Podcast – @Browns beat writer @ScottPetrak from BrownsZone.com on Kenny & JT Show

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I know it's March Madness.

I know Chase the Lotter made history last night

for the Guardians, right?

But it's always Brown season in the Buckeye State

and always on Fridays.

We talk some Browns with the outstanding beat reporter

for BrownZone.com.

Follow him on Twitter at Scott Petrek.

He is Scott Petrek.

First Scotty, how's that bracket looking so far

for March Madness?

Well, I still got off for Final Four teams.

Nice.

How about that?

Good for you.

I lost you last night, Scotty.

Was shocked that they got beat the way they did last night.

Were you surprised by that one?

You know what? Illinois was one of my teams.

Kenny, I watch a lot of Big Ten basketball,

so I'm probably biased for no good reason.

But I get three Big Ten teams in and two of them one last night.

You've got to be familiar with Illinois being

a Northwestern guy, though, right?

See, that's what I was telling Kenny.

We take it for granted.

We forget how tough the Big Ten is.

We get to the tournament and we pencil in around them.

Yeah, I watch a lot of Big Ten.

I'm Illinois and they're northwestern's biggest rival.

There's some good basketball being played in the Big Ten.

Hey, for football purposes,

do they play for something Northwestern and Illinois?

Is there a trophy or something like that?

Yeah, so land a Lincoln trophy.

It's a cool, like a stove top, a Lincoln metal hat.

It's cool.

How about that?

It's better than the third we play for Baldwin Wallace

and John Carroll that they put together.

My goodness, the Ohio Gold Bowl or whatever it is.

But anyway, Scott, let's talk some Browns football.

What was the biggest news of the week

for the Cleveland Browns that people were talking about

and you were right and about?

Yeah, I mean, I'm actually finishing analysis right now about it.

You know, the Miles Garrett changes to his contract,

which kicked off the latest round of speculation.

I would say that's the biggest news.

You know, the Browns say that they're still not going to trade him.

They're just giving themselves some cat flexibility

down the road in long term.

But the fact that they move the bonuses from March to September,

or right in August, right before the regular season,

it gives them a bigger window to make it trade

if they wanted to do so.

And it would benefit the Browns greatly financially

as opposed to if they paid the bonus in March

and then they decided to trade him.

You know, they'd be paying the money out front.

It would hurt their salary cap.

So it's easy to see why people are connecting dots.

And we know what happened.

You know, we know all the Miles Garrett requests last year

and all that.

But I was told they're not going to trade him.

They don't plan to trade him.

It was nothing to do with that.

But that's what the speculation is.

And I think that's the biggest thing going on this week.

Yeah, JT brought that up earlier.

And I'm thinking there's no way.

You know, this is just one of those crazy rumors

because of the debt cap money and how it would affect them.

And how much less debt cap money is there now

with this situation than if they would have tried to trade him

this past season after he signed the contract.

Well, see, to me,

once they signed him to the contract,

it doesn't make sense to trade him, Perry, right?

Because he was coming up to the end of his contract.

If he traded him last, you know, February or March,

then to me, it would have made...

I still didn't think it was a good idea.

Financial each seller cap wise, it would have made sense there.

Once you signed him to this long-term deal,

I mean, they paid him a bunch of cash already.

There still would be seller cap ramifications.

So I still don't think it would be a wise move.

Let's say they do it.

The first question would be,

then why didn't you just do it a year ago, right?

Right.

But if there is money,

did they would save...

You know, I have to top of my head.

I mean, I just read it too.

But, you know, I don't know if it's $20 million

and they get to push it over the next two years.

They get significant in which I think it's even more significant

is the cash that they'd be responsible for wouldn't be as much.

Like if they picked up the bonus in March,

then they're paying it and the new team would get a break that way,

where, you know, they wait to trade them till whenever June, July, August.

Before the bonus kicks in,

the other team would be responsible for that.

So it is significant savings.

And that's why people around the league saw the transaction

and started to wonder what was going on.

Scotty, I love the fake fact that they're putting this team together

and they're focused on making the team better in certain aspects,

like special teams, for instance.

They hire Byron Store.

I've been talking a lot about George Warhop,

the new offensive line coach.

I expect great things or better things from the offensive line.

And now that Bubba Ventrone is gone,

I really expect more from this special teams unit as well.

They also made some signings that kind of go under the radar with this.

AJ, epinessa, they get them from the Lions.

They get a re-sign Julian Aquara.

How big of a deal do you think this is?

And how much better do you think this special teams will be?

Well, first of all, I get what you're saying.

And I know Bubba was a coach, right?

So I'm not saying he doesn't deserve any blame.

I don't think it was all about Bubba.

I think the roster makeup had a lot to do with it.

And they had to down you.

There's no argument there.

And I'm trying to say Bubba didn't deserve any blame.

I don't know that just getting rid of Bubba Ventrone automatically means

the special teams will be better.

But I think when you sign, when you get a new coach and new coordinators,

it's important to give them pieces to work with.

So when you talk about store, they bring in Tylenolus.

They bring in Thomas Daniels.

And those are two guys that have had a lot of experience playing special teams.

Wallace comes from Baltimore,

which is a really traditionally strong special teams unit.

Todd Munkin knows them.

You know, he played a little bit of receiver,

but is mostly a special teams guy.

So I think they have shown a commitment.

And it's down the roster guys, right?

But showing a commitment that two special teams

and that they're going to give store a handful of guys

that are his special teams core.

And I do think that's important.

And then when you talk about AJ Epineta,

I think that's an important move.

Now it's, you know, it's a second or third tier of

Regency.

It's not a huge signing, you know,

it's a one-year deal.

But this is a guy that had six acts,

at least six acts, and three straight seasons.

Here's a second round pick.

Went to Iowa.

Big guy, six, six, two, 60.

You know, can set an edge,

and play defensive end opposite Miles Garrett.

I think he fits in that rotation.

I think he's a similar skill set guy to Alex Wright,

who they already have.

So I like that signing.

You know, it's a little under the radar,

but I think that's a key sign.

I saw a return, Tylen Wallace,

the guy you were mentioning,

that came over from the Ravens.

But I think when he asked you a couple of weeks ago,

if he would be your return man,

and he's more or less a gunner,

but do you see him returning punts,

maybe kickoffs too?

Yeah, it's going to be interesting,

because there's a video where he had a huge...

Oh, yeah.

I think it was a walk-off return for a touchdown.

But that's not what he did a lot.

You know, I think he had that moment.

I looked it up, six returns.

You know, so it's like he was returning a ball all the time.

But who knows?

Maybe they'd see that as an untapped area for him.

So I'm sure he could do it in a pinch,

but I think it's overall his play on special teams

that got their interest.

Scott Petrak is our guest brownzone.com.

Beat reporter, follow him on Twitter at Scott Petrak.

Scottie, we're getting closer and closer to the draft,

right?

Less than a month away now.

What are the rumblings or the rumors

that you're hearing about the Browns?

Is it six and 24 potential trades?

What's the latest on all of that?

Yeah, I mean, I still think they would lean toward training down, Kenny.

And I'm going to believe that till I hear differently.

I don't know what the options will be to trade down if there

is an attractive option to move down.

But, you know, to me, you have to focus nearly all of your attention on offensive line,

specifically left tackle, and receiver.

How could they make, you know, could they go off the board

and take a defensive guy?

You know, particularly one of those Ohio State guys.

Yeah, I guess I wouldn't be stunned if they did that.

We could debate whether that makes sense.

You know, when you're a team that has a good defense,

a really good defense, and has huge hold on offense,

hasn't been able to score for the last two years.

Do you really want to spend one of your key assets on a defensive player?

You know, and it's a good discussion because it's not all about 2026, right?

And it's about stacking players and stacking elite players.

So I get it.

I just said, I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around.

Then devoting such an important resource to a position that's not a position of need, immediate need.

We have so many needs on this team too.

It's hard not to, you know, just roll the dice or take the best player available.

That love kid from Notre Dame.

It's unfortunate or fortunate that we don't need a running back.

But boy, if we did, I can't see passing up a guy like that.

Even though we need so much help on the offensive line.

But Scott, I want to ask you, will there be?

Do you do?

I can't remember if you've done it in the past at brownzone.com.

Will you put together a mock draft or no?

Yeah, I usually do.

But I always do one right before the draft and put my draft playing together.

I'm thinking I might do a second one a little earlier.

Maybe spread it out a couple weeks apart.

So I take two bites at the apple.

So I'll for sure we do one.

Maybe do two.

But it's interesting when you bring up a guy like love.

Yeah.

And I think it applies to a certain extent, Caleb Downs.

Right.

You probably wouldn't take him because he took Junkins at the second or last year, right?

So it makes sense.

But even then, like running back, is that a position you would take hit number six?

And I think no.

And I kind of feel the same way about safety.

I think you have to save a top, whatever, five, six, eight, ten pick for certain premium positions.

And I don't think running back in safety, they don't qualify.

Now, I'm not saying you rule that out completely.

The guy that's to create the exception to that rule.

But I think when we're talking about the Browns and the situation there and right now,

I think the position those guys play work against them being a possibility number six versus

somewhere else in the draft, or if they played, you know, like you had an ad rush,

you loved it number six.

So the headwaters still create the importance, right?

So you could talk me to that more than you could talk me into a running back

that they don't quote unquote need, you know, or a safety.

I get it the only reason I bring those names up.

And I'll also mention Caleb Downs in this situation is because when we had Bill Polian,

Pro Football Hall of Famer, we had him in studio and we asked him, you know, how do you draft?

How do we look at this thing?

And he said, he goes, you don't take a running back in the first round unless he's a

Saquon Barclay.

Well, Jordan, the love kid from Notre Dame is being compared to not only Saquon Barclay,

but Bijan Robinson at the Atlanta Falcons as well.

This dude might be a game changer.

And when it comes down to safety, and I can't believe I want to say this,

but you would only take a safety if he's a game changer and he's Troy Palomolo.

I don't think Caleb Downs is going to transfer into Troy Palomolo when he makes it into the NFL.

I think he's a little bit undersized.

I don't think he's as physical.

Yeah, I mean, I don't, I haven't studied a ton of Downs to say that.

But what I can't see is you never know if the guy's going to turn out to be that one in a million.

Right.

Like Ray Lewis, you've never draft an inside linebacker in the top ten.

But if you knew he's going to have the career of Ray Lewis, then you would take him.

Right? But to draft the craft, you'd so many times you go, this guy's the next XYZ.

Right.

And he's not.

So that's why I think that's where you have to be smart and take a little bigger picture of you.

And you trust your processes.

You trust your philosophies.

And you say, hey, we're only going to take these positions here.

Hey, you know, again, you have to have some wiggle room.

But in the circumstances, the Browns are right now.

I just don't think that wiggle room matches up with their situation.

Scotty, the wide receiver position.

Every team views it differently, I guess, as far as importance.

Do the Browns or the Browns in that front office led by Andrew Berry?

Do they not feel it's as important as I don't know what tight end or running back or what?

I would think in this day and age of the NFL, we're passing the ball as a priority for them to continually, you know, look at bat as bad at wide receivers.

They do what quarterback is befuddling to me.

Yeah, that's a great question, Kenny.

I don't think they would ever say that.

I think they would.

It would say and I think mean that it's a really important position.

I think they would rank it higher than running back and probably higher than tight end on their scale.

Having said that, is they really done all they can to make that position better?

And the answer is no.

Now, they traded for Mari Cooper and he was a success.

They traded for Jerry Judy.

They haven't drafted anybody higher than the third round, right?

I mean Cooper was the number one.

Judy's probably not a number one.

So outside of Mari Cooper, since they had Odell Beckham and Junior and Jarvis Landry, right?

There's been a drop there at that position and they've been unable to build that room the way they need to.

Now, I think philosophically, they differ then.

You and I saying, like when they look at the room, I think they think there's more talent in the room than we think there is.

And I think that's where part of the disconnect is.

But I also think this year, finally, after last year really not doing anything, right?

They brought an Isaiah by and late. That was about all they did.

I think this year, they recognize and Todd Muckin may play roll in this, that they need to upgrade the room.

So I fully expect them to draft a receiver by number 39 at the latest and maybe even two.

And I'd be stunned if they don't, but if they don't, then that's going to be the number one question is why are you addressing the receiver position?

They seem to treat receivers like the Guardians treat outfielders.

That's no big deal. We'll get lucky. We'll find one here there.

And if not, we'll just trade for Brazil. And then we'll platoon guys and see who sticks and we'll trade for somebody again next year.

It's like, okay, what are you going to develop that position as opposed to not giving it enough attention and then trying to find somebody for at least a year

that can give you number one wide receiver production like a couple of the guys they did where they gave up fifth round draft picks for.

Right. And I think part of their thinking and nobody's told me this is, if you have the right quarterback, he makes your receivers better.

And you see that across the league and you saw it, you know, to a certain degree in 2023 with Joe Flacker.

Right. You obviously guys are catching balls, David O'Joker has the best finish he's ever had and you know, Mario Cooper blows up.

But if you don't have that quarterback, then you receive a court, receiving court looks worse.

And they're in a position, especially where they're a quarterback right now.

They need as much talent around that quarterback to lift the offense up.

And they don't have, right now they don't have those receivers to do that.

Scotty, we always appreciate the time. Thanks so much. Keep up the fantastic work there at brownzone.com and we'll start getting into more of that draft stuff in the coming weeks. All right.

Sounds good. Thanks, folks.