South Beach Sessions - Tig Notaro

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I'm very excited to do this.

It seems to me like you're in full blossom.

So I'm going to introduce you to the audience and tell you tignation.com is where you get tickets,

tour dates, saw her in Fort Lauderdale.

It was a lovely show.

She's back on standup comedy.

It's nice to see you there again, actor, comedian, best selling author, producer, director,

which of those do you like best, like the sound of best, not doing?

Podcasting.

Oh, wow, handsome.

Okay, so it's the intimacy of podcasting or you're just trying to throw me off balance

at the top.

I was trying to be difficult.

Yeah.

Well, I'm not interested in directing anymore.

I really enjoy producing.

Standup is like breathing and I really do enjoy podcasting.

But why are you not going to do directing anymore because all the problems come to you?

Yeah.

I mean, I've directed a bunch of comedy specials, which I've enjoyed, whether it was my own

or other comedians, but my wife and I, we co-directed a movie called MIOK, Dakota Johnson and

Sonoya Mizuno, starred in it.

And as soon as we got started working on this together, it was so clear, my wife is a director

and I'm not because anybody, yeah, if you're directing a movie, everybody is coming to

you to ask the big and the small questions.

So it's not just like, where do you want the camera set up?

It's also like, hey, TIG, do you want a silver pen or a purple pen on the desk?

And I would be just like, I wish I cared.

Whereas Stephanie would be like, oh my gosh, it has to be silver because the character

and then there's a whole story behind it.

So you didn't like being in charge?

I'm not crazy about being in charge.

It's like even collaborating with people.

It's like I like doing things together, but I, yeah, I just wasn't into, I liked being

on set, giving notes, getting a good performance, which I think we've really got, but just

Stephanie, down to like the clothing of each person, whereas I'm like, is everyone,

are your private parts covered?

Let's move on.

You know.

Right.

I would imagine doing that with someone you love, collaborating on something she cares

about that much, accentuating your differences, has its challenges.

I don't know if that goes into you saying, I will never do it again.

Will she do it again?

Oh, yeah.

She's very much a director and there what, like we don't have challenges as far as working

together and being creative.

It was just, it was more so, I was like, oh my gosh, this is really not my thing because

directing a comedy special is so different than directing a feature film with a huge movie

star.

You know, it's just a different world.

So, but a comedy special, that's all yours, right?

Like the gleam in your eye, you said the podcast and I imagine it's because it allows

you to exercise some of the same things that stand up allows you to exercise.

It's a, for your form of working on your craft and how to cut things up and be funny,

but stand up was the one that got the gleam in your eye.

Yeah.

I mean, and also I've directed other people stand up specials and, but a lot of directing

is camera placement for stand up specials, camera placement and then largely when you're

in the editing bay.

And that's fun to me is finding the right camera angles and where to cut off and move

on from each moment.

Where does your creativity come from?

Hmm.

I don't know.

I feel like I have to be submerged in real life and in touch with so many different

experiences, otherwise I don't know, I mean, you see a lot of people, I don't know if this

is exactly what you're asking, but I think you see a lot of people that get a certain amount

of success and then they're not having a terribly normal, I mean, it's hard to have a normal

life when you're a massive, massive star, but I just, I feel like real life interactions

spark so much.

So you were talking about the now, I was asking you more for the roots of it, like it would

make sense that you would answer it now.

You really, when I introduce you as blossoming right now, you must feel it creatively, no?

Like in terms of the amount of different projects that you're spreading that creativity.

Yeah.

I mean, I feel like I've gone through different points in my career where I felt like a lot

was going on or I had a lot of ideas that excited me in other times where it's like, okay,

I need to kind of pull back and see what I'm really feeling because you can get into

these modes of like, this is what I do and then I write new material and then I go on

tour and then and it's like, there was a beat after my last special that Stephanie directed

and was nominated for an Emmy where I felt like I think I need to take a beat away from

touring and so I took like two and a half years off and I wanted to return with a genuine

authentic excitement about being back.

Do you go back into the past and take me to the roots of where the creativity starts,

like you dreamt of being in music?

I think that as far as the where the creativity comes from in my past, I mean, I was raised

by the ultimate artistic mother.

I mean, she was very comedic, she was.

But what are you laughing at there?

You're laughing at something.

Well, I'm just like, my mother was, she was wild, she was an artist, she was a painter,

she was the back of our house as her canvas and she was very, yeah, funny, she was a prankster,

she was all of these things, she just, she was wild and it gave me a very different perspective

and she used to tell me to tell everyone to go to hell that had a problem with me and

I think that deep, just instilled message allowed me to be who I wanted to be and explore

what I wanted to explore because she was an artist and but yeah, I was, we were different

in that she was a little way more energy than I had.

I think I was kind of a reaction to her.

She would be embarrassed by your dead pen, she's more theatrical.

She's more, she was more theatrical and I was a little like, lovely but her sensibility

has stuck with me and but yeah, I just, I think it all kind of came from there and it's

funny, you know, I'm from Mississippi and people are always like, what is going on in

the south?

What's going on in Mississippi?

Everybody's got some crazy story to tell, where does that come from?

I'm like, I honestly don't know, I encourage you just to head down there and I promise

you will have a story when you return.

Well, what was it like?

So you're nine years old, what's the house, what's happening in the house?

She would say she's painting donkeys on the back of the house.

Well, we lived in Mississippi and then Texas and then a couple of years in New Jersey,

but what was it like in the house?

What was it like growing up as you when you're nine?

Oh my gosh, this would turn into a therapy session.

My mother was also a bit of a partier and so it was, it was, it was kind of a fend for

yourself in ways.

It was a, my mother's really wild, so it gives me no real gauge of what is a normal life

or what a normal mother might, I remember her saying, sweetie, do you wish like I had

cookies made for you and you got home and I was like, I don't care, and you know, but

I mean, there was, there was some structure like we'd have a bedtime and, okay, let

me be more specific to help you out here, okay, because I wanted you to paint in the

color for you, but the detail that I read was that she'd be so immersed in her work

and what it was to be a wild child that it's three meals at one time.

And if you're in diapers, everyone's just getting hosed it down.

Yeah.

So well, there's that.

Yeah.

But I didn't want, I didn't want to do that.

I thought that there might be color around that with frame how it is you become who you

become.

It's so much a part of who and where I came from that I sometimes forget to tell that

story.

But yeah, my mother would, my mother would set up me and my brother in high chairs and

she would feed, feed us all three meals at one time and then hosed us down in our diapers

and then let us just run around and dry off.

Did you not get raised that way?

Sure.

Oh, but you, but the, having the go to hell in you at nine years old, I mean, I don't

know.

The whole time.

I don't know that a parent could instill, I mean, maybe there are other things that a

parent can instill stronger than belief in yourself.

But if you have the strength, you've been telling everybody to go to hell since.

Yeah.

I mean, I'm not really, I don't actually tell people to go to hell.

I'm not, that's not my personality, but I think that the go to hell vibe studies me and

gives me a certain comfort and confidence in myself.

I'm certainly not a perfectly confident person.

I have my own little glitches that Stephanie and I were actually talking about in the past

couple of days that sometimes I get deeply insecure around when there's certain power dynamics

where I don't, I'm not quite sure how to navigate and, but that's for my therapy.

We decided.

Oh, and your relationship.

I don't know that there's a lot better inside of love than being able to share those things

with somebody two days ago when you've been in a relationship for as long as you're

having, you're still learning about each other.

Like that's pretty cool.

And about myself.

I mean.

Well, they're mirrors, right?

The people we love and they're being mirrors work is it's a safe place for you to put

that.

You don't want everybody to see that.

That's your most treasured, dangerous stuff, right?

Yeah.

For sure.

And so that's, it, your relationship is lovely.

And when I say you've got a lot of go to hell in you, it's in your work, right?

You're not telling anybody to go to hell, but you're being yourself, no matter the cause.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I guess that's what I meant is like, you know, the example of after having had cancer,

I did an HBO special where half of it I did with my shirt off.

And it was just my double mastectomy scars.

And I was so excited to reveal that once I came to terms with what my body looked like

and realized, why would I be ashamed of my body when the scars were just evidence?

That was just evidence that my body healed.

And so I was so excited to go out on stage, talk about ridiculous things and not acknowledge

that I took my shirt off.

And that is kind of a go to hell if you moved my wife with that as an, as I imagine, you've

moved many people with that.

And you take me through the decision making process all of that because it's not like

it's something, it was brave, but it's not like something you've seen a lot of people

do before.

No.

I hadn't seen anything.

It came from a very natural place.

And I didn't know if I was actually going to do it, but when I, when my surgery was lined

up to have a double mastectomy, I became aware of my body in a way that I hadn't been

before.

And I started to realize like, oh, I like my body.

I don't necessarily want it to change.

And so it was really upset that I was going to have this surgery and have these scars.

And then when I came out of surgery and I was going home, I was with the actress and my

dear friend, Lake Bell.

And I told her, I said, oh my gosh, I keep having these visions and thoughts of taking

my shirt off on stage.

And it makes me giddy.

And she was like, oh, Tiggie, you got to do it.

She was like, that is the best idea.

And then as time went on and I kept thinking about it, I thought, well, I already had my

surgery months ago because it took me a while to kind of get back into life after I was

sick and then once I was on stage, which was months after my surgery.

Even though I thought the window had closed, I realized that it's always there.

And I tried it out at a couple of venues.

I tried it out at Largo in Los Angeles and then I tried it out at, I think it's called

Town Hall in New York City.

And once I tried it a couple of times, I just thought, this is so exhilarating because

the people in the audience were stunned.

But then, and I don't acknowledge it, I just unbuttoned my shirt and take it off, hang

it on the mic stand and then talk about it.

Berk pressure before or time.

Yeah, I truly did this before Berk.

And so I thought, I am making a statement, but I'm also a comedian.

So I want it to be funny.

And so the funny part to me was what I was talking about while my shirt was off, which

is what the comedy community considers hacky, bad material, which is airline material.

And I was talking about, just stupid, like, what if you're on a flight and you know, why

I remember what I was talking about.

And I just thought it would be a really fun juxtaposition to do something that bold

while it was doing something so not respected.

And in the audience, they went from shocked to, it was like I had a shirt on.

They didn't even notice or care anymore.

Like, I just did the rest of my show, never talking about my shirt being off.

I have a number of questions about this, but where was the recall on the greatest

of the exhilarations here?

Is it coming on stage off stage?

Is it one particular moment?

The first one versus the last one?

Well, I didn't go on stage with my shirt off.

I did that halfway through.

So for the first half hour, I'm just dressed like a normal comedian.

And I guess a gay comedian.

And then I take my shirt off.

And I think the exciting part was when it merges with my shirt is off, the crowds going

nuts.

And then I go into my airline material.

And I was like, ah, this feels so good.

It felt so good because you could feel the audience.

They got it.

Like, because to take my shirt off and hang it on the thing and then be like, I was on

this flight.

And, you know, and then just it was such a rush.

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Do you have anything else that compares to exactly that?

Obviously laughter is laughter, and killing is killing.

But do you have anything in the realm of that kind of exhilaration that you've had inside

of a performance before?

When I, before that, before my surgery, I had done a show at Largo where I announced that

I had cancer on stage.

It wasn't the same kind of exhilaration, but it was like, oh my gosh, this is working.

This is happening because I knew I wanted to talk about all of the, you know, I had pneumonia

and cancer and this intestinal disease called C-diff that's very deadly and my mother tripped

and hit her head and died and I went through a breakup and that was all in a four month

period of time and I just thought, I really don't know how I can go on stage and talk

about going to the grocery store without acknowledging the hell I was going through.

I had never done anything like that and I just, I pictured myself sitting down on the

stool and I just didn't know how to get into it, but when I was showering before the

show, I had this like thought that I could go on stage saying, hello, good evening.

How's everyone doing?

I have cancer and delivering it in the way that you do when you say, hey, how's it going?

Are there any birthdays tonight?

Anyone new to town or, you know, just trying to deliver it with just a lightheartedness

and when the audience came with me on that and there's this moment in the album because

it's an actual album, this man was like, this is fucking incredible and like the crowd

was like, and I was like, whoa, this is so beyond what I thought this show was going

to be.

I thought it was going to be a somber awkward thing and I'd disappear in the night and

die.

The album sold like crazy because you decided bravely to share your vulnerability with

everybody.

Yeah, I didn't see in the moment like that it would ever be a popular thing to listen

to and I did not imagine, I just, I had, I wasn't, it's one of those weird things

where you just have no way of knowing what just happened is going to become what it becomes

and everybody was like tweeting about the people that were in the audience and other comedians

on the show.

People were tweeting and blogging and and when I woke up the next day, it had gone viral

and I was confused because I didn't really know, viral wasn't as big as it is now so

I didn't really know what went viral.

I did a show and then I went home and went to sleep, like what went viral.

There's no audio of it and it was just the idea of it that went viral and so yeah, I

don't remember what your question was.

You took us there, the vulnerability of sharing it with the audience right and that the

album ends up doing well because you're connecting in a very human way.

Yes, it's funny but you're also doing something that, you know, I, I, I think it's fair to

say is pioneering.

There aren't a lot of people who get to change the form of comedy right and there aren't

a whole lot of people going out there and giving their cancer diagnosis as, as a way to

be funny and connecting with an audience, everyone is affected in some way by cancer right

and so you're connecting there with just your public frailty.

Well, the cancer, there's illness, there's also the loss of my mother, there's the loss

of her love, relationship, all sorts of things were going on and I mean, people like Richard

Prior certainly had those kind of confessional sets that they did and I think that people

are doing it more now, it's mind was not, I wasn't like, it ended up being an album that

got released but it wasn't intended to be at all.

I didn't go on stage intending to release it as an album.

Was all of that in any way medicine because you, you, you use the phrase I think come back

to life that you were probably walking around haunted because of the assortment of things

that you were grieving?

It made me feel empowered when I felt nothing else could possibly be yanked out from underneath

me.

I didn't have any, I thought I was cursed and I don't believe in that kind of thing.

I, I was very scared and vulnerable, I didn't have a girlfriend, I didn't have a mother

to call, I didn't have my health, I didn't know if I was going to be able to make money,

I didn't know if I was dying.

I certainly had amazing friends around me, my brother, my aunt and cousin, people were

very supportive and strangers, I mean, but it was, it was definitely empowering at a rock

bottom moment.

Have you listened to it since or recently?

No, sometimes when I do interviews they'll lead in to a segment of a show with an audio

clip and I have to take my headphones off.

Not people think, oh, I'm sorry, I'm sure that's hard for you to hear because it brings

bad memories, but it's not even that, it's the, because I didn't intend for the world

to hear it, it's so not worked out material.

It's not your polish material.

Yeah, it was like an open mic.

So it's not the frailty of the announcement of the diagnosis, it's the frailty of that's

not my best work.

Yeah.

Look at your body language is crazy, you don't want that, that's not for the public, that's

the stuff I workshop next to the bar kitchen, I'm fine with it being out there and people

would say this is going to help a lot of people and I was like, because I didn't agree to

release it right away.

It took me maybe a month or so to think it through because I was like, that was, this

is not for the public, like, sure, I was on stage in front of a crowd, but no, that's

what you do when you do an open mic, there's a crowd there, but is that going to be your

album?

Absolutely not.

And the fact that it became that, oh, my God, as soon as I hear my voice, I'm like,

I'm like, it's funny for a number of reasons, but also it distinguishes sort of in front

of everybody, the pride that you have in the craftsmanship.

It sort of explains how it is that you are so good as a comic because you're crawling

around in your skin at the idea of it being imperfect, like it's not like, and what it

was, was, you know, imperfectly perfect because you were trying to be yourself, trying

to work through, literally trying to work through the paint.

Well, yeah, and so many comedians myself included, even after you work out your new material,

you toured around, and then you record your album or your special, that comes out for

public consumption, and then you still have notes off, I mean, I know I do, where I'm

watching and going, oh, I should, I, you're always tweaking and fine-tuning and rewriting

and moving things around, and so for me to just go on stage and do that show, and then

that'd be pressed into an album, it was, it was, I had to just make a decision, okay, for

the greater good, I'll put it out, but I thought it was not going to be well received.

In my mind, I thought, I, I feel like I know, and nobody else can see, that I need to

go to a deserted island and be there for weeks until this blows over after all the bad reviews

and, you know, because I just, but, but again, I think that's what excites people is that

it was so raw, and it was so in the moment.

And you're just imagining other people who care like you as comedians listening to it

and being like, oh, but that's not sculpted correctly.

Or even a, just a, person listening, whether it's a comedian saying, what's the big deal,

which plenty might have, and plenty of people that just heard it might have been like, what's

the big deal?

I don't argue with them, I'm like happy if it's helpful to somebody.

And then also, but that's not just that album.

It's anything I do.

It's like, if I'm not for you, I get it, and you can go to hell to hell with you, right?

I wanted to go back there because during, during your formative years in your youth, you're

not doing well in school, right, schools not for you, classic education's not for you,

because you're the daughter of a wild child, and you like music, and the arts are calling

you then?

Or...

Yeah, I mean, I wanted to be in a band.

My secret dream was to be a comedian, but I didn't know, I didn't really understand

how you do that, whereas music made more sense, like, okay, by guitar, practice, get a band

together, write some songs, and work it all out in a garage, and send your tape to a record

label.

Whereas the comedy career, I was like, all I knew was that I would turn on the TV, and

then it's like, please welcome Paula Palinstone.

And that could be the first time the world sees Paula, but I didn't understand that...

And that's not now, obviously, Paula and all these incredible comedians have audiences,

they've built over the years, but as a kid at home, I'm like, who is this Paula Palinstone?

How did she walk on stage to a sold-out theater?

I didn't know that they fill the theater with audiences, and then tape a special, you

know?

It's like the audience is bust in, and they don't know who Paula Palinstone is.

You have no access to your dreams.

Music seems like a more viable one, because you can pick up a guitar.

That seemed like, oh, I get that, but I'm not a great guitar player, or great drummer.

I play a little bit of both, but I do still dream of having a cover band with a bunch

of 50-something-year-old friends.

There's time, there's time yet, there's time for all sorts of creative explorations for

you, but you were saying so a secret comedian, because there was no access to that dream,

like you're there.

I didn't know who to, I was in Texas as a teenager, and I was like, so obsessed with

stand-up comedy.

But I didn't know who to talk to, to find out, where do I go?

What do I do?

I want to be a comedian.

It just seemed like so far off as far as a dream, you know?

Like becoming an astronaut, going to the moon, or becoming president of the United States.

Yet you figured out how to get there somehow, so how did you take the first step?

Well, it was accidental.

I have a group of childhood friends that had more focus in life and education and went

to college, grad school, and I just followed them where they went, and worked odd jobs.

How old are you at this point?

When I started stand-up?

Just this period when you're meeting the French, right?

Because you leave school in the ninth grade, right?

Yeah, but I had failed eighth grade twice, and then they moved me up to ninth grade.

So I wouldn't hurl myself off of building, you know, go to eighth grade three times.

No, I did it twice, failed at both times.

They moved me up to ninth, I failed that, and then I dropped out.

So I was essentially almost, or exactly, the age of when you graduate, so I left school,

and just went with my friends at, whenever they were at college, but I met them in elementary,

junior high school age.

And so one of my friends went to college in grad school for film and TV, and she wanted

to move to Los Angeles, so I went through a breakup right when they were moving out to

LA, and I was like, well, I guess I'll just throw my stuff in your truck and we'll go

out there.

Before we get to the jobs and what all that was when you were fighting for the life, if

I go back to eighth grade now, what's happening at home that makes it okay to fail eighth grade

twice and take a different path from traditional schooling?

It wasn't okay for me to be failing.

I think honestly my mother and my stepfather were just like, oh my god.

They were just so just exhausted by my inability to focus and get out of school on a legit path.

And so I was, I remember I was, I had, I don't know what I did, whether I was tardy a

bunch or I was talking too much in class or whatever it was, I ended up in in school suspension.

And so I'm just in a cubicle, there's other like, you know, 10 other losers in school that

are like in school suspension and so I was given a day in in school suspension for something.

And then they deliver your work that you're supposed to do for that day.

They collect all the assignments from your different teachers and put them in your cubicle.

And I was looking at it thinking, I don't know who they think is going to be doing this work.

I don't even do it when I'm out of in school suspension.

And I thought, I guess I'll just head out of here because they keep adding days in

in school suspension, even if you were only in for one, if you don't finish your regular

school work, then they add another day.

So I was like, I'm never going to get out of here.

I'm just going to grow a long gray beard in in school suspension.

So I, it hit me, I was like, I'm going to head out.

I'm going to, I quit.

I'm done.

You're a bit of solitary confinement for eighth graders, except you're a 12th grader.

Yeah, except I'm like old enough to drink.

So you, there must have been liberty in that though.

Oh my god, I was, I was stacking up debt and that was a massive light bulb moment.

Or I was like, I'm going to head out.

And I got up out of my seat and, you know, they just have gym coaches that are like, you

know, out of shape, like, like, they're off that period of class and they put them in

charge.

Oh, you planned your escape.

You were going to run if you had to, like, they weren't going to chase you down these

fat guys who don't care very much about their job.

Well, he's, you know, you know, those coaches and when I got up to walk out of the room,

I remember the coach got up, he's like, oh, whoa, whoa, where do you think you're going?

And I said, I'm heading out, I'm, I'm going, how I quit.

I'm done.

And he's like, what do you mean?

And I said, I'm quitting school, like, I'm leaving.

And he, he's like, he got out of my way, he's like, oh, okay.

And I remember driving home just like, why didn't I do this sooner?

Oh, my gosh.

And so I think that my mother, when I told her, she went to college, but she dropped out.

And, and I think she just got it and I was just ready to move on and start a new chapter

in life.

And I remember she would always brag to people when they'd be like, how's Tate?

She's like, oh, you know, she dropped out of school.

She's doing her own thing.

And I was like, I had nothing going on.

Like I truly just dropped out and I didn't, I didn't have a plan.

Have you carried that anywhere into adulthood with something like that?

What a great lesson to learn young.

Wait a minute.

I can just quit if I don't like something and start over to see if I can find happy

somewhere else.

Like, is that something that is presented itself again?

I mean, sure.

I mean, relationships and places to live.

But I also have been experiencing a new level of lessons on the opposite side of not

quitting and taking criticism and feedback and using it to my advantage.

And instead of getting mad about it, being like, maybe I should try that.

Anything in particular you're thinking of there?

Because yeah, something hurting your feelings or you're done with something, the criticism,

I'm not good at this.

There's no reason to try anymore.

No, I don't quit.

And now it's more fulfilling.

I think that it's an interesting place to be as a stand-up comedian that, and this

is it.

Listen, this is a very nice problem to have and I am well aware.

But years ago, over 20 years ago, I have friends like Zach Gallifinakis, Sarah Silverman,

all these people getting their own TV shows and wanting me to make appearances on there.

And I've never acted.

I didn't go to acting school, had no interest in acting.

I was pure stand-up.

And I did it.

And I had the luxury of very kind supportive friends that when I got nervous, Sarah took

me out out of the room and she was like, let's just jump up and down.

She was like, there's no reason to be nervous because we're friends and we're doing something

fun.

And then she'd be like, now do your worst possible take.

And it just took all the pressure off of me.

And I'd be like, okay.

But it wasn't my world to begin with.

And then that appearance on her show or on Zach show or whoever show would then lead

me to another one and another one.

And then I'm still not acknowledging that I'm an actor 20 years later when people are

like, oh, and this is my actor, Tignot, I'm like, whoa, I'm not an actor.

Because I don't want to offend actors.

That's some real imposter syndrome to be acting for 20 years and not identify as an actor.

Well, yeah.

I mean, I'd be on an interview and right underneath me, I'd be like, oh gosh, I'm so sorry

to the other actors.

Like I did not ask that to be underneath me.

But yeah, that's one of those things of just learning that, okay.

I'm an actor.

I'm here now.

I need to prepare and I need to give it all that I can.

And there are plenty of people that are still going to be like, you need to give more.

What's happening there that you're not allowing yourself the grace of, no, like, or the ego

of, no, I'm, I am acting.

I'm an actor.

I'm a, I'm getting parts.

I don't know if it's in reverse.

There are actors that start doing comedy where you're like, that's not a real stand up.

That's an actor doing stand up because they want to be able to sell tickets and, you

know, so I didn't want like, that's not me saying nobody should do that.

But likely they're not impressing me or other comedians, you know, and I know that's

possibly the same with like very trained, serious actors might be like, what is she doing

here, you know?

But anyway, that's an example of, I want to step up to where I actually am in life.

And that's also another part of my life that I'm not running away from is my marriage.

I've dated so much over the years.

Never did I ever think I would be married at all, not like I was running around town

or cheating or anything like that.

But I just, I was like, I'm not getting married.

And then I met Stephanie and yes, I'm in a committed long term relationship.

We've been together 13 years.

I love being in a long term committed relationship.

That's a road I've never been down and it's a new and exciting path for me.

And old me or some people would look at that and be like, I don't want to be stuck in

something for my whole life, you know?

And so that's another example of I think something that I'm not quitting and I'm not

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Why did you think that you would never be married?

Oh my gosh, the things I would say in relationships that were so telling of how one foot out I

remember one girlfriend said we had been together like six months or something and she's

doing something in the kitchen and she was like, where should we go for Thanksgiving?

And I was like, thinking Thanksgiving, she thinks we're going to be together at Thanksgiving.

Or another girl, she was making homemade soup for me.

And I just was like, how do you think our relationship is going to end?

I just thought like, let's have a, like, let's just explore that thought.

Like, are you going to cheat on me?

Are we going to?

Were you commitment phobic?

What was like?

I just, I had never had a relationship, I just, I don't know, maybe, maybe.

I don't know.

So it's no mystery that this happened after I lost everything in life, you know, my

health and my mother and my ex.

And by the way, the ex that I was with at that time, she's a very dear and close friend

and our family's hang out together now, which is just wonderful.

I mean, I committed to people for a year or five years and, but then I thought I'll probably

just move along, you know?

When you talk about this transformative year, this is a broad

question given everything you were dealing with at the same time.

But two part question, how do you feel like it changed you and probably too broadly?

What do you think you learned?

Well, it changed me in, I really don't know who I was before 2012.

And I think back, I literally do not understand what I was doing.

I don't understand.

And I really felt like it was one of those experiences where you're pushed to the edge

of the planet and you're hanging over and some get pulled back and some don't.

And I was luckily pulled back and I think that it is genuinely humbling to be that ill

and to be that sad and to be that fearful.

And I think I'm more not just humbled, but I am more careful with people's feelings.

And just way more sensitive and I want to do good in the world.

I want to be around good and yeah, it's like driving recklessly and getting in an accident

and just being like, I will never, ever.

But then you're human and time passes and you take things for granted and you're floating

drifting further from that grounding place.

But the luxury is that I do, I'm still tethered to that and I can have those wake-up moments

of back on track, you know.

Because you've made the commitment to someone else, you've made the commitment to yourself.

Well, and it's because I can't unfield or unsee what happened then.

And yeah, yeah, it's, I don't know how people aren't changed.

I remember I was on a TV, I was on a production where this guy, after I had cancer and he was

like, hey, it was like a really impressive story.

He's like, I had cancer, I had stage four, this and that kind of, I was like, whoa.

And then I saw him light up his cigarette on a smoke break.

And I was truly, I don't mean, if that's judgmental, it's judgmental, but it was just more

like, I could, I so could not relate to that because after I was sick, I started exercising

every day.

I changed the way I eat.

I am, all of those things that you're supposed to do, I didn't think about, I did not think

about, I was the epitome of the person, I was like, that's not going to happen to me.

I'm like, I forget cancer, I did, among other things.

It sounds somewhere in there like you learn to love better and in that transaction, you

love yourself better as well.

Absolutely.

I, I for sure did and, and that is what I'm continuing to, to go back to what I was saying

earlier about trying to find my place in, yeah, I, I have the, go to hell in me, but I also

get a little baby giraffe legs in certain situations where I'm not standing up for myself and

I need to learn how to do that, but, but it's, but I'm, again, I'm, I'm doing fine and,

I think that just finding that balance between the tenderness and the, go to hellness, I'm,

I'm just more aware, I'm way more aware.

What was the soup?

I feel like it was like a, a carrot ginger.

You'd know now, me more aware, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know,

you've been so thankful.

You wouldn't be in the middle of it saying, so how do you think our relationship is going

in? But I actually recognize some of what you're talking about when you talk about the

tether and whatever, wherever it is that your lack of gratitude makes you move away from

the present, right?

Makes you move away from the things that sustain you or make you happy or remind you to love

yourself and not fall into the same old patterns of distracted forgetfulness because there

are plenty of things that distract you.

Oh my gosh.

So many.

And you have to actively make changes.

And I know that seems obvious, but you really have to actively make changes to have a different

result.

And you can't just hope things will shift without a massive change on your part.

The success though can be tricky here, right?

Because they're all sorts of golden things now on your path that could grab you by the

ear and make you forget whatever if you're forgetful.

If you're in if you're in a place that isn't tethered because whatever that many of the

Hollywood shiny bobbles that perhaps you'd never been intoxicated by, but that offer

opportunities that that maybe become a cover band in your fifties because you're you're

about to have an assortment of opportunities that feed you I would assume once you get

into the Oscar space.

Possibly.

I mean, you see Oscar nominees and winners that kind of go by the wayside or struggle

to get work or but I think that also comes down to maybe their personalities or they shift

different into different interests.

But I don't know.

I think what's different about me is that I did not move to LA to make it.

I move to follow my friends.

And so I'm playing a very different game.

And I think that some people will trip over that with me and they can't put their finger

on why I'm not driven in the way that other people you're lack of materialistic here in Hollywood.

They don't recognize it.

It's an entirely different language, right?

All sorts of people are coming out here for different dreams that aren't bird watching.

Right.

Yes.

But I enjoy so many elements of what this entertainment industry offers and opportunities,

people that I meet in places I get to go and ways to express myself.

But I'm not I don't think I will I know I won't ever be I won't bear off.

Nothing will be too shiny enough for me to lose touch with what I'm tethered to.

Well, and what you've learned is what you're saying, right?

You're it's putting in my place very gently saying, no, Hollywood shiny things where you've

been what where I've been and learned what you actually want at this stage in my life.

I'm not going to I'm not going to be knocked over by superficialities.

No, I don't think that I'm I'm just playing a very different game, a very different game.

And where does it go in the next five or 10 years?

Do you have a plan for it?

And this isn't just professional what I'm asking you because your your your newest work

is littered with the things some of the things you've learned in parenthood, which I'm sure

has also changed you.

Yes.

It's very much changed me and what I feel more than ever is and that goes back to gratitude

is it's not that I want more and bigger.

It's that I want.

I want to maintain what I have and I want to appreciate it.

And I also want to and that means my marriage, my connection with my children, my work,

my health, that's really, really top for me.

What's all that matters, right?

I mean, it really is.

And the experience of making the documentary about my friend, the documentary comes

to me in the good light, that experience was solely driven by love and passion, not

just me, but the director, the crew, Andrea, Andrea's spouse, Meg, the financiers, everybody

was driving this project with love and it was true art.

It was every production I've ever been on.

There's a weirdo rattling around and there was not on this production.

And we came through it with all of us closer than we ever were.

I don't know of a production where the sound guy and the cinematographer are people that

were socializing with, you know, oftentimes the crew just, they pick up a job, they move

on and with this, it was, and I know so many productions say an R, a family after they

work together, this is really a family.

And it was so inspiring to be a part of it and to come out of that, that's what I want

more of.

I want way more of what I experience and of course there's the sad element of losing

my friend and our friend, but the way everybody approached everything was, and it wasn't just

everyone was being fragile and it was all in.

Everything was on the table to talk about, everything was on the table to laugh about.

And it wasn't a sparkly Hollywood project, but it oddly ended up getting the top nomination

through the Academy Awards.

Well, I mean, you, I'm not going to say it's darkly funny in any way, but it is really

informative that you just scored a sort of skipped pass the part.

And of course there was the sad part of the loss, but you're describing creatively

heaven on earth, following love right up until the end where there is the greatest loss,

which is what love risk.

Yes.

That had to be beautiful, like that artistically, I don't know how you do better than that.

You can't, I have chills right now, it's, it's, I was telling Stephanie that making

this documentary was the only thing that has come anywhere close to finding Stephanie

and having our children that I can't believe I nailed that.

I cannot believe after all of my failed relationships and imperfect partnering that I contributed.

I mean, I just so you know, I am very friendly with, I, I think there's maybe an ex that I,

it's not like I have explosive, terrible, I'm still in, you didn't know how to be a committed

partner.

I did not know how to love.

And I didn't even, I was just like, yeah, whatever, we'll do this till we don't.

But the fact that I met Stephanie and that I still enjoy her so deeply 13 years later

and that I love being with my family, I can't believe that that is my life.

And I cannot believe this is, I said, this is the only other home run except for turning

my health around.

My family, turning my health around in this documentary, home runs, home runs, and I, I,

I, I, I want to maintain that.

Well, you probably didn't imagine that you'd be able to without dark comedy or edges intervening

just tell a love story and tell a love story from the perspective of everything you've

learned with your own loss and what it means to live.

Mm-hmm.

And that's what this movie is about.

People hear that it's a poet with stage 4 of Avarian cancer and it's like, oh, Jesus,

that's heavy.

But it's, it's, it's a movie about how to live, not about how to die.

And it is so surprisingly funny.

And, and people leave the screenings or viewing, feeling this urgency of what have I been

doing with my life?

I need to make some changes and I got to, I don't, I got to get out of here.

I got to, I got to go live my life is how they feel and after they see that movie.

You don't often get to feel right what you just said, take you nailed it.

That was a home run.

You're probably not that kind of kind to yourself, even now with everything you've learned, right?

Or are you like, I, like, because that's the, there, what greater creative fulfillment

will you have than allowing yourself the real joy of, no, I did that as well as that

can be done because I was, because I was following the right things because I was following

all that life has taught me about what are the important lessons.

You don't get those chances that often.

No.

And, and what's so great is that I'm not the subject of this project.

I get to be, quote unquote, just the producer.

And so I can really celebrate this project and tell everyone you've got to watch it.

It's so beautiful.

Whereas if I was the subject of it, I'd be like, I'd be curious to see what you thought.

You know, where is this?

I'm of course curious what people think.

But man, I will go on about the movie, the subjects, and the process of making this film

because I've, I mean, I've had so many great experiences making things, but this was,

it just was something so different.

It makes sense what you're saying, though.

It seems like with everything you've learned through all of the growths, right?

Stand-up comedy is a bit lonely.

It's narcissistic, it's selfish.

It doesn't, it's not very conducive to committed relationships, the entire lifestyle.

No.

Isn't your feeding yourself, but later in life as you go through everything that you've

gone through, you learn such, it might seem trite, but you just learn to follow love

and then do something that's about someone else and then that becomes, that's, that's

also parenting, which is where your life gets turned, you know, you become a vastly less

selfish person.

Oh my gosh.

All like, all I think about is my kids and my wife and because I think I have PTSD, I

know I do.

PTSD after being so ill, I'm always like, okay, if something happens, I just want to make

sure this isn't playing, then we have this and that is, that's at a side and I'm like,

Stephanie, if anything happens, I could, I got it.

But yeah, it's my, it's my number one and I, and going through, losing, I mean, I've

lost my parents, I've lost my stepfather, my cousin, different people in my life and

there was something different in this loss of Andrea Gibson, the, my friend, the poet.

And I, I just want to make sure because Andrea's death as painful and sad as it was, it

was so beautiful.

Andrea wanted to be surrounded by friends and family at home and that is exactly what

happened.

As I said, anything was on the table to talk about, laugh about, and it made me realize,

I don't, look, I don't want to die, Andrea didn't want to die, but it's coming for all

of us and I've spent so much time trying to kick death away, trying to eat healthy, exercise,

got like I'm running, you know, and I, again, I don't want to die.

But what has changed with me is the real understanding, it's coming.

So I want to have a more open dialogue, not just with myself, but even with my kids,

not to scare them, but just, I want them to know I've had the greatest life in the

world and had a lot of tough stuff.

But I've, I don't want to die, but if I do, I've, I've done everything and more.

And, and I want my kids to know that and I want to have a special way that I go if I

have the choice.

I know not everyone has that choice.

But that's just become very important to me, to find some sort of beauty and celebratory

experience in my exit.

You say that and you remind me of, I lost my brother a couple of years ago and it, it's

little, you thank you, little brother.

So it sounded, and I sort of raised him so it's like, and I don't have kids.

So there's a lot here.

And obviously the moment of his passing, the most painful, beautiful thing I've ever experienced

because he was surrounded by so much love in the room.

And the, the power of that is what allowed you to follow your heart and make something

that everyone celebrates now.

But you're like, you're, you're televised, you're broadcasting something that is, is,

is the greatest lesson to, to have an appreciation for what's between here and there.

Yeah.

And know, and know that it's coming and live as if you live, as if you have that appreciation

with every step.

Yes.

Yes.

And I want my kids to know that I feel that way.

I don't want them.

One of my favorite quotes, which I've kind of re-arranged a bit so it's more universal.

I think the original quote, and I don't know who it is, but it's the best gift you can

give your children is a well-lived life of your own.

But my feeling is the best gift you can give anybody is a well-lived life of your own.

And I, I don't feel like anybody in my life worries about me.

Everybody knows I'm doing what I want to do and that I'm taking care of myself and I'm

living a full life and I'm surrounded by love.

And I, that's just really important for me to make sure my kids know that.

And, and I, of course, hope that they experience that as well.

It's been a pleasure to watch, a pleasure to spend this time with you, but it's a pleasure

to watch your growth as an artist.

So thank you for sharing this time with us.

I have the website, right, right, TIG World, TIGNATION, my car.

Well, it's also just TIGNOTARO.com.

I think I have them both.

Yeah, I think I have them both.

You're big, you're, you're big ballin' now, you got it.

Many a domain name.

Yes, yes indeed.

Thank you.

Appreciate the time.

Thanks for having me.

And the work.

Thank you.

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