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A little bit of best player available.

Whether some premium positions, the browns could look at it.

Number six, all of that stuff coming up in the Orange Brown Talk podcast.

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All right, here we go. Orange and Brown talk time.

Hey, everybody. Welcome to the Orange and Brown talk podcast.

Dan Lobby here with Mary Kay Cabot.

A Hey, Mary Kay edition of the podcast on a Thursday,

waiting until the browns finished up.

Not finished up, but got through the first real wave of free agency here to get to

our football insiders and get some of their questions about what the browns have done,

what they still might do.

So if you want to be a football insider, it's Cleveland.com slash browns,

the blue banner at the top of the page.

And let's just start here.

We've been talking all week about the moves the browns have made on the offensive line.

And Dave in Washington, DC wants to continue that discussion.

Hey, Mary Kay, I'd love to believe the offensive line has been addressed.

But ESPN and PFF have the new guys rated below average.

What gives you confidence?

Well, that's a great question.

Because they have to put all the pieces and the parts together and see how they fit.

And we're not even sure exactly who's going to start where.

We have a pretty good idea.

Titus Howard is probably going to be the right tackle.

And then it seems like Elton Jenkins is going to be the center unless Luke Whiplier comes in

and beats him out for that job or unless he's better and outright gets that job.

And then Zion Johnson is going to start at one of the guard spots.

And maybe Joel Betonio comes back.

Maybe he doesn't and Tevin Jenkins could start at one of the spots.

And then you've got Dewan Jones who right now is your starting left tackle unless they draft

someone. So you have to see how it's all going to go together.

And I do think that when you're grading linemen like that, it's very difficult

to give them an accurate grade on PFF for both defensive linemen and offensive linemen.

So I think you have to take those with a grain of salt.

Now a lot of times your top linemen will end up at the top of the list.

But sometimes they can fall through the cracks and it doesn't always correspond to what a team

thinks. So I'm sure the Browns have their own set of analytics.

And I'm sure that they feel pretty good about what they've acquired so far.

And they can field probably an above average offensive line right now.

And that's probably about the best you can hope for right now when you had to overhaul

the whole thing at once.

Yeah, and I think too. Like when you're talking about whenever you're talking about free agency

and ever talking about trading for guys, you're probably going to have to overpay a little.

It's obviously guys that other teams we're willing to part with for one reason or another.

So it's never going to be a perfect solution.

But I think to me the key point you made there is like some of these grades you just don't know.

It's hard to especially on the offensive line more than anything.

I still think it's the toughest position to grade individually.

And I think it's I think it's dangerous to get too caught up in those individual grades for

better or worse. I just think it's going to have it's going to be how those five kind of all

fit together. And especially when you talk about the interior of that line, how those three in the

middle kind of all fit together. It's I just think it's one of those positions that is

all five of those guys are so dependent on the other guys that it's just more about the

collective than it is the individual pieces of George Warhop and Todd Munkin and Travis Switzer

can get all these guys kind of piece together the right way and playing together the right way.

Then I don't know if those individual grades are going to matter that much. We'll see.

I mean, that's the point of this. We'll see on Sundays if Andrew Berry was right to spend all

this money on these guys or if he was wrong. But for right now, I just think we have to wait until

we see that full picture of what this looks like. Yeah, I think so too. And you've got as you mentioned,

you know, George Warhop. He's a very good longtime veteran, a good longtime veteran offensive

line coach. And he is he's going to come in here ready to shake things up and change things up

a little bit and play to guys strengths and and put his stamp on this offensive line. And then

you've got a new scheme with Todd Munkin and sometimes you acquire a guy who's going to fit the

scheme of what you're going to try to do. So so I think these guys were probably about the best

that they were going to be able to get right now. It's hard to go out and find a starting

right tackle or left tackle in free agency or a trade because if you have a good one,

generally, you're not going to let him go. So for them to find a starter in this cycle, I think

that was pretty good right there. And then, you know, some of the other guys, they've got, you know,

pro bowls in their past and things like that. So they come with credentials. Some of them like

Elton is coming off of an injury. So, you know, he may have come at a little bit of a bargain

basement price, although they paid a pretty penny for him. But, you know, he was available because

he was coming off of an injury. So, you know, nothing's going to be perfect at this time of year

when you're trying to refurbish and revive your offensive line. But I think they did a really

good job with what they had to work with. And I've also made this point on a couple pods before too.

I think what else you did was you brought in guys who play. Like if you look in their history,

now you mentioned Elton Jenkins obviously had that injury last year. But prior to that injury,

you're looking at 15 games, 15 games, and 17 games in the three years prior. Titus Howard has

been reliable. 32 games in the last two years. I and Johnson, you know, same deals. 34 games

the last two years, 33 starts. Like these are guys that have been available and been on the field.

And when the Browns O line has been at its best, whether you want to go back to the Joe Thomas,

Alex Mack, Mitchell Schwartz stays, those lines or more recently, obviously, the Antonio

Tredder, Teller, you know, the line in 2020. You had a bunch of guys that played and you had

a bunch of guys that were staying healthy and fighting and fighting and getting out there and playing.

And again, I just think offensive line is weird. And it's a different position than any place else.

And it's another position where that availability is your best ability. I think that really applies

to offensive linemen. And they signed three guys, Jenkins injury aside here, recent injury.

They signed three guys that for the most part have been on the field and played.

Right. And there is a culture amongst at least the Browns offensive linemen and the ones that

you were talking about, the Joel's and the Alex Max and the Joe Thomas's. These guys were Iron

Men. They were such Iron Men. They were out there and they they played through all kinds of

injuries and they carried that through and they passed that baton along to each other. And Joe

Thomas never came out. Joe Patonio played almost every single snap in his entire 12-year career.

My goodness. It's really amazing to think about how these guys are just

playing warriors. It really is. And so yes, you do need that. And that is so valued here.

And we'll really come in handy for these guys as they try to get through this season together.

Okay, let's get to another question. This one does have to do with Joel Patonio. Something we

talked a little bit about on the pod yesterday, but this one comes from Kirk Kettinger in Rochester,

New York, Camarike. How long can the Browns afford to wait for Joel Patonio to make up his

mind about retirement before it becomes a detriment to their plans in free agency in the rag. And of

course, one of the things you wrote yesterday on Wednesday basically said like Patonio's decision

could even stretch into next month. So it's not exactly clear when we're going to get a final

decision from Patonio here. No, but I would guess that when someone told me that it could be

sometime in April, I'm guessing that's going to happen before the draft, which is April 23rd to

April 25th. And then one of the next flashpoints that we have coming up are the NFL owners meetings,

March 28th to March 31st. And there we'll be talking to Todd Monkin. We'll be talking to Andrew

Barry. We'll be talking to the Haslums there. So I think we'll probably have a pretty good idea

there of what might be happening. And I think they also want in addition to giving Joel the time

that he needs. I think they want to let him, you know, make the announcement or, you know, whatever

it's going to be in his own time and his own way. It seems like it's headed towards him not coming

back. But I don't know that for sure right now. I really don't. And I do think that

sometime in April, maybe mid April, they will have their decision from Joel.

Yeah, just to this idea of it being a detriment to their plans, I think we're seeing like it's not.

It hasn't stood in the way of them signing, you know, they bring back Kevin Jenkins. They signs

eye in Johnson. Elton Jenkins can play guard if they need him to play guard. Like you said, he's

probably in line to start at center, but they can move him to guard if they want to. And

as long as he decides, I mean, even if he doesn't decide by the draft, although I think you're right,

sure he will. Well, you know, that would be a little ridiculous if we were getting to the draft

and he hadn't decided yet. But even if he doesn't decide by then, I don't know that him coming back

for one year would preclude you from drafting a guard or drafting someone that you really like if

they would eventually take Joel Betonio's spot. So I know there's some money stuff and I,

but Andrew Berry is pretty good at working through those things and pushing money around and

moving it down the road. So I wouldn't even worry that much about that. I think it's just,

it seems like they're just doing business as usual. And if Joel comes back, great. And if he doesn't,

they're covered. They are. They really are. And from a money standpoint, if you are going to

resign Joel, you can always do something where you give him that low base and then a larger

signing bonus or whatever the case may be, or you sign him to the contract the way that you want

it in the beginning. And then you convert some of that paragraph five, that base salary to a

restructure bonus. And then you give him a veteran minimum of about $1.255 million, which is the

way that they have been managing their cap. It's the way they've been managing their cap

throughout this whole Dishon Watson situation. And you're seeing now that they're certainly not the

only team that is in the same boat of having a large quarterback salary that you have to account for

and the guy might not even be playing for you anymore. I'm thinking of Tua, right? He's owed

$54 million by the dolphins. I'm thinking of Kyler Murray. He's owed $36.8 million by the Cardinals.

And he's not playing for them anymore. Russell Wilson was owed a boatload of millions from

the Broncos. And he wasn't playing there anymore. So it's just kind of becoming a thing.

You have to pay these quarterbacks so much. And sometimes it doesn't work out. But that's how they've

been navigating it is to restructure the salaries, push the money out, kick the can down the road,

pay the paper later, and then you're able to acquire the players that you need for right now.

And this salary cap keeps going up. So it gets a little easier to take as you go along.

I do think it's interesting that we're seeing, you know, the Browns are doing it a certain way with

the Sean Watson. Whereas like we saw with Denver and Russell Wilson, they kind of just said,

we're going to eat the money ASAP. Now they did do the post-June first thing. The dolphins,

I believe, were doing the same thing. So they spread it out over two years. They didn't just eat it

all at once. But I do think it's interesting that we're seeing teams being more willing to do that.

Whereas, you know, the Browns have kind of made the decision with the Sean Watson that first of all,

he's still on the roster. And we're just we're going to spread this out over a longer stretch of time

instead of just taking the medicine over two years. I don't know if there's a right or a wrong

way to do it, but I do think it's really interesting we've reached a point now where it's like

you miss on a quarterback. It used to be if you missed on a rookie quarterback,

the pay scale allowed you to move on quicker. And now it's just become even if you extend these

guys to some huge number. We're seeing teams being more willing to not even do the

Dishon Watson thing to just do the we're just going to cut him and, you know, deal with it for

two years. And it's not going to be fun or great. But like we're just going to move on from this guy

too. It's actually really interesting to see how this is all playing out. It really is interesting.

And in the case of Dishon Watson, I think they did hold out some hope that perhaps they could get

something out of him this coming year. And maybe they still will. I don't know how that's

going to go yet. There's a large part of me that thinks they really want to commit to Shador

Sanders and see what he can do. But you never really know. Maybe they'll try to get something and

salvage something from that trade and see if they can get something out of Dishon Watson

in the last year of his contract. Of course, if he plays well and he wins, then what do you do?

Then what do you do, right? So you could find yourself, you know, in a little bit of a pickle

that way, because then you have to make a decision. Do you actually pay him again? Do you pay him

more money? Or do you just cut your losses then and move on? It's going to be very interesting to

see how this plays out. And it's just going to go down in history as one of the most challenging

transactions that's ever occurred. That's something I've thought about a little bit. Because right,

if Shador Sanders is good, then it's easy. You have your quarterback and he's young and you get

whatever, two more years of team control. You've got to pay him at some point. Like if Shador

Sanders is good, the path forward is very clear and very easy. And in a perfect world,

that's what the Browns would probably want to see happen. If Shador Sanders be really good and

be their franchise quarterback, that would save them a lot of headaches. If Dishon Watson is good,

you're right. Like what do you do? He's older now. You just paid him a ton of money.

What would an extension for him look like? Would it be sort of like, I don't know what the

cult just did with Daniel Jones? What would you have to do one of those? Would it have to be like a

sand Arnold type of deal that he did in Seattle? Would you just say like, hey, thanks for everything.

Go see if you can keep this going someplace else. That almost feels like the most Browns outcome

is for Dishon Watson to be the one who's really good and puts them in this position instead of

Shador Sanders being the one that kind of comes in and saves them. But I do think that's an

interesting scenario. If Shador doesn't grab this thing and Dishon looks even just a little bit

close to 2020 Dishon, that's, that'll make for an interest, some interesting pods next year.

I'll put it that way. Yeah, really would. And in order for him to be that, that offensive line is

going to have to come together. And this is for Shador as well. The offensive line is going to have

to come together. And then they have to bolster the weapons around him. There's got to be a couple more

guys that can go out there and and really kind of help them light it off. So we'll see how this

is going to go. I don't know. I really don't know yet, but my gut feeling right now as we speak

is that Shador Sanders is going to have the edge. Like they're just going to want to let him pick up

where he left off and see if they can build on it and see what Todd Malkin can do with him.

I could be wrong about that because I've talked to plenty of other people who think Dishon Watson

is starting the season. So I don't know. I just don't know where this is going yet.

Well, and I think I think giving Shador the first shot is the right move. Like because again,

that's the that's the easiest path forward. That's the best path forward is if you could

if you could draw it out on a whiteboard and it would follow exactly what you wanted.

It would be you give Shador the shot in OTAs and training camp. He wins the job outright

and you right into the season with him is your number one and he gives you confidence that he can be

your franchise quarterback. And that's what he becomes. And then you just move on with everything's

fixed, all of a sudden. Dishon Watson just makes things more complicated. And again, because he's

older because he's a free agent, all of those things. The the perfect outcome for the Browns,

for as hard as I've been on Shador Sanders at times, the perfect outcome for the Browns is for

Shador Sanders to show them he's their franchise quarterback this year.

Absolutely 100%. That is the path of least resistance. If he can go out there at the money

that he makes right now, which is basically peanuts for a fifth round pick and become your starting

quarterback, that would be like winning a lottery ticket for the Cleveland Browns. And it would help

make up for the fact that you spent $230 million on Dishon Watson and virtually got nothing out of

him. At that point, maybe you would still only have nine victories out of him. 19 starts total.

So if that can happen and you can spend your next several years building on what Shador can do,

developing him at these low, low rookie contract costs. I mean, that that would just be such a

bananza for the Cleveland Browns. It would enable them to add other pieces and parts to the team.

They will almost be out from underneath the Dishon Watson Albatross after this year.

They won't have that big huge enormous cap number hanging over their head, although they will

still have void year numbers coming over the next how many every years through 2029.

But that would be the best case scenario for the Cleveland Browns is if they found a diamond

in the rough in the fifth round of the draft. Right. And this is something I think I mentioned

this last year. Like, can he be in a lot of ways? It would be because it's similar to the situation,

again, he sort of developed himself into a Brock Purdy type of quarterback. And you know,

when we watched Brock Purdy play against the Cleveland Browns and he, I thought he played great

against that defense. I know the statistics weren't great, but I thought he did some good things.

And then I think one of the encouraging things from Shador was, I mean, we did see incremental progress.

And I think back to that Buffalo game, I know that he took some heat for that Bills game,

but I thought a lot of that was him doing the right thing over and over again. Like Buffalo was

playing this too high. And he just kind of kept taking the stuff that was there in front of him.

And I think, you know, if if we continue to see that incremental advancement and you've talked

about it, we saw the two comeback drives almost one against Baltimore. But then we saw the one

with the two point play that we got taken off the field. We saw the one against Cincinnati.

He knows how to handle himself in those moments. Like those are the things you're looking at

and saying, like, this is why you do want to give him that shot. And now can he do the rest of the

stuff? Can he, can he consistently do it drive the drive, play to play week to week? And the Browns

might just be in a position where they're going to get to find out an answer to that question.

Absolutely. And I agree with Todd Monkin that he does possess elite playmaking ability. I don't

think you can deny it. I think the people that don't want to see it aren't going to see it,

but it's there. I mean, he has some very, very unique ability to make those while elite plays.

And he did so without having any first team reps, he did so with a very challenged offensive line

and with just a lot of really young guys at most of the skill positions. So I think if you do

surround him with a lot of talent, you know, they've upgraded the whole offensive line.

Todd Monkin gets in there, digs in there, identifies what he does best, plays to his strengths.

Let's him, you know, take some of those nice deep shots that he likes to take, of course,

trying to avoid the interceptions. He's got to cut down on those. But I think there's something

there to work with. And I'm very, very curious to see what he can become. And I think the browns

are curious to see what he can become as well. So I don't know. I just think that that he showed

flashes. He showed signs. And you know, he's got a long way to go. Teams are going to dig in and

try to take away his strengths and what he does best. They're going to test him and challenge him.

Defensive coordinators are going to find those weaknesses. But he's a gamer. He's a gamer. And he

has that it factor that Todd Monkin is seeking. And I think he just might surprise some people.

Well, and I think too, like, there are some things in there that you just, you can't teach, right?

That gamer stuff. And I heard an interview with Seth, Seth Wickersiam who did that quarterback

book. And I guess, I guess Kevin O'Connell, when he flamed out of the league and was getting into

coaching, went back and watched a bunch of game winning drives from Tom Brady and Joe Montana

and all of this. And one of the things that stood out to him was how calm those guys were. And it

wasn't like, I'm going to go out and make a bunch of spectacular throws. I'm going to hit the

check downs and march us down the field. And that's how and you go back to that drive against

Tennessee. But it was a bunch of like, hey, Dylan Samson is wide open in front of me. So I'm just

going to keep throwing to him over and over again. And the next thing you know, you practically

let a game time drive, who knows what happens if he stays on the field for that two point try.

Sam and Cincinnati, it's not like he made 10 spectacular throws, but he was calm and he took

what was there. Like that's stuff you can't, that stuff you don't teach. Like that's just stuff

that's kind of innate. And that's why he's intriguing. You know, whether you believe he's actually

going to be that guy or not, that's what makes him intriguing. And that's why I'm sure the browns

are still intrigued by him. And I think he's tough. I think he has shown a lot, a lot of toughness.

I look back even to that Raiders game and he did. It was his first start and his first victory.

And he got hit. Max Crosby hit him three times. There were several times where he slipped away from

a Max Crosby sack. And he showed kind of ice in his veins doing that. I think he has shown that he

can he can get the job done in a two-minute drill or a four-minute drill. I think he has shown that.

And he has shown it under very trying conditions once again without having worked with many of

these guys. So I think there's a decent amount of upside potential. I for one and very curious to

see what it's going to be all about. I think there is something there. And if people haven't seen

it, I don't know how they're missing it because there is something there to build on and to work with.

And who knows what that could be if all of the conditions around him are right.

So I think the Browns are going to I think the Browns are going to give him a chance whether it's

at the beginning of the season, middle and whatever. I think he's going to have more opportunities

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Okay, let's move on to a draft question here. Abe in Huntington, West Virginia. Hey, Mary K,

do you think the Browns free agent signings have opened the door to drafting the

to drafting the best player available at number six? Or do you see the Browns focusing on wide

receiver or offensive line only at six? No, I think that they have always been poised to take

the best available player wherever that is, whether it's at six, whether they trade back

or whatever they do. I don't think you can rule anything out. Even though they obviously need

still offensive guys, I don't think you can rule out a defensive guy because if the best player

on the board is someone that can continue to help you on defense and make that defense

be or continue to be one of the most dominant in the NFL, then why not go ahead and take that player.

So yes, I do think that they have the freedom to go out and do whatever they need to do in

this draft and to stay true to their board. And Andrew Berry usually does a really good job of that.

If it seems like he's taking a tackle when they need a tackle, it's because the draft strengths

are marrying up with the Browns needs. He's not going to take a tackle if the best player is a

defensive end at that point. So that's how you have to operate or you're going to end up with

the football team full of players that are not as good as they could have been. You have to keep

adding the premier players, the best players at their positions when they're there.

Yeah, and I think the key is sort of, okay, who's the best player available? Who are the premium

positions? I do think that matters too when you're talking about like the number six overall pick.

So what do you consider your premium positions? And actually this, so I was listening to Eric

Takosta at the combine. I walked down and was listening to him on one of the things he said was

about drafting a defensive tackle. And this quote, this quote was, I think if we have the chance

to draft a great defensive tackle, of course we will. It's one of the most important positions in

football. And that just got me thinking like we haven't always thought of that as a premier

position, but it's obvious the Browns do think of that as a premier position because they've

invested money there. They use the number five overall pick there. So some of it depends on what

they view as those premium positions. And so if there's a guy that kind of aligns, if it happens

to align with need and wide receiver and no line, I think are in that premium position discussion,

great, they'll take him. But I do think if they have a significantly higher grade on someone else

at another premium spot, whether that's, I don't know that they would take another defensive

tackle. I don't even know if there is one that would fit that category at number six overall, but

that's how you end up with an R-Vell Reese or something like that.

Absolutely. And defensive tackles have become so invoked over the past, I would say three or four

years. I mean, when this regime first got started here, the Andrew Berry regime, defensive tackles

were somewhat of an afterthought. Remember, they were just kind of like pulling them in off the

streets and finding guys under rocks and guys that could come in and plug holes or guys that had been

forgotten and left on the scrap heap by others. And that's how they were stocking their interior

d-line back then. And then you started to see this seismic shift in the NFL where defensive tackles

started to be some of the most dominant players in the NFL and on your defense. And that's where

we are right now. Defensive tackles are a premium position. And I think they're almost right

up there with defensive ends. Maybe a lot of teams have them tied with defensive ends when you're

talking about your premium defenders. So anything can happen. And if you find another one of those

guys and he is the best player on the board at the time, or if he's the best player at number 12,

if you've moved back, then Andrew Berry will do that. He's going to find really, really talented

football players. That's what he's about to do. Did anybody think he was going to draft Carson

Swessinger at number 33 overall last year, right? That just did not seem like that was going to

happen. And he went out and did something. And afterwards it made so much sense, right? We didn't

know then that J.O.K. that his career was probably going to be over. And so it made more sense

as time went along. But that was sort of a surprise pick in that moment, especially just because

because it's a linebacker, right? And it just doesn't seem like that in that moment was going to

be the pick. And he surprised everybody. And it's just turned out to be a dynamite selection,

of course, NFL defensive rookie of the year. And the upside is only going to be great.

Yeah. And that's so I think part of the debate is like part of this question is probably the idea

of Caleb Downs, right? So when we talk about premium positions, I do want to do they view

safety as like one of those top premium positions. You know, like I said, the point with defensive

tackles, they told us last year that yeah, they view that as a premium position. We know they're

going to view edge rush. So there's your RVL Reese discussion. Did they go into and think man,

could we pair Miles Garrett with RVL Reese and kind of just see fit what what Mike Routenberg wants

to do with his ed rushers? Like that could be kind of fun. So you know, that's where I kind of

wonder if you're sitting there with like a safety and maybe you don't love the tackles or you

can get a tackle at number 24. And you're looking at like a really great ed rusher, a really great

wide receiver. Is that the direction they would go? I don't know. I mean, Andrew Berry could surprise

us on on draft night. That's I guess that's the point of all of this. Right. And when you're looking

at a player like a Caleb Downs, I think you have to ask yourself. When you're looking at that

particular player almost in a vacuum. Is this almost a generational talent at his position?

Is he going to change the game or change the position? Is he going to be up there with

the ed reads and the Troy Polymollis? Is it going to be that kind of guy? And if he's that much

of a game changer and he's going to be getting his hands on interceptions and he's going to be

forcing fumbles and covering and doing all different kinds of things, then then I think you can

warrant a guy like that at number six overall. And he might be good enough that teams will come

up to get him. So he could be trade bait for you as well. So I wouldn't be surprised if we hear

a lot of really, really positive talk about Caleb Downs coming out of Cleveland. Not just because

they're going to like him, but because they're going to want to make sure other teams know that

there's a chance that they can take on. I do think too. I just think Andrew Berry fits the mold of

one of these guys who really values when we're talking really high picks. And again, this is where

Mason Graham, I think, is instructive. When you can get a big guy that can move like some of

these elite big get these elite athletes, like he really values that high in the draft. So

Mason Graham, you know, go back to number 10 overall, Jed Willes. I think if all things are equal,

he's going to lean towards the the trench guy. He's going to lean towards the bigger guy. That

doesn't guarantee that's going to happen. But if everybody's kind of graded pretty close together,

I think that's probably where he would lean just because it's harder to get those really high

level big guys later in the draft. The guys that are just super athletic and move really well and

just do all the stuff that like a Mason Graham can do. So I think that's part of it too. I think

he values bigger guys early, but that doesn't guarantee that he's going to take a tackle at six.

I just think all things equal. He would lean towards a bigger body.

Yeah, I agree with you there. But I also, and again, I just come from a different place with this

and I know this is a very deep draft for wide receivers and you're probably going to be able to

find one. You might be able to find a great one in the third round. But I would not be opposed to

carnell tape at number six overall because I do think that you need a premier weapon like that.

And if that's the best place to get him, then take him right there. So even though he does love

to stock the trenches and whatnot, I would certainly not be opposed to a carnell tape at number

six overall. And then if you trade back, then maybe I would still be looking at

one of the top receivers in the first round. Well, that leads us to this question

from Tom Bayes in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hey, Mary K in light of recent offensive line

signings to bolster the offensive scoring output for the upcoming season. The Browns have not

addressed the glaring need a wide receiver. Why haven't they signed a veteran receiver yet?

Well, first of all, when you're trying to sign a veteran receiver, you're talking about a lot of money.

I know they inquired about Mike Evans, but unless you think you are one season away or this is

your year, and you need that piece, then I don't know if you want to spend the money on a guy like

that. Or if you want to spend a money, the money on a Rashid Shaheed, and I don't know if they tried

or not, but I don't know any of that yet. Hopefully as we move through the next month or so,

we'll get some of those answers. But it's really a money issue when it comes to these veteran

whiteouts. And if you know you've got number six, number 24, number 39, in a very, very receiver

rich draft, you might not have to spend that kind of money. Or you can wait a little bit and see if

somebody comes free or becomes available that once again needs a change of scenery, needs a new

contract, needs a new home, and you can wait and see if you can kind of get someone in the more

bargain type market. So we got a question about that too. This idea of, you know, is it just

better to draft a receiver than try and go sign someone? And I do wonder if we're going to see a

little bit of that correction. And because these guys are getting, you know, the top of the market

is getting close to, it's almost ed rush or money for some of these guys. And then, you know,

like a Jamar chase. And that's kind of bringing up some of these middleing guys. Now they're getting

paid 20, 30 million dollars. Some of these guys, it probably aren't worth 20 or 30 million dollars. So

are you better off taking a guy at number six or a trading down and taking a guy at 10 or 12. And

then you get potentially an elite receiver on the cheap for four or five years. I do wonder if

we start to see a little bit of that correction where some of these GMs are saying, I don't want to

pay 30 million dollars for a wide receiver unless he's a Jamar chase or a Justin Jefferson.

So I'm just going to use the draft and load up on cheap guys. Sort of like what we see, you know,

it's like having a quarterback on a rookie contract or an ed rush or on a rookie contract. Like,

give me a really great receiver on a rookie contract. That's about as good a value as you can find.

Right. I mean, I'm all for that. But I've always been a big receiver guy. And I've always felt like

the Browns have left themselves a little short in that department. I don't think you can have

too many great receivers. Think of the great Joe Burrow years when he always had those three

really, really good receivers. And he still does have three really good receivers right now.

So I think that it's well worth a high first round pick because it can transform your entire

offense to have a guy like that. They can go out there and and just win games for you and catch

a touchdown passes and score those points. And I am all about that. And in my mind, it's a little

bit of a sexier pick. I know that they like the fundamentals and they want to build through the

trenches and all that kind of stuff. That's all well and good. But, you know, give me a Jackson,

Smith and Jigba and Les Role, right? I mean, like these guys are so good and they're such game

changers. And I mean, it's a crapshoot if you try to wait and get one much later. So I would

probably be looking for one in the first round. I would be looking for one in the first round.

Yeah, one and like to your point, think back to what was the one was the year they drafted Anthony

Schwartz, right? So they draft him at the end of the third round. Who goes at the start of day three,

actually one pick after the Browns took James Hudson, a monoraw saying Brown, right? So let's say

the Browns saw that differently and took a monoraw at the end of the third round. How different are

things? So you're right. It is a crapshoot the later that you get in the draft because these guys

just get harder and harder to project. And I mean, let's be honest, Andrew has struggled to kind of

nail that position later in the draft. So if there's a sure thing sitting there, I'll listen to the

case for taking a receiver at six. I'm certainly not opposed to it. If if you're getting a

shore fire, number one or like whatever, one A, one B, whatever it is, like that's I would take

that on this roster. They certainly need it. Right. And now this year, it will be interesting to see

how much Isaiah Bond develops and takes that next step up because I had heard that if he had been

in this draft, that he would have been a candidate for their number 33 overall pick. So they viewed

him in that light of being like a high second round pick. And that's almost a first round pick,

obviously. So that's how they saw him. So now let's see what he's got. Let's see what he can do.

Can he take his game up to that next level and be that bona fide consistent, deep threat?

And I know he's got the confidence to do it. He's got the speed. He does have the hands. Now he's

got to put the whole thing together. And he's got to just elevate his game a little bit. But I do

think that he has the potential to be that. So I'm sure that they they're looking at it like,

okay, they've got Jerry Judy. They've got Isaiah Bond ready to take his game up. They've got hero

Fanon who will be only better. So they probably don't even see or feel the sense of urgency to add

to premium pass catchers to this roster. But I still do.

Okay, there we go. Hey, Mary K addition of the podcast here as free agency moves forward past this

first wave. I'm sure the Browns have some more additions coming their way. If you're not a football

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there. Mary Kale, talk to you later. Sounds great.