The Apostasy & the Coming Deception! (Audio)

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A Catholic take with Joe McLean starts now.

Praise be to Jesus Christ. Welcome back to a Catholic take.

A bold synthesis of information and inspiration

from your host Joe McLean. Praise be to God.

It's good to be on with you.

Let's talk about the age of apostasy and the coming deception.

Father Jason Sharon joins us.

He put out a video on this very topic just a few days ago.

And boy, I think it's going to be very, very good.

Because I do believe we're entering into an age of greater deception.

So let's avoid that by holding fast to the truth.

Speaking of which, Cardinal Zupi hanging out with Muslims in a Ramadan street.

If tar is not part of the solution.

It's in fact part of the problem.

This is an error in ecumenical dialogue.

And it's going to lead to greater deception.

We'll talk about that with Nicholas Kovasos at 14 past the hour.

So we're going to have a great conversation.

And by the way, you can provide your commentary.

What your Catholic take is in the chat boxes of the live video feed found at the station of the cross.com forward slash ACT.

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Let's get after it.

We have a lot to pray for today, especially the violence coming out of Old Dominion and in Michigan.

Another synagogue attacked, at least according to recent reports.

So let's pray for peace in our world.

In the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, Amen.

Remember, almost gracious Virgin Mary that never was had known.

That anyone who fled to thy protection implored thy help or sought,

thine intercession was left unated.

Inspired by this confidence, I fly unto thee a virgin, a virgin's my mother,

to thee do I come before thee I stand sinful and sorrowful.

A mother of the word incarnate despised not my petitions,

but in thy mercy here and answer me.

Amen.

In the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost,

and now your saint of the day.

Pope St. Gregory the Great pray for us.

Gregory was born in Rome around the year 540 to St. Silvia,

a patroness of expectant mothers, and Gordionus,

a wealthy Roman senator who later renounced his possessions and became an important deacon.

Two of Gregory's aunts are also venerated as saints.

Gregory rose to briefly serve as prefect of Rome before becoming a monk

and later the abbot of a Benedictine monastery that was once one of his family's villas.

Gregory reliably served previous pontiffs before reluctantly ascending to the throne himself

in the year of our Lord 590.

Among his successes as Pope were many contributions to the Roman liturgy,

including the compilation and codification of Western chant,

henceforth called Gregorian, and the sending of St. Augustine of Canterbury

and his fellow monks to Convert England, for which Gregory is known as the Apostle of England.

After 13 and a half glorious years on the chair of St. Peter,

Gregory died on March 12th in the year of our Lord's 604.

His feast is celebrated on September 3rd in the modern calendar.

One of the first four doctors of the Latin Church,

Gregory is a patron of the musicians and teachers.

For more about the saints and seasons of the Catholic Church,

visit thestationofthecross.com, forward slash saints and seasons.

Pope St. Gregory the Great pray for us.

And now your headline news.

Ground news reports US intelligence says Iran government is not at risk of collapse.

US intelligence assessed Iran's leadership remains largely intact

and not at risk of collapse after nearly two weeks of US and Israeli strikes,

citing consistent analysis that the regime retains control of the Iranian public.

Sources say the situation remains fluid.

President Donald Trump has suggested ending the operation, quote, soon,

but has not ruled out ground troops.

According to the BBC, three cargo ships were struck off Iran's coast.

On Wednesday, the United Kingdom Maritime Trade Operations reported three cargo vessels were struck

by projectiles in the Strait of Hormuz with one fire forcing crews to evacuate.

Star, Gwent's crew were safe and 20 sailors were rescued by the Omani Navy.

And zeal reports, officials find that the United States was behind the deaths of the Iranian schoolgirls.

An ongoing military investigation has preliminarily concluded that the American forces were responsible

for the deadly February the 28th air strike on the Iranian girls' elementary school

that killed at least 150 people.

The tragedy was reportedly due to the US relying on outdated targeting data.

An investigation into why the data was not double checked is ongoing.

And those are your headline news.

The Gospel today comes to us from Luke, chapter 11, verses 14 through 23.

At that time, Jesus was casting out a devil.

And the same was dumb.

And when he had cast out the devil, the dumb spoke and the multitudes were in admiration at it.

But some of them said he casteth out devils by bells above the Prince of Devils

and others tempting asked of him a sign from heaven.

But Jesus, seeing their thoughts, said to them,

Every kingdom is divided against itself.

She'll be brought to desolation and house upon how shall fall.

And if Satan also be divided against himself,

how shall his kingdom stand?

Because you say that through bells above I cast out devils.

Now if I cast out devils by bells above,

by whom do your children cast them out?

Therefore they shall be your judges.

But if I by the finger of God cast out devils,

doubtless the kingdom of God has come upon you.

When a strong man armed keepeth his court, those things are in peace which he possesseth.

But if a stronger than he come upon him and overcome him,

he will take away all his armor wherein he trusted and will distribute his spoils.

He that is not with me is against me,

and he that gathers not with me scattereth.

The gospel of the Lord.

Laos TV Christie.

He reads their hearts, he reads their minds, he speaks to them.

In such a forceful and direct way,

the kingdom of God has come upon you.

You should be shuddering in your shoes right now if that were you.

And Jesus, the man who created all things,

spoke them into existences looking you in the eye saying this.

It should make you almost die of fright.

Father Hadoch would say this possessed person is,

said in St. Matthew's Gospel to have been also blind.

Upon him, therefore, were wrought three wonders.

The blind saw, the dumb spoke, and the possessed was delivered,

which daily takes place in the persons of such as are converted to the number of true believers.

The devil is expelled, and they both receive the light of faith,

beaming upon their eyes, and having the strings of their silent organs

loosed to sound forth the praises of God.

Quoting the venerable bead.

The multitude, though, devoid of learning,

were constant admirers of the actions of our Lord,

whilst the scribes and Pharisees either denied them,

or by a sinister interpretation,

ascribed them to the power of the unclean spirit.

The institution of the people of God.

Intention with the remnant of the people of God.

I think we're going to talk to Father Jason Sharon here in just a little while.

Father Hadoch goes on, though,

they will condemn you of injustice,

envy, and hatred against me,

and blasphemy against God,

because when they perform any exorcisms,

though they appear but little more than human in their actions,

yet you ascribe them to the virtue of God.

But when I perform any miracles, though,

there always appear most evident signs of the power and virtue of God,

you ascribe them all to the hand and the machinations of the devil.

The Catholic commentary in Holy Scripture would say,

the finger of God, this expression in Luke's Gospel,

echoes the cry of Pharaoh's magicians in Exodus 8, verse 19.

The demand for a sign is logical after the accusation.

Jesus is required to show a sign that he acts through the spirit of God

and not through evil spirits.

The conclusion in verse 23 is a very stern hint for the adversaries.

If they have so cited against Jesus,

when he casts out a devil,

is not that in itself a sign that they have taken sides with Satan,

whose reign as is shown in the allegorical application of the preceding parables,

our Lord has come to overthrow the kingdom of God,

has come upon them.

Think about that.

That is a condemnation from God himself.

St. Cyril Alexander would say,

I came to gather together the sons of God whom he hath scattered

and Satan himself, as he is not with me,

tries to scatter those which I have gathered and saved.

How then does he whom I use all my efforts to resist supply me with power?

St. Chrysostom would say,

but if he who does not work with me is my adversary,

how much more he will oppose me?

It seems, however, to me that he here under a figure refers to the Jews,

ranging them with the devil,

for they also acted against and scattered those whom he gathered together.

You know, we live in the great age of deception.

We are living in an increased era of lies and manipulations.

All the more reason to hang on to the truth,

the truth is a person that person was crucified by his own,

by his own people, by those who should have loved him the most.

He was crucified by them,

and where the master is so must the disciple be.

So it is reasonable for all of us to expect that we too should be crucified

by even those whom should love us the most.

Our own kind are going to nail us to a cross,

and there we are going to die slowly next to our Savior Jesus Christ.

And if we refuse to do that, can we even call him our master?

And can we be called his disciples?

In the age of deception, hang on to truth, unto death.

We'll be back in two.

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Praise be to Jesus Christ.

Welcome back to a Catholic take bold synthesis of information and inspiration

of your host, John McLean, praise be to God.

It's good to be on with you.

Coming up at 30 past the hour, Father Jason Charone is going to be joining us.

He's going to be talking about a video he put out.

When the majority is wrong, Israel, the church, and the coming deception.

When there's tension between the institutional church and the remnant of God,

what do we do?

And we're going to be discussing that.

So do join us for that if you can.

But speaking of deception in this great age of error,

how about false ecumenical dialogue?

Cardinal Zupi participating in some Muslim service for Ramadan?

What?

It's true.

There's links.

There's video hanging out with the Muslim prayer.

Not just here, but there's also like even the Germans are doing it in their churches.

It's rather bizarre.

This false ecumenical dialogue is causing much confusion amongst the remnant.

And we're discussing that this afternoon with Nicholas Kavasos.

Nicholas, good afternoon.

Thanks for being on the team today.

Appreciate you.

Yeah, absolutely, my friend.

Good to be here.

Praise be to Jesus and all things.

So Cardinal Zupi, what could what could go wrong here?

He's hanging out.

He's just trying to show a little bit of olive branch here hanging out with the

Muslims during Ramadan.

Why would that be a problem?

I think what makes it really problematic is that again, continues to give individuals

who are bystanders to the whole kind of discussion around Christianity.

The false impression that Christianity is okay with other religions.

Going all the way back to the Garden of Eden, we see our Lord be very clear

that there's only one God and that we should be obeying that said one God.

And it was deception from the fallen angel Satan that tricked us into thinking

that we could be like gods, that we could know better than the most high, if you will.

And really since that period of time, when you look throughout the annals of biblical church history,

we see, of course, the big fall of man, particularly with the children of Israel,

continues to be idolatry over and over and over again.

And this seems to be the issue in our own time in which we want to push the limits

of what God allows when it comes to worship.

So unfortunately in our own day, I think a lot of this of course goes back to kind of the spirit of Vatican II.

We see with Vatican II in a couple of documents, it talks about how the Muslims worship the one God with us.

And you see this, of course, enshrined in the catechism of the Catholic Church.

Of course, you can make the distinction between natural theology and what the catechism is probably talking about there,

which is that we all have ties to the Abrahamic faith and they recognize that God is monotheistic.

The problem, of course, goes to the fact that 99% of the people walking around in the streets

don't have a PhD in natural theology.

And so when they see a cardinal praying with a bunch of Muslims,

it gives them the impression that Christianity and Islam really aren't that different

and to use the words of Pope Francis, they're just various paths to God.

So it's quite troubling.

Yeah.

Remember the Abu Dhabi statement?

I mean, what could go wrong with?

I mean, aren't you just being overly critical and pre-concilier now?

I mean, should we just all move on and be one big happy fraternity?

I think if we love people, we won't and we will be critical because it's just what the Bible says

that Christ says that I am the way the truth in life and there's no way to the Father,

but by Him God says that I am God alone and there is none other.

And we see that the scripture calls the gods of the nation's demons

and that we should not go whoring after them, right?

These are very, very grave acts if people go and start messing around with false gods.

And so unfortunately, what it reminds me of today is it reminds me actually of the story of Balaam

and Balaac in the book of Numbers where the false prophet Balaam basically went along with the King's wishes.

God continued to correct him, but he was going along for money.

He was going along for popularity.

And this seems to be the trend of many prelates inside of the church where,

whether for financial reasons, they won't shut down the German church

or won't excommunicate the Cardinals or for popularity reasons in the eyes of the world.

They don't want to seem too harsh, but remember what our Lord says,

won't you win the world speaks well of you for so they did to their fathers who were false prophets?

So what would authentic, ecumenical dialogue look like if there could be such a thing?

What would, if you could do anything and you could advise its only this Pope Leo

on how to address the Muslims, what would that look like?

Yeah, ultimately I would say first you have to have a posture of great fear and great love of Christ

and recognize that Christ has a great heart for the Muslim people to be saved.

I think you first have to start with that reality.

And then on a practical level, how this would manifest itself,

it would be in the preaching of the gospel.

We of course would have to be careful about how we do that in various places.

Of course, it's probably not a good idea for someone to go and street preach on the streets of Mecca.

That's probably not a good idea. You probably end up dead pretty quick.

So you have to be prudent as our Lord says. That being said, of course, though,

you should preach the gospel. You should not go to war with individuals.

You shouldn't be trying to go into mosques or go into temples of false religions

and burn them down or create a ruckus or something like that.

But you should radically love them by telling them the truth and say,

hey, man, look, I love you. Jesus is the only way to the Father.

By having conversations like that, I think it can be good.

I think the Pope recognizes, you know, we've had 60 years now of dialogue.

And yes, of course, we're all on the same page.

We shouldn't be waging wars of religion, willy-nilly.

But now let's get to serious talk, which is that we're having souls being lost

by this confusion and by the lack of the preaching of the gospel.

So we live in a pluralistic society.

So what would society look like?

Let's just pretend Christendom was still a thing.

And we had Christian princes running governments, et cetera.

Society was ordered towards Christ and his church.

How, in that circumstances, what does it look like when Muslims live in our communities

or Jews live in our communities or Hindus or what have you?

You know, it's interesting traditionally Catholicism,

the answer to your question would have been that they could...

We could tolerate their false religions if they were to practice them in the privacy

of their own homes or something to that effect.

But on a public level, it would, of course, be banned.

This doesn't seem to be the case anymore because with the Vatican II document,

Dignittatus Humane, it's very, very clear that while on the one hand,

it tries to reaffirm the idea that the Catholic Church has not disenrolled its traditional teaching

of a religion being imposed in state, it does open up to religious liberty

in the context of civil law.

And it even gives some examples of things like proselytizing,

false religions, these missionaries from false religions,

they should be allowed to proselytize, they should be allowed to preach

and to give their tracks and things along that nature.

And so, honestly, when it comes to right now, you know,

we don't live in that medieval society, we don't live in a society

which is ordered according to what people would call pre-conciliar teaching.

And this is one of those issues that the Catholic Church needs to kind of figure out

because it does have great practical ramifications on how are we supposed to preach the gospel?

Because on the one hand, you see these teachings of Christ,

and then you have actions, for instance, like with Pope John Paul II,

who gave a large sum of money to one of the first buildings of synagogues in Rome back in the 1980s.

And so it's one of these situations where it's like real progress can only be made

if you guys all get on the same team.

We can't be waffling between pre and post-conciliar teachings.

The message has been really confusing over the last many decades

since the Second Vatican Council.

So many Catholics, I think, wrongly think that we're just trying to get along these days.

And when they hear us talk about this, they must think we're the craziest people on the planet.

How do we begin to change even the minds and the hearts of Catholics within the Church, let alone without?

Well, the first thing, of course, is prayer and personal sanctification

which can only come by the grace of Christ.

Without the grace of Christ, we can't do anything.

He says that, you know, without me, you can do nothing.

But I would say on a practical level, this is an issue that the Church and her leadership needs to address.

And the reason I say that is because we can have theories about what is the best policy to put forward.

There's, of course, the whole myriad of Catholic YouTubers and TikTokers who have their opinion.

But hopefully, the 14th was very clear in the 60th anniversary speech on Nostria Tate

that religious dialogue is not aimed at converting other individuals,

but rather individuals who are firmly rooted in their religious traditions

should be able to come together and dialogue so that fraternal peace,

and what he means by that is like lack of wars and disputations and stuff, would happen.

And so I think we need to stop looking at the situation with earthly eyes

and right, we can condemn war, we can condemn unjust violence, of course.

But we have to remember that souls are eternal.

And so I think the Pope needs to move a step further and say,

sure, yeah, we don't like the war thing, we don't like g-hods, et cetera.

But you know what, we also don't like, we also don't like souls going to hell

because that is far worse than any g-hod that could ever be done.

Yeah, I wish at the very, very minimum I wish the Cardinals would stop or bishops,

anybody associated with hierarchy of the Church would just stop with this false

ecumenical outreach nonsense that just causes more confusion and more chaos

and scandal within the Church.

We were talking about the Freemason, you know, the bishops who went to the Freemason ceremony

just last week as a matter of fact is we had another example of bad false ecumenical dialogue.

I want to switch topics real quick while I still have you before we have to sign off in this segment.

Vatican promoting dialogue on Cuba, Cardinal Paralan says,

that's interesting that EW10 came out with a news article suggesting that the Vatican is negotiating

between Cuba and the United States and even suggesting that there could be a brand new Cuba in town.

They might have freedom for the first time in seven decades.

Yeah, it's something that's quite interesting.

We've not really seen this reported unless you're kind of glued to the news,

but the Cubans are seemingly rising up in some form or fashion

and there looks like there could be a realistic chance of seeing a new government be installed.

I do hope the Vatican comes in and tries to play it truly fair according to Christian principles.

We've seen, of course, time and time again over the last,

especially just let's say five to six years,

the Vatican continuously seeming to back every organization or every sentiment that could be anti-American.

So I hope that if they do come in and try to negotiate in this,

it will truly be based in fairness and justice upon Christian principles.

I wonder what they mean though.

Quote, if there is freedom, there will not be suffering because there will be the necessary change.

How it will happen?

Well, that is what we're working on close quote,

the US diplomat said in the interview with EWTN,

with freedom that they've not had in 67 years.

Aren't they a communist country?

Are they discussing no longer being communist?

But what freedom could they possibly mean?

Yeah, realistically, it sounds like it would be some type of democratic republic situation

in which individuals will hold hopefully like the legislatures and something like that.

Because if not, it would just be a situation where you know,

you could have political vacuum and warlordism,

hopefully something like that wouldn't happen.

Realistically though, if the United States is speculating on this,

their policy of course is going to be some type of friendly pro-US style government in that region

because it's so close to our own borders.

I'd be amazing to see the communist government fall in Cuba

and they finally do have some sort of freedom that would be pretty amazing.

Can they practice their Catholic faith once again?

That would be interesting to know.

Hey, you're launching a new political show.

Tell me about that.

Yeah, I'm launching this next Monday here on YouTube Brumble

and a bunch of the other mostly audio platforms,

places like Spotify, etc.

A new show called the Nick Kavaso Show,

which is going to be airing Monday through Friday,

and it's just going to be politics, culture,

and the news itself.

And so we're going to be approaching all that from a broadly Christian,

of course, principal conservative background.

Hopefully kind of be able to give people more substantive answers

than the kind of classic click baity, outrage nonsense

that you typically see online.

So that's going to be coming this Monday, Monday,

the 16th of March, and it should be here,

and it's going to be a whole lot of fun

because I won't be here in this particular space.

I'll be over in the actual studio,

which is pretty cool looking at the moment

so I can't wait to check it out and to use it and for you guys to join me.

Yeah, we're looking forward to seeing that.

Now, will this be a separate YouTube channel,

or is it going to be the traditional Thomas?

This will be separate.

The traditional Thomas is actually going to be ordered

toward a positive ecumenical dialogue by having Catholics,

Orthodox Protestants, all to come on,

and actually hash out serious debates

and see what follows from there

as opposed to the nonsense that we typically see.

Very speedy garden, all things.

Nicholas Kavaso, so glad to have you on the team.

God bless you, brother.

Have a great day.

We'll see you next week,

and we're looking forward to the launch of the show on Monday,

check them out.

We're going to put a link to his YouTube channel and others.

Let's go to this two-minute break when we come back, though.

We're going to have a conversation with Father Jason Chiron.

We put out a video.

The majority is wrong.

Israel, the church, and the coming deception.

The age of apostasy.

The age of deception.

What do we do in the age of deception

but hold on to truth?

We're going to learn that.

The hard way.

Soon.

Two minutes from now.

Praise be to Jesus Christ.

Welcome back to a Catholic take a bold synthesis of information

and inspiration on your host,

John McLean, and hear your headline news.

Ground news reports two people injured,

gunmen dead after shooting at Virginia's old Dominion University.

Today, a gunmen opened fire inside

Constant Hall at Old Dominion University in North Folk,

Virginia, injuring two people before law enforcement

killed the suspect,

at least according to university officials.

Two victims remain in critical condition

at North Folk General Hospital.

Reuters reports Trump will release 172 million barrels

of oil from the strategic petroleum reserve.

Tapping the strategic petroleum reserve,

the U.S. will release 172 million barrels

to help lower prices amid the Iran war.

Gasoline prices rose to about 358 per gallon,

nearly 22% higher than last month,

and gas averaged around 294.

Who remembers when it was under a buck?

I do.

Those were good days.

A zeal reports Biden deregulation

of abortion pill hurt women.

The FDA's decision under Biden administration

to loose the safety restrictions

on the abortion drug,

Mitheprostone led to an increase in serious health complications

for women according to a new report

from the Ethics and Public Policy Center.

Pro-life advocates have repeatedly urged

the Trump administration to reinstate

these safety requirements for Mitheprostone.

However, the Trump admin seems to not be listening

and those are your headline news.

Praise be to God in all things.

It was a great video put out by Father Jason Charone

about nine days ago when the majority is wrong,

Israel, the church, and the coming deception.

I'm linking to it in the show notes,

but you can find it on his YouTube channel.

He joins us this afternoon.

Good afternoon, Father.

Thank you for your time.

Glory to Jesus Christ.

Now and forever.

One of the things you said in your video

was you talked about this tension.

This tension between the institution

of the chosen people of God, the church,

and the remnant, the people.

And you give us sort of the old testament background

brought into the new, right?

So that's a saint Augustine.

The old is the new is hidden in the old

and revealed in the new.

It's a beautiful thing to think about.

But I want you to expand upon that for me.

What is this tension between the hierarchy,

the institution, the official halls of the people of God

and the actual people living the faith on the ground?

It's a perennial tension between power and authority

between appearances and reality.

Between the institutional authority

and prophetic authority.

And it's been with us from the beginning.

And it's been brought into full display

with the pulling back of the veil

that we've seen in Christianity and Christendom

since the mid 20th century.

And now it's on full display.

The emperor has no clothes.

People see that many of their hierarchs

simply do not believe.

And the symptoms of that are in

revealed in questions like homosexuality,

reverence at the liturgy,

disregard for marriage, disregard for the preborn.

All of these are symptomatic of the landmine

underneath it all, which is apostasy.

The denial of the Lordship of Jesus Christ

over everything in my life.

You know, I was talking about this

with Gast the other day from CatholicVote.org,

Tom McCluskey.

And we were talking about the impact of the Iran war

on the coming midterm elections.

And I brought this up and he didn't seem

like he was totally on board with it.

And I said, it wasn't on my bingo card

that in 2026, we would be discussing

the rise of Christian Zionism.

And on a political scale that we hadn't seen

or talked about before, it seems like we live

in very interesting times.

He didn't see like it was that big of a deal,

but I certainly feel like it is.

Do you think Christian Zionism, the rise of Christian Zionism,

is becoming more of an issue in our society?

I'm not really sure what people entirely

mean by that term.

And I'd prefer to speak about the problem

we have with the rampant apostasy in the church.

I see that they're linked.

I'm not going to dwell on this in any way,

but I just find that this is interesting

because part of your video really talks

about the chosen people of God.

If we don't know who the chosen people of God are,

I think we're really going to be manipulated

in the wrong way.

We're really going to buy lies and disinformation

and all the rest.

I think it's important for us now more than ever

to truly understand who we are,

who we belong to, and what he expects of us, right?

I agree.

And we have to realize, though,

that there are political players who are using half-truths,

which is what Satan does.

Satan uses half-truths in order to get us into the trap

and then he uses the old bait and switch.

And so there is a concern that I have

when people are using the term Christian Zionism,

it's legitimate initially in my mind

because it refers to this unqualified support

that Christians have for the secular state of Israel.

And they want to push back on that.

And I give my full support to that,

because the true Israel is found in the Catholic Church.

That's the true Israel.

But what happens is, and this is where I'm concerned,

is that we have people who are funded, I believe,

by Russia or by certain Islamists,

who are turning a blind eye to the actions of certain Islamists

who want to annihilate anyone who wasn't Muslim.

And that means Israel.

That means the Jews, that means the Christians.

And right now, the Jews are the biggest target

because they own real estate in the Middle East.

So, yeah, I agree with the theological problem of Christian Zionism

and our Protestant brothers and sisters are,

it seems to me, irrevocably tied to that problem.

But we have to be careful of the political intentions

of the people who are putting that out there.

It seems like, though, we, the Catholics

and maybe even the institutional side of our church,

is a wee bit squeamish, a little scared of saying

the truth out loud and sort of a bold and a courageous way

that we are the chosen people of God.

I think they fear that people won't understand what that means.

They'll take it the wrong way.

Their feelings will be hurt.

But it's still true.

And the best thing for humanity is truth, right?

Yes.

And all of this is downstream from the shepherds.

We had from the Vatican during the Francis Pontificate,

the statement that the Jews do not need conversion.

That we are not to what any missionary effort

toward the conversion of Jews.

And so downstream from that is just the thing

that you spoke about, Joe, is this reticence

or hesitancy or squeamishness about speaking

about the true Israel.

And that really is symptomatic of a deeper apostasy.

We don't believe as our forefathers believed

that Jesus Christ is the savior of the world for all people.

And all people need to come to baptism in him through the spirit

to the Father, Muslims and Jews and atheists.

And we who are already baptized, we need to live our baptism.

But it's unfortunate that we're just not hearing that.

So it just kind of boils down and it gets past,

the buck gets past, past, past until it gets down to the layman.

And it's people who are taking, lay people like yourself

who are taking up that apostolate and proclaiming the truths,

which in the days of Robert Bellerman

or in the days of Cardinal Newman,

it was the hierarchy doing it.

So the spirit is continuing in podcasts like yours.

So let's talk about the deception that you talk about,

the coming deception.

What is this deception?

Yeah, it's the, what St. Paul spoke about.

It's this false spirit which maintains the appearance

of religiosity, the externals of religiosity,

but it's devoid of the spirit of Christ.

It is a denial of the cross.

It's a denial of the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,

the Eucharist, the denial of sin, the reality of sin.

And the symptoms of it are a hesitancy to call people to conversion,

a hesitancy to speak in tender language of our lady,

a hesitancy to magnify her role in salvation.

And these are the symptoms of it.

You can't look at any one of them and say,

ah, therefore you're an apostate.

But collectively, you look at them all.

It's kind of like those of us who grew up in the 80s and 90s

with Microsoft and they came embedded on their computers

with this game called Mindsweeper.

You know, and you didn't know where the minds were,

but you by process of elimination could say,

well, it can't be here.

It has to be here.

It's a logic game.

And that's the same that we're facing with the church

is we can't point at someone and say,

you're an apostate or this cardinal or this priest

or this, this, this layman.

But we look collectively at all of the symptoms around them.

Um, this, this disregard for speaking about the things of heaven,

the reality of hell, the need for conversion, confession.

Uh, you know, turning away from the violations of the sixth commandment,

especially contraception, almost sexuality, all these things.

And collectively, altogether, we can say, I'm no fool.

I know what's undergirding it.

You don't believe that Jesus Christ is truly risen from the dead

and that he is the center of history.

Yeah.

Amen. Well said.

In the last segment, we were talking to Nicholas Kovasos

about, uh, Cardinal Zupi going to a Muslim prayer,

Ramadan service in Italy on the streets of Italy.

And then there's a, I've got another video of, uh, of a,

of a Muslim doing the call to prayer at a church in Germany,

a Catholic church in Germany.

Like this just feels like it just is, maybe there,

maybe they mean that, maybe they mean well,

maybe they're like, oh, we're just going to reach out and,

you know, create some common ground and pee all of branch.

And maybe they're, maybe their heart is in the right place,

but it feels, it feels like false ecumenical dialogue

that leads to confusion and chaos in Holy Mother Church.

It seems to be a portrayal of our savior and what he's called

called the institution to do.

How, how would you, would you, is that a fair characterization?

Or would you, would you call it something else?

No, I'd say it's a biblical characterization.

I'd say that looking at these events through biblical eyes,

through prophetic eyes, we see that, uh,

the mark of the Prince of Darkness is tolerance.

The mark of the Prince of Darkness is inclusion.

And the mark of the Kingdom of Heaven is, in fact,

exclusion in one sense.

It excludes error from, from the life of the church.

It excludes sin from the life of the church.

And, uh, there is something to be said about the life of the prophets

is that they were different from the kings of,

uh, the Northern Kingdom or the, and eventually the Southern Kingdom,

as well, because they refused to accommodate themselves to include,

uh, the foreign gods.

And it was always the mark of the apostate kings,

uh, and eventually the apostate priests in Judah, as well,

to include, to be inclusive of the false gods of the nations surrounding Israel and Judah.

Um, and it was the same with, you know, the Romans,

is that the Romans were a very inclusive people.

They included, you know, uh, the Persian gods.

There are genemy.

They included the Persian gods in the Roman pantheon.

Um, and, uh, it was the Christians who were exclusive and say,

no, we only worship one.

And that's the risen Lord Jesus Christ, uh,

Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Um, but we see a resurgence of this in the churches of Europe,

which include Islamic prayers, and in the actions of certain hierarchs,

who are demonstrating, uh, not the exclusivity of the message of Christ's salvation,

but it's really a spirit of inclusivity that we saw in the ancient pagans of Rome

and in the, uh, the spirit, uh, that, that led to the downfall of Israel and Judah.

We're going to be at a break here in just about another minute.

But have we been soft-pedal that the meek and humble Jesus now for six decades

to the point where we just can't fathom a Jesus who would look the Pharisees and the scribes

and the Sadducees and the I and say, the Kingdom of God has come upon you.

I feel like we have no tolerance for that level of straightforward talk.

I think he'd be crucified on the obelisk and St. Peter's square today.

Ha ha.

Hold that five.

That's a great way to go to break right there.

All that thought, Father Jason Sharon is our guest.

We're talking about his video when the majority is wrong, Israel, the church,

and the coming deception. I'm going to link to it in the show notes for you.

Uh, but when we come back, there's something else he talked about in the video that really caught my attention.

He talks about the stiff-necked people in the Old Testament who never quite seemed to learn their lessons.

No matter how many miracles, no matter how many miracles God performed from them.

The pillar of fire by night, men have come down from heaven, quail, water from a rock that moved with the people.

The rock physically moved. Think about that.

No matter how many miracles still, they rejected God.

Still, so goes the people of God even today, even in the church today.

More than that in two minutes to go anywhere.

Praise be to Jesus Christ. Welcome back to a Catholic take a bold synthesis of information and inspiration.

I'm your host, Joe McLean. Praise be to God. It's good to be on with you.

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We've been having a conversation with father Jason Sharon.

He's got a great YouTube video.

When the majority is wrong, Israel, the church and the coming deception.

But father Jason is with us for a few more minutes.

Father, welcome back to the program in the in your video.

You talked about the people, the chosen people in the Old Testament.

Now, either way I look at I know you do too.

There's only ever one people of God.

That's the same in the Genesis to all the way to the end of the book of the apocalypse.

There's just one people have got his church, his people, his ecclesia.

And the Old Testament, they tended to be very stiff necked and rebellious.

Exodus 32, the golden calf, the pagan prostitutes on the plains of Moab.

There's lots of examples.

And I think it's strange when Catholic somehow think that in this era of the gospel and the apostles and their successors,

somehow we haven't followed in the same trend.

I think we can be as stiff necked as anybody in the Old Testament.

And I think we kid ourselves.

What would you say to that?

I think you're right.

And I think we're even in a more dangerous position when this is accompanied by miracles.

Because it's one thing to refuse God and his promptings by grace, by prophets, who speak in his name.

That's one thing.

But when his warnings are accompanied by divine manifestation in the form of a legitimate apparitions in our day,

and then we still say no, then what happens is a crystallization of our rebellion.

And that's where it's very dangerous.

That's where God says, then the only remedy is for you to suffer the consequence of your sin.

And to see how far and alienated you are from my covenantal love.

So I think you're absolutely right.

We're no different from our older brothers in the book of Genesis, the book of Exodus, rather.

We're no different from them.

Our technology has changed a little bit.

But certainly the wiring of our heart has not.

No matter how many miracles God performs, we tend to be very rebellious and praise be to God for the grace that we get in the sacraments to be sure.

But one of the other aspects to this story, and I touched on when I read the gospel earlier in the show,

is that I think we can also kid ourselves if we're thinking somehow that we're as his disciples that we aren't going to suffer and die.

I think Christ, our Savior, is asking us to be crucified next to him on Calvary.

But I don't think many of us are truly up for that.

We want it kind of easy.

We just want to have a nice, easy Christian life, but we don't want to suffer.

Yeah, that's one of the great downfalls of America is that we've had it good here.

We've had, we've lived in the land of milk and honey, and we've become soft.

We haven't produced a whole lot of saints because of that, though.

Whereas if you look at the gulag that Joseph Stalin gave the world,

that gulag produced myriad numbers of saints.

And it's because of the suffering that we encounter the cross and we encounter our own limitations,

by which we meet our own shelf life, so to speak.

And it's at that point that we're forced to turn to the hand of God in complete humility and ask for the assistance of the angels

and Mary and the saints, and that's where saints are made.

You know, when we can acknowledge our poverty, but that comes with suffering and with the cross.

Minasing the suffering and the cross from this life, we can ever imitate the Lord.

We look at all the prophets, name one prophet in the Old Testament, who avoided suffering.

You're not going to find one.

And name one apostle who avoided suffering.

You're not going to find one.

John, even John the divine, you know, who avoided martyrdom, he encountered a true suffering because he was the only one at the cross.

He didn't need martyrdom because he already encountered it there with our Lord and our lady.

So they did try to boil them in oil, but it didn't take.

He got to live out retirement at Patmos, which you and I hung out together for a brief moment.

Yeah, which was amazing.

Praise me to God.

Well, I didn't recognize you because you had your, your Aussie hat on.

Yeah, I did.

I got, I got the whole Indiana Jones Lakona.

So the other aspect that is it was his own people that nailed him to that cross.

And I think that's another aspect to this age of deception, this age of misinformation, this age of apostasy,

is I think that we must brace ourselves to not only be prepared for suffering, but suffering at the hands of our own.

Yes, the template is given to us by Jesus.

And we cannot think that we're better than our teacher.

And the template is this, he chose 12, one stayed with him at the cross.

So his batting average isn't very good.

One out of 12 was faithful when he was alive walking physically in the face of the earth.

So we ought not to be surprised when we see widespread deception and betrayal from within our own ranks.

It was the pattern of Joseph with his brothers and it was the pattern of Jesus with his brethren.

And in fact, when we look at the great saints in the east and in the west, we see that same pattern played out is that it's the small humble faithful ones who are abandoned by Jesus.

Rather brethren, yet they stay true to God.

You look at Athanasius of Alexandria, you know, most of his brethren turned against him in order to curry favor with the Aryan emperor and the Aryan bishops.

17 out of his 40 plus years as bishop, he was home the other years, he was running, hiding, praying in deserts and hollows of the earth.

He lived a very difficult life and the pain of the stigmata was one thing, but the pain of the way his own brethren treated him was another St. John of the cross in the west as another example.

I can go on, but you get the point is that betrayal from within is not extraneous to God's plan for our sanctification.

It's part of the secret sauce.

But giving us, I think the inspiration, motivation to be all the more zealous, all the more faithful, I think many of us have been blackpilled or hearts broken by the scandals within the church within the hierarchy.

And we see injustices that have yet to be to be satisfied and many people have walked away from the church.

Joe, if I could interject here and say this is part of God's plan, ultimately, why is all this happening?

What do we do? Where is it the Freemasons? Is it the Satanists? Is it the Communists? No, it's the will of Christ.

It's the will of Christ because he wishes to strip away all the false gods that we place our hope in, including a seemingly strong institutional church.

He doesn't want that kind of faith. He wants the faith like the Ukrainian Catholics during the Soviet Union who didn't have the support of the Vatican, didn't have the support of a chanceary, didn't have the support of brick and mortar churches.

All they had was Jesus in the field at night, in the woods with divine liturgy, knowing that eventually the KGB was going to catch them, separate them from their families, send them to Siberia to die.

And it's that kind of faith that sets the world on fire. And if he has to take away our chances and our seminaries and our monasteries, then he's going to do it.

Amen. Well said, Father, we're out of time. Can you give us your blessing, please?

May the Bussing of the Lord be upon you through his grace and his love for mankind. Father, Son, Holy Spirit, Amen.

Amen. Praise be to God. Father, Jason Sheroen, God bless you. Thank you for being on with us this afternoon. Great video.

I really appreciate the conversation to discuss that. We're going to link to it in the show notes. When the majority is wrong, Israel, the church and the coming deception.

Check out his YouTube channel, Father Jason Sheroen. Subscribe to it, like it and share it. We'll see you on the after show to take your Catholic take of the live video stream next.