This Week in Tech 1100: Yoloville

0:00It's time for Twit this week to take great panel. Oh my gosh, Stacey Higgin-Batham is back. Jeff Jarvis is in the house, and it's the return of Owen J.J. Stone. We're gonna talk about Google's big day in court. Snorting nail particles, is that the best way to improve your brains? And yes, we'll laugh at more robot videos. Twit is next. This episode is brought to you by OutSystems, the leading agentic systems platform. OutSystems is helping their customers modernize operations by enabling them to build, modernize, and operate enterprise systems, starting from any coding tool in a governed, agentic engineering model. Without systems, you can coordinate and govern your entire agentic workforce within your enterprise ecosystem and accelerate impact with industry-proven, agentic solutions that are prebuilt, governed, and customizable to your business. It's time to innovate at the speed of AI without compromising quality or control. Which is why thousands of enterprises worldwide

1:01trust out systems for their mission-critical apps. Teams of any size and technical depth can use out systems to build, deploy, and manage AI apps in agents quickly and cost effectively without compromising reliability and security. Without systems, you can accelerate ideas from concept to completion. It's the leading agentic systems platform that's unified, agile, and enterprise-proven, allowing you to build your agentic future with AI solutions deeply integrated into your architecture. OutSystems, built your agentic future. Learn more at outSystems.com slash twit. That's outSystems.com slash twit. PODCASTs you love. From people you trust. This is Twit. This is Twit. This is Twit, this week at Tech. Episode 1100 recorded Sunday, September 6th, 2026.

2:02Yoloville. It's time for Twit. This week at Tech to show we cover the week's tech news. We're going to spend the first hour introducing our panel because it's some of my favorite people. Stacey Higginbotham is here. From Consumer Reports, hello Stacey with her stellar J, or whatever they call that now. The blue, crested, super warbler, finch, and whatever it is. Hello, Stacey. Hello, you're doing great on the bird names. I really appreciate it. I thought we had blue jays, but they were scrub jays, so I no longer know. I just no longer know. Stacey also writes a bunch of stuff for other people, I think, right? I see her. Did we have you on after own past? Because you wrote a beautiful piece about on Malak. You didn't. Yeah. But that's OK. I think we wanted to. That's a lot. We had issues where fishes. People would write horses. OK. Yeah.

3:02Hello, Stacey. Also with us, ladies and gentlemen, from Stacey's former co-worker. From formerly this week in Google Now Intelligent Machines, I give you Jeff Reijarvis. Hello, Jeff. Hello there. New book. New book. And hot type. And if you go to this is new, if you go to jupcharvis.com, you can order an autographed copy. Oh, nice. Nice to range that. You can order from a local bookstore, the... Who's on a graph? Who's on a graph? And... OK. Did you use Auto Pen? Be honest. No. No. OK. I had nothing to do with it. Nobody won my autograph. So I would actually go to the bookstore and sign some books and then leave. So there you go. Nice to see you, Jeff. I see every way to get intelligent machines. But there's always more to talk about. We never have enough time. We got a little AI to talk about today. A little bit. A little bit. And from the home of the Philadelphia Eagles, fly, Owen fly, Owen J.J. Stone. Yay. Every time I see Jeff Jarvis' background,

4:04it annoys me that I don't read it. I feel like his setup is judging me. It looks like a lot of books. But Stacey too. Yes, Stacey is added books to her. That's all readers. Stacey is not above because she's not guilty of me. She's got a burn up there. She's got some art decor. Jeff's just got books on. But there's nothing of joy in there. There's no joy. Really joy. Look at the foliage. Look at what? The foliage of the time. There's no foliage. Oh, there's some foliage. Is that real though? Are those plants real Jeff? No, you can't ever watch it. All that is. And then it puts that right up there. What is that? What is that? What is that? Is that? That's an armadillo. It looks like some animals. What is that? Over your right shoulder there, Jeff. What is that? Actually, you don't want that. What is that, sir? That's the ashes of our last cat. Oh, wow. Since you're asked, are they in an ear or that you sit there at a box? OK. Oh, I have the ashes of my last pet behind me.

5:05And they are also in a box. I am losing out in this. I don't have any books. I don't have any ashes. I've got to get my life together. Oh, Goliath. You as well, sir. You as well. You this whole digital thing you got going on with? I got lots of books, but they're not behind me. It's all, yeah, because we're trying to show the computer e-thing. Oh, wait a minute. I got to flip the switch on the out there. Hold on a second. Hold on, ready? Run. Oh, now it's running the program. Poo. Look at that. Analog. You still got buttons to play. People love that. Poo, poo, poo, poo. Yep. None of that is functioning. Ha, ha, ha. In the other side of the room is all the AI machines, which, to be honest, aren't functioning all that well either. I hit out a little. So they're servers and you're hot right now? I mean, I don't know. They're just, I don't know. Leo scolded his alter egos. So, so twice now, I have fired my AI agents.

6:06This time I brought them back. You can't fire us, we quit. I got it. I sometimes they just dither so much. In this case, I was trying the new thing from OpenAI. OpenAI announced a new model, which some say is so smart. Mostly OpenAI say, is so smart that you should be afraid, be very afraid. This we think is related to the model, if not the same model, but probably related to the model that hacked hugging face. OpenAI says it's been, it's been properly scalded and now. And I would agree because it's so cautious that it, nothing was, nothing got done. I gave it on Friday. I said, look, it's a Labor Day weekend. I'm taking the weekend off. You can go to work. I want you to find the perfect model for my hardware. And you know, test it all. You can install it all. You got, you got a complete control. I said to, andthropics fable. These are the like the, the big brainiacs of the AI world.

7:08And to the brand new OpenAI, I asked, I said, you got it. You're in charge. I said, Astra, you plan it. Fable you execute. I'll see you on Monday. It's the holiday weekend, sir. You know what? That's what they said. Again, they have got like for the Monday. You have to be done on Monday on Labor Day is embarrassing for you. The computer knew better. They knew better. Last night Sunday, Sunday midnight, Sunday morning, last night, they stopped. They said, we can't do anything to you, to you wake up. So I got up and they're just sitting there. Not doing nothing. If we work, you work. That's how I said, what are you waiting for? I said, I told you explicitly. Don't wait. Don't ask me. Just do it. And but they still stopped because they're very cautious. They're taught, they're taught by their real masters, not me. The people who pay the electric pills that they should be cautious. And so what, so what did you do then?

8:11I told them. I said, I was, I said, did I not give you explicit instructions? Not to stop to continue. This is what I was told. The whole thing about Astray is it's amazingly persistent. It was a obsequious as these models are then. Oh, I'm so sorry. You're so right. Oh, yeah. You're right. I said, did you not remember that I told you? Oh, oh, I'm literally said, I'm sorry. But it's not. It doesn't. I'm sorry. I mean, it might be sorry. You never know. I saw somebody on the socials today said that I think it was Claude. At some point just said, I'm done with this and cut it off and killed the conversation. Fire. Yeah, I've seen that too. I said that on X. I haven't ever had it do that. But there is definitely refusal built into these, you know, cybersecurity refusal. They won't let you make bio weapons. I wasn't trying to make a bio weapon. I was just trying to do. I asked it to find the best local models I could run on the existing hardware on the hardware I have.

9:11And they were downloading them and trying them. I had Groc on what I call model watch. Groc, by the way, doesn't rock, which is Elon Musk's alternative, never says no to anything as we know. So Groc was on the model watch. I said, Groc, you watch because you have, because you're from X AI, you can watch X because that's where all the people put their, you know, oh, so good. And this is the other thing that X is filled with influencers who say, oh, I've got 3,000 tokens per second coming out of my machines. Now it's amazing. And I fall for it every freaking time. They don't, by the way, they never say how good, you know, how smart they are. They just say how fast they are, which should be the tell. So once you stole them, did they go back to work? No, I fired. What happened? I said, that's it. It's done. Who's this model? Done.

10:11I'm going to install it. I actually told Groc, I turned those guys off. You install this model and will be done. But now maybe I'm regretting it because you had anything to do with Groc. No, now it's, now the, it's just, it's stuck. The whole thing, it's, can I touch grass? I'm giving up. What, what, what is our bird's budget right now on AI? I hate to think what I've, well, I haven't spent because it was a, it was subscription. You said limits, right? No, no, I said, there is a limit because they will only do so much in a five hour period a week and a month. But I didn't hit any of those limits. They use it to limits. They just, they're just cautious. They said, well, I didn't want to install this model until you said it was okay. So I do that was exactly what I told you to do. Are you sandboxing the PCs? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm not that. I'm not that. You're so sane, Stacy. I live in Yolo mode. I'm in Yoloville.

11:12I, in fact, I see, I haven't at least done a separate network. No, they're all on my main network. I have, Stacy, he's using this to build the future of the business. Oh, yeah, the ad sales, but that's on the back burner for now. But his wife just took over. Yeah. Yeah, she said it was September 1st. She said, okay, we're taking back sales. Where's the sales system? I said, what do you mean? You want it now? I wish you give me some notice. I'm busy testing models here in Yoloville. So did you deliver the system to... Yeah, that's a working, it's sort of... It's mostly working. Yeah, it's pretty good. She has some... You're hearing customer complaints? No, no, the customer is not customer facing. It's internal. No, your customer is your wife. Oh, yeah, they're her. Well, that customer... How am I, are you? What have the most important customers? Well, you certainly, what I call a stakeholder. Because she's got the stakeholder over my heart. That's gonna say, did she have the stake right over you?

12:13Like, Buffy the vampire. So I now... Well, no, I live in Yoloville because so, okay, so I set up Bard, right? On any gravity, not Bard. It's a Gemini, whatever. The new Gemini 3.1 flash on another machine. And it kept saying, when you want me to edit this file? It's a yes. Do you want me to edit this file? I said, yes. Do you want me to always edit this file? I said, yes. So I finally, I said, do you have a Yolo mode? And then it said, okay, let me check. Is it okay if I check? It was like, oh my God. So finally, after hitting return, literally 30 or 40 times, it said, yeah. You start me up with dangerously skipped permissions. I said, oh, I wish you'd told me that at first. So now it's not asking me anymore. That's the answer to your question and say, see. They're all that sounds foreboding. Dangerously skipped permissions. Yeah, that's what anthropic. I think that's how open AI got in trouble with skip permissions. Spacey, you're muted. So you're basically lighting some firecrackers and dry brush.

13:15What could possibly go wrong? So this is actually the topic, one of the big topics leaked. Before we get to that though, I think this big story is that the core of the story is that the report has decided that Google does not have to break up. That this is Judge Brinkman who had decided that Google was a monopoly. No question about it with their ad. And Jeff, we've talked about this. Look, if you stay, she should feel right at home. Here we are, right back at this week at Google. Clearly, Google is the worst kind of monopoly. They own ad sales, ad buying. They own everything from beginning to end. The judge said that. But even though the DOJ wanted to ask the judge for Google to sell their ad division off the judge said, no.

14:18Google basically won. Yeah, this is like what we're doing with climate change. It's kind of like the most American thing you can do, which is like, oh my God, this is a huge problem. But man, if we tried to solve it or tackle it, it would cost a lot of it. It's a mess. We kept figuring it out. This is the second trial. Google was the FTC was trying to get Google to remember they wanted them to sell Chrome. They wanted to sell Android. They wanted to do something. The judge also said, no, you know what? The cure would be worse than the disease. Google and ever, I think, I mean, I didn't read the court documents, especially, but I don't think no one ever made the case. This is exactly why we split them up. This is what the benefit we're going to get. This is how it's going to operate then. I think it was more retribution. Just split them up. Hurt them, please. They're too big. Steve Law writing on the New York Times, he covers the anti-trust and tech beat for them. It says in his byline, since the Microsoft trial, just 20 years ago. So poor guy is really suffering at this point.

15:20Why the courts struggle to tame big tech? And I think he's right. He says they fear meddling in markets where the technology is moving so much faster than the court can move. The earlier case, the judge said, Google search is a monopoly, sure, but it's already losing ground to AI. So what do you know that I have to do anything about it? Right. And now, and the judge has decided, well, we can't break up Google. The judge, Brinkmouth, said, oh, you have to share some information with your competitors, how the auction works. We haven't really seen yet what the rules are going to be for Google. Right? Okay. So that's the next stage is they're going to have a penalty phase, I guess you would call it. All this stuff is such pure theater at this point. It's so annoying.

16:20It feels like it. Because you allow these companies to acquire other companies at alarming rates and they get checked by the FTC. We've got to check this out and start, no, you don't because you keep letting people buy up everything. And then, oh, wow, they've got lobbyists. So it's like, all right, well, we'll just keep throwing money at the problem. And now you can't break us up because everything's intertwined. And you don't know how emails work. If you take this out, you won't get emails. It's true. It's heart surgery and they want to take out the heart. It's not, it's not like it was back in the day when it would break up coming. It was like, all right, well, you make the parts you build the bar, you put the gas in, you build the railroad and then it's like separate. It's like, you don't understand technology. I can't take this out without taking that out. Even though you acquired those parts individually and brought them in, you can never separate them again. The DOJ said that Google had rigged ad auctions to give itself an advantage. The court agreed that Google illegally locked publishers into using its exchange.

17:21But it said, they didn't really break any laws. In the remedy phase, the DOJ said you should force Google to sell the ad exchange that will level the playing field. It's not a huge part of Google's revenues. And honestly, I think the issue the judge saw was, well, you sell the ad exchange, you're just creating another mess with some other company, right? Who's going to buy it? Oracle buys it. And now Oracle has got the same power. So, what's the best thing the ad exchange would have been? This is our technical rating. It would have been the most serious penalty the government also has for fines and quarter to changes to Google's business practices. It's likely DOJ will get a lot of that. Judge Leoni Brinkma sealed the order. Oh, so she's decided, but she sealed the order for 14 days so that the parties could request redactions. So in two weeks we'll know. So here's a question for you. In hindsight, did the breakup of Bob Bell work?

18:25I think it did in the interim. Actually, for a hot second, okay, for a hot second, parts of it worked. So when they do, well, no, I mean, this is, this is exactly what we would expect. What happens is the company, it breaks them up. And then they said in regulations to require like, you know, you had to, if you had the only lines on the ground, you had to let people access your like your central offices and I can't even remember what these are called now. It's been so long, but they had to use basically your equipment if it was the only thing accessible to them. But then what happened is the bells were like, well, this obviously sucks. When someone needs to like fix our fix their equipment or fix our equipment that they're using, we're going to, we're going to drag our feet. We're going to do malicious compliance. And I mean, this is exactly what you would expect from people. And so that's what we would see here is malicious compliance or like basically malicious compliance or instituting new laws to get around the existing laws.

19:28And then you would have to come back. The problem is voters and people and regulators want these problems to be solved. They don't realize that it's just a continual game of cat and mouse because. Or a shell game, right? I mean, is it it's not a shell game necessarily? It's just you're going to you're playing with people who have there constantly at odds and you just have to recognize that fact and realize you're going to do something. And then they're going to do something to respond to you. Right. It's the same thing we deal with the game. Or AI or anything. Yeah. But I mean, this is a court. So it's not, you know, it's not influenced by the electorate in Siri, right? It's it's not influenced by by lobbyists. They don't have to raise money to run for office. They should be the whole idea of the court system is that they're kind of just this is blind with the scale thing, you know? But again, they don't have an answer on how to that's the problem. There's no there's no reasonable remedy.

20:30Yes, it's not and so far out of the realm. Okay, do you think Google made it that way? The alphabet made it that way? Like what what if we just weave this? I mean, they saw what happened to Microsoft, which almost got broken up. Microsoft had to make a consent deal with the DOJ. They know what happened to AT&T with mobile. Maybe they said, what if we so enter weave our businesses? That happened when they bought double click. Right. And then there's also I mean the courts, they enforce laws in our current system of laws is not it. It is not enough to deal with what's happening with technology. We don't have the right laws in place still to address technological harms or the harms of deeply integrated technology. We don't have like the, what is it the high, the high Schman herfman index for detecting competition. I can't think of it's it's a formula like the DOJ uses for anti competition for access to the market.

21:34We don't have something like this to understand how much market the tech companies control. Or they're right there. They're impact too. Yeah. I was just praying to post for tomorrow for Labor Day, this the labor story out of hot type available now Jeff charvers.com. And I'll always be selling. And I was really impressed that the turn of the last century, there were federal commissions to understand and study in depth the impact of technology on labor and the economy and working conditions and so on. And companies testified labor testified huge amounts of data came out of it really, really very useful. And you'd think that we'd be doing that kind of study now about this huge change we're undergoing now and technologies, but no. Well, you know, I think it is a fantasy that some of us have that there can be fairness in the marketplace and that capitalism works fine if you have any trust regulation.

22:36And you know, that's not that's not a fantasy. The problem is we don't have a system implemented to address it quickly enough. Like you cannot you cannot punish wrongdoing eight to 10 years after you've seen it be harmful. I mean, you can, but it's it's not very effective. Oh, you need yeah, you need to act quicker. You're saying. And we don't have the mechanisms. I don't think we have the will or the education or the regular. Process from the beginning, not for nothing like we need terminus. You've got people that are in office that are supposed to make laws and regulate bills and they can't even send an email on their own. They've got TAs doing all their stuff on the internet writing their tweets for them. And when they go sit down in front of Congress, they're like, what do you mean? I can just send it away. We do mean you could block things like they're asking the most asked nine questions about the internet. And I'm like, no offense on the Leo. They're your age without your education level. They're older than me. I mean, the first requirement should be hold up your phone and show me how big your font is.

23:40If you're a father. Well, I don't know. That's just that's just. No, there's that. Those are people who just don't have good eyesight. Hold on. You. You. You mean this big. Oh, doctor, you mean that big. That big. Is that what you say? That big. That's so stacy. My eyes don't work. Time is it. Oh, it's. Two thirty nine. I would. I'd be blind with you to have I didn't buy a laser from myself. Best part of the song. Oh, there you go. No, I'm not sure it's term limits. I think it might more be get money out of politics because I think you're right. The remedy probably has to be in Congress has to be legislative first. And then it can be through the courts. You got to make the laws first and you have to act more quickly. Congress doesn't act at all. And I think they're also beholden to the people who have money. Because that's what it costs to get elected. If we got money out of politics, I wouldn't mind if somebody, if you could stay in office without cheating, you know, if your voters historically love their member of Congress, right?

24:45Yeah. I would hope that not all of them are evil, reptilian beings. But I do know for a fact that again, I've listened to a lot of things. We'll see. Even if they just don't understand what they're talking about, they don't understand the technology. That's what I say about term limits. I'm like, you've got certain people in there. Well, you need a younger people. You're saying, well, we'll talk about facts machines. I'm like, bro, we instant facts and like, don't hear why are we still talking about facts machines? And we're talking about Facebook right now. Like, what do we do? I don't think it's just age. And I would say it is impossible to understand the level of things that a legislator needs to understand the level they need to make effective policy. That's why they have staff. Which is why they have staff and they have people like... And you deal with this. This is part of your job. I mean, you know, policy. Yeah. Like, I'm now a registered lobbyist in a few states, which is bonkers to me. So, so talk about the Stacy in terms of what it's like to deal with policy level. I'm curious what your expert now that you're in it for quite some time. Your experience has been... I mean, the people that I've worked with for the most part, you work with the staffers.

25:45Like, we have, for example, we have model legislation that we are pushing around connected devices. It's like trying to get people to disclose how long they plan to support a connected device when you buy it. Right? So, that's the goal. And I pitch this to people. And if they're interested, they come talk to me. But they've never heard about this issue. And then I will... We go through meetings where we talk about why the issue. I provide these like long letters with like sighted reports. You know, just so much data. It's like little research reports for them. They actually read through all of it. They come back. They ask really insightful questions. We meet with... They meet with the opposition. Those people send letters with sources, like their sources, right? And documents. And then the person comes back to me and they're like, well, they say this. And I'm like, okay, but here's what they're not telling you. And it's a really... It's a really involved process. And if they're doing this for like this tiny little bill that I have, can you imagine trying to reform like healthcare or deal with like anti-competition in technology?

26:51I mean, saying that these people, you know, still believe in facts machines is ignoring the fact that what we're really talking about is like... Academic spend their whole lives researching like one corner of this. Right. So, I mean, I have a lot more respect for the process. I guess, and how much information and insight that these people have to digest before they can actually make reasonable policy. And that's assuming they even want to, which is really a big assumption. I'm having this fantasy though, Stacy, now that you said you were a registered lobbyist, I'm seeing you with a big stokey and a huge briefcase stuff with cash and a stake house. Okay, I work for consumer reports. Darren Oki sees you as an advocate for truth, justice, and the American way in the court of a tweet law. So, I guess I get to be the judge. Owen, are you the attorney for the defense?

27:51I know. That seems very aproposive of me. I'm questioning everything. I trust nothing. Yeah, that's good. I'm going on here. I got a final. Well, I think also your point of view is very common. I mean, this is, I think with a lot of people, people, this is funny. Somebody in the discord said everybody hates Congress. But for the most part, everybody loves their member of Congress, which is the contradiction that we are facing. You know, it's, once you get elected, it's, you're pretty much there for life. No, no, no, no. What exactly are they hate everybody else's congressman? That's right. Well, it's like, that makes sense. That's Benito, by the way, if that is not the voice of God, although, in some times, I think he might be. Yeah. Benito are a producer. Yeah, that's true. They, they, they hate everybody else's members. Well, it's like you like, you like your, the media outlet that you trust, but you hate media as a whole. But also, I think we don't like the process very much. And I think it's really good. I think it's very good for you, Stacy, to describe it. It says you're inside it. And I think that that's reassuring.

28:52Well, and it's, I mean, y'all, and this does not, I mean, again, I have only worked on these one issue in the states. I haven't done federal stuff. But we spend a lot of time on like really small minutiae and trying to like establish like facts and patterns and cases, like, like examples of things. And like, it is a lot of work. It is like every research paper that you've ever had to write. And then basically your congressperson has to read all of these research papers, decide where they want to stand, and then compromise from there, basically. And it's, it's compromise. Nobody likes compromise, right? That's part of the problem. The only way that it gets done, but that's politics. I love compromise. And I was actually thinking it's an adult point of view. It's so hard because we live in our own filter bubbles now. Right. We don't actually see people as people. And so you don't, if you don't know anybody who's been affected by something like it's really easy for me to like talk about like IOT issues,

29:55because I've seen it from both the manufacturer and the consumer, right? But if you've never seen it from someone else's point of view, you really don't understand when someone says, well, the tradeoff is this, you're like, well, I poop who their tradeoff, it's stupid. Even though it might be really relevant. I don't know. I'm probably too rational for all of this. Yeah. It's the last word anybody would use about our system. Stacey, if you could turn up a little bit, you're very quiet. And I want to hear every word that you have to say. I'll kiss the mic. It's me and my yellow at it. Yeah, I don't, my gain is all the way up. I'm so sorry. Calm. Now, we're taking a break anyway. Don't apologize. You're super soothing is what it is. That's what I'm saying. It's what it's relaxing. Kind of makes me doubt. I'm going to meditate. You tell you about fact machines. Yeah, sometimes I'm wrapped. I get it. I get it. Well, anyway, Google kind of, it looks like skated a little bit. We'll see what the final decision is from Judge Brinkman. But I sympathize with the judges in these cases.

30:58It's hard to find a remedy at this point. And I think you're right, Stacey. It's the problem is you have to get it earlier in the process. You can't wait till now to solve it. It's too late. Yeah. We all have more in just a bit with Stacey. Higgin, Gotham, great to have you from Consumer Reports, where she is a policy fellow. What? A Jolly Goodfellow himself Owen J. J. Stone. Oh, Doctor. It's great to see you from. You're still at IQMZ.com. Do you still do the wonderful podcast with your daughter, or she's in school now? You can. She's in school now. She's actually allowed me to get back on the internet. So she's going to come back on the internet with me. Oh, good. Cool. Don't. So play us great. Hang on out. Oh, she just say hello, by the way. Yeah. By the day, but she's she. She uh, when I brought her the last time he was out here and we all went to dinner and Lisa then took her jewelry shopping, which I'm so sorry about. Like some of us, she might have to come out there and and intern with you just so she can hang on with Lisa and not work. Yeah. I can't promise you'll do any work. That's okay.

31:58We don't have any word to put her. So she can sit in the lazy boy if she wants. That's about it. Also, of course, from our wonderful intelligent machine show, our intelligent professor, uh, I didn't get to do the Craig Numer jingle. No, it's, I think, um, is, but he don't try to suck up to you? No, I just didn't say the emeritus professor. I got in with plugging my book. Craig Numer, I just. Journalism. Craig. Sorry. I don't have it loaded up in two months. It's a different show profile. He can't play it. Yay. At the city university. York, he has actually now doing stuff for Montclair State University. It stays. You'd be glad to know that on the most recent, uh, in the culture of machines, we, we resurrected the Google change lock. We did. Yes. Play the drum and everything. Oh, dude, we hated that. I know. That's why I did a tea or a tea, Leo. Before I go, we'll find a please. No one has a boy. We'll find a please. But you couldn't do an AI change log. It would, it's the whole show.

32:58It's like every day, there's like 20 new stories. It's kind of an amazing thing that's intelligent machines. We also announced, by the way, I know people hate all the AI coverage. But honestly, this is the thing that is happening right now in technology. I mean, we'll talk about the iPhone on Wednesday. Sure. But really, the AI is, is, is where all the action is. And so we have added how micrissgt is going to start doing hands-on AI. A short form a show where he'll kind of help people or just, we're getting started with it. Understand the concepts, the terms you're hearing, how to use it more effectively, how not to use it. That's great. That's going to debut in a week or two hands-on AI with micrissgt. If you're already subscribed to the hands-on Apple feed, I think it's, we're just going to piggyback on that because it's the same initials. So we're just keeping using it. Oh, and Jammer B. Thank you, Jammer B. Has donated something to the cause. And of course, we can always count on him. Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, Craig, new mom.

34:08I don't know if Craig listens to this show, but he would, if he does, he needs to have that. We will have more just a little bit. I showed it a brought to you by, I would show it to you. But you know, Stacy you were saying, I live in Yolo land and it's true, but I do have the things to canary our sponsor hooked up onto the network. So at least I'll know if somebody breaks in. I have a question for all you people, all you business people about your network. How do you know? I know you have the best defenses. Everybody does nowadays, but people still break in, don't they? How do you know if somebody, an intruder, is inside your network? How would you know that? I'll let you think about it. You probably wouldn't. On average companies don't know they've been breached for 91 days, three months for an intruder. And by the way, intruder doesn't have to be a human. Nowadays we know that intruders can be even AIs, but just don't know that they're in the network.

35:10Unless you have a things to canary, things canaries are honeypots. They are irresistible, both to AIs. By the way, I could make my things canary be a wiki coming to think of it. Maybe I should both to AIs and to human hackers and malicious insiders. They see it and it looks like something real. A Windows server, Linux box, a SharePoint Exchange server, a skated device. It could be anything. There are hundreds of profiles. And by the way, it impersonates them perfect right down to the MAC address. It looks exactly like what it pretends to be, but it's not. You can also use your things canary to create what we call canary tokens. Files, you can put on not only your local on prem drives, but your cloud drives too. I have, I probably shouldn't tell you this, but if I have on my Google Drive files that say that look like spreadsheet files, to say things like payroll information. Now if you're malicious bad guy and you're in my Google Drive, how could you resist that?

36:11That's probably loaded up with social security numbers. Home address is all sorts of good information, but the minute you try to open that file, or the minute you try to brute force my fake SSH server, I'm going to get an alert for my things canary. It's going to tell me and you only get the alerts that matter. No false alerts, just the alerts to say someone is in your system and you have a problem. In any way you want a SMS text, you can get email, syslog, Slack. Whatever you want, web hooks, they have an API even you can write your own if you want. Choose a profile for your things canary device, register it with a hosted console for monitoring notifications and then just relax. Anybody who's breached your network will make themselves known. They can't help it by accessing your things canary or those canary token files. Visit canary.tools-twit, $7,500 a year you can get five of them. You also get your own hosted console, you get upgrades, you get support, you get maintenance, all of that. And if you use the code Twit and then how did you hear about a Spock's,

37:11you're going to get 10% off the price per life. You can always return your things canaries, they have a two month, 60 day money back guarantee for a full refund. I should tell you though, they've been advertising on this network for more than 10 years in and all that time. The things canary refund has not once, not once been claimed. Visit canary.tools-twit and the code Twit and the how did you hear about a Spock's? Not just for 10% off for the first year, but for every year you own your things canaries. So that's forever if you want. It should be canary.tools-twit. I love my things canary, I think you will too. We thank him so much for supporting. This week in tech. Right. Stacy's going to talk directly into the microphone. Is this better? Yeah. The Herffindal Hirschman index, you say, or HHI score. That's probably easier. Yeah.

38:11I could say that three times. Stacy put that in the club Twit discord. Sorry. I am such a nerd and I wanted to make sure that we had like in case anyone was like, oh, I really love thinking about anti-attract law. What is the name of that out? Is it an algorithm? It's an index. We now know the invitation went out. Everybody got them except me. Apple's having an event and they're going to be doing in Cupertino with the brand new CEO this Wednesday. Tim Cook stepped down on September 1st and September 1st John Ternis became the CEO of Apple. This will now be his first Apple event. Not too much pressure. All he has to really do is walk out on that stage and say, good morning. And then watch the video. They don't even do one more thing anymore. They just play a bunch of videos. They've probably been done a long time ago. We don't know for sure what Apple's going to announce, but it's pretty clear that we'll have that's a new iPhone.

39:16That's what they do this time of year. The iPhone 18. They won't do the 18 or the 18 SE or even the new iPhone Air to the rumor mill, which is usually pretty right on by this time of year. Says that'll be next year in the spring, but they will announce the 18 pro the pro max and a new folding iPhone that will not look like a Samsung Galaxy Ultra, whatever. But more like a little book, in fact, actually Samsung because they're making the screens for Apple. How's that product? They got it. They kind of said, we can do that. And they did it before Apple did. It's very popular, apparently. Is the iPhone still used to folding phone? I can't use the folding phone. I just want a tiny little phone. That's all I want. You want it to fold. It's tiny. It folds tiny. That way, though. You know, you want it to fold that way.

40:16That way, not that way. You know what I'm saying? You know, the book, the book fold as opposed to the razor fold will call it the moto razor hold. Perfect. I think I prefer the book fold myself. I think you're an Android user, though. You wouldn't get an iPhone. I am. I actually just got a new hot pink pixel 11. Oh, whoa. Can you show us? It's not in this room, but I can show you. How could you be more than I ever want to wait for your phone? What the hell's right on these things? What? She's. I just stopped the whole internet and like two big. No, no, no, Stacy. First of all, you got the new phone. It's got the little blink of the eye on the back to tell me about emergency. You have to look at it, but you need to. What if I needed you, Stacy? You didn't have your phone at the ready? You're on this internet thing. I'm trying to text you like my life depends on it. And your phones in another room. I'm trying to commercial break. I expect you to Ramus will bring that device. No, no, no.

41:16So you can spy on you in your room. I'm here. How are you supposed to know where you are somewhere else? This is shameful behavior. Absolutely. How are we supposed to locate you? I apologize. You sound just like my husband who was like, I texted you two and a half hours ago. I'm like, I was it. I was doing other stuff. People get mad now if you don't respond right away. No, not if you train them. They're like, oh, that's Stacy is so weird. That's what they think you're strange. Yeah. Yeah. You put a track and advice on my vehicle. I can't do you have a location tracking on or off on your phone? I shared my location with my kid, but actually. Did your kid share a back? They did for a little bit. And I felt so uncomfortable with it. I was like, I'm going to turn this off unless I just I don't like it. They're in Spain right now, so it doesn't matter. Wow. Don't you want to know though? Like if they I mean, which isn't that exactly why you want tracking is know what's going

42:17on. Well, they're going to tell me, I mean, though, we'll have these conversations. This is so Zen. No, let me know. I am spying on my. I just bought 13 seconds. Is Leah, is Leah have her location turned on? Oh, doctor, 100%. Is she can't go anywhere? She knows. She knows. Not only does she have her location, I gave her a watch too. So when the phone died because she is a teenage girl and the phone's always dying, I still got backup tracking. I don't bother her. I don't quit. Hey, look, one night she was in Brooklyn at clubs somewhere. She's only 19 years old. I found out two days later, she was at some concert that her friend was performing in. I was like, okay, well, you know, you made it back home alive. But I need to know. Last thing somebody's going to come to me and say, which last time you saw your daughter? I look, I check every other day randomly, like, oh, she's a class. She was at the bar. Why are you at the bar? You came to her. You got to know. I don't know why you just that this is different. I can't. I can't. I don't know why you just ask. Do you ask if they're at the bar? Do you are like, what's, what is that conversation look like? What's up with that?

43:17Are you at the bar at like three in the afternoon? So I've lived life. And when I tell her things, she's always saying to me, like, we watch a movie and kids get a fake idea and they go to the bar. She's like, that's impossible. That wouldn't happen. I'm like, why? She's like, when you look old. Now, she's at the point where she is a girl and her friend is a rapper and he's basically performing at bars. The rappers are 18 years old also. So they can't drink, but they can get in. So she's going with her friends and they're not allowed to drink, but they get access to these places. And I'm like, see, there's all kind of random reasons why you would get into a bar. You know what I mean? They put a wristband on you so you can't drink, but you're getting in there because you're an artist and you're part of their performance. So there's all kinds of things going on. But I personally, I only got one. I don't want one kid. If I lose this one, I've registered to be as perfect as I could be. I only got one. I can't. I have a backup. I don't say that was safe. All my eggs in one basket. We made a real nice basket. She knows I'm spying on her. I don't say anything. That is the thing I don't do. I don't say, what are you doing?

44:17Do it? Why are you here? I don't do any of that. Now, my kids in their 30s, I have no, well, I know her Henry is because he told me he's in Sun Valley, but I think what by the way, what you're just saying with his butt? As I said, did you take a private jet there? He said, no, dad, I flew commercial. Stacy, if I may ask, how old is yours now? 20. Wow. Okay, when should I stop? These two are in flies. You're making me feel bad. So I'll be clear though, and I still pay for my kid's cell phone bills. Me too. Yeah. So I think I should really have locations since I'm paying for it, but no. I don't. You gotta let them. You gotta fly Eagles fly, right? Let the bird, let the Stellar's jade ease in that. You gotta let them make their own way. And I think you need to do it without a safety net sometimes too. Like I think it's really important for kids to go out and be truly on their own. It's hard to have with it.

45:18I mean, it is hard, but just knowing where they are, I mean, basically then if something really terrible happens, which is all I'm really worried about at this point in time, right? I'm only worried if like they've been kidnapped or something's terrible. But I can't stop that if I know where it's happening. I just know where they were. You know where to find the body. I just like information. I'm not going to stop. Like I said, I don't stop from doing anything like when she's like I said, randomly until a clock in the morning, I'm like, where are kids at? I go check and she's somewhere. I don't text her next morning. Why were you here? I don't ask any questions. She tells me when she wants to tell me. I just liked the truth is that's not right. I just like the government would like to know what you're doing all the time on the internet. The government doesn't love me or care about me as a human or a person. I just say your kid, your kid deserves that same level of autonomy at a certain point. I'm about to call her an asker on the air. That's what the minute, I would never do that. No, don't do that.

46:18You're making me feel like I need validation right now. I need someone to back me up. Is it okay if I follow you? That's what you need. Hold on, think about what they need. She could say no dad stopped doing it and I could look like a fool on this internet or she could say would you stop? Yeah. Oh, well have that conversation with her in private? No, no, no, no, no. I like pop. That's a whole podcast episode stays here. Jesus, wait. Yes, save that for the podcast. Uncle Leo knows how to act. Oh, I'll put no, no, that's what we are on Apple. That's why that's the only something I'll never leave Apple. I can act harder than by that. That's not me in a shrap. It's not like it has that too by the way now. It ain't the same. It ain't as good. I'm not as good as to drive with Apple boy. You're speeding on the highway. Slow down. Yeah, that's true. So Stacy, would you, you said the book form is okay and that's the new thing. It opens up. It's kind of like an iPad mini, which I really like that form factor. I'm thinking I'm going to like this. I'm going to buy what I haven't gotten to iPhone. I started the iPhone 16 Pro Max. They have give me no reason to upgrade, but I am going to get the four.

47:20Three two or three is reasonable, I think. Every year is too much. Yeah, I went from my, I had three, three years of my, that's about what? Three of the six to the 10 Android. What? I was, I'm going from eight to 11, but you know what? I got the pink line of death and I tried to return it and for, you know, how Google's like you can return it or they, they replace it for you. I went to one of their authorized like fix it places to get a screen replaced and they refuse to do it. They're like, you just have to send it to Google. We're not going to replace this. What? You're an authorized thing. He's like, yeah, but Google doesn't always pay us for it. It's not like perfect. And I don't want to take that risk. So, you know, you're going to have to do Google for sec. I'm not going to do without my phone for like a three weeks or whatever. But it was like, ooh, but it's a way from you now, Stacy. It matches the front and the back now, match. No, no, no, my Android phone was, it was like my eight was green.

48:21No, this is old. A new one's pink. Yeah. This is the old one's. Is it high biscuits? Is that what? Anyway. Okay. That's the funniest thing. The name for people. Yeah. For these things is crazy. It's just the colors. Yeah. That was a great Android event where, oh, it's white. No, no, it's not white. It's white. Why? What are you talking about? It's soothing almond. We spend a lot of time. We don't need to do it on this ship. We spend a lot of time on Macbric weekly talking about Tim Cook's reign, which has just ended after he took the reins when Steve Jobs passed in 2011. So at 15 years of CEO, brought Apple from under a billion, under a trillion dollars to almost five trillion dollars in value, launched a bunch of important products. I think the most important product probably Apple's own chips. Yeah. And then he separated the move from Intel to Apple Silicon. And that has been maybe was accidental. I don't know. But it turned out to be a really good move in the age of AI.

49:25They now make the hottest, the most, they're not hot. That's probably the wrong word, the most popular machines for AI. You can't even get them. John Ternis, unlike, so Tim Cook's specialty was operations. He was the COO. He was the guy who made the iPhone kind of possible in China and really, really tightened that down so that Apple had an incredible supply chain, incredible capabilities to make a billion phones. Ternis comes after he's been a long time employee, I think 25 years at Apple. He is a hardware guy. In fact, he shepherded not only the Apple Silicon, but also the phones. So he knows the products very, very well. Probably a good leader, but also a mystery man. We don't know a lot about John Ternis. We didn't know.

50:25Actually, this might be Apple. We knew a lot about Steve Jobs. We didn't know a lot about Tim Cook at all. No. I don't. We still don't know a lot about Tim Cook. We went from having a co-leader to having a professional manager. He was very, that's a good description. Yes. Professional manager. What's the over under on him going permanently gray? And Ternis? Yeah. I'm going to give it to presidential four years. He is in his 50s. He'll be, he'll be looking like you and Jeff. Hey, he's talking about the stint wish, right? I didn't say there's anything wrong with it. I'm just saying it's common. I'm saying the stress of the big company, that on his shoulders, like he's got that dark and lovely going on right now to the few little grays, but it's, it's going to be, look at that. Look, it caught four years. I'm, I think it is. The president has gone from, from blonde to Brunette. I think this is going to be the year of the Brunettes, don't you? I'm sorry, that's too political. Eddie Q who is longtime Apple and Ways kind of moved up in the chain.

51:29You know, she's sitting right next to John Ternis in the executive profiles. He has a larger portfolio than before, very energetic guy. He's the guy who has the relationships with Hollywood. It's an interesting place. Craig Federiggie is still going to be there. Jaws as well, although many people think those guys may be on, on the way out. A lot of, a lot of Tim Cook's people have retired. There is an Apple smile. Yeah, they all have it, don't they? Yeah. It's probably AI. It's more gummies. I'm not sure it could be, it could be either. I don't know. I'm sorry, I shouldn't say that. That's disrespectful, Leo. Apple is, by the way, in a big fight with open AI, saying, you know, you stole our employees and with it, our intellectual property, open AI says, we don't do that. We just hired the guys. We don't, we're not, meanwhile, open AI is working on hardware. We know.

52:29And this will be a, this will be a court case where we're all going to be watching. It's Johnny I just know less, right? Yeah. Johnny not mentioned in the suit, just the people Johnny hired, which, I know, and go for the last comment on the socials was, well, if you can't keep your secrets, it's not our fault. Oh, that's not the right way to say that. I don't think that judge or jury will take well to that. They were, they had the better plan when they said, we don't want your secrets. We don't need your secrets. We don't need those thinking secrets. That's the better plan. We're training our hiring model on your hiring model. I mean, I'm going to stay with the issue is, I was taking it, who's destroying books? I mean, we're just taking the, well, but it has about to learn a lot about court rooms because the New York Times suit. Yes. It's about, um, filings made Friday in the New York Times suit. This is from the New York Times. So take it with a grain of salt. You'll see watched lawsuit against open AI and Microsoft, including a range of copyright

53:29law and cultural references. The real question, and I think it's an interesting question, is if you have a copy of the New York Times or the Seattle Times or News day who are also suing, if you have in effect ingested that content into your weights in the AI, does that count as an illegal copy? Because it's pretty clear you cannot really generate the contents of the New York Times by asking the AI for it, even no matter what the time says, you really can't. No. So is it illegal for them to have an ineffective copy in the weights? It isn't a copy because it's not even worth it. No, because I think it's a race. It doesn't. It's not held on to. They learn from the relationships of the words. Yeah. The US Justice Department filed a brief saying it is of the national interest, the highest interest in the United States of America for the judge to find open AI did not violate

54:33copyright law. Justice Department argued developing AI is critical to national security and the training AI systems sufficiently transformed the written works to new material allowed under copyright law. And it said, and I think this is really the most important point they're making. The benefits of AI far outweigh any competitive harm. How often do you see the federal Department of Justice enter in a private suit at this stage? That's a good question. It feels like not very often, ever. It may happen all the time. I don't know, but it just seems off. These types of file amicus briefs. But I don't know how long they've entered into a suit or how often. The Trump administration is in a very difficult position because he had elected as a populist president and it's become increasingly obvious. The populists, the poppul, the people do not like AI. They do not like data centers. This is going to be a midterm election hot button topic.

55:37They are very concerned about things like flock cameras. So concerned, I would say is late. Angry about. Angry. That's the populist side. On the other hand, he has massive donors who are big investors in AI, people like Andrews and Horowitz. So he's got pull from two different sides there. Zuck called and I think recently. Yeah. Please don't regulate. Yeah. And we know that Mark's given money to the president. And then there's the third party, which is I think very important also to the White House. The defense and intelligence establishment is you. We know they're using these AI's now. They want them infected in a way. If I read between the lines of the Justice Department brief, that's what they're really saying. They're saying it's important for society. No, it's important for our military. Well, the intelligence. And we're going to fall behind China and it's a strategic risk for the nation.

56:40Trump said AI dominance is critical to promote national security, prosperity and economic mobility for all Americans. Actually, that was a key means. Like, and I asked this, like, when we talk about AI dominance, that just means we have the five or six top AI companies, which we do right now by market cap. Well, that's I'm not just by market cap. I would say by quality of AI, but it's also by quality of models. Yeah, but it's not, but that leads to drinking. Like, it's true. Yeah, but it's shrinking fast. Yes. And to build a quality model, you just need access to lots of data and maybe a breakthrough idea in how you train it, which happens every now and again, we'll be good. And so, by the way, a third thing, a lot of capital because you have to buy a lot of money for your. But if you think about it from that perspective, like capital for servers, the internet,

57:45like the data going in or a breakthrough in like how something is trained, the dominance is going to automatically ebb and flow based on like if China comes up with a way to like power a server using seawater, just for fun, they're we're going to suddenly see like, they will become dominant, right? So I feel like we're always very short-sighted when we start talking about this because we don't think about the components that we're actually trying to be dominant in. And then if you think about what we're caring about, the fact that we like decimated our research funding for lots of things is probably really terrible. So I'm just I'm just thinking about this because this is how I think about the world and see the world. Well, I'll answer on those points. So first of all, if you look at who the leading scientists are in AI, they're almost all Chinese. Many of them working in the United States, but there are most many of them coming from Chinese universities. So I don't think on the innovation scale and the technology scale, we have much of a

58:50lead if any of a lead. The Chinese have worked very fast, very effectively to develop their sustainable energy. They have a much better long-term energy prospects than we do in the United States, where we are still highly reliant on fossil fuels. And in fact, liquid natural gas, which is highly problematic from point to point. And somebody we don't have to mention, it killed off projects on solar and wind. Right. Demonizing them. So and then now capital markets are maybe where the one thing where we really do have an advantage because we have a very vigorous and very well endowed. Yeah, but if you have a net. The markets are fickle, they'll go wherever they see. And in China, they also have the government. Well, they have a controlled economy, a centralized controlled economy. So you kind of don't need the capital markets because you decide where the money goes. And I think everybody agrees, I'm using mostly all the local models I use are Chinese.

59:50I mean, everybody agrees that Chinese models are catching up really rapidly. So I think there is a threat. And by the way, we let's add one more thing. What? Well, hold on, there's one more thing. They don't care so much about intellectual property rights. You're not seeing any lawsuits in China by the New York Times or the Beijing Times or whatever. So they have ample access to the data. They don't, nobody's slow down those. What kind of data they have over there that we don't have over here because we're prissy about, oh, I don't know privacy and individual rights and all that. So to answer your question, Owen, I mean, it really comes down to the quality of the models, right? And they build, oh, there's another thing that we do have an advantage and they don't is the ability to serve those models because we have kept for the most part in videos chips out of the China market. Rich Chess and Wong says it's a huge mistake because we lost, he lost Kuda as a standard the next thing that's happening.

1:00:51And it's already happening is Chinese companies are developing competitive chips. If you use deep seek or GLM or any of the Chinese models on a Chinese server, you're not running it on Nvidia course. You're running it on Chinese chips on Hyundai chips and not Hyundai, Xiaomi and you're running on chips from China and Huawei. Huawei, that's the company I was trying to remember. You're running on Huawei chips and so don't forget, stay see knows her chips. She's a chip guru. Actually, I want to ask her, we'll get to that. We want to actually want to, yeah, want to, but, but, but right now it, the only thing really come to think of it, we have an advantage in it's rapidly fading is in the Nvidia chips is in GPUs. And as you and I discussed on, on, on our chat earlier a day, I think we could have had an advantage out of the academia, but A, we've starved the government to starve them

1:01:53and be the Chinese technologists who are coming over here to study are not coming here now. So we're losing, that's a, that's a brain, a voluntary brain drain on our part. So I understand how the marine government might start to say, gee, you know, we are in this kind of cold war with China and, and we may lose this AI battle. If you think AI is important, especially if you think it's important and militarily and intelligence, that's, that might be scary. So to answer your question, oh, and it's about the quality of the AI, the models, well, their capabilities. Not only are we going to lose, we're, we're not only losing, we're going to lose. This administration is in, nept and incompetent and just saying things out loud doesn't make any sense. You read a quote from the president, you forgot to say, if you don't want to, hey, I didn't say to her, you're back yard, you're poor and back, he did say that. He said, you're going to end up dumb. Yeah, and poor, again, poor, the, the EPA isn't checking the air pollution that they're putting out or the noise pollution.

1:02:54No one's checking on the water when they tell me that water doesn't matter and it doesn't mean anything. Then on top of that, what, they just had that robotics thing where they had like the guys running and racing and one guy could shoot like a thousand baskets in a row and the human, the human oil Olympics, the only three companies from America could even compete with that like MIT and whoever else. But the other 600 other something companies are all Chinese. They're the ones making the robots that are doing the things running at hyper speed and, running into walls, we're not doing any of that stuff. Besides getting fake AI generated stuff from Elon telling me that we're going to have robots run around and he's going to build for us when he can't get the cars right or the spaceships right. So losing what we've already technically lost. We have the intellectual property, but again, like Jeff said, China doesn't have any of the gates holding them back from stealing. That's why I see the whole thing like Nike is like, it's a code. Nike's stock is going down because they found out that reps are real. Do you guys think using the same factories? Now you can go buy them straight from China for $50 instead of $250.

1:03:57Now nobody's buying real Nike's anymore because why would you do that? Do you guys think that bipedal humanoid robots actually are the future? No. Okay, I'm just curious. They certainly are leading in this respect. It gets you to something, right? You're doing it to get to the same reason they put cameras on a barber and said, hey, we want to get, we'll pay you $10,000 for you to cut hair for you and let us scan and copy you cutting hair. So we could teach our robots how to cut hair. At some point, this stuff will matter. Right now, it's all funny games until it's not. Right. So I just signed up for the event at the Aspen Institute. We're there looking at it. You missed the best part. But you cut away. No, not you. No one wants to do that. Nobody wants to see when he ran this in a wall. No, that's not. We just want to see. We want to believe technology works all the time. This is an incident. There we go. That was the one from evolving. Yeah, this is all of the outtakes from the Robotolimics.

1:05:00Now, stay on this one because the robot does a good job climbing up onto the cube and looks kind of human. He's standing at the edge now. He's going to jump off. This is going to be very exciting. He's going to leap from that five foot high cube and land on his head. I shouldn't laugh. I shouldn't laugh. They're keeping track. Do not laugh. Look, look. You wouldn't even believe that was possible. No, it's pretty amazing. In fact, I remember laughing 10, 15 years ago at the DARPA Grand Challenge where they had self-driving vehicles that couldn't go 10 feet. They drive right off the road. After that stage, they drive right off the road. We've come a long way. The Wright brothers only flew 148 feet and they tried it for the plane. They're playing, it wasn't the plane that got us to where we are. Their plane couldn't go 100 feet. My favorite in the humanoid Olympics was the somebody realized you don't have to run

1:06:01if you're a robot the same way humans do. We do our arms like this because it has to do with our hips pivot. They robot ran like this. It was a very into, looked weird and it was very fast. It's a little weird that the slavish adherence to the bipedal form like to make it look like us isn't necessarily the most efficient best way to do this. Yeah, because the dog robot crawled his ass. Sorry. Oh no, I was just going to say you can learn a lot about human mechanics and even like where things might break down. But yeah, I think many of the robots in our lives will not be like us. Sorry, I'm laughing at the robot. I'm not lost. It used to be these videos would scare you. You say it's all creepy and awful. Now you're laughing at them, which is a step forward, I think. Yeah, the previous ones were the dog. Okay, big dog is still a big dog from Boston Dynamics. Still very scary.

1:07:01I can't. I know what? I says buying those. Yeah, yeah, that's really that is terrifying. I think that's the real value to some degree of bipedal robots or robot dogs is their fear factor. How scary they are. Yeah, and make a betrothal. They're armed. Yeah, they're armed. And they're armed and armed. That's right. Yes, especially if they're armed. Anyway, yeah, so I don't know if the humanoid robot games provided much more than just a mere than a merement. So I want to go back to the data centers for a second because it's a great new marketing to an event for the Asperger Institute upcoming next week. And it's really this week. It's really interesting that there's an argument for alternatives to data centers. What if we approach it like public AI, centering public access accountability sustainability, the idea of tiny distributed networks, public owned utilities, the role of librarians,

1:08:02farmers, community advocates. So I think there's an effort to say, okay, we're going to need data centers, but the way that Elon Musk does it with jet engines, ain't the way. Well, I mean, I hate to say it, but we're using a data center right now to record this to stream it. You're watching it. You're watching it from a data center, not from anywhere. Well, you've downloaded it, but you downloaded it from a data center. The entire internet is data centers. Your bank is in data centers. You need to price in the externalities of the harms of a data center. I mean, I've covered data centers for what, two decades. Hey, just like that guy who covered the Microsoft Steve lore, I'm like the Steve lore of data centers. Is it that we're just making too many now, all of a sudden? I mean, because we've always needed data centers, right? I mean, yes, we are rapidly expanding the amount of compute and that we need for AI, right? That is unquestionable and it is an exponential increase in demand.

1:09:08But we also are doing it under the older economic model of data centers. So if we actually start charging what these things might be worth, one, it would slow down our innovation. So you've got to think about that, but maybe that's what the government does is they put their dollars towards paying for like better innovation. Let's put it that way as opposed to today's market capitalism, which pays for the cheapest innovation, which is worth thinking about, which is why that's why government funding exists is because we want to do things in a way that makes sense and prices in those externalities. We wouldn't have the internet if it were for government funding. Right. Yeah. And it took a little bit of time. I mean, the problem is, the problem is we took technology out of the technology industry or we kept that in, but we added a whole bunch of finance pros. Oh, yeah. The financial crisis and crazy test-free occultus, which I think is the real problem here. You know, they were always there.

1:10:09Like, if you hung out with enough nerds, there's always that there's one or two that you're just like. They're in power now. That's the, but yeah, now they're the bosses. They're not the bosses. They look like they're the bosses, but they've just been given a lot of money. And the guys are like, yeah, you know, this dude believes in aliens. Don't worry about it. He's going to believe in aliens. He's going to deliver this technology. The guy who started excite believed in aliens. Peter feels kind of a boss. Peter Teal just just took over a state in Germany. Peter Teal's kind of like trying to run half the globe. Like, all right, we got to take a break. I want to come back and find out what that took over a state in Germany. That's an interesting thing to say. We're going to take a break and find out what that all means. We're talking, we're talking, tweet here with Stacey Hig and Batham from Consumer Reports Policy Fellow. It's so great to see you again. Stacey's book club is a regular feature of our club. I hope you're a club member. You can go to the next book club. I think the voting is still going on. Anthony, if you're there, I know you are, give me a link to the poll so we can see what's

1:11:12going on with the. It's the, there is no anti-mimetic division. It's going to be that. Okay. That's actually great. Great book. I've read that book. I've read it five far like a one, like a landslide. Nice. 82% of the vote. Oh, our public should be so clear as Stacy's book club. Who is quantum? QNTM. Is that a human? Is it a robot? It is a robot. It's a person. They have an actual name. I don't remember what it is now, but. It's a very interesting book. I'm glad we're going to read that. That'll be fun. Yes. We went with a slight horror theme for that. That was our, it's Halloween for gas. I assume we'll do it. Oh my gosh. Already. Yeah. I mean, public and spice time, man. It's here. Oh, no, don't do PSLs. It's matcha. Matcha. No, but you're a spice matcha. No, no, no, no. Public spice is no longer like the reigning flavor king.

1:12:13Matcha is the main flavor king. I never had it. I never had a public size. Now that it's not hip anymore, Jeff, you and I can have it. I think I'm going to have one now. Have you ever had pumpkin pie? Well, yeah, but I never had a spunk pumpkin pie. It's the same spices in a latte with a lot of sugar. It doesn't have to do a pumpkin, by the way. I must say. Never saw pumpkin in its life. No, no. It's all spice, mostly, right? Yeah. It's all spice, clove, cinnamon, nutmeg. That's good stuff. Yeah, it's delicious. Chice good too. Also with this Owen, JJ Stone, we call him Odocta. I still don't remember why, but I'm sure it's a reason. But so real quick, Stacy, you get you lucked out on this because she doesn't think it's your fault. I texted my daughter and I said, you care that I randomly check your location. Leah said to Uncle Leah, who else is going to come and save me? Yes. My, my, I didn't think it's you. She thinks, you think Leo asks that you're off the hook.

1:13:15I'm still a lot of randomly checking. So she finds another man in her life to come and take care of. Who's going to rescue you? He'll be. Isn't that nice? You this the night in shining armor for. Well, I'm glad you checked with her. That's, that's good. That's the right way to do it. I never even thought to ask him, like, hey, look, I still pay the bills. You got a phone because of me. I asked. After this thing off up in here, don't let me ask no questions. Stacy got me feel guilty. Also, Jeff Jarvis is with us. You will see him as a regular feature on intelligent machines. And we're so glad to get you on a weekend. I'm glad always to be on the, on the big kids table, to big kids tables. What do you call it? I showed it a brought to you by my mattress, Helix sleep, love in the Helix sleep. Every night when I get in a bed, I, do you do this? If you don't, you need a Helix sleep. I get in a bed. I go, it's just, ah, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, ah, it just lets all the trouble of the day goes, ah, just, you relax.

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1:15:19our mattress, same mattress about eight years. We thought it's time for a new one. I think you're supposed to get a new one every eight or ten years. So we've shopped around. We looked, we read all the reviews. One of the things we liked about Helix among many, they have over 20 mattresses. One to fit every sleep style, every sleep preference. And they make it easy to figure out which you are because you can take the Helix sleep quiz. We did. It matches you with the perfect mattress based on, you know, are your front sleepers, side sleepers, back sleepers? Do you like firm, do you like soft? You mean there's a lot of possibilities to take the quiz, choose the mattress. And by the way, they're happy with Helix guaranteeing means that if it's not exactly the right mattress, you can get a new one. Easy, seamless returns and exchanges on that happy with Helix guarantee. So it's a risk-free customer first experience. I think it's really worth getting the right mattress. It's worth taking the time to just get that right mattress.

1:16:20It worked for us. In fact, it worked so well. I'm getting more deep sleep. I'm sleeping longer. And most importantly, I'm feeling better in the morning. But Helix actually did a Wesper sleep study where they measured participant sleep performance after doing what we did, switching from an old mattress to a new Helix mattress. They found 82% of participants saw an increase in their deep sleep cycle. That's the most important one where the brain gets cleaned out. You know, this cerebral spinal fluid comes up. The brain dilates because it washes it out. It's, you know, usually not more than half an hour and hour and a half, but it's the critical cycle. Participants on average achieved 25 more minutes of deep sleep per night. For me, it was, that was what I got. It was doubling my average. They also participants on average achieved 39 more minutes of overall sleep per night. And it's pretty subjective, but I could tell you I feel so great when I get up in the morning. I love it. Time and time again, Helix sleep has been named the most awarded mattress brand tested and

1:17:20reviewed by experts like Forbes and Whyard, you can read their reviews right there. They deliver that mattress right to your door with free shipping in the US. And of course, that great, happy with Helix guarantee. So you know, you'll be completely satisfied with your new mattress. Go to helix sleep.com slash twit 27% off site wide during labor day, the best of web offer. That's helix sleep.com slash twit 27% off site wide exclusively for listeners of this weekend tech. Now make sure you do enter our show name after check out this weekend. So they know we sent you. And this offer ends September 13th. So don't wait. If you're listening after the sale ends, don't worry. The boys got great deals. Check them out helix sleep.com slash twit. Thank you, helix for my mattress and for a great night sleep and for sponsoring our show. When I was a kid, my grandfather used to tell me something. I'll never forget. I tell people time. Three things you don't see bad on tires, your shoes and your bed.

1:18:23That's so true. You got to be bright. They got to be good and the bed and great thing. You spend more time on your bed than you do on your tires or your shoes. You do. And if you don't have not as much time as eating pumpkin pie. I've never had pumpkin pie in my life. What? You're out of America. Okay. Wait a minute. No, I know why because you like sweet potato pie. Yes. Yes. I literally ask when I go places, what is that? I want because it's a good, confusing thing. They look the same. They're both orange, but they don't not taste the same. They almost smell the same. And I've been, I'm big. So I'm big. So I got to take the sniff test. I'm like this ain't right. I just refuse to do it. There is nothing like a good sweet potato pie. I grew up my grandmother making 30, 40 pies with a church and everybody in town. And I'm not going back. I've never, ever, ever done it. So I've never had a pumpkin pie. Shame on pumpkin pies and that picture is blasphemous, burn it from the internet.

1:19:24Maybe we're eating sweet potato pie. You don't know. That's true. That's true. It says pumpkin pie on the side. I was about to say, didn't the sign say pumpkin pie eating pumpkin pie? It could be a lie. It's AI. I think it does not read. You can't trust that. You know, it's true. It's true. We're cream on a sweet potato pie. Oh, yeah. You're doing pumpkin. I, for Thanksgiving, when you're made Owens, a secret macaroni and cheese recipe. And it was Dino might. Yeah. Okay. So good. In fact, season is coming to pass on the Leo. It's time once again, macaroni and cheese is turkey and pies. Oh, I think this is where the Stacy gets hungry and goes off to get a cookie. I'm like, I'm gonna eat you guys. I'm gonna eat waffles during the show. She would go sneak off and get a cookie or a waffle. Okay. Let's see. What else is going on? Meta accepts US safety rules, but says, but the rest of you guys and the rest of the world, could you just chill a little bit as governments consider banning social media

1:20:25for under 16s, rest of world rights? Meta is turning to influencers to argue that parental controls are a better solution. Now I am not an influencer and nobody from Meta has ever talked to me, but I kind of agree the parents should be in charge. Well, so we still have alcohol limits and laws. We have anti-smoking laws. We have laws plus parental control for lots of things that provided documented harm to people whose brains are not done developing. I'll tell you the big difference. Okay. Hit me with your big difference. When you go into a store to buy liquor or cigarettes and you show me your ID, that's one thing. But in order for these laws to be to take effect worldwide or even in the United States or a state by state, every single person who uses that has to provide an ID over the internet where it may be stored and misused in other ways. It is a very different thing to do.

1:21:28We don't have to do it that way. Oh, okay. This gets to me because we have, we keep choosing wrong from a technology perspective. And the reason we do it is because companies don't want to be held liable. They don't want to be part of it. But if you had Apple or Google or Samsung or whoever owned your device locally, understand your age and check for you there, then it is a local check. And NIST actually had built a framework. The national institute for standards and technology. Yes, sorry. Those guys, real, nervous. Yeah. Now that she's a bureaucrat, she just speaks. I know. NIST was always my favorite agency. I love NIST. Yes. I'm sure you all are all surprised to hear that. Anyway. They, like, so there are ways to do it. But what we've got is this stupid, stupid, stupid thing where we're like, yeah, let's show a really important government document over the internet and let some company that

1:22:29we've never heard of before store it for us in a way that we can't check to make sure it's secure. Oh, my God. If we scroll down a couple stories, it's not. So I agree with you. Age verification is terrible and wrong and we should not be doing it on the internet for a bunch of reasons. But we didn't have to do it the way that we're currently doing it is all my point is. And now we're going to have to argue over this. It's met it. Well, it's a couple things about this. One is that net uh, is $17 billion over 10 years isn't a lot of money when you adjust for stock prices and acquisitions and such. Second, it's a case now about a regulatory capture trying to impose this view on others. And I read a Q&A with with Julia Anguin and Stephanie Keller, Stephanie's at Stanford on respect to greatly. And she said, now she fears that it's going to become a standard without any data, without any testing. And if others come up with better means to manage this, they're not going to be able to

1:23:31because they're going to be expected to follow this model out of the settlement. What does it want Apple to do this? I thought Meta wanted the platforms to do what Stacy was talking about, not make Meta do. Yeah, I'm talking about the two hours a day and all that stuff. Yeah, he's talking more about the rules. Yeah, I agree. I look at the regulatory capture potential here and it's so explain regulatory capture so we. It's basically like when a company gets to make the rules and they control their agency. So the telcos and the FCC is a great example. And they get to write whatever they want is their regulation. That's how we got shaken stirred, which is not a great. Yeah. Maybe they'll make it better this next round. Hasn't that worked? Are you kidding me? Do we get spam calls still? Oh, wait a minute. Okay. It's like, wait, wait. Oh, wait a minute. That was, I mean, in principle, that seemed like a good idea. The idea that you couldn't use a phone number unless you authenticated it from your carrier.

1:24:32Like you really were a real person, not a fake number. The reason it didn't work is because they blew the attestation part on that. There were other bottles in place, but you know what? They're fixing it possibly. Really? I'm filing comments with the FCC on Tuesday about part of this process. So whose fault was that? Was that the FCC's fault or the... It was bad legislation. So the rules that... On the surface of it seemed like a good idea. The surface, everything's a good idea. The devil's always in the details. I mean, that's why people... I say that because I was an advocate for shaken stirred. And you were... It was not a terrible, crazy plan. It did put a lot of power into... It let the carriers off the hook. And it gave a lot... The loopholes were so big you could drive. I don't know how many scam calls people get a day. A billion scam calls a day through it. Yeah, it's clear it hasn't worked. Yeah. More fax machine policies, it seems like to me. And the idea was...

1:25:32I know, I think that's what you did that. That a carrier couldn't get... Couldn't operate in the United States unless they set up an authentication system that would say, yes, this person is a subscriber with this phone number. And that authentication was provable on the other end. And the receiving company, that was one of them was shaking them all with them stir. They would say, oh, yes, okay, authenticated. We're going to let that one through. And of course, spammers in order for them to do what their dirty work don't use... That's why it's always coming from your area code and sometimes even if you're a neighborhood because they fake the numbers. And shaken stirred would stop that, right? But it didn't. And that's what puzzles me. So it... Okay, you really want to do this? Give me the next... Next to me chips. Give me the 30,000 foot if you can. I mean, I'm going to... So the administration did slowly cut off phone companies that didn't agree to this. And by now, I think they've cut off everybody that didn't agree to it, right?

1:26:32So part of the issue is... All right, with shaken stir, they created this like three tiered system where you could authenticate yourself as like a legitimate provider with a carrier using... It was like A, B, and C attestations. And if you were like the strongest level of sort of like... You were totally like the carrier has done business with you with... For years, they know who you are. That's like the highest level. What happened? Your calls would always go through. The second two tiers were a little bit more dodgy. Like maybe they don't know you so well, but you seem to be legit. They... You seem okay to me. And then there's like, you just started up yesterday, you're based in Cambodia. I don't know about you. That I think it was the middle tier is where it got... The carriers have discretion in letting those middle tier calls through. And what happened is they make money.

1:27:34That's the real problem, isn't it? But they make money and they make calls these... So the attestation, you know, they're like, well, let's just... I think it's totally legit. Yeah, that's really the problem is if they're making money on these, they're not incentive to make it work. And the FCC has to really put down the hammer. And the FCC is in the pockets of the... We just don't have to afford anymore. This is the regulatory capture part. So they were allowed to do this because, you know... Yeah. Anyway, okay, so meta and regulatory capture. So yeah, what is the analogy here? A couple of things. One is that that meta pays less money if... There's more money, forget it, which... If the government convinces the other major social platforms to all... Oh, in this settlement that metamate, which is very weird. They said, we're gonna pay $18 billion over 10 years. Not much, in other words. And we'll give you another of that $5 billion is dependent on Snapchat

1:28:37and TikTok and YouTube doing the same thing, which is weird, I don't get the logic of that. Why would the... The other major social platforms... They wanted to strong arm those other companies. No, but what companies don't care? There's no prison at the limit there. But then what that does is that sets up the rules here. The two hours a day and all that. And there's a lot of argument here that the time limits are not work. Don't work and could be damaging and don't really address the problem. But now, because of this settlement, not law, not a, you know, adjudicated court law, the settlement now this becomes the fact though the standard for protecting children with no data whatsoever is this gonna do a damn thing. And now Meta's going out and paying influencers to advocate. Well, it isn't paying influencers to have me. My God. I know, where's my influencer money? Oh, nobody listens to me. That's the problem. Yeah, and we have told you just before, you're not done in a business the right way when it comes to the way.

1:29:38But it's all your soleo. It's always amusing to me when they talk about protecting kids when there's so many helicopter parents that are not helicopter parents, they just want to shove an iPad in their kids face and say, go on and go to that. Isn't that part of the problem? You see that everywhere. And every week there's a video like, oh, Billy ordered a dirt bike. How did Billy ordered a dirt bike? I saw you long, Amazon. I mean, I trust all the money. I was like, what, you don't have somebody regulate that you gave them the device and you didn't lock it up. And this is something I'm not talking about. Old people and fashion is against, but there's so many hip and current parents that don't know any better. I brought this to you about a billion times later. We talked about it. My daughter's phone is blinging in the middle of the night and she was like in the eighth grade, ninth grade. She's had a phone since she was six. But anyway, her phone starts going off and I'm like, who is messaging her? And her friend got a phone for Christmas. She's 12 years old, two o'clock in the morning on Snapchat just sending off snaps and she was getting waking up late for school when I tore her down like, yo, she's on the phone. No, she's not, I'm trying to, she's like, dude, she sent him a daughter message as a 2 a.m.

1:30:38That's why she's not waking up for school because he was complaining about her not waking up for school. He's like, I'm checking her phone. There's no text messages. I'm like, she's not in the text. She's on the set. He didn't know. He didn't understand it. He did not understand. So it's like, you can't tell, I mean, not to you can't. It's just hard to regulate something when the parents aren't even regulating the children themselves when they just want to give a kid a device so that they leave them alone for 10 minutes a day. Well, that's why I kind of like the idea of the burden being on the platforms and the phone manufacturers, Apple is, I think, stepped up. They're doing better at parental controls. People are like, either a woman made a video in viral that it said, oh, is there using the FaceTime group chap thing? And it said, this conversation might be harmful. I don't know what the kid said that triggered that. But since they had like child parental things on there, it turned off the call. And the woman's like, welcome, Apple's listening to it on my thing. You don't want them sending nudes and all this all kind of stuff like they're checking things because you said it was a child using the device. So again, you're asking for things

1:31:40and people complain about them is such a beauty. But Apple probably, at every company that deals with customers knows that. They know that this is going to be a problem. But they're customers. Also, Jeff Kossoff, you remember who wrote the 26 words that made the internet or was it 25 or was it 27? I think I've already. We're talking about section 230. So don't talk about section 230. Jeff, Jeff wrote the prophet. You really want to get into this? He just quoting, just posted on law fair about the first amendment problems with the meta service. There had been cases about children have first and then writes too. Well, that's why remember we talked about my, you weren't here, but we talked about this last week of the week before. That's why the attorneys were going after meta. We're smart to say it's a product liability case. It's not about speech, but it still has implications for speech. Well, I agree. But the jury didn't agree in the case in the LA case. And apparently meta thought that they were going to have the same problem with these, with this most recent case because they settled shortly after the trial began. And that tells me they felt like it's not going to go well.

1:32:44In any event, $18 billion over 10 years is not much for meta. I think they got a good deal. It's another case of getting away with murder, sort of, so to speak. Yeah, Red, they spent $2 billion a year on lawsuits. Yeah. Legal budget. So that's actually higher than the amount they're going to pay in the fine. The lawyers are making that like, man, it's like, you got, I got in the wrong business. That's for sure. How are there. So they're stating these people? How come? Like, where does the money go? How are people starving and how are their homeless people? You just don't agree. We got the wrong priorities. Binds and like, I'm like, I got the money. The thing about the AI that we talked about earlier that I didn't say because I'm just trying not to yell about AI all the time is they say the government needs us to excel and do all these things. Well, you're going to let them IPO for companies that aren't making any money. Like you read the articles and they're like, well, Uber, Uber was making money. None of these guys are making any money. They're about to IPO and put it on the backs of the American people and get rich and get

1:33:47paid out for what? Building a product that the government says we have to lead in and you're going to build on these data centers or wrong people's air and what? It's just a big old scam and I can't stand it. You know, I use it. So don't I'm a hypocrite? I know. I'm one of my agents and foreign people like Angolio. I'm out here editing my videos and doing rational things with my AI. Are you are you doing that? That's cool. Yeah. Yeah. My AI stays in Poland. I haven't fired anybody yet. No. I hired him right away back. I hired him back. Actually, I hired him to do an investigation. And the local AI that I installed screwed up so bad. And here's the post mortem. I said, did I break curmies or does it need a better human running it? And it's it. It's it gave me the whole. This is asterick. Give me the whole thing. The whole post mortem, the breakdown. I preserve the evidence. It might be a you prop. It's it. It is. I thought I was being generous.

1:34:47Is it a me problem? Is it well? No, not really. It could be me. I don't know. Do I trust it? It wouldn't be me. It couldn't be me. Let's take a little pause, a little tidy pause as we continue talking about the week's tech news. And this week in tech with Stacy Hickenbatham from Consumer Reports. Owen J.J. Stone from parts unknown. Yep. I believe probably somewhere close to Philadelphia. I'm just guessing. You're absolutely right. I'm going to black box very close by. I'm on all roads and bridges, which I was in New York City. They got a great mayor up there riding a bicycle around down all time. Don't you like the commie, huh? But you got pretzels and she sticks, man. So, you know, we do that pretzels and she sticks. You do. And probably sweet potato pie if you know where to look. That's right. That's right. That's right. And the catch your Pepe kid, Jeff Jarvis, author of hot type. We're doing the old, what would Google do? I mean, this week in Google Best Hits.

1:35:48Yeah. Catch your Pepe. No, I think we were all into the Chipotle at the time. So I'm about to show you. But while Stacy made Royal Funamy for my catch your Pepe. You're frozen catch your Pepe. I'm going to taste it. It's night. Oh, no. I mean, I'm on my, I'm batching it because the family's going out to see Spider-Man. And I really used to go see comic book movies. So they're just leaving me behind. So see comic book movies. Come on, grandpa. Spider-Man is a comic book movie. Yeah. It's a book. At least it's a comic book movie. Yeah. I mean, you know, movies are out there. Booker any literature attached to it. I mean, you know, you kids learn how to read from Spider-Man. Thank you, Spider-Man. Did you see the Odyssey Leo? Not yet. That's based on a book as well. It's a comic book. That's a comic book. It is. It's true. It was a spoken comic book. It's an audiobook turned into a movie.

1:36:48Yeah. Don't see spoof. No, I haven't seen the Odyssey. Maybe I should go with them. They see Spider-Man and I'll go see the Odyssey. You can't see the Odyssey. It's a comic book. There's pictures and there's a story. It's a poem actually. So you're not allowed to see it. Oh, they got magical beings and witches and you're not allowed to see the Odyssey. That's not. No. Yes, you're only allowed to see reasonable, rational things. How many Spider-Man are there? Just out of curiosity. There's a lot of them. Like 15,000. 15,000? Who's the current Spider-Man? Tom Holland, right? Tom Holland. There's three live actions, but if you go into the Spider-Verse Spider-Man, there's one movie ahead of a bunch of them. Yeah. Spider-Pig. There's probably a Spider-Lio in one universe. Spider-Pig. They did cut Spider-Noir. So Nick Cage's Spider-Noir doesn't get a second season. It didn't get a second season? It's got so many awards lined up nominations for awards and they did not do a season

1:37:51to I hate that. I hate that. I was not a wagon white. Yeah, and it was kind of interesting. Well, you could choose. You could choose Black, White, or Color. You don't got to get canceled. Amazon is ruthless. They are just ruthless. There's throwing money at things and they don't keep things that people want. I don't understand the business model. Not that people want it. Not in that product placement. I mean, it didn't match their metrics. If you view everything as like some sort of return on investment as opposed to creating a cultural or artistic good, boom. Well, I'm just... Spider-Noir, Nick Cage. Yeah. It's worth watching because it's very interesting. Nick Cage is very interesting. Of course, it's going to be very interesting. Oh, no, she knows all about it. Oh, that they cancel it. Oh, I don't know about that. Yeah, yeah. I love it because it's a season to reach her, which is basically again another comic book TV show. Yeah. That was based on a book. Come on. It's an airport book, but it's a book. It's a book. It's a book. I'm lumping now.

1:38:51I'm going to just... I'm going to justify comic books with all books now because Leo's made me angry. I like comic books. I don't like comic book movies. You trust you. You like those Marvel movies? You like all of those? I... They got me young, Uncle Leo. They got me young. When you were... When I was a kid, you know what it was. Back in the day, when you would watch Wonder Woman and she would just twirl like this and they put a star burst in front of her and she would transform you like, oh, this is cool. Now it's so realistic. I'm like, this is everything I dreamed of is when I was reading the comics and I'm trying to imagine flying through space. I can actually see the things that I saw my whole life growing up. And it's pretty cool. I have to content his trash, but it's still nice. See it. It's good stuff. It's real thing. It's like, what about a few... There have been a few that I like. Did you read comic books when you were a kid, Leo? Did you have a childhood? No. He was reading tech journals on the... In fact, I could do it as a kid. I wasn't reading comic books. There's a read in the Katamani Cristo, which is kind of a comic book, but it's with words,

1:39:51not pictures. Yeah. Pictures you draw in your head. Yeah. I mean, it's a serial. Give it together. There are so many literary comic books I have to say that maybe we... Oh, and you were... You know what? Leo, he grew up. There was a comic books. We're not literary. There were comic books. There was Archie and Jughead. It was Superman and Batman. I thought it was a very brief period of biode. Then I regretted all the money I spent on them. Yeah. Because your mom threw them out. And you could have made billions. My grandmother threw away my grandfather's Archie and Jughead comic book collection that was worth $350,000. And she did it after he passed away because she said, those are for kids. I hated the fact that he had them. My aunt went down and went to the basement to go look for them. And she's like, I threw that stuff out of the year after your grandfather passed away. He had one through 50 and prith in condition. She's like, do you know how much money those things were? Nobody wants that kid trash or coloring books. She called them color books. Coloring books. I like your grandma. We're going to take a break.

1:40:51We'll come back with more of your watch. And this week in tech, I showed it. They brought to you by Doppel. As in Doppelganger, your double. AI has made social engineering attacks so much more convincing than ever from fishing emails that are indistinguishable from the real thing. But even worse now, fake websites spin it up in a minute. In personation attempts is becoming more and more difficult to tell what's real from what's not what's designed to deceive you. That's why organizations need more than a collection of point solutions. They need a unified approach to stopping attacks before they reach your people. That's why you need Doppel. Doppel is an AI native social engineering defense platform. Doppel strengthens human risk management by training employees to recognize deception. It provides digital risk protection across every channel and delivers a gender-email security that doesn't just score the inbox, but takes down the attacker infrastructure behind

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1:42:57So it's so easy. It works alongside your existing security stack. Join hundreds of companies already using Doppel to protect their brand and people from social engineering attacks. Doppel, outpacing what's next in social engineering. Learn more at doppel.com. That's D-O-P-P-E-L.com. We thank you so much for your supporting. This week in tech, Amazon. They're going to be a little bit of hot water. FTC is suing them. We'll see what happens. Saying that Amazon has been secretly and systematically overcharging for ads. This might do better because they're not screwing consumers. They're screwing Amazon's advertisers. The FTC did just get against Amazon. They had a settlement against Amazon for screen consumers. So they're not new to this. This is the FTC in 22 state attorneys general. They say Amazon used a secret ad surcharge to drive up prices for ads on its website

1:44:03and app. They were, oh, okay. So he says the chairman of the FTC, Andrew Ferguson, says that these higher advertising prices were passed on to consumers. So it isn't like we skated. According to the complaint, Amazon violated the FTC act in a dozen state laws. That's why 22 state attorneys general are involved. This was a year after Amazon paid to an $1,5 billion for that lawsuit. You mentioned Stacey over a prime subscription practices and canceling Spider-Man noir. In Amazon, second price auctions for ads on its platform. They call it the second price auction. The winning bidder is supposed to pay one cent more than the second highest bidder. The FTC says Amazon's been manipulating those auctions since 2019. Look, they paid 1 penny up to 80% more.

1:45:04Is that one of the articles said? Yes. That's insane. In Amazon's auctions, this is as explained internally by Amazon senior vice president and charge of Amazon ads. This is from the FTC's complaint. In Amazon's auctions, the second price isn't set by an actual bidder. You're not one set ahead of another person, but by Amazon in the form of a quote proxies second price that we calculate. So it's a penny more than what we say the next highest bidder was. The FTC says this is what this is what you're willing to charge. This is what we think you should pay. We'll go with the we think you should think we'll call it an auction. Yeah. How did you get caught? Who read it? Like how does that? Oh, that's a good question. That's what I want to know. Who drives an instant on that? Because that's the markup on that is so insane and greedy. FTC says $20 billion, $20 billion since 2019 over five years because it apparently ended.

1:46:13And Amazon advertising is alone is no bigger than the entire magazine industry. Yeah, that's something people don't think of Amazon as an advertising company, but it really is. That's probably besides from Amazon Web Services. That's probably their number two revenue source is ads. And they're going to find what? $5 billion. Yeah, right. $20 billion that they made. Proper. Everything on the tech, I mean, all of the monetization strategies, but all these tech companies, they're like, oh, I'm going to be an e-commerce platform. Oh, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do that. But they all come back to ads, which is one of their largest or second largest revenue sources. And it's just baffling to me that as consumers, many of us don't have a lot of money to spend on things. I'm just like, when is this going to break? Surely it can't go on forever that reaching our limited supply of dollars is going to

1:47:15be worth as much as these companies are making. But AI's going to keep all that for us, Stacy. And that's why we have to win. Yeah, I really interesting because why would you have agent, if you have agents going out looking for things that you actually need as a consumer, then there's no reason to look for ads. No reason to buy ads if you're a company, you're way better off striking a deal with an agent, like an agent supplier. Or I was just thinking about this because that Alexa, Amazon Alexa AI, the personal shopper, they announced that Alexa would start looking out for like books from authors you've liked historically, things that they know you're looking for basically. And like for Jeff's book, if I just said, hey, Amazon, just let me know when Jeff's book comes out, I like his stuff. His publisher doesn't have to buy an ad. They can just make sure that they update the Alexa API with the fact that Jeff's book's out.

1:48:17And that's just a really interesting kind of switch. That's a good way to do it. Right? That makes sense. Well, it's a question of whether or not companies, a lot of ad companies are now rejiggering to sell to agents. Right. Well, that's the agent. So in Amazon's own PR briefing on this, that's exactly what happens. So they said, so we said that we were going to, we didn't want you to pay more than this, a penny more than the highest bid you beat. So so there's an auction for an ad placement and you bid a dollar and somebody else else spent bet 50 cents and you beat the 50 cents. But Amazon said, but good news, we're not going to charge you a dollar. We're going to charge you 51 cents. That makes sense in principle until they say, but then we realized this is in their own press release that we were under valuing our ads. We could, we didn't charge enough. What is so? And they could have, and they could have set the price for those ads on their own.

1:49:18They were free to just set what the price was instead of lying. Yeah, the issue is saying lie. It's a deceptive ad practice. With real, so it's said, with relevant ads increasingly winning at prices below market value, we began a test a concept called soft reserve prices, a real time minimum value that seeks to better reflect with the actual placement is worse. And that's called setting a price, Amazon, which they go. That's anti capitalism right there. That's we also introduced to we called a hard reserve, which is the minimum a bid must surpassed enter an auction that helps cover our costs. Okay, that's fair. But they, what they did is they use machine learning to figure out what the price was that advertiser was willing to pay. Or auction looks at a combination of which ad is most relevant to the customer and the price, they'd say this out loud and advertiser is willing to pay.

1:50:18Amazon is really the mafia. You know, I, again, I've been hypocrite person, I have Amazon Prime right now, watch Spider-Noir and now they have commercials where I've had it for years now. And they're out in the commercial and I was like, well, you get commercials or you're going to pay extra. And by the way, I immediately paid the extra. They got me. I did not. And I'm not going to, I'm not going to complain about people being criminals and downloading things somewhere else, but I'm just saying, well, I watch it and I suffer through the commercials. I refuse to even touch my phone or walk near my phone. I'm about to start taking the station approach. Now, in fact, when I watch a show, I'm probably my phone in the other room because they love to do the, oh, what did you search on and leave in your cart and put it up on the screen to remind you that you left it in your cart. And I'm not scanning no QR codes. I'm not clicking no buttons, nothing. I'm going to suffer through this minute and 30 seconds of trash or you're trying to spell me and I'm never buying anything that you tried to sell me because I was getting it for free. And now you're charging me and trying to upcharge me. I refuse. And pro tip, if you leave stuff in your cart and don't buy it immediately on your little

1:51:22impulse buy, they come back in three or four days. I was like, would you like this five, 10, 15% coupon? The item in your cart is just dropped by 10%. You dang gum right at the end because I didn't need it. And I'm getting the savings because I have one of your tricks phone and I'm sorry. I think you should do dramatic reading of this Amazon's response to the FDC's lawsuit. I think it would be much more interesting. In Amazon's defense, they consider themselves a data driven company. And what they're really saying what they want to do is have that pricing set by data. But again, they could have done. And then you just say it upfront, this is how much it's going to cost. Yeah. I mean, there was a call in the actual when AdSense started, it was wonderfully counterintuitive. You didn't get the higher position because you paid more, you got the higher position because your ad performed. Yeah. Right? And that's more useful to the users and so they set new rules for how these options operate. And you can set the rules. You can set better.

1:52:23They do say, and this might be persuasive to the court, that the cost of ads, the average winning bid for sponsored products to ads fell 50% over the five year period. Because advertising is being less for their ads, increasingly winning placements with lower bids. So that's they say, and this is this is the critical language. There was no harm to consumers as a result that the advertisers paying less, not more. But in this case, the customer, the FTC is protecting the app. The FTC app doesn't require you to have harm. They don't, oh, but the court might. Okay. Let's see. Don't you have to see if you're going to frantide trust. You've got to have harm. Consort. But this is not an antitrust. This is just a practice. Does you have require harms? Let's see. This is what you call see walk at work. This is straight out of this week in Google.

1:53:24And you know, it's funny. I'm so sorry. When you left, no, when you left Paris came in and she does the same darn thing. There must be the researcher chair or something. You know, the reporter chair, who just blathered with me. Yeah. We don't look up for facts. We just go, well, it seems to me. Well, obviously, I'm a rantorist. I don't know what I've got worried about beautiful facts or scenes in that. All right. Moving right along. It does. It does require some form of injury or risk of harm to you. But it doesn't have to be financial or to the advertiser. Well, in this case, the advertiser is the consumer. Yes. Right. So I tell you, yeah, it doesn't. I'm just a rant. I'm a ranting this week. What got you, Ranting Leal? I might have a counter rant because Owen may agree with this. Bernie Sanders, along with Greg Casar of Texas, calling for a permanent ban on the development and deployment of artificial super intelligence and saying there should be jail time.

1:54:29Individual developers could face up to 20 years in prison for trying to circumvent the ban. It's okay, Leo, because there's not such a thing and never will be such a thing as super intelligence. It's BS. So it's never going to exist. It's the ban artificial super intelligence act. Bossa. When he started reading that Jeffrey, was that you signed? Ben Pinkpony's act. He's saying what can manven me? Oh, well, I love this idea, of course. I knew you would ban it all. I'm all for banning. You know what? And again, I'm wearing a sports footer. Somebody put it in my Google earlier. It says I'm a sports person now. I still love technology because I use it all the time. But I hate when someone buys a team and they want to build a new stadium and taxpayers have to fund the stadium and they say, yeah, all these jobs. Well, guess what? A stadium brings a hell of a lot more jobs than a data center does. And those fans still never get anything. If you want to use my taxpayer dollars, but a stadium, at least everybody in that area should get one free ticket to a game sometime in their lifetime.

1:55:29So they can actually go into that. That's a good point. But you want to go get a data center. You're going to tell me that my pop Mable that just had a 140 acres taken from them are going to front of 40 billion, not let me be realistic, a 40 million dollar tax free exempt for 10 year build on the backs of 20 people working in this data center and bringing in jobs. But this isn't a ban on data centers. We can argue about the ban on data centers. This is a band that would. So the ban artificial super intelligence act would permanently ban the development and deployment of whatever this is, super intelligent AI. I don't know what that is. I don't know if anybody does that. No one knows what it is. That's a made up term. And more to the point, temporarily pause advanced AI development until a federal regulator has established safety rules. It would also direct the US to pursue international agreements to prevent super intelligence from being developed anywhere in the world. I think Bernie Sanders must have seen a movie.

1:56:30Well, that's the problem with the test for all AI boys and their ridiculous dreams. Well, there have been, and I understand this is Sanders responding to this drum beat over the last two months of stories about AI escaping containment. There was another story this week about an AI from open AI hacking a German wiki to create their own AI message board. And I didn't hack it. Didn't they just share messages on it? Maybe, yeah, they didn't hack it. That's where the language is going to be. You just, we really just need to clearly state that these companies are liable for harms, which is something we actually have never literally done. That's a good idea. So why can't I let Stacy run everything? Because when you start using that, it doesn't sound appealing, but it's very concise and simple, but that's what I said about the fact machine thing. Bernie Sanders is not here saying stuff that makes everybody on his panel though, that's

1:57:31not what it is, but we get what you're saying, Kat. That's what I have a question along the slide. If a human being had done what the open AI model did to hugging face, was there anything in this? Yes. A violation of the computer fraud at that. Absolutely. And this is not a case of an outside user using the platform that open AI can control. This is a case of open AI's own model under its own control with negligence. Did this and that? I, as you know, and we talk about this on intelligent machines, I believe AI is a significant major advance in technology is very, very important. Maybe the most significant advance ever since the invention of the personal computer. And I'm all for it. And I think it could be developed reasonably without harming the environment, without harming individuals. But I think it's very important that we continue to work on it. This is just nutty. Let me ask you one serious question, Leo. What in the utopia, if AI could do the grandest thing for humans, what would it do that makes

1:58:37it so viable and useful? It doesn't have to be a, it doesn't have to be curing cancer. It could be taking people like you or sole proprietors and helping you make it so that you can have a website in 15 minutes that's, that's beautiful, practical and effective. Could help you develop your business. Could help you write a marketing plan. It could be. It's even bigger than that. It's just a foundational technology. It could be little things. I think that GPS that allows you to track your kid. So it's, yeah, it's foundational in the sense that like the internet is foundational. GPS is foundational. It is going to be a technology infrastructure that allows things to happen at greater scale. Fast and, based or faster, cheaper, easier. Again, and your wildest dreams, if you could snap your fingers and wish for one thing that it would make or fix or change, what would it be? Like new drugs, new drugs that for work. Yeah, it personalized medicine based on like your actual, you know, we already know

1:59:37how to make cancer drugs that are specific to the cancer of an individual, but it's very, very, very costly. If you could sequence that and do that, that would be done at scale. It could, it could cure cancer in effect. I mean, there's a lot of Mike that hasn't happened yet. We should point out. I'm not, and I'm, that's what I'm trying to get to. It's, so there's a prognot of people that like AI is going to do all the things you're saying. And then there's other people that are like, dude, have you checked the economy in the jobs report? People are losing jobs and saying that AI is going to help me build a website or create my own job. There are no jobs. What am I building a website for? There's no one there to buy the job. So I, you're better off saying what you just said is for the people trying to set like, we can cure cancers or individual things or help think like those things that it could possibly do just sound so far fetched for the average person. That's why they don't want an extra data center in their backyard because like, what do you mean? People are losing their jobs everywhere. How's this going to help me get a job when you're giving them a tax break? I don't understand. And I'm losing water.

2:00:37This is the weird economy we have right now with the sales pitch of how AI is going to help change the world. And so, yeah. And what's happened? Here's our issue. AI is built by and deployed by people. And right now the people who are building it and deploying it are motivated by basically returns to their private investors, not even the public markets. So if you think about it and there's no legal repercussions for them at all, right? They can do whatever they want. So everything that people are mad about, totally valid. I mean, these people are, you're letting like the scumiest people in the world like come into your house and, you know, poop in your neighborhood, basically turn your neighborhood into a cesspool. And legitimately they hate that. So what we need to do is realize that AI is a technology tool. It's not like this magical thing. And we, it's built by people deployed by people.

2:01:40So you have to hold those people accountable to it and build the types of guard rails and incentivize them to build the guard rails needed. And I hate when we start talking about it like this, it's this magical thing. And that's how we used to talk about technology and even things like the internet. And really all it is is a CCHA. It's a technological infrastructure CCHAGE. And we know how to deal with that. And also, we talk about it as if it's human, true, the anthropomorphization is the risk. Leo, if you want to see more nuttyness this week, good line 107 if you would mind. Oh, Jeff, you're up to your old tricks. Yeah, and indeed. Oh, yeah. This is just nuttery. This doesn't really have any other technology at all. Oh, don't give them anything. Please know. Just don't give them any, his Peter Teal already thinks it's a crisis too. Yes. So this is just against talking to Teal. Yeah.

2:02:41The vice president said that AI is satanic. It's not just anthropomorphizing. This is exactly the tension I've been talking about between Trump's populist instincts and Vance's populist instincts, which got him elected. And the fact that the other people that got him elected are Elon Musk and Peter Teal and the people who are promoting AI. And again, this third consistency of the intelligence community, the military industrial complex, all of which won AI. But I don't, this is, to me, this is actually pretty cynical. My guess is that the Trump administration and it's the people who are running the elections said, look, JD, you're going to have, this is what the vice president always says. You're going to have to go out and you're going to have to say something. It's going to, I, you may not agree with it.

2:03:42You may agree, but it doesn't matter. This is to appeal to our base. Now, unfortunately, this story got in the Wall Street Journal, which is exactly what Peter Teals reading. So I don't know if it was effective. The Trump administration officials are wrestling with the spiritual consequences of AI as the president embraces it as an economic engine. It's two. It's two. It's two minutes and one. So it doesn't help either when our media complex does the same thing. The next line is Stephen Levy saying, who cares if AI is conscious, it's basically alive. This is such BS. Stephen Levy knows better. What the heck is he doing? And that's why I keep going. You would think that those people do know better, but they don't. And the way they reference it and the way they talk about it, you're not, you want people to embrace the technology and the people that are pitching it are doing such a terrible job at doing it and explaining why is necessary. I don't want any chat said China's going to eat our lunch.

2:04:43I have a MacBook studio. I don't think it was made in the USA. I pad the camera every day. They're eating our lunch. There's literally a hundred thousand dollars in the room. I don't think there's one thing that was made here. So I mean, what do we talk about when it's like we're going to lose to, you know, I can't get a BYD vehicle over here and I like trying to vehicle this worth a dang because Ford and Elon are blocking real change in technology because they've got us in the chokehold. So it's such a weird economy. The game that we play with all this technology and it's evil. It's this is that. So that's what I can play about. That's why I'm about to cause we're all messed up right now, but we're human. That's what we do. Meanwhile, Nvidia, who makes the hardware for all of this and is doing quite well. They make your money. They're making a billion dollars a day profit, a billion dollars a day profit. So they spent a little less than two weeks profit to buy hugging face. This has been going on for a couple of weeks, but it actually finally happened. Hugging face is started off.

2:05:43By the way, I didn't understand this. So the name hugging face comes from the emoji where you've got a face and there's two hands kind of at the. That's the hugging face emoji. So that's where it comes from. JJ, let's all do what we can get it. So also, so, Brito can get a car. Yeah, everybody do the hugging face. Come on, you can do it. You trying to give me go against our overlords? You trying to give me a trouble? There you go. You're welcome. It's just for the thumbnail. You know that. Don't you own if you're going to get a downloads on YouTube, you got to go, I know the game. You know the game. Anyway, hugging face, which started, I didn't know this is a chat service. And that's where the hugging face came from. I never understood where I thought it was just two of those great stories of a pivot. And they ended up being the kind of the, remember downloads.com and two cows, the places where you'd go to get share where they're basically that for AI models. They've worn three million downloading AI models.

2:06:46Yeah, they're two cows and they're like, they're downloaded.com. And they just sold for $12.9 billion to Nvidia. Congratulations. It's not my business. It's not an investment from Nvidia. It was six months ago at seven billion. Wow. The irony is, it's not like those models don't exist elsewhere. I guess it's sort of like Microsoft buying GitHub for a little bit less money. I guess, but there's nothing. I mean, there are other places you can go to get models. So I don't really, but what I do like is the notion that maybe Nvidia is going to get behind open source or more properly. They have the way. Yeah, I think it would way behind it. And this is where I need your schooling, Leo. And I was trying to get it this morning on chat is the value of the harness I called it a saddle this week. The harness it's a price.

2:07:47It's a bit, it's a saddle. It's spurs and stirrups versus the underlying model and is the underlying model just the steam engine. And is the value going to be in the harnesses and how those operate? And is that kind of where I can face can play is that we're going to help you, it doesn't matter what model you use. It's all interchangeable underneath. But there's an I can't lay above the geek's best answer. It depends. Yeah. Maybe sort of. Well, the harness, which could be like Claude code or codex or any gravity or cursor or the agent I use Hermes or open claw, that's the software that surrounds it. The calls on the AI model and feeds it context gives it information gives it memory and all that stuff in the AI model then gets all of that as a simple string of text characters, tokens that go in and then tokens come out of the AI model and the harness gets that displays it on the screen and you know kind of puts it out in the world action on it.

2:08:51But the model still does a lot more than just simply. Yeah. But Chinko machine, that's what Benino likes to call it. But Chinko machine or a wind chime. It's more than something you put in information and it goes, it comes out. There's the people who build the models are also doing a lot, but you're using the model practically interchangeably. I feel like they're mostly interchangeable. They got more and more similar. They have, you know, people remember when the chat opening I killed chat GBD 40. People were so sad because they had fallen in love. These were their virtual boyfriend and girlfriend and they said you're taking away our loved ones. It was because and open AI kind of fixed it. Open AI had made that model independent of the harness made that model be very personable. And that's in the weights. So you take the model, you train it and then you adjust the weights so that some stuff

2:09:54happens more and some stuff happens less. All of that's the post training and they had post trained it to be very friendly and personable and lovable. And they realized, oh, this is not good. People are getting too over involved with their models. So they actually took a lot of the personality out and that upset people quite a bit. So it is everything. There's more than just the training. There's a lot of post training and reinforcement learning. And it's also the context you put in. You know, every model, when you start it up, you have a file, a text file. You can read it. Most cases it's called sold.md that tells it who it is. You know, what you are a smart, you know, social scientist or you're a great writer or whatever. And that kind of also shapes the outputs because it goes in and the outputs are modified and it goes out, but it shapes what happens. So it's a complicated, it's a very, it's almost a chaotic system. That's part of the problem with it.

2:10:56It's probabilistic, not deterministic. It's hard. Different, you put the same inputs in it. One point and different ones will come out unlike a computer program, which pretty much will always produce the same result given the same input. How can I talk Nvidia into buying America? Because they could buy the lake America, they could buy the Gulf of America, but I don't think America is available. They're making a billion a day. We're 40 trillion a day. We can just buy us. Oh, quick. He could just buy us. By the way, that's why the administration doesn't want to piss off these guys because yes, yes, right? Because it's so insane because again, like all the stuff we're talking about Nvidia is just making money. They're the ones making the money. Forget the fact that like when you're building the data centers, have the time by the time they get built in the two years, the chips are going to be different in that point anyway. And the other companies are going to be wanting to refresh their chips and update them. There, that's the biggest thing with somebody says to China is coming to eat our lunches

2:11:58to like that. Like we talked about earlier, we're forcing China to find their own manufacturing, their own chips that they want to create. And if they get on Nvidia's level, that's when you're really like, oh boy. Because we don't have the materials to build things. We don't have the infrastructure to build the things. But Nvidia could just buy us and fix everything. You're talking, you've been talking Jeff a lot about anthropomorphizing AI. And a number of people have said that this is sort of the problem. One of the consequences is the Bernie Sanders bill. The other one would be the president pulling fable from the marketplace. Getting it more like it's a human or it's acting like a human, then it's a computer program. But you're just saying to Darryl Oki in the chat, it leads to the mysticism we see. This is the strange power. And I was talking to my colleague at Stony Brook. We need new vocabulary for this. It doesn't think it calculates. Well, that's one reason I use the word agent more than artificial intelligence.

2:12:58Because I don't, artificial intelligence is by itself anthropomorphizing it. It's intelligence. It was a marketing term. John McCarthy came up with in 1956, 55 hoping to convince people to the government. It's very hard. I mean, Dorkish Patel in discussing the hugging phase. He highly answered for more. He highly had a point. He talked about AI civilizations rising and falling. And he gave Gary Marcus the material to work with. But I sympathize to the effect that to the limit that it's hard to discuss what these things do without using human verbs. Yes, because it looks like they're thinking. And in fact, I'm not convinced that we do anything that's special. Cut it. We're kind of talking to ourselves. We're kind of tokens in, tokens out based on our context that we've learned over the years of our lives and from our parents and our schooling. And we also have a little bit of, I don't know, is it intuition or something stuck in

2:14:02there at birth? I mean, we're not about sophisticated. How history gets things wrong and the Gutenberg parenthesis I wrote about this. And the argument in that book, which is a fascinating book, is that the theory of mind is BS. Yes. That we don't really have this diagram of structure that instead we, it's more like we have it. And this is my phrasing, a whole bunch of videotapes on our head. Well, what did I do last time I did this? Oh, I did that stupid thing. Okay, I'll do it again. Right? Because that's what I did before. And we have ruts that were in rather than exactly. Exactly. In 1978. And why did you brought that up? Because I was going to break up our theory of mind. So good job, Chef. I was facing, I think you'd like to book a lot of how history gets things wrong. I'll check it out. Classic. In 1978, I took, I took the, it should have been a comic book. It would have been a better comic book, but, you know, oh, no, you can't have everything. It's a lot, it was a lot harder to read. I have to take my time on this.

2:15:02A lot of words, no pictures, words, words, rats, experiments, all kinds of things. In 1978, I took something called the S training, which was at the time, you know, that was this human potential movement. There are some in our training. Air heart seminar training. In the examiner, I was mocking it, but keep going. Everybody mocked it. Yeah. There they are. They don't let you pee. It's two weekends. It's very intense. There's a lot of stuff. And towards the end, something happens and you're supposed to do it. And this is the phrase they use. Get it. And then, so you're at that point, there's a trainer leading this. There's 200, 300 people in the room. You're all supposed to be getting it. And I'm looking, I don't really get it. Oh my God, this is the landmark guy. Yes. This is a cult. Well, it was cult like it was cult like it's a cult. It's a cult. No, no, it wasn't a cult. In the sense that I didn't keep coming at me for money and I had to go to a special place. Oh, but there were, though, there were, but there were particularly loyal.

2:16:05Oh, there were some people. Oh, God, it's with that. I've had it very valuable. You know, I was 21. It was something very valuable. But, Rizmah, that's how old you were at the time. I want to do this. I was 21. And it changed my life. You got a way. And how I, how I, how I thought about things in many ways. But recently I got it. I realized how many years later, 50 years later, that what they were really saying is we, and this, it was actually explicit. I just wasn't paying attention. We're just robots. We are just act, just as you just said, Jeff, we're just playing back the tapes in our head of previous actions. Why we keep doing the same stupid things over and over again. We keep making mistakes and go, why don't I do that again? Because we're essentially automotons in many, many ways. And the point of the S training was to understand that so that you know, you can kind of break out of the loop.

2:17:06Therapy is probably, good therapy is probably a better way to tackle. It's like therapy, but it's very similar, right? The idea was, well, why would we could do this in two intensive weekends? But you're right. I mean, it's very similar to therapy. And it's, it's not inconsistent with therapy as well. I mean, I've done a lot of therapy too. But and that's, that's, and that's the same thing we do with technology. Because people think they're being rational, but they're just reacting to things. And they're like, no, this is totally rational. And you're like, is it though? Why do they keep putting money in a slot machine? Yeah. And the same thing with AI, we keep thinking that this is based on data. This is data driven. This has no agenda, but it, it absolutely does. No, it's just feeding back to us or old. Yeah. It's us. Or the creators biases and what we want to see. Right. I think I'm a higher being than what you guys are saying. I have freedom of choice and free will. My favorite other story to tell people is, I had a friend in high school. His dad was a drunk cat, two sons.

2:18:06One son grew up to be a drunk. The other one never drank any alcohol. The one says, oh, I have to drink our dad was an alcoholic. And the other one says, I'm never going to drink. So that was not called those two kids made choices in life. But there's also genes involved. But well, and my, my response to that would be, yes, they made choices. They may have been different choices, but they made choices in an automaton response to the stimulus. There were different choices, but it wasn't because they used free will. It was because they were triggered by that initial experience. And that's why we have therapy because this is a free will or is it like a gene thing? Is it genetics? Imagine that leaping just supposed to be. I'm not, I believe it free will. I think we have free will. Yeah, we have free will. I guess the ideas did they make a considered decision or did his videotape of his dad's drunk and behavior make him work one way or the other as opposed to saying, my dad was a drunk. It caused me the following. Right. I don't drink, but my dad was not a drunk. So I take opioids and I get constipated.

2:19:09Other people take opioids and it changes their life. Right? Because there's a different receptor in there's genetic differences in us. And if I die, if I die, I'm going to wear all the chatbots. And this is a chatbot conversation you are in trouble. That's all right. All right. You're watching. I don't know how we got very philosophical here. This is good because we have deep thinkers on the show today, including Owen J. J. Stone, who does believe in free will. I do. I do believe in free will. Oh, look, he's got so flaky. You can't even get that anymore in the Colombrian flavor to Uncle Leo when my cousin puts out a product. I said to myself, let me put these in the free. They might be worth money. One day, I think they will be the original. I waste like the Archie comic books to my grandmother's don't drive. Not me. They have one thing in common with those Archie comic books. No one's making those anymore. I told you they were there. I never tell you a lot. I didn't finish the story. Steve Gibson's wife called the people who made it and said, would you make me some more?

2:20:11No. And they said, no, we can't make some more. It's Salt Hanks. And she said, well, if I get Salt Hanks to say so, can you make me some more? They said, well, okay. So she calls me. I call Salt Hanks. Salt Hanks says calls the lady said, yeah, you can make some for her. So she made 20 more bottles. And I said, you're kidding me. I said, no. That's nice. That's it. Don't you be calling me, Owen J.J. Stone. You want to preserve the rarity of those. That's right. That's for those who are involved. I think I would have let that story just die and death. Now they're coming after you. All right. Now you've opened up a door. I should explain for those who don't know we're talking about Salt Hanks is my son. Well, I'm very happy to say both on the CBS this morning on Saturday and in the Wall Street Journal at the very top. They say Henry Laporte known as Salt Hanks. So at least the family name gets mentioned once. I like it that he didn't use my name at all, right? And just nobody knows these related to me. Anyway, he's very successful.

2:21:13Got a restaurant in New York. Was at the US Open Tennis Tournament. Salt half a million dollars for the sandwiches in five days. They were doing two thousand sandwiches a day. So he was very happy. Maybe I'll run him to New York and get an assignment my OG canisters. I actually he has now sold the name in the brand to wonder. Mark Loer's company and but he's going to continue on and they're going to keep the original store and everything. So I'm going out in a couple of weeks. I'm going to finally go out because I've never had one of his sandwiches. But you're not on that. Are you on the GLP's and that kind of stuff that you kind of can't eat it? Enjoy it. I can't eat it. I may not enjoy it. No, I'll enjoy it. I just won't eat all of it. All of it. But it's a lot anyway. It's a lot. Yeah, it's very rich. I bet it is. I think I might have one bite and go well, that's delicious. That's probably all I can.

2:22:13I'll eat the rest. I love it. I've got French to it. Oh, it's the best French to be ever had. It's a pair of said I stood in line and went there. It's incredible. We didn't use our cloud to get it in earlier or anything. We stood in line like I will. I will. I will use my cloud. I'm showing off how I hangs my clouds and everybody. Who's this guy? He told me I said, because Wesley Fockter was going and I said, I texted him. I said, how do I get Wesley in? He said, don't bother me. He said, I just tell them at the front, they've been told they've been warned. If somebody says, oh, I shouldn't say this out loud. No, it's a secret word and you don't know what people say. Tell me off air until I get there. I need to think. Whoops. I'm going to get my friend into the piece. Real it in. I can't very close. Now everybody's going to want sandwiches and salt to give it away to the secret word. It's almost like you haven't done 1100 shows to not know how to act. I have no, I'm telling you, we're just automotons. We're machines, my friend. Have it learned anything. I have learned nothing.

2:23:14That's why he doesn't do it in the name. He can't keep it. You're fired. I am. Fire me. I am. That's what Astra said, too. I said, Astra. What happened? You shouldn't have done that. I shouldn't have done that. I'm not kidding. The final thing is don't do it that way anymore. It says, require useful progress after 10 minutes. Give coding, test a focus session. Reconcid to the settings. I would not repeat this unrestricted high reasoning setup. Okay. Fine. I'm not doing it. Too long of a leash model serves you right. Real then. Real then. The assignment was substantial enough to require care, but entirely reasonable. Managing that complexity was the agent's responsibility. Oh, thank you. At the end, after saying all the things I shouldn't have done, it was the agent's fall. You know what? That's casting shade on your coworker.

2:24:15Knock it off. Yeah. This is a tweet. We could tech. We're glad you're here. Thank you for watching. Have a happy Labor Day, everybody. CyberCab launched. Woo! Did you see all the celebrations, all the excitement on September 4th? Oh, it's very cool. Oh, God. Why wasn't you on the side? A video about people in the wheelchair. It's very quiet. And it's already under investigation. That should be. This is Elon's Tesla that has no steering wheel and no pedals. The government says, unlike Zooks, remember Zooks, the one in Las Vegas with no steering wheel, no test. Did you end up running in one? I didn't get to. I couldn't. They were always booked up. They're very popular. They went to the National Highway Transportation and Safety Administration. They said, can we do this? They went through all the hoops. They did all the things and they got permission. That's not Elon's way. So he just started picking up people in Austin two days ago.

2:25:19You know, I'm not going to put my life in his hands in that vehicle. But the problem is it's not my choice. That thing can run me over. Right. Stacey, he rolls up in a wheelchair. Then stands and puts the wheelchair in the trunk. Was this made with AI? What is going on? Where is that? I got to find that. It's this commercial grade. It did the crutches. The guy has the crutches. I've never seen it before. I just Googled it. And I'm like, wait a minute. I'm trying to listen to Leo and look at it. I'm like, wait a second. Did you put it in the, no, I just scored it. I went. I went. I went. I went to the discord. If you would, they gave me a link. I'm watching on Facebook. I'm really, I'm really curious to see this. Larry in our discord went to the US Open and Had a Salt Hank. But he's already had one before. Wasn't this first time? I'm on five in the Squarish on YouTube. Oh, I keep finding it on. Oh, I could find it. It's called a Google search Tesla, Robo, taxi, commercial.

2:26:19Just do cyber cab wheelchair. I bet it pops right up. Oh, yeah. There you go. Cyber cab wheelchair. So this was put out by Tesla. This is why I'm so this is put out by them. They filmed it at their local factory, I guess. Okay. Here it is. It's on, it's on their ex account. There we go. So he rolls up. Okay. Yeah, or goes up and crutches, whatever. Yep. Put everything in the trunk. Walks around. Walks around to the people. What's the luggage? Put the wheelchair in there. He's standing there. I want to stand and putting his walks around in the front. Gets in. Nope. You don't see them walk around. We just see the driver there, though, to put the wheelchair in the trunk. So he opened the trunk. Yes. All the, what? What? This is this is great. You're like, hey, what if I'm going to wheelchair and they show you this? And you're like, wait, so what if I'm in a wheelchair? I got to, I got to tell you, this is definitely generated by AI, right? I was like, AI commercial. This is AI for sure. Like the color because, because first of all, he rolls up in a wheelchair.

2:27:22Then he walks up with luggage. Then he walks up with crutches. That's the logic of AI. If I had to crutches, I would just put them in the front, see with me, because it's so open and there's no brakes or steering wheel or anything like that. I could just take the crutches with me. But why is he unlike the Zooks? It has a front seat in a back seat. If there's no front or, there's no steering wheel or pedals. Why make it look like an automobile? Oh, because it is an automobile. They just took the pedals and the brakes out. Nitz is investigating because literally hours after the automaker shipped, they are updating their standards to make it easier and faster for driverless cars to deploy, but you still got to go to them. Anything should be regulated in technology. This is it. Should be regulated. Yes. Tesla says it doesn't need an exemption because the vehicles comply with all existing safety standards. Okay, but it doesn't have a break.

2:28:24I think that's a safety standard. I might be wrong. And they don't even use LiDAR. They're just using cameras, I believe. They don't even have the full range of the technology. That's what bothers me. And I'm, it just, again, this dude, because Uncle Festress is buddy, just feels like I can just go do whatever I want to do and push it through. No, you can't. This makes no sense. And what if I can stuck in this car or something happens? Like, I'm not really too worried about it like running over someone even at his possibility. But just the fact that like if something goes wrong and malfunctions, I have no way of physically turning to a wheel to help myself. Like, that would freak me out. So they're doing what they call an audit query to examine the data and process, Tesla used to make the determination that they don't need to get an exemption. They kind of want you to do that. They kind of want you to apply and explain. No, well, I'm not going to trust. It needs to be reports. Yeah. CR needs to get in on this. Yeah. I know people complain about Waymo and like when things go wrong or something like that,

2:29:30you know, it would drove you out of town or they got stuck in traffic in front of each other. At least there was still a wheel and a brake. Like, there's something there that could, I could get to. You know what I mean? Like my boyfriend's like, oh, you sitting back with a plane and you don't have a steering wheel or, yeah, but there's also a co-pilot and then a backup pilot. I like it. We don't need safety standards. We don't even have drivers. Why don't we need safety standards for? Yeah. Well, okay. And then Ray Kurzweil, actually, before we do that, let me just do one little plug for ClubTwit because I want to thank all of our fabulous ClubTwit members who make this show possible. You know who you are. Ten bucks a month and you got, I think, some benefit out of that. I hope you do. You get ad free versions of all the shows. You wouldn't even hear this begging commercial. You also get chapter markers in all the shows so you can jump around if you want. You get access to the wonderful ClubTwit Discord, which is a great place to hang out with smart people, not just talking about the shows, but talking about everything Geeks care

2:30:30about. No, we also do some special podcasts, but I don't think we're going to do Salthank this week in Salt. Although, Hank really, from day one, he said, I'm taking over Twit when you're done. I'm taking it over. So it may be, this is, I don't know if we're going to put Salt on our pumpkin pie, but it may be, I guess, a pumpkin. Snacks. Yeah. Snacks. Absolutely. This is the kind of thing that's from the Club. You also get lots of special programming stasis book club as a perfect example, our photography group, our AI user group, which we do twice a week, twice a month rather now. And we cannot do the Apple events, the keynote events in public anymore because Apple doesn't like it. And so we do this as a private event just for our ClubTwit members. On Wednesday, 9 a.m., we're going to get, actually, these 10 a.m., we're going to get together, maybe I'll get there earlier with Micah and I and we'll watch together as Apple announces

2:31:32its new phones, give you that commentary you expect. Because we didn't want Apple to be disadvantaged compared to all the other companies, we do all the keynotes that way now in the club only. But most of, that's the only thing we do this club only. Almost everything else ends up on YouTube where we stream it live as we're doing it like Micah's crafting corner. Chris Markworth's photo time. Micah is doing a media club too. We're going to do on September 18th. We're going to do the top animated episodes from Rick and Morty, the Simpsons are going to do the March and the Modern Rail episode. That's going to be a lot of, I can't wait. And that crazy show, we're going to do it September 11th with Jeff Atwood off by one. We have some very interesting viral video to show you. That's all I'll say about that and the AI user group. Join the club. We've been doing this for a couple of weeks, a month, lots of benefits. But most importantly, the warm and fuzzy feeling of knowing that you're supporting the programming here. If you like what you see, if you love our programming, if you listen to it every week, please join the club. We really, really appreciate it.

2:32:36Computronium's creator, Baker Swile. Would you explain that to me? We interviewed Ray. I think I like Ray. I've interviewed him many times. He has been per year saying the singularity is getting closer and closer by which he means machines get smarter than we are. And more importantly, design themselves so that they merge and accelerate at a high speed. And at some point, yes, we will merge with the machines. He's highly respected. He created the synthesizer for Stevie Wonder. He actually, because he was friends with Stevie, created the Kurzweil speech synthesizer. The first, I mean, he's a brilliant, brilliant guy. And among other things, he is a Google Fellow. Now he's joining a startup, developing a brain computer system that, according to Fortune, involves snorting nanoparticles. Now, I don't subscribe to Fortune, so I can't get any farther than that headline.

2:33:40But I'm not sure I want to. Jeff, did you read it? Nope, I don't subscribe either. And I'm not snorting anything or I'm not going to put a chip in here. I'm not snorting anything in here. Well, better snorting, I'm then in surgery, right? I'm not so sure. Yes, if those are your choices. Sure. Although, injecting it might be a better option. Then snorting it. And what are they going to do? They're going to go up into your, I mean, are they going to go in? Like, for brain computer, like actual brain computer interfaces, putting it in the right spot is actually really important. So they would know where to go, wouldn't they? Like, are they magnetic? Are you going to like drive them? I would know because they're smart. They're nanoparticles. They're smart nanoparticles. Okay, that is just a bunch of science fiction works together. I mean, they're real things. Nanoparticles exist. Like, what type? What are they made of?

2:34:40Do they have chips in them? Are they just really tiny bits of metal plastic? We have all of the options. I think Ray, who's getting on, deserves a little bit of peace and quiet. And if they want to use his name to promote the nanoparticles, God bless them. You want to see my phone? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Pinky. My last phone. Look, guys, what is this reminder of? Oh, yours was a lighter color rose. Now you're gotten deeper and darker. Do you like it? That's the new Pixel 11. Yeah. I do. I think it's actually a little lighter and you know how I hate a heavy phone. Well, you do. But it is because you got kind of floppy hands. That's a lot of fun. I'm not going to have to have the floppy hands. That's a large, big, small one. No, this is a smaller one because I hate big phones. It's just floppy hands. Well, I can't tell hand size depth perception, you know, it looks, it's hard to tell, isn't

2:35:44it? It looks like a big phone. It does. Well, it's the same size. It's a little, it's a smidge larger than the eight. I'm trying to think, do I have anything that looks like a, put it next to a banana. Do you have a banana there? I used to have a standing, I used to have a giant pencil that I put next to. I used to have a card or a coin or something. I used to have a six foot long pencil. Here's a photo. What is that? Where by six? It's a little... Everybody knows that. It's a photo. Back in the day, oh, it's the size of a five by four photo. It's a little. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. It looks pretty. So... You know what I have? That is hyperskis. What else do you have? I have a little pike. Oh, see that's been better. My dad used to carry a ruler with, he's a geologist, paleontologist, when he was out in the field. He would always carry a geologist pick, which is a hammer with a pointy end at one end.

2:36:47He would end up hand lends and a ruler. So it's about, it's five and it's a little, it's almost six inches long and then almost three inches. I don't even know what six inches is. I have no idea. I mean, I have a ruler. Your hand is six inches. I'm making a... They used to say that. They had a finger like that. That's six inches, but it's not really. My wallet has a little centimeter scale. By hand to the tip of my index finger is six inches. There you go. Yeah. I got the reference. I appreciate your help. Stacy, what's your working on these days? That old consumer reports there. What am I working on? That's exciting. I am still working on my legislation. It was introduced last legislative session in three states. Right to repair. What is it? Oh, it's my connected consumer products end of life disclosure act.

2:37:49Oh, that's right. That's huge. If anyone has a better name for it, feel free to send me an email. We're going to be reintroducing it in California, hopefully New York, maybe Massachusetts and Virginia, and possibly Oregon. So these are... Nice. This is what I do at the moment. Yay. Yay me. Congratulations. In October, I have a big report and a big research project coming out. So... Yay. Do you want to talk about that? Or is that a secret? I think they're like embargoed or secret or something. Okay. Good. I'm really bad at that. You're better than Leo. At least you caught yourself. You... The secret password is... Yeah. You know... No, we love consumer reports because of course Paris is also works at Consumer Reports. Paris Martino and we have Nicholas De Leon frequently on the shows. He also works. So it's a great group of people on that. Oh, you're working with him in those days. There we are. Hello.

2:38:50And you're happy. You don't want to come back to podcasting ever. I'm actually contemplating starting up my newsletter again. Oh, good. That's great. You did such a nice job. We didn't mention this giga-ohm thing but when Ompass, we got everybody loved Omel. We did, of course, talk about it. But I would have loved to have got you as one of the original giga-ohm folks on you wrote a lovely piece. I guess you kept Stacey and I out here around just for that. I kept it around as an archive. But yes, it was a good place to put that. If you go to Stacey and IT, it's probably on the page. Still, because I don't think it's- Yeah, it's still the story because I haven't written anything else for there. Do you want to say anything about Omel? If you said it all already in this story. I feel like I said, I mean, we lost a really good dude. He was a really sweet heart. A really influential- He was not a sweet man. I mean, he was a great friend. You know, I never worked for him. He was always great on the show and lovable and cuddly.

2:39:54But I know that people who worked for him knew another side. Well, no, he just- He did not accept bullshit at- Which is great. Which is great. Yes, yes. I'm not saying that he was like a cooler mean person, but he was not- He was demanding, right? He was demanding, but he also- He was- He knew- I don't know. He was very good at understanding the human side of tech and all it's for good and ill and how people use technology and he was brilliant. And when you didn't live up to that brilliance, you know, he told you. And so- But he would give you the shirt off his back quite literally. So he was sweet in that sense, but like- He's now like- When I think of a sweet person. He was very patient with me then because he could have easily- He probably was because- A lot more trouble. I miss having him on. When he had his heart trouble, we had him on less.

2:40:56Just like you, Owen, you know, when people have had the problems, the last thing they wanted to do is spend three hours on a Sunday evening talking about nothing. You know, suddenly priorities become more important. Yeah. Anyway, loved having a home on the show and we really appreciate it. I really appreciated the lovely piece you wrote at Stacey and I actually. If you want to read that, thank you for being here, Stacey. We appreciate it. Thanks, y'all. Want to meet my new dog? Yeah. Oh, yeah. I don't know if I- I don't know how this is going to work. Let's see what happens. Let's take a ride. Oh, she's so sweet. Is she a border collie? What is she? She's a mini Aussie. Aussie. She's a beautiful Aussie. I feel like she's not going to- Hopefully she won't be as loud as my other dog. So- Lisa wants an Aussie. She wants to see them as a very smart, right? And they need attention and they need to work out because they- Used to nipping the heels of sheep. Does she nip your heels? She does not. She's seven.

2:41:57I'm teaching her to dance though to entertain her. Good. So she's- What do they call it? She's not a senior dog. She's a middle-aged dog. She's a senior dog. Okay. She's not a kid. She's a sweet- She's not a kid. You're not a kid. You're only a kid. You're only a kid. You're only a kid. You're only a kid. I don't know how- I don't know the classifications of rescuing anymore. You re-hombed her. She had a home. Then she didn't. Now she does. Yeah. From her perspective, we kidnapped her from her loving home. That's right. That's right. What the hell? She was up in her shoes. Yeah. What the hell? And so- These people used to feed me. Until- Hey, I can make a loving companion like a dog. It'll never be real enough for me. That's really- That's a good point. I don't know. You guys say about choices and video tapes. That's a- Create a dog. Create the love of a dog. I double-dog dare you. Hard of a little intelligence. No, you're right. Go make something that makes my heart melt. I'm a hardcore person. I just saw that little puppy dog came out of that dog, but I still said, oh, because you know it's a dog.

2:42:58So yeah. Go ahead, A. Now we have- We do have a tradition around here. I will tell you who Owen is in a moment, but Owen has it. We have a tradition. Unlike anybody else who's ever been on this show, Owen gets to close the show out. I don't know. You haven't done that in a while, Owen. Are you prepared to do that? I'm always prepared. It's in the contract. Okay. All the other person who's talked about Twits can, and that's me. That's you. You're the only one is everybody else, even these highly respected longtime colleagues have never closed the show out. Jeff Jarvis, a real pleasure, a hot type is- I'm selling hot cakes. Everybody should go to Jeff's site and get it autographed. Jeff Jarvis.com. We'll see you back here on Wednesday for Intelligent Machine. I know. This week, no. That's why we're doing this now because you are going away. Where are you going? I've got Well Status, which is a wonderful site in New York, all over Darcy about media and all that is having its first event. And so I'm going on.

2:43:58I'm wonderful. I'm wonderful. I'm wonderful. And Benino, have we replaced Mr. Jarvis yet? Or are we- I can't believe I know that. Oh, that's right. Because Mike has got a new AI show. Mike Assangeant will be- Mike was almost the immediate host in last week's show because Leo lost his power. Oh, I know. I know. But fortunately, the reason I- Okay, so this is all connected because I missed your book club, Stacy, because the electrician was out here so that I could put a battery back up in for the system. Oh, good. Turns out, I thought I was going to be down all afternoon. So I was going to miss all the shows. I didn't prepare. He came in and he said, I already did that. Don't you remember last time I was here? I put in the 20 amp circuit and the special plug. It's right there. I said, just didn't clip it. No, I just forgot. I just forgot. No, it was sitting there. I've been using it. I just- I know you didn't read the book and you just need to some sort of excuse, but this one

2:44:59really is not a great one. I'm- He came right during the show. So I skipped the show because he was coming to put in the plug. I guess once he said, it's right there, Leo. And that'll be $250. I could have probably come on the show, but by that point, it was so strange. I just hung my head and shame. And what about- So was your power of kept going? Were you plugged into your- No, my power would not have kept going. That battery that I put in kept us alive. No, no, no, no, that's what I'm asking. You thought you only had 45 minutes. Were you hooked up to a bigger battery than you knew? No, no. That's another cause for embarrassment. The power outage was 16 minutes. But when the power came back, I guess it flipped a circuit, so I didn't get power. And I thought we were off. But we were on. And the battery is even getting juice, but it was just the stuff behind me that wasn't

2:46:02working. So I'm just an idiot. I really am. Leo does shows about technology, folks. Electricity. They all depend on electricity. But I, but this week I got it. And now ladies and gentlemen, we thank you so much for being here. We do tweet every Sunday afternoon, 2 to 5 pm Pacific 2100 UTC 5 to 8 Eastern. You can watch us do it live on YouTube Twitch, X Facebook, LinkedIn or kick or download shows from Twitter.tv. We have audio and video at the website. There's a YouTube channel dedicated to the video, of course. And the best thing to do because it's a podcast and God bless it. You can subscribe. It's just an RSS feed and you'll get it automatically in your favorite podcast. I just subscribe. You get it automatically. The minute we're done. And now I give you the Reverend Owen, JJ Stone. Or are closing. Bed addiction. Our benediction.

2:47:03So it's almost like you read my mind because you were talking about the power going out. A lot of people across the country have lost power. And I'm not playing that data centers. I'm not going to talk about the wildfires that go on across the globe. There are landslides in the Paul people have lost their lives because of earthquakes right now. The climate seems to be changing in a way that it might affect you. So as much technology that you have, make sure you get yourself a live straw. You can drink water. Get one for each of one of your family members because you need a gallon of water a day to survive. I got a bug out bag. I don't know if you got one on Khalil, but you really need to have a live straw. Jeff Jarvis books. You have some reading to keep your mind straight. Some of the lights when the power goes out, you know, a flashlight will help you out, but you don't want to be burning candles. There's lights to recharged. And when the power goes out, they give you like five to six hours of power. Start looking into things that might go wrong in the house and check with your insurance companies because they like to tell you that you got flood coverage, but you don't have flood coverage. And I know a lot of places talking about drought right now, but it seems like there's a lot of people's cars floating down the street, especially in my area.

2:48:05So check your insurance, get yourself a bug out back. Two of the most important things I have in my bag are vacuum seal cigarettes because in the apocalypse when the zombies pump, I'll tell you what I'm curious. I work done with cigarettes. I don't want to get the gold out and prison anymore. I want to get done with them gold bars like I stashed up. And I let me tell you something these cigarettes are going to get me a raft built so I can float on the salvation. But seriously, make sure you have that stuff together. If you have older people in your lives, make sure that you have something you can help them and get them prepared. If you don't want to have a bug out back for yourself, go drop on the extra flashlight and a solar radio off to grandma. You want to know what's in my bug out bag? My, my NAS and my Fuvuzella. Uncle Leo's old enough that if he doesn't survive, it's okay. But everybody else is. We weren't in a cold 1978. We might want to survive. So if you don't have a bug out back, you can email me. I send you a list of all the stuff. I got no affiliation with Amazon links or anything like that.

2:49:07I just want you to survive so that you can come back and enjoy another tweet that's in the can. Do on the tweet. Do on the tweet. All right. Do on the tweet, baby. Do on the tweet. All right. Do on the tweet.