WOW: Rueben Bain Jr. DOMINATES College but NFL Combine Measurements Spark Top 10 Slide Fears?

It's the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day.

We also Ruben Bain Jr. dominate in the college football playoff.

But the talk of the NFL combine was the length of his arms.

Here's how much it matters.

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On this episode, we'll talk with our special guest about Carson Beck and Mark Helbell.

I think improving their stock at the NFL scouting combine and Ruben Bain Jr., there's something

that is completely out of his control that has become the talk of his draft stock.

Very happy to welcome in Max Chadwick from Profitball Focus College and he and another

friend of the show, Dalton Wasserman, host the awesome PFF college show, which is a go-to

for me in season and out of season.

So Max, I know you and your co-host and your cohorts there at PFF think very highly of

Ruben Bain.

I saw the grades he was racking up over the last couple of seasons, so what's the deal

on the arm length and how much stock should NFL GMs put into that?

I don't think a lot, but I think they will is the problem.

So I think, you know, because you look at Ruben Bain, I mean, he has the fourth shortest

arms ever at 30 and 70 inches.

Now I will say some teams, according to Adam Schefter, had Ruben Bain above 32 inches.

I don't know how it's possible to have that much of a difference.

Maybe they measured it wrong.

Maybe it is pro day.

We'll get a different measurement.

I don't know.

But if it's over 32 inches, it shouldn't be that big of a deal.

But 30 and 70 inches, like I said before, is the fourth shortest ever and would be the shortest

ever for a first round edge rusher, let alone a top five pick at edge rusher.

I still would take Ruben Bain, probably the number two overall pick.

If I'm in New York Jets right now, I still think he's one of the best players overall

of this draft class.

He won the nation of pressure this year, he had a top 10 run defense grade this year.

He was, I might be, he was the best defensive player in college football this year, coming

off a great true freshman year, a banged up sophomore year, but still a really good year

when he wasn't a fielded at sophomore year too.

So I think Ruben Bain Jr.'s worth the top five pick in the draft.

The problem is though, I just don't know if NFL GM's with that arm length, it's a huge,

huge outlier.

I don't know if they're going to take him in the top five of this draft.

You might slip to the back half of the top 10, maybe even out of the top 10, which I think

is crazy in a draft that's as wide open as this one is at the top.

For a guy like Ruben Bain who I think is a really, really great player, I would take him

in the top five.

I just don't trust the NFL GM for going to think the same way that I do.

Yeah.

I think that's well said.

So a lot of Miami Dolphin fans who wouldn't mind if he fell to number 11, but we'll find

outcome draft night.

How realistic that is.

Is there, are there any player comps for you, anyone Ruben Bain reminds you of, arm length

aside, or maybe that is part of it?

Yeah.

There's a couple guys.

You know, you look at for, man, there's a couple guys you can look at and be like, okay,

maybe, you know, I think I've seen them both in Ingram a lot for him just because they're

kind of the same type of, uh, type of size and build and all that and Melvina really productive

NFL career too.

So I think that's one you can look at, but yeah, I mean, that's the size comparisons are

kind of limited because like I said, we've just never really seen guys with this short

of arms before.

Honestly, he actually, like I said, the fourth shortest ever and actually the second shortest

in this draft class and another guy, uh, Cassius Howell, who's another projected first

round pick, uh, could be even falling out of the first run now with his arm length.

I think it's actually third shortest in this draft class considering Kaden Curry, uh,

from Ohio State also came in with like the shorter arms and room main two, but, uh, yeah,

like I said, it's a big outlier.

So it's, it's hard to find a lot of guys with similar arm length, uh, two room and main

junior.

I mean, like David Walker coming out last year, who was, uh, you know, FCS player who I really

liked a lot.

Um, he had a similar wing span, which I think wing span is actually more important than

arm length.

And room and main wing span is like 11th percentile, which again, it's not great.

Yeah.

And what it is, like the first percentile of whatever his arm length is, I think wing

span is more important than arm length, but yeah, it's hard to find too many comparisons.

But if you're looking for like a high end comp, maybe you could be like another like

Move and Ingram type of player.

All right.

So you mentioned, uh, you'd probably, if it were up to you, I wish it was.

You'd probably take Rubin in the top five, uh, but maybe it's possible he falls out of

the top 10.

Uh, what about Francis Maui Noah, uh, they could, could he, you know, could he even be

a top 10 pick kind of where, where, where do you see him going?

I can see him going as high as number three over all, honestly.

I think the Arizona Cardinals are a team that is looking for a right tackle in the future

right now.

They had a really bad right tackle play this past year from Jonah Williams.

He's going to be gone.

He's, I think as a free agent of the soft season, they're not going to bring him back.

Uh, and then you have a great left tackle in Paris, Johnson, Jr.

Don't know who the quarterback's going to be, because they're going to probably cut

Tyler Murray.

Uh, Francis Maui Noah could be a great right tackle for the quarterback's going to be

for Arizona as well.

So I think he was high as number, number three overall in this draft, honestly, and he

could go to the Giants.

Maybe if not there, number three, maybe the Giants, number five overall, the Browns, number

six overall.

I think Francis Maui Noah is going to be a top 10 pick in this draft, especially with

the tackle class after him is kind of wide open, whereas you look at, you know, came

in product of where I like a lot, but it seems like most people are a little bit lower

on him.

He seems to be more like a late first round pick than anything else.

Uh, and then you look at a guy like Spencer Fano, who came in with really, really short

arms at the combine, so much so that people are debating now whether or not he's playing

Gaurd or even center.

He actually worked out at center at the combine too.

So I think out of all the guys who I trust will be tackles at the NFL level, Francis

Maui Noah, I think is is clear of, of most of them in most GM's eyes.

So I think he is, for most people, going to be the clear cut number one tackle in this

draft.

And in many cases, it's going to be a top five pick in this draft too.

So I think, I think his range starts at number three overall, uh, with the airs, uh,

honestly right now.

And I would love that for him.

So you know, if we're pretty confident that Maui Noah and Bane are first round picks, uh,

what about a Keem Mezzador?

Can he sneak into the first round despite, you know, he sees a little older, although we,

I guess we're going to see more of these guys now with unlimited eligibility and everything.

You know, Keem is 24 now.

He would be 25 by the time the next NFL season starts.

Uh, how much does that hurt a Keem's draft stock?

He's just, he looks like a first round pick to me, uh, Max.

Yeah, I agree with you.

I think he's going to be a first round pick, honestly.

I think his stock is rising enough for teams will probably look at taking him, uh, somewhere

in the first round now.

I can see this guy being a top 25 pick in the draft, honestly, at this point in this

edge class too.

So yeah, he is older and that is a, that is a question mark, uh, for him right now.

He also generally come in with great measurable, either at the combine.

You know, he came in at six foot three, two sixty.

These arms are barely over 32 inches, too, which is about 12 percentile for edge rushers.

So it's not like he has very long arms either, but really good run defender.

He was a great pass rusher this last year at Miami.

You look, yeah, the age is a concern for sure because it's probably not much of a high ceiling

there with a key message door.

But in the range where he's going to pick somewhere in the 20s, probably, he's probably

going to a team that just made the playoffs.

They're not looking for a high ceiling player, right?

They want a guy that's going to contribute immediately to their roster.

So any team that's picking somewhere from, I don't know, 20 through 32, the end of the

first round that's looking for an edge rusher.

I think a key message door is certainly a guy that's going to be on their radar.

Especially with a guy like Cassius Howell who a lot of people had above a key message

we're going into it.

I don't know if Cassius Howell is even above a key message door anymore with the arm length

even shorter than a key message door.

And like I said, the shortest ever for an edge rusher too.

So he's probably jumping Cassius Howell on big boards among edge rushers too.

And then after that, I mean, you got Celtic Falk who has a lot of questions as a pass

rusher, who's above the guy from Auburn.

And after that, it's really talking about David Bailey and Ruben Bain, right?

So I think a key message door has a chance to be the third, third or fourth true edge

taken in the draft, depending on what you think our goal Reese is.

We would love to hear three hurricanes names called the first night of the NFL draft.

But when we come back here with Max Chadwick from Profitball Focus, I want to talk about

a couple of players who seem to raise their stock in the combine.

Carson Beck and Big Mark Calbell.

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Thank you so much for making locked on canes your first listen have the pleasure of being

joined by Max Chadwick PFF college football show pro football focus dot com I love these

evals all right so so Max you know one of the one of the more viral combine workouts was

Carson back because he was getting booed there by the Hoosier and fighting Irish faithful

on hand in Indianapolis but it looked like he had a really good workout back including

you know that that go route that he hit you dropped in a dime what do you hear in the

chatter on Carson Beck's draft stock as I've seen a wide range of guesses on where he might

go yeah it's pretty wild that they're booing him out there when it's like hey man I think

in the NFAs are probably grateful to him right throwing him that the end of the game right

they won him a national championship so I can beat him in the next game right so I was like all right

I guess kind of it was a kind of a weird like but also like don't boo guys in the combine I get

it like it's like I get it like they're rival schools if it is a rival school which I don't

like Miami is well Miami is Notre Dame a little bit but obviously uh which makes sense because you

you kicked him out of the playoff which rightfully so uh so I get maybe Notre Dame fans do that

but Indiana fans like I don't know what the hell you're pulling him out there for uh honestly but

I think he's probably he's probably gonna go in the fourth round of the draft if I had to imagine

I think he's firmly in the top five quarterback conversation in this draft right now um maybe

even right outside of it if it's cold paid and jump some on team's big boards I don't think he

should probably should right now but um obviously you've got the big two of Mendoza and Ty

Simpson both those guys probably my first round picks I think Garrett Nussmeyer is probably

going to be the third one taken in this draft and then it seems like Dural or the Penn State

quarterbacks really leaping on a lot of people a lot of people's boards right now he might be QB4

in this class if not higher I'm maybe even QB3 but I have the Carson Beck's pride right after that

and you know what you like in Carson Beck is you know there's not really that high of a ceiling with

him but there's a high floor right you know exactly what you're getting in a Carson Beck he's a

game manager, the packer he's a good distributor of the football he gets rid of the ball on time

that's why I love about Carson Beck is that you know Miami did have one of the best offensive lines

in the country this past year but he also really helped his offensive line by getting it out

very very fast now I have some concerns with the arm strength you know after that elbow surgery

it seemed like he lost a lot of zip on the ball they even had it Georgia and he had like a B plus arm

at Georgia and it looked like he had even worse arm this year at Miami too so a little bit of

questions marks about that but and I think overall as a game manager back up type of quarterback

for a long time in the NFL I don't know if he has starter a starter ceiling in the NFLs I should

say he could start a few games for you and hold down the fort when need be but I'm not drafting

this guy thinking he can develop into a starting quarterback I think I'm drafting this guy

thinking he could be really good backup in the NFL for a very long time so that's probably

to go somewhere around the fourth round at least day three of the NFL draft by the McRition right

now always one of my favorite parts of the combine is watching the big guys 300 plus run the 40 yard

dash you know there's not too many situations in an actual game where a left tackle is just going to

be running straight 40 yards down the field in one burst but we still get to see it at the

combine and Markel Bell who is Miami starting left tackle this past season at six foot nine yeah

three hundred forty six pounds like he's you know one of the like the third or fourth tallest guy

at the combine in the last twenty two twenty three years it's hard pressed for me to even think of

the two guys who were taller than him in the last twenty some years but he runs a five three six

like the big man can move now I know and I'm interested in your take on Markel Bell because he

was a late bloomer he started his career at juco we really saw him the last couple years at Miami

kind of really start to polish his technique before our eyes so he hasn't like I still don't think

he's a finished product do you think NFL teams will view him the same way and how you know what

round range do you think Markel's going to be drafted in yeah I think certainly day three probably

somewhere fourth or fifth round if I had to imagine right now but you know teams are going to look

at him he looks like an NBA power for right he's a you know the admission six foot nine three

hundred forty six pounds and you know look we went from four out of the short arms for

Ruben Bain and a Kim Bezador this guy has like a weak length for a tackle right he has over almost

thirty six and a half inch arms just ninety ninth percentile for an offensive tackle over an eighty

seven inch wingspan to which is ninety ninth percentile for an offensive tackle to weirdly enough

he's got first percentile hand size at nine inch hands finally is that huge of a deal for him but

it's a little weird that he's got these massive numbers all over the place and they only first

percentile for hand size but yeah he moved a little bit better than we thought you know running

a five three six it's only 18th percentile for tackles but you know it's of course adjusted

considering he's three hundred fifty pounds and six foot nine out there it's an honestly a one

eight the forty yard dash is a good number to look at at the top end speed but it's not often

that offensive lineman are going to run 40 yards down field the more important number to look at

in the four yard dash is the ten yard split for offensive lineman and he had a thirty eighth

percentile ten yard split so a little bit a still blow average but a little bit more closer to

average which I think is really good for guy his size to about a one eight four for a ten yard

split too so yeah I think Marquette Bell there's a lot of tools to like there I think there's

still some things to clean up in this game he had a solid year overall I think it might as Miami's

left tackle I thought he'd look at a solid week overall the senior bull two I know a lot of

more remember the Derek Moore Clipery you ran him over but actually after that you know Marquette Bell

what I love about him is that he kept competing then if he wanted Derek Moore over and over again

just to go back at him a little bit and get his revenge on him a little bit too so you love the

competitive fire from Marquette Bell but yeah I think right now I think I would project him as

probably a definitely a day three pick I don't think he's sneaking into the top a hundred of

this draft but probably like a fourth or fifth round pick might do magic right now all right so

enough of this draft stuff because I couldn't possibly have a conversation with Max Chadwick

without asking you your take on Darian Mensa who's going to be taking the reins at QB1 for Miami

this upcoming season you know taken what he did at Duke where he had really an incredible statistical

year should have you know more talent around him and better complimentary football on defense at

Miami how do you project Darian Mensa at the U I very highly I think Miami is firmly the I think

out of all the conferences in the power for right now I think Miami should be the biggest favorite

to win their conference right now I think it's Miami and everybody else in the ACC right now so

and I think the big reason for that is getting Darian Mensa I think it's a top 10 quarterback in

the country I think I had him ninth in my my rankings he loved the power for passing yards

this past year and what I love too is that he's got an elite supporting cast man you know you got

Mark Fletcher a top 10 running back in the country there too you have Malachite Tony my opinion

the second best receiver in college football Cooper Barcai transferring in from Duke probably top

15 receiver in college football maybe the best receiver duo still a lot to replace in the offensive

line but you getting really excited about some of the guys they're bringing in there like Jackson

Cantwell with the number one overall recruit at a offensive tackle he could be a instant starter I

think it offensive tackle for the hurricanes this year and could be an instant star at tackle for

them too so yeah and the defense is still loaded right well the defense of line for Miami and

even though they lost some pieces they brought some really really good players and I love some

of the young guys like Marquis Lightfoot I think is in for a huge break out year this year too

and Damon Wilson is a great ad from Missouri too so there's still a lot of great pieces defensively

you got to rebuild that offensive line a little bit but you got a superstar quarterback I think

Miami and I know he brought them all the ways in the national title game I know Miami fans are

always appreciative for that honestly Alex I think Miami upgraded quarterback this off season I

really do I really do and whenever you do that after making a national title game it's it's scary

I think Miami is firmly the ACZ favorite right now and firmly a national title contender going

in next year yeah I think something you said about Carson Becker earlier hit the nail on the head

like ceiling was very or sorry the floor was very high but Darian mentioned to me I think

significantly raises the ceiling yeah that's kind of how I look at the situation upcoming huge

thank you to Max Chadwick for joining us I mentioned you want to check him out on the PFF

college football show he and Dalton Wasserman do an awesome job also follow Max on

X at CFB Max Chadwick thank you so much my friend and keep up the awesome work thanks Alex

appreciate you I love it we'll talk to everybody next time on another episode of Lockdown Keynes

we're part of the number one Lockdown podcast network your team every day