What is the true nature of our relationship with animals as South Africans?

0:00Let's walk the talk. There was an interesting article that came out not so long ago where the SPCA was warning that people who hurt or kill snakes can face prosecution under South African animal cruelty laws. Now, I am, it really got me wondering because I'm trying to understand what must you do if a snake rocks up in your home? And what is the relationship between ourselves and animals when we live in a country as diverse as ours? On the one hand, people will be asked to get permission to slaughter, right?

1:01In their yards. On the other hand, that is part of cultural practices, not just for blacks of Africans, also people who are Muslim. At the same time, we do a lot to protect endangered species. But in that same breath, you can go into a township and you will see a flurry of stray dogs. And then I was thinking about the stray dogs. And I'm like, I wonder when the stray dogs started being stray, particularly in townships. And how it is that decades later, there will still be a lot of stray dogs because somebody feeds them, I guess. Then I was thinking about my grandmother who would cook every single day for her dogs. They won't, it was not the type of relationship where dogs can be inside the house and chilling on the couch, right? Then I think about the conversations we've had on this platform around dogs and some people

2:03feel like dogs should be living in the house and others say dogs shouldn't be living in the house. Then I look at wild animals and the crazy stories. What was the name of that baboon that was being spotted everywhere? Guys, we had a lion, it wasn't, it was the lion in Jobic CBD. So I want to get a true understanding of what our relationship with animals truly is in South Africa, all animals of all kinds. Because if you're going to kill, if you're going to get in trouble for killing a snake, should you get in trouble for killing a rat? If you're going to need permission to slaughter in your yard and practice your cultural practices, what does that say for abattoirs and how they are being monitored and governed? In your view, when you look at SPCA and all of the different animal rights organizations, do you feel that there is a gap in this picture? Because animals are very much a part of our lives, but I'm curious as to what that relationship

3:08with animals really is like in South Africa. Odebel 1, 00302, the WhatsApp line 07272, 1702. 702, often news with Relebuchile Mabuta. We go to the lines we've got Jane from Ruidapurta, I Jane. No, it's not Jane, I actually Joan. Apologies Joan. No problem. So, I say, I say anything about dog rig or any tips. I don't eat meat or anything from the 4 more, about 22 years. I don't find my life's no meat, my fridge is like chicken, absolutely. Far from the rats of the animals who go to South Africa, with a sharp and a terrible thing. Yes. I mean, I'm all over the internet about this particular dog. Do you really appear to elections now and to example now, the GA is proposing in Cape Town, to reduce the number of dogs allowed to talk to you in residential areas. To reduce it to three.

4:08Now, if they should win in Jehovah's book, that's what happened years well. That is going to be a massive problem. We cannot share the world's wide. There are so many homeless dogs, cannot find homes, and then they go to South Africa, where last is hard in the cold. Not just a freezing cold winter, but with our terrible storms in the summer. It's cool. I'm a cold hoarder. I'm telling the hoarder, people don't know me, you're in a hurry, but I risk your dog. I've got dogs here. And it keeps on me. Well, that's a situation. Because my dog's to take me. And then, if you are telling me that I need three dogs of property, do you have a reasonable size property or a bit front yard and a backyard? You need three dogs in your front yard, three in your back. The hardest book is the most dangerous, ridiculous living in the world. Herb breaking is our number one crime. Yet the DA, if they come into power in Jehovah's book, will reduce it to three dogs.

5:15For me, it's traumatic. I have got little warning from all over. Can I ask a question, Joan? What was the reason that they gave? Because I missed that. What was the reason they gave us to why they want to limit the number of animals a person can have on their property? I don't know, but there's a happy, serious political parties who tried that a few years ago on one of the other radio stations. Some counsel in Victoria. The agency is also going to come around and check who's got more than three dogs and it's going to be trouble. And they were absolutely uproar. People were absolutely crazy. But anyone should talk with their dogs. Because our dogs are not only our children, our family. We spend a lot of time on them, and it's death. I went yesterday to the date with my one of my dogs, solely. And we got injections and tablets. It costed just under a thousand dollars. And I mean, you know, that comes in as a real pocket because we don't have medical ed.

6:16You know, if you've got a lot of dogs, you've got to mediate for all of them. And our children will spend our pension money on our dogs. And you think in our dogs, you are keeping a very dangerous nurse. And I think what you are raising, Joan, is valid with what you're saying about the concern. I'm going to have to find out about it because I'm still unclear as to what the motivation is. Because if you think about the fact that people have wine forms, so you would have three talk like I'm trying to understand why the limitation or what complaint might have happened for it to lead to that. Tandile from Ranberg. Hi, Tandile. Hi, Kumot. Thank you so much for answering the question. It's a really good. Oh, sorry, really good. No worries. No worries. They're blind to me. No, Kumot, Kumot was on during the news, but I'm back today. Yes, go ahead. Thank you, really good. Thank you, really. Yes, I wanted to speak about this. I think it's such an important subject.

7:17And I think it stems from cultural exposure. Also, there is a misconception that maybe African people don't have the same relationship with animals. And that's not the case. There are many black people that have very strong relationships with animals. And I think we will remember, I think a few years ago, 2020, there was research similar to this. I think it's a very important thing to have a lot of UCT, a drug controversy, because there seems to be this conception that, you know, in a cultural background, where maybe you aren't having the same relationship with pets that you don't have a care for animals. I think this is one that needs to be taken to, uh, maybe the policy documents and really go into the details of why they've decided to make this decision. And it's likely going to be linked to the biodiversity and the impact that having a snake's children and an ecosystem will have. Uh, culturally, I can speak from a perspective that while there is a fear of animals like our, um, and snakes, many cultures like my own, you know, um, I'm a mature.

8:17Now we celebrate the brown snake and then come to your home, you know, not to harm it. So there is a very close relationship that black people have culturally with animals. And we need to continue to have these conversations because many black people are working in the environmental space, and the change in energy. And, um, there's a misconception that black people maybe don't care about environmental stewardship, about conservation. And in the spaces I'm in, many people are continuously. Can I actually tell you, Tundile, what my firm belief is? I believe that Africans as a whole have always had a relationship with animals. We knew how to live amongst them. We knew how and when to eat them and we knew how. However, with westernization and us getting to where we are, at some point, I think animals got more rights than black people. So now where we are living, there's rights, what's in black and white, and there's real life.

9:22I think for many, many, and I'm going to speak about black people, brown people in this country will feel that animals will get prioritized over people of color in certain circumstances. I'll give a simple example, a man driving a bucket with his dog in the front while the black workers are at the back, for example. So that has brought us to a place where now it is like competing with animals to be protected. And that, that's what I think I think how we got here is it's not to say people don't care about animals. They're like, yo, I'm trying to survive. I don't even have the capacity to worry about protecting the snake because dang I'm trying to figure out what I'm going to eat. I might need to eat the snake. You know what I mean? So that's that's what I believe. I could be wrong, but thank you so much for giving us a corner. I see that we lost the person. I wanted to find out where they worked in the environmental space. Your voice notes are coming through on 072721702.

10:28Hello, really in team. Well, my experience with animals around in my surrounding especially in the township since from a young age to now. What I've observed is that we have Boma Lumi, the uncles, those dogs that you know walk you to the Texas, walk you to the shop, walk you to school, they don't bite. They are 10 funeral and weddings. You know, most households in the township have those dogs. I don't know the breed, but yeah, we call them Toyota tez. Those are low maintenance dogs. They don't get sick. They don't go to vet. That's just my experience. Same in Albatino. Oh my gosh. What is that breed, guys? That Cassie breed. What is and usually a proud with like the nozzle pot is stoats. You get black. I know exactly the dog that you are talking about. More of your voice notes. I'd be interested to know the thinking behind that getting into trouble for killing a snake in your home because what are we supposed to do?

11:35I think most of us do not know snakes enough to know which is venomous and which is not. So if you're afraid to be an animal in your home, are you not supposed to do whatever you think is right at the time to protect yourself? And we're concerned about that. This is CD. Thank you CD for asking that you know that also reminded me of the number of people that fly into South Africa and pay exorbitant amount of money to kill animals. Hunting is a thing in this country. Hunting is a real thing. What does that say? What does that say? Good afternoon, 7 or 2. You have a very interesting topic and I am a colored male and I side with your views where animals are put ahead of so-called black colored.

12:36Non white people. Treasure. Some of your WhatsApp messages that are coming through so called SPCA they are mad and require agency medical observation. Something's not right in their brains is what a person is saying in response to what the SPCA was warning. High level baboons run riot in the West and Cape but are protected and have more rights than the people do. Guys guys. I think we should all step up. We are lacking in caring for our K-9 units, pets and others and all the poor lost stray dogs. It is not right. I'm even going to add another one because there's so many animal things. I saw a lady posting her father. I do not recall. I don't recall the restaurant or anything but in essence the father is disabled. He's probably early 70s and is in a wheelchair. He has a service dog.

13:39So the daughter was posting a video to say that the father was not allowed to go into the restaurant with the service animal. I thought to myself I would be grossed out sitting in a restaurant with dogs. However, if it is a service animal and what they said to the father was we don't allow pets and he's trying to explain this is not a pet it is a service animal. I have zero problem with a service animal being there with somebody as they choose to die in an restaurant. Why? Because that individual who is living with a disability also should have the right and be able to have the access. But the contradictions that we are living with. Obviously if an animal is in a restaurant he is and sees a play but yeah that's my thought here. More of your voice notes. Hi, I'm Le Boquille. This is Neo from JoeBug. Now I just want to know that you know, retang the gun doin.

14:45Yeah, because they are everywhere and give you like a tropon. I live in town, JoeBug CBD. These are everywhere. I have to kill it with my foot. With my shoe obviously. My shoe was on. But yeah, I mean obviously I do feel something. It is a living creature and it will feel pain. But what do we do? Yeah, so she's saying what do we do about all these rats? What do we do about the guys? I don't have an answer to this one because rats gross me out. I wouldn't even have the capacity to kill it myself but I know I wouldn't want it there. I would not want a red near me. Hi, I'm Le Boquille. I was just saying I can't kill it. But I know the dog. I know the dog. I know the dog. What is that? Hi, I'm Keenabuffille. You see, those rats. That way that way implemented by white people regarding animals.

15:47It does not suit as black people. It does not suit as black people and they should be changed. Mina, if I see a snake in my yard, I'm going to kill it. I'm not gonna kill it. They'll rather arrest me. But I'm definitely sure that I would. That snake will not live my yard alive. And I want to call the police. And meanwhile, I'm now keeping my eyes on the snake to make sure that the snake does not go in the house or does not bite me. Oh, where do I get the time? Where do we get all that time? Mina, that will be an invasion in his Aussie Bula, is snake. Translation. The snake will not live my yard alive. Simple. And I mean, guys, there's also many spiritual beliefs around snakes. I haven't heard anybody mention a cat. I've not heard anybody mention a cat.

16:48Move your voice notes. Okay, as the voice notes are coming through, let me look at some of your messages that are coming through on social media. Prichard said animals are part of family and culture. They are wealth, lobola, status and connection to ancestors. Young Kosses, I'm going to speak for people who grew up in rural areas. We respect our animals, whether domesticated wildo pets. If you own dogs in villages, you will hardly see a dog on a leash. We see them as part of our family. When we went to hunt, it was done in seasons. We did not over consume. Even if it was fishing, if you had domestic animals, you don't just slaughter them without a purpose. I grew up knowing that a house that had no birds, its aura, was not right. Birds love a positive energy home. I lived in a suburb and realized people invest in bird feeders to call birds to their home. Animals are drawn to positive aura. Your livestock will grow and your home will have birds without even going out of your way to be creative in attracting them.

17:59That sounds so powerful. Thank you for sharing that. Num Kossi says, I mean from what I've seen throughout the townships, it's not good. I mean you see house pets starving and having to find for themselves. I mean they keep dogs just to make them bodyguards. I think people think animals have no feelings. It's a sad reality. Mokhasa says, I love and admire animals from a distance. I don't have pets, not even a cat. I wouldn't be able to look after them as required. It's what that person has to say. I think I just missed. Oh Vanessa on Facebook says, I am vegan for animals. So they are interesting viewpoints and I'm not clear if we are unified as a people as to what it means for going forward. Graftenen liberal and the seven or two listeners. My take on this is I have a portfolio of European clients that I work for.

19:01I manage the game forms in South Africa. They from Slovakia, Slovenia, Czech Republic, Vienna, Belgium. And they come into this country and they pay a fortune to kill animals and they pay a fortune to take out those trophies. So do the math. Do the math. Yeah, we will take your last messages, voice notes and calls when we come back. It's one thirty. Twenty five minutes to two o'clock we've been talking about the true nature of our relationships with animals in this country. Wild animals people come in to hunt them down. There's a perception that people of color black folks if you go to the township don't care about animals. But we had an environmentalist calling today. We do care about animals from a cultural perspective. There's a message I read which spoke about the relationship between people and animals in rural areas.

20:04You won't see dogs on leashes and we had the listener who said that gasi dog is our malo me. So Karavo I mean I wanted to know get your thoughts because I was asking people what is that breed? Another gasi breed and somebody said sent a message saying that breed is called bobi. Actually, apparently the official name is Spoddi. No, you're lucky. Google it. You'll see it. Google it. We were Googling it. Okay. And the ratan for instance that gasi breed is for real. Yeah, it's for the and you know what they they are part of the community. They're part of the family. They're the most loyal breed of dogs that I've ever seen. They come to our funerals. They attend our funerals. They attend our weddings. And you know, I had this other friend of mine. He's an elder. He was older than me, but he's a good friend of mine.

21:04He's part of the CPF in the community, the community policing forum. So in the mornings he will walk around with the dog. Yes. People in Sohit don't know they blow the vovo ze las. Boop boop boop boop. Through the streets of the neighborhood. So he always had this dog. Unfortunately, he passed on a few weeks or months ago. And guess what? That dog still does the rounds. The patrolling. So if you know you're going to go catch a taxi, go stop on the sessing in at this time. Oh man. You sure you're going to get that dog there waiting for you because that's your I'm tearing up. Every time when I drive out of home at about six o'clock in the morning, I always drive past it. And guess what? I hoot. Oh my god. Just like I used to hoot at Malo Mistobolo. Yes. Go away to the call him and Malo Mistobolo. Yes. And listen what you're saying because I obviously watch a lot of content. I saw somebody that was saying if a person is on is towards the end of their life.

22:08They say allow the person's page to be with them because they know. And if they don't know that the person died, those dogs will wait every single day for that person. Because that's how loyal they are. But also I think because we don't see animals as the same level of us in the hierarchy. They don't have consciousness, but doesn't mean they don't have feelings. They have feelings. They have all of these things. But Joe, Karab, sorry about your friend, but I hope he's proud. Hurry. That dog is still doing the job. No patrolling. No protecting us. No protecting us. Still protecting us. Still doing all of that. So more of your messages that are coming through audible one, double a three or seven, two, the WhatsApp line, O seven, two, seven, two and seven, two. Oh my word. L'Ov'Khile, Toyota test dogs, Gassi language, here I play it anonymous in Captain Park. As it finishes me. L'Ov'Khile, the brown, Gassi dog is tiger. That's from Bob. And persons as I'm grossed out eating an arish ronde was snotty screeching kids running around.

23:10Dogs are much better behaved. Hi, they I think the dog you're referring to is called an Afriganis. Not a case of putting before, but my dogs protect me. Will any black man walk by my side and give their life for me is what Lee and Albertan has to say. Another person says apparently that dog breed is African. Africanis. Is it pronounced canis or canis? I'm not sure. Had L'Ov'Khile, the lady talking about a dea counselor wanting to limit the amount of dogs you own is in fact the situation unfolding in Cape Town. However, please note that this has always been an is a by law, but is not police. I did not know that. Okay, now we have to have a conversation about by laws regarding animals. If I find red snakes or bats in my home, they will die. Hmm, the greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated a quote by Mahatma Gandhi that was sent through 702 listeners. Um, uh, uh, Babagasomanga in four ways.

24:11I noticed that many people don't know that majority of animals are very important scarce medication that can help change lives. All these animals are really working. People like spiritual guidance, just like, uh, yours. So you're something could have solved the HIV problems if they involve spiritual people and herbs or animals. I hear you loud and clear high level. There's a growing number of restaurants in South Africa that do have dog menus. I have seen this. You are right. Um, Chit says the pets are my family and more of your messages coming through. But let's go to your voice notes. Oh, seven two seven out to you and seven out to you. Hi, I was thinking about rights having more speaking about dogs having more rights than human beings. I find it weird, especially most entertain where you find the dogs of medical aid and the helper. And the garden guy, uh, no medical aid. So we came more about the animal than we do about, uh, about our fellow human beings. And, and then we say, we are all equal.

25:14Any man found. I'm confused. So my, they go and hunt animals. You know, they hunt the box. They hunt all these different types of animals and they keep tigers. Some of them they keep these big cats in their homes and lions. And when you say it's naked in your home, you must not kill it on who else? And who is low? I'm a man. We're now as, as, as, as people we must compete with animals. No, in fact, the law is up to the pavement in my house is my rules. Hi, really, we like it. Nice to pick the dog. It's looking about me and the people that are on my hood in my mobile. We call it my dad's being because it's consistently pulling down other people as always.

26:16And they chop him passes. So we call it woman. That's been. And it's usually brown and black. It's very dog, it's very silly. It's even scared of people when somebody comes into your home. It runs to the back of their house. Thanks for a great show. Thank you. After knowing the real book, he lived as his cellma from Ruripur. We have cats and they keep all the verben in check. And we don't have any snakes. Before we got the cats, we did have a snake or two, but cats are known to keep snakes at bay. So there is your solution to the problem. And they've kept all the rats even lying them up for me next to the bin so that I could just ride the wind. But to show mommy I've done my job. So there we are. Thanks for the lovely show. Hi, everybody. I only like pets that I don't have to pet. So I'm into fish and birds and that's it. Not dogs, not cats.

27:17If you've got dogs and cats in your house, I am not eating there. And they are the ones that are born from Ruripur. Guys. I hear you completely. I hear you completely. There's nothing like a stray dog in the township. These are dogs that have decided to own their previous owners and would rather go out and hustle for their survival. That is from Tabang. I keep says if I kill an animal, it's a problem. But these people, the SPCA people go in the bushes taking videos of lions killing the same animals. How is that? Another one says next thing, SPCA will be arresting us for killing mosquitoes and cockroaches. I swear we will pick up this conversation again because I think it is an important one. Thank you so much for your messages. Calls and voice notes.