The Army secretary resigns.

0:00From Executive Producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon and good evening and welcome to the Tangle podcast. A place we get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking and a little bit of my take. I'm your host Isaac Saul and I'm currently packing up some warm clothes and hiking shoes for our Tangle team retreat in mid coast main. Our team is spread out across the country and I'm thrilled when we can get together as a group, especially in such a beautiful part of the country and looking forward to chopping it up with some of the editorial and business staff and laying the groundwork for the months and I think probably years ahead. So I'm getting it together here right after this podcast gets out and

1:01hop it on a plane. But before I do, we are going to dive into the Army Secretary's resignation, Dandriscoll stepping down and I'm going to focus a bit on defense secretary Pete Hague Seth in my take because I think he is pretty central to everything we've seen happening. We also answer a reader question about artificial intelligence affecting constituent letters and discuss a rather surprising election result in Germany. It's a great episode and before you jump in, if you haven't yet, I encourage you to go check out Friday's episode where I explored the question of whether billionaires should exist. It's one of our members only Friday podcasts and it drove over 600 comments on the website already. So definitely struck a nerve and yeah, a lot of people have their own opinions, which I've found fascinating. I was reading through the comments and tons of super interesting and compelling pushback criticism, some support. It was a great comment

2:05section on this piece. That episode came out Friday again. You can scroll back in your feed to find it. All right, with that, I'm going to pass it over to senior editor Will K. Back who's joining me today and I'll be back for my take. Thanks, Isaac. Okay, here are today's quick hits. Five people were killed and five others hospitalized when an Amazon cargo plane crashed at Miami International Airport after the plane appeared to overrun the airport's runway. The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating the crash. Number two, a man allegedly assaulted multiple people at a fair in Ohio while attempting to move toward Democratic gubernatorial candidate Amy Acton. Law enforcement stopped the man who was carrying a taser and two pistols before he reached the candidate. Three, the Supreme Court temporarily paused a lower court ruling that restricted preferential rates in political advertising

3:05to only candidates, allowing political parties and joint fundraising committees to also receive the favorable rates. Justice Kentanji Brown Jackson dissented. Four, Russia and North Korea opened the first road bridge across their border, which will allow up to 300 vehicles per day to cross over between the countries. Russia said the connection highlights its deepening economic and cultural alliance with North Korea. Separately, Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky said that U.S. negotiators are exploring a plan to de-escalate Ukraine's and Russia's military operations this winter as part of a step toward a peace plan. And five, an immigration and customs enforcement officer turned himself into federal authorities. The officer was charged with lying to investigators about the shooting of a Venezuelan man in Minneapolis, Minnesota, in January. The White House has confirmed that the Army Secretary Dan Driscoll is resigning. There have been

4:10months of friction between him and Defense Secretary Pete Hanks as CBS News reported last week, Driscoll was considering stepping down by the end of the year, but obviously he is resigning now. In the statement to CBS News, a White House spokesperson said Secretary Driscoll has been highly effective in advancing President Trump's agenda. The United States Army is more powerful than ever thanks to his work alongside the Commander-in-Chief and with the White House calls to Secretary of War. On Monday, August 31st, the Wall Street Journal reported that Army Secretary Dan Driscoll had resigned amid protracted disagreements with Defense Secretary Pete Hanks' death. Driscoll officially resigned on September 3rd. Several other military leaders have been fired or resigned under HECSF, who has sought to reduce the size of military leadership. President Donald Trump appointed Assistant Secretary of the Army for Civil Works Adam Tell to serve as Acting Secretary and has not given a timeline for nominating a replacement. Driscoll served in the Army and deployed to Iraq in 2009, then attended Yale Law School where he met Vice President J.D. Vance.

5:15Before his confirmation as Army Secretary, Driscoll served as a Senior Advisor to Vance, and worked as an Investment Banker. He led modernization initiatives for the Army during his 18-month tenure as Secretary, including its drone development program. In April, the Hill reported on clashes between HECSF and Driscoll, after President Trump tapped the latter to lead negotiations with Ukrainian officials over a peace plan to end the Russia-Ukraine War. Driscoll and HECSF also reportedly disagreed on HECSF's efforts to block a list of Army officers from being promoted to one-star generals. Several military and civilian leaders have departed their roles or were fired under Secretary HECSF, and with Driscoll's resignation, both the Army and Navy's top civilian leaders have resigned in the past five months. Additionally, the Army does not have a top Senate confirmed civilian or military leader. Driscoll gave no official reason for his departure, but he reportedly spoke with President Trump about the state of the Army before submitting his resignation.

6:18In a post on Exxon September 1, Driscoll said, quote, it has been the honor of a lifetime to serve as the Secretary of the Army under President Trump and Secretary HECSF. Adding quote, we could not have made the progress we did without the support of Secretary HECSF. End quote. Some Republicans and Democrats praised Driscoll's performance as Army Secretary. Representative Steve Wilmak, or Republican from Arkansas, wrote, quote, Dan Driscoll is a transformative leader who brought common sense and discipline to the Department of the Army. End quote. And Representative Jason Crow, a Democrat from Colorado, said, quote, it was actually nice, I will say, having someone who was smart that knew the policy that wanted to do the work that had a background in these issues. End quote. Others including Senator Tom Tillis and Senator Jack Reed criticized HECSF for purportedly forcing Driscoll out. Today, you'll hear views from the right and left on Driscoll's resignation, HECSF and the latest at the Pentagon, followed by executive editor Isaac Sal's take.

7:28We'll be right back after this quick break. Here's what the right is saying. Many on the right express concern about Driscoll's departure, calling him a competent and valuable military leader. Some suggest the coming months could make or break HECSF. Others say HECSF is undermining the key facets of military leadership. In the free press Eli Lake wrote, the Army needs good leaders. Why is HECSF firing them? Driscoll was perceived by many in Congress in the White House as a quiet check on the erratic moves of the Secretary of Defense. And at a moment when the U.S. is relaunching strikes against Iran, Driscoll's role was as important as ever. In recent months, HECSF has conducted a purge of sorts. The highest profile example was HECSF sudden termination in April of General Randy George, the Army Chief of Staff. That same month, John Fellen, the Secretary of the Navy, was pushed

8:30out of his post by HECSF. As for the purges, they have been defended by HECSF and his supporters as a necessary corrective to the woke radicalization of the military. In practice, however, this has meant that the traditional non-political merit-based process for evaluating promotions of senior officers has been overturned. Driscoll's departure and George's firing have left the Army without a civilian and military leader at a time when the Army is doing the bulk of the fighting against Iran. HECSF may wish to defend these moves as part of his strategy to drive wokeness out of the military or to remove disloyal leakers from the Pentagon's senior ranks, but these are just excuses. In the spectator, Sarah Beth Spraggins asked, is Pete HECSF running for president or getting fired? HECSF sought a serious restructuring of the U.S. military. His allies praised his eagerness to cut, quote, deadwood, but inside the American war apparatus, opinions of him differ. Younger GIs tend to like him because he's plain spoken.

9:32A guy you'd talk to at a bar. Officers are less sure of HECSF because of his casual approach to military operations and his slogan hearing. Some believe he undermines military professionalism. The top brass worry about HECSF interfering in military discipline for partisan and personal reasons, or just because he wants to show off. When Trump proposed attacking Iran, many members of his cabinet cautioned against it, including former director of national intelligence Tulsi HECSF did not. There are rumors that HECSF wanted to get on board with fans if he runs, but given Driscoll's friendship with the vice president and Vance's view of the Iran war, it's hard to imagine he would have much influence. Some sources suggest that Trump is planning to fire HECSF. That seems unlikely at the moment, but the president may need a loyal scapegope if Iran is seen as the cause of Republican failure in the midterms. In the New York Times, David French called HECSF a wrecking ball. Our military is still highly capable, and we've watched

10:33it successfully execute some extraordinarily difficult missions during Trump's second term. The capture of President Nicholas Maduro of Venezuela and the rescue of two down-American airmen from the heart of Iran were remarkable feats of skill and courage. It's comforting, I guess, to know that HECSF can't undo the effects of generations' long commitments to excellence in just his 20 months. That's the end of the good news. From the top down, Trump is replacing the highly imperfect meritocracy of American public service with an idiocracy, and his corrupt idio-crats are creating profound short, medium, and long-term harms to American national security. Trump's critics aren't the only ones alarmed. I'd refer you to the recent resignation of Army Secretary Dan Driscoll. Driscoll was reportedly worried that HECSF's purges were hampering the ability of the Army to transform itself. And this is just as the conflicts in Ukraine and the Middle East are demonstrating that the world is in the midst of another revolution in military affairs, and we are not prepared.

11:36The combination of corruption, stupidity, and sickofancy that pervades the Trump administration is now infecting the Pentagon at the moment that our most powerful enemies are becoming more aggressive. Now here's what the left is saying. The left is also concerned by Driscoll's resignation, and many believe HECSF forced him out. Some say the military's leadership gaps are becoming dangerous. Others suggest HECSF could soon be fired. In MSNOW, Jeff McCosland said Driscoll is the first Washington casualty of the Iran War. Driscoll was highly respected by the Army's uniformed leadership. He established strong working relationships with senior officers, and he was one of the few Trump cabinet officials who showed himself to be willing to work with congressional leaders from both parties. But in his 18 months in the role, he repeatedly clashed with defense secretary

12:40Pete HECSF and leaked reports indicate that he, along with a number of senior officers, had cautioned against extending the Iran conflict. The war with Iran that HECSF strongly advocated for looks more and more like a strategic disaster, and Driscoll's departure is more evidence that the defense secretary is seeking to surround himself with loyalists. Trump frequently referred to Driscoll as his drone guide because of his advocacy for the military to rapidly embrace emerging battlefield technologies. Many of these initiatives, however, were rebuffed by HECSF. It's telling that late last year, Trump sent Driscoll, not the defense secretary, to be his primary envoy for bilateral negotiations with the Russians and subsequent talks with the Ukrainians. HECSF at that time was in Washington negotiating an end to the Pentagon's relationship with the Boy Scouts. That contrasts between Driscoll and HECSF, and the news that it's Driscoll who's gone, should give every American concern. In Bloomberg, James Stavritis argued, HECSF has turned the army into a rudderless ship.

13:46Driscoll was widely admired and supported by the top army leadership. He had taken a leading role in efforts to modernize the service using the lessons learned on the battlefields of Ukraine. He is a decorated combat veteran who led a cavalry platoon in Iraq and is also a graduate of Yale law school. Service secretaries are critical links in the basic functioning of the Pentagon. They are political appointees at the heart of the big decisions on the personnel, budgets, new technology training, and the war fighting ethos. These are not simply ceremonial jobs. HECSF may have individual reasons for the departures of so many senior leaders across the services, and he has sacked morale by denying the advancements of younger officers who had been selected for promotion to one-star admiral or general. But this latest damage to a major department in the middle of combat operations is stunning. Clearly, HECSF needs to nominate a stable team of new army leaders, get them confirmed by Congress and give them steady support. He simply cannot try to run the

14:47massive department himself. That is too heavy a lift for a secretary of defense even in peacetime. In CNN, Aaron Blake suggested HECSF's problems are getting harder to ignore. It increasingly seems that HECSF could be a political problem for the Trump administration. Senator Tom Tillus of North Carolina, who was a crucial vote to confirm the defense secretary last year, said he had, quote, never witnessed more inept management of the brave men and women who serve our country. Other Republicans haven't called for HECSF's exit, but have raised concerns about what's happening at the Pentagon. Those concerns have often come from high places, including Chairman of both the Senate and House Armed Services committees and other committees, the former Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, and several senators who voted to confirm HECSF. That's a lot, and it doesn't even include HECSF's sharing of highly sensitive information about impending military strikes on the unclassified app's signal. Amid a series of

15:47controversies and an unpopular Iran war that doesn't look like it's ending anytime soon, HECSF is certainly trending toward and battled status. Okay, that is it for what the right and left are saying, so now I'm going to pass it over to Isaac for his take. All right, that is it for the left and the right are saying which brings us to my take. Dandris school's resignation is the latest in a long winding series of concerning stories coming out of the Pentagon, and they all come back to defense secretary Pete HECSF. I've been candid about my feelings on Pete HECSF. I don't dismiss him as merely a Fox News host. He served two tours of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan. He has a bronze star and he earned a master of public policy from Harvard. Instead, I've argued that HECSF is simply unremarkable. As I said during his

16:49nomination process, HECSF represents the opposite of a meritocracy. He is only there because the president liked how he comported himself in front of cameras. HECSF tried to play up the dust on his boots from serving in combat as unique as if nearly all his predecessors weren't also veterans and far more experienced and decorated. His managerial record is far more pertinent and insightful. After all, the DOD has 2.9 million employees and a trillion dollar budget. That record was a bismill before and it's worse now. This man was never qualified to lead a department of this size or importance. If you don't agree, just look at what has happened since he has taken the job all leading up to Driscoll's resignation. In February 2025, shortly after assuming office, HECSF and Trump began clearing house. The biggest early firing was Air Force General Charles CQ Brown Jr., the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, over what HECSF described as Brown's support of DEI initiatives in the Armed Forces. Brown had been confirmed as the nation's

17:54highest ranking military officer and the principal military adviser to the president in 83 to 11 Senate vote just a year and a half before. HECSF then announced he would dismiss Admiral Lisa Franchetti, Chief of US Naval Operations and General James Slythe, the Air Force's Vice Chief of Staff, as well as the Judge Advocate's General, the military's top lawyers for the Army, Navy, and Air Force. In March, shortly before four US soldiers went missing on a training mission, all four were later found dead. The signal controversy broke. National Security Adviser Mike Walts had accidentally added the Atlantic's editor-in-chief to a signal chat where top military officials, including HECSF, were discussing forthcoming strikes against the Houthis in Yemen. Roughly two hours later, the first strikes killed 53 people, including civilians and children. An Inspector General report later found that the signal situation put soldiers at risk, though HECSF insisted he hadn't shared classified information. We'd find out even later that HECSF was also sharing

18:56sensitive military information in a separate signal chat that included his wife, brother, and personal lawyer. In April, three Pentagon Aids, senior advisor Dan Caldwell, deputy chief of staff, Darren Selnick, and Colin Carroll, had been fired amid investigations into unauthorized leaks from the department. The three issued a joint statement accusing unnamed officials of slandering them. HECSF conceded that the investigation was ongoing when they were fired and admitted in they have exonerated them. Then, John Uliot, a die-hard Trump supporter and former top aide of HECSF, argued in a public op-ed that the president needed to fire HECSF, writing that the Pentagon was in disarray under HECSF's leadership. This was particularly notable given that Uliot had once insisted HECSF was the right man for the job. Then, HECSF's term hit the 100-day mark. By June of 2025, we started dropping bombs on Iran, our first new conflict without all the leaders HECSF had fired or forced out. Then, we started striking alleged Venezuelan drug

19:59boats in the Caribbean, which have since extrajudicially killed dozens of supposed drug traffickers. A recent report from the Drug Enforcement Agency showed the supply of cocaine to the U.S. has not been impacted. Then, we had the Pentagon Anthropic Blowup, in which a leading AI company refused to give the DOD unfettered access to its systems. In response, Trump directed every federal agency to cease their use of anthropic products and HECSF designated anthropic a supply chain risk, which could have destroyed the company had a federal judge not struck it down on first amendment grounds. Speaking of the first amendment, HECSF has also imposed a series of escalating restrictions on Pentagon reporters. He's designated the Defense Department Press Office as a classified space off limits to journalists, required reporters to sign a pledge not to report unauthorized information, and threatened to revoke the credentials of those who didn't comply. Major media outlets refused to sign the pledge, but many sick-afantic news influence were stayed aboard. The New York Times sued, and a federal judge ruled parts of the policy

21:02unconstitutional. Just recently, the Pentagon fired three journalists from the federally funded but notoriously independent military news site stars and stripes after the journalists spoke out about the editorial independence of the paper being threatened. HECSF has reportedly allowed his wife, a former Fox News producer, to sit in on sensitive meetings with foreign military officials. His brother was hired to a senior advisory position. Meanwhile, HECSF has taken extraordinary effort to demote or pause the promotions of dozens of service members. At least 20 generals, admirals, and civilian defense leaders have left their jobs, the most recent of whom was Driscoll. After Driscoll's resignation, Senator Tom Tillis, the Republican from North Carolina, who previously chaired the personnel and readiness subcommittee of the Senate Armed Services, criticized HECSF's management. I have never witnessed more inept management of the brave men and women who serve our country, Tillis said. He is intimidated by competence and retreats to jaining up culture war instead of soberly attending the vital work of our national defense and

22:06the health and well-being of our fighting force. Tillis, by the way, voted to confirm HECSF for the job in 2025. The trade-off for all of this chaos was supposed to be a new era for our military, a singular focus on lethality, a fighting force that wins. We were told that by getting rid of dusty old bureaucratic leaders, military lawyers, DEI, and anything woke, we'd unleashed the full force of America's military might. And yet, the single most consequential military engagement the Trump administration has waited into hasn't evoked might. Maybe it's too much to say we're losing the war in Iran, but we are certainly not winning. By June of this year, Trump had claimed the war with Iran was nearly over at least 37 times. 18 service members have now died since the war started. Thousands of Iranians have been killed and American air strikes have now hit a girl's school and a wedding. The old Iranian regime has been replaced, but the newer one isn't much better. The Pentagon eventually articulated its core four goals of the war. Destroy Iran's

23:11missile capabilities annihilate its navy, prevent nuclear weapons and stop regional proxies, all of which are incomplete. Gas prices hit a Labor Day record, trafficked through the state of Hormuz continues to be restricted, and reporting from all across the media suggests our weapons stockpiles are depleting to concerning lows, so much so that we'd have trouble confronting China or Russia in the event of a sudden conflict. This is Hegseth's high-test austro-owned anti-woke military, and it's the one Driscoll objected to. Driscoll, for his part, is leaving at a time that the US Army is fending off some of the most serious missile attacks from Iran on its Middle East bases yet. Meanwhile, both the Army and Navy are without a Senate confirmed civilian leader since Hegseth fired Naval Secretary John Fielin in April. In January 2025, when considering whether Hegseth could help fix what ails the Pentagon, I said this, quote, I don't see any reason to believe Hegseth, who as a leader of several smaller, less complicated organizations has been followed by allegations of poor leadership,

24:14disorganization, sexual misconduct, poor financial management, and drunkenness, is the right person to solve these issues. I didn't want to be proven right, but I have been, and this isn't an issue I only care about under Trump. During the Biden administration, I called for Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin to be fired after he underwent surgery for prostate cancer, hid the operation from the administration, and spent three days AWOL in the hospital. As I said then, this position is too important to accept deception or mediocrity. Driscoll's resignation is only the latest warning shot about the issues facing our military. The only question now is how long it'll take before the commander in chief does something about it. We'll be right back after this quick break. All right, that is it for my take, which brings us to your questions answered.

25:19This one's from Tyler in London, England, hello, Tyler from London. Tyler said, I recently used AI to research prior legislation and draft a well informed letter to my MP about cage-free and rich cage hand welfare standards. It let me sound like I actually knew the policy landscape and I received a response, but I can also see AI enabling mass-produced form letters that flood MPs or members of congresses inboxes with low effort noise. Where do you land? Does AI raise the average quality of constituent engagement and lower the bar for writing a letter or does it just increase volume until it drowns out signal? Okay, so concern about technology obliterating a democratic process, including contacting congressional representatives is nothing new. In the late 90s, some senators were concerned that email would make it hard to connect with constituents. Senator Phil Graham's press secretary lamented in 1998 that their office didn't have a mechanism for dealing with the potential volume of email correspondence. Those concerns proved present as

26:22email would radically change senators' communication with constituents. In 1995, congressional staffers reported their offices received 50 million pieces of correspondence a year. By 2004, that exploded to 200 million, about 90% of which was email, and staffs adjusted by employing templates to respond to emails in bulk. AI is likely to change the way staffs interact with constituents again, but that impact will likely be much smaller than the paradigm shift provided by the internet. So far, generative AI has not measurably changed how congressional staff corresponds with constituents, either quantitatively or qualitatively. They still receive a lot of correspondence, bachelors, members of congress can understand the breadth of concern on a topic, then choose some missives that warner response. Maybe it will be more likely to garner a response if you use AI to help you draft a thoughtful letter, but uses like that probably won't transform constituent correspondence much. Instead, AI is likely to have a larger impact on congress's legislation drafting

27:25process. As Gizmodo recently reported, the Office of Legislative Council, or OLC, which helps draft legislation, received 72% more drafting requests over the first 60 days of this congress than it had over the same period two years prior, citing AI as a driver of the increase. OLC staffers said requests were low quality and riddled with errors. All right, that is it for your questions answered. I'm going to send it back to Will for the rest of the pod and I'll see you guys tomorrow. Have a good one. Peace. Thanks, Isaac. Here is today's under-the-radar story. On Sunday, the far-right alternative for Germany AFD party, 144% of the vote in the German state of Saxony and Holtz elections. It's highest vote share ever in a state election. AFD did not win enough parliamentary seats for a majority, but it could surpass the threshold through a coalition with another party.

28:27German politicians have widely condemned Ulrich Siegmund. AFD's lead candidate for the state's premiership over his rhetoric about the Nazis and the Holocaust, while AFD as an organization has called for mass deportations and greater government control over educational and media institutions. Axios has more on the election results and will drop a link in the show notes. Finally, here's today's have a nice day story. In the early 2000s, Vulture populations in South Asia dropped precipitously due to a then-unknown cause. Eventually, it was discovered that the culprit was a new drug that farmers were giving their cattle and a Vulture safe alternative was created due to the new drug, as well as sustained effort from India, Pakistan and Nepal. The Vulture population has stabilized. Going forward, organizations like Savian Asia's Vultures from Extinction hope to continue the work and allow for the recovery of Vulture populations. The Royal Society for the Protection of Birds has this story

29:29and will drop a link to it in today's show notes. That's all from us today. Thanks as always for being with us and we're excited to talk to you more tomorrow. Until then, have a great day and Peace! Our executive editor and founder is me. Isaac Saul, an our executive producer, is John Woll. Today's episode was edited and engineered by Duri Thomas. Our editorial staff is led by managing editor Ari Weissbeng with senior editor Will Kylback and associate editors Harjim Warhead and Belly Saul. Music for the podcast was produced by diet 75. To learn more about tango and sign up for a membership, please visit our website at retangle.com.