Real Housewives’ Producer on Casting, Firing and Female Friendships

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Hey, the McDonald.

Has got the juices scoop.

When you're on the road, when you're on the go.

Juice is scoop is the show to know.

She tops Hollywood tales, her real life, Mr. Sigma's serial data, and serial systems.

You'll be addicted and addicted fast to the number one tabloid real life hot cat.

Listen in, listen up.

Hand of McDonald.

Juice is scoop.

Hello and welcome to juicy scoop.

So excited to have a first time juicy scoop guest.

Paul Woriston, he is a delight.

He is adorable.

But more importantly, his career has been producing real housewife shows in the reality world

and we met many years ago.

I guess.

I rediscovered your cute face telling juicy stories on TikTok and I'm so glad you're

here.

Thanks for coming.

I'm honored to be here.

I was like, before I start, I had to tell you, you were a part of like my gay awakening

because.

Love it.

Nothing could be more flatter.

Yeah, I was going to say I hope you appreciate this when I was growing up like one of my

favorite books was I'll never blue ball in this town again.

Really?

Yes.

Absolutely.

Oh my god.

That is so nice.

And I wasn't out then, but I'm like, hello, I mean, I'm reading your book and like

you know, the straight guys are like, we're going to the football game in high school.

I'm like, I'm at home reading Heather McDonald's book.

That's amazing.

I love that.

You were a part of my coming out, journey.

So thank you for that.

I always love it.

I always love it when a cute guy comes up to me at a show and is like, my mom and I

used to watch and I'm like, and I'm like, I hope that mom knew that your son was 13

and staying up late to watch Chelsea lately and especially loving Heather McDonald.

You have a fabulous gay son.

There you go.

That was our whole environment in our house.

And I was like, you literally comment on one of my rules when I want to go see Chelsea

at her book signing and I got fired from my job at the time because Chelsea gave my

brother a shout out on the show.

Oh wait, I remember this whole story.

You commented on it and you're like, I wish I would have known because I would have

given you like a show.

I would have said something like on the show.

Yeah.

I got fired from my job because I called out rightfully so to do this.

And somebody saw the picture and I got fired from it.

Okay, wait.

So you had a job.

What was the job?

I worked at the Phillies in Philadelphia.

Yeah.

The Phillies, if anybody knows that, the baseball team.

And I worked like, I think people know the Phillies like, I don't know if you're audience.

I'm like, you know, the gay's, hey, we're gets the Phillies is the, you know, a baseball.

There's a small baseball team called Phillies.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah.

And I once worked for them and I worked like, pitch them and tip them in like the fun

plex where like the kids would go in there and I'm like, so I called out one day and

it's something.

Saying I'm sick.

Yeah.

I just don't even go to go do this book signing at the Philadelphia free library with my mom

and my brother.

Okay.

And my brother, um, he, we got interviewed and the interviewer from the Philadelphia

inquire was like, how is like your son who's 16 and your other son 13?

Like, love Chelsea lately as a mom.

Like you let them stay up and watch it and that was like the article, right?

Like so so scandalous.

And it got out there and then Chelsea gave my brother a shout out on the show at the

time.

Yes.

And I remember that episode.

Yes.

And people found out about it and they were like, well, you weren't out.

And I'm like, what?

So a drunken Delcoma mom got crazy and ran into the funplex that day.

Like what really could I've been doing differently that I could not miss this opportunity, right?

Like, so yeah, I got fired for that moment.

And what a full circle moment to be here on GC scoop.

I'm honored.

Amazing.

Yeah.

So thank you for having me.

So let's just get a little history about you.

Yeah.

You lost your job.

Yeah.

Come a long way.

Did you then go on to college?

Yes.

I went to Temple University in Philadelphia.

So I stayed there.

I grew up in New Jersey.

And how did you end up in the reality world?

Yeah.

So I grew up like watching you on Chelsea lately.

I loved like the E news era of E. So I tried to finesse my way anyway possible where I was

like, I need to get out of New Jersey and Philadelphia.

And I need to get to Hollywood.

So my first job was working for E on the live from the red carpet show.

And then I was like, OK, I'm finessing my way into the newsroom.

That's a couple of floors above because I've always grown up watching it.

I grew up with like the Ryan C. Chris, the Juliana Rancid.

Love.

Yeah.

And it was like such a time.

I mean, you know, you literally were there.

Oh, the best.

Yeah.

And I'm sad because I missed like the Wulsher building, which I know was where you guys

were at.

It was just such a, yes.

And it was always just weird.

It was like, no, we weren't at the Wilsher building.

I would go there for other things.

We were at, we were at a building that we shared with Hulu.

OK.

And we're like, Hulu, like, that's ever going to make it like we were such assholes

about this.

That was at Olympic and Bundy.

And then she got her new deal and we moved to Universal.

Oh, we took over the studio that Conan had had.

Oh, and then it ended there.

But like, which was better for me because it was closer.

But yes, that Wilsher building was where it was.

Oh, yeah.

Fashion police and, you know, we knew other people that worked on other shows and it was

a golden era.

Now it might come back because it's coming back with the golden life.

Yes.

And which is interesting that they, the girls are going all going back to E and, and I

think that's a smart move because now E is no longer part of PC so who knows?

It could be a whole new thing.

Yeah.

Well, that's why it's kind of reinventing itself, I think.

Yeah.

Well, that's why at that time when I really was like, I wouldn't work there.

It was so lively.

It was just everything was going on.

And then I was at E news.

I worked on like daily pop and I was like, I feel like this checks a box, but it doesn't

fully check everything.

Like I loved pop culture.

I loved like reality TV and I was like, I need to get like my feet wet and I need to

get in here.

And I thought being like young and like being in TV, the jump from entertainment news is

going to be so easy to get into reality TV.

And then like I left that job at a short stint on like this Lindsey Lohan, like post

production show for her like short live grease show, whatever that was called.

I was just talked about that the other day about she had a beach club.

Yeah.

It was like very short live, no good promotion.

Um, and it was a one season wonder, but what was that?

I wait.

So she moves to Greece where she had they just gave her a beach club.

They just what they thought you could be like Lisa Vanderpump with a beach club.

Essentially.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It was like let's do a Vanderpump rule.

And there's ramen.

Someone, this is their, their shift or didn't fill the champagne bucket.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Big things like that.

So I had this like, you know, gig to work on like a post clip show to promote it.

Yeah.

And it was like six weeks.

And then after that, it was like crickets like I didn't work on anything because I was

like, oh my gosh, I have no, like you have to start over, you know, working from entertainment

news to get into the reality TV world.

So I'm just like, okay, this is more of a hustle than I really thought it was going

to be.

So months go by.

And my first reality TV credit was Vanderpump rules.

Oh my gosh.

Wait, you know what?

Let's like jump to Vanderpump rules.

It's not, wasn't my original order.

This article just came out, Jack's Taylor, formerly a Vanderpump rules in the Valley and

Brittany Cartwright have reached a custody deal with alcohol restrictions.

We're all rooting for Brittany and they're coming back with the Valley and Lala and she

are good friends.

I'm good friends with Lala Lala has said, um, Brittany's doing great and doing it, you

know, and I, I did not stop following Jack's, as he disappeared off of Instagram.

I feel like we have not seen him.

I was going to say it's been very quiet from what I've seen and like things that have

come out, but I always laugh because I feel like he is who, like what you see on the

show is who he is in real life, like the first time that, that season that I worked on,

it was the season that they got married.

Oh, yeah.

And I was like, you know, oh, I'm going to go on like all these fabulous trips and it's

going to be like, you know, I don't know, like the beach or something, something exotic

and I got flown to the Kentucky Castle for my first, where I'm like, oh, okay, like

this is.

And how was that?

Oh, I mean, so you, so that was their wedding.

Yes, that was their wedding.

Do you remember there was some controversy about the wedding that caused that contributed

to the cancellation of them and I believe them getting asked to leave the show, which

was that their pastor had a without spoken about maybe not being as accepting of gay people

being married and being part of the church.

That's what I recall.

I remember that.

And the craziest thing was that the week that we were there doing it, it was Lexington

Pride.

I'm like, I didn't even know Lexington like had a pride.

And I remember I went out with one of my crew members, but it wasn't a good pride.

Was it fun?

I mean, we're going to support, you know, the community, but is it like West Hollywood,

where they go all out?

No, not necessarily, but I remember just the irony of that happening with like the family

and like, you know, all the things with the pastor and then I'm like, we're here and

this is Lexington Pride.

No, then they didn't have the pastor, right?

They didn't.

They decided to advance.

They had to advance then.

Yes, because Lance, that was the big thing, like he came in that season.

He was at the wedding, but I remember now that you're saying it, that was like a thing

that came out where like everybody was like, do they do it?

Do they move forward with this person?

Like what?

Yeah.

Yeah.

But yeah, was it wedding fun?

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, like, you know, you go into these shows and you think like, you're going to

be like a part of it or like get to enjoy it and I mean, you're sweating your ass off.

I'm like, my armpits are sweat and I got ass cracks wet like, you know, I'm here doing

this and you're watching it from above and you're like, okay, it looks beautiful.

But you know, you're not in the middle.

So in that time, your job, you are like what hustling the talent, taking notes on the

scenes, like what, what is it like to be a rally show like producer?

Yeah.

So for that, I was a segment producer.

So like, there's, you know, so many, there's, you got talent, segment, field for this particular

show.

I was a segment producer and, you know, what you do is usually clear locations.

So I remember like that first time on Vanderpump Rules, I, like, it was my first location and

we did it at Al Compadre.

And I remember they were like, you know, the crew, the crew showed up at the wrong location.

Like, what are we going to do?

We got to scramble and like, you know, this is my first one.

You're like, shit, what do I do?

Like, so it's things like that for segment where it's like, you know, you got to make

sure that like, the crew's in there.

They're getting, you know, everything set up, you know, the talent's good and stuff.

But for the Kentucky castle, there wasn't really much for me to do at that point because

yeah, I already, you know, I had a supervising segment producer and actual segment producer

above me.

And then I was kind of bottom of the food chain.

But I remember, you know, just kind of going along with the flow and like, just seeing

what was happening.

But I always laugh because that was like the first time that I tried to open up my relationship

when I went on Vanderbump rolls.

What do you mean, open up?

Like, I was with my boyfriend at the time.

And you were like, let's have an open relationship like we could fill out other people.

Yeah.

Okay.

So, and I remember I was like, not really into it.

But I'm like, okay, you know, as a gay, I feel like it's a right of passage that you

need to do this right.

Like, let's do it.

So I ended up going on Grindr, you know, you're in this hotel room by yourself.

And I start talking to this guy and this guy is very like aggressive.

And he's asking about like my boyfriend at the time.

And I ended up finding to come out that he ended up finding my boyfriend that I was dating.

And my boyfriend and him at the time were having like a secret thing on the side because

this guy found me on social media while I was in Kentucky.

And him and my boyfriend had like this little like a fair, like a little twist like

sexting like social, like while I was in Kentucky for this.

So I'm like, yeah, just like the irony of like the gay whole pastor thing to tie it back.

I'm like, this was how my journey went because I'm like, you know, it gets lonely when

you're on set sometimes and you're in the field and I was younger.

They are broken up.

Now, we all watched it from home and you want to root for them.

I liked them both separately and everything, but the girl saw a poor Brittany saw the

whole experience happen when he slept with the other girl faith and it all came out.

And you know, rotten hell and so you know, was there any like any doubt that it's over

with anybody being like rolling their eyes at this wedding or was everybody like bells

on this marriage is going to last forever.

I mean, I feel like I remember the consensus of like the cast, like the peers, like,

you know, there, because I remember there was one time when I worked with, we were doing

something at hide on sunset and I was a segment producer for it and Jack's came in and it

was like, you know, man, everyone thinks that, you know, we're against gay people.

Like, I love gay people.

There's gay people on my wedding.

And I'm like, I love that he's saying it to like the one gay guy that's on the crew

and it's me.

And I'm just like, yeah, like, you know, I totally see it.

You know, I never got any vibes that they were homophobic.

You know, like they're absolutely not.

I was just, oh, hey, this is my pastor and nobody bothered to go.

Let me just make sure that, you know, that you, I could see what you didn't have a lot

of people that aren't famous that are getting married.

I was out of wedding.

Yeah.

And it was like a family, whatever adjacent wedding.

And the pastor literally was saying kind of very non-inclusive stuff.

Yeah, yeah.

And some of the other like, like, we all had tension because we're all like, I'm bothered,

but then also I'm like, I know, my kids are going to be bothered.

I know the cousin of the bother, like, and we're all like, this is, what are you supposed

to do?

Yeah.

And I don't even think that the bride and groom, like, thought about the whole thing of

what that could be like.

Yeah.

So young people getting married, you know, it's an important thing.

Like, just make sure that you're, because I don't think it had, you know, of course,

I don't think either one of them are at all a homophobic at all.

No, definitely not.

And I mean, I think it's public knowledge because the mom was very like, uh, Brittany's

mom on the show was like, are you get, like, I think she, like, schooled Jacks on one

of the episodes?

Do you remember that where she was like, asked Jacks if he was gay?

Yeah.

Remember when Jacks had like the, got older kids and worked with him and that came up

at one point.

Yeah.

And I remember like while we were filming, you know, there was issue because it was

Lexington pride.

I remember some people of her family, like, didn't want to film at certain places because

of it being so close to the gay pride festival.

Yeah.

So I mean, and when I think about that, I just, when I, when you're there in Lexington,

I mean, and Kentucky, I'm like, can you, I mean, you can't fault, you can't fault these

people for thinking that way, but like, you can't blame her, right?

That her family is like that because I mean, when you look around, you're like, yeah,

it makes sense why these people cannot be so open and understanding of this.

Right.

You can't control everybody that goes to your wedding or everyone that's in your family

or what they put on their front lawn, you know what I mean?

It's just like, yeah, I totally see that.

But it sounds like she'll be thriving and, yeah, I don't know.

I hope Jacks is doing better.

I don't know what he is doing.

I mean, I thought maybe he, maybe he'll be coming back and doing a parent.

I doesn't sound like he's in this season at all.

That's what it sounded like to me too, like I, that he's just completely out, not in

the picture.

And it's just.

And not filming or anything.

Yeah.

But I don't think that will hopefully that won't be forever because, you know, I'm like

thinking if he does get it together and maybe she has a boyfriend and he comes and is

supportive of the boyfriend hanging out with crews and then they could move him back

in.

I mean, he is just a very entertaining person to watch.

Well, there's also something.

Even when he's, you know, out of the map.

Yeah, like it's just like, yeah, you just can't believe he's just such a character,

you know?

Well, there's always something funny.

I mean, I guess it's not funny.

But to me, it's like, there's always like a, a circle of life on these shows, right?

Like, Stasi, she was threat.

Like that season that I worked on thriving, you know, she had, I remember saying to her,

like, oh my gosh, you're having the best year ever.

Like, you know, she got engaged.

She had the book tour.

She was going to spin off, I think, or like podcast series or something and then chanted

up getting canceled, right?

And then it kind of just completely won a skew.

And then we didn't see her for a little bit.

And then now she's kind of back up and it's like, totally taken accountability.

She's moved forward.

I think, you know, she's apologized for it.

Jacks, I feel like the same thing.

Like we saw a really dark side of him.

Things kind of hit rock bottom.

And then I feel like now he's going to kind of disappear.

And then at some point, he'll come back around.

What do you think about James Kennedy?

Do you think we'll hear from him again?

I, the last thing that I saw, what was the, there was a big thing that happened with?

He was with his girlfriend and there was an account that there was a domestic violence

call.

And she, he was not charged with anything formally.

And she, she did not press charges.

They did break up.

Yes.

The account that was told to the cop, which got out to the press, was enough to make.

I think everybody just be like, there's too many other things.

His relationship with Kristen Doty.

There were other stories with Raquel, Rachel Raquel and, um, and so, you know, and he was

really out of height of a thing.

Yeah.

I saw on the night that that happened and he was as Kathy Hilton's like Chris's party

through direct.

Oh, yeah.

He was, you know, very excited about all the, all the opportunities coming up.

He's pitching shows, he's doing this, the DJ careers pop and invited us to, you know,

he had like a residency.

I mean, I don't, I don't, and he's another one that I don't know if I stopped following

him or, or I don't think I can't, but I just don't see it like in the cycle of things,

you know, and, um, we'll see that's the thing, too, is like, you're high.

You're such a hot commodity.

That's why I always think it's so interesting.

It's like when you're popping and like you are, you know, in thriving on one reality

show or an unscripted project, like, people are going to find ways to like pimp you out

in other ways, right?

Like you're going to get the podcast deal.

You're going to get a spin off series.

So I always just think it's so interesting how something, I mean, granted domestic violence

is a very serious thing.

But like, you know, when you are at that height of it, you know, you said that he's pitching

all these shows, you get so much momentum, but then as soon as one thing goes wrong,

it's like, you're forgotten about, you know, jacks, we don't see James Kennedy, same thing.

It's just like you go completely off the radar and no one will touch you.

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What do you think about Tom Sattavall?

He's still hanging on for their life.

Yeah, I think they're, because you know what I think the best thing was.

He was just so much of him's life.

Yeah, traders was the best thing for him.

Totally.

Because I think when you get out of like, when you see people like Lisa Rinnorn traders,

great.

There's something in Canvas on traders, like you get to see them in a different light

than being in that type of pressure cooker and environment.

And I feel like it get you get to see more of like a silly side or maybe not a side where

you're like going in and you're like, oh, I got my boxing gloves on bitch.

Like we're going at it at each other like the traders is such a weird, simple, yet fast,

great.

Yeah.

I don't know why it's just such a great, it's so great.

And there's house of villains and things like that, but it's just not for me hitting

like the traders.

I hope that people are thinking of other type of shows like that that can really make

it so fun for these former big reality stars to still kind of stay relevant and show

what made them famous.

Like I would like to see jacks or James Kennedy on the traders.

Like to me, that would be interesting.

I'm so happy you're saying that because I just met with somebody who was a network exec

and I was saying how I love an underdog, like a one season wonder or somebody who just

kind of fell off and you like to see them kind of pop back up.

And I always am trying to find, you know, being in the unscripted world.

I'm always like, how can you find these type of people who maybe like haven't had big

momentum, but you want to see how they would be in a different format like what we're

talking about.

And the problem is is, you know, people are like, well, they have the traders.

That's where these people who kind of, you know, go into oblivion kind of can revamp

their career.

But I'm like, there's something different where I would love to see like you have these

OG people like, you know, Teresa, Mimi, you know, people who have Bethany.

What do you think about just doing like a traders or type of traders?

For me, I don't watch the challenge and the survivors anymore.

And I get that they mix them all up and also that might make it fun because it was like,

oh, the housewives are going to have, and when they're like, the housewives are going

to have each other's back.

I'm like, when they've never had each other's back, why would they have each other's back

from a different, even franchise or season like they can't have their own cities back?

Like who?

But like, for me, I would, I would, I think on me more, it would be fun just to see it

with bravo.

Bravo should be working on shows like traders, but just for bravo, past talent.

Well, because I think there's a lot, like these one season wonders that go on housewives,

right?

Like, where are they?

You know, I want to know what they're doing.

Like, I want to see if they're down and out and they're losing paychecks and they can't,

you know, live the same life that they used to.

Like, those are the type of people that I'm like, oh, it'd be really interesting.

You see the people who have built an entire career off of it, like a Neenie or Teresa

or Bethany.

Like I was saying, and then you see the people who literally have no momentum.

They have no star power and they haven't had that same kind of luck.

So I'm always like, oh, but then, but then there'll be something negative that follows

them forever.

Like, sadly, on real housewives of OC, Lynn Curtin's daughter is really struggled and

some buddy with an iPhone found her and, and, you know, and then I think that person,

God bless them.

But I also feel like that could be a little unsavorable, like she keeps going back to her

and Lancaster.

Yeah.

And being like, well, we're trying to get you some money and I'm like, okay, so you're

collecting the money whoever's doing the phone.

And then we're supposed to believe we're giving it to Lynn Curtin's daughter to stay in this

grow.

So to like the whole thing and then people like, no, Lynn's trying to help her and then

she ended up doing an interview and, you know, when she tells her story, she's like,

I was 15 or say, sister, we're like 15, 16 when the show started on the show, we're actively

drinking.

They showed that in the original like our, we get evicted the same week that my mom

is getting a facelift.

They ended up getting divorced.

It's just, yeah, of course, that is such a vulnerable time for a teenager.

And at that time, there wasn't social media, but they were also like one of two shows,

like so of this.

So there was a lot more eyes on the show and then to have it go and be able to repeat

over and over while she's down and out and struggling with addiction.

I mean, that's the part where it's like, I know.

Well, that's the thing, right?

Like, viewers really want to watch that.

Like, no, you know, yeah.

And that's kind of like the Mary Cosby of it all with Salt Lake City, you know, with

people talking about like, oh, is it too soon for people to pick up cameras and start

putting them in your face when you're going through something as serious as that.

I've always viewed housewives as like escapeism.

But then for me, I like, you know, where things are real because I think the big thing

that I always say now is like, on the casting side, you can see when people are coming

in and they know, I got to check this off the list.

I got to act this way.

I got to show up this way.

I got to flaunt this type of lifestyle.

And when I know it's so tragic and dark, but like, that is real life, right?

Like you're getting to see a real emotion, you're getting to see real things unfold.

And that to me is kind of what I think it's a really hard thing because as the talent

as Mary Cosby, there's two ways to look at it.

One is, I'll just not share this and go mourn by myself, which sounds awful.

Or I'll use this opportunity to shed a life on this epidemic and also be busy.

You know, a lot of people after tragedy, they want to go back to work.

They want it, you know, because they're like, I don't want to just be left home to like

wallow in my bed.

Like I need to like get up and do other things.

So I mean, it's one of those things I don't think anyone can judge.

And as long as she wants to do it and is on board to do it, then I think it's, you

know, it's up.

She's going to do it that I don't think they should say, no, you can't or you have to

do it.

You sign a contract like, and I'm sure that it was a mutual agreement to share this part

of her life.

Oh, yeah.

I mean, I think of like when I have worked as like a talent producer on these shows, like

I always felt conflicted in those moments.

I mean, granted nothing ever as serious as that.

But when, you know, a housewife like comes to you and your job is to like build a relationship

and really like, you know, develop trust and understanding.

It's very like conflicting, I feel when they come to you because they know they can trust

you.

You're this outlet.

You have all these cooks in the kitchen and they're like, you're the one person that

I can go to and divulge this information.

And sometimes, you know, it's your job to like navigate, okay, do we put this on camera?

Do we show this to the world?

Or do I respect this person's wishes, you know, telling me, hey, this is between me and

you.

I'm just trying to like, you know, I feel like I feel like the relationship, the relationship

between a housewife and her real housewife producer is the traders.

It's basically the traders.

Can I trust you guy?

You a trader?

Are you faithful?

Are you truly?

Yes.

Yeah.

I'm truly my friend as my producer or are you really any Cohen's best friend?

Yeah.

Like, what do you, like, that's such an interesting position to be in.

And I've always, I've always thought a great scripted show would be something fictional

like housewives behind the scenes and the star would be a producer who's gets, because

every season could be like a different thing and they get caught into it.

And I always believe if like, I mean, I don't know how much the networks would want the

cameras to really showcase those things, but like, the castings part of it, the talent

producing it, like, that's a series in itself, right?

Yeah.

Like, I mean, how conflicting of is it, you know, if somebody sent their saying like,

hey, I, you know, I know this woman's really struggling, you know, her husband's cheating

on her.

I know this is happening.

You know, she's my best friend.

And I don't want to put that out there.

She's telling me this now and I'm sitting there like, okay, I really love this person who

I've developed a relationship with.

But if she says this and that other cast me is going to know that it was her that said

it, right?

Because she's the only one that's privy to it.

And then that demises their friendship and that comes on me that I betrayed someone.

It's just like so messy.

Now, in protecting you in your position, so hypothetically, hypothetically, this is the

situation.

Maybe not you.

Yeah.

But what other producers figure out a way to get that juicy information out there without

jeopardizing the relationship where the one housewife is like, I can't believe you told.

Like I, I think, you know, we've seen it like with New Jersey where it would be all of

a sudden Teresa would go, well, I heard a rumor that what was the girls?

What was the girl?

Jackie Goldschneiger.

Yeah.

It's not in the photo.

Yeah.

I heard that Jackie's, you know, Evan was messing around with the gym.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Which I'm like, at the gym, I immediately thought this is a double juicy scoop because

I just thought like a shit, right?

You're at a gym.

Yeah.

I didn't think.

I didn't think kidding on a girl or helping her do her squats.

I just immediately thought like, you know, you're on Grindr going to play another top

room and Kentucky.

Or the sauna is like, okay, like I don't know what have it.

Yeah.

So I was like, oh my god.

I can't believe she's saying that.

Well, it was just a rumor.

Well, where did the rumors start?

You know, and then sometimes as a cast member, you're like, okay, so now to get the story

off of you or you have no storyline at any moment.

So I kind of want to know what you guys think as that at any moment.

I go to the dinner party.

I've been on the show for five years.

It's the real housewives of, you know, West Lake Village.

And I go and I sit down and I'm like, I mean, I had a rumor that Sasha's husband was

seen with like a really young gay guy in Port of Arda.

Yeah.

So that you would most likely have already, like if you're a talent producer, you're already

talking to them about like, hey, we're going to try to get this scene with you, you know,

at here, XYZ with this amount of people, whatever.

So at that point, if they know that they're going into that scene, like they're going to

be like, oh, and their mind, it's going to be like, am I going to bring this up then,

right?

Like is this going to be the moment that I'm going to unfold and drop that by?

Okay.

So now here's the hypothetical.

Yeah.

I go do that.

Okay.

And I tell another girl that this other person is going to go on the show, I had a rumor,

he has a little gay boyfriend, okay, and they were in Port of Arda together.

And that girl kind of knows it's true, okay.

But she's like, my friend is fine with him having a secret gay lover, but this would destroy

her family, the conservative relatives.

She wants to stay married.

The little gay lover does her hair extensions for free.

She doesn't want this out there.

I'm going to say she might like that.

She doesn't want this out there.

She does not care.

She doesn't want to fuck the husband.

She's glad he's gay, like whatever, but she doesn't want to out this out there.

And so then that girl goes, bravo, bravo, fucking bravo, excuse me.

And she gets up and she goes to you guys and she's like, cut, do not put that in.

Now what do you do now?

See, well, they're airing that shit because that's on camera.

So she's already, if you're blowing up and you're making it, like then now they're going

to die deep.

Yeah.

Now they're dying to see.

Yeah.

If I'm somebody who they're just telling me on the phone and they're like, you know,

kind of giving me tidbits, that's for me to say, okay, is this something we can push

forward?

It's something that feels like there's holes in it.

It's not adding, not adding up because sometimes also, like you got to remember, if you're

on camera and like you're watching a wife and a husband and their chemistry is completely

fucked and they're not like intimate or they're not seeing each other, you're going to be

like, okay, we're a producer.

Like we're going to start pushing holes in this and seeing what's going on here.

But if on camera you're showing up making it look like it's the best thing in the world,

but somebody knows something that the producers don't know, then that opens up a whole

another can of worms for that example, though, you're seeing that.

So you're going to push that further, right?

Like you're going to dive in and now get to the bottom of it.

If you're coming in saying Bravo, Bravo.

I don't wish that was a real storyline.

That's so good.

Oh, yeah.

I mean, I'm sure that, honestly, I'm sure that there has been that we just haven't seen

it.

I mean, there's been a couple questionable relationships on that show and throughout

the cities.

But yeah, I mean, for me, it's just hard.

Like I always felt like so empathetic because I'm like, oh, I love these women.

Yeah.

They give us, they're all for the most part of majority of them.

They're coming in.

They know it's a paycheck.

They're dedicated to it for the most part.

And you know, when they start to feel like you're their outlet because if they tell XYZ

on the show, they know it's going to become a storyline.

So it's like that hard balance where I'm like, oh, you're their friend.

But then you're also like, you know, their coworker and it's like, how do you navigate

that balance of not putting their shit out there and losing their trust?

The whole job for that particular role is building trust within somebody, right?

Feel a producer.

How does someone like, is there a training process for what you do?

No.

You know, there isn't somebody who's like thrown into the wool.

Yeah.

You just kind of figured out and you kind of develop your own style.

Yeah.

I've gone through field producing, segment producing, casting producing, development producing,

all the above.

And I feel like you never get a full like, okay, let's have a, you know, a training manual

that you're not, no, you're getting like thrown into, I mean, even casting, right?

I mean, there's things where, you know, I've had women, you know, someone say hypothetically

is telling me, I mean, I put this out on social media.

But, you know, one of the shows I was casting for, you know, a woman was referring her friend

to come on the show and this woman told me like, hey, one of my children is not my husband's

biological child.

But, you know, this is something that we're not going to talk about.

It's just off, you know, camera.

She referred a friend and her friend is now putting that information out there to try

to get on the show and make it a storyline.

I'm like, that is so fucked because that is like your girl.

That's your best friend, right?

So I'm like, it just, examples like that, like, you know, people know what they're doing.

It's, it's very hard to navigate that, but, um, so the friend was like, I have this

nugget.

Yeah.

All of us of my friend who's a regular on the show and I want to get on it.

Yeah.

So if you have me on it, I will throw this nugget bomb at a luncheon or if like, you know,

this is going to be, I'm letting you know this because maybe this could be a future story

that could unfold.

So is that a problem too in that the audience after 20 years who also might want to be cast

members have become so savvy and sophisticated that they're coming and they're whatever

being secret bloggers like Monica Von Tees, what was that reality Von Tees?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Real house of Salt Lake City and like, you know, maneuvering their way into it or giving

it to secret bloggers or they're the secret blogger.

Oh, yeah.

Does that make it harder or better?

I mean, does that help storyline that we're in this situation?

Does it, I mean, I personally don't like it because it's been done so much now.

Yeah.

Like, if you're going to do, like, it's like the binder of at the reunion, it's like,

if you're going to come here, like, give me Kenya more scepter at least, you know,

like, that was something different.

Like, now, I hate the same song and dance repeating.

Yeah.

So I'm like, listen, I'm not going to stop someone's hustle and get their bag.

Like, if you're trying to come on the show, just be quicker and savvy about it.

If you're going to do something we've already seen, no, that's boring.

Like, I had in, you know, we were casting for a show and one of the women found out one

of the girls in town was on the show.

She gets my number somehow, being a casting producer, I guess, it's just now out there

and she's like lambasting this cast member on the show saying, if you want to know XYZ,

she's a fraud.

And to me, it's like, I get, she's mad, but she probably thinks it's her way of getting

on a show, but it's tasteless because I'm like, you're doing something that we've

already seen.

Like, you're bad mouthing somebody saying they're a fraud, they cheat on their husband,

their scammer.

It's like, come up with something better, you know, like, I'm just like, give me something

more.

Like, come up better than, come up with a better than a grifting cheat.

Yeah.

You know, because we already did that.

And just kind of like telling the cast.

Are they vampire?

Yeah.

Like, give me something fresh.

Yeah.

Like, do they take their head off at night and replay like, what, you know, order, they,

they, like, what are they doing?

I just need something more than this, like, and yeah, I, I'm not mad.

I think like, if somebody's truly not a forthcoming and they, you know, do have skeletons

in the closet, you know what you're signing up for too.

That's a thing.

Like, on these shows, I always say, like, look, you're coming on these shows, you're doing

it.

I just said this recently, it's like, you know, I've talked to like a billionaires wife

on the show, like, to see if they would go on it.

Like, if you really want to be on this type of show, you know what you're getting yourself

into, you know, you're signing up for, um, and it's a huge platform.

And I think people, whether they have money or not, they want to do it for the fame.

And you know, these people will sell other people down the river because they're like, well,

I want my ticket.

I want to get on the show.

So I always think the behind the scenes of like all the casting stuff and just the, the,

the trying to get on the show and the tactics, like, that to me is just so interesting.

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slash juicescube.

Let's go and talk a little bit about one of the shows I'm watching right now which is

Real House of Beverly Hills this season has been a little criticized as being not very

juicy, not very eventful.

Yeah, a little bit.

I will always watch these women.

I'm always like down.

What do you do when just not a lot's happening with the cast amongst each other and also

not a lot of exciting things are happening in the in the people's lives.

I mean, sometimes you have at 50 you have kind of a smooth year and this is about.

Yeah.

Yeah, nothing's right.

Sorry.

I'm not remodeling my house.

Sorry.

My mother has been dying.

I'm not cheating.

I'm not cheating.

I'm not getting divorced.

You know, my kids are fine.

No.

My husband's gay secret lover is not adding hair extensions into my hair.

Yeah.

Literally, my other side career is non-existent.

I'm not doing Halloween 52, like what Halloween 50, like I'm still separated from a ratio on

the fourth year.

Oh, I have a strong opinions on this.

So let's hear.

Yeah, yeah.

So tell me.

And so when you said like, what do you do in those situations, this to me all comes

back to casting, right?

Yeah.

This show is hard to cast.

I've worked on this.

I've casted on this show before.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

It's hard to cast because the caliber is these women need to check a lot of boxes.

You're in LA and Beverly Hills.

You represent wealth, affluentness, entertainment, everyone's a little bit besides Sutton.

Even I feel like Bo's being that she was an executive.

I mean, everybody on this cast throughout the years are like either entertainment, Hollywood

or entertainment adjacent.

Oh, yeah.

She, you know, I mean, perfect example.

She's smart.

Which one?

Oh, yeah, yeah.

I mean, you come on the show and look, she's on a show with Jimmy Fallon now.

She's building this whole brand like that to me is the calculation of being smart when

you're on a platform like this, right?

I feel like it comes down to casting because we just got to accept that the women of Beverly

Hills, they're not friends.

Like, they really aren't.

Like, when you watch Salt Lake, you're like, these girls love each other.

Like, there's something there where they're connected, right?

I've been watching, I watched just as much as I work on it.

I'm a consumer of it.

And I was like, have the last three episodes just been like three girls filming in the

Hamptons by themselves and then every scene is like someone just face timing because

the producers are like, okay, let's get a scene where it makes it look like you guys

are communicating still because it just feels so disjoint it.

Then I feel like Amanda is just in her house by herself and like everybody hates her.

And I'm like, what is, like, what is going on?

It just is like no one's connected at all.

Yes.

And I think that's what's really hard because you want to have a boom moment.

You want to have at least Serena or Garcell, you want to have a Rachel, you stole my fucking

house.

Like, you want to have the star power of what bring in those type of women in their heavy

hitters.

They represent Beverly Hills.

But when Rachel, though, doesn't know anybody in the cast and it feels disjointed, it's

like, well, yeah.

That's why nobody's, no fights are really happening.

So I would say if I was a producer, now I'm having to deal with casting decision on that.

Now it falls on me to be like, okay, what is the story, right?

What can we bring out of these women?

What is actually happening?

And it's how much those women are willing to go there and put out there.

That's why I said, like, people are hating on Amanda.

I kind of like her because I'm like, I mean, without Amanda, this show would really

be struggling.

I like a girl that comes in and it's like just making people mad for just being them.

Like, I love a delusional housewife.

I love somebody who's all manifestation, whatnot.

But yeah, without her, there would be nothing.

I mean, but I do think it is interesting and relatable that, you know, at one time, you

know, Mauricio and Kyle and P. K. Andrew, it had this great force and friendship that

we saw.

This was the couples.

And this happens in life.

Not only do one of the break up, but you all break up.

But then Kyle and Mauricio are having their cake and eating it too and eating each other.

I mean, they're just staying married, getting along like, you know, half brother and sister

or something like, and then people are just like getting mad that she's not filing or

whatever.

And I'm like, listen, she doesn't want to split up the houses.

Why would she?

Yeah.

Why would he, when he can have another apartment show up at all the houses, be good with

the daughters, fuck young women and just go, whoo, whoo, show up on the show and like

laugh.

And she doesn't seem to care because she's probably been checked out for years.

And now she bought a place in Tennessee.

Listen, he's not getting divorced because he makes his realms be married to her.

He's been on real housewives.

Batoma keeping on.

It's like the best thing ever.

It's a great.

Yeah.

You know, yeah, why, why would you, I mean, I always said they're not going to get divorced

until one of them truly falls in love with somebody else.

And that lover partner is like, pull the trigger and do that, yeah, like we're not doing

this anymore.

And that's why I think the whole like secret of love affair with Morgan Wade had to be

a secret of love affair because they were getting divorced.

Yeah.

And, you know, and, and now she's just like, okay, well, I'll, you know, walk around

and I'll talk about Doreet and PK, which in real life, you would be talking about Doreet

and PK with your friends.

Yeah, of course.

100%.

Your friends are, your close friends going through divorce.

Someone gets up from the table and you're like, oh, do you like her new boyfriend?

He wouldn't be for me.

I mean, I, I live this life without cameras.

Yeah, yeah.

That's what she would do.

Yeah.

Oh, well, you shouldn't be talking about that.

Well, that's, that is reality.

And like, if it's not juicy enough for you, I think it's, I think you can, what's good

is that even though it's like a simple storyline, it's not, you stole my goddamn house.

It was going to rehab.

But it is like, I miss this.

Give us people at home to go, is, should Kyle shut the fuck up?

Yeah.

Is Kyle actually being concerned for her friend, which I believe does she even like to

read at all?

Should Doreet be annoyed that they're talking about her or not?

I mean, I just kind of feel like, do you, like, I'm over kind of the story.

I like, I just kind of, like, I get why we get over the storyline.

But that's where I feel like it's such a hard job because as someone who loves it as

a fan also makes it part of my content and talks about it.

I all, I sympathize with the producers.

I sympathize with the lady at home who's bored.

I sympathize with the person who's living life who's like, again, I'm sorry.

It's my life.

Do you want me to create something?

Do you want me to file for Doreet when I really don't want to?

It would not serve me at this time in my life, maybe in two years.

I, well, maybe in 10 years, I will.

Maybe I never will.

Maybe we'll be grandparents together and call it a fucking day.

I don't know.

Well, that's why I think it's such a tricky show, right?

Because I think if you lose, I'm like, looking back and I'm like, going through each

one.

I'm like, well, so if you lose Kyle, Kyle, you can't lose Kyle.

Because at this point, it would, it would feel like nothing is there, right?

Right.

It would just feel empty.

But the thing is now what I realized over time and just the way that the housewives

has been, you know, moving forward is that they want to skew younger.

Because when you look at it now, Sutton, she's not married, she doesn't have her kids

really on the show.

I mean, who else is on it now?

You have Amanda who fits what they are looking for because she's younger kids and she's

like 40.

Exactly.

I'm not sure if that Erica, you don't see, she has, her kids never been on the show.

She's not married.

You don't even see the guy that she's dating, Doree, her kids are in it, but she's not married

anymore.

Rachel, though, I just realized we haven't seen the kids in it this season.

I don't know if that's something they agreed together.

I haven't really seen, I don't think they, she talks about them, but I feel like we don't

see them, not that we need to see them, but, you know, well, that's the thing is that

I, with these shows, it's like, they, it's just that they don't have real, like I, when

you fall in love with housewives, it's because you had access inside their home.

You got to see their day to day waking up, taking the kids, yeah, like I remember one of

the first years with, with Kyle and when I had Kyle in my show, I remember I said this

and at the time, you know, I had little kids and I just remember she's putting Porsche

to sleep, who's like two and a half and when you have a little kid like that, you know,

let's lay down with me, mommy and she's having a party, she wants to get back to the party.

And so she's like laying there and she's like rolling out of the bed down the hallway

so that the kid doesn't wake up.

And that's funny and like so relatable, you know what I mean, it's like, and the problem

is is when the kids start not being on the show anymore, you're, I mean, I'm not a mom

or a woman so I can't speak on it, but you could, I mean, you're like changes, like you're

not at home as much maybe you're not as involved in those type of day to day things.

So what do you have going on your life? Well, I, you know, not much.

So it's like, yeah, how, how hard is that for a producer to try to pull those things

out of it, right? I mean, I just feel like for this particular city, it's been kind

of the same storyline.

Do you think like the merging of like, like I feel like for the, for the good cities that

are like the cities also a character like New York and Beverly Hills where you just won't

get tired of it because you see these beautiful, like, do you think they'll ever be a time

where they kind of just do Beverly Hills and they keep OGs and women at that age?

And then it's like Beverly Hills 2.0.

I don't, I think the route that they're going to go forward more is new cities, new cities

because I think you get, it's less money for the women.

Because everyone's starting off at a lower pay rate, yeah, less money and it's a way

to skew younger in terms of getting to see, you know, you like, you, you know Kyle and

you love Kyle because you grew up watching her, right?

So it's like, I watched her kids grow up when you see Portia's like 21 years old taking shots

at the bar now. I'm like, you're like, oh my gosh, I remember when she was in a diaper

on the show, right?

Right. So you're like, holy shit. So you feel very connected to the, you know, as an audience

member watching it. So I think my take would be, oh, new cities fall in love with new people.

And they start to build momentum. I mean, Salt Lake had like, you know, a rough start, I think,

you know, in terms of the fan base. And then it took a couple years for it really to pop.

But I foresee that happening with new cities and new new cities popping like Salt Lake.

Yeah, yeah. I think it just makes more sense. I mean, this brand, it's a brand. Anytime you see

the real house, why I stamped on it, you're going to watch it. Right. So let's talk about

ladies of London. There's just two episodes out. I think it airs right after

real house was Beverly Hills, I think. Yeah, yeah. So there we, there's two out. And I'm obsessed.

It was brilliant the way they marketed this. I'm giving Bravo props like I always do.

Though I wish I'd get some problems. But we got to talk to to get that. I don't know.

I turned Andy. I turned out to watch what happens live. And Bose was on next to

I'm learning everyone's name. Oh, yeah, there's this girl with a pony.

Micah. Oh, Micah. Yes. Yeah. She's the one that Derek, Derek, as they had the falling out.

Right. And so right when it starts, Annie goes, now when was the last time you talked to

Dara, she never came back to the show or Dara. I'm saying Dara. I think it's Dara, right?

I don't know. But so and she's never coming back to the show. And, you know, she's not in the

poster. And I immediately go, oh my God, London started airing. I didn't even know. I

immediately went over to peacock and watched those two episodes because I'm like something went

down where a cast member left after two episodes. Like I was like, that is juicy. So I start to,

so I watched the two episodes. And, you know, this thing, they're not calling it real housewives.

Do you know why? Because there is a real housewives of a London. And they didn't, they just want

to start fresh. Yeah. Well, because I think for them in the culture that we're kind of living in,

most shows that are breaking through are shows that either have original IP of some sort,

right? Like you already are familiar with it. Like I always say, like the only thing in my mind that

has really stood up out in its own form is Secret Lives of Mormon wives because that's just

like lightning in a bottle on a show, right? But like these shows, like ladies of London,

you're already familiar because you know that there was already a series on Bravo before.

So you're kind of like, oh, let's see what it looks like. So that is my take of why it's just

a ladies of London. Also, I think a ladies. So the ladies of London, so you, so that could be

we could now do ladies of Chicago. Yeah. We could do ladies up. I think it's brilliant. Yeah. Because

if so many times they're not housewives, they're not married, they're not straight. And now we

actually have a man on the show, who is, I think the star of the show, kind of the anchor,

because he's friends with everybody who's really funny, he's dry. He is a real. I'm just like,

you could just tell us a cast, my like he knows like he's like, hey, let's drive this. And so

and I think that's the way it should go. I think if real housewives, I think should stay

a cast of women. I mean, I think some things, we just, if they're not broke, don't fix it. Yeah.

But I like this ladies of London thing where it's just, it's predominantly still women, but

a guy doesn't just have to be the best friend that comes in and out. Like he can actually be a

real person because he really is hanging out with these women and everything. Yeah. And of course,

he's so funny and everything. I feel like they used to do that back in the day on housewives.

Like, I mean, the gay wasn't like the focal point on real housewives of Atlanta. They had like a

like two guys. Yeah, they had, oh my gosh, it was, oh my gosh, what's going to say?

One had cheekbones and one white. Yeah, white you banks. And then it was like the hairdresser.

That was like Lawrence. Yeah. So whatever. Yeah. And so, but this, but I can't, this was a really

good casting and, you know, I've never even been to London. But again, gorgeous, gorgeous city.

Yeah. So there's a lot to look at. So it just kind of transports you into a beautiful place.

And these people are different. Yeah. And there's a few hand, well, like half is American,

which I also like. And I can't tell who's who, but I was like, I don't even need to know who's

who because if you have a premiere like that was, I'm like, I'm just locked in and I'm going to

figure it out along the way. Right. And I was confused in the beginning between the two older women.

One that lives with a bird and one that looks like she has severe lipstick. Oh, Kimmy and Margot.

Yeah, those are those two. Yeah, Kimmy and the green rain. So I'm like, those two were interchangeable.

Then there's three brunette, like, model actresses. Missy, I like her. That's the,

the mod. That's the one who blew the whistle on Dar. I like her. She's gorgeous. You know, and then

there's this beautiful black woman who's like, looks like Tandy Newton who has, you know, some type

of royalty. I don't even care if she's boring. Yeah, I just like to look at her and I like her outfits.

And I like that she like lives in a castle. Anyway, the Micah story. So now I'm going to blow up the

Micah story for you. So too bad. But you know, you can watch it. So Micah has his friend and she's

American and she is kind of an influencer that's talking about etiquette. Uh-huh. And she has

his friend who she's like, oh, my God, we are best friends in college and she's this beautiful

Asian woman. We don't even earn a Dara Dara. And she's actually an architect. And they are

cutting it so brilliantly where the dark girl is like, oh, my barely knew Micah in college.

We're not really friends like. And then they have this blow up scene where it's called out at the

dinner that Dara has called Micah cringe and like been kind of nasty about her. And she just

basically goes, this isn't for me. And kids up and like, I mean, it's like, it's great. I mean,

because now I'm like, oh, we're still not even in the story. Like the two episodes are just about

this. Yeah. No spoiler alert. But yeah, I mean, it completely takes a complete turn because now

we're like, oh, that wasn't even fully getting into the story. That's like now one and done.

Like we're related to the Dara because I'm like, if I was cruel and talked shit about my friend

and was called out on it on camera and I didn't need to do this job, I think I might do

the same thing. I might be like, just get me out. People will forget about and people will.

If this becomes a hit, people aren't going to remember that girl in a year or two.

You don't think so? No, I don't. And then, but what I thought was really crazy in this day and age

of Epstein files is that the rumor they drop in the first episode is that same woman Dara,

who was a bitch, Jamaica is a madhouse. Yes. She's an alleged mystery. Yes. And a madhouse. Now,

this could be funnier 10 years ago. Yeah. When there was the happy hooker and there was

the girls that were hooker lights like I used to talk about and there was the Heidi Flies.

But now it's all negative. It's all not. One person wants to be a hooker unless they're

on only fans and they do it themselves. Everyone's trafficked. We never used the word trafficked before.

So it's like, if she's being accused of this, like setting people up, it's a time that it's like

you want to watch how you are seeing it. And I'm like, oh my god. And then the fact that that

Dara will be like, it was like, well, it's not true. So I don't. Well, that's the thing too,

is that I said, see, when that's that first of all, great casting because I mean, to me,

I'm like, somebody had to reveal that there was, you know, suspicion that she was in a ledge

madome. If that's already coming out, like the first one or two episodes, right? So like,

that to me is great casting. But for this, I think that's the problem is like running away from

the cameras and doing that. Now they're breaking the fourth wall, which is what I love because I

think it gives more insight on what actually, like you're seeing the producers hiding behind the

back with the little monitor, you know, in the kitchen when she comes in and she's like, I'm done,

I'm out, you know, and I think that to me is crazy. When I heard about that, she left the show

for Andy Cohen. I'm starting to watch it. I'm like, oh, well, she's going to be like, you're accusing

me of being a fucking man. I'm like, I'm out. No, it was just she was being accused of being like a

shitty friend or a shitty person. And they all were like, we've all heard shitty things about her.

The, the madam is probably the most flattering thing they said. Oh, my God. Well, that's the thing,

too, right? Is that she came in. She obviously does well for herself financially. She came in for

the fame. And I'm like, what does this woman to come into a show where she's getting called a

madam? And this is like, we're not talking about like, I'm like, girl, that's child's play in

the housewives world. You know, if you get called a, a madam, a hooker, like, we, we can. What

are you okay? What did you think about it? Because I thought if someone said, like, I just had

someone recently say, I heard that you, you know, someone told me you said this about me. Okay.

I did a little investigation. I'm like, you got to, you got to mess a trauma troll. Like,

I've never talked about you outside of when we brought it down the show together. It's just,

and then what they said that I said was never anything I've ever said about anybody. It's,

it's typical mean girl shit. It just, you, if you listen to me, if chat GPT, if you ask chat

GPT, what's something mean? Heather would say about it. It wouldn't be that because they would have

taken everything I've said for 10 years and given the right answer. I'm like, this just isn't

something I've said. So I did immediately, like, correct this girl. I'm going,

just can you look where the source is? This isn't because I didn't want this person to go to bed,

feeling that you would do something like I was like, I know how it feels to be

trolled by a troll. And it's all made up just so they guess we're like, just want to fuck with

people. So I'm always the one that's like, I'm always saying that about like juicy crimes too.

Like when someone's being accused of murder, I'm like, and they're just sitting there and they

don't take the stand. I'm like, I think I'd be like, I don't know, but I thought it was like

a very weird reaction when it came out when the Micah Girls goes, look, they were talking

at this party that you're a madam. And she's like, I know, you're right. I know it was like,

it was very weird. I'm like, either you knew this scene was coming. Uh-huh. Or you have heard this

before. Or something, not that you were it in making a commission, but maybe there was

something in your past where you did, well, they introduced somebody to some situation that was

a situation ship involving money. I don't know. Well, the producers had to like, there's no way

that this would have been brewing and she would have no idea that this would have been the thing.

Because I think, uh, Micah brought it up to her on camera, remember? Yeah. And she was like,

oh, well, someone told me like she deflected. So she just gave me the vibe of she was somebody

who probably was like difficult to work with in terms of like, I'm not going to talk about it.

I'm going to completely shut down. And you can't go on a show like this and shut down. Like,

that's just not how it works because you're going to need to defend yourself. You're going to need

to push back. You're going to need to talk about uncomfortable things. I mean, the thing with

Micah came up to her and was like, can we talk about it? No, babe, but I love you. And she like

kissed her. It was like the weirdest thing. I'm like, what is this? Like it just was like a

Jesus and Judas. Yeah. Oh my gosh. It was a little bizarre. But I was like, I'm interested. I

want to see like, I want more. But that to me, which is somebody who came in not knowing what

this world entails. Yeah. And signed up for something that she thought was just going to be like,

rainbow isn't butterflies. And I'm like, that's not it, girl. Like if you know, you're signing up

for a show like this. And you know what also makes me excited about this is like the same way when

people write me and they're like, okay, we're doing our girls weekend in LA. And besides,

you know, going to whatever this restaurant, whatever like weird places, we should we go, whatever.

This makes me go, I definitely like want to plan like a girls trip to London since I've never

been. Yeah. And I want to go to that Asian restaurant. All the spots that they bought and yeah,

yeah, yeah. Stuff because it's not funny because people do that in LA all the time. They're like,

let's go to sir. And I'm like, okay. And now we're like, no, let's go to London and do this.

I'm like, I'm down. That actually would be really fun. It would be really fun. Anyway,

everyone should watch it. I think it's a real fresh show. Now there's rumors that Real Housewives

of Miami is on an indefinite pause or not coming back. What can you give us any inside scoop?

I don't believe that to be true because I feel like there's no way that they would just pull

the plug on this. I think what this comes down to again, casting. You need women. First of all,

the people love Dr. Nicole. She's never coming back to the show. She doesn't want to. And then you

get somebody with like money, like Stephanie, who's been vocal about saying, I don't know if I would

put myself into that again. Todd has a lawsuit out against Bravo apparently. But then she's back

with him. Yeah. So I just think and then also, you know, you got to look at it. Larsa not married.

Kids are older. Adriana kids are older, not married. I'm trying to think who else. I mean, Lisa,

she's going through divorce has young kids. But see, I see you just saying all that. I'm remembering

them. I I think they're all great. Like I think it I say bring them back. Like I feel like they're all like.

I love it. I wish I was like, I don't make this is from like my understanding of just like where

the the connection of where viewers don't like, I mean, they have a cult following, but like,

it's not here. It's not a skyrocketing, you know, and I think it comes down to

disconnection of the women and not having real story. I mean, like, how many times can you watch

Lisa go? No, date and then fight with yeah, fight with Larsson. Yeah, Alexia. And it's Miami too,

right? Like it's a heart. It's like Beverly Hills. Another city that it's hard because

you get a lot of people who maybe look the part, but do they actually fit the bill? Like you

can look the part, but do you have the financial means to live that lifestyle? Are you really connected

to these women by any ounce of degree of separation to connect them to each other? And, you know,

do you really have the personality where you can step in? Yeah, I kind of get me thinking like

with the Rhode Island coming and stuff and this success of Salt Lake City, even though I

was sort of like not not overly into Dallas and I don't really miss it because I felt like

there wasn't, I don't know, it's really about the people. So it's like, but I wonder, yeah, if

the city's almost too big and the characters in an aren't big enough or something, like it kind

of has to fit. Yeah, the city has to be the right size and the connection always has to be real,

which is why like New Jersey and, and you know, the sisters, how it originally started was such a

hit. What do you think will happen with New Jersey? We keep waiting to hear what's going on there.

Same thing. I think they, I think the network has been so used to turn and burn. Like, you know,

they New Jersey infamous for that. I mean, they filmed a reunion while they were still filming

a season at one point. Like they would just crunch these bad boys out. I think now because they

know that other cities are coming. They have other shows, a lot more shows on their slate.

They don't need to turn these shows out the way that they used to. And I actually think for a show

like this, it's beneficial more time has passed because then you can get passed. Okay, we're not

doing another Theresa versus Melissa thing. They made a man's, they know what they're doing.

You know, and it kind of lets things cool off a little bit. And I also think another city that's

hard to cast just because we'll state the cast because, you know, who is really connected,

who fits that bill? You have really strong stars on the show. I mean, Theresa alone is,

I mean, a star. You have Margaret. You have Melissa. You have Dolores. Like, those are heavy hitters.

So it's like, where do those girls stack to? And then you have to think they age part of it too,

right? Who were the women that are coming in with young kids? They did try to do it the season.

I don't know. I mean, they didn't land. I feel like for the viewers with these two,

because I think the tree-sim Melissa stuff was so dark again. Yeah.

It'll come back. They're not going to cancel New Jersey. They're not going to cancel my

Emmy either. I think it comes. I mean, I'm saying this. I don't 100% know, but in my gut,

I can't imagine that they would let these shows go. It, to me, it's all about good casting and

taking their time with it. Yeah. I think it's interesting that they just picked plucked Dolores out

to go and spend a summer in New Rhode Island. Yeah. We'll see. That's where I think she has a

genuine connection to one of the women. And I feel like that is a smart move than doing that,

because I even feel like New York reboot. Carol has been announced to be in the mix of it.

And I'm like, oh, okay, this is really smart and a good tactic, because you bring in

that core audience of that legacy of what you liked of the show, right? You like Carol,

because she really fit New York. You feel like you know her. Same thing with Dolores. You feel like

you know her. You do know her. You watch her on traders in New Jersey all these years. You put her

in a new city. Then you're like, oh, there's something there. It's different than just plucking

brand new people and throwing them to the wolves. I think it's like maybe a new tactic that Bravo's

using. If like, let's give some IP of people that we know already and then build a show around

that in a way, right? Yeah. When does Rhode Island come out? April 2nd. Oh, and then the valley

comes out then too, right? Like April 1st or something. Yeah. Yeah. That'll be an exciting

situation. Okay. Going back to Real House House of Beverly Hills, what happens when you have

like the friend like Natalie goes. Oh, yes. We don't know her at all. Yeah. Like poor girl.

Natalie goes. It's just there. Yeah. And she goes to Italy. And I don't know if like she never

pops during the season. And they can't like really cut around her. But then as you know,

it's like she shows up one day and she's like, I had a happy ending by a man at a massage.

And I'm like, when they did that, it was like, we don't need a girl. That's the first time I ever

heard you talk. I felt like that was so planned. And it's like, it's not even original like joke or

story or anything. I know. And it's kind of gross. But you can't even be mad at her because

if it's not saying you are, but the audience, I feel like in terms of saying like, oh, you know,

why she like try to be provocative or why she just so boring. It's like that's just they're

not giving her enough airtime or she didn't pop or she just they cut out all her other interesting

stuff or whatever. And like, but I'm sure like she maybe had a story like that and they're like

tell that story because like all the women will die. But I also want to say that story like

sometimes I wonder like, you know, some some guy that's producing it maybe heard that and thought

that was like, oh my god, a woman getting a happy ending. It's like, there was a whole story

line on sex in the city about that in which, you know, I was written by man, uh-huh, where Kim

Catrol like gets kicked out of the spot because she keeps going back for her happy ending. But also

to someone at home, honestly, I don't want to think about like if that's gross. You don't like that.

I don't like it. You don't. I don't think it's that we're Heather McDonald draws the line on how

I can't wait. It's in a gay world. It's like a real treat. Yeah. But for a woman to think that

you're like getting a massage that guy just starts like dealing with your bean and you're like,

I didn't really know how. I'm divorced. Like, there's just something about it that's like,

I don't know. I mean, nobody even really made a big deal out of it. And I, I haven't until now,

I just thinking like, that's the only thing we're going to remember this poor girl. I'm about

getting a happy ending at her massage. I didn't even know what a woman's happy in. Like, I know,

I mean, I'm gay. I live in West Hollywood. I know. I know what a happy ending is for any guy.

There's a, of course, a dick. And there's something you do with it. But I didn't know with

girls. Like, I was like, Oh, like, dude, like, I didn't know that was a real thing. I went to a

place. I go to a massage place. I assume it's he's massaging you. And then he starts, you

know, getting to a place where you then orgasm, whatever that is, I figure with, you know,

finger you, whatever. And, you know, and then I almost got insulted because I put my friend onto

a place. We're not going to out the name, but it's a place close by that I go to for they've

given me legit massages. I've been like, Oh, my gosh, I feel like a new person. My friend has

gone to about four different people, gets a happy ending every time he goes. And I'm like,

do I take this personally? Like, why are they not doing this to me? Like, why are you getting

every person on the roster? I think there is. I thought there was like an unwritten rule hint

where it's like you kind of say, I thought it was like, do you want that? And then you either,

like for men at like places that do both, just legit massager, I one time was somewhere in

Encino. And I had like an hour to kill. And I'm in like a square thing. And I see like the little,

you know, cat waving, you know, like a place, whatever. And I'm like, I like love a massage.

I don't care if it's like a random spot, whatever. So I go in. And it's like all covered up.

And the lady comes out saying, hello. And I'm like, oh, hi, I was wanting to get a massage. And

they're like, no. And so then I realized, oh, my God, this is a legit sex shop. Like,

it was like, they're not going to take me. They're all the only one men give the happy ending

pay more than the $42 for the massage. And that I was like, oh, because I, yeah, like like the,

because when I go into those trim on places, they're totally legit, like get a massage. And

there might be somebody in a cot lane next to me getting a massage. But I'm like, whatever,

it's not the price. But yeah, I just thought that was just such a weird thing that I feel

kind of bad. Cause like, this is what she's going to be remembered. Yeah. And then someone made

a video about like, oh, so Victoria, all the after show and she's sitting there. They're like,

why is she on the after show? She must pop later than this is what I'm thinking. I, if you want

to hear my hot take, my hat take is that I'm thinking she doesn't pop that what, what happens

sometimes on these shows is that somebody can come in as a full time cast member. Yeah.

And it just the cards don't pan out for you. Like I had somebody on a franchise who started off

full time. They could not give the story that they promised. And they were just became a

friend of they were, you know, when you say that without getting yourself in trouble,

give the story promised. What's an example hypothetically, like let's do a hypothetical so you're

not revealing anything. Yeah. Yeah. I tell you something in our interviews. Everyone's like,

holy shit. She's great. Have her on. Yeah. Like what would be a story that then I don't deliver?

My husband is going to be on camera. We have this great relationship and it's thriving.

You know, I'm working on rebuilding my relationship with my sibling and my parents. Parents don't

want to be on camera. Siblings don't want to be on camera. Husband doesn't want to be on

cat. You're like, I mean, what are we showing you knitting? And you know, like what are we going

to do at this point? You know, it's like, well, I love sudden, but the other day her scene was

watching her TV with the three cats and a dog. And I almost felt like I was felt that as a viewer

and as someone that knows TV, like they shared to show that they they showed that part. They showed

to do it just to kind of like fuck her a little bit to kind of be like, well, there's nothing going on.

If if if you are not back next season, it's because you maybe couldn't deliver those things.

Which is unfortunate because sometimes you do, like I said, get to a certain age. And if you're not

dating anyone and you're not and your kids don't live with you and they're not particularly like

wanting to be on the show or FaceTime every day and tell you about their exciting thing or have

you be stressed about them. Yeah, it's like, what are you going to do? What are you going to do?

Well, that's why I think with Natalie, it's either something was promised or things were just so

boring that they brought her in there with the assumption of like, maybe she'll make it pop and

give a little more. And it's either that she got overshadowed or they brought her in and she didn't

pop the way that they thought she was going to pop. But that's disappointing because I think the

season they needed someone like that to really make it happen. So, so hypothetically, do you keep

Amanda if I was producing this? Yes. Oh, yeah. I'm keeping her absolutely like I just like I like

somebody that can come on a show and just make bitches mad just for being them. Like, yeah,

that to me is just hysterical. Granted, if they're really toxic behind the scenes or whatever,

like, let that come to light. But I don't think she is. I think she's just, but she's getting a

reaction and that's important. Oh, my gosh. I think it's so amazing. I just love when someone

just comes in and it just likes people up and they just get mad. And right now it just feels like

her against everybody. Yeah. Kyle is just like probably holding on because Kyle has been through

the ropes that this like been through the ringer of knowing this girl is going to get next season off

if I don't jump in and help her out, right? Yeah. So she's her only real friend at this point.

Which I kind of like too. I kind of like her being like, well, we are supposed to give opinions

about each other and then your mad that she's giving an opinion about you. Like, what else do we do

on the fucking show? Exactly. Then like, so I kind of like that there's been more like moments like

that like our job is to talk about our lives and talk about each other. The other thing is

sadly Rachel Zo was robbed. And now, you know, I talked about this on the show. Yeah. So she was robbed.

Kathy Kilton while her husband was there was robbed. Kyle has been robbed. Doreed has been robbed.

Garsell has had two SWAT situations where someone calls a SWAT team to her house.

What do you, has that ever been an issue in that you're showing these people's homes? I mean,

but on the other flip side of it, everyone can find your address. Yeah. You know, so unless you live

in high security gated community, people could drive up to your house. They could take a photo of

the outside of your house, even if you're doing a false house on the outside like they did the

Kardashians for so many years. I mean, Rihanna's house, too. Just that. I mean, that was horrific.

So I mean, does that ever, is that ever a discussion or like, and then you're supposed to show your

goods and show that you're wealthy yet? Well, that's the problem is that they want you to show this,

but then there's a really bad side of it when you're putting it out there that people say,

well, we know they're a bravo con during this weekend. So let's go and rob like, I mean,

that's really something. Sure, even if you don't post in real time, being like, I'm at this

restaurant and you actually take your photos and you do it. Oh, we had, you know, now I'm back.

Here was my great weekend at Watchroom's life. You're watching what happens live. Yeah.

You might not be filling right now, but you filled in two hours go, which means you're not in LA.

I've seen that in real time. There was one time we were in Vegas and I saw a housewife there.

And I was like, wait, is that her? And I'm like, oh, yeah, that is her. But I'm watching her story

and her stories that she's posting at her house. She's there. But I'm like, oh, no, she's here.

That's smart. And then I saw a couple of days later is when she posted that she was in Vegas.

And I'm like, oh, that's probably because she was back home at that point. That is very smart.

But sometimes you're just you're too big or you're on a show, you're on a live show,

you're on a New York show and people knew you really can. I mean, I guess I was saying like,

yeah, I think that's another thing people need to consider when they go on a real housewife show.

Then on the case of Potomac, they jumped on the being robbed bandwagon,

but they were never robbed. You're like, you're like, you're like, can't make this shit up, right?

I mean, they were never robbed. And then they said we were robbed. And then they added things to,

well, to your point about the house exterior shots, there were there were moments specifically

when I worked on inter pump rules when a lot of cast members were starting to make money and

they were buying all their houses in the valley. And they were a lot of them were like, we don't want

exterior shots of our house because those houses aren't in a gated community. They're just like

right off the street. I mean, granted some of those houses too are off the street too. I mean,

they might have big gates and Beverly Hills, but I mean, Sutton lives on a main road, you know? So

it's like, we see it. But yeah, that has been a point of people like, I don't know if I want my

full exterior of my house out there. But that's a big thing like in casting, like you're looking,

you're like, what does your house look like, right? Like that's a big thing. They want to know

if you are walking the walk, you're talking the talk. So I feel like that is the housewife's

brand of like seeing, like you're saying, what do you live like? What is your lifestyle? But

I feel like the future that could be a big thing for people not wanting to put that out there now.

That's what was so funny about this pretty woman on ladies of London that she lives in like a

fucking hobbit house. Yeah, oh my. Oh, the one with the bird. Yeah, this was the bird. It's like

a tiny, the most tiny. I don't even know how the carer man fit in there. The paint's peeling on

the roof. There's like bird shit everywhere. But then I'm like super intrigued with her life story.

Oh, yeah. Because she's like, oh, I had all this money and then I got nothing and now I'm like,

I live with a bird and like, I was like, there's something there. Yeah, as long as it's honest,

I don't care. That's how I feel too. That's why it's hard. Like there have been women. I

rather see someone live poorly, but have an interesting story than someone to act and buy all the

fake shit and act like they're rich. So happy you're saying that because when there have been

projects that I've worked on where if their house doesn't look the part, they they're not in the

mix. Like that's a deal breaker. Like if your house doesn't look a certain way, like it's like,

well, what makes this real housewives? Why would you come on here? And I agree, I'd rather see

somebody live. It may be a more modest home. But then in the bigger picture is like, does that

take away the image of housewives? Because what do you think of housewives? It's women who live

a particular life, you know, an affluent life and expensive life. So it's like, well, if she's

living in the house that, you know, the kid that I graduated high school with just bought, you know,

it's like, does that really mean anything? But I agree with you. I think it's like as long as you're

interesting and you're, you know, as long as you're doing the job, you're clever, you're funny,

you have an interesting point of view, you're fun to watch on TV because whether you're attractive

or both or you know how to put it out together or and you actually have a real connection to these

other women. I mean, like Gina, people always criticize Gina on OC. She's not rich. Yeah,

her. So what? Like, you know what I mean? She's, yeah, she's funny in the confessional. She's

interesting. Like, oh, she's to me. I feel like she's become somebody like full. Like she knows

her job now. Like, she's great. Like, I think she's actually, oh, the thing that people forget is

that it's just all subjective. It's entertainment. Yeah. You were not hiring people to work at the

factory. Yeah. Where you're like, well, you're supposed to know how to work a 25 inch screw or

something like, there's no criteria. Like, and so it's just like, no rules apply in entertainment.

Just be fucking entertaining. Well, I think they're thing of what they do is that's the friend of

role. Right. We can get a brandy glamville. Brandy did not live like the rest of the Beverly

Hills ladies. And what did they do? They're like, you're going to be a friend of right? Because

we mean afterwards because she became a regular. Well, yeah, she did. But that's because she proved

herself as a friend of a personality like her saying is like, she's quick, savvy, witty, but she

did not live in a very aspirational life in terms of financials, you know, and I think that's what

they do because then their point would be, well, if we just let anybody with, you know, a regular

house or regular lifestyle, then that's just now everybody. It's a free for all anybody can join

the show. But I kind of feel like that is Salt Lake. Yeah. Like, I mean, like, you know, Meredith comes

off wealthy and Lisa says she's wealthy. But like Whitney lives in like a cute normal house and always

has. Yeah. I mean, Monica, I loved when she came on for the sake of her house was like a regular

regular house. Like it was just cute. Yeah. And nice. But she definitely, and she was honest about

it. That's what I liked about it. Like, hey, this is not the type of lifestyle I live, you know.

Right. Well, this has been so much fun. I thoroughly have enjoyed you being on the show.

Thanks for having me. And we can talk about housewives all the time. So you'll have to come back.

Please, let me come back and tell everybody where they can follow you because you give good

tiktok and insight and funny. I, yeah, follow me. Just my name on tiktok, Instagram,

Paul Royston. And I have a podcast with my mom where we talk about these Hollywood stories,

all the good stuff growing up and surviving in Hollywood. And that is at hold on. I'm calling

my mom. So we have a podcast that we record every week and drop every Monday. So yeah.

That's a great name. I love it. Thank you. Well, thank you so much for coming.

Thanks for having me. Thank you for you. Thank you. And everybody, go to Heatherington.net

for everything tickets to my shows. I'll be in Salt Lake City March 20th and 21st. And

to drone picture on. Thank you. Bye.

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