The Three Pillars of Athletic Lifestyle Medicine w/ Jerzy Gregorek | Holistic Pharmacy Podcast

You are listening to the Global Network of Podcasters dedicated to the Pharmacy profession.

Welcome to the Pharmacy Podcast Network.

Hello and welcome to the Holistic Pharmacy Podcast. I'm your host Marina Books of and I'm a

functional medicine pharmacist in New York. I'm also a clinical herbalist and an integrative health

coach specializing in mindfulness and empowerment. I'm on a mission to transform the way we approach

health care by bridging the wisdom of traditional medicine with modern practice and in this podcast

I will be highlighting guests who do just that. I'm constantly inspired by them and I know you will

be as well. Hello, hello, welcome back to the Holistic Pharmacy Podcast. I have another amazing

guest for you today. His name is Jersey Greggarek and he's a four-time world weight lifting champion

Hoyt and co-creator of the Happy Body Program. Together with his wife, the world champion, he created

the Happy Body, a lifestyle medicine program that combines mindful exercise, nutrition, and emotional

eating intelligence. Over the last three decades, Jersey has coached everyone from Silicon Valley,

leaders to individuals overcoming pain, aging, and chronic challenges. So that's further ado,

Jersey. Welcome. Hey Marina, great to be here. Thank you for inviting me.

Yeah, so Jersey, I'd look for you to fill in your whole life story very, very quickly. Where you

grew up, how you feel to be this coach and now specializing in inflammation? Challenge, right?

So I was born in Poland and when I was 19, I went into the fire department. I became the fireman.

Really liked to be a fireman. The first time when I went to a fire, I had this feeling that

somebody needs me and I've never had it. So that feeling really I chased my whole life. It feels

good when people need us and it feels good to help people. So both really inspired me and I was

glad that, you know, I was a fireman. But after five years, I went to the fire protection engineering

academy in Warsaw, spent it four years. So I loved the fire department and been a fireman.

And slowly at the time, it was 1981. So it was very strong and the government was fighting

yet. And they tried to use the fire department against the demonstrations. We said, no, I was

the leader of this strike. And it ended up after 10 days. They landed helicopters and tanks and

forces out. And I was underground for three years. And my mentor was captured, tortured,

murdered. Now he is the martyr in Poland. His name is Gerzy Popiuszko. And I escaped from Poland in

85. And just we didn't end to Germany. And then came to US. In US, it was tough. It was very

challenging at the beginning. We slapped on the floor of our friends. It was like a homeless

experience. But because of our weightlifting background, we became coaches in James in Bullbank.

And slowly found our life into fitness and and and health and fitness. And

and eventually led to work with people, regular people, not weightlifters, but regular people.

And the experience and the gifts were that we learned that people have a lot of different

desires when it comes to fitness. Some of them, they want to lose weight. Some of them,

they want to be happy. Others, they have more energy. And others, they want to get rid of

pains and be beautiful ones. So all of these reasons were there. But we follow certain ways

like weightlifting is to become flexible, to become strong, to be fast, to have good posture.

And that helped everyone. So that helped us to really see that there are certain standards to

follow. And if you follow those certain standards, you should be okay with a good life. And then

you should improve. You should be a quality person. So that led to the creation of the

happy body program. We call it athletic lifestyle medicine. And I can explain later what that's

what it means, really. But the book was published. It took us about five to ten years to really

write the book. It was a journey quite journey. And then after the book was published, we learned

that to have a plan is not enough. There are really other factors in measure that helps. So

what wasn't, it means that people need to be educated, inspired, motivated, habits need to be

formed. Even something is good in life doesn't mean that people will do it. So that led us to

pursue a PhD in research and psychology to understand human behavior and learning how to talk to people.

Inspire them, but also to create in the mind acceptance of doing what is good even they don't like it.

Yeah, Jersey, I completely, completely resonate with everything you're saying. First of all,

I am a fellow immigrant. So I understand what it's like to be in another country. And it was

easier for me because I came with my parents and I already have some family here. So that was

a lot of support that we received already from having people that we know. But of course,

being an adult and fleeing a country and immigrating somewhere and then building your

computer from scratch must have been very difficult. And yet you obviously have achieved massive

success. So I'm curious. What was the biggest challenge that you felt you had to overcome and then

what is the key to the success and the program that you've developed that helps that will see you.

The language was the biggest challenge. It was not as much for me, but for Aniella was a big

challenge. So we were weightlifters. So we knew a lot how to handle the body from the perspective

of lifting weights and being healthy and strong and quick. But the language was a challenge.

So Aniella was progressing very slowly. And at certain point, if we go like that,

then it will take forever to learn the language. So at certain point, I told Aniella,

tomorrow, I will almost speak in English to you. No more the Polish language. And she laughed at me.

And she thought that that was not serious. But next day, English on them. So then she got upset

next day. And then she knew she figured out that I'm not going to talk in Polish. And after three,

four days, she started walking with a dictionary. It was really tough. It was tough. But after a

bad week, she signed herself in a high school for about three hours or four hours in the evening

and granted college for all English classes. So she was in English for 12 hours and 13 hours a day.

And after two months, she was like, she spoke English very well. And then she applied to be a coach

had women's only in studicity. And then she got the position there. And you know, it was really good

for her. She actually fought for herself in English and succeeded. So she was a coach in board

bank in power source and for women's only. And that's slowly our life progressed. We made

little money, but it was enough for us because we are immigrants. So we didn't spend much money.

Our clients lived in board bank in this little small house. And there was another house. It was

like 400 square feet truck. But it was 300 dollars. And she said, I'm going to go somewhere else

because I can't afford. And I will let you to be there to live there. And so we did. And it was

our independence first independence in US. The most interesting was that we had a lot of clients

coming from Beverly Hills, billionaires at that time. And they were coming for dinners to our

little shack. And that was really interesting that we had different youth and stills and

for eating different plates. So you see, again, you know, like it's not really important.

The money is not really important. It's like so exciting. All right, about that equanimity or

happiness really doesn't depend on how much we have. It really depends on how we are,

how we are together, how we are enjoying conversation, how we are interested in each other,

are we liking each other. And that's where it is. If that is not working, then nothing can fix it

really. Yeah, absolutely. And where did the idea for the happy body come in? And how can we

make our bodies happier? So after many years, really, we figured out that there are certain

standards to follow to actually achieve this wonderful, fantastic body. And we thought, okay,

there is a certain body weight, there is certain leanness, there is certain flexibilities,

certain strengths, certain speed, certain posture. And we tried to really figure out

what is that, you know, enough of that. And where is it? And after years of looking,

we found the numbers. We found the numbers for every standard. And

those numbers became the pillars of the happy body. We started really, once the standards were

established, that we created a plan, a plan on how to achieve it, that we had to create the exercise

plan, the food plan, and the meditation. Because there are three things that really are

important in life to focus and exacerbate is one of them, the food that we eat. And the

last one is calming yourself down. And meditation is really good here. And how to really

exercise or how to eat is important, because that is the link to work our information, right?

See, we can exercise too much and become too inflamed. And the body doesn't have time

to recover itself. We can make a lot of mistakes.

Yeah, absolutely. I have seen personally in my practice and in my own life that there has to be

balanced, there has to be moderation. Too much of a good thing can also become problematic,

right? So we need to understand what our body thrives in and what can we do to help ourselves

with the benefits, but not as much of the risks. And as a clinician, that's only what we think about.

So I want to know from your experience, why do you think so many people struggle with

inflammation and also what you mentioned earlier, which is the resistance to change their habits?

What you said, thriving is a good thing. Well, information is interesting,

information and research really points to that the more we exercise, the more information.

Okay, that is true. And to exercise less is actually the road towards not to

inflame the body and then the recover. But society somehow focuses on a lot of information,

like the running for one hour or two creates information for one hour for two hours for seven

hours after. So there is, I don't know if you know the book, Born to Run, the book was written on

basis of a person that was running with Mexican Indian tribes. And here are a lot. He was 58.

And then when he died, he passed in Mexico, he collapsed from exhaustion. So what really

happens when we exercise too much? There is the chemical in the heart that when we get inflamed,

stays there. And that chemical is powerful. It can make little small scars in the heart.

And when we keep inflamed about a system for a long time, that can cause arrhythmia.

And after arrhythmia, we have a problem with, of course, dying.

And so that would happen to that runner and a lot of research came from Canada actually

investigating exploring long distance runners. And they found also that inflammation

arrhythmia and sometimes, you know, death. So we know that the more we exercise, the more

inflammation we cause. So it is important to exercise little and have the most benefit

problem. And be happy. Enjoy it. Right. So when you think about sprinters,

sprinters run 10 seconds and then rest three minutes and run 10 seconds. Usually they don't

even run 10 seconds because they, when they really practice, they run three or four seconds

coming out of blogs and we can imagine the sprinter training coming out of blogs. And

it's about three or four seconds and the rest three minutes. So in one hour, three or four seconds

every minute, it comes to about really one minute of training, 59 minutes of resting or sitting on

an adventure. Death kind of training creates the fastest, the most powerful athlete on our planet.

Usually involved, wow, you know, I watch his training coming out of blogs and

and then you know, between his three minutes, so they talk, they on the phone, right?

Because it's just like they're not never exhausted, right? So this exhaustion somehow

became the way of life. We think that if we are exhausted, we train hard and we are good.

Well, the opposite is true. The exhaustion actually creates a lot of chemicals in our body,

the system that leads to, you know, being tired, being overtrained and, you know, disappointments

and depression, anxiety, all of it happens because we have expectations and expectations are not

meant. We think we want to get better. We want to, let's say, lose weight, get stronger or recover

a muscle, but then we do certain things and the opposite happens. So what's going on, right?

So then do we listen to the wisdom of our science, what the science is saying and we don't.

So why did it happen that science is saying in order to gain muscle, you need to do

stunt training. And what happens also is that sarcopina happens to all people who age after 35,

we start losing muscle. Then also when we exercise too much, we actually lose muscle, not gain muscle.

We lose. So there are, you know, marathon runners, there are 120 pounds, but when we look at sprinters,

they have 200 pounds. And they don't exercise at all almost, right? You can imagine

pole water training, yeah, run very fast, about four seconds, jump, tremendous rest, maybe

another run. And that is the training, the training based on extreme quality.

Do you think about like Olympic stadium, what do you see? Do you see people, all the people

there, run very fast, throw things, jump, and that's all they do. Everything lasts more,

not more than five seconds. So how to really exercise? So we thought about that and we created

30 minutes training exercises that would cover the whole body system would make the body happy.

So the body wakes up in the morning and you started moving and through the older movements,

the flexibility happens. The body likes it. The body is like water, what, you know,

Bruce Lee was saying, water body, you know, think about that like water.

So that's the purpose of the happy body to create this flow, this water body, this movement of

the body, no obstacles. And that creates the impossibility for the pain to be created because

bones are away from each other. There is no inflammation. So it's another factor that

flexibility causes the bones to come together. And once they are getting together, the inflammation

sets up, our fright is set up. And then we have pains and remove our joints and you know, so it's

a, it's a lot of knowledge there already, but there is also obsession about being tired,

being exhausted. It's hard to train, let's say, to jump on a box two times and the rest for two

minutes. It's a, it's something that needs to be cultivated by people that will know how to talk

to people that skills are a good thing. And to develop skills and quality is actually a better

thing that exhaustion and, you know, mindless learning.

Yeah, you're definitely tapping into our societal obsession with productivity and always being

on and more is better. And so from your philosophy, what's the perfect amount of exercise,

what time of day should we be exercising and any other factors that may be the culture around us

gets it wrong? I think that they know, we, I think the 30 minutes is enough today. And that should

be enough to create about it that is flexible, that is strong, that is fast, and that has good posture.

And then once it's done, then sustain it throughout your life. I mean, there's something,

so we thought about the happy bodies like yoga, but with weights and because the weights are

important, the strength is important. And their exercises should deliver all those things that

we talk about in this 30 minutes. So that's what we created. We created the program that

the standards and then the plan as the program that could actually deliver. And people do 18

exercises a day and no more than 30 minutes. And then that helps to develop all those standards

and pursue them. And to create this thriving body, the robust body, ready for almost anything,

flexible, strong, quick. And it was eight, right? It can go forever almost like it's amazing.

You know, I'm 71 years old, but you know, I don't see the difference between

when I was in 20 and my living is today, if I want to ski, I ski, if I want to serve, I serve.

And the same way as I used to. So what's going on here, right? So there is a huge

gap and possibility between those champions and those who don't do anything, or they do

something not right. They do something that actually helps them to age faster. I don't want to

age faster. And ageing faster for me, it means to exercise too much.

Wow, that's amazing. What you just shared about your own abilities and lifestyle. So

congratulations on that. Now, I want to talk about the food piece because I've been studying

health and nutrition for a while. And outside of like the theory of what should be healthy for us,

I'm curious that you can speak on the quality of

and all the toxins that we're exposed to that also contribute to inflammation and how we can

address that. I mean, that buying first of all, the food is important to be aware, mindful,

that buying foods matter. So a word to buy matters. So if you go to Whole Foods,

we have certain food. If you go to grocery, we have certain food. If you want, really get

better quality food, then you buy from farmers. If you have farmers around, develop

relationship with farmers. So we have these farmers that deliver boxes like CFA

company farming company that does it. So we buy two boxes every week. We go to

Palo Alto and pick up our boxes every week. We know the company, we know it's organic,

we know that people volunteer there, they go there, check them, see them, how they actually

do things. So it's an important factor. The other thing is that we do not eat any products.

So we do not buy a product. So we don't, the only product that we buy is oil,

virgin oil, avocado oil, or vodka, right? Wine would be the product. But that's it. We buy

veggies. We buy fruits. We buy nuts, seeds, beans, rice. Everything is not a product,

is a product. And we love both the cook. So we both, you know, my mother taught me how to cook.

I was about, you know, 27 years old, 28. And I went to my mom and said, mom,

teach me how to cook. And she said, okay, come for dinner and we'll cook. And so,

right? And then I came and brought my notebook and said, no, no, no, no, no, you have to really

get it. We will cook and keep cooking. And then eventually you will integrate into you.

And it did after about two months. I was a cook. I go to cook and

and on those days I cook. I make soups. I make different, you know, cabbage,

mixture, stews and juices and smoothies and really awesome food. We asked them for it. There is

a really, and it's so inexpensive that it's crazy and so healthy. It's nuts. I mean, really,

the most, you know, inexpensive food is healthy food. I don't know where the people got the idea

that healthy food is expensive. Well, I don't know where is it coming from, but when we go to

Whole Foods and we spend $100, we have like three or four bucks and we have at like 50 pounds of

food. Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. You're making me want to put my kids to work in the kitchen as well.

And let's acknowledge, yes, the food prices are rising. However, I agree with you that we can still

find helpful organic or local foods that is going to be less expensive than all the packaged

processed garbage. That's just a waste of money and calories.

So I'm curious if you have any tips on how to decrease plastic around our food.

Plastic. Yeah, plastic is a problem. So I didn't like plastic, even when I was in

pond 50 years ago. It just didn't like plastic. So I've never liked plastic and I didn't use

plastic. So we use everything glass. And when we buy containers, they're always glass. You pay,

you know, we pay a little bit more like you pay for organic food a little bit more. You buy

garbage, say red cabbage or regular green cabbage. When it's organic, I can eat it like an apple.

But when it's not, I cannot eat it. It's tasteless and it's not good. But when it's organic,

it's sweet like an apple. I can eat the cabbage and then, you know, I love it actually.

And you know, one day we went to Napa and we were at this pool and we ate the food that

was there. And I get a nap after two days. I went to a grocery and brought two cabbages and I

was eating the cabbage on my way. And when it came to the pool, there was this Polish couple that

didn't know we were Polish. And the woman said, look at this stupid man eating cabbage.

That was so interesting. But Anula, look at her and then after a while, she went to her and said,

he was studying Polish. Maybe you would like some, you know, cabbage.

Well, it's, I think that there is a way to our really healthy food and

inexpensive weed, a lot of beans and rice and grains. And you can look into the

advantage place in Lomalinta. Lomalinta is near Los Angeles. And this is the one of the blues

ones. And mostly the food that they eat is beans and rice. And when you go into stores,

there, there is like bags, 50 pounds bags of beans, you buy 50 pounds of of beans. And then

you have it for a year of beans. So, you know, you add a little bit veggies to it. And the other

thing is we don't really need much potatoes are really awesome. You know, I would like sweet potato

and regular potatoes. And when you, when you take a potato and you pay 50 cents for it, maybe

when you actually make the chips out of it, it will be five dollars. So, and unhealthy five dollars.

So, it was just a doctor who conno, you know, forgot the name. But in, after the war, he went to Hawaii

to be a doctor. And then he was only one doctor. And he said, all the people that

ate poor diet, they were all healthy. And the Richmond diet was not healthy. And they were not

healthy. And after 25 years or 30 years, those poor people could afford the Richmond's diet.

So, they did it. And everybody became unhealthy. He spent 40 years there. And he said, it's

amazing how it happens. So, what are the engines that we don't like the poor, even the poor is the

most healthy, the best. So, what's going on in our mind? We reject the goodness, the goodness

that is inexpensive. And that, that is a mystery. That's what the mystery, that's, I guess I

started psychology because that's it fastening that, you know, we would, we would spend a lot of

money on something that is very expensive. And in time, there is something better even and very

inexpensive. And we will not do that. Yeah, the economy doesn't follow logic sometimes. And

what you shared made me think of one of the biggest hot topics right now, which I think is

protein consumption. And also, there's arguments for animal versus vegan proteins. So, can you

speak to what's the perfect amount and the perfect source? Well, first of all, how much is the

amount of proteins needed to survive life, 10% and that's FDA says. Then if you have 20% protein

intake, wow, this is a lot of protein. Okay. So, where is it? Well, in beans, there's about 50%

in rice, it's about 10% in potatoes, 10% in garbage, 30% in broccoli, 50% in spinach, 50%

spinach has more protein than salmon and more protein than steaks. So, um, well, protein is almost

everywhere. The only ingredient that we will always have more than we need is protein.

The only ingredient, no matter what we do, no matter what we eat, we always have too much. Crazy.

Crazy, right? Because the protein is everywhere. It's not only in fruits,

fruits are like traces of protein, mostly sugar, and monosugar, but anywhere else,

protein is everywhere. Even, you know, in cabbage, about 50% protein, it's cabbage and wow.

So, the other thing is, where is it coming from? Well, there was this China study that

researched that investigated the protein and the protein, whether the protein was coming from

animal products or plant and was the difference, there's also organic or another guy. So,

uh, they found out that there is a link, uh, when is animal protein to our problems, health

problems. And then, uh, less, uh, when, uh, it's planned, but they found out that 5%

protein, when the intake is 5% of protein, then cancers stop in the body.

And then when the study was done on mice and rats, and whenever they, uh,

went higher, we fed the animals with protein higher than 5% the cancer came back. So, on and off,

they said, on and off, they could do it like that. But 5% protein is almost impossible

to really, uh, have this kind of intake. Uh, Gerson Terrapi, who was created in 1930, and,

and he created his son Terrapiante against Terrapi that is based on juices. And based on

kerosene, green apple, and then other greens are added. And he, he did it, uh, intuitively,

but it looks like it's about 5% or 5%. So, um, then there is other story with the,

the organic or not organic, and they tested that too, and they found out that there is not much

really the difference between that, you know, organic, also, not organic, also, uh,

supported the, uh, the health, uh, as well. Now, vegan? Oh, I'm vegan. I'm vegan for, uh, 15 years.

So, um, I like to be vegan. So my wife is vegan. My daughter became, but she was not vegan.

And, uh, we had a family that she was not, her boyfriend was not. So when we cooked dinners,

we included steaks. I could make steaks for them. And, and then created some ways that

family could ever enjoyed dinner. And there was no stigma, you know, whether some are or some

are not. And, uh, not only after, when she was, uh, 19, she became vegan. And she expressed to us

that she was very thankful that we would, that we didn't force her to become vegan in any moment

of life that she arrived to that on her own. So is, is vegan, um, good or history, um, I think that after 50,

uh, maybe, uh, should, people should maybe become vegan. That could help with, uh, also the, the

weight and, and opening the, uh, arteries and become healthier. I think that is one way.

But we can be vegan and also be, so it's another element here, the body weight. And the, the

body weight is really linking to, uh, to, um, longevity is linked there. And the research that, uh,

is done on that points that the skin here we are, the longer we'll live. So the skinny body,

it looks like the older, the arteries, everything is open, cholesterol is low and so on. And then

when people eat veggies, uh, it could be that it's easier for them to be filled

and to control, uh, the calories. The colors are controlled by, by itself. And

and everything becomes caliphia. I, yeah, I, I love my life as a vegan.

Yeah, absolutely. I always quote Michael Pollan, eat real food mostly plants and not too much.

You think you can't go wrong with that advice. And we haven't talked about the microbiome yet,

but there is also a whole transformation that happens with our food through the microbes that

they just is. And that's why a lot of the plants and the herbs really help our body become healthier

too. And with a healthy weight and healthy bowel movements and intestines and all disease really

starts in the gut, right? So I would love to continue talking to you. I feel like there's

so much more to cover, but I've been trying to wrap it up. I'd love to touch on the mindfulness

that you mentioned and the psychology behind how to actually actually the habit change. So people

have resistance, right? To get good sleep to getting meditation or mindsets to resting when they

just want to keep going and exercising. So how do we help people help themselves?

We, um, we build the program, our program is that we do it every day. So our thoughts are that

if you want to change anything, if you want to develop different habits, and they have to be

integrated into the daily routine. So it has to be daily, first of all, one, the first thing.

And the second, it has to be enjoyable, pleasurable. It has to, you know, be fun that you do

certain things and you have to really feel that it's good. So this one is an important element

to you. You are really behind learning skills like you learn dancing. Let's say you want to

learn a rumba and you go and find teachers and then there are steps and there is a awareness.

There is a mindfulness already there and it's really hard to remember. And to pass this time,

actually, that it feels good. And then you enjoy it. There is this time that we somehow need a

lot of help from others. So we, uh, on your line, I, we started this dance this about five years ago.

And we found out that we've never danced that actually dancing is skilled. It's knowing every

movement, every hand, every signal, every step, every turn is actually, you know, I have to know

about that. And I've never thought about dancing that way. So I was just moving, but I was not dancing.

And finally, we started dancing. And what a joy is that, you know, like, when you start

flowing, when everything moves and, and you know, and the music happens, wow, this is just like

pleasure zone. So the heavy body we created is kind of like finding the dance, the dance, the

mindfulness. And how, how did we do it? But also it had to be strength training. Everything

has to be the parts of it. And then the posture and so on. So we integrated into the happy body

pranayama breathing. It means that you have four seconds for the inhale, about eight seconds for

release, for holding the breath and four seconds for exhale. So when we exercise, we do exactly

the same way. For repetition happens, we inhale. We tie certain parts of the body, we lift,

we stretch for the flexibility, we return. And then exhale. So we inhale, hold, exhale.

And that breathing patterns comes the body. And parasympathetic system is engaged. We're doing

six things during the happy body. Inhale, flex, lift, stretch, return, exhale. A six

factors, six words that happened during the one lift. Those six words is a mantra. It's the

happy body mantra. So when people do the exercises, they will do inhale. So mindfulness is coming

out. So the focus becomes like in T.M. Transcendental Meditation, there is a mantra.

A focus is on the mantra. Calmness is happening. And the distance is developed. So in the

happy body, we have this six things repeating the mantra repeats itself. And after 30 minutes,

people report one thing. They are spaced out. They don't know what happened. But

what happened is that the mind shifted to the mindfulness and to the calmness. And then they

rest it from thinking about the world, the way we think about it. It could be good thinking,

but it's really thinking. So it goes into the place of mindfulness where we are focusing on

the mantra. And because of that, we get the stress release. We get the peace of the mind. We get

relaxed. And we start really enjoying the time, the moment, not differently than we watch sunset.

I love the analogy of dance. I would choose dance any day myself over like running or something

like that. And sometimes it really is two steps forward and one step. So we just have slow with it.

So thank you so much for coming on and sharing your wisdom. I would love to invite you to

a rapid fire round if you're up for it. Yeah, of course. Yeah. All right, question one.

What's the number one thing somebody can do right now to improve their quality of life?

Happiness. So it's definitely something that leads to happiness. And that's where now,

according to Stoics is the virtue, mindfulness, psychology, but happiness is awesome. Yeah,

definitely session for it or become we have to become happiness because the happiness is a

side effect of our way of life. It is not something that you can grasp, we can capture. Yeah, it is

it's a side effect of a way of life.

So all right, what's your best tip for somebody to find their happiness?

I think that the goodness is the first thing, you know, we have to become authentic and good in nature.

So stop complaining and blaming, become creative, look forward and creativity is the shift that

kind of help us to rest from negativity can shift toward the creative. And once we are creative,

creative about making so creative about cleaning, creative about writing something, creative about

whatever it is, that creativity is awesome. Victor Franco was creative. He he wrote his

manuscript and he looked into the future, the goodness of the future. He looked into Vienna and he

imagined that he will be reading from his manuscript. He spent six years in the concentration

come, survived that because of looking forward into something good, something good. And it helps.

And it could be that people were needed, but the focus needs to be on the goodness and forward,

forward. And that the happiness I guess follows that.

Wow, I love that advice. And I have to ask this, we've been talking about cabbage a few different

times. So what's your favorite cabbage recipe? Number one, and then number two, if somebody

isn't very excited or interested in cabbage, how can we try it?

Okay, I have for you, ask them this, we love this, this, this, this, this, like,

holy moly, when we eat this, what's going on? The best dish on the planet, you know, it's just like

and I'd be that one, you know, this is like, okay, here it is, how I do it? I take red cabbage

and I know half of it and cut into six pieces, I put into the breville food processor.

And then I take red onion, cut into half. So red onion, half of the red onion and the

wholeness of the cabbage twice as much. It's the red onion can be strong. So I put this in and

pulse it until the texture is good. I like the texture, let's say, but it's all cut and musht,

right? Not musht, but there's the pieces after that. I'm adding the pear, the pear that is

right, the pear, right? And then avocado. I add about two other colors that they are

array, right? That they are really good. I place them in and then mix, mix to the texture that I

would like. So when I pulled out everything, makes everything so it's even mixed. I put into the

plates and cover everything with blueberries. Holy moly, this is just like, wow, you know,

wife food is so good. It's just like, wow, this is really good. We love this recipe.

You can eat everything, but it's like so delicious and so healthy. That is crazy. And you know, I

when I never like the kitchen, you know, I for me kitchen is doesn't have to be there at all.

But I like a raw food and mixing food and finding the way that this raw food is delicious. And

this is delicious dish. So how do we train our taste buds? Like if somebody does not find that

appetizing, I do. I'm excited. I'm interested. But if somebody's like, I'm not sure, how do we

develop these buds that we like it? Personally, I've never met a person that doesn't like it.

Yeah, everybody that I give this dish is like, wow, this is delicious. Everyone I've never really

met anyone that doesn't like that dish. But in case somebody doesn't like it,

then you would need to find their way of pace. What could be added to it? Or what could be taken out?

You can become a little bit mixer and open to investigating, exploring the dish.

So yes, there is adaptation that you could adapt. You could change

amount of onion, let's say, or cabbage. Add a different fruit that the person likes. Yeah,

change it. But there is always a way, right? Always when there is a will. Well, Jersey, thank you so

much. This was so fun. Please tell everybody how they can get in touch, learn more of your recipes,

your exercises, and do all the things. Thank you. Well, I know I was writing the, her book is

almost bright. I finished about our food the way we eat. So we'll be there.

All right, beautiful. Well, I'll have all of your amazing links in the show notes. You're offering

time with yourself, right, for a day or four a month. People can check it out.

And then also I'll share the link to the book. And hopefully we'll be in touch. Jersey,

thank you so much. Thank you. Appreciate it. One question. Where did you immigrate from?

Ukraine. Oh, I see. All right. So yeah, I wrote a lot of poems about Ukraine. And because of what

was happening, I'm going to send them to you. All right, please do. Thank you so much. Enjoy the

rest. Thank you. Bye, Jersey. Thank you very much. Bye. Bye.

Thank you for tuning into another episode of the holistic pharmacy podcast. And I truly hope

you enjoyed the show. If you learned something useful in this episode, please consider giving the

show a five-star rating and a sincere review so that more people can find it or share it with a

friend directly. To get in touch with me, you can find me on social media by looking up my name,

Marina Books of, or email me at marinaatrawfork.com. Take good care and see you soon.