131: The Best and Worst Plants to Eat on an Animal-Based Diet (And How to Prepare Them)

In a most people come to an animal-based diet and assume the goal is to eliminate

Every plant from the plate and honestly, I get it when you've spent

Years being told that Kaley's a superfood and you finally learned it

It's loaded with oxalates and goitrachens the pendulum can swing pretty hard and now it did for me

But that's not the full picture, you know, and today I want to give you

The nuanced version because the reality is that not all plants are created equal and the blankets

Plants or baths take leaves a lot on the table now. This is not a pro plant episode

But it's also not an anti-plant episode. It's a it's a framework episode how to think about plants strategically

And hopefully by the end you'll know which plants earn a place on your plate

Which ones to treat with caution and which ones to mostly leave behind?

Welcome to the Primarchive podcast

The thing here is there is a lot of nuance. There is a lot of personal or individual sensitivities

There is a there are preparation methods to take into account. There are a lot of

things that don't easily fit in a framework or in a in a rigid framework that is at least so

My goal with this episode is to paint a somewhat flexible framework

One that you can use to get started, but one that allows you to

modify and change things as you go as you learn more about how your body responds to individual plants

And I'm gonna give you some specific example of plants that are that fall into the good category that I don't tolerate very well

And some plants that fall into the absolute the not so good category that I seem to be tolerating significantly better

But nonetheless

Talking about a framework having a framework a starting point is very useful if you're new to animal-based eating or if you

Realize that whatever you're doing right now isn't working and you need to change something, but you don't quite know

How to do that

Before we get into all of that, you know, let's just make one thing clear, you know plants aren't health foods

Plants don't want to be eaten, you know, that's really the starting point. That's the realization you need to have

It's also true that animals don't want to be eaten

But unlike animals plants typically don't run or have teeth to defend themselves

You know, they cannot run from the predator that is the human being or another animal

So they evolved using chemical defenses like toxins, antonutrients, enzyme inhibitors, inflammatory proteins, etc

And those aren't in plants in trace amounts in some cases or in some plants there is significant enough

To cause real physiological harm

And some of the key compounds that I'm sure you've heard about but just to reiterate it so we all on the same page are

Oxylates, you know, they bind minerals like calcium and magnesium and they can accumulate in kidneys and soft tissue

So if you have kidney stones or you know, joint

pain, etc

Those could be caused by oxylates

Lactins is another great example and they can damage the gut lining they can contribute to leaky gut

They interfere with nutrient absorption

etc

Phytates is another one that blocks the absorption of zinc iron and magnesium. So another

Anti-nutrient literally then they have goitrogens they interfere with thyroid hormone production

And they are specifically found in kale and spinach and brassicas like broccoli

And there are a lot of them in those specific plants

And then there are protease inhibitors

So they as the name implies disrupt protein digestion

And those are only

what I want to three four five out of

A dozen or more

Antenuitrient and plant toxins that we know that might be even some that we don't know yet

And if you have the things or if you have the factors that are important are dosing obviously

And your individual tolerance and that can be different you know for anybody and so

some people might respond incredibly

Negatively to oxylates while others respond more to lectins. So it again that goes back to

You know make a trusting the framework to make it work for you

Another thing that's

Fair to say is that someone with a healthy gut and the robust metabolic function can likely handle plants

Better or a specific plant load better than someone with a leaky gut and autoimmune issues

Now that doesn't necessarily mean if you're metabolically healthy and I have a healthy gut that you should be eating a lot of plants

But it likely means that you can get away with significantly more than someone else

Which is likely the reason why I tend to be able to get away with certain things that someone else cannot

Not just because you can get away with something doesn't necessarily mean you should and you have to

That's another nuance to keep into to keeping consideration now

I think about plants and toxicity

as a spectrum and

Because and not all plants repeat not all what I mean by that is that not all plants sit in the same category

So I like to think of a think of plants of a I put them in a four tier system roughly

Once that I can eat freely once that I can eat the moderation once the one category for plants that I eat occasionally

And then others to completely avoid now again my

The way I categorize those plants might be different to how you do so in this episode

I'm going to share with you my starting point

That's how I started and then I point out where and how I modified and why that is the key variables that determine

Where plant where plant lands in those four categories is the concentration of

Antenutrients and seeds and the skin usually carry the most

Antenutrients so by deceating and removing the skin or peeling the plant

You remove in many cases a lot of the Antenutrients

The second category is whether or the second factor is whether

Preparation can neutralize the worst offender so can I soak ferment

peel

Heat etc

To remove a lot of the Antenutrients

Metabolic health and gut health we talked about this already

And then how much you're eating and how often that's also a major factor

I can get away with eating

sourdough once a week and not even notice if I eat it every day

I noticed a negative impact that you know the grains in the sourdough have on my overall health

and so the general hierarchy

From least to most problematic as I see it are

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Number one on the top of it

A ripe low seed fruits like berries, avocados, olives, coconut ash and the last couple day

Sound like veggies but they are technically fruits

number next

Step in the hierarchy would be the peeled and deseeded veggies

So those include all the squashes like cucumber, zucchini, classic squash, pumpkins etc

All of those would fall into that category

Then there are tubers like potatoes, sweet potatoes, yams

Especially when properly prepared and we'll talk about preparation methods

What I mean in the context of tubers

Then there are fermentable vegetables like cabbage, onion, garlic

It's very context-dependent so those are not usually the ones that

You know that I would recommend you eat a lot

But the fermentation can make a meaningful difference

And then there are leafy greens and brassicas like kale, spinach, broccoli, you know the health foods that aren't really

And then in the last bucket are grains, legumes, seeds and nuts

Now here is the nuance

I tend to tolerate some of those much better

Then for example

Potatoes even when prepared properly

I can eat more sourdough bread and potatoes without noticing the negative impact

Or their negative impact

And so let's dive right into it and talk about each of those buckets and what they specifically entail and why

And so the past the best plans arguably for an animal-based diet are sweet

And I would say that berries are probably very much on top of that

You know strawberries, raspberries, blueberries, blackberries

They have a fairly low, a glycemic index meaning they are low in sugar

And they have a fairly low anti-nutrient content

They have antioxidants, you know if you're into that

The caveat is that raspberries do have oxalates, you know

To varying degrees so if you're

Dealing with oxalates, with kidney stones, et cetera, kidney issues, leaky gut, et cetera

I would probably not

indulge in raspberries too much

Blueberries, you know, might be the better option for your strawberries rather than raspberries

Next one up are avocados, olives, you know coconut, those, you know, fruits that don't sound like fruits

They are very high in fat typically they are relatively low in sugar or no sugar at all

And they have minimal toxin loads

Obviously don't eat the seed of the avocado but nobody does anyway or the peel

You know, those would be still fairly high in toxins

But the flesh itself is relatively low in toxins

Low in in carbs and those are generally

Some of the best fruits that don't sound like fruits that you can have on an animal-based diet

I really love avocados even though they are not grown here in Georgia

I like coconuts and I like olives as well

Sweet fruits, you know, are also fine

Typically the sweetness of a fruit is an indication that the plants want you to eat it

You know, that's why they are sweet, they look delicious

The plant really wants you to eat them and then poop out the seeds somewhere else so that the plant can proliferate

That's the purpose of sweet fruits

And most people do fairly well with them

You know, I can have apples and oranges and all of those things without any negative impact

Now they might raise your blood sugar

They might cause a spike in blood sugar

That is true so if you're, you know, diabetic or prediabetic

Maybe the sweetest of the fruits are not necessarily ideal

But if you consume the whole fruit, rather drinking just the juice

You know, you still get some of the fiber that slows down

The conversion from the carbs in the fruit

You know, to glucose and then cause a lower relatively speaking blood sugar spike

Not that, you know, you need fiber for digestion

But fiber does slow down that conversion that can be beneficial

If you want to consume sweet fruits

Now with bananas there is one caveat that I should point out is

ripe bananas are fine

Bananas that have not ripe and yet contain higher amounts of lectins

You know, that anti-nutrient that can cause issues

So ripe is generally better

One thing that doesn't really fall into either the animal or plant-based category per se

Is raw honey, you know, that's an entirely different category

But since we're talking about sweet stuff raw honey is typically fine

Even if you're, if you have blood sugar issues based on the studies I've seen

raw honey can actually be quite beneficial

And it doesn't mean you should be eating a gallon of honey every day

You know, instead of protein and fat

But you can have honey

Even if you have blood sugar issues

And because it's not only the sugar in the honey

The love trace minerals and other elements that are beneficial overall

I like honey, we have our own bees

So we produce our own honey and we do eat it quite a bit

Next up are peeled and deseeded veggies

So your cucumbers, your zokinis, your squashes, etc

If you remove the skin and the seeds

Then you remove also most of the toxin load

And you know, we have pumpkins, we have zokinis

We have you know, there are, you know, tools out there

Especially if you're into zokini or cucumbers, etc

That you can deseed them like with, you know, one step

You know, seeds are gone, fairly easy

Peeling obviously is relatively easy as well

And then you just slice them or do whatever with it

And you know, they're not, not a source of nutrients per se

But they're flavor, you know, they're aside

They, you know, can fill you up

You know, if you maybe want to, you know

Reduce the amount of food you eat overall

Like I'm a big eater, you know

And I don't always need, you know, all of the food that I eat

But I do it anyway

And if you fall into that category, you know, having some of those

Harmless plants as a side can be beneficial

Next one up are tubers

And tier of preparation is incredibly important, you know

Potatoes specifically have most of their

Antenutrients in the skin

Because that's the part that protects

The tube, the inside of it

From the elements because tubers are in the ground

So they need a very very good barrier

And that is the skin

And that has a lot of those

Antenutrients, you absolutely, there is no reason you should never, ever

Consume potatoes with the skin on

Or most other tubers peel them, you know

Get rid of those antenutrients, there's no benefit in eating that stuff

And then they're always also best when cooked, you know

Don't eat raw tubers

Specifically potatoes, I mean, you probably notice eating a raw potato

Not a good thing

So cooking them, I would cook all of the tubers

You know, be it

You know carrots or

You know, beets obviously and parsnips, you know, cook them properly

That reduces their antenutrient load even further

You know, with potatoes in particular

And with most other things really

A tubers as well, you can ferment them

You know, just in a simple saline solution

2.5% saline solution, ferment them

For a couple of days

And that further reduces the glycemic index

As well as their antenutrient count

And when combined with peeling them

They can be quite compatible with an animal-based diet

Now, not as a daily staple necessarily

But as a useful tool

I mentioned before, I alluded to it

That if I eat too many potatoes

My stomach doesn't feel right

And so, I can have them in moderation on occasion

But not as a daily staple

You know, white rice is maybe something

That's not a tuber, obviously

It's more of a grain

But white rice can also be

Some people tolerate it well

Again, for me

In moderation, I cannot have too much white rice

But if you do consume rice

Soaking, white rice is better than brown rice

That comes with the brand

Because that's where most of the antenutrients live

So I don't buy into the brown rice is better

Because it has fiber

It also has a lot of the antenutrients

That cause more damage than the fiber does good

If fiber does any good at all

So white rice soaked properly overnight

Discard the water

And then cook it in clean water

That's something that you can do

Again, test it out, see how you tolerate it

I don't tolerate it in greater amount

Mushrooms, you know, they are technically fungi and are not plants

But worse, including

You know, that's also something

You have to test it

And see how you respond to it

I do find with most mushrooms

You know, when properly cooked, et cetera

But I wouldn't eat it as a daily staple

They are toxins and they are

Other toxins and you would find in regular

In vegetables but nonetheless

It really depends on your individual tolerance and sensitivities

Now let's talk about some of the worst plants

We've talked about the good ones

Now we talk about some of the likely not so good ones

And leafy greens

You know, are the sacred cows of the wellness world

But they are really for the most part

Some of the worst plants you can eat

Now there are some exceptions

So the things that I would absolutely not eat

Our kale, spinach and chart

You know, I now consistently push the superfoods

But there are some of the worst offenders

There are some of the worst oxalates levels

And oxalates you cannot mitigate

That's the one new antonutrient

That there is no way known to human

To mitigate

Meaning to remove by cooking, by fermenting, by sprouting

Whatever oxalates won't go away

Maybe at some point in the future we'll find a way

But as of right now

They, you know, they accumulate

They bind minerals and they contribute to kidney stones

And so if you've kidney stones already or someone in the family with kidney stones

Chances are they got them from oxalates in your food

And not from, you know, eating meat and a lot of salt

And

So those, I would just, you know, avoid

You know, same goes with, you know, with brusicas

Like broccoli and cauliflower

They are usually, you know, nothing good comes with them

You know, they're full of quadrotrans

They compete with iodine uptake, uptake

And they can suppress thyroid function

And this is especially relevant for anyone already dealing with thyroid issues

Needless to say

And

The good news is that cooking significantly reduces at least the quadrotrans

Not the oxalates

But if you eat broccoli

Cook it, you know, never ever eat that crap raw

Or put it in the juice in a raw juice or whatever

You just get the full toxic load

And as a rule of thumb, I stay away from leafy greens

Now, lettuce is somewhat of an exception to that

Not that I'm a huge fan of lettuce

But lettuce is arguably among the leafy greens the least problematic ones

If you like, you know, spring lettuce or whatever

And some, you know, I don't know, with meat on top or shrimp on top

Or salmon or whatever you, by all means, you know, have your lettuce

Just don't make it spinach kale

And, you know, those type of leafy greens that are full of oxalates

Nitrates is another example of

likely problematic plants and nitrates include, you know, tomatoes, peppers,

eggplants, they're, they contain a lot of lectins

Solanine and other alkaloids that are gut irritating

For a meaningful subset of people

You know, this is not just all, you know, one in a million is sensitive to those

No, most people I would argue are

And you really have to pay attention

Now, solanine, if you have never heard about this, is a naturopesticide

And that's concentrated

So often as other anti-nutrients as well

Or toxin as well in the skin and in the seeds

So if you make, if you grow tomatoes like we do, you know, removing the seeds

Removes a lot of the problems

Now, if you remove the skin and the seeds from a tomato

There's not really anything left

So we typically, when we eat tomatoes, we remove the skin

Sorry, we remove the seeds, but we leave the skin on

Again, that works based on our sensitivity and tolerance

It might not work for you, but that's what's experimenting with at least

Generally speaking, I've noticed that I do well, really well with peppers

Surprisingly, I can have peppers every day

I really like, I've come to like jalapenos, we grow them ourselves

Even with the seeds of the jalapenos now

True, we don't eat the jalapenos every single day

With every single meal, they are seasonal

So, you know, it's somewhat limited

Even though we can or we, you know, we can them

So we have them for longer

But it's not something that we eat in huge amounts

But the amounts that we do eat, we seem to be doing fairly well

Even though I should say the part that's spicy of the jalapeno, the seeds

That's really the plant telling you don't eat me

You know, so if you think about that, you know, it makes a whole lot of sense

And if you're sensitive, if you're not in top metabolic health

If your gut tells you it's not top notch

Maybe removing nitrates altogether is probably a very smart idea

Next up are grains, I mean, those are really the crop tonight of most

Healthy diets, including paleo and obviously carnivore, also animal-based

So grains are very problematic

And that includes, you know, the wheat oats, corn, rye, barley, rice

For that matter, which we talked about before

And the reason, or the, some of the main issues with grains are the lectins

You know, particularly what's called wheat-term glutinine

Phytates and gluten, obviously

And gluten isn't just a problem or a celiac issue

It's an intestinal permeability issue

For much of the broader population

So even if you don't have celiac disease

And you don't get a full-blown immune system response to eating

Or being exposed to gluten

Your gut is likely going to respond

Now the good news is, or the bad news is where, you know, the brand

Of that seed is where most of the anti-nutrients live

And so that's one of the examples where white rice is lower risk than brown rice

Also fermentation, so if you do sourdough properly

It degrades a significant portion of the gluten and phytates

The problem is that most commercial sourdough

Isn't fermented long enough to matter

So if you buy a sourdough bread in the store

It's likely going to be as problematic as regular bread

But if you make it at home, like, you know, casitas

Where she doubles ferment sourdough over several days

Then there is a good chance that it's significantly more compatible

With your health in your dietary framework than otherwise

Now that doesn't mean eating bread every day is a good idea

It is not

But you can probably have some without negative impact

And I've noticed that having sourdough maybe once a week, maybe twice a week

I can handle without noticing any negative side effects

If I have more, I do notice it

And so, you know, gotta play with it

But processing preparation matters a lot for those highly problematic

Types of plants

Legumes is another great example, you know, beans, lentils, soy, peanuts, chickpeas, etc

They're also very high in lectins and high in phytates

And soy in particular, you know, is also an endocrine disruptor

It's a phytoestrochense as you might have heard already

If you've been following me for a while

Mimic the sex hormone estrogen in the body

And that's not a good thing

That's especially relevant for man and for kids

But also for women

You know, you don't need fake estrogen in your body

Coming from plants, you know

And so

If, but if you soak

And if you cook the grains that reduces lectins significantly

But it doesn't eliminate them

Fermenting reduces lectins and gluten

But it doesn't completely eliminate them

What I, the way I see it is

I categorically exclude soy from our, we all do

We don't eat soy

We seem to be doing fine with peanuts in certain amounts

And with peanut butter

The rest we don't really eat

Once a year for Costa Rica National Day

We eat a dish that contains beans

That we grow in our garden

That our daughter grows

So that's a one a year

You know, our currents

Celebrating Costa Rica National Day

Or Independence Day

Soy is completely off limits

Mostly because of the phytoestrochense

And peanuts

You know, we seem to be doing fine in limited amounts

Same goes for nuts and seeds

You know, with nut trees now on our property

And we'll probably eat some of that

We eat some, you know, nuts occasionally

Like, you know, just a handful of mixed nuts or whatever

But it's not something

That most people do well with

And there is really no need

There is nothing in nuts that you particularly need

To be honest

You know, if you have it for a snack ever's off

I mean, it's probably fine

But listen to your body

If you feel like, you know, digestive system

Changes after eating nuts

Like it does for our little one

There is your telltale, you know

Don't eat nuts

Now, let's talk about preparation a little bit

Because that's one nuance

That most people skip

And it's super important

If you want to make certain plants a part of your diet

If you say, you know what?

Don't care for them, don't bother

But most people

They want to eat certain plants

And they ought to learn how to process them

So they make them

More compatible with the physiology

And the six methods

I think that matter

That you gotta

That you gotta learn

And some of them are super easy

Because you've probably done it already

And number one is peeling and deceiving

You know, just remove the most toxic parts of the plant

You know, tomato remove the seeds at least

You know, if you make a squash

You know, peel the squash

I mean, you probably don't eat the skin of a squash anyway

But peel it

And remove the skins

Fermenting

You know, that's something that takes longer

That requires some expertise

Some learning has a learning curve to it

But it's significant

It decrates the phytates

It improves mineral absorption

Or the mineral blocking

And it reduces the glycemic index

And all of this is a good thing

So we ferment sourdough

Meaning grains

We ferment potatoes

And it takes a little bit

It's not fast food

But fast food isn't good anyway

It's slow food

But it's better food at the end of the day

Healthier

Doesn't mean healthy but healthier

Soaking is another thing

And we do it with rice in particular

You know, if you have beans or whatever

Same applies to beans

You know, soak them overnight

Discard the water

And then cook them with fresh water

That's super useful for all types of legumes

And you know, grains as well

Sprouting

You know, that again, segregates certain

Antonutrients

Like phytates and proteas inhibitors

You know, if you're into

In like eating, you know, grains or whatever

And you sprout them

Or even beans and sprout them first

Your way ahead of the game

And you could potentially make them part of your diet

Heating and cooking

And that's obvious

In many cases

But not for everyone

You know, eating raw veggies

In many cases

Is it a terrible idea?

Because those veggies contain

The most amount of antonutrients

And toxins overall

If you cook and heat them

Specifically tubers

You remove and destroy a lot of those

Heat-sensitive antonutrients

And including the goitrotrans in Brasica

So

No raw

Smoothies

No raw veggies

You know, cook them first properly

You know, you're not a cow

And you're not a rabbit

Milling is another example

That you know, for example, removes the brand layer

Where most of the grain

Antonutrients are concentrated

And so that's also, again, why

White rice is better than brown rice

Now

The caveat with all of those processing methods is

That none of these

Remove or eliminate 100% of plant toxins

They reduce the load

But they don't remove them completely

The goal should be, in my opinion,

To reduce the toxic load down to a level

That matches your metabolic health

So down to a level that your body can handle

If you choose to include certain plants

On your animal-based diet

If you're currently dealing with gut issues

With auto-immunity, with metabolic disease, etc

You know, the preparation method

Doesn't change my recommendation

In the sense of, you know, minimized plants

Remove plants from your diet

Unless you're in a

Until you're in a position

Where you can handle some of the toxic load

And also

Just because you can handle a toxic load

Doesn't necessarily mean you have to

Because if you think about it

We get exposed to so many toxins

Environmental toxins from the air

From, you know, skin care products

From clothing

From laundry detergent

From

All around us

There is toxicity that our body

Has to handle and deal with

And

Plants

Or food in general

Is the one thing that we have

Much more under control than the air that we breathe

Or

You know, maybe the environment we live in

And so

It's easier to cut out

Or reduce your toxic load from there

Than it is

You know, doing something else

And

What I'm trying to say here is that

Nutrition is a very powerful level

You know, if you're not in

Tipitope de shape

Maybe I trust your diet first

But before trying to tackle

You know, air quality issues

And other things

You know, it's a fairly low hanging

Fruit pun intended

And another thing that I want to point out

And reiterate is that

The same food

You know, can be fine for one person

And problematic for another

And I give you one example from the animal-based world

You know, if you're in an animal-based diet

Chances are you consume raw dairy maybe

Or you've heard that raw dairy is so good

Because a lot of influences in us

Whereby it

I cannot have raw dairy

I cannot have any dairy

Only in very small amounts

And I notice that if I drink milk

And it can be that best A2A2

Grass-fed milk

From

You know, regenerative racists

Dairy cows etc

My body odor changes

And not for the better

You know, if I cut out dairy

I don't have to use the odor

Now one could argue

Well, maybe, you know, human should

Should stink to a degree

I don't know that to be true

Or not to be true

But

I kind of lean towards not smelling bad

Is better

Also from an ancestor perspective

Doesn't attract predators quite as much

You know, then if I don't smell

I mean, I smell always

But if it's more neutral

It's probably better

For overall survival in the wild

And smelling, you know

More distinctively

And so that's an example of

That raw dairy might work for many

It doesn't for me

On the other hand, nitrates

And tomatoes and peppers in particular

I can have

I mean, I'm not eating, you know, a

A pound of peppers every day

But the, you know, smaller amounts that I have

During growing season

Almost on a daily basis

I seem to be doing fine

Again, personal, you know

Differences, nuance, tolerances

All of that matter

You have to experiment

Listen to your body

And find out what works for you

Now, if you want to

If you want to have some sort of a

Practical self-testing protocol

Eliminate as a suspected food for three to four weeks

You know, because some reactions

Really take a while to clear

If I stop drinking dairy

It takes me a while to stop smelling

And it also takes me a while to start smelling

When I start drinking dairy again

So

You have to give it some time

And then, you know, reduce

Whatever you've eliminated on its own

And pay attention for the next 48 to 72 hours

Not just the immediate symptoms

And pay specific attention to

You know, digestive systems

Maybe shifts in energy levels

Skin changes, sleep quality, mood

You know

Don't rely on how something tastes

Or how healthy you've been told it is

Really listen to your body

And to wrap this episode up

Because it's been long enough already

The bottom line here really is

You know, the question

Shouldn't be

Should I eat plants or not

It's which plants

How much

And how prepared

And based on that

You can build your own foundation

Hopefully what I told you today

Can guide you

Can be your general framework

And from there

You kind of, you know, experiment

Just keep in mind that

The foundation always tastes the same

Muscle meat

From ruminants

Organes

Eggs

Wild-cooked seafood

You know, animal fats

And then plants play as a porting role

You know, flavor

Variety

Cultural connection

Strategic carbs

Maybe for athletes

And then tear your choices

By toxin load, you know, the fruit

And peel vegetables

Before leafy greens and legumes, etc

And figure out how to prepare

Some of those things that are more on the toxic side

To see if you can make them

A part of your diet without any negative impact

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They are not

And if you want to download

My animal-based diet guide

You know, I leave a link down in the show notes

It's a PDF that goes through all of those categories

With all of the details I've mentioned

Even more so than what I could cover in this episode

So download it, check it out

And use it as a framework

And let me know

What do you think?

How it's been working for you

If you're watching this

Or listening to this on a platform

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All of this helps

Others find this episode as well

I appreciate it

And I'll see you in the next one

Thanks for watching