About this episode
Jonathan V. Last, editor of The Bulwark, stops by the show to talk to Lovett about his "Grand Unified Theory of Trumpism" — that Trump's opponent "will always choose surrender over discomfort." Together, they try to make sense of America's rotting political culture, breaking down when and where it all went wrong, and debate what it'll take for the nation to heal from this moment, be it a reckoning of virtue, kindness, or democratic will.
Jonathan also walks Lovett through the echoes of Goebbels recently displayed by Secretary Marco Rubio and Stephen Miller and why he believes the desire for a figure like Trump may have always been present within the Republican base.
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