The Real Reason You Can’t Focus and What to Do About It | Ep. 331 with Nir Eyal NYT Best Selling Author

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It's so great to have you back near we had a phenomenal conversation

Last time and I've watched so many of your recent videos. You have a new book. That's out beyond belief

Which I have to say when I was 12 years old I was diagnosed with OCD and part of having OCD

I think majorly impacted my belief system

So to this day if I looked at what is my

Trade like the one thing that I want to change the one thing I want to get better at and if you ask my wife a hundred percent

she would say I

Definitely have a negative belief system that I think really holds me back in life

So I'm sure I'm gonna learn a lot today and I can't wait to dive in but why

Right now is this book so important. Yes, I think this is the moment when I needed this book most

You know, I don't write books because of what I know I wrote write books because what I want to know

So I went on this six-year quest to try and answer this this question about how

Beliefs shape our reality because I think that in a time of extreme uncertainty where we have

What's going to happen with AI geopolitical uncertainty economic uncertainty

We need ways to find control over our existence or else we go crazy, right?

When we think about all the things that are outside of our control when we believe we have to do something about those things

That are uncontrollable we we can literally

Burn out we can we can drive ourselves mad

And so what what I what I was looking for was to access how what's the the the greatest point of leverage that I can have to improve my life

It that's in my control and it turns out that if you can identify what we call limiting beliefs and turn them into liberating beliefs

That is the greatest point of leverage to accomplish your goals to unleash what you're capable of doing to meet your full potential

To decrease your suffering and increase your motivation wow

How do I do that? What where do I start? Okay, well, I'll tell you what it it is not about so it's not about magical thinking

It's not about chakras. It's not about necessarily the you know vibrating at the frequency of the universe and all that

So I'm I'm very science-based and everything that I do is back by peer reviewed studies

There's over 30 pages of peer-reviewed citations and so

It's it's it's nothing

magical whatsoever that in fact unfortunately

I think the the self-help industry has led many people stray by preaching this gospel of we'll just think positive

Right just manifest and I think that actually has some really negative consequences and the research backs us up

That it's not just about the end goals, but rather it's about the means that you have to prepare yourself

For the inevitable pain that comes from that journey to get what you want that if you just think about the ends

You're never going to get though that what they've done studies where they connect people to blood pressure monitors

As they are thinking about a future outcome. I want a beach body. I want money. I want love in my life

Whatever it is and it turns out that you become less likely to do the things you have to do to get those things

When you only think about the ends when you think about the vision boarding and the manifesting it actually can backfire

so much smarter way in the way that I

I

I'm promoting is called mental contrasting where you're preparing for the pain

That pain is just a signal. It's just data just information and we have a tremendous amount of information at our disposal

In fact our brains are processing 11 million bits of information per second

That's the equivalent of reading war and peace every second twice

So you have tons of information entering your brain

But your conscious mind can only process about 50 bits of information

So you're seeing life through this tiny pinhole of attention and you call it reality when it isn't

That in fact that that we don't see reality clearly because we can't reality is filtered based on our beliefs

And so if you get the right beliefs

If you're able to identify the beliefs that serve you rather than hurt you

That's how you unlock your real potential. And so it's it's a process

It's um, you know, I like to call limiting beliefs are like your face

That your face and everybody has a face

And you can see other people's faces just like you can see other people's limiting beliefs

You can probably say how your spouse and your co-workers and your parents all that you can see their limitations

They're limiting beliefs

But you can't see your own just like if I were to say look at your face

How do you look at your face? You can't look at your face. You need a mirror

You need to reflect in order to see your face in order to see your living beliefs

So there's a process to go through in order to uncover those limiting beliefs and turn them into liberating one

I'm so glad you say this because I don't like to manifest and I feel like

You don't have to

Thank you because people keep telling me manifest. I'm like, I don't know. I manifest it

I recommend against it actually

No, I appreciate that I appreciate that and something you've said to

Beliefs aren't facts and they aren't faith right at their tools

And something that got me thinking was

When I think of something to me it feels like a truth

Because I'm believing it it feels like a truth and I think that's held me back because

My limiting beliefs feel like they're truth to me. It's so common now you are not alone at all Daniel

This is this is super common. Why is this because it turns out the brain hates changing its mind

The brain hates changing its mind

Why because what what has evolution given us evolution as a given us a brain that doesn't want you to flourish

It doesn't want you to be happy. It doesn't care about any of that stuff

All it wants to do is to keep you safe to keep you alive so you can procreate

That's it

So your your your default state is not get to get you to a point where you're fulfilling your full potential

Now thankfully we know how to do better than our hardwiring would

Indicate that in fact if you just go back to your default of well that belief served me in the past

So that's what I'm going to continue to believe where you never do anything great

Why because everything worth having in life is on the other side of some difficulty

You want to have a fit body, you know, I used to be clinically obese. Let me tell you it takes work

It takes it takes some discomfort you want to build a family

You know, I got a 17-year-old and I've been married for 25 years. It's going to take some discomfort

You want to build a business? You want to write a book? It takes effort now the good news is

That pain is not suffering

This is a super important concept that blew my mind it took me a long time to understand pain is not suffering

Remember we've talked about that 11 million bits of information that you know

War in peace every second that your brain is conscious of the light entering your retinas the sound of my voice in your ears

The ambient temperature of the room your brain can take in all that information

But it can't see reality clearly and so it's processing all that information. It's just not aware of it

So instead you can use that pinhole of attention to decide what you let in and what you don't let in to your conscious awareness

And so that actually is very much in your control. So what that allows you to do

Is to say that pain that difficulty of doing that hard thing that gets me what I really want

That's just data

Just data just information. It's my interpretation of that signal that causes suffering

That causes me to quit that causes me to give up that causes me to not get my long-term goals

And so you know you think it's just mine said and woo woo and hocus-pocus

It's not that it literally can define who feels physical pain

We know that chronic pain it turns out is caused by exactly what I'm describing

It's called the fear pain fear loop that you have some kind of fear typically caused by actual damage

Then that fear perpetuates pain that pain perpetuates more fear which perpetuates more pain

And so it turns out that we can actually create pain and suffering in our lives where it doesn't necessarily have to exist

And that's psychological as well as physiological and I know you've said

Labels become our limits

Which kind of makes me when you talk about pain this this makes me think of of the limits

I've been putting on myself like it's just my luck

Or that's just how I am

I feel like we do that a lot and

So how do I how do I rewrite this script? I guess or how do I not automatically go to this like when something happens?

I'm like well, that's just my luck. Yeah, yeah, so so you know, I didn't answer your last question

But this this brings it up perfectly

What is the difference in fact faith and belief so a fact is an objective truth?

It is something that is true whether or not you believe it the world is more like a sphere than it is flat

Sorry flat authors the fact

Faith is a conviction that does not require evidence

God rewards the righteous

There is no amount of evidence that I can give to someone who has faith in that statement because no evidence is required

Belief is somewhere in the middle belief is not fact belief is not faith

Belief is a conviction that is open to revision based on new evidence

So unlike facts and faith beliefs can change

The problem is that too many of us

Think that what we take as faith is a fact and don't understand that what we think is a fact is nothing more than a belief

So someone saying that's just my luck

I'm no good at this. I'm not a morning person. I'm a satirious. I'm a whatever. I have ADHD even I which I do

You start to create that as a label

Whether or not it is true. So I would tell myself let me tell you about my ADHD diagnosis

So I got an ADHD diagnosis and for years I would say I have a chronic condition

That's not going to get better because that's what I've been told that it's a chronic condition now

I don't I'm not a doctor. I

From what I understand of ADHD

Looking at the literature there's a lot of controversy out there

And yet we fill people with these diagnosis unchecked. There's nobody saying hey

Maybe maybe we should cool off on these diagnosis if you go try and go get an ADHD diagnosis

You're you can do it on the app these days. It's incredibly easy to get one

This is only the United Kingdom more people are neurodivergent than not that a third of Stanford students are neurodivergent

Stanford students like is that is not surprising?

Like we we've we've tossed around these labels not that I'm anti late and not that I'm anti-diagnosis

Right, I think that they do have a place and people I'm going to get kicked off your shows soon for saying something

It's going to be very unpopular

But I'm telling you we're going to look back in five maybe ten hopefully not 20 years

And we're going to realize that this was a huge mistake

That we way overdiagnose and do not prepare people for how harmful

How harmful these labels can be

That we need to be very careful because our labels can become our limits. So for me. Here's what happened

I'll just tell you personal experience

I would spin myself out

About the label about the diagnosis there's my ADHD again

And it's always going to be a chronic condition

And what if I never get better at this and am I always going to struggle am I always going to be behind

Is this always going to be harder for me and I would make up these limiting beliefs

About what I could do and now what happened Daniel instantly as I'm thinking about my limitations

I'm not thinking about the work. I'm not thinking about the thing that I actually need to get done

And every time I was distracted my brain would go over to this limitation

As opposed to

It's a map

Right that a diagnosis is a map. It's you're here. You're trying to get there

And yeah, you're at a different place than other people might be. Okay, we all are

Now it could be that you have certain conditions that make it a little bit more difficult here and there

So your path might be a little bit further. The problem was I was becoming the map

This diagnosis became my identity

But it's not useful. It wasn't helping me as opposed to now. I don't tell myself

Oh, I have ADHD. It's a chronic condition. I'm never going to get better. I'm never going to start spinning out

Instead I say I'm learning another skill

This is an opportunity to get better and eventually I would learn that skill and get better for example

I learned that you know I've written three best sellers. You know what I learned that when I'm really into a topic

I'm in it like I'm hyper focused when I find a topic

I mean now when I have to do boring stuff. I don't want to do okay. Yeah, I get distracted

But also so does everybody

I mean like it's a skill you overcome. It's a it's a skill you can learn

Not that I'm anti-diagnosis or anti-pills or whatever. I'm not a doctor. This is a medical advice

But it's a great example of how our beliefs can actually become our biology

Can let me tell you a very quick story that I think we'll illustrate the point

There was a guy in the medical literature about an a who's anonymized and he's called mr. A is how he's named in this study now mr. A

Has a very bad breakup with his girlfriend. He decides he wants to commit suicide

So he takes an entire pill jar of anti-depressants

he

Downs them all and just as he finishes swallowing the last pill he decides he wants to live after all

He runs to his neighbor's house. They take him to the ER when he gets to the hospital

He collapses on the floor. He's he's rushed to the operating room. They're trying to figure out what what medicine to the overdose on

And they notice that his blood pressure is dangerously low his heart rate is falling

And they take the pill jar that he brought to show them what medicine he took and they look on the jar of anti-depressants

And it doesn't say what brand of anti-depressants it has a phone number

They call the phone number

They get the other the person on the line the person on the line tells them that mr. A

Was enrolled in a clinical trial of anti-depressants

And in fact he hadn't taken the the anti-depressants at all because he was in the placebo group

And yet the idea that he had overdosed on anti-depressants had caused these physical symptoms of dangerously low blood pressure

Falling heart rate. He was falling in and out of consciousness

Because he believed that something was happening in his body

Prompted from these anti-depressants which he hadn't taken he had taken placebo pills, which were completely inert

They tell him this that he taken just just placebo's in 15 minutes Daniel

He's off the gurney his heart rate is stabilized his blood pressure is fine

He walks out the door completely healthy. Maybe a little embarrassed

So if the idea

That our biology is doing something whether or not it is is so powerful that it can make a man sick this way

Do you telling me that putting in these notions of our labels that weird this or that also doesn't have similar effects?

Of course it does we know it does yeah

I think when it's it's

Easy to label somebody when you don't have that label, but when you're labeled

I think you're like I don't want to be labeled a therapist told me that a long time ago

They said you might have been diagnosed with something but that if you're a small business owner

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Doesn't mean you are that something and that really changed my mind

I think I was like 18 years old it this changed my life of of like maybe I don't have to be something

So I'm I'm with you and like you're saying I'm not a doctor nor do I give medical advice

But I do also agree that we over label things and it's way different when you are the one being labeled

Which then is like limiting you to being this thing

You talk about this Yale study

When it comes to aging and positive thinking

I couldn't believe that this was true. Can you tell me about it? Of course. Yeah, absolutely

It's it's shocking that there's a study done at Yale that people who have positive views of aging in their 30s

End up living seven and a half years longer now to put that in perspective seven and a half years longer

That is greater than the effect of diet

It's greater than the effect of exercise. It's greater than the effect of stopping smoking

It is an incredibly powerful full effect just by having positive views about aging now

What does that sound like a negative view of aging would be something like I'm having a senior moment

Aging involves inevitable decline right we've all heard that or thought that right now all the time

We just say it all the time in society whereas a positive view of aging is something like

Growth is possible at any age

Okay, something as simple as that growth is possible at any age now which one's true

Aging involves inevitable decline or growth is possible at any age

They're both true

But here's the difference that one of them

Leads to certain types of behaviors and the other leads to other behaviors

that if I have a positive view of aging that

that

Growth is possible at any age how likely am I to

Volunteer my community to go to the gym to go see friends to take care of myself in a way that's different

So it's not that there's some kind of magic

You know the mitochondria in my body are changing because I have you know positive vibrations

No, that's not what's happening at all

It's that people who have a positive view of aging

Behave differently and their behavior becomes their biology. I'm learning a lot today

I have to say I'm learning a lot and I appreciate this because I want to have more positive thinking

I feel like every time I have positive thinking

Something happens and I go extreme. It's crazy near like like really great things could happen

And I'm my positive thinking slightly goes up right like if I'm at a 40 it goes to a 50

One bad thing or what I think is bad happens. I go from 50 down to negative 20

0 to 100 so fast and it drives people around me crazy and they don't get it

They can't understand but for me it weren't when something bad happens or something happens

I cut I automatically think of the extreme to where I'm like like I'm thinking 15 steps

Past that let's just say something happens in business. I automatically think like oh my gosh

If this if this one partnership doesn't go through

That means I'm not going to make revenue for this month and next month and three months

And if I don't make revenue that means I'm going to have to go out of business

And I might even be homeless like that's like how my mind thinks from one thing

Yeah, all right. Let's let's do it. Let's do it. So what's the limiting belief there

What's the belief that you think is a fact that is causing you suffering?

I can't I guess the limiting belief is that I I won't be successful

Okay, that's awesome that if I'm not successful that's bad

Is there any way the opposite could also be true?

I guess it could be a learning thing failure could lead to learning or something happens and I lead to learning

But also I guess it hasn't equated to not being successful. It's just one small thing. Oh, okay amazing

So you could start with the surface level thing or you could go as many layers deep as you want like literally

I've you know using this technique. It's called inquiry-based stress reduction

Which is where we keep inquiring down down down. Okay. What's what's really the the thing that's causing me suffering?

You know, you could do this all the way to I could be homeless and

Well, I I'll you know, I won't have any friends and and I could die and you see it's just data

It's just data

It's our ceaseless desire to judge judge judge. This is bad. This is bad. This is bad. I don't like this

I don't like that. I like this and I like that

Because our brains doing it for us our brain wants to protect us our brain is trying to keep us safe

So it tries to keep us as far away from anything potentially bad and we become

Less because of it. We worry we're anxious. We don't try we don't put ourselves out there because we're so

Judgmental about everything. Let's take the worst case scenario. You die. Okay, you're dead. You know what happened

So like that's that's how far you can do not that we're not wishing that we don't want that

But literally let's take it to the logical conclusion. Okay. Now let's zoom up zoom up that business deal doesn't go through

Okay, you're miles away from homelessness and death

Like you're in a different planet

But let's okay now so we went and we we agree that

If you're dead, you're dead who cares? Okay, like even being homeless could be a potential learning experience

Again, we're not wishing it. We don't want it. We should help the homeless. I'm not saying anything that that contradicts any of that

I'm just saying that is also a judgment that that would be a bad thing

It's that all suffering comes from

Wanting reality to be something. It's not

That's what suffering is suffering is that person should behave differently. I wish they would change

So I'm not going to be happy until they change

That thing should have happened differently and I'm not going to I'm going to keep suffering until it changes

That's where suffering comes from so you don't get that business deal

I can think about 20 different reasons why that would be amazing because we didn't get that deal

That opens up another potential opportunity now you get to spend more time with your family now you get to start that other business

You've always wanted to be doing you know what at the end of the day good. I hope you don't get the business deal

Because think about all the things you might learn if that business deal didn't happen

You know the crazy thing is every time I don't get a business deal

It turns out that I never really would have worked well with that person anyways

But it's just it but even though it happens every time I still get concerned about it

So here's why rain is quiet. Yeah, no, don't say that. That's a limiting belief

I'm limited see no one you're you're you're doing again

This okay, so you you might be a severe case here

Which is good because that means you need the book

When we cast that die

That I am this I am that that that's like that's one of those trigger words that we should be very very careful of

That's pointing us to a limiting belief

I always do that or there I go again or that's impossible all right

I keep doing that these are all limitations. So what's the reason it's happening? I know exactly why it's happening

You don't have a response to that limiting belief

You hear it in your head you hear this isn't going to go well

And all the only place it goes is spiraling down down down down

That's where it goes to so if this happens and this bad thing is going to happen this guy

Then all these are going to happen to be homeless and dead

Right you see how quickly it went in your mind whereas you need to catch it early that when you it always starts with fear

It's always fear

Is your brain's trigger to

Tell you why you shouldn't do something

And sometimes that manifests in physical pain. Okay, this is the source of chronic pain

Is always fear

So what you need is a limiting belief that you can always refer back to like a like a secular prayer

Like a little mantra that you can constantly bring up whenever you hear that little voice that tells you

You're not ready. This is not you're not good at this. This is going to hurt

And so one I could suggest to you. I recommend you make your own. I'll tell you one that I've used constantly

Then what whenever I get stressed about what if this what if that

I constantly repeat to myself. This is happening for me not to me

This is happening for me. I didn't invent that I've got it from somebody else

I don't even remember who anymore. Oh my brother told me and I'm sure he got from somebody else

This is happening for me

Happening for me right just like you said you said it's so perfectly

You know what every time I've missed out on a business deal turns out I didn't want to do business with that person anyway

You should give them a big hug

Thank you for not giving me that deal because I it turns out I you I dodged a bullet right it's great

So I want you from now on whenever you feel that paying of this isn't going to work out and that's bad

I want you to say this may not work out

Awesome because it's happening for me

Now do I know that for a fact

Do I know that there's some kind of cosmic purpose for you? No

And I'm not going to tell you some story just so that it makes you feel better

Rather, I'm going to ask you to adopt a belief that you find to be a better tool

I don't have to concoct quantum

Whatever vibrations the secret all that stuff you don't need that you can just say to yourself

I don't know right the future is unknowable

And so I'm going to choose

The tool that fits for this job just like a carpenter doesn't say oh the hammer the hammer is the one and only true tool

Because one time I worked on a job and I use a hammer is really good

So I'm only going to use hammers from now on no

So you're using a belief that you've always used

Time to pick up a different tool. Thank you. I see I did mention the beginning

This is going to be a tough one for you, but you cracked I appreciate that

I need the book. I need the book like right now

I love that you and your wife wrote it and I believe from what I read that you've been together for over 25 years

Was there something writing a book together and writing a book together about beliefs or limiting beliefs?

Was there something that you two learned either about each other or learned about your relationship?

Well, you know, okay, I'll give you a very practical tool. There's a lot we could do a whole episode about

I think a secrets to a good marriage

A lot of it has to do with beliefs a lot of it has to do with acknowledging

That you don't see reality clearly right if you're only seeing that 50 bits of information when we're

Processing 11 million bits. You don't even see your own reality clearly

You're gonna tell me you think you're gonna try and get in someone's head and tell them what they meant when they said that

Impossible impossible you cannot

Compute someone else's intentions as much as you try you don't know you can't even see your own reality clearly

How can you see theirs? But I'll give you a very careful I'll give you a very practical tool that we use all the time that

I think has been awesome is

We try and assess how important something is to one of us so we don't fight like you know

We've been married now 25 years in September and sometimes I get this question and and like I tell people

We don't fight we disagree, but we never fight

There's never that and and the secret to that of why we don't we don't even argue to be honest

We we have conversations because like I so value her perspective that of course

If she thinks differently for me amazing. That's like a huge asset that we have different perspectives because now I can see reality more clearly

It's a gift not not not something to be feared

So one thing we've done in order to to better assess what is unspoken

Is to ask each other a simple question so when when we have a difference of opinion on something and I say hey

I'd really like it to be this way and she says you know, no, I want it to be that way

We ask ourselves well do a one-to-ten for me on that

Do a one-to-ten for me on that what does that mean? Let's say where do we go out for dinner or

There's the parenting that that's actually a much better example of like you know when when you have kids

I don't know if you have you and your wife may have a disagreement of how to raise the kid one way or the other and she says

No, no, I really think they shouldn't eat too much sugar and you say no, no sugars fine. We do to we ask each other

What's your one-to-ten on that so if I and when it turns out there's usually almost every time a huge gap

Whereas the person says hey, I you know

I want it to be this way and the other person says no, I want it to be that way

Oftentimes one person is an eight and the other person's a two on how important that is

So done deal no need for an argument or disagreement the person who cares deeply about that issue

Just do what they want because they care way deeply on it

It's only the small minority outs. It's maybe 10% of the time where you're close together

You know where it's a seven and an eight or a six or five

If it's anything less than a five who cares just like toss a coin

But if it's more than a five and you're close that the only stuff you actually have a discussion about everything else

You know what color should the couch be uh, well, you know

Where should we go with your parents this year like all that stupid stuff if you care more about it

Let's just do it your way that doesn't mean you do the work. Let's just be very clear

It doesn't mean you do the work. It means that let's go with what you prefer

I appreciate that because I like to tell people too

We don't my wife and I don't argue we don't get into fights

We just passionately communicate and I think when people around us especially when we go to Southeast Asia

It's very prominent when

We have people around us they sometimes they're a little shocked because they're not as vocal many times depending on on the country right

They don't always speak their mind so much and we're like look we're not arguing

We're just passionately communicating and I think that's why it's successful for us is because we communicate no matter what and we appreciate

The communication final question for you because I know you have to go on date night too, which is

Final final question we can make it short

So I wrote this book unlimited possibilities because I I hope people will be able to break through barriers in their life

And have what I call an unlimited unlimited possibility moment

What was that moment for you when you broke through a barrier in your life that you didn't think was possible

Well, this just happened yesterday

So it's top of mind, but we made the New York Times bestseller list

Which is something that I had resigned myself to not

Thinking was a possibility

Because it was it was

It wasn't in my control

And so I wasn't worrying about it with my previous books

I really really wanted it

But with with beyond belief I just I stopped caring because I decided look and it's not my control

Why should I suffer?

Why should I suffer that what I can control is I can I can sit down every day and I can work on my book

I can control that I can control my beliefs about the process is this hard and my suffering from it

But I can't control what people think at the New York Times

Turns out we did get the New York Times list which is amazing

But it was a nice surprise. It wasn't anything. I was staking my happiness or suffering on well near I y'all

I mean

Not only are you an incredible human being you

Dedicated you're dedicating your life and I've only written one book

I don't know if I'll ever write another book like anyone who writes books hats off to them

It is a process like it is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life

And I don't think I could do it again

So for someone to do three books

Finally hit New York Times best seller which I think you totally deserved

I think everyone would say the same

But it also shows you how good of a human you are to get dedicate yourself

And I hope everyone picks up beyond belief. I'm guessing it's everywhere

Every store online people can get it. That's right. Yeah, audible ebook whatever whatever format

Whatever market place you like awesome near thanks. Thanks again for joining us always great to have you likewise

Thank you so much. This is great

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