Patients take back their lives from psychiatric drugs

Hello, our wonderful, wonderful audience. Here we are again. It's the

Breggins, Dr. Peter Breggin. Dr. Peter Breggin. And Ginger Breggin, I folks, this is the

Breggin hour. And I'm Peter Breggin, recovering stroke victim, and I want to tell

people I'm doing better and better and better, and that they leave clinic

hyperbaric oxygen. Hyperbaric oxygen clinic was ginger feels just turned the

corner for me from a guy who was barely speaking to my real self who was here

today. My real self is here today. Thanks to Ginger taking me down there. And I

think my real self though came out not as certain about the hyperbaric as I

am about what all the efforts to Ginger was going to. When you see the love of

your life expending herself as I did first to save my life and then to save

the quality of my life. The motivation of loving her just made me decide I

wasn't going down with this stroke. I was coming back from it. And I deeply

believe we are more than our brains. And I'm learning it firsthand now that I am

more than my brain. I can't tell you exactly what it is people have puzzled

about who we are or spirits or souls. But I believe with beings made in God's

image. And one of the conclusions I'm coming to more and more that I'll share

with you today is a little extra something. We have a great guest and I'll tell

you about her right now. And then I'll tell you a little bit about what I've

been thinking about love. It's like a little ordough. You want to take a minute

and do the love and then we'll come back and come back to our guests and we'll

show our guests. Yeah, let me do that. All right, good. Because I have a lot to

think about lately with love coming through the stroke and going through

recovery now. And having such so such a blessing in Ginger Breggens loving me and

supporting me. And one of the things that I kept puzzling over was how hard it

was for me to describe love. I mean, most descriptions of love come out of

poetry or or old songs or songs. Another kind of poetry. Yeah, songs, old songs or

songs. But to just sort of talk about it, I thought well, let's start with that.

That's a major character. The accusation of love is that it's ineffable. Ineffable

meaning difficult to express in language. And I think that what makes love

ineffable is that love of any kind, for artwork, for looking at the moon and the stars

at night or sitting in the woods or standing on a mountain and just seeing it or bird

watching. For me, watching the birds come and go from bird feeder and sometimes a flock

of golf inches or maybe three families or cardinals. Just amazing to see that that's

kind of ineffable for me too. And I think it's because love is a direct connection with God.

That God wants us to love one another. He wants us to love creation. The New Testament talks

about I'm Jewish. That's why I call it the New Testament to distinguish it from my old one.

The New Testament is very, very clear about what Jesus has to say and that what he's come to say

and he's come really to kind of stand out for love the way no one and no place in the Old Testament

does and comes to say I'm giving you a new commandment to love one another as I love you

and that love you have for one another will be your page who you are. And I think that the reason

why love is ineffable is it participates in God which for all of us is ineffable.

I think that it is what God wants us to do to love one another and when we do it God gets close

to us and it's present in our lives. And I think it goes hand in hand ginger's being close to me

and loving me and helping me through the stroke in ways that she's just made the first priority.

It's one of the first things I heard as I came out of like a dreadfully confused at the end

of the stroke because I didn't know I was having a stroke. I thought I was having seizures.

The doctors thought you were having seizures. And they overdosed me with a drug that

gave for seizures right on top of the stroke. And I just had went to a state of confusion

and I said I came out of it. I had to literally identify ginger for who she was. It was very

confusing to me. I was this person taking such amazing care of me. I didn't know where to categorize

or understand her. I never had such an experience. I think that for me more than what I

wrote, whenever I've told a story of her meeting ginger, I talk about everybody knows me well.

It's her this story. I've talked about how I just fell so in love with her. It scared me to death

and I avoided her for approximately 10 years until fate, which I think is God's hand.

One of my ex-girlfriends told Ginger that she knew me and they got to talking about me and

she was very private. She never disclosed she'd been your girlfriend. She just said you were a

great reference for her as a journalist. And then she told you I was coming out to Los Angeles

with a TV show. It's when you were out in Los Angeles. Yeah. And that's how I met up with Ginger

again. I called her because I got a number from this old girlfriend, quite recently old girlfriend,

a lovely lady. And I spent about two days with Ginger. But on the first day,

I asked her to marry me. I said, I don't want to do it, lose you again. And I'm just really all

love I felt for you before. And you said, yes, you have to get over it. No, I said yes right away.

Believe me, I wasn't going to let that pass me by. Then it was all logistics after that, sweetie.

And we've been together now 40 years. What a 42 years. That was 1983. No, yeah, I know it was 1983.

And then you came east and we at the end of 83. And then we

agreed to get married and we did in 84. In July 4th, 1984. My new mental kind of a date

from the book and from Liberty of America. In July 4th, 1980. And together ever since,

I made this great discovery though that when I came out of the confusion surrounding

my stroke and I tried to figure out who you were. And I realized that what made you seem unfamiliar

to me was how loving you were and how just generally focused on me you were. And you would

made a decision that your whole life was going to be about making sure I survived and that I got

maximum recovery which meant you would take it over my medical care basically and my mental care.

And I realized that what probably scared me into not seeing you for 10 years took up

with us together again. One of the things was that actually I probably sensed that you loved me

in a way that I was totally unfamiliar with. And I'm prepared to deal with wasn't that I was so

loving of you. It was that you were so loving of me. But it was not in my category of things to

explore. A woman who was as loving of me as I was of her when you were just so to me. Such an

amazing. Well, we got married and there was a lot going on everything. So our lives were just

full of your reform work and our kids and you know learning to deal with all. Learning to live

together and you know who was going to get the closet that was in the bedroom and I gave it to you.

I needed a bigger one. I don't think I have a news issue. No, it wasn't. I just decided you're

getting the closet in the bedroom. You were very sweet. You cleared it out for me.

Well, I just tried to set the house up for you. You really did. And I think you forgot a lot

of that right after the stroke. So I, in addition to looking after how you were being treated and

working on just reconnecting personally so much, I became your historian for your personal

history while you while your brain knitted itself back together. So those first three months we

spent just your resting and beginning to heal before we heard about the weave clinic. That was

by the way, that's a feminine metaphor. My brain is not knitting itself together. It's hammering

itself to back together. Okay. I can practically have a clanking in my ears.

Well, anyway, I think that those first three months were really helping you to reconnect with

your own history. I gave you the conscience of psychiatry, which is the book that our nonprofit

published that we published with our nonprofit. Under your direction. Under my direction.

And the conscience of psychiatry really documented your reform work. It was very valuable.

But it always be wonderful people saying wonderful things about me. But in the way, you know what,

we have another wonderful person with us today. Oh my god, yes. And I want to bring to. Yes,

I want to bring her in. Okay. Go ahead and introduce her. Okay, it says right at the top of the page.

Meet Jen Schmitz, therapist and holistic mental health pioneer. What interests me so much about

Jen. And despite ignoring her, which is hard to do because she's very beautiful, very brave. Okay.

She is a holistic, describing, deep prescriber consultant. She does what I do. She takes people

of psych drugs. That's a very brave thing to do if you're not a physician or if you are.

But if you're not a physician, you get attacked for doing it by psychiatry and by other non-physicians.

Who don't want to take responsibility for changing the world? One patient at a time.

And when they may, yeah, that's, that's really true. I think a lot of it is.

They're doing it one patient at a time. It is. Because that's what you're doing, Jen. And

a bless you for. Thank you. Thank you. I told Jen that many years ago, when speaking through

an audience of therapists, I said that if any of them got in trouble as, as non medical therapists

for taking people of drugs, and I would, without charge, become an expert on that day.

And I think only one person has ever called me and said, I am in trouble.

So I think that non prescribers are doing, I mean, non... Deep prescribers. This is my brain

hammering while I'm trying to talk. My brain's been hammering, yeah, for two and a half years

with this like drug withdrawal I've gone through. So I'm listening to you talk and I'm thinking,

yeah, the symptomology that you experienced after your stroke is so very similar to not only the

things that my patients go through when they are trying to deeper scribe for medications, but myself

as someone who has been trying to get off of an SSRI after 25 years of use. And

the cognitive decline is just, it's, it's unsurmountable. I can't even describe.

You said the word historian before ginger and I'm sitting here thinking, I wish I had one of

those in my life too. Not only recently in the last couple years of trying to touch her at off

medication, but one of the biggest issues that I have is such a little memory. I don't remember my

wedding day. I don't remember the births of my children. Oh, do you? You know, I don't, it's so

difficult. I don't remember big vacations where I went somewhere tropical and you're there a whole

week. It's like these memories never imprinted on really big things in my life. And that goes back

all the way. That's very interesting that you think it didn't imprinted to begin with in the

long memory. Yeah. That's what it is, I think. Yeah. We don't get one while in these drugs, we don't

engage. We don't recall vividly. We don't. And I can't read have those vivid recollections.

And now I have to put so much intention into a moment just so that I can try to remember it

longer. This is the effects of the withdrawal. Right. Right. You'll recover from that. That's

yeah. It's going to be a gradual recover. I've learned that I have to. Right. I've learned I have to do

that. But going back historically, being on a psychiatric medication, being on a LexiPros since I was,

I think I was about 17. My medical records say I was about 17. I can go back and that past all

that past memory. It's just not there. It's I can't pull it. I can't look at photos and go, oh yeah.

It's like a lot of it is lost on me. No, that sounds like it's the same as some of my acquaintances

from high school that I've been in touch with from time to time. Some of whom got involved with not

psych drugs, but street drugs. Sure. Back at that point in time over their youthful adulthood.

And they have lost memory too for all that period of time. Yeah. I think that's pretty.

The memories from being laid down the drugs.

Just into fears with the whole process of engagement and recollection.

Right. Right. And how we store things. I mean, it's hard to really store a memory and to really have

that again imprint when you're not actually present. You're there. I mean, you're there physically.

I was there at my children's births. Trust me. Yes, I was going to say.

You know, like I and I can remember a few things right from from that day and those those days.

So I mean, I know I was there, but if you asked me to go back and just recount that the times,

my children, the time they came into the world, I couldn't tell you. I couldn't tell you what was

happening around me. I couldn't I couldn't tell you the smells. I couldn't describe to you what my

husband was doing. All things that you would think you could. We're at a break. So we'll be right back

in just a couple of minutes. This is Dr. Peter McCullough. You know me from America Laugh Pulse

and the McCullough Report. Well, I'm inviting you to join me in Nashville July 2nd, 3rd and 4th

for a truly historic experience in 2026. America Laugh News 250 slash 10 Nashville. I'm calling

all patrons to be a part of this unforgettable weekend packed with inspiring entertainment,

incredible fireworks, and nationally recognized speakers who proudly stand for freedom.

Together with you and our partners Clear and the Wellness Company, we'll celebrate two major

milestones, 250 years of America and 10 years of America Laugh News led by Malcolm out Loud.

I can't wait to see you there because your presence matters and you are family. So make history

with me and Malcolm. Register now at americaloudloud.news forward slash Nashville.

That's americaloudloud.news forward slash Nashville. We'll see you there.

Struggling with your health, energy, and constantly feeling hungry?

Want to save money on the rising cost of groceries and dramatically improve your health?

Go to chemicalfreebody.com forward slash out loud today. Get nature's super multivitamin

doctor formulated green 85 juice formula. Empower your immune system, cut your grocery bill,

and save 20% on your first order. You wouldn't go a day without brushing your teeth or washing

your hands. What about washing your nose? I mean your nose does filter the air you breathe.

Air loaded with bacteria, viruses, and irritants. Make nasal hygiene part of your routine with Clear.

No messy bottles to fill. No drowning sensation. Clear is a natural drug-free saline with the

added benefit of xylitol, which blocks bacterial and viral adhesion. Available in stores and online

at clear.com. That is x-al-e-a-r.com.

And we're back with Dr. Peter Bragan and Ginger Bragan for the Bragan Hour on americaoutloud.news

where you can go and hear us live when the show first airs on Saturdays and then again on Sundays

at 4 p.m. Eastern time. Jen, you want to continue? Let me just finish a little more on that.

And then the show goes out everywhere. Their shows go pretty much. Yes, they do. It goes to podcast

on Monday and it goes to go to your go to your favorite podcast platform and look up the

Bragan Hour. Yes. And you'll find it. And that's us. That's us. And what is this?

Spotify. Spotify. Spotify carries us and the interviews, the radio show, the Bragan Hour is

also carried on our page on americaoutloud.news so you can find back episodes there.

And I bring the show out each week on our substack. And then our substacks are archived

in our substack page, Ginger Bragan. Exactly. Which is probably where most people hear us.

I think most people actually Malcolm said he got thousands and thousands of listeners live on

Saturday and Sunday. So we have people listening live there and then people listen to the show also

if they don't go in on Saturday and Sunday. They can hear us on Spotify when I release the show on

Spotify, which usually comes a week later. Spotify carries every Dr. Bragan Hour of every time.

Going once. Yeah. Yeah. You can hear it on Spotify too, but also on substack. All right, let's go on

and have Ginger pick up again. And I also want to mention that another reason we wanted to have

her on is because she works closely with Dr. Tara Lynn. Yes. Yes. On the gas like true gas lit

truth podcast. Yes. And what are these ladies are? These wonderful professionals are really dynamic

and interesting and exciting to listen to. And their their websites have a great deal of information.

And a lot of people and a lot of people. Oh, these two women. Yeah. Yeah.

It's pretty neat. What's what started between Terry and I as calling on the phone for hours

talking about psych med harm, talking about how I could get through withdrawal, talking about

references like just getting into these deep almost philosophical conversations about our

profession as therapists and the harm we've perpetuated over the years because we didn't know

what we didn't know, right? Western education gave us one heck of a siloed view on psychiatric

medication and how great it is. And so we'd spend hours talking. And finally here and I were like,

we need to put this we need to put this into a show. We've we've got to do a podcast on this.

And we didn't know where it was going to go. We didn't know what was going to happen. And here

we are now, you know, over 110 episodes later and a following growing of people who want to hear

what we've got to say. So it's it's pretty cool. Yeah. It's wonderful. Yeah. Welcome to the

Greg and I. Hey, it is so it's so great to be here. I mean, I so Peter, your book psychiatric

drug withdrawal, not only as like a as a therapist who's understand what is trying to understand

every single thing I possibly can about psychiatric medication, but to set that aside as a consumer

who has trying to go off of psychiatric meds, your book was the very first book I ever read.

And every single concept in that book blew my mind because I'm like, why didn't nobody teach me

this? Like two degrees, a licensure later, all these practicals, it I knew none of this.

And it was an awakening for me. So to have the conscience of psychiatry sitting in front of me

is pretty damn cool. So thank you, Peter. It's really. It's a pleasure to be talking with you too.

It's really cool to be here. So you will recover all this stuff with time that you were talking about.

Yeah, to be sure you about that. Yeah. And it's slowly coming down. People seem to really get over

their drugs when they get off. Yeah. Unless there's some really particular illness they got from them,

that was very damaging. And I think the hardest part of this too when I look back is,

you know, I was 40 years old when I finally had some information on drug harm. Okay, I'm 43 now.

I was 40 years old when I decided to dive down the rabbit hole of, well, what if psychiatric

drugs aren't the gold standard of treatment like I've been taught? And the hardest part to rectify

with this is as I learned more and I have now been two and a half years into tapering off of

an SSRI. I look back to that 16 or 17 year old self and just go, gosh, how is it that in all 25

years? No one ever said to me, hey, maybe it's time you don't need this anymore. Or remember that

issue you had that you went on when you were a teenager, when you went on that drug? Do you still

have that problem in your life anymore? Because if you don't, why are you still taking this, right?

And that's the part of this that I think I have to keep grappling with. I didn't get curious enough.

I didn't get curious enough sooner. It took 25 years and two degrees in a field and to finally just

at some point, something dropped in my lap where I went, yeah, why am I still on this?

That's one of the harder parts. And that's something that I talk a lot with my clients about when

I work with them is, you know, how did this start for you? And are those still the same issues

you have now? Because it's very rare I meet with people like myself. We've been on psychiatric

drugs for years, not months, not the four to six weeks for the drug trial, years and years.

And what's happened over those years and the damage that can be done. And, you know, the

irreversible effects and all the medical issues I've had in my life and, you know, you just look back

and go, this all could have been because of that. But nobody ever, no one ever told me.

I just went with what was being told, which is, oh, does it seem to be helping? Sure, you're not

depressed. Okay, well, good. Let's just keep you on it. Well, what kind of mom are you going to be

if you go off those drugs, Jen? Like, remember, you started them because you were depressed.

Okay, well, we got to be careful with that now that you're going to be having kids.

The manipulative language around this that was said to me and that I hear every day with my clients

and how to get people to get curious about that there maybe is another side to this?

That's the challenge I tried to take on. And I want to tell people, you know,

that I want you to get curious about it because that's where change starts to happen.

As soon as you start to really get curious about stuff that you never quite thought could be a thing.

That's so important. And, you know, it's no accident that you weren't asked that question and that

patients who have been prescribed psychiatric drugs are never asked that question because

I mean, the question of the question of how could you do without them and do you still have

that same problem and have you considered ever tapering down on your drugs and coming off of them?

That the whole system is designed to suppress any inquiry that has to do with stopping psychiatric

drugs over a long period of time or whatever. And that's because the drug company influence is so

overwhelmingly present in medicine and as well as psychology and psychiatry and through media,

through social media and through the legacy media, you know, the newspapers we used to read and

magazines. And in addition to that, those drug companies have in this country permission from

the FDA to advertise directly to consumers. And I'm sorry, I lost track.

Yeah, I distracted you. I wasn't sure if that noise was...

No, it's Bella and I don't think it's going to get Bella is sitting under my desk and

on a little pad that's like a pad for her to lie on and she's busily trying to dig a hole to China

which she does. It's the action of a sweet little mammal trying to create a nest when there are no leaves.

I don't think the mic picks it up and I think I can't hear it guys. I can't hear it on my.

I'm sure our listeners will be very tolerant. So anyway, all I was saying was here in this country,

the big drug companies spend a vast majority of their promotional funds advertising directly through

radio, TV, social media, etc. And that in itself puts a clamp on any legacy media being

interested in interviewing someone like you Jen or like Dr. Bragan. The other thing is that

the censorship industry and it's become an industry now. Those PRs and those content managers

and so forth that all the big tech social media has were massively expanded during COVID so that

you've got people looking over all of our shoulders and you've got algorithms and computerized

programs searching for key words that then alert sensors to come in and tell you Jen or tell

us here at home that you absolutely must not talk about deeper scribing. You can't talk about

coming off of the drugs. You certainly can't talk about the MRNA vaccine and so forth and so

so on. Right. Well, and even coming from someone who's not a medical provider, as you had said,

Peter, you know, I don't have a medical doctor. I am a licensed professional counselor.

All right, that is that is my license. I am told repeatedly that by talking about

risk benefits and alternatives of psychiatric medication, which is what informed consent is, right?

I am told that I am grossly out of the scope of my practice and that this is such a problem and

I get shut down so frequently for that. And so to your point, Ginger, yes, that is that and that's

an algorithm that's pushed that there is a there's a social dialogue around this that is, you know,

that that continues to be filtered. Yes, I mean, it's like climbing up a mountain forever.

And I get the word out. Yeah, I'm never going to hit the tap, right? I'll get a few steps in and

maybe somebody will go, hey, I can see you and I'll go, okay, great. One person saw me.

I want you to know, Jen, that Peter's been doing this kind of education for the public about

the damaging effects and psychiatric drugs and other biological psychiatric interventions,

any kind of attempt to harm healthy tissue, which is what has treatment, shock treatment,

psychocergery, lobotomy, yeah, electrical stimulation, right? Right. And any of those,

gosh, I lost my track again. And I interrupted you on your list. I think so.

They've probably going to say this is all been met with resistance. Well, yes, it started this.

We've been experiencing this at one point or another all along. And yet, what happens again and

again, and this is the good part is we don't hear about the numbers of people we've reached

through Peter's books through our own podcasts and our own radio shows through our website,

except sometimes 10, 20, 30 years, 40 years after the person has received a message that Peter sent

out into the world, we get an email or a comment in our sub-stack or something else.

Someone will say, I heard from Dr. Bragan 25 years ago, or I read toxic psychiatry back in 1990,

or et cetera, et cetera, or I heard him in 1980 at a conference that he presented at.

And they inevitably have amazing stories to tell about how that redirected a portion of their lives

to enable them to, for instance, refuse Ritalin for their child in school, stand up against the

school wanting to just drug their little boy as he came in because he was rambunctious or helped

them themselves in understanding what was going on and then working out themselves how to

do withdrawal. So your words mean so much more and reach so many more people than you'll ever know.

It's truly, it's a miracle every time it happens. And you're part of that. You're part of

people healing in their lives every day when you and Dr. Terrellin do your podcast and through

your work. Yeah, we're there to ruffle feathers. We are there to whistle blow. We are there to do

all of the things that seem out of context and crazy and yet they really aren't the things we're

talking about. Like the world has painted these as so controversial. But yeah, they really aren't,

you know, just for the brain folks. Yeah, like, it really isn't. Like when you, when you boil this

down to just basic, basic, like how I would talk to my, my son, my 12 year old son, I would say,

what you're doing right now, what you're eating. Here's how it's impacting your brain.

Here's what happens to your amygdala in your hippocampus when you do insert whatever it is.

Anything that goes into the mouth and that goes into the body. So I do a lot of nutrition work with

people, right? Anything that goes in that mouth hole. If you think for a second, it's not going to

impact your brain. You're actually grossly inaccurate, right? And that includes psychiatric medications.

As well, anything that's going to change how your brain organically wants to function,

then we're going to have an issue. You can't get something for nothing, right? The output is going

to change. And if you just look at that from the most basic, how you'd say it to our sixth

grader science, like they're like, oh, yeah. And as long as we view something as a treatment and

not a drug, it is always going to be viewed as a treatment. And that's where it gets really messed

up because that's how it's viewed is as a treatment. And it's not. When I talk to my clients about

psychiatric drugs, I talk about the mechanism of action. And I will compare it to another drug that's

a stimulant or to caffeine or to like, I will lay it all out there. And I will talk about that with

them. And they'll kind of sit there kind of dumbfounded. And I'm like, the same things happening in

the brain. But you've been taught that this one thing is a treatment. And it's helpful. But the

mechanism of action is the same. And they kind of just sit there and they're like, huh.

I've never thought about it that way. And I'm like, well, no, because you've never been given

informed information in that way either. Right. And so it opens these discussions about viewing

things in a way that they need to be viewed and a drug to be viewed as a drug. Because that's what

it is. It's altering the state of the brain. So it's like a talk about it simply, very simply.

And we don't have to get crazy in the science. I'm not, you know, simple. That's wonderful. We are

out of time again. This is our second set segment. And we will be right back with part three.

Feeling off lately, bloated brain fog low energy, it could be parasites. These sound

vaders, so we can your gut immune system and mental clarity. That's why Dr. Peter McCullough and

the doctors at the wellness company formulated a hypermectin in mebendousoclens, a medical great

solution designed to help eliminate parasites and restore balance. No gimmicks, just real medicine

trusted by top doctors. Go to twc.health4th slash out loud and use code out loud for 20% after

your first order. Take control of your health today. The smartest food on the planet doesn't come

from a lab or in a package. It grows in a class jar. I'm Doug Evans, author of the National

Best Seller, the spout book. Sprouts deliver up to 100 times the antioxidants of mature vegetables.

They grow in just three to five days for under a dollar serving. Get your spouting kit at

thespoutingcompany.com slash out loud. Use the code out loud for an exclusive offer. Gross smarter.

Have you been looking for a healthy snack from the go? Well, not all energy bars are soft and

sugary. Bear bars are a crunchy, savory bar made from just six simple natural ingredients.

Bear bars are plant-based. Organic gluten-free contain six grams of protein and a low temperature

dried for a unique crunch. Most energy bars are based on chocolate or fruit and are held

together with serps or sweeteners. To learn more, just visit bearbar.com slash out loud.

Peter, just so you don't run out of time at the end, I'd love for you to be able to comment

at this point because I know at the very end we have to, we are compelled to stop because

we can't air longer than the time we're allotted by the radio station.

Well, why don't you share anything else you'd like to share?

You're watching me ginger gently try to deal with a major conflict that often happens at the

end of the show and which is I cut him off. The effects are marriage.

And well, we work through it. She's going to get little signs to put up in front of me.

So, so I did be like an authority there, making the statement a card, two minutes left, that kind of

thing. But thank you, ginger. I think it's really good because otherwise I would have waited

longer to comment. Yeah, I think it's good to have this opportunity. Thank you for this positive

way of handling it. You're welcome. So like saying, hey, here's some time. See, I learned from

you every day still. Go ahead. Yeah, it is. Thank you, honey. So, go ahead.

I'm often working with couples because I like to have a person involved, somebody that's close to

them when they're coming off the meds. In case they get very angry and upset, they need somebody

to tell them, hey, it's maybe the trouble to draw or they become very depressed and self

injurious and thinking about hurting themselves or something to have somebody right there to say,

don't think it's your life. Everything is going pretty good right now.

Honey, this is the drugs doing it. Do you remember you talked to Wonders about that?

And it's so interesting because what I specialize in is helping people love each other again

because a woman who's been 25 years on a drug has very likely lost her some of her affection for

her dogs or children or life or work or something else. And I've seen some wonderful things go on

where women, when they realize this, they start talking to their children about it and their

children are so happy to hear mom recognizing how she wasn't quite this fully there in childhood.

They can talk about it and make up for it as adults. A lot of positive things come out of realizing

these things and people as they come off the drugs, they do kind of remember as you were describing

that they don't remember and if those things they can revisit with loved ones and start remembering

more of and being told more about relearning. There's a lot of positive things that can happen

and they can start to love again. And once people are loving each other again then they probably

don't need me anymore. Maybe just a few directions on how to talk to your wife like you actually do

love her or to your husband. People need to learn to do that in our culture. They shy about

putting a very high priority on the love between them. And that's one of the worst things about

psych drugs. They're anti-love drugs. But it's a tough subject to sell to anybody. I had a book

that I thought would be grabbed up and made at best sell right away called anti-love drugs. I

loved the title, anti-love drugs. Little subhead about what your psychiatric drugs might have to

do in your marriage. And but we've never been able to sell. I've had top agents try. I've had

a turn down by always without explanation by top publishers. I've got to read it.

And I think there are also anti-god drugs. They provide this kind of generalized cognitive dysfunction.

And despite what atheists and leftists and communists tell us, believing God's a higher function,

not lower function, and requires a very spiritual attitude to it life.

Requires a sophisticated way of thinking that evolved slowly over you and you met within

humanity, going through all kinds of stages along the way from worshipping rocks and stones.

It's all in the Bible and getting able to actually love one another.

I think that when you withdraw from psychiatric drugs, the one of the things you'll experience

is your ability to love increases and with it all, the term oil that goes along with that.

It's good to have a psychotherapist like you are a psychotherapist, helping people withdraw.

You do a much better job than a non-psychotherapist because when people come off the psych drugs,

they start to have no their feelings become available. That's exactly it. The drugs take away the

bad, but they take away all the good as well. They just reduce the human being.

Yes, and myself, I've experienced that. I was explaining to somebody the other day,

the stuff you said about marriage, it's real hard and I don't know if we have time to talk too much

about it, but it's got 11 minutes. Okay, we have 11 minutes. Okay, before we get into that,

I want to talk about it. I think it's really important to talk about it.

I think it's imperative. In fact, on the Guest Literature's podcast, we have now had multiple

guests come on and talk about that exact thing. Facebook groups like anti-depressants ruin

marriages. We've had guests come on from that group. They follow us. They're fantastic.

And we all talk about this idea of really, truly not being able to

feel connection to somebody and to feel that closeness and to truly feel love.

Like at the beginning of the show, when you were talking about your definition of love,

I'm thinking, well, if somebody asked me that, it'd be like, well, it's a noun. It means to be

fond of a strong attachment. I'd give you the logical Webster's Dictionary answer,

because that's all I'm able to muster up, but I know it's there and I can slowly feel

different levels of it coming back as I'm titrating off of my medication.

But it's a very interesting space because it almost takes away a piece of who you are.

I can't feel certain emotion. I still can't. I can't feel pride if my life depended on it.

I have tried to feel it. I have tried to sit in it. I've tried to manifest that. I've tried to

meditate around this for years. I still can't. It'll calm. I know it will. But something as simple

as that, when you can't feel these emotion states, these deeper emotions, you can't make a connection

like that in your marriage with somebody. There's implications to that over time.

I don't think people recognize how that can happen. In fact, they don't know what's happening

when they're in it. They're spellbound, as you know. That's a thing. I didn't know it. I would blame

every issue in my marriage on my husband. When in reality, I couldn't even understand myself

and my role in everything. Because I can't get to that level of self-understanding.

You can't get there. You think you can. You think you're there. But you can't.

And so how that implicates itself within relationships, within your marriage,

how going through PSSD, for example, can impact your inability to have a sexual experience.

Let's PSSD with your spouse. Post SSRI, sexual dysfunction.

Oh, there you go. And that's huge.

For some people, they're all genuine. You haven't gone through that. You're still on a med.

No, actually, I've been on this med on it, off it, on it, off it. I would increase it, decrease it.

The seasons would change. I'd go from 20 to 5. My prescriber would say,

Jen, you know how you get in the summer. Go down on it. And the winter, go back up.

So talk about the ability of protracted withdrawal to just continue to harm itself repeatedly

over 25 years for me. So I have gone on and off, up and down, right? And what that's done to me.

And what that does when it comes to sexual dysfunction, when it comes to the inability

to connect with someone on that level, no, it becomes newsweather in sports. It's a task.

It's not something that I can feel a deeper connection in.

Those are the issues that can come and they're implicated within marriages and within relationships

when you are on a psychiatric drug. I was never told that. That wasn't a thing. I was told,

well, Jen, I think you might need a sex therapist if this is what's happening in your marriage.

That's what I was told by my prescribers. And so, of course, what did I do? I wouldn't look

for sex therapist, right? I'm like, I guess I need to find somebody, right? Like, I have no

sexual drive anymore. I'm not, I don't, I can't feel that for my spouse. And when you start a

psychiatric medication, when you're a teenager and your entire, your whole body isn't even developed

yet, right? Your immune system is still trying to figure out what to do. Your metabolic structures

have, I mean, my goodness, none of that's developed in four months. Yeah, into your mid-twenties,

right? Like, like, none of that has happened for me. I was stunted so early. I was stunted at such

an early age. And so it... Thank you for being so brave as to share with us. Yeah, that's really

true. This is so brave. This is so brave. For when you're in there, loved what they're loving

husbands, don't stand. You're welcome. And I think what you said, Peter, is so important. When I work

with people and even my husband will attest to this, having somebody who understands drug withdrawal

is that's the battle. Dozing down is the easy part. Like, that part is easy. You have withdrawal,

we'll dose back up. You understand your symptomology, you play around with that. That's the easy part.

It's figuring out who you are and having somebody that can be by your side to understand what's

happening and support that. I think is probably the bigger task to this. The science behind

deeper describing is easy. The psychology behind it is the difficult part. That's the hardest part.

When you're trying to discover who you are and you don't know because you have been so numb

out for so many years, you sit in front of your spouse and you're like, I don't even know who I am.

You feel an emotion and you're like, I don't know what that is. I've never experienced

like true loss. And so now you've got to go back through and understand and feel all the loss

that you couldn't process before because you didn't know how. So to have somebody next to you

who understands that is huge. And I'd like to add just very briefly that the sexual dysfunction

also frequently accompanies taking SSRIs and other psyched drugs from men and young men.

And again, if a young man is in his late teens and he started on an SSRI and he starts to have

erectile dysfunction, he doesn't have a clue. And the next thing you know, he's going to go online

to the hymns website and talk to a teladoc and get a prescription for ED, erectile dysfunction

medication. And then he's taking two things. The second thing because the first thing is

injuring him without him understanding that it's the psychiatric drug.

I'm not aware of any such information about hymns in particular.

Oh, yeah, sorry. I used that as an example of the multiple numbers of online ED

resources that are there that you don't know what they're saying that people can

can. Well, they offer ED medication with teladoc.

Pretty easily accessible. It's very easy accessible. I myself went to the hers website and put in

all kinds of symptomology that I could be having. And boy, it's pretty darn easy to get a prescription

sent to my home. And I'm not criticizing that because these human beings who need to

any of us human beings who need to get that kind of help, they deserve all the help they can get.

But they aren't fully informed as you're saying about the fact. That's what they deserve.

Yeah, they and they that's the part I think that people are missing.

Is the risks, the benefits, the alternatives, like a conversation around what in what really

truly makes you informed before you start that drug so that you can make the best decision.

For someone to say to him, actually, this is very common. 50 to 60% of men that go on an SSRI

do have PSSD. And here's what it is. It can be emotional numbness. It can be genital numbness.

It can be erectile dysfunction. It can be all these things, right? And it's it could be that the

drug is doing this. I don't know. I'm not in love. Right. It could be. Yes. If your love

feelings are suppressed, so maybe your sexual feelings because it's all one package guys.

Right. And your or could be your hormones are being altered. How easily it is that when we

change the structure of the brain and how the neurochemistry is happening, we're going to alter

hormones. And so that could be leading to what's occurring. All these different possibilities.

But that's what an informed conversation should be. That's what should be given to patients.

And unfortunately, it's not. And so I just feel like that's kind of where I come in.

And even in my therapy practice, people get very inquisitive about the medications and the drugs.

And I will have informed conversations with them. I'll have people ask me, I'm taking a bunch of

meds. How effective is EMD are going to be for me, Jen? If I can't process emotion. Or how

effective is psychotherapy? You're even cognitive behavioral therapy going to be for me.

And I will have a conversation about that. And those are all very smart questions. They're valid.

It's absolutely valid. We have one minute and 45 seconds left, Jen. Would you let people know how

they can reach you? Either for both for your podcast with Dr. Terrell and those who can

reach out to you as a therapist. Sure. So if you're looking for therapy services or you're looking

for some coaching on deeper scribing, you can find me on my website, which is genschmits.com.

Jen with two ends, genschmits.com. Very simple. And if you're looking for the Gas Lit Truth podcast,

you can find it on my website or you can go to the Gas Lit Truth podcast at gmail.com.

And that's got all things gas light on there. So pretty easy to find me or to find the show.

Great. Peter, we've got one minute. I think you're wonderful.

Thank you. Jen, I think you're doing really good work. We should come back again and talk about

love and marriage. That's something that I'm thinking about doing in my next book on.

Yes. How do you relate to people in a loving way for a whole bunch of years? How long will we

be together? 42 years, honey. How did that happen? It just rolled right along and then it happened

and God bless you and God bless us. We're very fortunate. And Jen, thank you so much. Thank you.

And thank God for having me on. Yes. And God bless you too. We'll be in touch again soon. Thank you.