crazy. Right. So a lot of the same tenants that, you know, that when we fought for civil rights, we fought for with women's rights. A lot of the same, you know, being a person, just like everyone else. And so I do think, and, you know, the kind of equal power to be able to be in the world and have a job and get credit. And so Gloria was amazing. And I think that she did a lot of work with trying to pass on the power of believing in herself and being able to be an activist and get other women involved in that. And I think that that legacy will go on forever. And she had, you know, in some ways, she had all of these children because she was so focused on other people continuing on the work. Right. Right on, Molly.

8:36Monique, you knew her. I didn't know her, you know, as a friend, but I would see her at be at events with her, be on the same podium or same panels with her. And she was always so gracious and welcoming. She never met a stranger. And you actually saw her recently within the last couple of years. Did you have a conversation with her? I can't hear you, Monique. You're muted, Monique. The picture that you all are seeing, and I know, Dawn, you would recognize some of them, your dear friends like Sunny Haasden, front of you, and to me, some you've had on your show like Shannon Watts. I saw so many people, Rhonda Fox, who brought us all together for the persist movement after she worked on in the Biden Harris administration and worked on the campaign. And Gloria had a talking circle for us, which was one of the things in her later years that she was doing often for all kinds of different groups, whether it was Emerge. I see the head of Emerge, Ashanti Golar in the picture.

9:39I see Karen Khan, Carolyn Pompey, Z Tina Chen. So many people, women who in their own rights have been strong in political and media circles who have been standing up for freedom and for democracy and for women's rights. And she was allowing for her home to be a gathering space for us to have candid conversations, not for us to all sit there and agree and be kind of like yes, choruses, but for us to challenge each other and challenge the ways that we were going to show up for each other and show up for the causes that we cared about. And this was December 2024. So many of us were raw with emotion. And in the months following that election, people had worked so very hard. And this was like a first step of us coming and saying, where do we go from here? And so I appreciate the times that I was able to interact with her. And so many people say she listened more than she talked.

10:43And in those rooms, that is what you would find that she was asking the questions and then listening and then bringing more people to the table and more people after that. And you know, now she is an ancestor. And she's carried the baton for as long as she possibly could. And she left a charge for all of us. And I think we all have to figure out whether we're doing enough to answer that call. Molly, you know, the question that everybody else is going to ask, right, do you appear on their programs? Do you watch? They'll say, Oh, what if we lost? I think we know what we lost, right? This is a legend. She's an icon. My question to her. So if you've ever furnished a restaurant, hotel or an office, you know the trail. Five vendors, five invoices, five delivery windows. But there's a better way to do this. Creighton Barrel Contract is a business to business program that covers three brands. Creighton Barrel, CB2 and Creighton Kids with one account, one order, one delivery. They've got durable plates and glasses, contract grade furniture, and lighting that looks custom

11:45that's built for the wear of busy space actually takes. And the best part is you're not doing it alone. A dedicated rep handles your project end to end from volume orders to design curation. Plus, members get 20% off, tax exempt checkout, and flexible payment with no minimums. Learn more at Creightonbarrel.com slash podcast. That's Creightonbarrel.com slash podcast. Her and I think up to you, and I think she would love this question, is what have we gained by having glorious Steinem be a part of this world? And what should we do moving forward from here? So I think that's a really good question. And I would say one of the really great things that Gloria did was she was really focused on solidarity, on educating, listening, going to different countries, working for women in different places. She sort of came through. She had a very tough childhood, and she was able to push through that.

12:52So she didn't have a lot of education when she was growing up because her parents didn't move around a lot, but she was able to educate herself by reading a lot of books. She ended up going to Smith College. And then with Ms, she really did try to elevate all different kinds of voices. And the thing I think that she did, which I think is what she got a lot of flag for, but I think was ultimately very important, which she went into, like really very patriarchal spaces and was able to get in there and advocate for women, for all different women. And I think that was incredible. And she did, I mean, remember her breakthrough writing was this piece about being a playboy bunny, right? And she used her beauty to get into spaces and expose what was happening. And she got a lot of flag for that, but she was really in allied, all different kinds

13:58of women, all different, you know, she really went different countries, different groups. And so ultimately she did really do great stuff. And she opened the conversation for all of us. And the fact that she supported it in her later years, all different activists and women doing different stuff, because she knew that you can't do this alone, that we need lawyers and activists and writers and feminists. And you know, we even need, you know, we need this movement needs to be broad and encompassing and it needs to include everyone in order for it to work. So she did all that. And you know, we lost, we weighed, but we've, but these women have gotten us very far and they've done a lot of stuff. And, you know, we have, we made some huge progress too. Yeah. Monique, same question to you. And, you know, it's not always true when people say, without such and such, there wouldn't be such and such, or I wouldn't be here.

14:59And I understand the sentiment around that. I think without Gloria Steinem, there would still obviously be a money presser here, but your path and your trajectory might be different if it wasn't for Gloria Steinem and women like her. And let's not forget, women's rights are civil rights, right? The two movements, it's not, it's not really a separate movement. It's people within the civil rights movement working for their rights. Right. No. And one of the things that I appreciate about Gloria during her life, she understood that there was no single group that benefited more from the civil rights movement than white women. And so when she was bringing people to the table, she was, she was bridging, as Molly just finished saying, she was ensuring that there were black women, brown women, Asian women in the room because she understood that even as we thought that some amongst us as women had advanced further than others and we were the ones, black folks, who were paying

16:03ultimate sacrifices for the gains that were made. And she did not run from that. And we can't run from that. You know, I see a lot of people who call themselves progressive, call themselves civil rights, activists and fighters who don't fully understand the history or aren't willing to acknowledge it. And that's some of what keeps us apart. Gloria was not a part of that. She was one who sat in the history, who lived in history, frankly, and was able to tell the story. And so I think what we have to do now is ensure that our storytellers, that we take these opportunities. When I look back to send you that picture, Donna, I looked at my text messages from that day and I was sharing with all my different girlfriend group chats. You'll never believe. Like I didn't say it beforehand because you know, you can't say things before they happen. But once it had happened and we put the pictures, I was texting everybody and saying, wasn't on my bingo card for this December, but this is what just happened.

17:06This is what I just experienced. This is where we're going from here. And so I think that those of us who share in those types of experiences, we now owe it. You know, I've got a 20 year old daughter and I'm telling my stories so that she can understand her place in the earth. And that is what Gloria did for us. Monique, I appreciate your words. Molly, I appreciate your words as well. And Monique is going to stay with us. Molly is going to go. But Molly, thank you so much. Have a great day. I hope to see you soon, neighbor. Molly's my neighbor. We're all friends here. Thank you, Molly, Drunk Fas. Check out her podcast over on the YouTuber anywhere you get streaming and also check out her social and you can also catch her on MS now. Thank you, Molly. We'll see you soon. Monique, we're back. We're going to talk about a couple of things. We'll have an update for you on the Nolan Well situation. And also we are discussing what's happening with Lindsey Clancy as well and some other

18:07things. So get ready, comment section because I know you guys are going to want to weigh in on that lemon heads, the elimination friend of the show, Monique Pressy, back with us right after we're from our sponsors. We spend a lot of time in the show talking about numbers, poll numbers, prices. Interest rates, approval ratings, coming out of Washington, right, all day long. That's all you hear. Well, there's one number a lot of people probably don't know about and it actually belongs to you and I'm talking about your blood pressure. And the thing about high blood pressure is that you may feel perfectly fine. That's why you have to check it. That's what I like about 120 life. They make it really simple. Here's what you do. You try it for 14 days. It's an experiment. Blood pressure, drink 120 life once a day and keep checking your numbers so you can actually see what is happening for yourself. No guessing, you're measuring here and especially right now when everything seems to cost more and I like that you can try it without making some huge commitment. Go to 120life.com.

19:08That's 120, L-I-F-E.com and use the code Don for 20% off. You can try it risk-free for two weeks. Your blood pressure doesn't come down. You get a full refund. These statements have not been approved by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Always check with your doctor. Always check with your doctor and thank you very much. We appreciate it. Our sponsors keep us powered. Let's do, I want to do an update first before we get to the Clancy story because I am wondering if this is going to be a hung jury in the Clancy situation. I want to talk about Nolan Wells and update that we have on our social media. Nolan Wells brother, at the Ocean Springs High School football team, people were concerned because the school did not honor him or mention him but his brother did. Also at his college as well, they honored him as well at the football game, the last football game that they had. There's an update.

20:08The family is speaking out. I think there's a post if we can from the mother if you can put that up where she responded to saying this was what Nolan wanted to be thinking about these things. The mother is still out there speaking out. She is still grieving. The family is honoring him and his friends, by the way, members of his football team at the college and his brother at the high school. His brother is Elmore Wandsley Jr. I don't know if people are wondering what is going on. There is no movement. I know that you're not the DA, you're not an investigator. What's happening? Why aren't we hearing anything? What's going on with the toxicology? All the things. The only time we're really going to hear is once the grand jury makes some sort of decision whether there's going to be charges or whether they're going to just dismiss it with no action but because it's quiet right now, doesn't mean nothing is happening.

21:12In fact, it could be being reviewed before the grand jury right now. That's not something we would know because that happens in secret. I'm not certain that quiet means no movement. Quiet means no resolution as of yet. The DA has already told us that until something happens in the grand jury that there's not going to be any sharing of top-sea findings or toxicology or witnesses or evidence, none of that is going to happen before all of that information got presented to a grand jury. We know that's where it is and we don't know how long that could take. Look, Monique, I love your take on things. You've been watching this, you and I have been discussing it somewhat about what's happening with the legal situation. There's Reverend Al Sharpton, they sent a letter of intent to sue. He responded saying that it was frivolous or his attorney said, well, he responded as well, saying, bring it and you're going to have to pay my legal pieces.

22:14You're watching as a legal mind. Hey, I'm running out to drop off a stack of letters and packages. Need anything shipped while I'm gone? Save the gas. Stamps.com lets you print, postage and schedule pickups right from your desk. Sink your contacts into the address book. Get detailed accounting insights and get notified the moment your certified mail is delivered. All from my desk? All from your desk. Join the four million businesses using stamps.com right now with Code Podcast and get your free welcome gift. Stamps.com Code Podcast. Texas and Fees Apply. What's going through your head? What are you? What thoughts can you share with us? I'm sure you don't want to share everything. What thoughts can you share with us about the investigation and the legal actions taking place? Some people have been arrested for making threats, et cetera. Right. And you know, you and I have talked a good deal about the role responsible media plays in cases like this where people who are not responsible, which you are on your show and which others

23:15have been in covering what is actually facts that can be proven or leads that are being followed or talking to witnesses who actually have information. There's been a lot other than that happening. And it's now led to some people having very serious charges, pressed against them, pressed against them. And I think that we've got the first trials set for threats that were made against witnesses who were involved in the case. So I issue the same caution that I always have. If it's not something that you know to be true or you have a factual basis for saying, then saying it publicly is dangerous. We slap allegedly in front of things that doesn't always help. And so while the public needs to continue pressuring for answers and demanding answers and while media plays such a role in ensuring that we get the answers, people really have to

24:19watch the way that they say whatever it is they're going to say because it's been shown that people lawyers now on behalf of witnesses that who may or may not have been involved in what happened to Nolan Wells and involved in his death. They have lawyers who are paying attention. And the last thing you want is to have your livelihood on the line or have to pay lawyers to defend you when you could have just chosen some different words and stayed out of the fire. So what does that mean? Help. Thank you for that. What does that mean? Intent to sue. What are they trying to negotiate with the Reverend Al Sharpton here? It looks like I would think it sounds like they don't want to sue him. They want something out of this perhaps. That's how I'm reading it as a late person. I'm not sure. They asked for an apology.

25:21They gave it. It was a 19 page letter intent to sue and it listed several times where in their opinion, the comments that were made by Reverend Sharpton were defamatory to the three friends who were in the picture that was shown of him. One of the last times he was seen alive and Reverend Sharpton's attorneys responded with their 15 page document saying that there were no defamatory statements. And so he's not going to apologize for defamation he didn't commit. And so now we'll see whether they go ahead with what they, whether the attorneys for the young men will go ahead with a lawsuit for whatever they believe happened that should not have occurred. And it went in great detail, the letter. I know that everyone has seen the letter at this point.

26:23At least everyone who wanted to see it, I don't want to make assumptions. But what they were basically saying is for instance that the three of them did not all go in the same boat with Nolan Wells to Horn Island nor did they all three of them leave in the same boat together. So the statements that were out there about them all coming together and leaving him there were not accurate. They gave other information in there about the fact that all of the people who went on all the boats all 27, I believe, immediately gave statements to the police while there were stories out there saying that they were refusing to cooperate, not cooperating with police. And again, Don, these are all things that you and I have discussed. There's a difference between the public knowing what's happening and what the actual investigators and district attorney's offices have at their disposal because they have not been reporting

27:23that information to the public. And I believe that on the one hand, that's one of the reasons why things went so wild and why so many things that were undocumented, that were misinterpreted, continued to be spun, tales being spun out there. But I also understand on the other side of it as someone who has worked as a government attorney that one of the reasons why you don't show your hand, give your information, tell who's giving witness statements, tell what the evidence is, is because then you tank what happens with the grand jury because you have a grand jury who has seen and heard parts of your evidence and made their own conclusions or jumped to conclusions based on lack of evidence or not having all of the evidence at the time. So they preserve that to protect witnesses and to protect the case that ultimately goes before the grand jury. And yes, this is the picture. This is a picture of the three young men who were with Nolan Wells at some point in the

28:30day who have now sent the intent to sue letter. And these are the three people who many have been calling names like killer murderers saying they left their friend, they came together, they should have left together. And the evidence that we know, at least the things we have documented at least now, is that they did not all go there together, nor did any of them all leave together. So there was a much larger group than the three, than the four men that have been the center of the external like public opinion trial of this case. Okay, so I think what basically what you're saying, I'll sum it up in, well, forwards. Be careful and be patient, right? And the patient part is harder because people want answers and it's when something is racially charged. And when there's no information, it's very difficult.

29:32Like I can't imagine, and frankly, don't want to have to imagine what the Wandsley family is going through, what the siblings are going through, what the extended family and friends are going through now, not knowing as each day passes that gets harder and harder. But for public at large, yeah, be careful what you say. All right. Monique, thank you for that. And now we're going to talk about Lindsey Clancy and their several new developments. And he did the live shot of the courtroom, not sure if it started yet or if you have it. But this is a courtroom in Massachusetts where the jury is still out. And that's not just a cliche or saying today, the jury is still out. It has been, I think, about seven days or so that they have been deliberating on this. They told the judge several times that they cannot, they cannot come to an agreement. We're going to take you again live if there's anything there. And then we're going to talk about the new developments. And I want to ask Monique something that has been pressing. But first a word from our sponsors. Look, I don't know about you guys, but this is crazy in the morning for me.

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31:39This morning deliberations in Lindsey Clancy's murder trial entering a sixth day, despite jurors hitting an impasse once again. After much deliberation, we are still unable to come to unanimous decision. But in the last ditch effort to break their latest deadlock, the judge sending them back into the deliberation room for a second time. Reading what's known as the two-erad regas charge, trying to avoid a mistrial. You must examine the questions submitted to you with candor and with proper regard and deference and respect to the opinions of each other. The jury of nine women and three men have the complicated task of reviewing hundreds of exhibits and testimony for more than 80 witnesses. As they weigh whether Clancy intentionally murdered her three young kids in 2023. It was a choice to take them with her. It was a horrible choice. Or if she should not be held criminally responsible because of postpartum psychosis. Are you concerned we're heading for a mistrial?

32:42I don't know. It's up to the jury. Meanwhile tensions outside of the courthouse high end. 56-year-old Don Light, seen rushing away from the media frenzy at her arrangement Wednesday, is accused of taking photos of jurors in a restricted employee parking lot. Why were you hurt by that? To see Lindsay and I did see her. The sanctity of the judicial system is at risk because of her actions. The retired nurse pleading not guilty to witness intimidation, as her lawyer calls it, a misunderstanding. How serious is that kind of arrest? It's very serious. Every day this case goes on, the danger of something from the outside coming into the courtroom and impacting Lindsay Clancy's ability to get a fair trial is in danger. As for what's next, Clancy's defense saying, they come back with a verdict. We'll see what it is if they don't. I'm ready to try it next week. All right, so that is the latest coming out of Massachusetts that's bringing a

33:43money press again. How many times has, I think it's been like three times they've told this judge, hey, we cannot come to any sort of consensus or agreement about guilty or innocence or should she be acquitted, not guilty? How many more tries are they going to have? Well, there's not any law saying how many times he can send them back or preventing him from sending them back to continue deliberating there is good law on what he should and should not say to them. And any defense attorney will tell you, he gave that dynamite charge yesterday. We hate that. It's called the two-year-old, Drieger's charge in Massachusetts where I practiced in DC. It was called the Winters Instruction. And one of the things that it says is that jurors should not assume that a new jury would

34:46be able to do better than them and that they should be reasonable in their deliberations in listening to other jurors. And so for defense attorneys, we look at that and it looks like it is weakening the beyond a reasonable ground standard and there's also grave concern that depending on how many people are in the jury who are not committed to whatever the rest of the jury wants, like just imagine it's only one juror that you do something like this and it unfairly pressures them into abandoning their own convictions about the evidence and going along with the rest and that is not what's supposed to happen with the jury. So and also for defense counsel, you know, for a defendant, a mistrial is a type of a win because the prosecutions then going to have to decide whether they're going to drop

35:46it and dismiss the charges, whether they're going to offer some sort of plea, whether they're going to spend millions of dollars to try the case again. And so deadlock, hunger, mistrial, that's a win for the defense and when a judge keeps going back and going back and saying try again when they are saying we cannot, you know, and for this jury to come back yesterday and still be deadlocked. And instead of at the end of the day, the trial judge saying, okay, thank you for your service. He sends them back to come back again and to me, it's very obvious at this point that this jury in the regular course of events has tried very hard and believes itself to be deadlocked. Like that's the foreman talking to the judge saying let us out of here and the judge is sending them back again. Monique, I want you to listen to this because we asked a question yesterday and we spoke

36:48to a doctor about this, about the disparities, the disparities between blacks and whites and the legal system, especially women and still waiting in line. Again, that's time you'll never get back. Save time and money with stamps.com. Over four million businesses have skipped the line with stamps.com. Send them to save up to 90% off carrier rates from your computer or phone right now. Print postage for Certify Mail, Register Mail, and packages in seconds. Then schedule a pickup right from your home or office. For a limited time, go to stamps.com and use code podcast for a free welcome gift. Taxes and fees apply. The medical system and the legal system as well. I want to play this. This is from a podcast. It's a similar sentiment to what we asked yesterday. What if Lindsay Clancy were black? Listen to this. This is the issue that I have with this. You get all these white women and some women of color and support and I understand the feminist aspect of it. But then somebody made a very great point that if you try to say that her emotions were

37:51out of control and she wasn't in control of her behavior, then you basically reinforce this idea of like women not being able to control themselves. Now I understand her monotranges. I understand postpartum and I understand that it's just a different thing that women have to deal with. It doesn't make them less. It doesn't make them inadequate. It's just different. So we just have to call this shit what it is. Y'all like to view white women as damsels and distress. Y'all like to enfance lives white women. Y'all like to make it seem like white women are not in control of their actions and holy they are innocent and they are incapable of wrongdoing. This is not the first white woman to kill her children. She is not the last. White women actually have a pattern of killing a fucking children. So Monique, do you think it would be different? By the way, we don't have to imagine if it was a black Lindsey Clancy. There is Latarsha Sanders. Similar, not exactly the same thing, but very similar. She has two life sentences.

38:52Now she is getting a new trial because her mental health issues were actually not brought up or allowed to be brought up in her trial. Yeah. That clip got a couple of things maybe right and others so very wrong. Let me just say first of all that postpartum depression is real and saying we can't control our hormones is tantamount to ignorance and describing what that type of effect is on women and depression is in women and how it shows up and how it shouldn't be ignored and needs to be treated. It happens to black women, white women, brown women and the whole thing about white women not wanting or people wanting to view them as being innocent and being damsels and distress. All of that is true. We know the history of racism in this country, but here is where we always get this wrong Don. What's supposed to happen is whether it's a white woman or a black woman, that illness

39:57is supposed to be taken seriously. It's that when it's black women, we are viewed as supposed to be so strong that we can endure things like twice the size of a man and if it's a white woman, she's a delicate flower. We both are fragile. We both experience postpartum depression. We know the statistics on black women not being listened to when we are dealing with issues with our pregnancies when we are dealing with issues in maternity wards. We die at larger numbers because people don't listen to us about what's going on with our bodies as we're carrying children. All of that is true. What we're then supposed to do with the information is credit it no matter the race of the woman. The what if the woman was black? Maybe if the woman was black, they would be treating this case differently, but that wouldn't make that right.

40:57That doesn't mean for the white woman, we don't take it seriously because it wouldn't be taken seriously for a black woman. It means we fight to fix it in the legal system where our concerns, our health issues, our morbidity issues are taken just as seriously as our white counterparts. That's what's supposed to happen. Yeah, I hear you on that. The question is for me is maybe these two cases or these two people are benefiting in some way from each other because, well, let's just say, she made benefit from, meaning Latarsha from the exposure of this story in the media. Maybe that helped to get her a new trial and we'll see if they treat her differently in the new trial. Well, I mean, it's the same judge and he's messing up for both of them. Go ahead and tell me about that. Why? Yeah, I mean, well, in the earlier case, in the Sanders case, it seems, listen, let me

42:03leave seems alone, the appellate court has said that the documentation of the defendant's mental state in prison after the killings that that should have been some of that evidence should have been allowed at trial. The jury should have been allowed to consider it and this judge did not allow it. If we have a little torch to headlines, you can put it up, please, sorry, go ahead, money. So the new trial is because all of the psychosis that was being exhibited and I'm sure that some of the arguments at the time were that maybe the psychosis was being caused by the actions that happened and the psychosis didn't exist before as opposed to it being undetected before and those are two different things. But the appellate court is saying no, there was enough documentation, there was enough evidence

43:09that the jury should have been able to consider that this one was out of her mind. I frankly am asking, like, couldn't she even, to me there should have been a competency to stand trial issue and I don't have enough of the facts of that case to know whether that's something that didn't see the light of day, whether those issues were discussed and whether that was litigated or not. But then here we've got this judge now who let in the information because this evidence about her middle state happened before there was documented evidence from before. I think there was documented evidence before and the other thing, but I want to wrap this up because I want to ask you about something I think is very important to be running out of time here. But Monique, so let me ask you about this because I interviewed, was it yesterday? I can't remember. When did we interview Hakeem Jeffries? Was it yesterday? I think it was yesterday. I see some folks in the comments saying, we had this headline that was in the news yesterday, Don Lemon Grills, Hakeem Jeffries about his meeting with Jared Kushner.

44:12I see some folks in the comments saying, imagine if Don had imagined if I made him answer for his APEC, whatever, I don't make Hakeem Jeffries answer for anything. I ask him questions. He has answered. That question has asked and answered. He's not backing down. He has explained to you. I've interviewed him 85 times about the APEC money and every single time he has the same answer. So that is not changing. I am not a judge. I cannot sentence him. I can simply ask him. And when he's in the news for something new, which is the news is, which is Jared Kushner in the elections, I ask him about that. I'm not going to go back 45 times to ask him about APEC money because that's been asked and answered in the Don Lemon Show on Meet the Press on Face the Nation on this week, on CNN, on ABC, on it has been asked, the New York Times, and answered. I question him about his Jared Kushner meeting and why he did it and he explained that. So I know that you were very passionate about how you feel about the possible next house speaker,

45:19the leader of the Democrats and people who keep asking about APEC. I'm not saying it's good. I agree with their disagree with it. It's good or bad. I'm just telling you as a journalist, what I'm doing here. And you can ask people think that Monique, as you know, as an attorney, that in order to grill someone, you have to yell at them, right? It's all in the way you ask the question. I get more out of people by asking the question nicely with a smile on my face than going, what the hell were you doing with APEC? Why were you meeting with Jared Kushner? Sir, let's get this out of the way. You met with Jared Kushner. You're receiving a lot of pushback from it. You want to explain to us why you met with someone who is not a member of the administration. Would you please answer that for us? It's the same question. It's just that I'm not being an asshole about it. Sorry, go ahead. What do you think? Right. No, I mean, civility is a lost art form. It's kind of like one of the reasons why you're the level of journalists that you are and you get the interviews that you get because you know how to interview people and get things out of them and ask the questions that need to be asked. I, where APEC is concerned, I mean, I humbly submit.

46:22I'm with my sister, Rese, on this. And we need to focus on November. We need to focus on these Republicans, some of the people that are asking about APEC, can't spell APEC. Don't know what APEC stands for. It's just a talking point because what they want to be is like the people within the group who cause issues. They're just disruptors for the sake of being disruptors. And we cannot do your crack me up. We have people over here like are you Don Lemon, but go ahead, go ahead. Yeah, because you are Don Lemon. Or as my daughter calls you Uncle Lemon, like she kills me with that. But people are just being disruptors for the sake of being disruptive and their eye is not on the ball. The focus is not on what we have to do in order to take back control of the House and the Senate so that we can survive. Yes. We're trying to survive. We're trying to have elections right now. Monique, thank you.

47:23You're on focus. Monique, thank you very much. We got to get inside of this thing that we're at for a get out the vote push. Okay. So we're in South Carolina. We'll let you know what it is. Monique, thank you. I appreciate everything. My co-anchor for my buddy today. Monique, Presley, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Ma'am, come in. Don't tell him where we are, but what did you, you're standing there eagerly. How are you? Get in here. I'm here because I love you. Thank you. What's your name? Tina. Tina, thank you. I do. I watch you all the time. Thank you so much. How are you? You can ask the right of me. Well, I did, yeah. Listen, you're the second famous person that I met. Adam Bulkler. Oh, you did. You met Adam. He's a good dude. He stopped when we were protesting. We demonstrate every Saturday that we've been doing for years, ever since. Thank you. We'll keep up the great work. Thank you for coming over to sing a song. You keep up the great work. Thank you very much. I hope so. Thank you very much. We appreciate it. So listen, here we will let you know where we are and why we're here a little bit later.

48:26Now you're informed, go to Don Lemon.com. When you're there, check out. You can get the DL and DL tickets at Don Lemon.com. Also back out of that, if you, we start September 11th in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. Also back out of that, go to Don Lemon.com. Check out everything. Our merch store, our YouTube page, also our sub-sac page. We're being summoned to go inside and do our thing. Okay, so be informed without being inundated until I see you back here at 5 p.m. Eastern time here on the Don Lemon Show on the Don Lemon channel. Turn the TV off. Thanks for watching, everybody. I appreciate you. Make sure you like, subscribe, and turn on notifications so you don't miss anything. We're live weekdays at 10 a.m. and 5 p.m. Eastern with new content at 2 p.m. Eastern, sometimes at 8 p.m. So follow the Don Lemon Show wherever you are. YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, Twitch, Substacks, Spotify, IHardRadio, Apple Podcasts, we are everywhere and we're there every day. And if you want a little more, join the Lemon Community, exclusive posts behind the scenes, live chats, just hit join or check the channel pages. Alright, I'll see you next time.

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