Rece Davis and David Pollack on Lou Holtz & the State of College Football

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And how about that Polak interception in the end zone?

Well, it's David Pollock, and I think people are going to learn what kind of ball player

he is.

He's got a heart of a line.

I'm real proud of that kid.

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Next, here on Seaball Gitball.

It's not just Mr. College Game Day with basketball and with football.

It's my dude, one of my best friends, one of the best people on the planet, Reese Davis,

and Reese.

There's so much to talk about with basketball going to the tournament and college football

because we're almost there again already because the season's so long, but the great

Lew Holtz, man, like you getting to work with them, us getting to work with them just

at ESPN.

Like very few people do you go, that's one of one.

Like God only made one of those, and there isn't another one that you'll ever think of.

Like that's, that to me is what stands out just about, about Lew.

David, there are so many great stories, but just, and I don't think his son, Skip, will

mind me sharing this when Skip called me yesterday afternoon after, after Lew died.

And Lew's had a tough time for quite some time, and he said that, he said that when he

would have good days, he said they would take him out and he would sit outside and get

some sun and be in his bed by the pool, and he'd say, bring me my pipe.

And he said, one day they were out there and he said, you know, why don't, why do you

think the Lord just doesn't go ahead and take me?

I'm ready to go.

And Skip said, well, dad, he said it's probably because you'd go up there and start telling

him how things ought to run.

And when you get ready to be an assistant coach again, he'll probably bring you home.

So Skip said, dad must have decided he was ready to be an assistant coach, finally.

But he was a wonderful guy.

There's so many people, David, in my life that, you know, people of the U and I both know

mutual, mutual friends who have, you know, handled many affairs for us, who I would not know

would have never met or even known they existed, if not for Lew holds, through connections

with him.

You know, he was a really meaningful guy and, you know, we had a lot of great times.

I posted that picture last night of you and him and Mark on set on the bowl selection

day.

When Mayday was holding up that blank t-shirt because Ohio State didn't go to a bowl.

He said, this is your Ohio State bowl shirt.

The Ohio State fans loved it, didn't they?

Oh, yeah, they were thrilled about that.

They love that.

You know, when did you first meet Lew?

Like, how did you first start a relationship with him?

He came in right after he finished coaching at South Carolina.

They had hired him and he was supposed to be on ESPN 2.

And if you remember, oh, you may not, because you were still playing.

But the first weekend, maybe it was, maybe you were still playing.

You might have been in the NFL.

But the first weekend Trev Alberts was with us and Trev, you know, got crossways about

some things and left, you know, after the first week.

And they brought Lew in and said, you know, and said to Lew, well, you know, why don't

you sit in with Reese and Mark until we find somebody in permanent basis, we'll see how

it goes.

And then Lew joked years later, they brought me in there and didn't even send my wife

a ransom note, you know, and he was in there.

And so we started working together and, you know, he had a presence about him, even all

five foot six of him or whatever and skinny as a rail.

But, you know, he had an RN of presence and you wanted to be around him and he was great

storyteller.

And just I think through those long days in the studio watching games and learning from

him about a lot of things about, you know, learning about what he viewed as important

in terms of being a father, learning what he thought was important and building a team,

you know, and learning, he has this remarkable photographic memory and the ability to dissect

instantly what everybody on the field did on any given play.

It was a really remarkable thing.

I think just spending all that time together, when we spent, you know, we spent 12, 14 hours

a day, a Saturday together for 10 years.

And you know, so you get to know him and he was really big on building relationships.

So he would, he would come to our house on Thanksgiving.

I remember one of the first years that we worked with him, probably working with him

for a year or two, and we were going to Orlando for our annual Disney vacation.

And Lou insisted that my family and I come over and say, you know what, stay with us the

whole time.

I want you to come over and stay at my house for a couple of nights.

And so we thought, well, this is a great opportunity.

I'd like to get to know him as his whole, and we'll do it.

So when we get there, Lou had to go to a speaking engagement.

So it was just some of his holds for a while.

But Lou said, I want you to understand something.

He goes, it's not my responsibility to entertain you.

I'm not here to be your tour guide or to make sure that you have something to do.

That's up to you.

He goes, we just want you to be here and get to know us a little bit.

No, let's find coach.

You know, you don't need anything like that.

Well, one morning we're up and we're having coffee with Mrs. Holtz or whatever.

And I look at my kids are going, like, where are my kids?

Well, I said, no kids, no kids, no Lou.

And before along, the guy who wasn't there to entertain me or wasn't there to entertain

my kids, I catch a glimpse of driving through the neighborhood.

Lou driving them around on a golf cart and then they come back around later and my son

who was probably eight, I don't know, was driving the golf cart through the neighborhood.

And my daughter would have to, except she distinctly remembers she couldn't reach the

pedal.

So Lou put her up on his lap, hyping his mouth and there, you know, he let her steer

while he hit the gas and, you know, he was, he was really meaningful to our family

and he was wonderful to us and I, you know, it'd be a great loss.

But I have so many, so many funny memories, some of them involving you, actually.

Yeah, I remember sending him in the picture in the South Carolina picture.

It was it to you and Lou, a video of, it was, it was the South Carolina interception

play and I went right to the spot on the in zone and I'm holding the camera and I'm

like, god, Lee, it's something right here happened.

Like, Reese, do you think Lou remembers this right here and what do you think he said about

that?

What did he say in studio?

I remember exactly what he said.

He said what he always said when he gets mad, he goes, oh, kiss my hindquarters, if you

didn't say hindquarters.

And then he started ranting about one dang play, one not dang either.

He didn't swear very much.

He's like, what else like?

Well, he actually made a lot more than one play, Lou, that was just the most memorable

one.

Oh, I kissed my hindquarters again, you know, he, that was so funny, though, because it was

tough to get him because he always would have the last barb.

I mean, he had, he went on that one.

He was so, even, even in later in life, he was so sharp, like so quick-witted.

I would never forget.

He was like, I remember he killed, he killed his son, I mean, he was just like running

with speed option to at, at, at, to end the game, really?

Like, that's what we're doing, Skip, like, like, he totally screwed us.

And I was like, I love that he will throw his, his son under the bus, like, what were

you doing?

What were you thinking?

Uh, and there's no, no one was spared.

I mean, he loved everybody, he loved, he loved Skip.

And I mean, there, I don't know, I mean, you know watching Nicholas now and then me

with, with my son over the years watching the play sports, and Nicholas and Leah for

that matter, that, that can be kind of agonizing.

Lou went through it, man, when Skip was a head coach at East Carolina and at USF, Lou

went through it every Saturday because, uh, the pirates or the bulls, they were definitely

on, on the six pack of monitors in front of us all day and he would, he was living and

dying with every snap.

So, yes, he would, he would, he would call you out.

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On it in a heartbeat, but man, he believed in skip and always did and talking about what

a great coach he was, but he was living and dying every play.

And if the play wasn't what he would have called or the defense wasn't what he would

have run, he definitely was having his say in the studio too.

He might let you know about it.

Oh, yeah.

What about you and him and Mark, like just that that show, like for you to put a robe

on, like and do that show, because I just remember watching it so vividly, it felt like

15, 20 years of it, like we got to see it, but like making the case back and forth and

both of them going at it, like it was just that had to been, that had to been the fun,

the most fun part of the day.

It was for me.

It wasn't always for them, because they were competitive and they wanted to win.

And we never scripted who was going to win.

And we'd always try to find something that they legitimately disagreed on.

And usually that wasn't too terribly hard because, you know, I mean, I love Mayday

and I know you do too.

But if you continually tell Mark May how blue the sky is, he's going to start arguing

at cloud.

There's some shade of gray in there.

I mean, you may say it's blue, but that's a lot of gray, you know, so that's kind of

just his disposition.

So it wasn't hard, but they would, I mean, they would get mad when they lost in the famous

scene that's popped up on social media over the last day or so about him flipping over

the podium when I ruled in Mark's favor.

He was mad.

David, he was legit mad.

And he had one, three or four weeks in a row, whatever it was, and you know, I was sort

of feeling the need to tip the scale of justice back in Mayday's favor.

And, you know, I remember telling him, because I kind of got annoyed with him actually

to be honest, I got mad at him.

It was like enough already.

He was like, we finished taping it and he was just on and on.

You're a corrupt judge.

You couldn't judge anything.

Your court is awful.

You're terrible at this.

I'm never doing it again.

I'm on and on and on and on.

And finally, I said, you know, Luke, you can't win every week.

And he looked me dead in the eye and said, hell, I can't and stormed off again.

I mean, he was just, you know, that's a way he was.

The other story that I haven't told as often is I wrote a script, a parody of that great

courtroom scene between Tom Cruise and Jack Nicholson and a few good men.

And I thought Mayday would probably pull off the Nicholson role better.

And that was the only time we ever scripted or prompted anything like that.

So I wrote the whole thing.

It came to me for whatever reason and I wrote it.

And Lou was furious at the end of taping that because he felt like he hadn't had a big

enough role.

He didn't like his part.

He thought it wasn't enough.

Why was Mayday getting all the lines, all this stuff?

What turns out, even though I told him it was a movie and told him you're the Tom Cruise

role, he, that didn't matter because he'd never seen the movie.

He didn't understand the whole thing.

So he left mad that Saturday night and I thought, well, I'm going to have to smooth that

over next week.

He comes back in next week and he's happy as happy as a clam talking about how great

final verdict was the last week.

And I said, well, I thought you were mad when you left last week.

No, I wasn't mad.

And he goes, you know what, you know, four ladies in the airport stopped me and told me

I looked better than Tom Cruise, right?

And when they took, so you know, it's all what took.

It's all what took.

Totally saved you.

Totally saved you.

All right.

Well, no, I mean, Lou, it's good to know that there's another assistant coach up in

head and that's the dang sure.

What it, what it, what most excites you about the Hoops tournament coming up, man, just

everybody always has a bracket this time of year and it's always fun, man.

I think it's the number of individuals that potentially could put their teams on their

back and carry them really deep in the tournament, sort of like a Kimber Walker or Carmelo

Anthony, she passed Napier, you know, a number of names over recent years, kind of loaded

up teams and had, you know, transcendent performances.

We've had an inordinate number of individuals have, you know, 30 and 40 point games.

This year.

And I think because of that, you have some guys and maybe their teams aren't as strong,

but maybe somebody gets hot.

I think that's the most exciting thing because to me, it's pretty clear cut.

It's not as clear cut as last year, but it's pretty clear cut who the four best teams

are.

I think I think the four best teams are Duke, Michigan, Arizona and Florida.

Now, you cons close, but I think those four are the best.

Now, Florida, I mean, you know, you cons good, Houston's really good, you know, there are

a few others.

I'm sure I'm forgetting off the top of my head that certainly could do something, but

I think those four are set apart, but they're not so far above the fray that AJ Devonze

can't, you know, put 45 on you and knock you off.

You know, that Kingston Fleming, who is a Houston one of those better, better players

that can do it, they're just a number of young players.

If Caleb Wilson is able to come back healthy from North Carolina, you know, they're just

a number of the list goes on and on.

Yeah.

I mean, I spent some time this week with Booser, with both Boosers and John Shire, went

up to Duke.

I mean, you know, look, they're one of the best teams anyway, but then they've got a guy

who just always delivers.

He always produces.

I asked him, David, this is an interesting question for a guy like you who played at a high

level.

I asked him, you know, Cameron, you do everything.

You know, 13 straight games with a three, every game this season, multiple assists, you

know, shooting a high percentage, they said, how do you evaluate when you watch your tape,

whether you played well?

And it's sort of stumped him for a minute and he finally said, you know, if I do things

that contributed to winning, whether it was scoring or not, that's how I evaluate it

right now.

And he's just, I mean, he's not as explosive and not as dynamic as Darren Peterson, you

know, Kansas or his defonce, you know, or some of the other guys, but man is he good.

He is so, so good.

So I mean, he clearly can carry them as well.

Well, and that's what makes me for the next level.

It's he's an interesting case to me because I know he could be a high pick, obviously,

but like to be that next level and go to the NBA, you find very few guys that aren't

freak athletes that can go dominate the NBA.

Like you can find good players and I know he's better than his dad and I think he could

be a good player.

But he's either that player that, you know, you can put a franchise on his back like that

will be interesting because but the big and strong in the head and all that stuff, I don't

doubt.

He's fun to watch, obviously.

Who does he remind you of?

I mean, I, I talked to Scout and I said, I'm not saying he's this good yet, but are there

parts of his game that remind you of Luke a little bit?

I mean, he can, he can shoot it, he can pass it probably a little bit different because

he's a little more in the post or whatever, but, you know, not as good, not as good with

the ball, you know, not as, not as good at putting people in jail like Luke, it's a, I

don't get it.

That dude can barely jump over a curb and he and he can dominate anybody you put on him

that's super fast and springy.

Like it's just incredible, it's, it's incredible to, I just literally, I'm like, I'm blown

away by people who don't have that upper level elite athleticism that can still win.

Like it's a, it's, I mean, I was watching a game last night where we got two kids in

high school.

It's on Nicholas's team.

One's got all the SEC offers and another one's going to Clemson and they're totally

different players like, but one is crafty can do all these different things, can shoot

the mess out of it.

The other one, he, he dunked last night Reese and he was looking down at the rim and I

was just like, well, as like, it must be nice to fly like that dude.

He knows what it feels like to fly that he was so high in the air, but it's so fun to

watch the different dynamic abilities of folks, but, but again, you have to have a component

of this, which Luca does and watching at the next level, it seems like it's going to be

fun to watch who the number one pick is overall because like you just talked about, there's

a bunch of kids that can carry and it's because there's so many good freshmen that are just

off the franchise off the rip that are just so good, man.

Two of them at Arizona, I mean, they're not quite, you know, quite what those guys are

and I don't, they're not quite Peter, Senator DeBonzi, you know, take over a game, Nate

of Bent, Tennessee, you know, before he got banged up, I know it last weekend, but, you

know, there are so many guys can take over, but it was at the guard at Arizona, Braden

Burries is really good, co-opied, big guys good and they've got a nice mix of older guys.

I mean, it's going to be a really interesting tournament, but I do think that those top four

seeds aren't quite as set apart as the four who ended up making the final four last year.

Yeah, all the ones last year, college football offseason, like what is, what is stuck out

to you this offseason anything in particular?

There's obviously been a lot going on with portal and it seems like there's a court ruling

every, every so often and if you get a good football fan, that's a good, it's a good

thing for a college football, but anything stuck out this offseason?

I think just those things and what are we going to do with the future of the playoff and

the future of eligibility, because the playoff will work itself out if they just don't do

something dumb, you know, if they just, it's six, 12s enough to be honest.

So what I would probably prefer right now is 12 in another round of home games, but 16

wouldn't bother me.

Go beyond that, it's too much.

The eligibility thing and how you determine it.

I don't care what you do, you just got to find something and stick to it, you know, whatever

I don't, what is the rule, you know, is it, you know, five or six years after your high

school graduating class is done, is it, you know, what, what is it because, you know,

I laughed at Sabin, not adding, but you know, I sort of chucked him, but okay, that might

be a little hyperbolic when he said, how far are we from, you know, former team's quarterback

being on the practice squad of the Giants in the, his old school, they had a year left

in his school's quarterback gets hurt and they bring him back.

You sort of, yeah, that'll never happen.

And then, you know, you have the whole thing with Betty Acko and Alabama.

And you know, I mean, I got into a pretty good discussion with an athletic director this

week.

I said, look, I do not like the way Alabama went about that.

I don't think that was the way to do it, but if you take a step back and look at the arguments

and kind of divorce yourself from that and say, okay, what is it that we're really bothered

about?

There's other guys do it and we, now it hasn't happened in football, but we're probably

not that far from it, you know, unless they come up with a, with a real standard about

what eligibility is and now we're going to, how we're going to be able to enforce it.

I expect that, I expect that quick from the, I expect that quick from the NCAA, I'm

sure they're working on it.

Well, you're not even their fault, though, because they, they're own a billion in court

because even if they do something, they're going to get sued and lose.

So they've got to figure out a way to, you know, and some people think it's a narrow

ruling from Congress about, you know, what it might be, others, you know, I, I'm in the

collective bargaining camp, but I fully realize the problems with that.

There are a million deeper level problems with it, but the first problem is who bargains

with whom?

You know, it isn't going to be the NCAA, it's college football playoff committees that

are new enterprise and who in the world reps the plays.

You know, so it's real easy to say, well, you should bargain this out.

Who?

You know, so there are a lot of problems with it, but I think the most pressing one is determining

eligibility standards so that at least that part of it is, you know, is level and, and

reasonable.

You know, Bill has had a great line about the Mediaco thing, is it?

You know, everybody said, well, this is the line for the NCAA.

Well, why would you, why would you worry about crossing a line that's so blurry?

You know, that line's been so blurred there about, you know, what constitutes, you know,

a guy who's eligible to play.

It's, it's a really interesting time and I think that's the most pressing issue for college

sports.

Admittedly less pressing for football than the other ones, but I mean, think about, think

about baseball.

Let's say you had a guy who went straight out of high school to the minors and it's not

really working out.

He's in AA and all of a sudden, Florida needs an arm and they need a bat in the middle

of the lineup, breaking back from AA.

I mean, you don't want that.

That's not what we should be doing.

So in order to do, in order to figure it out, you've got to, it, well, I mean, phrase it

two ways.

It's either not what we should be doing or we should just embrace it and say, this is

just another pro league.

And if a guy's played, you know, five years in the NBA and he's not working out and he

comes back, we're just another pro league.

Let him play, you know, I think we have to make the determination of what we want this

to be.

You know, it's amazing.

Chris Winky did that 20 years ago.

Yeah, like went and played baseball, came back, played, played football and he was, he's,

he's 28 years old in football, right?

And he won the Husband that year.

Yes.

I mean, so, I mean, so we've kind of seen it, but it's, it is like the linebacker, you,

you know, the guy from Montana who got his ninth year, you know, they used to call you a

doctor.

Now they just call you a linebacker, I guess.

He just got so long enough, I guess you can just be, be a linebacker.

It's great.

Um, but yeah, you're right though.

I mean, it's just so the NCAA, I mean, that's why Joey Aguilar.

I'm like, Tennessee fans are upset.

I'm like, just keep suing.

Trinidad lost the first three.

He lost the first three suits and then, and then he got, he got it.

So just, just keep peppered them.

They got to pay for it.

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It's really funny because what I want is for all of that all of the stuff to matter

You know a finite period of time

But when I take a step back from it and I ask myself why do I want it to matter?

It's usually just because that's how it's always been and there's a feeling of nostalgia to it

And then you have to ask yourself well, is that the right thing?

Is this nostalgia a good thing for the enterprise? Is it a good thing for the players?

Is it a good thing for the sport in general or has this now just become another professional enterprise?

Is there something that differentiates it from the you know from pure professional enterprises

Meaning only pro sports leagues with no other components you know and people say academics but I mean

Academics are important but sports and academics are not mutually exclusive you can do both

So you know and one doesn't I'm not sure why we've decided that one has to be tied to the other

Well, that's always the case. All right real quick. We'll just do some rapid fire stuff

Texas Texas one of your top contenders to win an national championship next year good need to see the offensive line

So if the offensive line's got to be a lot better and I could say that a lot of places

The the will must-champ hire I like for that component like I like the fact that he's got some mother blank you in him like

And you know the Sark Sark's Cali you know like I think that's such a good like marriage together

And you know like Sark's gonna let him run it like he's gonna let him run it. He's gonna let him do his thing

So I think it'll be it'll be fun to watch does does Lane do we get do we get happy lane?

Do we do we get?

Contankerous lane like what lane are we getting at LSU this season?

This season and maybe this season we get happy lane. Well, I think we'll get happy lane this season.

Now does that mean championship lane? I don't know, but we'll get happy lane. They'll be good and I think Levitt will work out well for him.

Yeah, what about Ohio State like we're gonna see so many of those folks drafted and they rebuilt it all last year

Like you think they're gonna rebuild it again and be right back where they were you betting on that?

I don't know if I'm betting on them being right back where they were but I wouldn't bet against them. That's hedging my bet.

I would say because I mean they've certainly proven they can stockpile talent and they can produce

But those they lost so many leaders from the championship team and then they they're losing a ton of guys

Next year, but they have still the most dynamic playmaker in the sport

So you know, I figure I figured they'll be right back right back in the mix. I'd be very surprised not to see them in the in the big ten championship game

And in the playoffs

Jalja ain't want to play off game in a couple years. They're they're just been kind of they've been really good winning the SEC

But what about what about it? Poor Georgia Bulldogs, man. They can be back in there a lot.

I just hope they can find a way to scratch out a first down those poor old boy.

I mean they were really young. They were really young last year in a lot of spots, right?

I mean it's fair. It's really young.

So first time I've ever gone into a season with Kirby and I'm gone

Who's the ballers?

Like who's going to be the All-American?

Because usually you got okay, we got three or you got three or four that are first round picks and that last year you were like

I don't know who those guys are

Well, let's let's look at if they you know what they got caught up in a buzz saw you know in the playoffs

They win that game. I think they go to the national championship game

You know, I think they they would have won the next one. So I don't think they're that far off

Georgia's going to be right in it. I think Georgia's one of the favorites to win the national championship last year or next year I should say

Yeah

Is Indiana going to sustain their success? Will they be will they be right there again in the mix or are they going to fall off a little bit?

I mean they're going to have to fall off a little bit because they were darn near perfect this year

But I think they're here technically they were perfect.

Yeah, they are they are here to stay I think now at that level probably not you got to hit on the quarterback again

And they've got a great track record of doing that and I think Josh Hoover is really

Is really talented and is the right kind of guy to fit well and into that system and be developed by those guys

I might shan't hand in a tino sincerey back with them again

So you know, I think that I think they will continue to be a force in the big 10 will there be as good as last year

I think one of the things to look at David they've done a great job in the portals

Signeties a tremendous talent evaluator

But he also for the first two years has had a core of guys who have been with him for a really long time

And now those guys are gone and incorporating new guys as a challenge no matter how good you are

So I think they'll be they'll be in the mix they'll be in the fight

But I be hard to be as good as they were this year

And we're deep in the weeds here. This is the last one though

Like who could be next year's Indiana is there a team that you're thinking about like

That could come off the right I have one that will come I think that's going to come off the radar and be very competitive and very good

I mean, it's saying they're going to be Indiana is is not fair to say for anybody but

I have one big I've won the big 12 I really really like

The column is look on the state you know I go on the state yeah

I just think bring in the whole system they brought the whole system

They brought they brought the best with them and Eric Morris obviously can coach

I really like him and and by the way like just his quarterback play that he's been around is like stupid

It's silly and we could go my homes may feel we can keep going back the tree he comes from like

Kingsbury and Holgerson and leech like he is he had all these guys on one staff

Lincoln Riley rough and McNeill like he's been around so many great minds

Then you bring in 80 of those guys with you oh by the way messed to maker who was the nation's leading quarterback

Like the nation's leading Russia for touchdowns a stud at receiver and why like I think they got a chance to

I think the pokes got a chance to come in and at least pokes some people like at least get some get some big fish

I think that's a good call it's a really really good call because they'll be able to catch some people unaware at different times

So I think that's a really really good prediction

Well I know you're in the the basketball mindset so who wins who wins the NCAA tournament

You're gonna think I'm crazy I already do now that's true

You know what I'm gonna I was about to say Florida but I think I just can't quite do it because it's hard to go back to back

So I'm I'm gonna say Duke I'm I was really I was at the game where they played Michigan

And I've been on the Michigan train for pretty much a whole season and I was really really impressed with what the way what they were able to do against them defensively

That's a really good defensive team and they've got a lot of a lot of parts they've got a difference maker and boozer

I'm gonna say Duke but it's not gonna surprise me if Florida wins it again because they are they are hot at the right time and they're really good

And they're really big big they're huge up front some games some grown ace men

Yep

All right well appreciate your time big homie

Hi ma'am

To re-talk about Lou Holtz the great Lou Holtz

I know he's smiling about that and those stories and all the other love he's getting across the nation

I know he loves but thank you so much for your time big homie and we will write down Florida and Duke

We'll put that we'll put that in the two brackets because you're allowed to fill out more than one anyway

See you brother

See you man

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