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However, listen wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome back to Tujujee Girls, this is Mary from the Bay.

And it's Courtney from LA, it is Wednesday, which means we are in the final four of March

Manus.

And by the time some of you listen to this, it will be the final two of March Manus, what

a week.

It is so exciting, I mean, I am rooting for my man West Wilson now.

At this point, I just, I love him so much.

He once kissed me on the cheek you guys, no big deal.

She is playing with her hair like a little girl and blushing so hard right now, I wish you

guys could see this visual, which is like also surprising to me because you've loved

West, but you're like a fan now.

Okay, I feel sorry for him last night.

He was on watch what happens live and I feel like he was very nervous.

You know, he kept twisting back and forth in the chair.

He was definitely like on the hot seat.

He hates confrontation.

He's not good at a reunion, but I know the man he is because I did him on that boat, Courtney.

He knows how to work a room.

He knows how to make you feel special.

He went around and said goodbye to everyone, gave them a hug, a little kiss on the cheek.

He is a genuine, nice guy and I love that he sent us a ton of pictures.

And at this point, I'm rooting for him.

That is my pick.

Have you washed your face since no, this corner right here, yeah, never washed it again.

You put just like a sticker over it when you wash your, through the rest of your face,

like preserve this West wilton area.

It's on the West side of her face.

She is giddy over this man.

Now I agree.

I think West is my overall choice as well, mostly because as you guys know, my favorite

thing about this competition is the participation.

Like you said, he sent us a ton of photos.

Madison has sent us photos of Brett, but Brett doesn't have social media.

So he's not present on it.

Andy has partially participated.

He did say that it was sad that he was in the final four and I'm like, okay, well, you're

a one seed, sir.

And then Rob, right, he probably hasn't seen a single DM from us.

So I do think based off of that, and I also, I love West too.

I have washed my face since, but Brett neither here nor there.

I'm rooting for him.

I think they're all one seed.

So all the one seeds made it to the final four.

So I will also be happy with whoever takes the crown.

I think they're all worthy of it, but personally, I prefer a participant.

Andy only won by like two percent yesterday.

He really squeaked by, but yeah, just my final vote is for West.

We'll see who makes it to the championship.

And it's exciting.

It's been a fun, a fun time to be alive, international women's month.

Shout out to Whitner.

I just feel like he had a blast with the competition, Seth Marks, Mr. Congeniality.

It's just been fun overall and I just think the production value was priceless.

I was going to say we need like superlatives for like the end of it.

It's like you have Mr. Congeniality of Seth Marks.

You have like best newbie within like Whitner's, like KJ was up there, you know, maybe like

most robbed.

There are so many different categories that I think that there could be.

I am sad it's coming to an end, but it's like I'm not going to cry because it's over.

I'm going to smile because it happened.

That was said by Tyler Perry, Dr. Seuss.

Say it, forget it, write it, regret it.

Yes, during the medley, Tyler Perry, when it came to West on watch, what happens live,

he had a lot of nervous energy.

I think he maybe had a few cocktails before he was out there.

He also hates confrontation.

You mentioned he's always bad at a reunion.

I think he's really concerned about who he potentially could offend with an answer because

they bring up the Amanda West rumor and like Andy gives it to him, like all you have

to say is no, all you have to say is no and he kind of got in his head and he was mumbling

a little bit and he's like Amanda single and she's a very important person to me and these

rumors are out there.

It's like all you had to say was no, but because it wasn't a straight up no, the fandom has

gone wild.

I know.

I just can't imagine him doing this.

Just to Sierra, to Kyle, him and Kyle have hung out since it would be so shocking.

It would be bigger than Skandival if you asked me really, it would be bigger than Skandival

for you.

It would be.

I guess they were separated at the time, but no, it didn't happen you guys, it didn't

happen.

No makers think it.

Why are we putting this on the universe and didn't happen, okay?

You're not putting it out in the universe.

It was put out there.

We're just commenting on it.

Don't trust him.

I'm so sorry you're getting so upset.

I think you're worried about his chances to be the champ.

So you are, you want to clean slate.

Let's men in black, everyone right now.

Okay.

So I also want to watch what happens live.

So we talked about this on our Patreon too, but Paige and Hannah are going to have a Netflix

sitcom that's being produced by Amy Poler and Decomments on it as his like, Muzzle of

the Day on Watch What Happens Live and then like roasts Craig.

Oh, I've just been saying for months now, he's the ultimate gas lighter and biggest

villain on Bravo TV and I just feel like the rest of the world's finally seen it.

Well so Andy said, you know, it's time for my Muzzle of the Day and it goes to the news

that our friends Paige, Disorbo and Hannah Burner will be starring and co-writing their

own comedy series for Netflix produced by Amy Poler and then he says, I have a feeling

Craig is going to need his magician to make him some pretend to be happy for you, spray.

Oh wow.

I was like, huh, my, oh, my, there's also nothing worse than a breakup you can't get away

from.

They've been broken up for quite some time now and it just is always talking about it.

That's brutal, you know, because it's the one that got away for him.

While they spent every single day together, Mary, which we'll get into it when we talk

about the reunion.

I was like, I'd like to see the calendar, you know, mostly because I can see Summer House

filming when when Craig wasn't there and Paige was.

So the everyday thing is I would say an exaggeration because a storyteller, I know and he does

tell some great stories.

I agree though, for him is just to see her continue to do well, has to kill him.

I actually feel bad for him in that regard.

Like it has to be horrible to be in the spotlight and then to see your ex partner doing all

these great things with and not that he like doesn't want her to do great, but almost

like I'm not even a part of that anymore.

Like that would have been a thing we would celebrate together.

And I don't think he thinks this way, but was I holding her back from achieving all

of this success?

Look how much she's done since in my how he's fallen from grace.

I remember there was this time where people were saying like Andy was going to retire and

like Craig Conover was going to take over like that was like a rumor a long time ago.

But think about that now.

Like that would never be a rumor now.

Well, people are like, how did Craig win March Madness and I'm like, when the winners

won their year, how high up they were within the echelon of Bravo?

Like people like, of course, Craig won, like, oh God, this must be like rigged.

No, because two years ago he was dating Paige and everybody loved him.

Well, and he was always the bridesmaid never the bride.

He was always the runner up totally.

But I'm just saying like he because he was just seen in such a better life.

And then, you know, obviously the breakup has like affected him.

And now we're seeing a different side of him.

I honestly do feel bad for him.

I don't feel bad for him, but well, and also someone I also don't feel bad for his Kyle Cook.

I got a little nervous yesterday, you guys.

You guys, I got a text, was I too soft on Kyle?

No, you are just so desensitized to Kyle Cook, his actions, things you have seen,

that while it was a bad episode for him, you're like, this is history repeating itself.

We've seen this behavior.

Nothing shocks me about the guy.

There's this TikTok going around.

He's at a fan's house.

He's like wasted.

It's like four or five o'clock in the morning.

I'm like, you guys, we see this on summer house.

Like this is no different.

He does his DJ set.

He has a great time.

He won't stick decompress after he meets fans.

They say, hey, we're having an after party.

He goes.

And that's how we fall asleep at people's houses.

Like nothing is shocking to me about this man.

He is someone who does not end a party.

Like he's always looking for the next part of the party.

I mean, you watch it on summer house.

He's never like, hey guys, I think we should go to bed.

It's like everyone's gone to bed.

So then Kyle has to go to bed.

You know, we always see him drunk by himself

eating in the kitchen because there's nobody else

because everyone's asleep at that point.

Kyle is someone who has a massive FOMO.

Like someone else, I know that's on this podcast right now.

FOMO fear of missing out.

But it's FOMO with Mary.

Fear of Mary's missing out.

I mean, I have to say it.

I suffer from two diseases.

Lateness and FOMO.

It's hard.

It's tough.

It's tough.

And which is funny because you would think being late

would also, you know, exaggerate your FOMO.

Like, oh, you're late, but it's more the end of the night.

That's so true.

That's actually super interesting to think about.

If I'm 20 minutes late,

that just means the party is going 20 minutes longer.

Well, I was just going to say the party doesn't start

until you walk in.

I think Kessa sings that.

And I think that song is written about you.

Now, the party don't start

until I walk in.

Michael's birthday is on Kessa's birthday

and he like loves Kessa, which is so silly.

You love Kessa?

Because they have the same birthday.

He loves her.

Has Michael gone to a Kessa concert?

By the way, Kessa is going on toward

Erica Jane is one of her openers.

I think you guys need to go for the joint love

of Kessa and Bravo.

You know what?

I'll consider it if it's in San Francisco.

We've got to look it up.

I mean, imagine surprising Michael with Kessa tickets?

Wait, so did Kyle Richards like introduce Kessa and Erica?

Is that the connection?

Remember when she was at Mighty Hoopla?

Kessa was on the bill there.

I think she's met Kessa through Kyle,

but I think that they've been at a couple

festivals together too and probably have like connected that way.

Okay, got it.

I assume Kyle was part of the ignition of the relationship.

Okay, I love this.

Yeah, and I think Michael would love the show.

Six degrees of separation of Bravo always.

Love that.

Let's talk some bachelor at secret lives,

because even though the cameras aren't up,

the drama is constantly going.

What do you think about this new bachelor at rumor?

So they're saying more from the traders.

I would love to see it.

I feel bad for ABC.

I mean, they had all these advertisers.

You feel bad for ABC who could have done their due diligence.

Okay, that's a valid point.

But I'm very hopeful that someone like Mora will

got the opportunity.

And we get kind of this like live reality show of her dating.

I would definitely watch it.

I think I would.

If it was a live version, maybe it changes the formula a little bit.

And we go more love Island.

Mora doesn't live in the US.

So yeah, but I feel like she's a LA girl.

I guess she's already done a show like that with love Island.

I just actually I kind of think this is a little beneath her to be the bachelor at.

Really?

I feel like the bachelor at can make you a household name.

I guess I just mean in the sense of it's going her going back to a love show.

Like she's already done that with love Island and then taken experiences from that

and taken that into like hosting and doing other shows.

Not beneath her is not the right word.

So apologies for that.

I mean more so I think it's backtracking on her.

Because she's already done a similar show to this.

But it's ABC.

I mean a Sunday night.

And we see all that for them.

No, I don't anymore.

I love more so I'd probably watch it.

It's just like take your berk and go.

I just don't think they'll be able to pull this off in the time frame.

Like as I would literally have to start next Sunday.

Yeah.

And there's rumors too.

And I think it was Abby Boenardy's that had posted something about.

There's some dancing with the stars or something like that.

Derek Huff had commented on it kind of like stay tuned.

And I do know that there's a dancing with the stars.

Finding the next pro that's being hosted by Robert Irwin.

And I wonder if that oh no.

I didn't know I hear about I can't I can't watch it.

Why do you hate him so much?

I told you.

I like my all that Micah.

Micah, Robert Irwin, two unproblematic people.

But maybe that would go in place as they would do that.

And you know, you might miss a couple of weeks of Bachelorette.

They're not going to go the secret lives of Mormon wives.

If we're going to move Jen Affleck to the OC one,

is the Utah one?

Are they all kind of dead on arrival now?

No, not at all.

Let's talk about Jesse on call her daddy.

This is the summary.

I watched a Jordi McRase TikTok.

So they basically had already decided to divorce.

And they hadn't told their kids.

And he blindsided her by like going to the media.

He tried to get that restraining order,

which didn't happen because he basically didn't want her to go

on podcasts telling her side of the story.

She has like screenshots of escort services from season one.

She found out about it two weeks before she met Marciano.

There's like some brumblings of orgy parties.

They only communicate now via a third party.

Like she changed her number.

He would like totally shame her about her body and stuff like that.

And he's obviously like very traditional in the gender roles,

which is so funny because he's literally living in the house that she bought.

He's a stay-at-home dad, right?

He does not work.

She assumes that she is going to have to like pay him out,

alimony and child support.

He was using the Marciano stuff as black male.

There was also some Harry, um,

Jousey.

There was something there in he was trying to use that against her.

He just sounds like very evil.

And I just hope the best for Jesse.

And I, I feel bad for her.

Like she talks a little about the surgeries and stuff.

She just like has very low self-esteem.

And I'm just excited for her to start a new journey alone.

And I hope the best for her.

So it sounds like he tried to do a restraining order

so that she couldn't go on call her daddy and tell the story, right?

That was like what happened.

And it got denied because it wasn't an emergency thing.

Also, that's not a restraining order.

That a restraining order.

Is to get people to not come by you on your property.

It's like a physical thing.

I don't understand how that would, um,

I wonder if there is a kind of cease and desist restraining order

about not being able to talk on somebody.

Maybe I said this, but not a restraining order.

I don't know.

Not a lawyer.

But it just feels like good for Jesse.

I feel kind of bad for the kids because I'm like,

we're really putting it all out there.

Like this is crazy.

But also way to tell her story outside of the kid part of his.

Like way to tell your story because like expose him.

He was clearly so jealous.

He wanted to be the leader of dad talk.

He was blackmailing her with all that stuff.

She said you could like ruin my life.

It's like we're at some point.

Like this is supposed to be your partner.

I saw a little clip that was like for five years.

For five years, there wasn't a day we did not fight.

At one point, he was trying to blackmail me with the Marciano stuff.

And I was kind of chasing after him to grab his phone.

And he brought it out to try to record me and be like,

oh, what are you going to do?

Same thing Taylor did.

So like him and Dakota are clearly in cahoots

about manipulating and being toxic and all of this.

And also one of our friends texted and was like,

TMZ confirmed that they didn't get the video from the courts,

meaning that someone sold it to them.

And it's like, who has that video?

So I am definitely in the camp that Dakota and Jordan

are working together because it was like,

you know, Jordan was the one who filed and all of a sudden it was on TMZ.

I saw somebody else's like TikTok that's friends with Jesse

that was like, when your friend finds out about her divorce on TMZ

and it's like a video of Jesse just on the phone.

I'm obsessed with mom talk.

I just feel like they give us so much content

and the story happens so fast.

There's a lot going on.

A lot, a lot going on.

And there's no cameras.

There's no cameras.

What the hell is happening here?

It's crazy.

Something's always going on.

It's like by the time tomorrow rolls around,

we'll have 50 pieces of new information.

I mean, I'm sure there's things that we aren't even saying.

Okay, we actually think this is a great part to the reunion.

Let's take a break and come back and get into it.

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Okay, they basically have break for lunch

and Craig is freaking the fuck out.

Like he is just like, this is my world is crumbling.

And the way that he comes back for lunch and talks to Andy.

And he's like, I was doing so well all season.

I'm like, does Craig think in his head he had a good season?

He thinks until Mexico that he had a great season.

And I'm telling you, this is why I am convinced

he was blindsided.

Reality is a different reality for him

than the actual reality of the world.

And in his mind, I think when it comes down to everything

that's happened that he was like, I was provoked,

I was provoked, I was provoked.

The one time I basically got out of my seat to escalate

was in Mexico.

And I think because the repercussions

and the consequences for Mexico,

which was basically the end of Charlie and Craig,

is why he thinks that he was so good.

Because oh, it's just the same with like the literary party

with Austin's dinner, all the things that had happened

was, well, that's just Austin and I.

No, he has such tunnel vision

and has such high regards for himself.

And you can tell, he multiple times like tried to get Charlie

to say something different.

He's like whispering things to her when he has a chance.

It was very strange.

Mexico, it's not fair for you to mention Mexico.

That's not really cool for you to mention

that Mexico is why things ended.

It's like, that's exactly why it ended was Mexico.

It also made me question Charlie

because at first, I think she was interested in Craig,

but now kind of seeing it play back and knowing

she's with Justin, I'm like,

did she play up the Craig thing

to have more of a storyline on the show

or be a main character

or do you think she was genuinely interested in him?

I don't think she was as calculated.

I think her mom was more calculated

and I think she had influence from her mom.

I mean, right, though, like her mom's like,

yeah, he's so yellowed.

Who's that bad, Charlie?

Oh, he had one bad day.

That's probably why he thinks he's like,

I talked to Charlie's mom.

She said I had a good season.

I did, I just, the way that it was played back,

I just felt like Charlie might have been talking

to him to be relevant.

I don't, okay.

And I never thought that the whole season.

I don't think she loved bomb him.

I think in Charleston,

it's like a four to one ratio of girls to guys.

I think that there are not a lot of guys in Charleston,

which is why they have their pick of the litter,

if you will, of who they end up with.

And I think for her it was like, it's twofold.

This guy is interested me

and also the star of the show is interested in me.

And I do want to explore this.

And I think Craig is a good looking guy.

And I'm it's that as well.

Yeah, like and so to Sally, like, you know,

we want Craig's looks and Austin's personality.

But it's like, I think that there's something

about the enigma of this person liking me

and then being like, okay, maybe I'll try to pursue this

because this guy is interested.

Like there's just such a blurred line of the whole thing.

I don't think she was love bombing him.

I think she wanted to feel it out.

I think she liked getting attention from him.

And I think she was like, okay, could this be something?

And then, okay, it's a storyline.

But also I don't feel like it was that much of a storyline

because she was trying to keep it so private

while she figured it all out.

I know it's very, it kind of like messed with my head

a little bit because originally I thought Sally,

I thought Charlie was just a fun, nice girl.

She was interested in Craig.

Then she realizes it's not what it is.

But then for something happened in this reunion

that I like didn't completely trust her anymore.

And I felt like she was trying to be relevant for the show.

I don't think she loved bomb him at all.

I also, cell phones are so dangerous

because I feel like they had a connection over the cell phone

but not in person.

Like they love texting each other.

They love FaceTimey.

They love checking in throughout the day,

but they only went on two dates.

So Craig felt their relationship was much deeper

than what was actually happening.

And there was a lot of talks of what's gonna be,

what's gonna be, but it wasn't really.

Well, and I think on the show,

it was like Mexico is crazy, I'm not interested.

And then they end the season.

He's like, oh, just friends, and she's just friends.

And I feel like he probably maybe texted her

and said, hey, the show is over.

Like maybe we could try.

And so she was like, okay, maybe I'll give that a chance

and she was also starting to talk to Justin.

And at the end of the day was like,

you know what, I can't move past it.

I think I'm really into Justin.

He's giving me the attention and like he has the qualities.

I'm not sure why, but he has the qualities

I'm looking for in a partner.

And she ends up going with that.

And so it wasn't that she like led Craig on,

but she was like, I'm still talking to Craig.

The vagus thing was interesting too,

because then I felt like awesome

was kind of like an ex lover here too

where Austin had to tell Craig,

oh, you're talking to Charlie.

She's come into the bar with this guy being like,

I'm in love.

See, I just questioned her now.

Like what was the relationship with Craig at that point

or is it one of Craig's stories

that well, we were still talking,

but like was she talking to Craig as a friend

and he thought maybe there was still something more

because they were never really friends?

Evolving, he said that we were never gonna be friends.

There's three sides.

His side, her side and the truth.

Right.

I just questioned her more than I thought I would.

And I definitely would love to see her

with Justin on Southern hospitality more.

I don't think she makes sense in this group any longer.

And I would love to see her facial reactions more.

Oh, you want more of those?

Yes, they're all the same.

She's got one look, guys.

It's one look.

I felt bad for Charlie.

I also was like, Mary really had the read

on her from the beginning of the season

because you're like, she's not made for reality TV.

And the way that she was handling herself in the reunion,

I wanted her to just shut it down.

Just put it all out there.

Like she stayed relatively quiet

and then like left the stage and went and cried

and was like, I'm just overwhelmed.

She Sally checks in on her and I'm like,

I don't even know why we're crying right now.

The fact that we're crying over this

is kind of crazy because if anything,

I'm like, Craig looks bad.

The Craig, you think I was love bombing you?

We had one kiss.

I also love that she was the one

to call it quits with Craig.

Like I think that's the problem for him.

Totally, but I'm like, you own that girl.

You look great in this scenario.

Like you are ending it with Craig Conover.

That Sally's been trying to get him all season.

You know, she couldn't, so she moved on to Austin.

Like he was the biggest star at the beginning of the season.

And now I think he does look like the villain,

but for her to say, no, and walk away from him,

I think she was her true character.

I also wanted to know, I was like,

because Craig's like, you are face timing me

from your friend's wedding.

Like, well, Craig though, did you dial the number?

And did she answer?

So those are like the details I want to know

because I think that there's,

I think both of them are blurring it and like lying a tad

or omitting some parts of the truth.

So that's why I'm like, where are we going

with this?

I still am team Charlie on the whole thing.

I don't think she like led him on.

I think she was also being nice.

And I think it's hard when it's the star of the show.

Right.

I mean, Craig is definitely trying to make Charlie look bad.

And I do believe they only talked one time after Mexico.

I believe they genuinely probably went out on two dates

that were actually all filmed,

but they had this like relationship over the phone

that Craig thought too far.

And she was just talking to a lot of guys on the side

and then ended up with Justin.

I think that's pretty accurate.

And I think-

That's the summary guys.

Yeah.

I think Craig being rejected is a PTSD thing for him

because Paige ended it.

I think Naomi ended it with him

because I don't actually think that Craig ends relationships.

But there's something about when the woman

is the one, this is the decision maker

that he's like, hold on, hold on.

What do you mean?

And it's really triggering for him

because I think him saying the things on the side

it's unfair for you to say Mexico is like him being like,

you should be defending me here.

No, he's so controlling.

I feel like he said so much stuff to Paige

that we'll never know.

I wish we would.

Honestly though, maybe in their new show,

they'll write a character named Greg.

Oh my God.

And maybe Greg will be somebody from our past

that just won't go away.

What is he selling?

It's not pillows.

There's something.

There's definitely something there.

I love that idea.

I'm not giving the idea.

Maybe they already have the idea.

I don't want to be a part of it.

I'm not gonna knick-by all over here.

I don't, uh-uh.

No, I'm not giving that idea.

That's just something I was wondering if they had the idea of.

Okay, let's talk about Vanita.

Well, I have a question.

Okay, please ask it.

Are Sally and Vanita going to be friends next season?

I am somewhat unclear on why they aren't.

Like, I think Vanita has a big grudge here.

I found it interesting when it was like Sally's birthday

or like they're hanging out and she tells Sally

like, you can't post about me.

Is it because of like the timing of the show

when it's for like show storylines

that you don't want to be seen with her?

Or like, why is it that you don't want pictures with her

but you still wanna hang out with her?

What's going on there?

I felt like Andy jumped into

because Vanita's like, you don't see all the comments

but then she also says, I'm never on social media

during the season.

Right.

And she's like, I, you know, I feel stupid

and people are, you know, not standing up for me

and they're saying I was played like a fool.

And she says, watch it back.

And I was just so confused.

And she's not giving anything.

And it's like, yeah, people are probably rudely

in your DMs being like, Sally's not a friend.

If you go back to summer houses,

Amanda's saying that with her relationship with Kyle, right?

Like the fans are telling me, why am I with them?

Why am I with them?

And the things get in your head.

But like you said, Andy jumps in and is like,

but you're smarter than that.

Like you should be going to the source

and not what random people on the internet are saying.

And I also feel like Sally is the type of person

that would sweep it under the rug

and she can move forward from this situation.

And then I maybe think is Vanita like jealous of Austin?

In what way?

Like Sally spending her time with him?

Yes.

Oh, I don't know.

I think Vanita loves hard.

And I think when she has a friendship,

she puts her all into it.

And maybe it's kind of like an Austin and Craig thing

where I joke that it's like this lovers quarrel

that they're having because they care so much.

And I'm like, I think Vanita just thought

at the end of the day, if it came down to this random guy

and her, that Sally would choose her friendship.

And she learned really fast that Sally's for Sally

and Sally is a little desperate, oh, no.

Sally's not desperate.

She's for Austin.

She has her eyes on the price.

He's married.

She's mature.

You're not even going to eat Euro me

because she's worried about Austin eating her ass out later.

I was like, what?

What?

I love her so much.

I just do.

It's like two, that was like two months.

But I think like Vanita is just looking for the friend she is.

And a lot of times in friendships,

you're like, Sally is my best friend,

but like Sally doesn't consider Vanita her best friend.

I see.

I see.

She's got energy in because and she expects the same back

and doesn't get that and learning that in real time is so hard.

And so now she puts up a guard

and she's making these little kind of snide comments

like when Sally's like, oh, yeah, your mom,

oh, yeah, that's my girl.

And she's like, well, she doesn't know the full story.

And it's like, okay.

So we're either going to move on

or you guys are going to be enemies.

You have to decide one way or the other.

I really like Vanita and I don't think she had a good season

and I think she could have recovered at the reunion

and she still wasn't able to move forward.

And it also breaks my heart

to hear about the carl situation

because basically he went to People Magazine

and said the distance and issue

and that's how she found out about that issue

and a People Magazine issue.

It's like when West did that to Sierra and the New York Times?

So on publications, one text, guys, one text.

We were in that article, guys.

No big deal.

Oh yeah.

I don't, yeah.

Is that the same article?

No, I feel bad.

Oh, or was that the follow up?

No, there were two articles.

I don't think that I think we were just in the original.

Unclear.

Sorry, guys.

I just like any time I can bring up

that I was in the New York Times,

I tried to drop it.

Miss Mahoney and Miss Frane.

They were like, can we get your ages?

And we're like, no.

Yeah, that was a bummer about carl

because we were looking for the update too.

I feel bad for Venita because I do feel like she's on an island

there and nobody has her back as strong

as they have someone else's back.

And she even says too, I did not open up to anybody,

the way that I opened up to Sally.

And so then when Sally's not there,

she's like, and as a friend,

I'm trying to steer Sally in the right direction.

Like, well, there's your mistake.

You cannot change anybody.

You can give your piece and then move on from it.

You can decide what your relationship

and your boundaries are from there

based on the advice you give and then the decisions they make.

But you also can't get upset and be like,

told you so, told you so, told you so.

Because at the end of the day,

she doesn't, Sally doesn't care.

She's gonna go for what she wants regardless.

Austin.

I just think in general,

and the same way that Madison says about Craig at the end of it

is like, you guys kind of have to kind of accept

that this is who he is.

And if you don't want to accept

that that's who he is, then don't be his friend.

Okay, let's take a break

because I want to talk about team Madison and team Craig.

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What do you mean team Madison and Team Craig?

I'm, they're on the same team.

Like, I, I was so confused by that.

I do not know why Madison is Team Craig.

I feel like she supported him so much at this reunion.

What was the deal with that?

I Madison plays the game smart.

And at the end of the day,

everybody had an issue with Craig.

Meaning that they all had a storyline.

I think Madison also sees too is the way

and, again, not excusing Craig's behavior,

but the poking and prodding, right?

Like, Vanita even says in Mexico

that, yeah, she said that thing about Austin

because she wanted it to bother Craig,

which is what we said when it happened to, right?

Obviously, she's inferring that about Craig.

And it's like everyone that keeps poking and prodding,

of course, he's going to react.

Not saying it's the right thing to do, but he does that.

It did not, to me, seem that crazy because she was like,

if I was in that van, I would have tried

to deescalate the situation.

It got to a point where it was like,

I wouldn't even let you get to that point.

I think it's very interesting that Craig did not watch

the season.

And Madison says, so that's your pillar of him.

That's your therapy to watch the season back

and see how you can change.

But I didn't like that.

I can see how you can change.

But I didn't like Madison saying,

we should accept him for who he is.

I thought that was bullshit.

But I do think what you're saying, she is smart.

She knows how to play the game.

But I think it's accepting for who he is

and then decide if you want to be his friend.

Not accept him and be him be an asshole.

Like, because Austin's like, oh, accept my friends

and asshole.

And I think she's saying, no, you want him to change

to be this person.

You want him to be in order to be your friend.

He's been working on himself for three years.

I'm witness like, haven't seen the change.

But like, let us know when that happens.

But if you don't want to accept who Craig is at that point,

then do not be his friend because he at the end of the day

really isn't changing because in his head he thinks he has.

He's the same old Craig though.

And if you don't like that, don't be his friend.

Courtney, he was deprived of water and food.

And he was so pissed because he's like,

you are not going to call out production

and this reality reckoning.

No, it went like deeper than that.

Like, he was getting pissed.

Like, do not try to say that the show did not give you food or water.

They even play a clip of it to let the audience know.

We do not, we do not just supply them alcohol

with no food to put them in this sort of thing.

We will not be sued over this.

The rolling of the footage of the case D.S.

of the tequila tasting with the food parade.

I was cackling.

The ride's also smoking with the chicken.

No, but he was like, you are not going to say that we put you

in these terrible circumstances and that you are forced to do this.

And he was like, do not try to bring this house down.

It was so funny.

I mean, Craig does say at the end, he's like, well, you know,

I bottled it all up and I was just feeling really rejected by Charlie

and was blaming the situation in the environment.

And I need to have the tools to deal with this.

And he says sorry to everyone and he will try his hardest

to never let it happen again.

Which just gives me the opening that it's going to happen again.

Of course.

Of course it will.

He's perfectly imperfect.

Imperfectly perfect.

Okay.

He's a work in progress.

And we've never heard about that on any of these shows.

Of any of these men and Ramona singer being works in progress.

Okay.

They are doing their best.

And that's all that we can ask is not to do the best.

Do their best.

And if Craig thinks he's done his best, well, then we have to accept him for that.

And then decide if you want to be his friend in the state that he is in

and the person who he is, you get to decide.

Now, do you think that Austin and Craig can move forward?

What is going to happen with this show?

They have to because the show doesn't work with all three of them on the outs.

Like the three of them of ship Austin and Craig are the show.

I think they all to be honest and especially Craig and Austin need to accept some truths about themselves.

Austin needs to accept the fact that he did not like having a girlfriend.

He wanted to fuck around and he was jealous of Craig being in that position.

Ow, ow, ow.

This is tough love, Courtney.

But then Craig also needs to accept is like, I am an asshole.

I do go off the deep end.

And you know what?

I actually was jealous that Austin was in the place that I wanted to be.

Narcissist.

He's an empath.

He got special spray.

But I'm just saying, they both need to come to terms with the fact of, hey, you know what?

I think we were both projecting on to each other what the other had.

And I think we can move forward.

I think Craig also needs to be like, I am someone who parties.

I do want a party.

I do want to have the hot tub.

And instead of like embellishing the truth or his version of the truth has to also understand that he's wrong sometimes.

Wait, speaking of the hot tub, did you notice when they talked about Corey and Sally in the hot tub and then going off?

They definitely hooked up.

Something happened there.

And then that brings up the thing that Craig brought Charlie to the sewing room.

And you can kiss me if you want.

And she was like, no, thanks.

Yeah.

Then Andy said, shouldn't you be like, can I kiss you?

Craig, they're being like, okay, but honestly, I don't have a game.

Which that is endearing.

That is endearing.

They have to move forward those two.

They have to go do ayahuasca in Costa Rica with chef.

Thank God.

They have chef to bring this bridge together.

I really hope we get to see one more season of them.

The three boys come together because I need like a happy ending in the end of this.

I don't know how much longer this show can go on to be honest.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It is interesting because I was going to ask of the cast.

Do you want to see any differences?

And it's like the show is a three of them.

Sally has been a great addition because like she's unburdened by the shackles of shame.

But like it's for the rest of us like Charlie has to go.

Unfortunately, there's just no storyline for her.

And I think she fits better over in Southern hospitality.

I agree.

I agree.

That's a check mark for me.

Uh huh.

Tell me what else.

What does make a good point?

She's like, actually, this is the first time ever in Southern charm history that the girls

are actually friends, which is actually I disagree because I think past seasons, Cameron and Chelsea

and Naomi were all friends.

But like, this is the first time they're friends.

So I'm like, okay, then I need you guys to do a lot of off camera bonding then and get to a point

of where you guys are an alliance for each other because right now I feel like the alliances are girls.

It's like whoever the girls are going to attach themselves of the guys on the cast.

I also feel like Madison said to us, I will have one hawk girl summer.

I will do one show not pregnant if I'm back on next season.

Like, I am going to put the show before my family one last time to really ruffle some feathers

because then I go back into the hive.

I will stir shit up one more time.

And if you want me to either bring the boys together, I can do that or I can tear them apart.

Just let me know the path you want me to take.

Actually, it would be kind of funny if the three boys went on the trip and met with Madison

as well as like the mediator of some sorts.

Yeah, I was good trip.

Any trip.

I do want to go to the I waska place because I think it was so life changing for Shepi.

Yeah, there's something there.

I would love to see Rod tie the knot on television.

I think that would be super fun.

I love the idea of Madison officiating.

I love that.

Austin thought he would be the efficient.

He's like, Rod, be honest.

He's like Madison.

He's like, okay, she's a Tom Ford call me.

I love Molly so much.

I hope we can hang on to her.

I think she is a neat and cookie.

I'd love to see more about her relationship.

I want Venita to get in the hot tub.

I think we got one more season in us.

The group has to come together.

They weren't able to in Mexico, but I'm hope.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, Venita and Craig seem to make progress.

I mean, when it comes down to the Venita stuff with Craig, I don't even think we got to like the crux of it.

But it's like Venita didn't know what she was talking about and she wasn't ever friends with Paige.

And Venita never at one point says, I am friends with Paige.

And I still don't think what she said was that crazy.

There's something more between Venita and Craig.

They're not breaking the fourth wall for who they need to kiss.

Maybe there's something more to that story.

And I wish they would just say it.

The end of the day, the entire cast minus Venita chose Craig over Paige, right?

And so if Craig wants to get Paige completely out of his life in a way, he wants Venita off the show.

He doesn't want whatever the connection is to Paige.

So he doesn't have to talk about Paige on the show because after this season, if we talk about Paige, it's Kuku Bananas.

We cannot talk about her.

It's been long enough.

She's not even on Bravo anymore.

It has to be done.

And we can't let the reason that Venita and Craig aren't friends be because of Paige because that can't be a storyline.

No, we have to stop talking about her.

Venita is such a nice person that I think as soon as someone apologizes to her, she takes it for their word.

And she's like, okay, I'm going to do my best to be the best friend I can be to them.

Think about over the summer.

It's like she still was nice to Craig's face even though she didn't need to be granted because he's probably this is his show.

I didn't like the way they were throwing back at her.

Like he saved your life in the pool.

She owe her the rest of her life to be nice to him because he did that.

Thank you for doing that.

I do not owe you my life.

No.

She's allowed to have an opinion on things just because Craig jumped in the pool.

And that was very kind of him to do and very nice.

And he probably did really save her life.

She's not indebted to him forever.

No, not at all.

No, but I hope that they can move on.

So basically we want everyone on the cast to come back except for Charlie.

And that's just a show transfer.

I had a weird, weird thought come across my mind and this is kind of wild.

Share it.

Okay.

So you know how Sally says that Austin is going to be like a great father.

He's going to be a great husband.

Okay.

Then I started thinking about Catherine Dennis in like how she got pregnant with Thomas Ravana.

And then I was like, oh my god.

Mary, don't finish the thought.

Do not finish the thought.

No.

Do not finish the thought.

No.

It crossed my mind.

Don't fail.

Is it wild?

Yes.

Did I do it?

Yes.

Yes.

Will Austin ever seriously date Sally?

Nor.

Oh, Courtney, you're killing me.

Do you think so?

Okay.

I think I guess if you finished your thought, you think maybe because of that.

No, no, no.

I think if she pulls back and says like, I'm not going to talk to you anymore.

I have feelings for you.

I don't, you don't want anything more.

I think if she can gain some power back, it's just like he's, she's too easy of a target for him.

Like he knows he can get her whenever he wants.

It's like Ashley I.

And Jared of bachelor to now real house was of Rhode Island fame where she was so about,

like about him finally decided she was going to do better and get away from him.

And they said, no.

And now they're married with kids.

I'm hopeful.

I believe that's the exception and not the rule.

Or will you have the cat, Catherine Dennis route.

No.

What's up?

Okay.

Okay.

See you tomorrow.

See you tomorrow.

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