271. Healthy Churches, Healthy Leaders: Restoring God's Original Blueprint for Local Churches (with Natalie Runion)

I am so thrilled to welcome Natalie Runion back in the studio for today’s episode. If you remember my last conversation with her, then you likely remember how it left me deeply moved and inspired, and this time is no different. Natalie joins me to discuss her new book The House That Jesus Built: Leading Our Churches Back to God's Original Blueprint, and I'm excited to get to learn from her again.

Natalie’s latest work picks up where her previous book Raised to Stay leaves off, with this new book addressing the reconstruction of faith, focusing on rebuilding a church that’s true to its biblical roots. Natalie shares how the journey of deconstructing faith doesn’t have to mean discarding it but can instead lead to a more authentic and healthy church environment.

Join us we explore what makes a church truly healthy, with Natalie emphasizing that it’s not about the size or programs but the genuine presence of the Holy Spirit. We discuss practical markers of a thriving church community, including how to handle conflict biblically and the importance of having genuine leaders.

We also touch on the concept of finding ministry opportunities right in our everyday lives and how even the smallest acts of kindness can be significant. Natalie challenges us to rethink what it means to serve and engage with our church community, urging us to be a source of support and encouragement rather than simply seeking it.

I hope that you will listen in for this insightful conversation that promises to be both thought-provoking and encouraging. You might just find yourself inspired to look at your own church community in a new light, so don’t miss it! Be sure to also read Raised to Stay if you haven’t already and pre-order The House That Jesus Built!

In This Episode

[0:35] - I welcome Natalie Runion back to the show!

[1:57] - Raised to Stay tackles faith deconstruction, emphasizing rebuilding rather than discarding.

[4:00] - Church, Natalie argues, is a community of broken people with shared faith; focusing on biblical purposes can manage expectations and foster connections.

[6:13] - A healthy church focuses on repentance, worship, and outreach, with the presence of the Holy Spirit as the true measure of health.

[8:20] - True church leadership requires shepherds called to protect and guide, avoiding celebrity culture.

[11:02] - Large churches can thrive when multiple shepherds, mentored by the lead pastor, actively care for the congregation.

[13:23] - Natalie points out that addressing abuse in the church requires discernment, although leaving may be necessary if it's unsafe to speak up.

[15:31] - Ministry opportunities are often found in everyday actions, like helping neighbors, rather than on grand stages.

[17:13] - True ministry focuses on seeking the Holy Spirit's presence, even in ordinary settings, rather than pursuing platforms.

[19:15] - Ministry also often means stepping outside our comfort zones, like humbling ourselves or prioritizing church attendance despite obstacles.

[21:37] - Natalie feels that shifting focus from what we receive at church to how we can help others makes attending church worthwhile.

[24:06] - Simply being present and showing kindness in church can be as valuable as active participation.

[28:17] - Hear how Natalie's father supported her and prioritized her spiritual needs, influencing her approach to raising spiritually curious and honest children.

[31:03] - Natalie discusses parenting challenges and describes her strategy of engaging her 11-year-old in church through serving.

[33:01] - Natalie is raising her daughters to be Christ followers and not just churchgoers.

Links & Resources

Crystal Paine

The Crystal Paine Show - 215. Hope and Healing from Church Hurt & Disappointment

Natalie Runion

Books

Raised to Stay: Persevering in Ministry When You Have a Million Reasons to Walk Away by Natalie Runion

The House That Jesus Built: Leading Our Churches Back to God's Original Blueprint by Natalie Runion

Social Media

Crystal Paine on Instagram (@moneysavingmom)

Crystal Paine on Instagram (@crystaliscleaning)