Ron Simmons talks making history, The APA with Austin

Recently, our company's softball team lost the big game by one run, then Dale tried to

console us with the quote, winning isn't everything.

Dale's a loser.

I played a win, like early payout from Beth365.

If my team goes up big, I could pay it out instantly, even if they blow the lead later.

Sounds familiar, Dale?

Beth365.

Winning is everything.

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life, in app-only.

Our yoga instructor challenged us to find inner peace.

I found it faster than anyone.

After four seconds, I stood up and screamed, I found her, Fauna, I win!

They asked me to leave.

I guess they don't respect winning.

Beth365 does, though.

New customers get $365 in bonus bets just for betting $10.

Now I must stay losers.

Beth365.

Winning is everything.

Gamely Problem Call 1-800-Gambleer 21-plus-only must be physically located in Virginia.

TNC's apply.

In app-only.

Recently, our company softball team lost the big game by one run.

Then Dale tried to console us with the quote, winning isn't everything.

Dale's a loser.

I played a win.

Like early payout from Beth365.

If my team goes up big, I could pay it out instantly, even if they blow the lead later.

Sounds familiar, Dale?

Beth365.

Winning is everything.

Gamely Problem Call 1-800-Gambleer 21-plus-only must be physically located in Virginia.

TNC's apply.

In app-only.

Hey, I'm Stone Cold Steve Austin.

Welcome to The Broken Skull Sessions.

My guest today is a man who is universally respected by all of his peers, whether it comes

from the world of football or sports entertainment.

A leader among men and a WWE Hall of Famer.

My guest.

Damn.

Ron Simmons.

Ron.

How are you?

Good to see you, Ho-Pam.

It's been a minute.

Yes, sir.

Yes, ma'am.

Good to see you.

How you been holding up?

Hey, man.

You know it.

Look.

From all the, you know, I got to tell you, from all the, particularly with the football

and the wrestling.

Hey, I'm thinking my luck is starting to blow them up right.

So, you know what?

Everything's good.

Was it all worth it?

Every bit of it, bro.

Every bit of it.

You know?

And I'd be honest with you at this point.

You know what?

You know what?

You know what?

You know what?

You know what?

You know, and I'd be honest with you at this point in my life, right?

I'd do it the same way.

I've been wanting to have you on the show for a long time.

We finally got you here.

So, I appreciate coming out here.

You know what?

And they said it for you.

I'll do it.

Well, but last time I saw you, and I let you tell a story.

If you remember, it was down there in Tampa at the Royal Union.

I was down there at the bar with some of the guys.

I was going to go to my room and get something.

Yeah, man.

I remember the last thing on my mind was seeing you.

And then, and particularly, being surprised at where I was when the elevator door was open.

Listen, man.

It was absolutely...

I can't tell you, man.

It was just a real joy to see you.

You know?

The funny thing, if we go way back to our days in Atlanta.

But I was in there on the elevator.

You were standing on that floor.

And I was sitting in the doors open.

And me and Ron noticed it for a long time.

He was standing there looking at me.

And I'm looking at him.

Finally, we both just started laughing.

Oh, okay.

And now if we start to hug him, I need some of the babies.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And how could you just like hug it a day for the refrigerator?

Listen, you know?

But it was...

It was shinning you one feeling.

Yeah.

Genuine feeling.

You know?

That I have for you, you know?

For real.

You know, I got a chance to, you know, start researching you and you ready to do the show.

I always knew what a football star you were, but I never knew much about your past.

I didn't know how you grew up.

Right.

So when I was watching Legends with JBL, I realized that you had a tough childhood coming up.

Bro, listen, see.

You know, I've taken pride in everything I've done.

I've never, you know, been a cryer and bitchy, you know, about things of this nature below.

The hand that was dealt me as a child wasn't the perfect one by no means.

I was disclosed.

My siblings and I are from being placed in an orphanage, okay?

Mother died when I was eight.

Dad had left us.

And I remember when he took the right turn, the day he left, okay?

And didn't see him for another 12 years.

Move them, my grandmother.

She passed away a few years later.

So, you know, all those things that life and throughout you, I've been through it.

So there's nothing no one can tell me about the ups and downs of life.

I've seen it from, been through it.

So how did that change you when you realized that your father wasn't coming back?

And you got to proceed on with life and make a lot of decisions for you.

It includes you are very fast.

Believe me, okay?

You get another perception of people in general, okay?

Your ideas of how life is supposed to go change dramatically, all right?

But look, as I'm going on, man, you know, bouncing from home to home,

finally I settled with my cousin, all right?

And thank God for him and my mother's sisters in order to keep us out of an orphanage, all right?

She came down from Detroit, picked up my younger siblings and them and my older brother and I stayed behind

because at this point now, I'm 13, 14 years of age.

So now the coaches have seen something in me that they came to my uncle and said,

hey, look, maybe it's any way possible we can keep him here because we see something in this kid

that in the future could pay off for him.

And that's how I manage to stay behind and not go to Detroit.

And luckily, thank God for the coaches.

Our yoga instructor challenged us to find inner peace.

I found it faster than anyone.

After four seconds, I stood up and screamed.

I found her, Fauna, I win!

They asked me to leave.

I guess they don't respect winning.

Bet 365 does, though.

New customers get $365 in bonus bets just for betting $10.

Now I must stay losers.

Bet 365.

Winning is everything.

A gambling problem called 1-800 gambler.

21 plus only must be physically located in Virginia.

TNC's apply.

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Let's go places.

Junior high and seeing this.

It was a football you specialized in where you all shot a track star as well.

Right.

I was a shopper and track state champion in discus.

Right?

What was your best throw in high school with a discus?

I was at a state record there.

I think, of course, you had a good time.

Right.

You.

I threw the discus too.

And I know you were there.

You were there.

Yeah.

But at that time, I believe it was like wanting something of something, you know, right?

You do 180 and die.

I quit.

That's awesome.

Is football an outlet for you to channel some of the anger?

Or are you just a super alpha guy that happened to love football?

Or was it a combination?

You know what, man?

That's a good question because a lot of it,

I have to say, it was a combination.

Okay.

But this is how it went for me.

The way the pros and cons are what I was best at.

And it turns out that I'm better at football because of the prowls of the game, physicality of the game,

the strength, you know, everything that went into that.

And, you know, that's what I concentrated on the most.

You know, that's why I thought that this is worse than anything that's going to get me out of this situation

that I'm in.

It's going to be football.

Yeah, I didn't mind.

I'd be throwing the discus.

Oh, yeah.

Right.

You know, going back to your strengths as a football player, one of the things that stands out to me

when I was watching old footage of you just in the wrestling ring was just this explosive quickness

and acceleration.

It's almost like no other that I've seen inside the ring.

And also, when you're whipping a guy from Turnbuckle to Turnbuckle or into the ropes,

when you send the guy in, he goes.

Well, I think that came from the train from football.

And particularly, you know, the explosiveness, you know, because at the position that I am in,

absolutely essential, as a knows factor, to get off the ball, you know,

to get your hands on him and an explosive factor to try to get control.

So, I'm sure that's where a lot of that came from.

You've told this door me in times, but let's just gloss over it so we can get into it.

You're right in the middle of Georgia.

Want to ride into high school.

You're all state players.

I guess you guys are the national champions.

Right.

You're trying to recruit you.

Everybody assumes because you're a Georgia guy that you're going to go down and be a bulldog

and Bobby Bowden comes down and wins you over.

How did he win you over to leave Georgia to go down the floor to stay?

People really don't understand the gravity of looking.

You're going up in middle Georgia, South Georgia, right?

Bulldog nation is real.

You understand me, particularly if you're high profile high school athlete coming out.

You are automatically projected, right?

That you are going to go to Georgia.

It's together, right?

Yes.

I worked at a battery shop with a very, very great guy by the name of Bill Franklin, right?

There are absolute luck for me as a kid.

And he had played for Bobby Bowden.

Yeah.

And the only thing he asked of me was that I just give floor to state.

Leave one visit open for them, right?

Yeah.

And I owe them that, man.

You know what?

Absolutely.

I'll be more than happy.

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Let's go places.

Do that.

And I'm going to be absolutely honest with you.

I had no idea what Florida State University was.

As well as most of the people, you know, because it wasn't on the radar when it came to football.

Right.

And I'd gone through all of the stages of going through all those recruiting.

And most of the ones I went on, you know, they were saying things like great football player, you know,

they've been used to freshman coming in, sitting behind someone, learning the process to ropes, you know,

and red shirt and perhaps, you know, this is foreign language to me, you know.

Yeah, because you're a starter.

You don't want to play.

Yeah.

Red shirt for those who don't know is you're on a roster, but you're taking a year.

You're basically.

Yes.

You later.

You want to sit on the bench.

Yeah.

Okay.

And probably not even dressed.

Yeah.

Okay.

And listen, man, I'm going up a national championship team.

I'm national lineman of the year.

I'm a customer play.

It comes about about, right?

Second year at the university.

Okay.

And he's soon straight with me saying, listen, I don't have anything over here.

You know, I'm sure you've heard it all.

I've actually been offered some monies and things of this niche.

And he was telling the truth.

Yeah.

Okay, he was.

So he says, oh, look, I can tell you this, if you come there, right?

And there's someone where we feel that we can use you that's in front of you.

And if you beat them out, I will start you.

Not just because the guy is a senior.

He's going to stay there and just offer senior ranks, he will play.

better athlete than him. I'll start you as a freshman. You can't ask for any more than that.

Only thing I wanted, man, was a chance. That was it, okay? And from that moment on, hey,

that was so. You got to tell me, because I can't find any pictures. I've heard you tell a story a

little bit, but the trans am, yeah, will your picture paint it on the hood? Look, when I figured,

hey, it was my junior year, right? Yeah, all the men, right? And since this is all American now,

all right? Had a nice looking girlfriend at the time, right? That's what, you know what?

How about if I remove the bird and paint myself on the hood, you know, fighting off demons?

Which didn't go over too well because the guys were seeing me coming through the campus, you know?

And I'm a big time football star, and that's all, you know, all the girls want to take a ride.

I always tell everybody together, you understand? Ron Simmons is a god at Florida State.

And there's still shot number 50. And then this is the number that they would retire,

the first defensive number that Florida State would retire. And that's a, and I'm glad you

choose that shot because that's a data that I'm on top of, right? Thank you. When you look back,

I mean, you were two time consensus on America, but basically a four time on America through

freshman and sophomore pickings, back-to-back Orange Bulls, a Tangerine Bull. You're

ninth in the highest-man trophy awards when Charles Whitewater, you go into the College Football

Hall of Fame, the Florida State University Hall of Fame. How would you bottom line your collegiate

career? Absolutely. Brother overachieved from whatever, ever imagined. I am extremely proud

of what I have accomplished, okay? Coming from what I did, Steve, and I know the work

that I put in, man. Hear me? When there was no cameras, nobody around. Jumping fences,

bro, to sneak into weight room, dragging home, cement blocks that the construction

sites to use for weights at home. I'm ecstatic about the way things went for me as

forwards when it comes to what I have accomplished and football and wrestling. To me, brother, look,

I have done it all. It's an accomplishment for me, you know? I did think you were going to say,

damn! Hey, so you end up getting drafted, but by then the guys have been chopping you,

blocking your ankles or giving you problems. Well, in your season. So the pros, you know,

asked it for what they were, but you pretty much had your gut full of football. Oh, yeah,

you're missing, man. I'm out of position, okay? First of all, all right? I'm a true blind,

backer. I'm undersized as a nose. Six, one, and two, fifty at the most. And that's working hard.

Now, I don't see when I went to Cleveland, you know? All the guys there, when you get to

fill in, fill in that professional level, everybody is great. Everybody is a superstar.

I was satisfied with what I had done in college, bro. The football thing was winding down for me.

You know, I'd had enough of it, brother. I'd been double triple acts when all of that was legal.

Yeah. Well blocked by the tight ends, you know what I'm saying? So it was okay. You're about to

get into the business of professional wrestling, but you were basically recruited by hero Matsuda.

Right. If I'm not mistaken, because he saw you or heard of you and said, hey, man, this guy

could probably be something. You watched professional wrestling, but you weren't pursuing it.

Right. Tell me about this chance meeting with hero Matsuda. Well, man, you're being in South

Georgia, South Texas. You got to be arrested. You know, we're already a big fan of it,

and that came through from the little time that I spent with my grandmother. She was a big fan

of professional wrestling, man. And her favorite was Bob Armstrong, you know. He came on the

term, Sheila. Don't say anything, you know, right? And she just loved Bob Armstrong, you know,

and through that process, I fell in love with it. And so as that went on and then fast forward

to this, after I played the three years, you know, in the USFL, and Lex and I were on the same team

together, he had started history and he was like a year in. So at that time, when it comes to

blacks in this business, nearly none. All right. So hero Matsuda, being a liberal-minded man,

that he is, hey, wanted to find some black athletes that he talked to cut it. And when I say

cut it, I mean, I know I mean cut it. Yeah. See, okay. And I'm thankful for my good friend,

Lucas. So he suggested, you know, to hero, and he gave me a call and said, hey, look, I'm doing

this thing and it's going well. I said, man, I've been checking you out. It's going well for you.

Say, look, reason I'm going to Mr. Matsuda would like to see you, you know, and I said,

start the phone call with you. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Set up the meeting with hero. Right.

So he says, look, how would you like to start me training you? And if the thing goes well for you,

you know, we could go from there. And I'm thinking, you know, in my mind, I'm a football player.

Sure, this speaks to Kate. Yeah. Yeah. No big deal. Yeah. Because I wrong. Okay. I couldn't have

been more wrong about what I said. Steve. Then when I first started two of the days in football.

Right. So this thing I had to go through. How long was your training camp? How long did you

train with a hero before when you started and left training camp and had your first match?

Right. Because you were well school. Yes. From the time that he took me in. And that hot

barn-like building with no windows and no ventilation. Okay. It was three months before I even got

in the ring. It was conditioning. Yes. Just that alone. Steve, before I even got into it.

All right. Now, I'm like, I'm sitting here and telling a lie and said, hey, it didn't end

in my mind. Be like, no, what the hell is this? You know, you know, I'm going to talk to you.

Okay. I brought myself on hanging in there with it. But hey, you know, I'm better might give

this thing a second. A second thought, you know. But something in me when I started something,

I want to see it through, you know what I'm saying? And the guys that were surrounding it was three

or four at that time, right? You know, they dropping like flies, you know? And particularly when

he introduced the boards, I mean, started doing this thing with it. So y'all in three months

of condition. I'm going to roll some footage here in just a second. But so you three months

conditioning and then you get into the ring. So how long were you in the ring before you would

have your first match? Because we're three months in now. Probably we would spin at maybe a month

hitting the ropes. Just hitting ropes. Yeah. So your mechanics, that's why they were so sound.

You understand me? Because he was a stickler for, hey, first of all, one to note. All right. If you

were going to get in this thing and they could rely on you to be there and yet more importantly, Steve,

taking somebody else's body and life. And be safe with it. Yes. Okay. If hero taught you all

the things that he did, where did the vicious right hand come? Because I'm watching footage and

you've always had a great right right hand. And but it's a working punch. Was he the one? Because

you got a good working punch. You don't listen, brother. You had the board that he would stand up.

Yeah. Okay. He had something that he had put in up there that you had to tap. He had to know

that you came this close to hitting it because the board was right behind it. And that's mine or

your face. Okay. So the realism of looking that real. That's where that came from. That's a great

story. Roll some footage because I want to go back this training camp. Doing Forte on the left.

I believe in Ron Simmons on the right with this. And so like this is just drill. And there's that

building you're talking about. It's just ain't no where it can be. It's not the pain of misses inside.

This they're going for it out. Okay. And this was conditioning. And then you guys drop like flies,

but he's not doing this to run out. No. But he's going to say, hey, do you have what it takes?

You hear me? Right. That's another great exercise that you just come off the street and tell

someone to start doing these. No, man. That's it. That's it. That's it. But the grind here, man.

There's he running the back in there. Yeah. Good man. Was he? Good man. Yeah. Now we've got chance to

hit me. Good man, Steve. I like a Hindu push up. Yeah. And that's tough. And you're on your finger.

Okay. See that's the way he wanted it done. Yeah. Big man here. He's on his palm. He's doing it.

I wanted to think of this to have a drill here. Yeah. And so it's like, you know, when I watch you,

you know, with as much muscles as you can, you didn't blow up. Yeah. I mean, because you were in shape,

you know, and all of it goes back to him. It was not only conditioning for the body,

but it was a thing where he was conditioning your mind too, man. Not only to rely on you in the ring,

but a conditioning for you brother to show up for your shots. Right. You know what I mean? Yeah.

It'd be reliable. So I couldn't have come on the better tutors. I agree. Nick Bridges were

actually bad for you. But everybody did him. You know, amateur wrestlers did him. Now with the

dude on top, dude is a brutality. Right. Okay. And a hot ass building. And here's a day they

weren't paying you to come. No, everything. No, no, no, no, no, no, no payment on the job. Do you

remember what you had to pay the rest in school? He, bro, when I got in with

hero Matzuda, it was humbling. He didn't. Look, this was so brutal. He trained me for free.

I can't you charge a man for that. Is that board? Here we go.

I'd like to sit here and tell you that, you know what? I didn't flinch a little bit. How can

you're not tough process, but they wouldn't have did it any other way, man. So you get out on the

road. What was your adaptation process to live in life on the road, doing work in a squared

circle and making round. But look, it couldn't have been a better environment for me, you know,

because look, I have had the opportunity to come along with the best guys this business will

ever see. Yeah. Okay. I've got very wonderful there. And here I mean, you know, microtunder,

okay. On Anderson, these guys are coming through. I couldn't have been surrounded by better

guys, you know, that were willing to continue to help mean, you know, when they're on the road

in the training process, bro. So, hey, it was absolutely a benefit for me to be in with them,

okay. To adjust to the road, leaving home and having a little baby at this point, you know,

right. So things got tough. So did you say, hey, man, this is something I'm just going to keep

doing. I can make 11 doing this. At that point, right. Okay. Now at that point, you know, I'm with

a lot of, we're not, we're on the road with traveling, you know, with bouncing a little bit,

right? She's not on board totally. Yeah. You understand me? You know, go things are tight.

You know, right? And she's like, hey, you know, we're going to have to think I'm, and I'm begging,

hey, just give me a little more time. Let's just see what this thing carries me. As a football player

and part of the team, and you were the epitome of team, you played in some of the biggest crowds

in college football. So now you're about to go into some crowds within some small buildings,

but people as being a very confident man and alpha. Did you ever get the jitters? Were you ever

nervous or did you just take to it like, no, absolutely got the jitters, you know, you didn't. Yeah,

you know, you know, you know, right, no, I'm not going to tell that like, oh, yeah, you know,

I'm saying right because I'm on an island now, you know, right, it's me. And not only that,

like we were talking, right? His well-being is in my hands and some, and mine is in here. Okay.

Wanted to do the right thing and put on a great show, you know? So yeah, man, yeah, I got the jitters

something. All right. I want to play some footage of not not your earliest days, but during your

days before you hit WCW, I believe. And it's going to be some on cocaine. It was going to be

Yoko Zuna. And man, he is moving well. Jump shit to begin of the match. Boom, headbutt.

Big right hand. Andrew man. Yeah, oh, he's awesome. Yeah, send you in. Yeah, for him. Kind of

a little bit of a close line. Go down. He's on you. Andrew, boom, boom, you got it. All the

smokes got to go headbutt because your head's supposed to be harder than everybody else's.

Stand on your feet, but you're selling big scoops. Slap easy. And I can't you not learn from

working with people. Oh, I don't know what I mean. Oh, right. Okay, here you come. Okay,

say I like how you're taking your time. And you're still pretty down here. Couple quick kicks.

But now that was Scooby Muff. Here you go. Boom. Big right hand. Big right hand. Send him in for

the ride. Jammy man. Boom. Elbow down he goes. What's your favorite behavior that took a lot more

pride? Yeah. Scoops slam. Oh, he posted the guy thing. He's talking about okay, coming

up with the football background show. We've been a great dad some, you know, they're trying to

put the football, you know, background in post-shop position. Wow. Statement win early in the game.

But you know what? Good. The work with guys like that in the beginning. Yeah, you know what I mean?

They want to go out there and do business and he was one of them. Yeah, you know, great bumpy tough

time, you know, and like you were speaking of like with the right hand. Here's the thing that

I always took pride in, Steve. Never wanted to hurt anyone, but I wanted my stuff to look as good

as it possibly could. Right. Okay. And sometimes if it got to be a step foot,

it's not injuring anybody that, you know, that happened. Yeah. You know, so you're making rounds

and then I'll sudden you end up down there and WCW. How did you end up WCW? Well,

coming along through there, right, and you know dusty. Yeah. It's always been a big guy for,

you know, when it comes to athletes in particular football. Yeah. You know, he's been a big fan of

that. So as things were going there, right, he kind of kind of weaned his way, weaned me in

to get in there and working, working my way in with WCW. All right. And kind of being at the point

taking me on his wing. All right. In my corner, working with me and giving me tutelish brother,

you understand? Right. Because here's the thing, you know, and I know a lot of people have gone

through and put the record one way or the other. You got great minds for this business. Even then,

you've got people in there that don't know rats ass about anything that have been in positions

of power. Okay. He was one that knew this business. All right. And he knowing that, hey, here's a guy

that's got that athletic ability. He's a black man on top of that. So let me just try to start

grooming this process to right to see if we can get more diversity in this. Okay. And that's what

he was doing. You know, somewhere as things go on. Right. It got reverted back to the same

most stereotypical stuff that WCW was accustomed to doing. All right. And the things got still made it

for me at that point. You know, rather than me, bowing into what they were doing, let me pack my

bags, brother, and take another avenue. And that's when I packed my stuff and was going back and

forth to Japan for a year and a half. Oh, I didn't know he's going back and forth to Japan for that

back. Yeah. Yeah. I thought back when we were, that was your first trip. No, no, no, man. The

sequence of how things went, brother, dusty roads had the right mind for this. All right.

Somewhere in there, man, within the higher up to knows better, decide to fire him. All right.

In comes bill. All right. Now, just as like you and I were talking about guys and athletic,

you know, abilities and having gone through that mindset. So bill watch comes in with a head coaching

attitude. You understand? Right. That was him. All right. If you're not getting it done, he would

come in and he could be overbearing. You know, hey, what the hell are you doing? All right. That's

not what we're talking about. Get out there and do it right. Some people couldn't take it. You

know, because he was giving constructive criticism to me. It wasn't. I'm used to it. Yeah.

I've been being coached all my life. Okay. Because that was the process. All right. And he had started

something also with it kept it going with myself that dusty as started. And he felt the pressures

coming on with him. Right. That his days were being numb. So when he at this point, he said, look,

let me just go ahead and do what I think I need to do. That's when this thing came about when we got

the Baltimore. Let me just make his ass to champion. Right. Before his days were numb. Okay.

But before you would be the champion, you know, you're doing good on the same. And they see

potentially, I mean, you're having matches with saying you were working a lot of great guys. But

who decided at some point to put you and hacksaw butchery together and form doom? Yeah.

I think that came in, you know, somewhat, you know, and it's several people came in with that.

You got born it. You got Jim heard working in there. You just then you really don't know only

thing that we know is this. We show up there and they're telling us, Hey, this is how this is

going to go. We're just going to put you two together. We think you're all a work well together.

You know, we want to see what a black tag team would do. So what did you think about that? Guys,

when I got paired with flying Brian, you know, I wouldn't have you about it because I was a

singles wrestler. So y'all would become a hell of a tag team in a very intimidating tag team.

But were you happy about that or were you good on the single side? No, no, man. I was just

happy about it, you know, because listen, okay, here's another thing, you know, new to the tag team

thing. All right, this is a learning process for me still, you know. So yeah, and it's

butchery, you know, butchers been accomplished, you know, and yeah, but now I got to be honest with

you know, he wasn't on board with it to start out. Yeah, right. Because he's still saying,

you know, he is a guy that's still yet, and his eyes still green, you know, new to the tag team

thing, right? Right. So you know, hey, as things go on, I'm still got to win his favor, you know,

I'm saying in that, hey, you know, I can carry my weight. Yeah. And God rest his old butchery bass

a little bit back. So woman is with you guys for a little bit. And then of course, Teddy Long would

come on then to get shot, get shot. So what happened to woman and who decided, hey, let's, let's go

with Teddy, you know what, it's still in this thing though, you still got to think about this,

all right. So here along myself, I have been talking, you know, all throughout my singles,

you know, career up to this point, all right. Everybody on the planet, no, no, who the hell are we

kidding here? This is Ron Somersen, this is Bush, you know what I'm saying. Right. So you know,

look, butchery and I talked about that also, you know, so there at one point, you know, he didn't

want to do this and put the mask on, right. So myself, hey, young still ain't got this voice to

just walking in and say something, you know, out of, you know, out of the way and out of character,

right. So I'm like, hey, only thing that we can do, bro, is get out there and push it and make it work,

you know, right. And that's exactly what we did. Yeah. Let's just put the realism in it.

Made it a physical style. Yeah. Yeah. You know, okay. So man, I got to ask you, because I mean,

I'm watching somebody's match with the standards. I'm at the physical. And there was some mutual

respect between all you guys, because you knew where they come from. They knew where you guys

come from. And it was just four tough ass guys just thrown down. But when you watch some of those

matches, I mean, they're some of the most physical and professional wrestling and stuff that I like

to see. And I like to watch the thing with that, you know, look, from first onset of me meeting,

and I'm speaking for myself, all right. Meeting Rick and Scotty brother, it was a mutual

thing to where we both had admiration for each other. Yeah. Because we'd go through the process

of being an organized, you know, and saying me, sporting, that's okay. And combative sporting event.

No one would have takes, you know, the line up in front of another man. Hey, if you get chance,

get going. He could kill us. So it was a mutual respect that we had for each other right off the

back. And when we work with each other, we understood, hey, it was nothing of crime with each other.

Let's just do this thing and make it look damn good, you know. I thought there was an interesting

transition from you guys working with the standards, road warriors. Yeah. I thought the standard

matches were way more physical. But then to build a dollar back and when working with one of

the greatest taxis of all time, Rock and Roll Express, you guys are right. We're a little half

your size. Yeah. To let them, you know, do, you know, break the works, you know, wreck the work,

but, you know, because Rick is this guy, you know, he's, they're off. But to be able to work with

both types, any kind of tag team and get people over and get yourself over and either win, lose

whatever it is, but have a hell of a sense. Right. But you know, we're working with all of men

with the road warriors and speaking of Rock and Roll Express, absolutely joy to work with.

I ain't got to tell you, man, you know what? And they, they don't know when they, but you're not

coming out being physical, never, never complaining about anything, you know. No one that we were

going to take care of them in the process of doing this. Yeah. You know, great to work with.

With, okay, hacksaw butchery was a little bit your senior, right? Okay. Ted along. Yeah.

So who are you getting your learnings from? Because you're schooled. That's a great shot. Right.

Both coming from my hero, my pseudo, such as a very smart guy. So like, like, when you ride

down the road and you're going to learn and treat all the veterans that took me under their wings,

like who's guys? And people don't understand us about it. He listened. He'd gone through all the

phases, you know, of this business you can do, right? Brother, he was pulling the ring, driving the

ring to the, to the events referee, you know. So he's been in other guys corner. He's seen a lot

of this business and butchered been around. So you know, from me within, you know, me being the

junior of both of them. Right. Hey, this was great knowledge for me. You understand? Right. You

know. So I'm still under the tree with both of them. I want to take you back to a match. Right.

I'm going to ride down memory lane. I match many of my consider when the grace of all time.

And it's a real barn burn between a young stunning Steve Austin and Ron Simmons for the

world television title. Everything is on the left. From Hollywood, California. Look at that name,

Ron. Look at that haircut. Look at the blue sky. He's coming. He's coming right there.

I'm glad I shaved my head. I never was stunning. You know what I mean? I had five decades.

All right. Here you are. Look like a man. Bucks. Those were long tights and I finally just cut them off.

I've been saying, maybe the way short. All right. Got a headlock.

Send you the ropes. What a big tackle.

Hey, go ahead and ropes. Oh, kicking the gut. Come back. Oh, man. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That's right. Right here.

My working punch wasn't here. Watch his three.

Watch it. Watch it. Watch it. I've one more drop down. I'll leave.

Oh, what the hell? No. Man, I don't know. You can drop it on top.

Right across my vocal cords. That's why my voice is ranting. This day,

you know, I'm begging off. I'm the heel. You're the baby. Paul Heyman said, oh, I'm shooting you

out with it. Using the trunks for leverage. Oh, you're not too happy about that.

Okay. I got you to compromise position here. Okay. You get that big right head. I've been

talking about right. So here's Paulie. Where were the cell phone? Got to have a weakness.

That's your main stuff. I'm working. I'm working here. Okay. Okay.

You've always taken your time. You've never been a guy to rush things. Yeah. You're not with

both from my dude, man. It can go wrong. Where? Oh, man. That was a blow. Try to use that head.

But there you go. Going back to the cell. You when you got a guy is big. Okay. Use the flipper.

Guys, big as you and you're willing to, you're willing to sell. Okay. I ain't got no choice but

to run that turnbuckle. Oh, cut your knee. Cut your knee. But I'm going back. You know what's up.

Go through it. Add power slam. Oh, wow. You got me. Okay. You've got me right where you want me.

Oh, kick out. Two and three quarters. Can't hold you. Oh, man. That was a bad punch. Okay.

Send you in for the ride reversal. Here I go. Oh, the clothesline. Come back. Oh, sidewalk slam.

Brought it from Florida. Yep. Okay. You've got me. You've got me.

One, two. Bobby. Here's Bobby. I don't have a jam. Oh, man. It's just throwing that

DQ, man. Yeah. So basically you should have wanted to. But we're going to a DQ mode. That was

a, that was funny. Do you remember a long time back in the day? We used to make it around. We

used to go to camp was you. Do you remember these six man? Yeah. Okay. It was me, Rick

Crude. There's a biscuit. Yep. Sting. Ricky Stimble. Absolutely. And you. Yes. And you remember,

you remember what happened? Yes, I do. Remember what that story. Right. Because, uh, well,

my point is right. Okay. We get through the match. And the match happens. And we go into the

dressing room like a room and all of a sudden, man, you went off. Yeah. And I was like, God,

thanks. I'm going to die tonight. What happened? Well, no. Hey, well, the match is going well.

Everybody's in a changing, right? Come in. And, right. And Rude had worked the program with Sting

and Stimble. So they all had their whistles going. Good. Yeah. We're doing the match. Well,

they, everybody's going in doing, exchanging, you know, ice box. Yeah. Everything.

All right. What's going with it? Place the jump. So I'm tagged in right here. I come in. I think

you're in with Larry. Yes. You're doing the scene, you know, go to lock up, you know, the

lot of gagging thing, right, pulling back. I'm not wanting to do anything right. You know,

you know, just standing there. But what happened was, you know, we started off and, you know,

Rude's in there, Sting, Stimble, everybody, being banged in the room, I come and do a couple of

hugs. And then it was like in a headlock headlock. And then right in the heat. And then we do go,

to go home. Right. And so you didn't get nice. Right. And man went back to that locker room. And

I heard this big boom and voice, which is you. And I always told, I told people, I said,

Ron Simmons can scare somebody just saying the ABCs. And it was a little bit more than ABCs

that you were presiding at that point. And you would basically, Hey, man, next time I said,

I'm gonna get my, right. I mean, listen, I really took everything I had. All right. For real.

I know. Okay. Not to let things get out of hand. Yeah. All right. Because that's not the way

you're supposed to do. It's all right. Right. Yeah. Long, long time to do it. Yeah. All right.

Yeah. So that's how that really went down and started. Oh, do you remember going over to Japan?

Yeah. We was over for three weeks. It was you, me, Arnanderson, D. Malinco, Eddie Guerrero.

And you had been over before, but I guess it had been a while. Right. Because that was like one of

my first tours over there. And we were state side guys. We went over three weeks, man. I was about to

go crazy. You was too. Yeah. And so was on. Yeah. So I remember on the third and now that tour,

I jumped off the top turnbuckle. The guy moved. I tore my right trives up off my arm.

So they had to put me a lot of tags and six man. So they modified the car. So we was in a lot of

six man's together as you, me and Arnand. And so, you know, I was doing work because I was busted.

I got a little bit, but I couldn't do much. But and that was back in the day when you tore your

trives up off your arm, you didn't go home. Yeah. And it's the story. The story goes back to you.

Me and Arnand on the corner on the apron. And you tag in. And you know, you hear stories about

Japanese strong styles. Sometimes I'll try to take advantage of somebody. But no one ever tried to

do that with Arn because you've been around. Maybe I guess I don't know. You certainly not. And you

go in there, you start whipping those guys around. Just boom. Power slam. Back drop. Close line.

And Arn looked over at me. And he always called me hog. Right there in front of that credit,

he goes, oh, I'm glad that's him or not. You know, you know, I'm on the right team. I don't

have to tell you, man, you know, coming when you're over here and you go there, brother, the game

has got to be stepped up. Okay. Because listen, you know, and that's just the way they work.

Yeah. You know what I'm saying? You know, and I've been coming back, you know, back and forth

over there. You know, so you know, yeah, you gotta, you gotta get with it, brother. You know,

we glossed upon this earlier about your World Championship match and the set up that Bill

once did. So we're gonna go to August 2nd, 1992. You're gonna become the first ever Black World

World Championship. And you didn't know this was gonna happen. No. So set this up and I want to

roll to the clip because it's a very, this is a very good match. It's a very physical match.

Absolutely. As you both like. Right. So give me the set up because you didn't know this was

like, okay, like why is it alluded to earlier? Okay. The highly events in my view went, you know,

from Whitvesti, grooming, okay, working with Luger, him being in my corner, right, to transition

to probably getting to that point, all right, before his time ran out and WCW. So after that,

then interject Bill Watts, right? Watts haven't seen this, right? No, and hey, all right, with him.

You know, he's a guy with a pedigree, right? And we want to integrate more Black men

and women into this business, right? But look, well, let's just get going with it, okay? So

him filling the pressures of this, right? Knowing that, hey, I'm gonna have to get this thing done

if I'm gonna do it. Now I had no idea of the timeframe that he was looking at. But you know, he had

talked with me all along, man. You know, hey, and he was calling, screaming at me, whatever it

day. You know, like I said, it wasn't no big deal with me. I could take it. Long as it wasn't

nothing overbearing, you know, a lot of times couldn't, you know? So he was very adamant about

that day, you know, for some reason, or everybody showing up, you know, we thought maybe it was just

being, you know, hey, you know, right? So at that day, you know, when I came in there, man,

no, I did this, it's gonna take place. No one did. Not even a guy, right? Right? So he kept

everything, you know, with no one knowing nothing at all. That wouldn't even care if hey,

man, that wouldn't even, because nobody knew, no one knew, all right? That's why I always say,

when I, when people ask me about, I refer to, it's a real moment because it was, you know,

in professional wrestling, right? So when he calls me, man, he said, hey, we're gonna, we're gonna

change history tonight. Okay, you guys get the decision. How is Vader upon him? God rest his soul.

How is he upon the decision? You know what, see, he, you know, and like you said, God rest some

brother, you know, I mean, at times, you know, and working with other guys, you know, hey,

some guys can say he could have been difficult, you know, to work with a good, he and I had

an understanding, okay? Right, all right? Now I'd work with him one, you know, a little

adding the change with him before, all right? Japan, you understand me, right? And back in,

and even back in the state, we had a mutual understanding, all right? Now he wasn't on board with this,

at that particular time, you know, for it to take place then, all right? But I got to give him this

though, brother, my head is all tuned. You went out there and did a great job, okay? Fantastic job,

all right? He did business. Let's go play some footage from this match and man, we're

gonna see all of these exchanges, but man, those, those bear paws in the corner and you're bringing

them to, but I mean, man, those things were snowing.

Every time I look at it, man, it's the same thing. Okay. He's a big, he's a big strong big guy.

Only I would get through, you know, boom, big right hand right on chin.

Okay, here we go. That's what he's famous for. Yeah,

bones, those shots in the corner. There's a lot of people didn't want to take

them, okay? If I house fire, he can back with big right hand ears. And he's going to go down for you,

man, beam down, boom, smash him, man, you know what? Boom, okay, he's, okay, I've had enough,

a bigger fire, look at the crowd behind it. Okay, pulling them up. He's a big guy,

but you ain't got no problem with man, man. Good right now. Almost invaded the Superman punch.

Boom, big clothesline. All right, fired up, crowds with your 100%. How old are you here, Ron?

I'm maybe about 30. Oh God, yeah, baby. Okay. He's got you a little bit in the

world of hurt. You're selling here. He's enjoying working with him. Yeah, worked the way I like

the world. Yep. Heavy impact on that. Watch this. Oh, well, yeah, yeah, that's good. No,

they didn't complain. No, man, let's, a lot of people are trying to injure you, Steve,

or intentionally, Jay. It's okay. Yeah, you know, yeah, I'm taking this time. I'm going back

on the second. Comes up. I love working. A little bit of it. Makes flash coming here. Boy,

you're trying to get out of the way, but you just can't do it. You just can't. I try.

Big kick out. I'm going to take that referee. Okay, here is about to send you for the ride.

Out of corner. Here he comes, charge. Oh, miss. Surprise here. Here it is. One, oh, kicks out.

It's ropes, sunset, flippant. How is this? Do you have that? It meant the thing in

this that I think I want to point out to this, right? At the finish of this thing, the thing that's

so surprising at this time, not only just once, you know, the few black people that are in the audience,

watch everything. Here it is. Okay, watch everything. Okay, just watch everything. Holy

little rotation there. Power slam. Look at that. Everybody's going to pop.

Listen, the impact is the circle, you know, right? Hit up there. Okay.

That's as big a pop as I've ever heard, especially the size of this building. Everybody came.

Absolutely great moment. Okay. Introduce Dave. Well, I'm receiving letters in the mail and

these are these are me and with kids now of how that impact their lives.

Perfect. Well, then great dude. Dustin Ray. Great guy.

So you stay chained into high school and everything you've done is a couple of national championships.

Okay, you win a little championship and miss the program. Super important to you.

Life change of you. Yes. Absolutely. And for many to follow. You know what? He's like a

like we've said, man. And I said, hey, I'm absolutely satisfied with what I've done with my life.

You understand me? There's nothing that I'm at this point I'm desiring to do. You know, I've done

things. I've had success in most of everything. I've tried Steve and set out to do. Okay.

I've no the work I put in to do it, right? And when this happened, right? When I'm more proud of

it's the way it impacted people lives. Okay. First, because I'm a black man and it opened doors

for other blacks to come into the business and not be afraid to try it. Okay. Then secondly,

it was people of all colors, you know, that still right me, man. Like I said, to this day, man,

to tell me how much debt changed their lives. Okay. You can't ask anything better than that.

You know, I used to when I used to apply cash people say, hey, Steve, how come you don't see

more black people in professional wrestling? I couldn't answer because I just figured I wanted

like me being an athlete. I always wanted to be one. Why do you think more black people didn't get

in the business? Well, when they were looking at it from the television standpoint, okay? They

wasn't doing it. Black people, you know, and when they did, you know, they would be them.

Being the crap out of them, and they was in some other sub-subburet rule of any kind, you know,

still with the stereotypical stuff, you know, hard to do to feather hanging the things of this nature,

right? So that's a deterrent that turned people off with, okay? Then if they're seeing mostly white

guys out there all the time, there's nothing to cheer for. You know, they want to cheer things of it

all along, okay? But see, that's one of the things that I'm more proud of, the route that I took

in order to do the things that I've done in this business. I'm going to tell you what times, man,

that day, I can tell you, okay, things were rough, all right? Very rough, all right? And it wasn't

due to my work or anything in the ring, it had to do with my race, okay? It got like that,

but I'm glad I took the route I did, because I knew had it been some other route that I wanted to do,

it was going to be a standard that was going to be placed on me, and it was going to be a stigma

for others to come after me. Just you broke the ground for a lot of people. You still had

to have any WWE superstars who could come up to you and say thank you or ask me, I said, hey,

you were a guy who inspired me. Yeah, man, listen, all of them have been great, all right? And

Mark DeLoe, Rocky came through the nation, found his identity through that, okay? When they

couldn't find something for him to do, all right? And get him something and put a character on him.

He did his homework when he came through the nation, man, and formed his own.

And that's why he formed his own character the way he is now.

How'd you end up in WWE? Right. Well, tell me about the phone call, because so it's phone call.

Like I said, right, I've gone through, right? I've gone through the transitional period, man.

Well, look, I just spoke, right? It was all of a sudden, I can go from being world champion,

right, world tag team champion, right? To now, hey, you're going to tell me I'm among one or

five guys, black guys in the company, right? And then the success I've already had, there's nothing

now of a sudden that I can't do. This has to do with, in my opinion, the people that they had put

into those positions now, booking and power that had no idea what they were doing, no idea what

the business was like, planning to all the backstage entries, right? So other than me,

give in to that crap, all right? I took the route out like I did going back and forth to Japan.

Now here, two of them, my favorite guys on this planet are Bruce Richard and Michael Haye.

Clearly, I'm sure seeing what the hell is taking place down here, you know, in WCW at that time,

right? Getting their call. And at this time, there's no more contractual obligation with Japan,

so I can get, yes, set up a meeting with myself and Vince. And that's where it took off, man.

All right. So you're going to bring in as Faruco, okay? I kind of draw as a parallel to Ringmaster,

because when they brought you in, did you meet with Vince or did you get the phone call like I

didn't, he's explained how this gimmick is going to work. How did the creative go down on that?

Well, no, no, at this point, he and I were just talking, you know, about coming in, right? And

you know, just general things are coming in. Nothing in detail about the character of how we

going to, you know, softly alluded to it, the gladiator type of image, but in my mind,

I'm thinking, you know, the gladiator image of, hey, you know, this could work out pretty cool,

you know, with the shining metal and the real gladiator type of helmet. You know what I mean?

I mean, this could look really cool. Never in my wildest imagination, okay?

Could I have dreamed that the gladiator soldier would be wearing a leather helmet, okay,

but now I'm listening. And yeah, I'm laughing with God in there, you know, and on the fight

up, I'm going home, you know, on a date about excited about this thing when I'm going to be fitted,

you know, for this outfit and this thing, right? So I'm all getting myself ready for the shining

metal, you know, and then I envision someone putting it on me in the ring, you know, and all of that,

right? So when I get to the studio where the guys fitted me for it, right, I'm looking around

for the, you know, for the objects, you know, the suit, the drama, you know, right? And I don't

see it, and I asked to do it, it was fitting, and I said, what brought, well, where's the suit,

you know, he said, well, there's some of it, you know, right over there, and I,

so I looked over and I was like, where? And he says, right there. I said, wait, oh man,

yeah, I said, well, what's it? He said, oh, that's your helmet. I was speechless, okay?

Right, I literally, right, I couldn't say anything, you know, I mean, the first thought was, you know,

hey, I looked at the phone and I got to call this, you know, about this, right? But better judgment

for me. I'm just, I'm just getting this shot, okay, right? You know, so I had to do some

show searching with this thing, you know, and on the flight, back home, you know, I mean, brother,

I am, it's a million things going through my mind. So I get home and my wife says, well, how

did the suit look like? And I said, well, you know, I didn't even know how to tell her,

I told her it was made of leather right here. She laughed just like we're doing now, right? And

told me to stop getting, right? Here's the deal. So when I'm doing the research of this character

and looking at this outfit, I'm like, hey, okay, now this is how this is going to go, man,

it's either you're going to step out there and you are going to be the laughing stock of this entire

business or here's how you're going to have to do this. You're going to have to take this guy

then make him just kick people's ass, okay? And that was the only of the row that was that, okay?

With that being said, and a few more questions before we move on, I want to throw to some footage

of your WWE debut. Okay, we've got a tag team match in progress.

Okay, there's your debut. Make the attack. Sean with the big right hands on the smoking guns.

Okay, I'm out there. Boom, put the boots to him. Okay, referee trying to get you off.

Sonny is with you. Okay, you know, boom, big right hand. Okay, Sean with the kick, try to get

you out, pat, pat us some back and you off. And here you are about to turn around here.

Referee is trying to get you. This is your debut. And then

here's this shot there.

You're in that blood helmet. A baby, I mean, that's the most baby-gillion, at least,

each day before. But it's almost like, almost like USC Trojan. The mevel is when I go,

well, here's the thing. If you remember, when you showed up on the scene, everybody knew you were,

well, you know, we'd all known each other. But then even if you didn't know you, when you put

that outfit on, like 99.9% of the guys would have got laughed out of the business. Nobody

sent to you about that outfit because that's a respect that you had in the locker room and you had

just came in. And if you remember, we affectionately referred it to that as a skull. But nobody sent

it with a mouthful because, hey, man, the gimmick ain't no good. If that's Ron Simmons,

I didn't know if you knew that, but that's the way it went down. Did you think there was any

chance that this gimmick could work? No. Okay, you're right. Right, absolutely not. Why do you think,

the question I had was, why didn't Vince capitalize on your all-American football career? And the fact

that you're Ron Simmons and in the South of God, and revered around the United States as this

football player, you know, your voice, I always thought you should have been to the voice

silvers your whole career because of your voice. As, like I said, it's one of a kind. I just thought,

why didn't Vince say, hey, man, this is Ron Simmons? Let's know. I don't know. I don't

I'm thinking maybe at the time, you know, the roster was compiled of characters. Yeah, well,

you know what I'm saying, man, you know, and so maybe more in tune with trying to create characters

other than looking at the persona of their guy himself. Okay, that being said, as the attitude

there begins, you know, a lot of the bad gimmicks died. And the presentation becomes more

reality-based. So, take me through the genesis and the formation of Nation of Domination.

When I see, now I'm thankful for that character, okay? Because what he did was that he set up the

Farouk, you know, the Nation of Farouk. That Farouk had a slight bit of that belligerence,

the arrogance in him, although he wasn't as vocal, you understand, as this Farouk was being

with Sonny, being more of the mouthpiece, right? But his character was along those lines of

militancy, but he actually set this guy up. Was there any real-life influences that helped

shape the nation's image that you wanted to represent to the Earth? Absolutely, okay? It was a

natural process for that guy to voice out some of the things that he had been holding in, that

had to do with racial injustices for real and the real life, okay? That had to do with people

in general, you know, white and black. He really felt in some ways about people. It was a process

the way they would come to me, you know, with some things to say, I'm like, oh, you kidding me?

This guy would never say, oh, and by the way, by the way, who's Farouk? What? That's not

about the guy. Here's what it is. Yeah, you know, right. Yeah, so absolutely, man, you know,

it's kind of a who's who of office, because you've got Godfather, you're the leader, you know,

Mark is one of the strongest guys in the world. Deilo, tough guy. I don't know how tough he is,

and he's your wrestler, how about a hand? And while we're talking about Deilo, this is the fact

that we discovered what we're doing research for the show. Deilo was actually in the crowd when

you won the World Heavyweight Championship down in Atlanta against Vader as a fan. Deilo was in

the tenders right when that when that happened, right? Absolutely. Yeah, no, so he didn't know this,

but I mean, no, I did not know that he was there, man, he never, he never mentioned it, you know,

absolutely, but you know, I got to say this throughout all of the years now, he and I,

there's probably not a month that go by that we don't talk. Really? Oh, every month. Next time

you talk, ask him. I'll do it. So you got a lot of office, Godfather Mark and Deilo Brown Rock,

all these guys attributed a major part of success to you, but all of these guys, as I've talked to

them, said they learned from Ron Simmons that Ron Simmons took them under their wing. Ron Simmons

gave them advice. Well, look, man, I get like you, you know, I've been with you and known you

for a great many of years, man, and seeing you and I've even conducted yourself. You took the time

to learn from others and took criticism from others, all right? The same thing with me, all right,

and I was, and that's the process that I'd gone through. Hey, if you're in there to enhance

others to keep the business going, that has changed somewhat now, right? Every one of them will

intend to learn and would ask advice about certain things. Rocky, all of them, you know? Hey,

some of the phrases that I was saying to them guys behind the scene, hey, he took it and made

a million bucks off of, off of saying it, you know? Well, you guys travel together at all or

at least a few of you. Yeah, yeah, all of them, man, you know what's going on right now?

Because he's going, what's going to be going on in 300 mile drive because I imagine he's going to

be a little bit different than what we're going to get to here in a minute, you and the drives

when JBL, right? So, so are you booking territories? You just say, hey, cab, can we make this better?

Like, what's the trip? I'm not. I mean, you know, no, we, you know, because of, you know,

the number of us being in, you know, we could change up, you know, one guy around the different,

the different ones, right? And, and that kind of thing, you know? But for the most part, man,

you know, it was the thing that I loved the most about all of us being in the nation, man, look,

we got a long well, okay? And there was never one trying to hog or

bitching about the limelight not having enough airtime. We all got a long well, you know?

To the point you made me want to go about the rock bar and know you're right. And he did his homework

and he sprang upon that opportunity, but you presented to him. That, that was cool with you.

Yeah, absolutely, look, look, you know what, man? I've never been Steve, thank goodness. I've never

had a jealous boy in my body for no one at any point about nothing, man. You know, because,

like I said, brother, I'm happy with the things I've done. I'm a complete man. You understand me?

I'm going through with just about every phase of man can go through. Yeah. I'm happy with it.

I'm proud of all of them for what they did, you know? Okay, so you, you guys are obviously very tight

unit, but yo, so as serious as you could be as far as presentation, you guys are having funds

behind the scene because here you got four badass guys, alphas, and there's Godfather giving

D. Lowe the bunny ears. Absolutely. As you and rock, they're looking tough as nails.

Absolutely. We had a lot of fun there along the way of doing everything, you know? And the

biggest part about it is that each one of them hears what I love the most about it, right? As much

fun as we had, they had even more success even after the nation is on. Right? That's what I'm

really, you know, a static about the most proud of, you know? Right. I love that part of it.

So that the nation gets dissolved and you end up joining the ministry of darkness working

alongside the undertaker. What was your relationship like with the taker? Man,

and you're one of them. It takes a lot, right? And I've got, you know, a few guys, you know,

that's hanging up on my wall at home, but in order to make my wall, I consider you've got to be

above a man, all right? Listen, he's one of them, all right? All I've since I've known

the undertaker has been a friend of his man and have watched him throughout the years,

I've never heard the man it's a moan about doing anything. Okay? I've watched him work his ass off

Steve when he was hurt. And I'm somewhat of that kind of guy to a bone through those things

and work through her injuries, that kind of stuff, because I've been accustomed to nothing but

respectful. You know, in the ministry, you're going to be paired with Bradshaw as a team called

the acolytes. And it's no secret that, of course, you and Bradshaw would become the best of friends.

How did the chemistry develop between you and Bradshaw? Because y'all have come from

these taxes you're Georgia, then all of a sudden had y'all crossed paths before? Did y'all just

meet up in WWE and then strike up or a kinship? No, you know what? Backstage, you know, we

had the ideology of, you know, hey, that kind of thing was already there with both of us, right?

You know, getting on the road, hey, drinking some beers, you know what I'm saying, right?

Both very physical. Yeah, both very physical. Having the football background, him having the same

mentality that I like to pride myself into going through injury. I'm complaining about things

that there wasn't anything there to be complaining about. Hey, showing up doing your shots, right?

Not bitching about mind of things. Hey, get not there willing to work and do what's extra, you know?

So it wasn't a process of working through anything, but we hit it right off. So how did the acolytes

become the APA? I think it got to the writers that came up, I think it was with an interview

to write with Bradshaw, right? Saying like, you look, you know, everybody's, you know, always

wanting somebody to come in backstage and help them out with a certain thing, right? How about

we just morph this thing that you guys being hired, you know, for protection, you know, right?

And I think that's our base of it, guys. I'm glad you said it because I'll play some footage of

how the APA became open for business. Throw it to this. Big P, two little A's, acolyte protectionate,

this is a business that we don't make some money. Wait, what do you think? Look at it. Look at it.

Big P's. Are you in real life, a card player?

See, these became such great material. These kids were some of the best on the show.

Hey, wait a minute. Wait a minute. We're protecting those guys.

They ain't already hired you before.

Rumor around the locker room has it that you boys are now in the protection business.

Yeah, the APA. We just got jumped and I got a damn chunk taken out of my face.

But you know, it got to the boys even where it was such a thorn and such a good backstage stuff,

you know, people were cochlear. They want to be in part of it backstage, you know, because I

much enjoyed doing it. What do you got? We ain't got no money on us.

Here's your, listen, we'll write you a check, a check. Okay, but listen, if that check bounces,

so do you. Let's talk about it, boys.

I've got money paid for the check, but the big moment, boys, I've had a little

key said, if the check bounces, so do you. And like, okay, check, I can go bounce.

How much of you in John Layfield were the APA? That just seemed like you guys had been

you. All of us, man. And I think I said this, man, that is what not only did we hit it off

as a tactic or brother, he provided something for me that had been missing in my life for years,

you understand? Hey, would it be like to ride along with perhaps your brother on trips,

you know, like that, you know, to talk about intimate things, you know, to talk about personal

things, you know, so I'm forever indebted with him for that. Y'all used to go out a little bit,

yeah, I was doing a little bit of beer. I can do a live fight. Did you actually get some fights

absolutely real, right? You know, him being a big, big country bar, right? And

deduce me to the scene, okay? Right. We could absolutely Steve walking through the bar,

and he or I, you know, when people would recognize us when we walk in, and he would say,

or I would say, it's gonna be the one right there. We could pick him out. Y'all walking

to bar, and someone actually is gonna start something with you. Yeah, never fail. Really? No, never

fail. I always always got someone, someone always wanted to arm wrestle me. No, and I was like, no,

man, but the fighting thing, yeah, yeah, when you pick up one of them, the biggest baddest guy walks

in the bar, and somebody wants to pick a fight with you, that's dumb. Yeah, well, well, you, when

you interject the alcohol and women, okay, you got a lot of people that get 10 feet tall.

Yeah. So if you guys are in the bar fight, but let's take you to a bar fight that was played

on, on television for a part of the WWE program, and this is over at Timmy. Yeah, white's place.

Timmy loved it. Yeah, he redecorated it so we talked about it. Yeah, y'all about this damage here.

Hey, man, let me buy you guys a drink. You guys are wrestlers, right?

Be sure. Not today. Not really. Let us buy you a drink, man, you're wrestlers.

Peace. Peace. That's all right, man. We got it.

Well, that's too good for you to buy a beer for us, dude. There we go.

Oh, uh, what are you two good to do? Uh, have a drink. You'll notice you're cigar in this whole

skit. Yeah, you just tell me who you want. You need to go. Hey, you know what I am?

Yeah, I know who you are. Who am I? You're about to get your ass kicked.

You, man.

See, see, man, if you don't tell me that, I'll have you guys come out and walk away.

Okay, here we go.

Oh, what happened? What are you looking at, man?

I'm about to be in my pocket. I know. Yeah. And you know, he, he, he took extra.

You know, gotta protect the business.

Oh, keep your right to Dave Shortrance.

Timmy is loving it.

You get the big screen, you know, huh?

All right, it's about to come.

I think you're about to rip it off the wall.

Did you, you're selling your hand there?

Did you hurt your hand in there?

Oh, right off.

Oh, fuck.

Totally destroyed the ball.

What are you wearing there?

90?

Probably around, yeah, right up to 85 to 90.

Stuff like this is a common occurrence for you guys.

Obviously, that was on TV, but taking me on a road trip

with you, yourself, and Tim, allow them.

Oh.

May we have a lot of fun?

We have a lot of fun with that.

We love him at the end of the reason we picked on him.

He was a designated driver.

So that opened us up, hey, we could just sit back

and drink and throw the cans out the window.

Yeah.

You know, right?

And we threw a lot of them out the window.

So it was one particular time that we were throwing the cans out the window

and Ohio State trooper saw us throwing them out.

So it pulls us over.

Teddy's driving, right?

We thought Teddy was our boy.

So it's always a man pulls us over.

It's not like I'm all.

It's those two, right?

Hey, so it's like, yeah, it's us, man.

So John says, no, it's me.

And I said, no, it's me.

I don't know.

Yeah.

I mean, that's how you.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

When the good idea.

So he made Teddy get out of the car, right?

And go through all the stages.

Show the rim guy reverse to him.

Yeah.

So he made him do the karate cheese.

So when he determined that he, that he wasn't drunk, right?

Put him back in the car.

Now me, I have in that smart mouth in the back seat.

So the guy says, you all are going to have to cut that drinkin' out.

And that's it.

Well, you smell alcohol.

I said, well, what on your butt, huh?

Oh, my God.

Not good.

Well, I couldn't leave it out.

I couldn't leave well enough alone, right?

So he calls for back.

He calls for back up, right?

We think him with this is it, right?

So Teddy, I mean, he's Kirsten John and I out.

You stupid, you know, everything, right?

So as it goes on, the other shows up and say,

well, I know you two.

I know you guys, right?

And with, yes.

Right.

You know.

Yes, you do, sir.

And here are the belts, right?

Right here.

Right here.

Right here.

Thank God.

He was a big fan, man.

He wanted to take pictures with him.

And that's how we got out of it.

Do you remember the time that I heard one story?

I can't remember the details of it,

but y'all pulled over to take a break.

Take a leak.

And then two people got the car and pulled off.

Yeah.

Teddy again.

What happened?

Okay.

Well, we're doing the normal thing again, man.

We're ragging him, right?

You know, we did our normal process.

This is outside of Chicago.

Yeah.

Blizzard.

You know, 15 miles an hour.

Can't see.

You know, leaving the shot.

Getting caught in the storm trying to, you know,

make it through the next shot.

So we all got to stop, you know,

to get the beer out of us, right?

You know,

Florida is a blizzard.

I mean, big flakes brother,

covering the car up.

If not for the headlights,

you wouldn't know that it was there.

So I'm still outside.

John finishes, right?

Get's back into the car.

All right?

And Teddy's mad.

He just gets in and right.

This quick as he could in this speed job,

because he's mad.

So I mean, it's probably your journey.

As he says,

about maybe five minutes down the road.

So, you know, Johnson will win you.

Gonna stop joking.

And he said,

joking about what?

He said,

what?

You know, he said,

what were you eating?

Run.

You left him.

It's just stopping.

He's back there.

You know, run.

What are you?

Stop.

You're right in the deck.

Right?

So he looks back.

And I'm, you know,

and I'm seeing the light.

Yeah.

As they pull off, you know,

they start fading.

I'm like, hey,

this is not funny.

Any more.

Okay?

The jacket.

Everything.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Right?

So this ain't funny.

You can't turn around.

Okay?

Because it's a one way.

Yeah.

Now, he's out of vision.

Okay?

Right.

So luckily,

this is how this happened.

All right?

We were at cigars.

And I happened to have

the lighter in my pocket, you know?

And that's what I pulled out

as he was backing up.

To that,

they were nowhere I was.

This is how heavy the snow was.

And so we finally pulled back up.

Right?

I'm so rigid.

I can't,

I can't say nothing to him right now

because I can't talk.

I can't talk because I'm so,

because I'm so cold.

Right?

I want to get into him.

But I can't.

Right?

I'm so cold.

He's just apologized.

Hey, man.

I didn't know you out there.

You know, I'm sorry about this.

Right?

And I'm,

you're like,

you son,

but I still can't get it.

I didn't know you.

I still can't get it.

I didn't know you.

So from the beginning,

I can't give an ass weapon.

But,

yeah, but,

yeah, but man,

it was good to ride with you, man.

You know?

Hey, we've had untangle

on the show a couple times.

And one of the things

he always touched upon was

the wrestler's court.

And John was,

Bradshaw was terrible.

It could be bought out.

So easy.

And a lot of times you're the

bailiff.

Do you remember any of those days?

I mean, just fun.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Always fun.

But, you know,

why they were fun times.

But, you know, they were serious.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It was going to like a rib on a square.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Before it gets too bad.

You know, the name was people

there on the street.

You know, they always thought it was just,

you know,

along the joking lines.

You know,

but it was joking and spirit.

But it was serious.

Wait for the boys to kind of say,

hey, man,

police support you.

Yeah.

We don't need that set for us.

We're going to do this ourselves.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And what it got down to,

like you say essentially, hey, you know,

it was something that had you,

you know, it ain't good ethics.

What we do, you know,

on the road or to one of the guys,

you know,

the girls, you know what I mean?

Right.

So that was a way of us getting to,

you know, getting to the bottom.

Well,

before we bottom line,

no pun intended to the APA,

I want to play one more clip.

And this is

with Rebecca Romaine

and L.L. Cool J.

And this was,

I don't know where this was.

But people always

have to be a part of y'all's sketch.

Right.

With one song,

I've always wanted to know about.

Right.

How did you come up with the lyrics for Mama?

They don't know about that any more, man.

How did you come up with it?

No, it was, you know,

I just...

Hey, you know what, you know,

let's hear it one more time.

One more time.

One more time.

No, they won't play cover.

They say, interview, man.

They say, 20.

I'm not going to let this.

That's good.

Come on.

Come on.

Come on.

Come on.

Mr. Beck,

come on.

I know how you hollowing your star,

the gentleman,

can you hear it?

I don't know.

Yeah, we got some food Since we were going to watch.

Not aware...

You have some food, man.

It's all right now

This one.

Just wait.

That's it.

We gonna know how much it took.

You are from...

I'm home again...

What are you going to do now.

I guess I'm in beer, right?

Oh, should I?

Can I have a beer?

Oh, means, it...

Back a leg into my...

Anything you want...

You just set up a supermodel in here.

Well, man, haven't there is a god?

Ha-ha-ha.

Damn.

All right.

So, you know, that's plant to seed, uh, what's to come.

Right.

But he goes without saying that the fans

have fond memories of the APA when it comes to the attitude

there, because a lot of the beat, the physicality,

the beat downs, the legitimacy, but the humor.

It was too guys being funny without selling out

like Sissy.

Right.

You know, it was just funny stuff.

Yeah, man.

Put the bottom line on, uh, the APA, and you're

run as, you know, during the attitude there.

Brother Lil Afield, uh, absolutely among the top,

along with becoming, right?

First black champion, right, ranks right there, brother,

with a best period for me that I've got to say in my career.

Great time, like you said.

The package was there for getting in the ring, right?

With the physicality and the style of the way

I like to work, plus coming backstage and, you know,

and breaking that ice up with having,

hey, giving the people of another side of it.

You know, you, you can't act for nothing.

As for the attitude to the toughest guys on a roster

are actually really funny and can make you laugh.

Yeah.

You know, one thing you can beat a bunch of people up,

but when you have range, you can do different things

to entertain and, and, and, and, and the best point

about it, man, is coming from a hard-lined character.

Yeah.

The way that I've been, you know, beaten people up, you know,

and, oh, with the Peru, character and the nation,

and before, you know, right.

So you're coming from a legitimate athletic background

and toughest guys to ever be in a business

and a latter part of your career was a lot comedy-based.

Right.

But was a nice to worry, not so much as far as taking bumps

or sustaining any more of the beatings

because you're gonna start slowly a little bit here.

And this is one thing, you're by ready kind of stuff.

Yes, I am.

Yes, I am.

I'm nearing 50, 49 right at that point, right?

Absolutely put my body through it all.

Okay, you know what I'm saying?

The desire of getting up there now,

doing it the way I wanted to do it, brother,

was waning, waning down.

So this is nearing the end of it, right?

Body parts are starting to fail now.

Right.

At the end of it, when it came to the ending of a APA, man,

the hip was gone already.

Like I told you, I never said anything to John about it, you know?

Because I've watched him go through a process similar to me

of trying to find his way and build this, you know,

some niche and some character for himself

and some way in his business.

Never complained about nothing always been there for me.

So I wanted that to go as well as it could for him

to morph into where it was gonna take him.

So my hip was going to replace me.

Shoulders were giving out at this point, say, yeah,

I, at this point, I'm ready for it, you know?

I'm ready for it to come to wind down.

But how come you didn't say nothing to John?

No, not even in the moment of confidence ride down the road,

just two of you never said a word.

Wow, never said a word to him, man, because I didn't want him.

I know, I know him.

I know he would have wanted to get in there, man.

Hey, Ron, you just come in, you know,

toward the finish or whatever at the beginning

and take up the bulk of the match, okay?

Now, now I'm not gonna, you know, that's not me.

I wasn't gonna do that to him, you know?

Cause I knew that's what he would have done, you know?

So this thing, man, when he came to the end like it did,

it was perfect time.

I was satisfied with it, with it all.

Right. You understand me?

Hey, I've had enough on the mobile, I'm okay.

And so then when you just had to ride off

and so I said, you, everything, yeah, it was okay.

Okay.

Okay, so the body of work speaks for itself.

And in 2012, you would be inducted into the WWE Hall of Fame.

And JBO's gonna induct you earlier,

or at some point in time, you inducted Godfather.

Okay, so play some footage from 2012,

your Hall of Fame induction.

And we'll talk about what this means to you.

You know, such a great speaker.

Did this whole evening, I just sat back there,

but you know, I tried to just put this all

and harness it into just one word, but I just could not,

speak up, come up with it.

So,

but I'm, I'm still ain't gonna give it to her.

Not here.

Yeah.

The world is going to run out instead of giving them it.

Honored.

She's honored to see you in giving it to them yet this coming.

And over the past three years,

fortune are being inducted into some very prestigious Hall of Fame.

How did you turn into a great, such a great figure?

What is the greatest dishonor he has to make?

To me, it is for the journeys that I've had in order to get here, that I treasure the most.

As a human being, we all try to live and leave a legacy of something that we're most proud about.

That is very endearing to our heart.

And for me, I can tell you without question, it is becoming the first Black

World Heavyweight Champion.

To have watched guys like Booker T, like Mark Henry, come after me and say to me,

thank you wrong. That's to me, it's what makes these 27 years and this ring worthwhile.

You know, it's tanky time.

Over the 27 years that I've done this, I've always tried to take the time to let the people out

there through TV land and the people that sit there know just exactly how much you have meant

to me. Because to me, without you, there is no WWE. There is no Ron Simmons.

It is not possible for these young men and women to do what they do.

And I hope that over the years that I have given you what you have come to see of me,

and that is professional wrestling and a thing.

This whole thing has been so surreal to me and I just really could not put it all into just one

ball and some this whole evening up, so I'll just...

I think it's time.

It's time, you know, to say you have to throw out the soulman, man, you know, you have to

throw out the soulman's going over it, right.

Damn!

Thank you very much.

I stand up, coming up, yeah, everybody's up.

That's awesome.

Hey, man, nothing, man.

If you go in there, boot it in among your peers, nothing, nothing more complimentary than that.

So, obviously, that means a lot to you.

Yes.

Absolutely.

Look about it anywhere, right, show up your career.

You know what?

I have often thought about that, Steve, and I've thought about at that particular time,

other courses that I'm at that time that I should take, but if I take in those courses,

things wouldn't have happened the way they had.

So, no, you know what I'm saying?

No, you know, just like it did, man.

You know, not a thing because it ended.

It come full circle for me, you know.

Couple of grizzled bags right there coming off the bus.

This is over in Iraq, you remember that?

Yeah, well, looking.

We're coming off with what we do best, too, right.

And I can tell, I've already had a couple.

What, and probably the thing was, you know, sometimes it's hard to get alcohol.

If you remember, we would see the troops, the snipers of the ones that took care of us.

They gave me a big ass bag here, and that's what we ended up sharing.

They had a stash of weight.

They're person.

Oh, absolutely.

Well, there's a will, there's a way we'll find it.

Blood out.

That's good.

That's great.

So, with everything you've done, what do you want your legacy to be?

Hey, I wanted to be man that I gave it everything on hand, right?

And more importantly, I wanted to be that I did it with class and dignity, okay?

Something that I can look back on and be proud of.

That's what I most proud of.

Hey, man.

Hey, with that being said, they're giving us a go home queue.

So, I want to thank you for coming out.

Thank you.

To the middle of nowhere.

Jordan, man.

You and I have been friends for a long ass time.

And I've been wanting to come on the show.

And I'm glad you come out here to share your story.

Congratulations on the health of career.

Thank you.

And it's been a lot of great memories.

And there's a lot of great memories we never did get to Japan, stuff, and stuff like that.

But that's on the deal.

Thank you for coming out.

My name is Stone Cold Steve Austin.

This is the man, Ron Simmons.

And that's the bottom line, because I said so.