Ep 1416 | The Lindsay Clancy Case Hits a Nerve With the Robertsons’ Own Family History

0:00I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. You know, I'm used to me and Zat being in the box for our podcast if you're watching, but we got old J's in a box today. He's not in the studio J's. Where are you? Are you in parts unknown? Al, the place in Tennessee that got hit by a tornado. I guess it's been what two and a half years ago. It's been reborn. You're mobile. He's back on the hill. What do you think about my set? Well, it's a lot more bright when you were there two and a half years ago. It was like you were in a dungeon. You were in like a dark cave, but now you're all bright and areas at the redo on your house. I got tells me that there may have been a messy Robertson involved in what's behind you. Well, I'm going to tell you the story. I don't feel like you were involved in that.

1:03She had a few things here, which is there behind me. But this is a desk. So what's this? She just had a few things in frustration developed and I said, oh, I can do it. So if I'm at a desk, then I turn around. I'm like, oh, hey, good to see you. It's casual work days. This will be God. I have a desk that I've been working away back there working. I've never worked five seconds back here. This is what it is. It's the 80s and 90s sitcom where they turn around and they, oh, hey, you did a whole surprise look. That's what he's doing. It's the introduction to every 80s sitcom and every Mentech commercial or someone's doing some random activity.

2:04And oh, the camera's there. Wow. Hey, let me join you for a second. Take a break. But on my desk, not took the stuff she had laying around. So I got a globe. This is the earth. Because Jay's we're global. You know, we're global. Yeah, but look out. That's Matthew 28. All authority. What's crazy is this globe is actually upside down, which I love because that's what God does. He turns the kingdoms upside down. Of course, then I got a light. You know, Jesus is the light of the world. There'd be light. What else do I have? I got some old shotgun shells here that were. I think they're literally like 75 years old. Never been opened. Well, I got these rimington express. Can you see that back here? Can you see the rimington express extra long range?

3:06Now those are old. I mean, really old. I don't know if they're 75 years, but I got the whole box and everything. But I know. Well, I wanted to go through the rest of it. Then I got my little friends here. I got a little dog, a little statue frog. I got one of those skippies hand painted decoys. Skips. The man who can remember his own birth. That's why I missy laugh because I said, why did you take one of my decoys? It was in the car. She's like, well, I thought you might want to use it on the set. I'm like, no, I use that in the wild. But anyway, that's why she said, I'm out. And this, she came up with this picture of my dad taking me hunting. It looks like I'm maybe 10 years old, eight, 10 years old. So, which I found fascinating because we didn't pose for that picture. Someone secretly picked that picture. I didn't know that picture existed. I have cancer. I don't know that I've ever seen that picture.

4:06Yeah, yeah. Yeah, kind of moved me when I first saw it. Yeah. So, but here's what I want to say. New creation, new birth is in the air. Come on. Oh, I have my duck calls. You know what this name this tune now? Roar. Roar. Roar. Roar. It's a time of year. Name it. It was a dove. It's a dove. It's a dove. So, dove sees an open Saturday and I participated. And it's a feel. I feel brand new. It's so weird. I thought you were going to do the one of the eastwood movies has an opening kind of like that. I thought you were going to do that. I mean, he's got the. Do you know? Do you know? Do you know? Do you know? Yeah. I like it. So, yeah, you can have fun with it. But I actually did that wild dove, honey, but I did it with my hands because I think

5:09when you reach a certain. But did you all kill him? Look, you ready for this? That's better than the calm. Yeah, that's with my hands. I did it. That was good that you were in the outdoors. I felt like this has been one of the most controversial weekends that I've experienced in a long time on a lot of different fronts. I mean, I was, we had a couple of get together because Labor Day weekend. And when I tell you that things got heated between friends, things got heated between friends. Over two issues. One was the obvious, the bottery of LSU college football and all whatever all that is. It's just, oh my God. I'd call it domination there. So my ass with the dad, they said, how do you feel about laying kidneys? Your head coach said, well, I've felt a lot better than I did 24 hours ago. I can't stay any longer. It's so good for college football to have a villain like that.

6:11I mean, I think it's, I like it's good. But man, it was like, we and all the guys were sitting around and that was the big topic of debate. Was the whole LSU scandal. And then all the ladies come in the rain and it switches to which I was not familiar with the whole Lindsey Clancy story. Oh, that was that we've been watching that one every day. That shocked me. I was stunned at the visual heated divide between in the rain. I mean, it was like, it was a moment I had to step back and think what has happened to America? I mean, it really shocked me the difference between the viewpoints. But so, yeah, I've come out of a very controversial weekend. And I don't know if it means a lot. The fact that you're just now learning that this was happening is disturbing. I knew it was happening. I didn't know it was a, I didn't know it was a, you just thought it was a case and then everybody kind of agreed that she didn't need to go to jail or to think that people, I'm not saying any names of people that I know very well were like,

7:13oh, no, this is, and they were like pathologizing the entire murder of these kids like this. Oh, this is not her fault. I was like, wait, wait, what? And it got, it was pretty crazy. I was getting educated on the whole thing. But with the word, the fear was to me because I knew, I mean, I didn't know how is all going to turn out. But I knew that this, this thought process was there because the whole case that there were people outside the court. I mean, protesters are every day or supporters, I should say, and I really protestors of her, you know, like in almost lionizing this woman, which I just thought was crazy to me because no matter what, where you land on the, whether she was culpable or not, but to lionize a woman who killed her three kids for any reason. I can't understand that because you got to be, I mean, my thought, this is what I was. I thought this is what I was telling all the ladies in the room is that clearly you have a psych, I mean, I don't know what's debating.

8:17I mean, I don't think they're debating that there's tremendous psychological issues going on. Right. Yeah. Or demonic or whatever. Or demonic. I do think it's a bigger discussion. So as the conversation unfolded, it was kind of funny because I was, it started off with like, should she go to prison, should she be held accountable? Should the doctors be held accountable? That was what somebody said with the doctors need to be held accountable because they're the ones that prescribed these medications to her. Well, then I was like, well, then you got to hold the drug companies accountable because they're the ones marketing to the doctors and you got to hold the FDA accountable because they're the ones that are proving these products. I will say this, like, I do think she needs to be held accountable and put in a facility. There's a bigger discussion. I do think there's a bigger discussion around mental health in America that I would love to see that conversation emerge because I do think that we have pathologized and my pathologized. I mean, we've turned a lot of spiritual issues into diseases. We call them like pathologies. It's like you can measure in a lab.

9:21You can't measure in a lab. That's the funny truth about mental health is you can't actually measure any of or most of these diagnoses you can't actually measure the mental lab. You can't measure depression like with a microscope. You can't look at it. They don't even know how these antidepressants work. Or anything antidepressants they don't even know how they work. It is a big discussion. I think the church needs to, I do think there's a biblical answer here. Have you all got into it within the, I don't know if you haven't even had the discussion in your circles with has this popped up in your world? Absolutely. I mean, I'm like, so what if she's mentally ill? So if you kill your three kids, you need to be locked up for the rest of your life. Yeah. I mean, some, some justice has to be there for them. I mean, and that's kind of where the dividing line has been. So I'm excited to tell you guys. I know a lot of y'all have already signed up for echo EKL. It's a new streaming service that we're a part of building.

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11:26All right, Al. So the nights the night because Jill's at a ministry event, which means that I'm cooking dinner and I got some wild Alaskan fish in my freezer that I'm going to thaw out and cook. What is your recommendation? Oh, you were in for a treat. I put it out on the smoker. That's the way I like it the best. But anyway, you fix it. It's fantastic. Wild Alaskan company offers the best way to get wild called high quality seafood delivered to your door on your schedule. Each wild Alaskan box comes straight to your door with individually portion vacuum seal fillets that are easy to prep for quicker elevated meals. All their fish is wild called quick frozen to lock in the freshness flavor texture in the Omega threes. This is fish you can trust with no GMOs and robotics or additives and you're supporting Alaskan fisherman who value sustainable fishing. And they have a 100% satisfaction and money back guarantee. So you can try your first box risk free. I think the Pacific halibut was probably my favorite. I love it. We tore right into mind. We put the whole thing, the whole box on the smoker and enjoyed it is fantastic.

12:35Exactly. You'll be telling us next time how much you enjoy to go to wildalaskan.com slash undershame for $35 off your first order of premium wild called seafood. That's wildalaskan.com slash undershame for $35 off your first order. Thanks to wild Alaskan company for sponsoring this episode. I will say that and it sounds like that from what I'm watching and I have really, you know, had it myself, but it seems to be a male female. Most males, I hadn't heard any men. Men that that aren't saying what we're saying. It's been more for women. I've been late divided here. Yeah. So I don't know if that's just because, you know, postpartum depression, women have experienced it. Obviously we can't does we're men. So maybe that's part of it. Maybe just because she is a woman. Someone said something I thought made sense. They said because of the horrific nature of it. It's hard for some people to just accept the evil part of that.

13:38Because, you know, how do you accept that? How does any woman, you know, how can you relate to another woman who kills her kids? You know, it's just it goes against every instinct that we have. So therefore they have said, you know, it has to be driven by something else, whether it's some pathological issue, mental issue, whatever. Of course, it's hard for us to because that because we, we obviously know the Bible and we know about the evil and we know about the demon possession. We know about when Jesus was here, especially, they're saying about the evil. They're saying, they've got a lot of that activity. And we also know that there's some mental things because we've got mental illness in our family. And some of them, in my grandmother's case, our grandmother's case, it was abated simply by adding a drug to her body, a lithium deficiency. And then she was fine, you know, the last 20 plus years of her life. So, you know, I don't know. They're just a one size fits all. It's not either all demon possession or all met. It's got to be some kind of mix of both.

14:39I had an idea. I had an idea for a documentary film that I may do one day. But if I do this film, I know the only thing I'm scared about is that it would be. It would be probably one of those things that could be dangerous because I would want to take on one of the largest industries in America, which is the pharmaceutical industry. And here's why because I actually worked in pharmaceutical sales for, I think I did it for like 15 years. And I worked in mental health. And, and this is a hit me at the end of my career. The last job that I had, I was selling this product. It was very expensive, too, by the way. It was like 30, 40 grand a year. And it was a treatment for a disease caused by the drugs that I used to sell at a previous company. And it was and I got, I don't know. It didn't hit me at first, but like I guess I was into it about a year. And I was like, wait a second. I don't know why that didn't like come to life for me. I'm like, I'm selling a treatment for a disease caused by the drugs that I used to sell all in the mental health industry.

15:50And here's the truth about like the pharmaceutical industry, at least my experience in it. And what I'm going to tell you here's not, not a secret. But you can look at all the anti psychotics, atypical antipycho antipsychotics. You can look at all the antidepressants, your SSRIs like Zoloft, Paxel, Lexipro, Selexa, your SNRIs, effects are what I used to sell. And you can look at the, they have a label. And the label is what the FDA says. This is what you're allowed to say about the drug. We've tested this. It's been submitted to the FDA for approval. This is, this is what the science says. And would you believe that in every single one of those packages in search when there has been a lot of evidence of the drug, the FDA says, this is what the FDA says. And would you believe that in every single one of those packages in search when there has this part called the mechanism of action, which means this is how the drug works. This is how this product works. Every one of them says we don't, some version of the mechanism of action is unknown. So they don't really know how these things work. You can look at certain products where the like certain trials where the placebo wins, which is the sugar pill, wins three out of five times. I just think that what we've done in the mental health field is that we've done a lot of the same.

16:59The real thing that we've done in the mental health field is that we have turned a lot of these issues. And like you said, I think Granny had a real issue, a lithium deficiency. When she was treated with lithium, she actually was, was her, her, all of her psychosis subsided. But man, how many people were just throwing these pills at people. And it's not working. I mean, you look at the, the science, it's not working. And we did have to have a conversation about what real, you know, real spiritual illnesses. And I think that anybody that was capable of murdering your children, I guess we're all capable of that kind of heinous crime. Anyone that does that is obviously in a very six spiritual state like that, like there's something going on here that we can't just turn everything into a pathology into a disease into something that could be treated with, with a pill. I think society is reaping the consequences of a lot of, I think a lot of marketing, which I participated in for years unknowingly, but you know, but now that I'm on the other side of it, I'm like, hmm, I don't know if what we were doing was a good thing or not.

18:08But I know that's how they, how they controversial kind of a hot take this morning. But I think that it goes right into what James is talking about. I mean, the book of James is not your sins and your, all these things are happening because something from outside you, that's actually coming from within you. And you got to deal with some of the stuff. I'm not saying there's not a real, I know there's real mental illness out there. But I'm saying the vast majority of what we call mental illness is we have no clue. And we're treating it as if we have some kind of objective science when we don't have any objective science around it. Well, and even in that situation that was, it was, she was, she had a jury of her peers. And apparently 11 out of 12 were going to a quitter. And one person, sounds like was where we are and just said, I can't do that. This conscious wouldn't allow it. But I mean, 11 out of 12 were for saying that she, you know, she's acquitted. She wasn't her fault. And the fact that three kids died, I guess, is just a well. That's just a consequence of what happened. But already since it happened, there's been another woman that killed her child.

19:16In a similar situation. So, you know, if it's a copycat, I don't know what that's about. But, but yeah, it's evil and least is evil and least. I mean, you have to look at it. When I saw there, my mind didn't process it. I thought 11 had voted guilty. That's what I thought. And even though I was looking, I was reading it. My mind wouldn't compute that. What I want to bring up is, you know, this goes back. This is, this is nothing new. And when you go back to what calls the flood, which we have evidence of that. And I think it explains a lot when you think where are the dinosaurs and all this. But you had this happening in Genesis 6, which I realized is very disputed. And there's a lot of views on it. But you had these angelic forces who had fallen and got hooked up with humans. And the result was a lot of violence.

20:25And which led to the flood. And when you bring in the book of Enic, which we've talked about before, there's a, in a simple Google search, we'll show this that they introduced, you know, potions and herbs and various things to humans. See what is the exact phrase of this? Or yeah. Well, I'm just looking up in the book of Enic, where it's like these angels teaching mankind. This is like chapter 7 and chapter 8 of one Enic. But the sorcery and dividing routes learning about plants and medicinal magical mixtures, which later traditions expanded into mind, altering substances or drugs contributing to total societal breakdown. Which there always seems to be this aspect of it, even in modern day movies.

21:27You know, I've seen movies that I didn't watch to the end where it's like, let's, you know, let's do counseling and we'll use mind altering drugs to, you know, try to picture behavior, which only made things worse. It turns into horror movies if you really want to know the truth about it. My whole point for bringing this up is I do think there's, you know, demonic forces, spiritual forces of evil. I mean, that's all through the Bible's seed line. But when the flood happened and the reboot happened, it goes back to what we talked about in James, this survival instinct that God put in animals. So we would wouldn't kill them all. And he also makes this statement in Genesis, where's that Genesis chapter 9, which is the reason I have a frog on my desk, because Genesis 9, Jesus the Word,

22:27giving guidance, introduced hunting in Genesis chapter 9. That's Genesis 9, 1 through 4. And then he starts saying they'll be on accounting because we have a reboot here. There's a, we have a new start to humanity. But two things he says, he says I'll make the animals wild and I'll give I'll demand an accounting from every animal, even in the animal world. And from each man too, I will demand an accounting. This is Genesis 9 for, for the life of his fellow man, whoever sheds the blood of man by man shall his blood be shed for in the image of God has God made man. And so that's, that's where justice and judgment and accountability all began. So that's why I feel so strong on this, whatever happened, you can't have somebody who's capable of killing their three kids and doing it meticulously where, no matter where you are on the issue, I mean the woman center husband out, and then immediately, you know, plan this.

23:42And so you can't have that person running around in society, there must be accountability. You can figure out what the judgment is, but at least it has to be locked up so you don't do that. There's an accountability for shedding innocent blood, which is one thing God hates in the book of Proverbs. That's, that's my take on it. So, Jays, you are officially the second generation land steward of our hunting property was, you know, we've all been involved in it, but you know, with dad now crossing over to the resurrection. Basically, he's left you in charge with the stewarding and conserving our property. So do you take that mantle lightly? No, and look, I just received three texts while you were talking of my crew brushing the blinds in Louisiana while I'm sitting here in Tennessee. Now that's called quality management quality management. I like it. Well, the federal Dougstamp has always meant something to our family because it connects hunting with taking care of God's creation. If you're a waterfowl hunter, you're required to have one, but that stamp does a whole lot more than just give you permission to hunt.

24:58Every purchase helps conserve wetlands that provide habitat for ducks and countless other species while protecting outdoor spaces for future generations to enjoy. You can get yours easily at duckstamp.com and carry the digital version right on your phone throughout the entire hunting season. But don't worry, you're going to get the collectible physical stamp in the mail in the spring. So that's why duckstamps matter. That's why we're asking you to make that simple purchase that supports something much bigger than one hunting season. Visit duckstamp.com. It gets yours today. This duckstamp.com. Well, and also the fact that a multiple occasions, Jesus would have would illustrate with us child. And he used it in many different ways. But almost every time he did this, he would always say, if you harm one of these or you cause one of these to sin or he had several different things that happen to a child, he said, is be better for you to have a millstone around your neck and thrown into a lake.

26:03I mean, in other words, you can't get much more clear than that on how the Lord feels about harm in children. So, you know, how that how you come to judge on with you, Jay's is you get there, but that has to happen. They just can't walk away from it. What I said to the night, I said, two things can be true at the same time. And one is, if so many murders or children there, I mean, you have to put that person away. I mean, they have to be there has to be accountability in that. And yeah, antidepressants are over prescribed. Antisocotics are probably over prescribed. And so I think both of these things are true at the same time. But I think it's another form of pathologizing what happened to say, well, the drugs made her do it. Well, that's the same thing as, you know, throwing drugs at the problem. Like, no, we, like, we do have agency here. And I'm not saying that there wasn't that didn't play a part in it. You know, these a lot of these argument is a lot of these antidecotics and antidepressants have what's called a black box label, a black box warning in the label.

27:08And it's something like this product is known to call suicidal ideation and certain patients. So there's these warnings that if you take these products to treat depression, you actually might become more suicidal. And the reason why I think they do that is because in like people actually do kill themselves and people do go psychotic when they're on these drugs. But it's also arguing, you know, the people that are on these drugs are probably already struggling with mental issues. I think the answer is is again, we have to treat the person as a whole. There's a there's a counselor that we all know from Monroe, I won't say his name, but he told me something one time because we used to share office space together. Now he was not a psychiatrist. So he didn't like prescribe medicines because he didn't he was a doctor of marriage of family therapy. So he didn't have prescriptive authority in Louisiana. But he would do like just counseling and he told me this one time and it just kind of stuck with me. We were sitting outside our office. His office was right next to mine and we were talking about something sharing a cup of coffee. And he said, he said, they all come to me. They all want to they all want the same thing.

28:18I said, what's that? He said they all want to know what is the reason why they are the way they are. They wanted to know one thing. Why people want to know that is that that's what they want to know that's why they pay me. And I said, sin, that's the first thing part of my mind like that describes my my my issue or it may not even be my sin could be somebody else's sin. But he said, no, no, you can't tell him sin. He said, you got to find something outside of the patient. To explain the way they are and and I know that like there is things that happen to us that we got to deal with past traumas and all that and that's super helpful. But I think the therapeutic model in scripture is a lot of that you can't control. You can't go back and fix the things that happen to you. It's great to identify them and get to the base of that trauma or whatever the issue is, but but a lot of it is is coming to the beginning of your what you can control yourself and and seeing that yourself and taking that before this holy God and and God does heal us over time. He does sanctify us. He does.

29:24He does make us psychologically more healthy and we but that's a process of sanctification that can take a lifetime and what's a lot more appealing to me is just to give me a pill. You know, give me a thing. Give me a give me an awakening because I don't want I don't want to process me and I want deliverance. I want it right now. Sometimes these things take years to unpack and to deal with because because they're layered on one another. You know, being a human is much more layered than than that. So I mean, I say all that and say just to say I think two things can be true. I do I actually do have. What's the one before I do have sympathy in my heart for this lady. I mean, I really do when I when the girls were talking about it, like I was about at the same time. Like people have to be held accountable for actions like this. You can't have a society that's built that's going to last the people can just kill their kids and then get away with it. Well, and our society hasn't done a very good job dealing with mental illness drugs. I mean, you look and see the amount of people that are wandering large, you know, cities in America.

30:33And you go there and you see them and it's not living. I mean, it's it's living, but it's not it's not any kind of live. Any of us would want for anybody we care about. And the answer has been well, just give them more drugs. Literally, you know, let's do it safely where they, you know, they won't, you know, give each other some other disease by sharing needles. But that's the mindset. Well, that's a terrible idea. Basically, we're just saying we're going to help them kill themselves. That's that's our answer. Society was. And that's a terrible idea. And yet it happens every single day. So I just think it shows you that unless there is some kind of appeal to some higher power to get there, you're not going to get there. And these cases like this, just, you know, I mean, it's to me, it's appalling that you can line eyes the woman. I'm like, you I did have sympathy because I thought, man, what she's got to live with that now. What she did. And I don't know, she heard voices. She says, you know, but but just the one time. So I don't know what to make of that either.

31:37Yeah, that doesn't sound like a drug problem. That sounded like something else. So. Yeah, but I think if you draw the, yeah, that if you can draw, I think the defense is said if we can draw out the, if we can get people to connect with her, her pain, then, then no, quitter. And they were, and they were going to, but I think you can, two things can be true. One, you can recognize the issues. I mean, you know, I met with a guy a while back. I won't give too many details because it's confidential, but he had done some really, really horrible things that landed him in prison. And he got out of prison and he was now kind of in this probationary period. And I mean, the crimes he committed were horrendous. When you sit now with this guy and you hear a story, you're like, oh, it makes sense. I mean, I really had compassion for him in the moment, because I'm like, it makes sense. How you got to such a dark place when you hear his whole story.

32:38But our council to him was, but you, but you still got to live with the consequences of your actions. And so, you know, these consequences are here. But at the same time, you can be forgiven for your sin, but, but the consequences don't necessarily go away. And I think that I think that's what we got to hold in that tension is having compassion for people, understanding that, yeah, people are going through a lot and darkness is right at the right around the corner, which was saying, to the power of all of us. You know, so we got to hold that kind of thing in tension, but you know, your consequences do carry forward with you. Well, I'm sure on the shame nation has their opinions as well. You know, it's, it's, it's an ongoing situation. We're going to deal with that probably to the Lord comes back. I will say this, Zach, I was the son of the Friday, which I think is when the verdict came down last week. We, I was like you and shock, and Lisa and I were just, you know, we're kind of talking just just she and I hear, but Jay's, you know, who brought, who was the bright light that, that changed the demeanor of our household that night was your own daughter Mia, surprised us. She was coming down here to for her work.

33:51And she had enough time to carve out to stop by here and have dinner with us. And we just had a great two and a half hour. It was, I was kind of like Zach was. Because I was just kind of a Paul to, you know, we're talking about this situation and all of a sudden, someone comes in and, you know, you see people that are full of life and men at the beginning point of what they're going to do in the conversations you have are really just uplifting. And so I'm at the end of the day. That's where you have to look at it anyway. You know, we have to spiritually we got to do the best we can to help people see Jesus. And you just can't let these things get you down or men they'll bog down so bad. You know, you'll start having mental issues as well. So I'm grateful Mia was in the neighborhood. She, she definitely was what is she doing now? She's working. She taking care of some kids this summer. And I guess what you got a nanny on Jay's well, hard to describe. She's, she's basically doing that. I mean, there's a difference in like babysitting and then like kind of moving in and being a rock to kids and organizing the house and she's a little bigger than just like taking care of kids.

35:05But she graduated college. And I think she's going to further education, but she she wanted to work with camp for a couple months and and you know help those kids. She wanted to help kids in the community in that role also. So what she's getting paid. So she's making her a little money in between. And I think I tell her that all this stuff she's been doing with kids is is prepared for this particular role, which is fulfilling a need in this in this family that really had tough situation. So I think that I think she's perfectly suited for it. And she's a blessing to these little little kids. So do you find yourself paying more attention to what things cost now than what they used to cost? I know I know I'm paying a lot more attention. What about you guys? It's $150 to fill up my truck right now. I definitely noticed that. I'm telling you every time I buy something, I got to take a double take. I mean, I'm like, wow, inflation's a real thing.

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37:10That's an extra 25 cents back for every gallon on your first tank of gas using promo code unashamed. She seems to be finding difficult situations and seeing how she can help even with her own charity. You know, the Mia Mew is we're fixed to have our annual event coming up. And so I've just noticed a pattern with that. I think since she went through so much difficulty as a kid with her physical condition, the Lord has has trained her into how to help other kids and difficult situations and boys, she's without really a conscious decision. I've just noticed that that's what's happening, which is kind of brings joy to my heart. She's amazing. And we don't get that. We don't get a change. I was in the end time with your nieces and nephews. They start having their own lives and you just don't get a chance to visit. So I relish the two or three hours we got with anybody in the family. That's always a blessing.

38:16Well, with all this depressing news that's going on in our culture, you know, I think we're at a place in James that's it applies to this situation. I mean, this is kind of shocking what's happened to me in my Bible study because we started off in James, tell him about wisdom. And that seems to be a theme line of it. And we went back to what happened in the garden where this all kind of went sideways with you'll Eve looking at that fruit and listening to the voice. Irony of thinking that by this doing what God said don't do that you're going to have some kind of wisdom that's going to fulfill your life without God been just the outspoken standard for which you should live. And we know all you know how that went, but we actually went through proverbs and we looked at all the you know the two different sides of wisdom, the lady of folly and the lady wisdom.

39:23And it led us to the sermon on the mount which James references a couple dozen times of trying to kind of figure out this new wisdom that Jesus is offering. But when I got to the end of chapter four, which where we are, it kind of led me to the book of Ecclesiastes because even in this situation where we're talking about this woman that does this, you know, people have noticed when you're living your life of trying to find something under the sun as Ecclesiastes puts it. That's going to produce satisfaction and meaning and give you an idea, a better idea of time, I guess of one day you're going to reach this utopia and not have all these problems. You know that that's really what the book of Ecclesiastes about. It's kind of depressing if you don't have a relationship with God because it's just basically telling you, you know, we're we're trapped in time. There's nothing you can do about it and you start reading it. It's like this is all meaningless. I look for satisfaction. I look for meaning.

40:41I recognize time you can't stop it. It just keeps going and you're kind of searching for something new that's going to produce some kind of fulfillment or satisfaction or significance. It just does it happen. And you kind of see this played out with the group that James is addressing because when he gets down to them, maybe I should read this. Right after he says, humble yourselves for the Lord in verse 10 and he will lift you up. It says brothers do not slander one another anyone he speaks against his brother or judges him speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it but sitting in judgment on it, which a lot of that's going on about this case that we were talking about. There's only one law giver in judge and this is what I want to present to this argument. The one who is able to save and ultimately destroy.

41:42But who are you to judge your neighbor? Now listen, you who say today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city spend the year there carry on business and make money. Why you don't even know what will happen tomorrow? What is your life? Which is a fantastic question. You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes. So you ought to say if it's the Lord's will, we will live and do this as it is you boast and brag all such boasting is evil. Anyone then who knows the good he ought to do and does it do it since now. Now before we read what happens in James chapter 5 of the first six verses, you know what I didn't realize? Zach, you're a theologian. I did not realize that in Ecclesiastes the word meaningless or some translations have vanity.

42:48It is the Hebrew word for this when you look at the Greek translation of you are a mist that appears for a little while and vanishes. So you know that that's that is the word in Ecclesiastes. I do everything is meaningless. We just had this conversation at our house church like the Wednesday night. So I didn't know that but one of the guys in there mentioned this exact thing and it was like kind of a pretty powerful moment to think about that. Yeah, I'm packed that for a second. We were going over we were talking about Psalm 127, which says unless the unless the Lord builds the house then the laborers the builders labor in vain. Unless the watchman watches over the house over the city then the watchman watches in vain and he was going back to this idea of vanity and Ecclesiastes meaning it's like the mist of April. It's there. Yeah, right. Yeah, it's really not vanity or meaningless. It's it's a mist. It's a vapor. We apply that. And that's how it's translated because it's like you having life.

43:56And when you start reading Ecclesiastes you see this and you're trying to grasp it would be like you trying to go out you know when I went dove on sincerity. We started a day lot. Well, there was a mist that came over which really impacted me because I was reading us instead. It would be like trying to go out and grab it or to sustain it somehow or just pause it. And so that's why I mentioned those four four things. It was interesting to church the city of Nashville where I'm at. They're doing a series on Ecclesiastes and I like a darn white head. He's one of the pastors and I listen to two of his sermons on Ecclesiastes. And it was so weird for me to listen to this because you could sense how he knew this was so depressing to preach on. It's it's almost like. Oh, you know, good morning. He literally got up and had everybody read Ecclesiastes one through eleven and the next time we read chapter two, which is you said what does this got to with the book of James.

45:08You see James referencing this. This is what are you going to do today or tomorrow and especially in chapter five one through four. And then when you throw in the sermon on the mount, well, you remember Matthew six and I know we don't have a whole lot of time, but I want to introduce this because I want to get into it. In Matthew six of all people, who does who does Jesus bring up on the sermon on the mount, especially when it's talking about what you wear, what you do, what you worry about, what you're pursuing after, he brings up Solomon. Just think about this. A thousand years before here's the son of God in human form, relaying this new wisdom and he brings up Solomon. I'm saying that you can't unsee this. And so I really think we should at least dip our toe in the water and what he says, especially in the first cup of chapters of Ecclesiastes, because I think James is going about the same.

46:12Ideal. And really it comes down to these four things that are wrote down. Yeah, she brought your brunt workwear with you. You know that we believe in a product when you don't leave home without it. Well, that this is what they're supposed to look like. Yeah, might look like that. Yeah, actually, I actually work in mind and the reason why is because brunt boots are comfortable from day one. So you're not spending weeks breaking them in. They've got something for just about any job waterproof, safety toe, soft toe, heavy duty lace up and pull on options. You can actually try them out on a job site. If they're not a right fit for you, I'll send them back for a full refund. Right now, brunt is running the brunt potty of gold sweepstakes. It's a funny name, but one winner is taking home a very serious and real prize of $50,000. It's free to enter until September 18th. Just create a brunt account or log into the one that you already have. You can earn extra entries by following brunt on social media, signing up for their emails and text and every dollar that you spend through September 18th earns you more entries.

47:20For a limited time listeners to our show, get $10 off that brunt when you use the code unashamed at checkout. Just head on over to bruntworkwear.com. Use the code unashamed. And while you're there, enter the brunt potty of gold sweepstakes for your chance to win $50,000. That's bruntworkwear.com code unashamed. It's so much, Jason, about the heart. Because James presented the two kinds of wisdom. And if you look at Solomon, because you know, he brought up that idea about the double minded, you know, the double sold we talk about. And Solomon, who wrote a Cleasy Astides also wrote Proverbs, obviously, but you look at those two different completely different views of life. And you say, well, how does the same man ride them both? Well, obviously his heart was in one place, one time, and another place, and another time. We know that once he had had all the entanglements with the political stuff and the wealth and the women that they said they turned his heart away and he began to seek other gods.

48:32You know, and I don't think he ever totally forgot about, you know, Yahweh, his God, but I mean, obviously his heart was being pulled in all these other directions, which led him to that place that you see where he recognizes that there was there was nothing there. I mean, the end of the day, he did recognize who God was and God honored him for that. And like he said, Jesus even brought him up in Matthew 6 when he was talking about the worry. But you see that that's what happens with the heart. You can go through these periods of time where you're not following the right wisdom. You're following the wisdom of the world instead of the wisdom of God. So you can't the heart of the person has to be a part of this discussion as well. Well, that's addressed in the Cleasy Astides, but what I was going to say is I think we're all thinking one day I'm going to get there. Whatever your pursuit is, whether it's your career or you know, finding some kind of satisfaction with your family and where they're at and how much money you have or all this kind of stuff.

49:35But you look at the backdrop of why this was written. This guy had everything. I mean, he had money as much as you could ever have power, sex. We had a thousand women. He had fame. He had all these possessions. He had land. He had gardens. He had pools. He had rivers. He had knowledge. Just anything that you can think of it was given to him. And he had wisdom. Yeah. And it created the most depressing book that you could ever read. I just wanted to read some of this because we all think, I mean, think of all the people who is the richest man, Elon Musk. Well, you know, who's had the most famous, whoever you want to go with, who has the most knowledge, the smartest person.

50:39Well, Solomon had it all. And this is what he wrote. He starts off saying meaningless, meaningless, which is that word for missed paper. You can't grasp. Says the teacher, utterly meaningless. Everything is meaningless. What does man gain from all his labor and which he told us under the sun? Generations come and generations go, but the earth remains forever. And the sermon I listed had made a really good point here and I want to make it. And he made the point. He asked a question. He said, uh, when you look at generations and who we are, and here we are. We're three men. We all think we're something whether we do or not. We are what we are. And we look at our parents. So you have two people. Well, then you look at our grandparents. So now you have four. And so then he asked a question. But if you look at your great grandparents, you have eight.

51:42He said, how many people can name the first and last name of your great grandparents? Nobody's hand went up. And then I thought to myself, could I name my eight great grandparents? No. And he says, you realize what this means? It means that your kids grandchildren, they're not even going to know your name. That just kind of hit me. Oh, is it so green? But he's like, we live in this delusion, you know, of our own space and who we are. When you look at it and you start reading the book of Ecclesiastes, and when you, when you read what he says there, it's not really depressing. It's just true. Generations come and go and the earth is going to move on without you. And so is your family. And I'm not even addressing the work part of this.

52:45But it's the same thing. That's why when you get into the sermon on the mountain and Jesus was saying, I think when you combine it with a book of James, and these thoughts in Ecclesiastes when it comes to wisdom, all of a sudden it doesn't seem as depressing as it is. I'm making some poor decisions on what I'm pursuing in this life and how big I think I am. It starts revealing some truth that we're just in denial about. And if I keep reading, it says the wind blows to the north and turns, I mean, a blows to the south, and it turns to the north, round and round it goes, ever returning on its course. And you got to remember, because that's what that word means. You're trying another phrase in the book of Ecclesiastes. I think it's used nine times. It's chasing after the wind. And it really becomes about what you're pursuing. And I do think these four things that I reference, especially in the first chapter, is this search for meaning, this being trapped in time, this search for satisfaction,

53:57and then trying to find something new, which is where he goes in verse seven. All streams flow into the sea, yet the sea is never full. He's just making you think about how this is all set up and your place in it to the sea, to the place the streams come from, there they return again. All things are worrisome. More than one can say, the eye never has enough of seeing nor the ear, it's feel of hearing. What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again. There's nothing new under the sun. And the reason that really stood out to me, because that's why Jesus is so appealing when he was offering bringing something new. Think about the, you know, as little take on the new wine skins and even the sermon on the mount about what he's introducing.

54:59So I'll finish reading this because I know where at time, is there anything of which one can say, look, this is something new. It was here already, long ago. It was here before our time. There is no remembrance of men of old and even those who are yet to come will not be remembered by those who follow. Of course, then he gets more specific into riches and pleasures and in the end of chapter one and chapter two. But it's going down the lane that James is going down. And finally, something positive happens at the end of chapter two, because then he starts going from eye to all this stuff that we have here. These are gifts from God and not acknowledging that is where all the problems come in. So that was my introduction into that. I think we should revisit it in the next podcast. time was the sermon on the mount and then when you read James five, pursuing that instead of viewing people as made in the image of God

56:03is what's causing all these problems. Oh, that's good. All right. We'll dive into that next time. No no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no. Thanks for listening to the unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcast. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch. modifications to watch every episode.