Peptides, Hormones, and the Real Path to Aging Well with Jay Campbell

Hey Mark. Hey Katie. Hey you want to do a podcast? Yeah. Sweet okay. Welcome to the

Unforget Yourself Show where we use the power of blue and the proof of science to help

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So today we have this Jay Campbell, co-founder of BioLongevity Labs, a health optimization

and longevity-focused business that helps high performers, athletes and everyday people

improve aging, fat loss, vitality and long-term metabolic health. Through science-backed peptide

therapy, hormone optimization and personalized longevity protocols, Jay supports individuals

in repairing their metabolism and building a foundation for lasting health and performance.

Now, Jay's journey of balancing cutting-edge science with the realities of growing a fast

moving health business demonstrates what it really takes to move from symptom management

to true optimization and while navigating the pressure to innovate, lead a team and

stay ahead in a rapidly evolving field. He maintains deep commitment to helping people

not just live longer, but live better. Jay, welcome to the show.

Mark, it's an honor to be here. And first off, I have to hire your bio-generator or whoever

did that. And don't tell me it was AI because that was really well done. So thank you. And again,

as I told you off-air, it's always an honor for me and a privilege to be able to speak to people

who are getting it and understanding it and doing great for the world. And I know that you and

your wife are doing that as I told you from watching your video. So again, I'm humbled to be here.

And I know that this podcast episode is going to be epic. Oh, shucks, Jay. Thank you very much.

I'll take all that. Well, let's get cracking with with Sedness Up. So your turn, can you expand

to touch more on where you are today with your business and who is it that you love to work with?

Yeah, so I'll be 55 years old. One month from January 24th, I've just released not yet for

publishing, but uploaded it to the publisher. My ninth book, which is called Metabolic Awakening

with GLP-1 peptides. And I can assure you and the listening audience that it is without a doubt

the greatest book in the history of the world about GLP-1 peptides. It's over 715 pages and 1300

medical citations and references. It's eight months of deep, intensive work and focus with me

and a copywriter and perhaps another couple of eyes. And we'd used zero, zero AI, no AI,

no nonsense, no hallucination, no regurgitation, no poor signal to noise ratio, which most people

use when they get AI. And so the book is a triumph. And again, that's coming from a guy who's written

a lot of books. Five of them have been international bestsellers. So I'm very, very excited about

that book because as you probably know, and your audience probably knows, 95% of the information

found online about GLP peptides is complete, unmitigated nonsense. And that is because the average

user of a GLP-1 peptide does it completely wrong. And I talk about all these things obviously

in the book and break it all down. But the main reason why they do it wrong is because the

pharmaceutical industry wants to make money. And they want to have doctors prescribe them,

outside the means of the way they should be done. So without rabbit holding on that on that,

that's kind of like where I am. And I uploaded the book on Sunday, or actually Saturday evening,

and in Sunday morning, I was talking to the publisher. And since then, I've had complete total

brain drain. Because again, when you birth a baby like that, it's putting a lot of energy, a lot

of effort and intense focus and really work that now is over. Then hey, we can ring that out.

We can squeeze out all the remaining juice that you have. Because that isn't there's some good

stuff in here. For sure. Look, we are going to go to that rabbit hole of why 95% is nonsense in a

minute. But I want to hear, I mean, you said this is the best book ever. Fantastic. But what

is it that the readers, your people, what are they going through? What's their biggest challenge

right now? Or what's going on for them? Why do they why do they reach out? Why do they need help?

So the biggest issue right now in the world from a health standpoint is obesity and insulin

resistance and metabolic derangement. And by 2040, probably a little sooner now between 35 and 40,

obesity will be the leading cause of death on the planet. So to understand the significance of

how many people in the West, especially USA, Canada, Mexico right now are battling obesity and

insulin resistance. And again, just too much body fat issues is insane. And you have to understand

that obesity is the causal agent of all disease of aging, whether that's diabetes, whether that's

type three diabetes, which is neurodegenerative disease, whether it's a heart attack or heart

disease or heart condition, vascular incidence, stroke, myocardial infarction, all these

different things are all caused from this. And so that's the biggest issue that people have. But

these, you know, column drugs, you know, adjuvants from pharma, which have really been in the

mainstream now since 2021, really the end of 2020, they're being prescribed incorrectly because

again, the pharmaceutical industry is not looking to improve people's health. They're attempting

to make money. And the same thing is happening with the physicians that are prescribing these. So

you know, my intention with the book, and obviously, I own a company that previously was involved

in selling GLP1, you know, not basically drugs, but GLP1 has research chemicals, which in that

world, there's literally millions of people that use the research chemicals because it saves them

money that pharma would charge them for the actual prescribed version. So I'm very, very familiar.

I've used them on myself since the end of 2021. My wife has used them. I've worked with literally

hundreds of thousands of people, both in person and online, in using these agents. And we know

how to use them in the context of health and longevity. So the purpose of the book is to explain that.

And to also go through all of the negative side effects, to go through all of the things that

people have felt, experience, and associated with. And then hack, you know, through that by showing

them, well, this is out the actual evidence says, like I said, there's 1,245 research citations.

And then, you know, come to a conclusion of like, okay, this is how we do this correctly.

And this is how we change lives. And very, very truthfully, we can solve the obesity problem

with these agents, but we have to cloud source the correct information. And we also have to teach

people how to get them outside of the clutches of the pharmaceutical industry.

Well, there's so much noise. There is so much going on right now. And there's so much information.

And of course, we trust are the practitioners, the doctors, which not going to diss anyone.

People have a certain amount of time with you, have a certain amount of knowledge, and they have their

own preferences or what they should be, what they're told to give. The heartbreaking

personal story just came to my head. Katie's best friend had cancer. And she survived it, did super

well. But she, as a nurse, was talking with the doctor at the time. And he was devastated because

he was like, yeah, I know what I'm going to prescribe you is 10 years behind the current research.

But that's only as far as it's got through the system. So it's so hard to know what to do for

ourselves, especially in times of stress and worry and health. So how can you help break this down?

So just really simplify this, give us some nuggets, maybe of the book or setting up the book.

So the right people can know that this is the right information for them.

Yeah. So I mean, the book is 10 chapters. We actually have a chapter at the end of the book that's

called the transformations. And it's literally 15 real, I think it's 16. It's 15 or 16 people.

I need to look at it real quickly. But it's 15 or 16 men and women from all walks of life,

all over the planet, who have used the GLP drugs, again, called in peptides to completely

metabolically transform. But not just in there before and after images, but in their own words,

how these things change their life. And that's the biggest thing that people have to understand.

If you're metabolically, again, call it deranged, deficient, I mean, people don't like to use

that word deranged. But that's kind of what happens when you have insulin resistance and you have

too much body fat. And again, that's leading to all these, you know, inflammation, which creates

all the disease ideologies. You're not in a good mood. You're not in a healthy space. I mean,

people don't understand that an obese person is literally walking around every single day, 24 hours,

seven days a week in a state of inflammatory cascades or what are called cytokine storms. And so

they feel like absolute dog. You know what? So if we can create a pathway, again, through these

medications, through lifestyle changes, again, everything is covered in the books, stoop the nuts,

how they can remove themselves from feeling like absolute crap, then I think it's an amazing,

you know, path forward. And unfortunately, as you said, the signal to noise ratio in the mainstream

is mostly noise. The signal is very, very low. So it takes a very, you know, it takes a person

like me who's been using these products for five years and has worked with some of the best

GOP prescribing doctors in the world to really hack through the misinformation and the disinformation.

But to present everything to you in a very clear, concise fashion and then allow you to see,

okay, I may have this fear, I may have this, you know, just call it a misunderstanding of this

because of what my friend told me or what some doctor prescribed me or etc. And now I can actually

see what I went through or experienced perhaps because again, I cover everything. Every single

side effect under the sun is broken down and covered and explained why it happens and what you

would do to avoid it, you know, or to minimize it, etc. And then we get to, okay, so now you understand

what not to do. How do I do this right? And I don't just cover the drugs. Of course, I cover the

lifestyle changes. I cover the adaptations that people have to look at to do. And again, I'm obviously

very passionate about this. My mother died of obesity. My mother actually was labeled as a COVID

death, but as you know, that was a giant scam. And she was obese and comorbid metabolically

for the last 25 years of her life. And it was, you know, I attempted it early in my life to help her,

but yeah, she was not capable of being helped because as you know, the teacher appears when

the student is ready. And people that are not ready to lose weight or to improve their physical

health, and obviously ultimately their mental health and change their lifestyle, or you can't force

them to do anything. So you have to understand. All right, Jay, then let's talk to those people that

either on that fence or they're ready. So, okay, you have a personal connection with this. I was

going to ask you, like, where does it come from for you? What's your personal story? You just

answered that question. Fantastic. So it's super personal for you. I do want to expand on.

Well, actually, let me just say this. It's not just personal for me because you have to understand

in your listening audience has to understand that this is a massive burden to them. This is

destroying the healthcare system. This is the greatest underlying rot in the world right now.

If we do not cure obesity and insulin resistance, which is metabolic dysregulation,

our healthcare system will collapse. It is on that path now. So it's a lot more than it is personal.

Yes, I'm connected personally to my mother, but this is a much better issue. And most people in

America right now, do you know this is a statistical fact? 70, I'm sorry, 68% of men and women over the

age of 40 in the United States are classified as obese by the BMI. 68%. So this is a crisis of

proportions that we don't really fully comprehend, but it's going to be much bigger if it's not solved.

And again, I would just tell you that obesity, solving obesity could do the most for this planet

from a consciousness standpoint. If we can get enough people to have access to these amazing

molecules. Okay, so this is this is fixable now. Fixable doing things the right way. So as you

said, it's not just about here's what not to do here's what to do with with with medication with

supplements. It's not there's there's a whole lifestyle, but also there's there's the human being

behind it because even I've read enough books. I it's so hard for human beings to make change

even with a life-changing situation or diagnosis. We still keep doing what whether it's avoidance,

whether it's fear, whatever it might be, there's a lot of reasons for it. Now, can you guide people

through? So those people that are on that fence or they're ready, those are people that are willing

will hear this message, but they just need to hear it in a different way or know that okay,

remove some of the blame. You've been trying to do things in the right way. Maybe you haven't,

but maybe the time to do this. Can you talk to that person from sort of the mental side in terms

of their beliefs, their thoughts, because our our beliefs, our mind, our conscious, our subconsciousness,

it plays such a big role here and that can be that can be coast. That can be helpful. Yep,

a hundred percent. So it's as simple as this. I mean, I know it doesn't seem simple for somebody

who's obese, but it's as simple as literally changing your thoughts because your thoughts create

your reality, your thoughts do become things. That's not woo. That is the law of resonance and

action. So if you are an obese person and you're watching this, and like you said, you're on the

cusp of wanting to do this correctly, this book will definitely give you all of the finer details

of how to do it in a way that will be conducive to a long-term, sustainable weight loss, fat loss,

and B, and I think the most important thing, complete behavioral change. Because the one thing

that these drugs do when you're used correctly, and let me just say it right now, use correctly

means micro dosing the formulations, which is again, 95% of people doing wrong because the medical

system, big pharma, they want you to start at a higher dose because that's how they make money.

And then they want to titrate you higher and higher and higher until they literally blow out your

receptors, blow out your body's sensitivity to the medications, and you end up worse than you

start it. And again, I go through all of this in very finite detail of how it works and how the

average person experiences this. But the one thing about GLP peptides that we now know from the

science is that when they're used correctly, again, in a micro dose fashion, they change brain,

wave, patterning, permanently. So an obese person who has a lack of considered inability

to stop eating, they have the hyperpollative addictive engagement with food because again,

the chemicals in the food are created by food scientists, all this. These drugs can eliminate that

noise that's going on mentally that makes them overeat and over consume and want to eat all

this crappy food, right? So we have a lot of stories in the book about people who are

alcoholics who are addicted to porn, who are obsessive, compulsive issues, disorders, auto

immune, et cetera, that once they started using these in the context of the way we recommend them,

which again is microdosing them, it all went away. And like I said, in the chapters with the

people that have made these transformations, and again, some of them are incredible. I have

mended or 425 pounds or 175 pounds with a six pack. I have women that were 260 pounds or 120

pounds with a six pack. So it's like, you know, anyone can take these medications and ultimately

and radically transform not just their physiology, you know, from a higher body fat to a lower body fat

composition, but to a mental framework where like I now know that I am worthy and that I can

truly love and trust myself. And so, you know, that's my real take home with the book is that

it's not just about the physiological, you know, change or the physiological manifestation,

it's about the idea that these can help you, you know, be a guiding, you know, part of your life

to get to a point that you personally never thought possible due to whatever it is that it

ails you. And as you said, you know, human behavior is very difficult to change. But these tools,

if we want to call them that are probably the greatest ever to augment

behavior that was perhaps or perceived initially to never be changeable or correctable or

adjustable other than through, again, diligent, hard work and extreme willpower.

It sounds like these are helpful guys to put you to bring back control, to empower you to be

able to make these decisions to change your habits, your lifestyle. So that's a great way to say

to literally empower their agents or adjuvants that will literally give you back

agency over your health and ultimately your long-term, you know, call it longevity.

Beautiful. So, I want to talk from from your perspective because this is all great. You're in

a ninth book, your, it's personal, it's also societal, these changes. From your perspective,

as the change leader, as the entrepreneur, what's this journey been like for you as you have your

mission, you have your, you have the products, you have the how to use them, but you're battling

the noise, you're battling other people. What's this journey been like for you personally behind

the scenes as you, as you've been doing this? Yeah, it's great. So the first chapter is literally

that story. You know, it's like, how did I become attached to these agents? How did I find out

about them? You know, really, what led me down the path? And it really started with a physician

who's truly one of the world's first GLP1 prescribing doctors. His name is Dr. Rudolph Eberwimes,

Eberwine, shout out to Dr. Rudy. And he actually ended up writing the forward for the book, but he

you know, started talking to me back in 2019 about these. And you know, this is still two years

before I started using them myself, but he said, Jay, these things have the ability to transform

the world. And at that point in time, I was like, okay, bro, you know, like I hear those from stories

from all sorts of people, because I've used everything from, you know, therapeutic testosterone,

to peptides, you know, all the things that make me, you know, I call infamous online. I already

had a great understanding if not a mastery of that kind of stuff. So when he started telling me

about this, I was like, okay, cool. That sounds interesting. But then a year and a half goes by,

and I start seeing stuff about these. And then he says, hey, man, let me write you a prescription

for the GLP peptide, GLP2 peptide, which was a trizapatide at that point. And I was like, yeah,

you know, I don't know. And he's like, trust me, you know, and I'm like, I did trust him. And I'm

like, okay, cool. And I started using it myself. And I started using it with my wife. And again,

we were doing it right because I was obviously getting the guidance from this man, who's a master

himself, which was a microdose. And it was profound. I mean, it made me realize that this

medication, again, used with somebody who's already living, calling it a longevity lifestyle,

a biohackers lifestyle is the ultimate cheat code. Because now I can eat less. I can eliminate food

noise. I can actually eat more food if I want to to modulate my weight, as long as it's clean,

because it's increasing metabolic rate. It's improving insulin signaling, it's improving nutrient

partitioning. It's doing all these amazing things at a molecular level that you could never find

previous to these drugs being available in the marketplace. So, you know, very truthfully or

very, you know, seriously, from that point, I really started researching them. I started working

with a lot of other people. And then obviously I got involved with a company called Limitless. Go

ahead. I was going to say, what were the maybe the barriers with the boundaries that you face

along the way? Because red do I hear there's just one straight line, one straight story. There's

things that get in the way barriers, beliefs, there's other people, there's organizations.

Did you have any like hurdles along the way as you as you started to build this?

Yes, so yeah, no, it's a good question. There was always barriers in the background from a

standpoint of the research use only or research chemical use only space is in a great,

functions in a gray area, right? Because it's not governed by the FDA or the medically, you know,

practicing arm of, you know, what I call sick care, you know, illness medical system. And so it's like

if you're recommending these again, research chemicals and you're not a physician, which I'm

clearly not a physician, you know, there's always that like background noise of like, you know,

do you really want to do this? Do you really want to tell this to people because, you know,

these people are going to go to their doctors and their doctors are going to say to them,

who is this person? Does he have a medical license? You know, all that. So that was like always

in the background, but I've been dealing with that since I wrote my first book on testosterone in

2014, you know, so and just, you know, for the audience's purpose, like my two books on therapeutic

testosterone are the books that train doctors all over the world, right? So it's like, I don't have

that even though it's in the background because I've obviously personally, you know, fought through

that and overcame those adversity obstacles. But, you know, early on, I always thought, you know,

when I would be lecturing at these medical conferences or biohacking conferences or whatever they

were now, whatever they want to call them now, performance conferences that, you know, I had an

you know, what would you call it? Inadequacy, you know, expect, you know, I'm the I'm the

imposter, you know, imposter syndrome. Whatever you want to call it, there's so many names for it

because like I'm not a doctor, right? But then eventually through my conversations with doctors

and my presentations and all these doctors accepting who I wasn't me talking about at the level

that I did, I realized that it was just self-created. So that was still, you know, somewhat there

in 2021, 2022, 2023 as I was experimenting with these personally and then helping other people.

But then eventually I just got to the point of like, you know, what they're looking to me

to be the guy on the cutting edge. And, you know, obviously I walk my talk, I talk my talk, I'm

a living embodiment of what I speak about. So it just became really simple for me to really

start doing this without any kind of fear of reprisal or just that background noise.

What was that moment like? So that moment, except that everyone should put, we always go through

it. The imposter syndrome, the worry, the fears, the doubts, those voices in our head, who am I?

It's what, what was it like for you once you finally heard that voice or realized,

damn it. Thank you for asking. Let me tell you why I'm the best person for that. What was that,

what was that shift like for you? You know, that's actually a great question because no one's

ever asked me that. I want to say that happened way before GLP. Is that probably happened in 2018,

2017 or 2018? I was actually in Peru. And it was, it was actually, it was the end of 2018 and we

went to Peru for the first time. And I had an absolutely amazing, profound, you know, spiritual

journey or slash awakening. And at that time, I was, I had a website called the TRT. And then

I eventually turned it to TOT, which was testosterone optimization, optimization therapy revolution.com.

And it was the number one site on the world in the world from a traffic standpoint and just

information about the therapeutic testosterone, which again, back then eight, nine years ago,

was still like on the fringe. But I had this awakening when I was in coming back from late

Titicaco that I was changing everything to my personal brand and my own name and that I was going

to evolve my personal brand to be more than this, you know, pigeonhole guy talking about hormones.

And then I would talk about consciousness and raising your vibration and, you know, just all

things that I wanted to really truly jam about. And that's it. It was at that point that

everything expanded for me, like my, you know, my audience following in my podcast and just

everything that I did, it just went like this, you know, it was like I knew at that point that it

was about time to talk about consciousness, talk about frequency, why it's so important as I

told you off air to teach others that it's about raising our frequency, that it's about raising

our consciousness. And so everything exploded, you know, for me subsequently since then and all

this other stuff has just been, you know, kind of part and parcel of like evolving, you know,

as a soul and a physical body, you know, as I learned more and more stuff. And that's obviously

what led me to read, write the first book that I wrote in 2023 about peptides, which also exploded

into mainstream consciousness. And now this book is my, well, actually, I wrote one other book

a year and a half later. It was called 30 Days to Shreds. It was like a real hardcore fat loss book.

But now this book is like a scientific, you know, evidence-based, you know, inquiry for people

that are questioning GLP peptides. And, you know, again, I took five years of personal use and

experience and working with lots of people to write this book. And honestly, after my last book,

I was like, I'm done. You know, there's nothing for me to write books about. But I always kind of

say that because just like I said that when my last testosterone book, and I've written obviously

four books since then, but it takes me, something has to really grasp me, you know, in the consciousness

of the world to like say, you know, what I can do a better job or I can, you know, really expand

upon this. And it really was GLP peptides. And obviously, it took five years of my personal use

with them. And obviously working with, again, hundreds of thousands of people, both online and in person,

to truly write this book. But I mean, that, that statement, that question, that answer came when I

was in Peru in 2018. Okay. And let's flip that around because from that, that moment, that

realization where all these different worlds come together, the physical, the metaphysical,

the spiritual, it's, it's, it's all us at the end of the day, but the how different names

are different ways of connecting. Take all of this. And let's look forward. Where's,

where's all this going for you? What are you most excited about?

Great question. Um, that's actually another question that I really, I don't, I don't live in the

future. I live in the moment. So I don't really think about it, but I do have spiritual mentors

that I work with and people that guide me. And I've been told that my, so this is the words

that the people that work with me and there's two, they said that I'm a planetary reformer.

And so what I am destined to do, and this was told to me literally when in 2016 and 2017 when

I was like, yeah, right, bro, but they told me that between the age is a 54 and 61 that I was going

to change the planet. And that if I kept my nose to the grindstone and kept doing what I was doing

that I would do that. And so it's interesting, because in the last two years, since I launched

BioLongevity Labs and it's completely blown up, you know, it's now the second biggest research

company in the world. And now with the writing of this book and also with just the people that I've

met in the last 12 months, who are asking me to be involved in other things that I'm not yet

allowed to talk about, I can kind of see that arc. And also, I think you know this, like we are facing

or dealing with a consciousness shift in what I call quantum healing versus, you know, call

alipapic sick care medicine, where it's like the field is going like this. And the bifurcation is,

you're either choosing to not go to the alipapic doctor with your co-payment and actually

invest in what I call your personal self-health care. You know, I teach people to become the

personalized scientist of their own health. And so I see that shift going like this. And it's

going to go parabolic. And I feel like I'm going to be one of the peoples to lead, call it that

right hand path shift of people becoming personally accountable, fully autonomous, and responsible

for their own health care. Because as I told you, you know, obesity and insulin resistance and

and all that, that's going to collapse. So if you're invested in that system, they're not equipped

to handle it because they don't use the tools that I'm talking about. Sure, they have access to

them, but they don't know how to use them in the context of living longer and stronger. Whereas

the people that, again, I will hopefully shepherd or Sherpa, you know, they're going down a path

where they're in complete autonomous control of everything, not just their health, obviously their

wealth, their sovereignty, you know, their ability to like, navigate this planet without worrying

about the external, you know, quote unquote, savior, whatever that would be. And I just think that

that's the dichotomy, that's the bifurcation. Like you are your own savior or you're externalizing

your savior complex. And that's where this is all going. And so I really feel that I will be one

of those people, really helping people, you know, guide or guide, you know, Sherpa. I love that

word to do this in the right way, you know, in a way that is conducive to obviously helping society

because I'm a, I'm purely a service to others being and I've always been a service to others being.

I didn't realize that until my early 40s. But now for me, it's like, you know, how can I serve

as many people as I possibly can, you know, with zero expectation without attachment. And that's

kind of where I'm at now. What a fantastic place to be. So I just wrap this up with a big, big,

beautiful bow. It's how we'd be fully accountable, fully empowered. That's what we, that's what we

all truly, truly wants. So for those people that want to know more about you and also your book,

what's it called? Where can they find it? Tell us what about it.

For sure. So it's going to be called, it's, it's not out yet. It'll be out February 24th.

It's called metabolic awakening with GLP1 peptides. It will be everywhere because there's definitely

very big book promotion companies and agencies that will be behind it. I self publish. I don't

use any of the big publishing houses because they're all scam. They literally don't give you anything

other than an advancement. They don't, they don't, you don't have the rights and it's so sad how

many people have never really understood that. But now that again, we live in the sovereign and

powered free world, you have the ability to control the publishing rights of your book. And so

if you have the right marketing people and know how behind you, you can do all sorts of stuff with it.

So, you know, obviously I'll sell it on Amazon, but I'll also sell it from a book funnel.

I will also actually, because so many so few people today can actually read because of,

you know, conscious aggregation or, you know, attention aggregation. I am making a video

masterclass of it. And honestly, I, the book is not going to be priced expensive. I don't look

to make money off selling books. I really honestly, after 90 days of this book being on the market,

it'll be free available on my website. I don't, I give all my books away for free as a PDF. In fact,

everyone who watches this podcast can go to jcambo.com forward slash free dash info and can get a

fully downloadable PDF copy for color. Really nice of any book that I've ever written, which as of

right now are eight. And they're all there on the website. And like I said, within 90 days of this

book being in the marketplace, that will also be there available for free. So I always make my

books available for free, because I do realize that there are people out there that are not as blessed,

you know, in the third and fourth world, but obviously desire the information. So I always do that.

And, you know, people can find me on social media. For as long as I'm not deleted,

which by the way, will not probably be much longer, because this book is definitely challenging

the status quo. Jcambo 3333. And again, 3333 is the connection between master teachers and spirit.

And each of us is a mind body, right? So that's how you can find me.

I love it. Well, so, so kind. Everyone, if you're curious, I think this sounds amazing. Go and

check it out. Grab your copy. Whether you pay for it, grab the free version, but use it. Apply it.

And again, back to empowering yourself. So Jay, look, thank you so, so much for sharing not only

the amazing work you do, but behind the scenes, you're journey through this. It's fascinating. So

thank you so, so much. Mark, thank you for bringing a great interviewer. And thank you for taking

this in a different path than I assumed it would be. And it was awesome. And I wish more people

did the podcast like you did. Ah, Shucks again. Dude, you're so good. Thank you so much. It's all true. You're welcome.

Hey, Katie. Yeah, Mark. Wanna do an outro? Sure do. Sweet. Hey, thank you so, so much for listening and

making it to the end. Yay, you. So what happens next? We asked them the things that podcast

are supposed to ask at the end of an episode. Can you please rate, review, download,

subscribe? Yeah. But why is it important? Because that's how our podcast gets noticed.

Some people find us. It is. And we want all their earballs. All the earballs, all over place.

We do. Nice. Yeah. So please do all those things. We'll be ever so grateful.

And then more people here. You're a beautiful voice. Oh, you're awesome. Oh, yeah.

See you next time. Bye.