We Make $200K and We’re Still Broke

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Normal is broke and common sense is weird, so we're here to help you transform your life.

From the Ramsey Network in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is the Ramsey Show.

I'm George Campbell, joined today by the Rachel Cruz, who is also a co-host of mine on another

show we do called Smart Money Happy Hour, which you can check out on YouTube, podcast,

Spotify, all the good places.

Taking your calls at AAA8255225, Jessica kicks us off in Idaho.

What's going on, Jessica?

Hi, I'm real nervous about talking with Trude with this, but it's real thankful it's

you too.

I enjoy your other show, Smart Money Happy Hour.

Thank you.

Feeling a little on the anxious side.

We don't see.

Well, thank you.

All right, I will just jump in here, so my husband and I are both 50.

We have a combined growth income of a 200K net 161.

We did not pay taxes in 2023, he owns his own business, an HVAC business, and with the

accounting, we found out last October for 2024, which filed late, was 47,000 that we

owed.

Well now, because we didn't find out so super late, we now did not get to correct anything

for 2025, and so we own additional 25,000 for 2025.

We also have combined current consumer debt, which again, I am not real proud of this

by any stretch, but it's about 137K.

So, what is that, Jessica?

What is that consistent of the 137?

Oh, the good, the good stuff, it consists of credit cards, some small, you know, side,

you know, loans to try to, you know, eventually re-fi, but then didn't necessarily re-fi, but

then also we had a, after we purchased our house in 23, we had a really bad septic issue

and had to replace that end, our drain field, which cost the 50 grand, all that.

And so you took a loan out for the whole 50?

We sure did.

Okay.

Yeah.

Can I ask a stupid question on behalf of America?

Sure.

Maybe not.

And for a couple that's making $13,400 a month in take home pay, why were you turning

to debt at every corner?

Where was all that money going?

I think, well, stupid, it was just all stupid, you're 100% right, we weren't making that

at the time.

That's just where we're at now.

This is newer income.

So you guys have made more money over time, and have probably spent it all, as most

people do, as soon as they get a raise, they go sweet, more money for us to make more

bad decisions with.

Right, we jumped on that bad decision train, absolutely, and again, not proud of that

by any stretch.

Well, that's normal, Jessica.

You're not alone in this.

And I think there's hope here, you have 137,000 in loans that cross-consumer debts, you

have another, it's called 75KO to the IRS.

So it's a little over 200,000 that you guys have, correct.

That's the total mess to clean up, and that doesn't include your mortgage.

How much of that is your mortgage?

Our mortgage is 4,150 a month, 4,150, yeah, 4,000, anyway, that's a monthly.

So our mortgage is not even included in that, and so our mortgage is 5.75 total.

Okay, that's what's left on that.

Woo, okay.

Well, the good news is you guys have an incredible income.

The bad news is you're going to have a new requirement, either at 50 years old.

Yeah, it's okay.

We'll make up for that later.

You guys are going to be working probably longer than you wanted to, but if you can keep

making 200 grand, this is a solvable problem.

On napkin math, you go, all right, 50 grand a year, we're done in four years.

Yeah, if you guys can find a way, and I just took, what you bring home, a month, minus

the mortgage, you know, you should have around 11,000 ish left.

And if you guys can throw 6,000 a month at this debt, Jessica, which means you live

on nothing.

I mean, you guys, your grocery budget's like 200 a week, if that, like, I mean, it is

like, we are just, we are doing nothing, but paying this off.

Yeah.

And if you can.

It's under three years.

Yeah, if you can throw, if you can, if you can be intense for three, three and a half

years, you guys can get out of this.

And that doesn't even include selling stuff, right, or working extra or whatever that is.

I mean, there's, there's stuff in here that you can move.

It's just going to be, it's going to be a couple of years of grinding it out.

I may or may not be wanting to cry right now, because that makes me real excited, because

we're both on the same page, we both want to talk about this.

Are you guys both working full time, Jessica?

Are y'all both full time?

Yes.

Yes, we are.

And kids.

Do you have kids?

No.

No, we do not in the home.

Okay.

So that's a good.

I mean, honestly, that's great.

And if you guys.

Let's mouse the feed.

Yeah.

And it takes a level of, of even a step of humility at 50 years old after two great

careers to say, hey, we're going to go work nights and you and your husband just handshake

and say, all right, I'll see you at 9 p.m. tonight, because we're going to leave at five

our jobs.

We're going to go work somewhere for four hours, and we're going to come home.

And that's going to be an extra 1,500, 2,000 bucks a month that's added to this.

That shortens it.

You know what I mean?

Like, you start to see me, see a path out.

It's just going to be hard, Jessica.

I mean, but I think you guys are at it.

I mean, even as you're explaining coming on to the call, how you're feeling, like the

emotions are just right there, they're right there.

Which actually is a good thing, because you're actually feeling something.

And that's going to help in the motivation of it all.

It really will.

Yeah.

What was going to be your next step if you hadn't called?

Well, I mean, obviously looking at the debt consolidation, just literally, I mean, we've

already talked because we're like, all right, we got to get these baby steps started.

So we've already drawn out our spreadsheet, live in that life.

And then, yeah, calling that consolidated, what can we do to shorten this pain, you know,

the way both are anxious about?

And neither of us like it.

It's very wavy.

And we've got kids that are getting married and all the things.

And so you feel real handicapped in your abilities to really be progressively moving forward

and trying to even bless them with, you know, helping to pay for all this.

And so you just, I don't, we don't like dealing this pressure either.

And so we're definitely to that point of just being super overwhelmed.

Hmm.

Well, I want to free you of feeling the obligation that you need to pay for everything

or else you're a bad mom.

I think you guys are incredible.

The fact they're even struggling with this tells me how much you care about these kids

in your family.

And so here's the truth.

You can't cover a wedding right now.

You can't bless them with some outrageous gift.

But what the best thing you can do is clean up your own financial mess so that they don't

have to take care of you later on in life.

That's the true burden to worry about.

And maybe later on down the road, you do get to bless them with an amazing gift six years

from now.

Yes, that would be, that would be awesome.

So can we say we're doing this in three years that you'll call us back and do a dead

free scream?

Oh my gosh.

I would, I would love to.

Well, here it is.

Absolutely.

You spit shake with your husband six thousand a month is going toward the step.

The IRS debt comes first because they will screw up your life.

So let's make sure that we cover that then attack all of the other debts sell everything

we can.

And you'll have anything to sell Jessica.

Do you have like a full wheeler and extra car?

I mean, I don't even know.

So do it.

We do.

No extra vehicle, but we do have a camp trailer that we've definitely that's one of the things

right.

And my husband has said, let's try to get rid of it and sell it.

Yeah.

Even talked about selling the house to be honest.

Not sure that they're, I mean, there's maybe 120, 20, you know, of equity in there.

Yeah.

Maybe in there.

That's like your like last ditch effort.

That's like we're on the verge of bankruptcy.

We're going to have to sell the house.

But I wouldn't do that.

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Pat is in Philadelphia next, Pat, welcome to the Ramsey show.

Oh, thank you, thank you for taking my call.

Sure.

How can Rachel and I help today?

So I'm 68 years old and have a $40,000 student loan debt for my daughter and the only requirement

amount I have is 37,000 in an IRA.

I am still working and I wanted to know if I should take that all my retirement savings

and pay off this student loan and just be done with it.

That's the only debt I have at my house on my car on no credit cards.

Oh, man, is the loan in your name?

Yes.

Okay.

So is it a parent plus loan?

Yeah.

It's a parent plus.

Oh, boy.

That's brutal.

Where's your, where's your daughter at in life, Pat?

No.

She never finished.

Never finished.

She's stay at home, mom, so she doesn't really have the finances to help pay.

I've asked her several times.

Does she understand your situation?

Yeah, she does.

Okay.

Again, she just, she doesn't have the money.

Yeah.

Well, she has two little ones, so she's, you know, she can't work right now.

And what about her, I mean, her husband's working, right?

Born and off.

Oh, boy.

Well, here's my fear, Pat.

Let me play this out for you.

You drain every penny of retirement to pay off your, these parent plus loans.

Now you're left with nothing.

Now we're down to social security and you working until you can't work anymore.

Whoa, whoa.

That's it.

That's the only future available to you at that point.

Not that the $37,000 is your saving grace for retirement, but that's something that's

really draining everything down to nothing, all to pay off this parent plus loan for your

daughter.

And so I'm just trying to figure out what the other options are.

What is your current income?

78, 78 a year.

Great.

And what are your expenses?

So around three thousand a month.

Okay.

Should have, if we were doing a budget, you should have a few thousand dollars left over

each month.

Oh, I have a few hundred left.

I figured like around 400 left.

I do budget.

And I do have other debt or no, that's all, but it's, you know, till my take on pay is

like 34 hundred because of me contributing to my IRA.

I've been putting 25% in.

I've been really trying to, to build it up, trying to make up for lost time.

Mm-hmm.

Man.

Well, I'm trying to think through a plan where you could knock out these loans, get them

out of your life, and still try to build a decent nest egg.

And that's what I've been trying to do.

I've been putting 600 a month against this loan.

Well, the interest is probably 600 bucks a month at this point.

Those parent plus loans are brutal.

Oh, they are brutal.

It's, yeah, it's looking at the daily interest is a six, almost seven dollars a day.

And that was the other thing at seven point nine percent is there a way to negotiate that

interest?

I don't know that they'll negotiate the only way to get out of that would be to, you

know, refinance it, which you lose, you know, the federal protections, it'd become a private

student loan.

And I don't know if you'd get a much better rate.

It's something you can look into, but I, again, I don't think this is going to be the solution.

I'm wondering if we pause all retirement investing and just got real intense about this,

and you pay it off in two years, because right now you're trying to do two things at once,

and you're not making great progress on either.

Right.

Pat, what will you be getting at, are you getting Social Security right now?

I am.

I'm getting 2,000 a month in Social Security.

Okay.

Are your benefits hurt by the fact that you're working right now?

That I don't know because I just started collecting Social Security.

Okay.

You are full of retirement.

So I think you should be getting the full amount, even if you're working at this point,

but that's something to look into.

At least you have a great income.

I mean, there's some saving grace here.

Usually people that are 68 either retired and are just trying to live off Social Security

or they're not making 80 grand a year.

They're making 30, 40, 50.

And so this is at least something you have to your advantage of knocking this out.

And maybe, eventually, I don't know their situation financially, but if they're able

to even chip in and help, because I just don't want them to be a burden to them when

you're in your 70s because you have nothing saved, and now mom's got to move in with them

and they have to cover her financial life.

Yeah, that won't happen.

The husband wouldn't even let you move in.

Sounds like a peach.

All right.

Well, Pat, these parent plus loans really are becoming like a cancer on society.

It's destroyed relationships and parents took it out thinking they were doing the right

thing for their kids.

The kids go, hey, it's in your name.

You took it out.

I was a kid.

I was 18.

I didn't know what I was doing.

This is on you.

At least, be very blunt about your financial reality with your daughter so that she knows

what's on the line.

And if they can at all help you get rid of this, that at least gives you a chance at a

decent retirement.

Okay.

So I'm pausing my contributions in my IRA.

Yeah.

Yeah, put that 25% back in your paycheck.

But remember, you're not pausing it for the rest of your life.

You're pausing it for a short period of time.

24 months.

We're going to pause it all and we're going to start throwing this kind of loan.

You're talking about three grand a month going toward the loan to knock it out in two

years.

A little more than five.

Because the interest is adding up.

You're right.

And so the more we throw at the principle, the faster this thing is gone.

Because right now, you throw 600 at it, but 100 to 200 is interest.

Well, only 400 is now knocked out.

And so if we can start throwing 3000 at it, you'll actually see that balance start to

go down instead of just keeping it at bay.

Okay.

But there's no other magic wand I can throw at you.

I mean, these loans are not even bankruptible in most cases.

And so really the only way to get rid of student loans is to pass away, which is the darkest

part of it all.

Yeah.

Oh, my goodness.

I'm wishing you the best path.

So sorry.

Riley is up next in Memphis, Tennessee.

Riley, welcome to the show.

Hey, how are y'all doing?

Great.

What's going on with you?

Um, about two years ago, I bought a $60,000 truck.

I certainly know that it's $39 on it and it's worth about 20, 29, 30, 2.

Okay.

I can afford the payment.

But once I get my payment, after I get paid and, you know, insurance and my diesel for

it, I'm left with about 100 bucks for three weeks.

Yeah.

After your truck payment?

Yeah.

After my truck payment.

How much do you make?

How much do you make a month?

How much do you bring in?

How much do you bring in?

A month.

Oh, that fluctuates depending upon if they're letting us work overtime.

But it could be anywhere from 1,400, bring home to 2,000, bring home.

In a week?

Yeah.

You know, I mean, every two weeks.

Okay.

Okay.

And how much is your truck payment?

$758 and 54 cents.

Woo.

That's a lot, my friend.

That's a quarter of your take home payment.

Just go into the truck payment.

So you're under water by $7.9 grand.

So that's the magic number we need to come up with, either in cash through savings, future

income, or by going down to your local credit union and seeing if they'll give you that loan

for the difference, plus some to get you something to get around it.

Yeah.

And an ideal situation is like a $12,000 loan, $13,000 loan.

So you have an extra 3 to 4,000 to go get a crappy truck.

Facebook marketplace and get an inspection and just go, all right, this thing is not fancy,

but it runs.

And then you save almost $1,000 a month, $750.

Yeah, between the diesel, the insurance, and the payment, you're going to feel like you've got a giant raise

because you did.

Yeah.

Well, I've talked to the bank this morning and they told me that I have another car that's paid for.

And it's fine.

It's in the driveway.

They told me to get the VN and put it up for collateral.

No.

You just don't do that.

Like a title loan?

No.

Yeah.

Like they just said for collateral, but I've never had a loan.

That's a title loan.

I mean, they own the car if you missed the payments.

I don't like that at all.

Yeah.

No.

Just see if they will, if you can do just, yeah, just a personal loan for $9 grand at that point.

Or if you have $1,000 bucks saved you're only then $8,000 a loan, whatever it is for that difference.

Yeah.

And pay this truck off.

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Tyler joins us in Canada.

Tyler, welcome to the show.

Oh, thank you for having me.

It's my first time calling.

So I'm excited to hear your feedback.

Hey.

About time.

We're glad to have you.

What's your question?

Thank you very much.

Yeah.

So my wife and I are moving to a different province in Canada.

She's just about to be done graduating seven years worth of school.

She's going to be a veterinarian when she's done.

Nice.

And because of the, she has a job guaranteed contract.

She's already signed it.

And I have work lined up back home as well that we both know what we're going to be making.

Um, so we went ahead and made a decision.

We put an offer on a house in part because of the money we had saved for school plus.

Unfortunately, um, her father passed away recently, but that meant she got, you know, the,

the life insurance payment made it so that it was more than possible for us.

To do either a 10 or 20% down payment on all the housing that we were looking at in in rural New

Runswick in this case.

Um, which maybe that's maybe that's fine advice.

Maybe it's not, but the problem became then.

Um, you know, I, they're good people and they had, you know,

their worries and concerns.

But her mother and grandmother and, and my in laws have sort of been telling us.

But it's too much too soon and it's a bad decision.

And I was just wondering if there's, um,

if I'm making a mistake or if, if what I'm doing is fine.

Are they saying it's a bad decision because of where you guys are financially?

Or because it's just too soon because you just graduated.

Your newlyweds.

Was it more of a life or money reason?

I think it's definitely more money reasons like we've been married for almost five years.

So it's not like, you know, you're keeping up too much on to the new relationship or anything.

Okay. And they know your incomes.

Yeah.

You'll have a lot of making a lot of debt from her vet school.

Um, we have some hangover.

The only caveat here is because it's Canada.

There's no interest on the student loans.

So we are paying them.

But it's a lot of debt is there.

No matter for the, uh, it's, it's around 30,000.

Okay.

What other debts you guys have?

Nothing.

It's just those.

Do you have any money?

I don't have any credit cards.

Okay.

And how much money do you guys have saved total, including, um, what she, what, when her father passed away?

So all between what I've saved and between what we have, we've probably got around 80,000.

80,000.

Okay.

Okay.

So it'll be a little over $80,000.

That's like liquid right now.

Okay.

It's non-retirement.

Gotcha.

So if you take away the loans, that brings you down to 50.

Take away an emergency fund of six months.

That takes it another, another 30 down.

So you're left with 20.

Okay.

Three months.

They're young.

They don't have kids.

Okay.

Rachel's being very kind.

We'll go 20.

20K.

So 20K for emergency fund.

30K for debt.

And then it leaves you with 30 left for a down payment.

Yeah.

Yeah.

30,000 for a down payment is where we would say you guys are parameter wise versus 80.

How much is the house that you guys put it on for on?

So what we ended up settling for was 345.

So 10% would be the, the 34 and half.

Okay.

I was hoping to, so maybe this is the philosophy difference.

I was going to leave the student loans and go for 20 on the house and then use the excess

because it would be, you know, an extra 500 bucks a month that I stayed in on the mortgage.

And I wanted to use that to go in and pay the student loans.

How much a month extra would you get?

You say you'd save 500 a month if you put 20% in.

Yeah.

Because it would avoid PMI, right?

Yeah.

Sure.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I would rather, I think I'm not saving more money by reducing the insurance load over

the interest on the house rather than, you know, the student loans that I'm less incentivized

to pay.

Yes.

Well, yeah.

And in that case, if it was just 500, you're putting towards those loans.

It'd be like three and a half years to their pay it off.

So our philosophy is to be debt-free before you buy a home and to have an emergency fund in

place.

And then what is left is, yeah, what you would put down for a house.

How much do you guys make a year to gather all the new jobs fees?

Yeah.

It'll be the, so the, both the floor, the most conservative estimate will be 125.

Okay.

For a job she's expected obviously like within three years to be making a lot more than the 85 starting.

And there's a commission component to like depending on what drug she does or doesn't sell.

So one, I'm not like planning that into a budget or anything.

Yeah.

Another consideration.

So 125 for both of you.

Right.

What are you making?

Oh, no, no.

That's combined.

125 is combined.

Combined.

Okay.

Okay.

Okay.

So if you guys lived on 90, well, I guess that's before taxes.

Yeah.

My guess is your take home pay will be somewhere in the $7,000 range.

Yeah.

That seems about right.

Okay.

And maybe I would say a little bit more than that, but, but yeah, that's around there.

Okay.

Okay.

Okay.

Okay.

My fear is that, I mean, if you do it the Ramsey way you're talking about, I know you guys have a different

a mortgage structure.

You guys have like adjustable rate mortgages that change every five years.

Is that right?

And our interest or the rate is like three and a half percent here where it's more, I think, for you guys as well.

Okay.

Not sure though.

And but the rate could change, you know, every couple years.

Yeah.

So my fear is that you pick up this home and if you do it our way, you know, that mortgage could be

$3,000 out of your seven, right?

It's possible.

That feels like a big load to carry going into this new phase of life.

And we know we recommend 25% going towards your housing.

And so you'd be closer to 40 edging up to 50 depending on the situation, insurance, property taxes, all of that.

HOA, I don't know how that works in Canada, but that's my fear right now.

It's world.

So there's no HOA in the property taxes available.

It's about $100 a month.

Okay.

So there's a piece of me that says, you guys might be able to make this work, but it's going to be more stressful than you think it is.

But if you waited another, let's say six months, you signed a short lease agreement to rent in this new province, kind of get used to the area.

Even just a year.

You know what I mean?

It's the, it's the province we were from.

Yeah.

I guess the other, the only other thing, a piece of information that might be relevant here.

Her job requires her like we got to be off to be in one of two different places.

So where we were getting is kind of in the middle to reduce her driving between each one.

And it's closer to where I would end up working as well.

So the options to rent that are actually close are like close to not existing because of how we're rolling.

Well, how far is the, what's the difference of the two places?

We're talking about like 45 minutes.

That's 20 minute drive versus over an hour.

Okay.

Well, for a year, here's the thing, Tyler.

The reason that everything is laid out the way it is with the baby steps and all of it, which hasn't changed in 30 plus years, is because this is the most peaceful, most efficient way to build wealth long term.

Okay.

And so, and I say peaceful people getting out of debt.

It's not really peaceful.

It's crazy.

You're like trying to get out.

But the point is, is that especially with a house, you know, your house is supposed to be a blessing.

It's supposed to be a place of peace and rest.

And the thing is people quickly move into that purchase thinking, okay, if I could just get that house, it's going to be okay.

And we'll figure out the finances.

Well, it's okay.

We're right on that edge.

But what George was saying earlier is you're just, you're right on that edge.

And what it could cause is a level of stress that's unnecessary for today.

That if you guys just waited one year, had an inconvenience of an extra 25, 30, 40 minute drive for one year,

saves like crazy, knocked out the debt, had, you know, looked at it and said, okay, we can go full force, 20% down.

Like, it's just a more peaceful way.

And there's no one telling you you have to buy a house right now, you know?

No.

There's no one.

You know, it gives you more options online.

Let's see if you have kids.

One of you wants to stay home.

Well, you can't.

And guess what, there's no daycare out in the woods.

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Haley's in Seattle.

Next, Haley, welcome to the show.

Hi, Haley.

You're very excited to be here.

What's going on with you today?

I am trying to decide if my family just needs the biggest financial mistake of our lives.

Oh, no.

What is say more?

So we just sold our Ramsey model perfect house in Boise, Idaho to move to a high cost living in Seattle, Washington.

Why'd you move?

We have two young kids.

And I became permanently disabled from my job.

And I wanted to be close to family.

Oh, thank you.

I'm dealing with it.

But I wanted to be close to family to help with the raising of our children.

Yeah.

That's a very noble decision in a great way.

So what is causing you to feel like that was a big mistake?

Well, I think it's all financial related because it's just more expensive.

Yes.

So while I mean, it's hard to justify leaving a $1,200 mortgage.

Well, it is when you're permanently disabled and you have young kids.

You want to be near family.

I mean, that's really important.

And it depends on how much of your world is new mortgages.

Yes.

It might just be like, well, we're paying this much now.

We're paying this much.

The sticker shock sometimes hurts more than the actual reality where she is.

So like our rent can be moved into an apartment and our rent is $3,285.

Oh, yeah.

That can hurt.

And what's the household income now, like every month?

About $7,500.

So that's where you're feeling the pinch.

Mm-hmm.

Is half of the income is now going to rent instead of building equity at $1,200 a month?

Exactly.

And it was, I mean, it was just such an affordable place to live too.

Yeah.

Sure.

Okay.

Well, it's done, right?

The decision's made.

The house has been sold.

Correct.

Yep.

Okay.

So what can we do moving forward to help you?

So we, my husband, and I feel like we are never going to be able to reenter the economy

as homeowners and take that next step again.

We feel like we took this huge step back.

And I guess my husband is in the mindset currently that we need the biggest financial

decision that could ruin our future going forward.

And it's going to take us years to regroup.

It's very dramatic in rent.

Wow.

Very dramatic.

Wow.

The cloud.

And I feel great.

And I feel great.

Well, what happened to the postage from the house?

What are you doing today?

You sound like me.

Pret like the world's going to end.

Yes.

I mean, it's scary.

Like I get where he's coming from.

I get, yes.

I get such a solid financial base that I don't think that's not true.

What did you get from the house when you sold the house?

230.

Where did that go?

Where's that?

That one is in a high yield savings account right now because we don't know like when we could buy again.

Okay.

What are the houses going in the area that you guys are in?

Of course.

Like for a decent sister bedroom house, we're looking at seven to eight hundred thousand.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay.

I mean, I think it's a problem, I mean, yes, it's more expensive than living in Boise.

So we need to get that out of our head of the base.

I don't know that though, Hayley.

Like, right.

You, right.

You guys didn't just like show up and see I don't be like oh, my gosh, this is more expensive.

Like you knew that.

So living living in it's a different reality.

I understand that.

But it wasn't.

It was it.

It is.

It wasn't like it surprised you.

Well, I think it surprised my husband a little bit.

but just because he wasn't really for them

and he loved our home and like the situation we were in

and we thought like we were really financially stable

and he kind of believed that we made it.

So I wonder if that's part of his dream.

I wonder if that's part of the big statements, Hayley,

is that yes, it is more expensive,

which can fill overwhelming,

but you guys have $280,000 sitting in a high yield savings account,

which is more than enough for a down payment on a new home.

You're not at the two.

Yes.

And I think part of it is I just don't want any level

of bitterness or resentment in him to grow

because it doesn't sound like you both were felt really,

really solid and really excited

and really on the same page about this.

It's not something you chose.

You didn't do it out of a place of strength.

No, well, it just seems so.

It feels like we just want against everything that Dave Ramsey teaches.

Forget Dave Ramsey.

This is your life, Hayley.

I mean, you have this health condition

that has caused you to have to move

and it wasn't your choice.

And I have Dr. John Deloney in my head going,

you need to grieve the life that you had.

That one's over.

And now there's a new chapter.

And so we can either look backwards

and go, oh my gosh, if we just could live in Boise again,

or we can go, hey, this is a fun adventure.

We got young kids living in this really cool city.

Yes, it's more expensive, but my husband has a great job.

Maybe he can make even more money in the long run,

being in Seattle, especially with all the tech stuff around it.

There's a great economy there.

Yeah.

So guys, we'll be home owners again one day.

You have hundreds of thousands of dollars saved.

Right.

And I was gonna say, would we put all of that money

down on a new home?

Yes, it was stuck at the last home, wasn't it?

Yes.

And home.

What else would you do with it?

I was really sure.

I don't know.

I just feel like it's, I don't know.

Yeah.

I guess it just feels like we do a lot of things.

Was this move, Hayley, a quick decision?

When from the moment you guys started talking about it

to it actually happening, was it a couple,

was it a year, was it?

Oh, like month.

Okay, so I do.

I do wonder if you guys rushed into it.

And George, I love you, but I will correct.

He said, you needed to move.

You didn't have to move.

Yes.

You chose to.

For the help.

Yeah, exactly.

For the overall quality of your life,

because of what happened.

How long ago was the accident that caused you

to be permanently disabled?

I guess it's kind of like, I'm blind.

So it was a slow progression.

Okay, oh, I'm so sorry.

Hayley, I'm just dealing with it.

Can I just say that?

You're just dealing with a lot.

That is one of the most horrific life changing happens.

Yes, you're, I mean, you're grieving your,

your sights, which I can't even imagine.

Yeah.

I didn't want to give up work.

Your husband and really hard to fix it.

Sure, and yes, and giving up that part of you

that was contributing and that you loved your, your work.

But you know, your husband who's, you know,

I mean, like, there's a, there's a lot.

And I'm sure it's a lot on him to figure all this out.

Yeah, I think the stress is less about it

being more expensive in Seattle.

And I think it's that your life has completely changed,

completely changed and what, and what George said,

quoting John, of kind of grieving what was supposed to be,

what our life, what you thought would look like

for the next 10, 15 years of our life.

It does, it looks so different on so many levels, right?

And that's a, it does.

It's a really sad reality, you know, that's hard.

Not that you guys can't get through it

and create something beautiful in this next season,

but to acknowledge that, that that's, that's difficult.

Yeah, it has been hard, but I, again, like you guys said,

I feel like we're in, like a safe space.

I mean, we're around family and there is the financial backing

to purchase a home, we're just kind of,

as it's an industry of like putting all that money

into a new home in this area,

like just with the current economy and climate,

like we don't know if that's like smart,

or if renting is the better way out.

Yeah, what do you mean by the current account?

When you say that, what does that mean to you?

It just, to me, it feels like with the interest rates

of where they're at and the type of houses,

they're like, they're not like,

a lot of them are fixed for uppers,

that the 700 to 800,000 range, you know,

we're going to have to, we'll get into a home

and we'll probably have to replace through

for the HFAC system, it's going to be ancient.

And so it's like this, your factor,

like if we buy into another home,

like is that really going to be wise?

Is, are we going to get equity on that?

Long-term, long-term it will.

Paying $3,000 in rent forever and every man

is not the wisest move.

It would be, you know what I mean?

Yeah, more wise to get in and, and you guys need to,

I would say slow down before you buy

and actually look to see, yes,

does the HFAC unit need to be replaced?

How does the, you'll see all of that

in the inspection of the home.

None of that will be a surprise.

You guys will have some factor, but yes,

being a homeowner is more expensive.

You're, you're exactly right.

But also I do think there's some,

some semantics that are thrown around

when it comes to the economy and the housing market

and it is true, houses are more expensive

than they were five years ago.

Yes, interest rates are around 5%

and they're not at the two to three percent.

Like there are some realities,

but just this vague idea that, oh gosh,

the economy is just not good, we shouldn't buy a home.

I would want some more facts around those thoughts.

My fear is you look back 10 years from now

and you go, wow, the economy was great back then

and we had no idea.

And so I'm a glass half full kind of guy

when it comes to that.

So the goal is let's grieve what was

and let's make a plan for the future.

And that might mean we're gonna save 25 grand a year

for 30 grand, 50 grand a year

for this next home three years from now.

And that's it, it's slowed down your wealth building

but you have the right set up in place for your life

and that's far more important.

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Well, really a couple things.

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Yeah, that's a big deal.

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Welcome back to the Ramsey show

in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio.

I'm George Campbell, joined by best selling off

for Rachel Cruz, and we're taking your calls

at AAA 825-225.

Lynn is in main up next.

Lynn, welcome to the show.

Are you with us?

So close.

Yes, I am.

Oh, good.

You scared me half to death, Lynn.

Thank you so much for taking my call, I'm sorry.

What's going on?

Hi, so my husband and I got married last year.

We started the baby steps right after getting married.

We paid off our debt aside from our mortgage.

And six months into marriage, I found out

that my husband owed $80,000 in tax taxes.

And also at this time, we found

that we were pregnant with our first child.

Oh my gosh.

That's finding out a lot going on.

We paid the $80,000 out of our emergency fund

and house funds that we had the money to pay that.

But we are unsure where to go from here.

Emotionally and financially, because tax fees

in for 2020-25 is quickly approaching

and we are expecting to owe about $40,000.

Oh my gosh.

Lynn, why has the accounting not changed after everything?

The accounting.

I do quarterly payments.

We're employed.

No, we know we haven't.

Okay.

Okay.

So you didn't learn.

You didn't make any payments in 2025.

But didn't learn from owing $80,000.

Do you know what I mean?

I'm just wondering, did it not occur to your husband?

We found out in December.

So we were trying to catch up before we paid 2025.

Oh, so you found out about the $80 in December?

Yeah.

And of that point, 2025.

You found that was for 2024?

That was for 2022, 2023, and 2024.

Got it.

So by the time you found out about all of this,

it was too late because 2025 was over at that point.

So now we're just sort of cleaning up.

This is still part of the mess.

Let's call it a 120 grand and you've cleaned up 80 of it.

Yes, exactly.

Well, it's fairly simple.

It's a $40,000 debt that you owe the government.

And so we got to pay that as aggressively as possible.

Do you have other debts as well?

We don't.

We paid off all of our other debts, thankfully.

We do have a business.

It's a restaurant.

So we have $40,000.

Well, total, we have $60,000 in the bank account

for our restaurant.

And we have $20,000 in our personal account.

And I know you talk about causing pain

debt when you find out you're pregnant.

So we're just wondering if we should take money

from the business account or if we should get on a payment

plan with the IRS or what our best way forward is.

Yeah, I think for stork mode is what we call it.

I think IRS debt is not included.

I think you got to pay that.

Yeah, especially if you have the money.

So the question is, what was that $60 grand earmarked for

in the business account?

Was that needed for upcoming purchases, investments,

anything like that?

Or was it just kind of an emergency fund for the business?

Yeah, an emergency fund for the business.

It takes about $15,000 a week to operate while we do bring in

more than $15,000 a week.

We just wanted to kind of call it a week.

Yeah, how much do you guys bring home?

In total, a month, re-bring home about $15,000.

Oh, amazing.

So you could easily restock the business account.

Yeah, I would pay 40K today out of the business.

Because truthfully, this is kind of an emergency for your

business, is you didn't withhold enough taxes or at all.

And so I would take that out and now you get 20K in there,

plus 20K in checking.

So you're not in a lurch if you did need to cover an

emergency.

And so I would just work on restocking that and you guys

should still be good for your stork mode.

I mean, you have 20 grand.

This is, the stork mode is more for like, we are broke.

We have $1,000 starter emergency fund and we need to make

sure that we're covered in case there's, you know, health bills.

Right, right, okay.

So I have full confidence.

I would clean it up because truthfully, while you're pregnant,

you don't want to be dealing with the stress of

IRS today.

Yes, yes, yes, I want this to be exciting and fun and not

this looming in the back of your mind that we owe the IRS.

And you all have, do you have someone that's helping you

with your taxes for the business?

We do now, yes, and how in that we had before wasn't great,

but we have somebody trustworthy now, which so we feel like

we're in a good past forward.

Obviously, this was very hard emotionally, which I'm still

trying to get over.

I think that's the biggest thing for me right now.

Emotionally, because you didn't know about it, because trust

or yes, yeah, and it wasn't no about it.

Do you feel like was there any level of secrecy?

Out of not malice, that sounds bad, but if like, oh gosh,

I don't want her to know.

Or was it complete just ignorance of genuinely not knowing

that he owed this?

I think it's hard to say for sure.

I think part of him maybe knew that he owed something.

I don't think that he knew that he owed $80,000.

He was filing taxes for the business, but wasn't filing

personal, the money that he could do from the business.

Yep, yep.

And he wasn't fully realizing, but also should have

definitely checked.

So it's just been hard to find that out.

Yeah, for sure, Lynn, that's very stressful.

Yeah, absolutely.

Well, the good news is you guys can cover this with the cash

on hand, and it's fixed for the future.

So I would just get rid of it now.

I wouldn't get on a payment plan.

Just cut them to check for 40 grand and fix it for the future.

I mean, you got your next quarters coming up here.

To pay your quarterly estimated payments.

So let's prepare for that and finally get ahead of it

instead of kind of being reactive.

Right.

And use the kind of cash flow for the next month

or try to cash flow for the next month

that quarterly, because we're kind of still

playing catch up right now.

Exactly.

So you might owe $10 or $15 grand in quarterly,

and a quarterly payment coming up.

And so we got to make sure we have that.

And so the next week, we're going to be living on a pretty tight

budget now.

So I don't know how you guys are living now.

If I was making $15 grand a week,

I'd be living La Vita, Loka.

And so it might be time to batten down the hatches

and live a little bit more conservatively

until we get through this phase.

The taxes are solved.

The babies here.

Yeah, he may not bring home as much,

because he's putting more in the business

to make sure those taxes are paid.

Okay.

Okay, awesome.

Thank you so much.

Yes, best of luck with that.

I know, good luck with that.

We, baby.

I know.

Such an exciting time.

You don't want it clouded by this mountain of debt.

So much.

And it's scary, like what she said.

I mean, when, and thank God, I mean,

they're somewhat responsible.

They got 60 grand and an emergency fund

in the business, 20 grand.

I mean, like, they're, there's elements of it

that are saving grace, because some people,

usually if you're making that kind of money,

you're comfortable with all these payments around you

and you're just sort of keeping up.

Yes.

And luckily, they lived fiscally,

responsibly in other ways.

Yes, to be able to have some of that,

yes, that savings.

Ooh, and a good reminder for anybody

who is self-employed, even if you do like side gigs,

I mean, you got to pay self-employment tax,

you got to pay her quarterly estimated payments.

And it's not that hard.

You can sort of calculate using calculators

on the IRS website, how much you'll own taxes.

And you go, all right, I'm gonna owe 40 grand this year

or I made this much this quarter.

I need to write a check to the IRS and log in,

connect your bank and pay the IRS what they're owed.

It's not fun, but we can't pretend like,

ooh, free money.

I don't have to pay taxes because I'm self-employed.

You got to pay them and then some, bud.

You got to business taxes and your personal taxes.

The government wants their cut.

And so make sure you take care of that

so it doesn't add stress to your life

because the IRS can really screw it up.

They can garnish your wages, come after your stuff.

They're not your traditional lender.

So take care of the stuff.

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We're headed to Providence, Rhode Island.

James joins us there.

What's going on, James?

Yeah, you guys are doing great.

What's your question today?

My question is about communication.

I'm 30 years old.

I just got engaged.

And I found you guys maybe a year ago

and I'm on baby step two.

I got $10,000 left in the car loan

and I budgeted $12,000 and maybe a little more

for a wedding that we have coming up in 2028.

That's a long ways away.

Yeah, well, we could have done it next year

but we wanted to fund it ourselves

without going into debt.

Okay.

That's why we chose 2028.

Right now I make around 50,000 a year

but transitioning careers to become a firefighter

and I'll be making 80K.

So I'm helping my income for our future.

But I wanted to try and start a conversation with her

but as I tried to talk about debt and all of that,

I just found myself not knowing

how to approach it well.

Become really passionate about living debt free

and trying to become debt free.

So how do I communicate with her

without coming off as controlling

or judgmental about her, having debt and all that?

What do you know about her finances?

From what I know, she has credit card debt.

She has card debt and student loan.

The amount is not, I don't have full knowledge

in the amounts.

I know it's north of 25,000 or more.

Well, you guys are engaged.

So you have the right to start talking about this stuff.

It's not like it's been two dates and you're like,

hey, I really want to lay it all out.

And so now is the time.

Consider this year's like pre-marital counseling

to make sure and you go into it saying,

hey, as we head towards marriage,

I want to make sure that we're aligned

because I know money is a huge part of marriage

and I don't want us to be having money fights.

I want us to hit our financial goals.

And my values are on money is that I believe

being debt-free is our best path to building wealth

and having a marriage with less fights.

And see how that hits her.

And it's not a judgment.

You're not saying, I can't believe you're in debt,

you better get out before we're married or else.

That's not the spirit of this conversation.

Yeah, it's almost like not even shaming the past decisions,

but it's more like, hey, going forward,

how are we gonna build a life together

where we're unified and we have the same value system, right?

And that would be true with how you want to handle in-laws,

how you want to parent your spiritual life.

I mean, this is all part of uniting two lives together

when you get married.

And you don't have to be the same person, right?

She may still be a spender, you may still be a saver.

It's not like you're trying to morph her into who you are,

but the value systems on which you make decisions

doesn't have to be consistent, but the more consistent they are,

I would say probably, I don't wanna say the easier,

the marriage is gonna be, but definitely,

it's a less mountain to climb.

Yeah, less tension in that area, for sure.

So yeah, so if you, go ahead.

I know she's the one,

and I really want my future to be with her,

and I just want our future together

to be as stress-free as possible.

Yeah.

What if you guys did something together

to sort of get on the same page,

like reading the total money makeover

or going through financial piece university,

and hey, as part of our sort of pre-marital counseling,

I'd love for us to go through this money course

or read this book together

so that we're kind of speaking the same language.

Well, her language, she's a teacher, she's an English teacher,

so her language, she has a bunch of books.

So, I mean, that would probably be the good first step

to go through books.

I love it.

And even an audiobook, too.

If you guys are on a road trip or something,

it can be casual.

It's not like it's an intense,

we're gonna do a book report.

Yeah, no, and you're not wrong to ask this stuff, James.

I do want to just affirm that when you're engaged to someone,

everything's out on the table.

Like, you're about to combine your lives, you know what you mean?

So bringing up big conversations and hard conversations,

that that's the grounds of marriage.

Like, that is what you're gonna do.

And so, you're right, practicing that now is very important.

And for you guys to, you know what I mean,

by the time you guys walked down the aisle, James,

you didn't know how much she makes, what's in retirement,

what she has set up, you know, as a teacher,

what debt she has, she needs,

I mean, you guys are gonna know everything

because you're gonna combine it all and be one after that marriage.

You just don't want to come off as, you know, someone,

like, I'm trying to, like, dominate or anything.

I just want to know what I have to deal with

and what we will have to deal with together

once we become married.

And...

And nothing about you sounds controlling and dominating

at this point in the conversation.

So I don't know that you could really screw it up

unless you're just super way too passionate and overbearing.

She's like, who is this guy?

He came out of nowhere.

But if she knows you well enough,

this is gonna feel like another conversation

and just say, hey, I've been thinking a lot about this

and I was thinking, man, it'll be really cool

to be heading into marriage debt-free.

Can we, like, just, I want to map it out on paper

and just see, like, what's possible?

Cause you got to pay for the wedding.

You're both covering that.

And you're still getting out of debt, James.

So it's not like you, you know what I mean?

It's better than that.

There's no better than that.

Yeah, I mean, that's what you can say.

I mean, I've, you know, messed up with money.

I've been so in debt and it's stressed me out

and I've started to actually find freedom

and peace by getting out of debt.

And it's really important to me

that as we build a future together

that we see in our aligns on this.

And it doesn't have to be like this my way or the highway,

but at least, at least approaching the conversation, you know?

And then whatever she says next,

that's your cue to dig in and ask more clarifying questions

and really get to the heart of whatever her fears

or dreams are.

Definitely.

And then you can sort of couch that to go,

okay, now I can see how debt freedom is a part of that.

And I think even going into it saying,

I have these goals, how cool would it be

if we had options when we got married?

Instead of having to clean up a bunch of debt,

how awesome would it be to have the wedding paid for

and no debt and money in the bank

so that we're closer to buying a house

or we can go into some amazing vacation or honeymoon?

And so now we're dreaming.

This is an exciting conversation versus a woe is made.

And you get to know a person through the lens of money, right?

How she grew up.

What was, what was her household growing up with money?

You know, was it stressful?

Was money talked about?

Was there tension?

Was it scarcity mindset, you know,

you kind of learn how she is, what her personalities are,

what her tendency is around money,

the things that she loves to do with it,

the things that she's scared of

and that she's fearful for in the future.

I mean, you know, you get to,

you really get to know someone as well on a,

on a great level and a deep level

when it comes to these conversations, too.

Okay.

Thank you so much.

Sorry, I probably overwhelmed James.

You know, hold on the line and Kelly's gonna pick up

and we'll give you a copy of my book,

you know yourself, know your money

because it does talk about those money classrooms

of how you grew up your tendencies

and total money makeover.

We'll give you two copies.

We'll give you two copies of total money makeover

so each can read one.

She's an English teacher.

She wants her own.

Yeah, yeah.

And she can highlight it.

Yeah, and this is exactly, we probably overwhelmed him.

Sorry, James.

No, he's excited.

I get it.

And the engagement you're nervous.

You're like, I don't wanna screw this up.

You know, you're on the precipice.

Yes.

So you're like, now's not the time to throw a wrench

into things, but it's the right wrench.

But it is.

Yeah.

It's the right wrench.

Well, you don't wanna throw it.

Because money fights, I know.

Don't throw wrenches.

I know, but money fights and money problems

are one of the leading causes of divorce.

It's in the top three list always.

Yeah.

Of reasons why people get divorced.

And it's a big, big conversation.

Like, it's a big conversation to have

an urgent one to have because.

Yeah, I don't know what woman is like.

If you came up to her and said,

hey, money fights and money problems

are one of the leading causes of divorce.

I don't want that to be us.

I wanna just.

Yeah, you almost feel love and care for her.

What a fiscally responsible man.

I'm about to marry.

This is awesome.

James is such.

So responsible.

And if she gets.

If she gets frazzled or upset, then you,

you're the common one going, hey, what's going on here?

Well, then that's saying more about her.

What's going on there?

And then you can dig in.

Yes.

So there's really no, like.

Lose, loose.

Yes.

This is gonna be so great.

I wish I was there to watch it.

You know, we should do like a show

where we, we were like, we're in their ear

with a little microphone.

My gosh, that'd be so fun.

And we're like, say this.

Say this.

I'm gonna hold her hand.

Grab her hand.

Okay.

Well, uh, we'll workshop it.

We'll pitch it to the network.

Because people know we can talk.

I think we just talk James and zero.

I would love it.

But like, you have her.

I've got him.

And we're like sort of battling.

Oh, that's good.

I think that's great.

I'd watch that show.

I think that sounds fantastic.

It's like in practical jokes.

That's what I was going to say.

There's a show that, yes.

So they make them do something.

But we would actually be helpful.

But it's not a prank show.

We're just trying to help you.

No, we're really trying to help.

Nail the conversation.

To the money fight show.

That's what it should be.

All right, guys.

I think we just nailed it.

We just pitched it.

I think Dave Ramsey just signed off.

We're good.

Can't wait.

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Today's question comes from Brooklyn in Ohio.

I am 27 and married to a great guy who also lives by your principles.

We're on baby steps four, five, and six.

And our home will be paid off in five years.

We have a six-month-old baby.

I'm a free spirit.

But with my husband's help, I have become a saver.

Wow.

I didn't know you could change.

I know.

Wedding budget.

A couple of years ago, it was almost $50,000.

And with inflation, our daughter's wedding is going to cost around $70,000.

I want to start a wedding savings account for her.

But my husband thinks we should pay off the house first.

Can we do both at the same time or pay off the house first and then save for the wedding?

That is a hilarious and fantastic.

I mean, from a free spirit too, I'm planning the wedding for the six-month-old.

Because she wants a great wedding in 20 plus years or whatever.

In the year 2015.

Yes.

So no, Brooklyn, I would not be saving right now for a wedding.

I would be paying off the house.

Yep.

On your husband's team.

You don't know.

You don't know what it's going to cost.

You don't know what your daughter is going to want.

We don't know that far in the future, right?

So that's a very far-off purchase to make.

Now, one thing you could be thinking about that was college in saving for that.

But, yep, for the wedding, I would wait a little bit.

I would get the house paid off and get some college funding happening on the side.

And then as she gets older and you guys are in a great financial position to be saving.

Yep.

I just crunched the numbers for you while Rachel was talking.

I got so deathly bored.

I was like, I'm just going to go to the investment calculator.

Well, I wanted to show her that this is a solvable problem.

You focus on paying down the house.

Yes.

Five years from now, they're dead free.

You have five and a half-year-old daughter.

Okay.

Right?

So that gives them, let's say, 20 years.

Let's say at 25, she's getting married.

Okay.

Wedding's happening.

Yeah.

So it's 20 years.

If you invest 100 bucks a month starting from nothing in an investment account, non-retirement.

So just like a taxable brokerage account in index funds, you will have $86,000 likely.

Let me go 10% to be conservative.

That's at 11%.

10% you'd have 75%.

And that's 100 bucks a month.

So 75 to 85%.

75 to 85 grand you'd have when she's 25.

So that's 100 bucks a month.

That's very doable.

Again, when you have no mortgage payment.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

And that's what I'm actually doing right now is not just for wedding.

But you got to think about.

That's how it's going to cost.

Yeah.

Of course.

Wedding it down.

Payment as a gift.

What are houses going to cost?

How can I help my kid get a leg up while they're young adults?

Yes.

So I think it's more of that.

I think it's just the savings for future purchases in life, right?

College.

Yes.

If you want to help them.

And some other way, down payment you mentioned or wedding all of that.

And there's no obligation.

You're not a bad parent if you can't help with these things.

But if you can, and you definitely can when you have a paid for house following the steps,

it just gives you more options and flexibility and more room to be generous.

Yes.

So I love this question, Brooklyn, you are nailing it.

You and your husband are doing the exact thing we would tell you to do.

So keep it up.

Pay off the house first.

AJ is in Nashville.

Up next.

AJ, welcome to the show.

Hey, guys.

How you doing?

Great.

How are you?

I'm doing pretty good.

I wanted to call in.

So my fiance and I got engaged last March and the wedding is in July this year.

Woohoo.

I already had a house and everything so she just moved in with me about a year and a half

ago.

So I paid a mortgage and kind of fuel house broke, I reckon.

She makes a little more than twice what I make and I know she can help by asked her to,

but with her student loans, credit cards and just I guess miscellaneous things like her

wedding dress and stuff like that, money type or two.

So my question is, I don't know, Dave's generally pretty traditionally against it, but would

it be easier for us to combine finances early since the wedding is in five months or just

hold off on it and then you know, hit the ground when it's in there?

Yeah.

No, I would not combine finances till you're married.

I would have her be working on her debt and you working on your financial situation.

Then when you guys get married, combine and then if you are out of debt and she still has

debt, then your income will be going to help her pay off her debt and you know, you guys

are focused as a household on that.

So AJ, how did you afford the house before she moved in?

Because you said you had a house and then she ended up moving in, but it's still stressful

for you.

Is it too much house?

I'd argue it is, but it's when I bought the house, it was in 21, I was in a sales role,

so I was doing really well.

And then some things happened with the customer I was working with, so I kind of just took

a hit.

Oh, gotcha.

Okay.

Okay.

Are you still in a sales role?

No.

I don't make commission, but it's more of a support.

Okay.

And then you guys combine in July after you get married, because that's soon, I mean,

you guys will be, you know, it's a couple of months, will the mortgage then between both

of your incomes be about a fourth of your take home pay?

Monthly take home pay?

Yeah.

Okay.

Perfect.

Okay.

So you guys can afford the house once you guys get married, but yeah, but to answer your

question, no, I would keep everything separate until you get married.

The scary part is that she doesn't have housing expenses, and she makes double what

you do, and she still paycheck to paycheck.

Yeah.

So she got her loan that she just paid her car off.

She, I think the way we grew up was really different.

She'd been pretty much on her own, she was like 15, so I think it's just a matter of how

we look at it.

Yeah.

She paycheck to paycheck, because she's paying off debt, or she's just paying minimum

payments on everything.

I think it's minimum payments.

I think lately she's kind of kicked into another gear where she wants to try to get everything

paid off before we get married, or at minimum before we have kids, which was ideally two

years as a timeline for that.

Okay.

I would just dig into this and get aligned on what the goals are going to be.

It sounds like she is aggressively paying off the debt.

I don't think she's just sitting around comfy, going, well, we'll just deal with it when

we're married.

The attitude of how cool it would be to have this debt paid off by the time we're married.

So I mean, it's going to be tight until then.

I don't think it's, if you were like, hey, listen, it's tight for me to cover all of the

housing expenses on my own right now.

I don't think it's terrible to ask her to pitch in.

And if you did it, I'm old school, I would have just said, let's not move in together before

we're married, but you guys have made those choices already.

We're not going to victor at this point.

I don't think that probably wouldn't go over well for you, but I would get on a game plan

of, here's what's going to happen from March through July.

Here's how we're going to handle the finances.

Once July comes, when we're married, we'll combine and whatever debt is left, we'll attack

together.

Yeah, but I think my fear was on asking her initially, once you've moved in, I didn't

want her paying towards like a house, if she's not getting anything out of it.

Right.

I think that's a big thing.

Yeah, I mean, unless it's quote unquote rent at that point, right?

If you had a roommate, they would be paying rent, but yes, no, I hear what you're saying

because her name is not on the house.

But when you guys get married, yeah, combining assets and everything is, is a big

point.

I mean, it will end up being half-hers in a sense once you guys are married.

So, yeah, I mean, you did the front end work.

So either way, I believe all marital assets should be combined, one account, not keeping

your separate accounts for fund money.

Just do it all out of one joint checking account, do a budget, keep a high yield savings.

That's again, joint that you both have access to.

That is the key to a great marriage, as it relates to money.

Okay.

Good luck, my man.

Great job, AJ.

I'm going to send you a financial piece university as our pre-marital counseling gift.

It's one of the best courses to get on the same page and to light a fire under you guys

to start dreaming about what life is going to be like as a couple as you build wealth.

Thanks for the call.

It's wild how relationships and money get so intertwined and they can get heated quick.

And he's trying to avoid the, I don't know, want to ask her because she's working on

her thing and do we combine?

Yeah.

The important conversation is when July happens and we are a married couple, what does life

look like?

And painting that picture is really important.

So you probably both have very different pictures right now.

Yeah, if you haven't talked about it, you do.

Yeah, absolutely.

It's a rare thing.

But like I was thinking the same thing.

This is what I wanted to do.

That's rare.

Yeah.

So the more lines you guys can be before the wedding day on, again, every topic in life.

This happens to be, we're talking about money here, but on everything that, yeah, I mean,

there's just more clarity, more direction.

And a little bit more enjoyment because you're walking the same path together through life

versus competing, right, or budding heads in it.

So you have AJ, great question and good luck to you guys.

It's exciting.

It'll be here before you know it.

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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show.

Tax season is upon us.

If you want free checklists and guides that will help you file, go to RamseySolutions.com

slash taxes.

We've got you covered for all the resources you need.

Elaine is in North Carolina up next.

Elaine, welcome to the show.

Hi, thanks for taking my call.

Yeah, what's going on?

Well, I am recently widowed.

My husband took care of all the finances.

I am 64.

I'm in good shape in regards to finance.

I just don't know exactly what I'm doing.

So I have about three and a half million dollars in a high-yield savings right now.

I have two homes probably worth right under another million.

I know I will, eventually, hopefully this year, be selling one of the houses and I do have

an appointment next week with a certified financial planner, someone that I trust and so my

question to you is, do I just deal with one financial planner or do you?

Should you split up your money and do it with different people?

I'm comfortable with one, having someone in your corner that you trust and you look

at.

I think having a team of people is wise, like having someone, you know, a tax pro in

your corner for taxes and different things.

So there's different elements of money that I would probably bring some people in just

to make sure you have expertise in these areas, but when it comes to specifically investing

and looking over your entire financial picture, yeah, if you had one person again that you

trust and that you know that you at least know the history of even other people they've

worked with, you know what I mean, like that they are reputable, that I would be comfortable

with just one.

Say that because my husband and I, we just, we have one that we use and that we use for

10 years.

So they'll be able to look at this 3.5 million and say, hey, how much of this do we want

to leave liquid?

How much do we want to maybe put in into the market so that it grows and you know, maybe

you can live off that and even have some, you know, when you pass away to pass on to

your kids, right?

And so whatever that that legacy looks like for you guys, because what a wonderful position

that you're in, Elaine, I'm so, so thankful for that.

I know that's a heartbreaking thing to lose your husband and I'm so sorry, but I'm glad

the financial piece isn't a stress factor in this.

Yes, I'm very thankful to my husband.

Yes, yes, I have one more question for you.

Yeah.

So being 64, I don't yet have social security.

My husband would have been, well, he passed away, he would have been 65 this year.

So I was told, and I'm just wondering because I've heard from different people, I was told

though that I should not take social security right now or claim his because I really don't

need it right now and I never worked really outside of our home.

I did the whole life and mom and you know, all of that stuff.

So when I would get in social security would be in a fuel and I've been told that if I

wait till what later 60, 70 that I would get all of his what he would have had.

Yeah, at 67, they'll be full retirement age, so you'll get 100% of the benefit.

If you take it now, it's reduced.

And so because you don't need it, I mean, you're three years away, you get 3.5 million,

I would just wait.

And you said you're healthy?

Okay.

Yes, I am healthy.

So the longer you live, the better of a deal it becomes to take social security later.

And obviously, you know, not only knows how long we get to live, but in your case, I would

be waiting till 67.

Okay, and that's actually what my financial planner said, but like I was talking to some

friends and they were like, well, you don't know if you're going to live that long and you

could, you know, take it now.

And then if you don't need to invest that though, but, um, well, the truth is you're going

to be fine either way, Elaine.

I mean, social security is a drop in the bucket compared to the legacy that you guys have

built on your own without the help of the government.

Okay.

All right.

Well, that, Elaine helps me.

That gives me a lot of confidence.

Yes.

Can I ask the, um, the 3.5 million was that part of that life insurance?

Was that you guys over decades saving?

How did you guys, how did you accumulate that much?

It was both.

Okay.

It was both.

Um, I just got a, my husband always had life insurance, praise God.

Yeah.

And then he was a very hard worker and we did, in fact, we employed the grantee program

years ago.

And before our children married, we took them to Atlanta to see your father and go to,

you know, before they got married, and we were like, you need to do this, you know,

prerequisite.

So great, Elaine.

Oh, my goodness.

Oh, and I would, and I would wait to, Elaine, we do say, usually if there's some type of,

you know, tragedy or death, that it's okay to wait a year, right?

Just, uh, um, I don't know how, uh, when he passed away, but you can have some time.

There's no rush to do anything.

Um, so if you feel a little stressed or, or question, or not understanding, you have time

on your side.

So don't feel, um, any urgency from this financial planner to do something today, you know,

you can, you can wait a little bit and, and that's okay.

It's whenever you feel comfortable and any questions you have for this financial planner

ask and fully, fully understand before you put your money into whatever you're putting

in.

Um, so I would say those two things.

Okay.

Thank you so much.

I really appreciate it.

It helps me a lot.

Well, thanks for trusting us with the call.

I'm so sorry for your loss.

Lucy is in Lewisburg, West Virginia.

Up next.

Lucy, welcome to the show.

Hi.

How are you guys?

Great.

What's your question?

So I just turned 30.

I've got a four month old, um, married, um, last year as well.

And, um, my grandparents, when they were still alive, they had built a cabin that could comfortably

hold at least 12 to 18 people overnight.

So they made it as a vacationals for us because of what we do.

We're farmers.

Um, we don't get to go on vacation very often.

This is kind of close to us.

But my grandparents left the entire cabin in my four, well, myself and my four siblings names.

So there wasn't money to maintain that cabin.

And it's drying up.

In other words, you know, we're running out to the bottom of it.

And right now our farm is currently being growing it.

So we estimate about eight to 10,000 years when it costs to maintain the cabin.

That's everything.

And maybe a little bit extra if we have, um, stuff happens, you know, quick fixes, stuff like that.

But, um, I know first, so I'm 30.

I have another sibling that's 27, 125, and 20, 24, and then 18.

So my question is that the farm is not in a position to bankroll this for a long time.

You know, the farm will take care of it for, you know, what it needs.

But when did it ultimately become the responsibility of my siblings and I to pay for this?

Because we own it.

But we have guests and friends to stay in it too at no charge.

So yeah, you guys are going to have to just create some kind of, um, document.

Honestly, and rules and boundaries around this property.

Cause five, five people owning a property is, is pretty difficult.

And so, um, from the,

The biggest thing is that I know, at least so my brother, the only boy, um,

he will probably, we've talked about it.

And I said before, he will not find it to be able to contribute to this camp, um, year after year.

So we estimated, you know, between 15 to $2,000 a year,

each of us give into the camp to kind of, um, you know, help.

You might need to just buy his portion out and he doesn't own it anymore.

If he can.

That's the thing though.

My parents alive, like you shouldn't do that.

Just pay for his part.

You know, he can't do it.

Share it ownership and share responsibility.

And so it doesn't really matter what your parents feel like you should do.

He owns a fourth of this.

So a fourth of it is, is his responsibility.

And if he can't pay it, you guys can be generous for a little while and ship in.

But long term, you're going to have to figure out if he should be a part of this or not.

And that's going to be the harder conversation, wishing you the best as you have those conversations.

But I like Rachel's plan, make a document, make it very clear so that nobody goes,

but I thought that's not what you want.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Farer Wins Credit Union Studio.

I'm George Campbell, joined by Rachel Cruz this hour, taking your calls at AAA8255225.

Hannah is in New York City up next.

Hannah, welcome to the Ramsey Show.

Hi, how are you guys doing?

Great. How can we help?

So basically my question is, my husband and I own a gym here in New York City.

And about a year ago, right before I had our baby, we decided to move into the basement of the gym to save money on rent

and kind of make it so that I could be a stay at home mom and run the business at the same time.

And in that year, because we were able to save so much money, we paid off $70,000 of our business loans.

But we still have about $120,000 in debt.

And we're trying to decide when to move out, because we're not technically supposed to live here.

And it's not the most comfortable living situation, but we do want to pay off the rest of our debt.

Oh, boy. So when you say technically, do you mean it's not legal?

It is not zoned for it.

Oh, boy. Well, that poses a problem.

Yeah.

I mean, one is the actual legal implications.

Another one's just the integrity of the situation on top of the risk that you're putting yourself in, especially with a baby.

Yeah.

I mean, is it even safe to have a baby there?

It is safe. It means all the requirements of the windows being above ground and like the ceilings being high enough all of that.

It's just a zoning.

Got it.

Well, the real question is, why can't you guys afford rent and start to knock out the stat?

We, I mean, in New York City rent is so expensive.

We were paying $3,000 a month for an apartment that was basically, you know, a closet.

Yeah.

So can you afford to live there, Hannah?

I mean, you're not paying rent right now.

But in order to, you know, we have the four walls that we call food shelter utilities transportation.

In order to survive, you have to be able to afford it.

Would you guys be able to?

I think so.

We went from last year when we moved here.

We were only bringing in a gross $40,000 a month for the gym.

And we've improved up by $25,000 a month.

So now we're bringing in about $65,000 a month.

Nice.

How much of that do you take home?

So last year we were taking home basically nothing.

But now we're probably taking about $10,000 to $15,000 a month.

Great.

Okay.

So let's play this out.

Even if you're spending four grand a month and you make, you know, 15, that's still reasonable.

And of course, everything's just going to be more in New York City.

But it's not like you guys are making five grand a month and you're paying four grand in rent.

Right.

Yeah.

And we could probably pay the same amount of debt off that we were paying last year.

Yeah.

I would make that a goal of let's still attack the debt aggressively and have a place that is that we can legally live in and rent even if it slows you down.

Yeah.

Because eventually you're going to have to move.

You know what I mean?

So I think I would rather be on the proactive end of you all choosing them versus, I don't know, getting fined or something found out.

You know what I mean?

It's like a poor situation.

Or get sued by the city.

I don't know.

Yeah.

That sounds like I wouldn't put it past New York City.

I know.

Right.

Yeah.

I would be making this move soon.

Um, and just to set up a home and set up a, you know, a place that you guys are going to be for a while.

Where did you guys move from?

Um, just a couple blocks away.

Oh, okay.

Gotcha.

Okay.

Because we said we moved to your last year.