Case Keenum or Tyson Bagent?; Steelers holding?

0:00Yo, yo, yo, yo, what's up everybody? On today's Chris Simpson button. No con er, Rogers. Just me solo. We welcome in JG. That's right. Coach Jason Garrett. We're gonna talk about why teams are still winning with their backup quarterbacks and why and what did the Cowboys do wrong in Brazil? And of course, it's Wednesdays with Warren. Yeah, Warren Sap. He gives us his film analysis on Quentin Williams and Dexter Lawrence while sitting next to a gator. Yeah, you got to tune in and check that out. Chris Simpson button starts right after this. Again. Someone's moving on. Someone's going home. The MLB YVCard series presented by Fee begins September 29th on NBC and Peacock.

1:04I gotta get you a headset with bat on this side so we can uh, converse easier. I'll do that. Yo, yo, yo, what's up everybody? It's Chris Simpson. It's Chris Simpson button. It's Wednesday. That means I'm solo. I'm by myself. Con er Rogers has the day off, but that doesn't mean we still don't have a great show. We got it all coming to you today. First off, we're gonna bring it with. It's Wednesdays with Warren. We know that he'll be joining us in about a half an hour. He's gonna talk to us a little bit about some of the detackle play throughout football. Quentin Williams Dexter Lawrence. I think being two of the guys he certainly wants to hit on. We're gonna have some talk about the Texans. The Texans. Yes, we know the offenses and good. But what about the defense? Is that as dominant as what we've seen, especially last year? We're gonna break that down. And then we're gonna get to my old buddy or this is going to be the first order of business. We're going to bring on Jason Garrett. My ex teammate, crazy enough. That's what's amazing. My ex team. That's why I know I'm getting old.

2:10Because I was teammates with you and you're old. I just can't believe it. We go way back. And JG, thanks for spending some time with me. I really do appreciate it. Excited to be here, Simsie. How you doing, man? I'm doing good. I am doing good. You know, it's full steam ahead. Football talk here. I don't know if you saw the opening there, right? But I got a kick out of that seeing that on social media where you know, I mean golf in Barkburg now giving quarterbacks a bad name. But the rocket scientists, you know, Josh jobs. He figures out, hey, if you just flip the thing around, we can go and put it on the other side there. So that was pretty funny. No question. There's different kinds of smart Simsie, different kinds of smart. You know, you're right about that. You know, there was a time in my life just while you're on this right now where I thought if you're too smart, you're usually not a good quarterback, right? You're like, you overthink things to a to a degree where it's like, you know, maybe the lesser smart quarterback. Oh, I threw an interception. I can just kind of brush that aside and move on with life. I don't know if that holds true anymore. But there was a thought of that at one point in my life.

3:15You know, there's a great David cutcliffe story about all that and apparently cutcliffe who we all know legendary quarterback guru made Peyton and Eli matting what they are. Right. Has Daniel Jones and many others through the years, but there's a story that he always liked to go out to dinner with the quarterback that it was recruiting. And when the waitress came around to ask what they wanted if the guy was having a hard thinking about, hey, I'm thinking about the fish. What about the chicken? You know, what do you think about the steak? You know, he was like, that's a, that's a red flag. This guy's overthinking it. Yeah. And the legend is Peyton matting sits down and says, hey, no menu. Okay, filet medium like crispy fries. You know, he knows exactly what he wants. Exactly right. I think most quarterbacks are pretty much that way really at their roots, at least the ones I know. But, but all right. So anybody wants to get a Jason, of course, you know Jason, he's on football night in America. He's doing a great job. I miss not being or being with you there this year, buddy. I really do.

4:16Because so we always have a lot of fun. You're the best. You're the best. And then if you want to get at Jason on Instagram, it's at Jason Garrett 1717. Here's, you know what? Something I never asked you through the years. Why number 17? What, what, what was your, what drew you to that number? You know, it goes way back. You know, my dad was a coach in the NFL for a long time. And he coached in Cleveland from 78 to 84. And it was the cardiac kids and Brian Siphon. My older brother was a quarterback. My older brother Jim and he wore 17 and I started playing. I'm like, Hey, I want to wear 17. So I was really copying my brother who was copying Brian Siphon. That's a great story. Yeah. I mean, those those were, that was some good teams right there. The Cleveland Browns. Of course, lost a heart breaker to the Raiders in 80 to where the Raiders ended up going to the Super Bowl and beating the Philadelphia Eagles. All right. So we both have a lot of experience being a backup quarterback. You more than me, right? But that's kind of been the theme of the year so far. You know, when you look at these guys, we got drew lock Carson Wenz, Michael Pennix, James Swinson, Marcus Mario to Case, Keenum, right?

5:21Is there a common thread you see with these guys and why they've been able to at least win or hold down the fort, why the starter hasn't been available? Well, the most common thread, the thing that I think about most is when you're involved in building the team, you better make sure that quarterback room is right. Yeah. Everybody wants the star quarterback who's in his prime. We get that and you go to all ends in the earth to make sure that happens. But creating the right quarterback environment in that room, I think is critical. And I always felt like, hey, you want the guy in his prime, then you want a veteran guy who's played a lot of snaps to be the backup. And then you want a young developing guy. And you have to allocate resources for those. And you can't be afraid to spend too much on them because as we all know, you know, quarterbacks go down as much as we're protecting them in this day and age, you know, they get hurt. And we've seen it a lot here in the first three weeks of the season. So to me, it goes back to building your team in the off season and saying, okay, this position matters to us.

6:24Okay, what's the short term? What's the long term build it the right way? And I think the teams that have have had to go to their backup quarterback. If you look at them, that they've done that. They've chosen guys who are veteran guys who have been around. It's not their first rodeo, as Case Keenum said. These guys have played snaps. And if you look at a few of those guys, the first player taking on the draft or high first round picks who are looking for a restart in their career. So I think it goes to building the team first and foremost. We want the guy in his prime, but you better have other guys. And I always used to laugh at that thing when when when owners or GM's or people in the media would say, hey, you know, if our guy goes down, you know, we're done anyway. That's not the way to build the team. No, that's not the way to build the team. You build the team to handle the different things that come off over the course of a 17 game season at all positions, particularly that one. And even when you do that, there's no guarantee of success, but you better try to do it. And I commend all these guys because you and I both know how hard it is to go into games.

7:33When everybody else had been playing, you haven't played since the preseason, the game feels like it's 100 miles an hour. And right, and you just got to somehow take a breath, take another breath, get the snap, hand the ball off. And I think the other part of it is the guy who's calling the plays, understanding that. You know, you've heard me say this a million times, get the quarterback into the game, right? Get him settled. Get him, you know, make him five for five before he's even thought about anything. Yeah. And he's got his feet up underneath him. He can settle on him playing. Well, we saw that the other night, right? I mean, the common thought was on Monday night case, Keenan, they'll come out, they'll run the ball. They'll make him feel comfortable that way. And Ben Johnson goes, no, not so fast. I'm going to come up with a few easy ways to get him a completion. They won't be expecting that. And he'll feel good about himself that I'm good. I'm going to rip him. I'm three for three here. And I think you're, you got, you know, definitely some merit to the, but you're saying there 100%. Yeah. And you and I both talked about this a lot through the years, but you know, I always go back to the number one trade of a quarterback is instinct. You have to have instincts for the game. And, and each of these guys, I think we really saw in case Keenan, the guy threw for 19,000 yards in college.

8:42Yeah, 19,000 do the math on that. It's hard to imagine. And so you think about the number of drop backs he's had, the number of times you've seen defenses had to react. And there were probably four or five throws in that game the other day where he has a guy right in his face. And he lays the ball over the linebacker into the hole because he's been there a lot. And you see young quarterbacks guys who don't have that experience or that instinct, they take the sack or they run or whatever. And this guy obviously, you know, some of his physical skills have diminished. He's 38 years old, but he has all the rest of it. And that was on display for all of us on Monday. Yeah, totally was. Something I echoed of young kids all the time. You know, I have a son in high school and playing quarterback and even college kids where it's don't always chase going to, oh, I got to be on the best team in the area or the best college. Go somewhere you can play and get reps. Reps are the biggest thing, right? I think we lose sight of that sometimes. It is important. And it's important for your growth that way. And, you know, and back to your point too, with the backup quarterback.

9:45Yeah, there has been teams that have kind of skirted by with that. But man, ask the 49ers. Would they have been what they were last year without Mac Jones to your point or the Vikings two years ago when JJ McCarthy got hurt. Thank God they had Sam Donald. They go 14 and three. So you've got to have that guy. You're right about that. And damn you know, I mean, you had a quarterback that heard his back and Dak Prescott came in and saved the day. And you guys didn't, you guys didn't blink at all. Yeah. And the hardest part about the whole thing is, is salary cap and boy, we need past rushers. We need guys who can cover, we need playmakers. We're really going to pay that guy that much money. Now you've got to be thoughtful about how you're allocating your resources, but your resources have to go to that position. And I always say that you have to be thoughtful about it years ahead, you know, all the legendary stories about the Packers for years draft in a quarterback late. And you know, those guys emerging guys like Mark Brunel or Matt Hasselback or all those guys and that or other guys that they traded, you know, because they became guys that were sought after.

10:46So it's such an important position. We talk about it at nauseam. And I think the resources have to follow that. Anything jump out to you about Drew Locke, whence, James Winston, Mario, you kind of hit on Case Keenam already, but you know, any of those guys in particular that you saw something you liked or you can continue to see them being successful as we go forward here. Well, ultimately it's about winning. And so it's not about this guy throwing for 300 yards. It's okay, the starters out. Okay, you need to be able to come in and the train needs to keep moving. And I've been so impressed with each of these guys, because when necessary, you know, each of them has stepped up and made some big throws, but otherwise they're playing mistake free. Yeah, for Drew Locke to go in up there, he understands what he has. He understands that they got a really good defense. Hey, don't screw it up, but hey, I think he was the leading pastor in the NFL. He was, you know, so he knows who to throw it to throw it to that guy number 11 and it off, play to the defense. And I think each of these guys, his examples of that, I was so pleased with Marcus Mariotta, you think about the ups and downs of his career.

11:54Yeah, you know, a really, really high pick. And then he's not the starter anymore. And he just continues to anytime he gets an opportunity, step up and play. And you know, in the big moments of that game, he made the throws. And then he made, you know, he pulls the zone read on the third set. And he goes and makes the first down and, you know, what a feeling for a guy like that. And you can tell he's so well respected. They made it one of the captains of the team. And, you know, the roof came off of that place when he made that knock off the world chance. It was awesome. It was unreal. First off that he's as fast as he is at that age, still amazed by that. And you know, you brought it up. But I do find it weird. And maybe I'm, you know, Johnny media guy now. But did you find it odd that he was named the captain of the team like for the year as being the back of quarterback? I mean, it's rare that you hear that. And you're an eye history there. There's no question. And teams do the captain thing a lot of different ways. I mean, for years and downs, we're in super balls. We never had captains. We had game captains.

12:57You know, but, but now it's become a much bigger thing. They're putting the sea on guys jerseys and, you know, some teams have 10 captains and whatever. But, you know, it just goes to, I don't know how Dan Quinn is doing it there in Washington. If it's a player vote, if the coaches are involved in it, whatever. But there's no question about he's incredibly well respected guy. Yeah, you can see why. Yeah, you can definitely see why. You know, the case kingdom situation. I want to go back to that just a little bit because we know Tyson Beijing's the backup. And he's a damn good backup. Everything that you kind of talked about already. I mean, he fits that mold. But case kingdom was pretty awesome the other night. I mean, you could tell he was in total control of the offense. I enjoyed that part of him. If you're the bears, what would you do this week? Would you turn the keys back over to Tyson Beijing? Tyson Beijing because he's the backup or would you ride the hot hand of case kingdom and what he did the other night? Well, first off, I agree with what you said. I love Tyson Beijing. Yeah, I love this guy. We've all seen him play really well in the preseason. I've been around him a couple of times in training camp. And he's just, he's everything that the NFL represents to me. Talk about a guy who's earned it. It's a meritocracy. And he's come from from nowhere and said, okay, I'm going to show up at the bears. And I'm going to show you guys that I can play at this level.

14:15And so he's no surprise to anybody. He's just every time he goes out there and plays, he does a really good job for them. I'm a huge fan of that guy. But I think you pull back and you say, okay, what's best for the team? And what might be the best for the team right now is a keep case in there. And I think those are the hard conversations you have to have as a head coach with your players. You know, line one, I used to say it was the first thing out of my mouth, you know, as a head coach with the cowboys, every decision we make is going to be in the best interest of the entire Dallas Cowboys football team period. Right. It's not in the owner's interest. The head coach is interest. The GM's interest. Any coach or player's interest. It's what do we think is best for the team? And so everybody has to understand that. And it doesn't have to be a decision forever. It just might be a decision for now. And what's best for this team right now might to be to keep case in there. I'll tell you what though, I keep ties in Beijing hot because I'm a huge fan of that guy. Yeah, I hear you though, but I lean your your way to stay with the hot hand in case, Keenam, what he did, the teams and I have some belief after that win the other night and how he played. So I'm with you there all the way.

15:24All right, let's go to a guy that I would think the team is wondering a little bit about right now. Drake May, right? I mean, we've seen Drake May play at a level where you go, gosh, that's as good as anybody in the sport, but bleeding into last year's playoffs and into the Super Bowl, what we've seen here this year, it's it's below average quarterback play right now. Right. How do you think Vray book and help fix Drake May or and where he's at right now in this whole situation? You know, it's been an amazing turn of events because again, you and I've talked about this a million times. He was awesome last year. Yeah, I mean, a real heated debate about whether or not you be the MVP of the league and, you know, finally everybody went with staff or I think rightfully so, but he was right there in that conversation because he was off the charts. I mean, a high completion percentage explosive plays made plays with his feet decisions. They made on that they went on that run where they won all those games in a row. And and then when they got to the playoffs, it wasn't as good. And and you know, they're kind of winning with defense and winning different ways and hell, they went to the Super Bowl. So, you know, you got to give him credit for leading the team.

16:30But I think we all know it wasn't great through the playoffs and the Super Bowl and it hasn't been great to start the season by any means and you know, the most important quality really for anybody in life, certainly for football players and absolutely for quarterbacks is a deep down confidence and a belief in yourself. Yeah. And I think when we all watch him play, he just doesn't have that right now. Right. And he's not cutting it loose. He's forcing things. He's not playing naturally. He's not letting the game come to him. All the things that he did throughout last season at such a high level, he's not doing it right now. And you know, you could trace it back to maybe, you know, his arm is hurt. You know, there was a lot of conversation about that last year. What's the health of his shoulder? You know, whatever that is. But I think the biggest thing if you're a coach in this situation, you have to say, OK, how do I get this guy to start believing in himself again? And again, we've talked about this a lot. That's your number one job as a coach is and still believed from your players and nobody does that better than Mike Vraples. So I heard him make a comment after the game, where he said he just has to relax and play.

17:38And there's no question. That's what he has to do. So how do you get him there? Josh is so good with quarterbacks. We all know that. I think the biggest thing is you have to take some burden off of him. Sometimes there's a sense that, you know, I always think about that, that atlas statue in New York right outside of 30 rock. Yeah, you guys got the world on right on his shoulders. And sometimes you feel that way as a quarterback. And your job as a coach is to make sure the guy never feels that way. He goes to line of scrimmage, no one that he's one 11th of the offense and just go do your job. And I think getting a guy like trade got Henderson going will be big for them. Get the tight ends going will be big for them. Get them some easy completions. All those kinds of things. You have some success where okay, before you know what you're six for six, you're eight for eight, you're rolling again. And then all of a sudden your feet get back up underneath you start stepping into throws. But you know, I think a lot of that has to do with some real honest conversations with Drake about what's been good and what hasn't been good. We're not mad at you. We're just saying, hey, this is a standard. It hasn't been there. And then on top of that, the conversations about, hey, what do you really like?

18:45You know, we both been around Drake. I love the kid, not like love. I think he's fantastic. But, but you know, he might be a little bit of those guys that, hey coach, I'm good, whatever you want, call it, call it. I'll make it work. You know, a little bit of that and some of the best guys that we both been around, they say, hell, hell, never call that play again. I hate that play. You know, and it doesn't even have to have a reason for it. But you know, you're looking for that as a play caller. Tell me which ones you want me to put a line through. Yeah. Right. And I think that's part of it. Decide what they've been good at. Dress those things up a lot of different ways. Get him some easy stuff. Get the other guys involved and get him playing with a smile on his face again. Because that's a big part of this thing too. No doubt. All right. So there's the other guy that's under, you know, a lot of scrutiny. And I don't think his playing is poorly as Drake, but Justin Herbert just because of the expectations there. And Mike McDaniel being the new offensive coordinator and all that. You know, now I do think at times the criticism of Justin Herbert goes overboard. I pretty much watched every throw of his through the season so far. Now last week was not his best. And certainly the turnover he had late in the football game.

19:56Where they had a chance to kind of take the control against the Buffalo bills or take control of the game against the Buffalo bills. Go up to scores. He throws a bad interception. But you know, how do you kind of assess that situation and where we are right now? You know, I think it's a little bit of the same stuff. You know, when he's played really well, he gets back and he rips the ball. Yeah. Yeah. And he throws. He can throw it all over the field. He plays with a spirit. He's getting away from people. There's a swagger about him. He has some natural playmaking ability with his arm. You see him make these tough throws under duress. You and I've talked about that one he made in Kansas City. Yeah. A few years ago, like one of the all time great plays I've ever seen in football. So he has that capability. And he's certainly not at that place right now. I think for me, it's a macro thing. Yeah, let's get back to being the kind of team that Jim Harball wants to be. Exactly. He's a tough physical run the ball. Now there's been glimpses of that. They've run the ball well at different times.

20:58You know, Amaria Hampton. I mean, he's a big time player now. So I've always felt like, you know, getting the runners involved helps the quarterback immensely. And, you know, I've been banging the drum for running backs my whole life just because I was around Emmett Smith and saw his pervasive impact. We had to mark Amaria and Z. Kelly, you know, what they do for the quarterback for the receivers because you get run defense for the defense because you possess the ball. All of that. So I think they have to get back to, you know, those offensive line and put their hand in the ground and coming off the ball and hitting people in the mouth. And all of a sudden, it's going to feel more comfortable for him back there. Yeah. And then it's the same thing. It's get him completions, make it easy on him. You know, get him playing with that spirit and that swagger again. It's a long year. We all know the statistics about one, three teams and making the playoffs, all that stuff. But hey, we're still in September. Take a breath, get back to doing things are capable of doing, take some pressure and burden off of this guy, become a physical team. And I think they can start to turn the things around.

21:58Yeah. I'm with you. That's kind of something I've said over the last two days. I mean, first off, like we always kind of talk about, hey, follow the assets, follow your money. We've got two top 10 tackles. They got a second round center. They got a first round right guard. They got a first round running back. They should be able to run the football and be more effective that way to help out the whole situation. But another little nuance I just want to ask you about here that, you know, I'm kind of like fascinated with the modern day NFL. Because you and I grew up and, you know, as I stated, you're a little older than me, but we still grew up in the same era of football where, you know, Bill Wash was all over Joe Montana. Bill Parcells was all over Phil Sims. Jimmy Johnson wasn't throwing pedals, rose pedals at Troy Ackman's feet and doing any of that. We know Bella check was hard as hell on Tom Brady. Do you ever get the sense a little bit with Harbaugh and Vrable that the just the effusive praise and just the always this is the greatest human we've ever seen on the planet.

23:00Do you think that helps them or the situation or the locker room in that like I'm curious just to hear what you think about that. Well, those are two fantastic coaches and their track record speaks for itself. So they know their team and their player better than I do. Yeah, so I want to be careful about comment and too much on that. I will say this though. I think in this day and age with so much scrutiny with social media and everybody has an opinion and it's so immediate. I think sometimes coaches and rightfully so are very protective of their players publicly. I certainly was. I thought that was an important thing. They don't need to hear me standing in a podium ripping them and sometimes you as a head coach people say, oh, I just wish he. Well, it's more important for me to protect the team and protect the player than to satisfy the guy who asked me the question in the third row. So that that was an important thing for me. So I understand that approach. The thing that has to happen though is when you get in the quarterback room, when you get in the offensive meeting room, when you get in the team meeting room, you have to coach the player just like you coach everybody else.

24:06Yeah, right. What that means is when they do it, well, you say, hey, this is what we're looking for. Look at this guy drops back. There's a guy in his face. He delivers a strike on a third and seven. This is how you play quarterback in the NFL or he misses the read or he misses the hot or he missed. There's a miss idea the Mike linebacker and he gets hit in the back of the head as a result of it. Hey, communication is critical identification. How we do, you know, you just have to hold them to a standard when it's good, tell them what it's good. When it's when it falls short of that, you know, he has to know that individually and he has to know that and that has to be brought up in front of the team. And the best guys that I've been around, that's what they did and maybe at the time is a quarterback. You don't love it. But the best quarterback coaches we've been around, nor have turned, it was incredible for me and for Troy and for everybody else there. And he's the guy that we're still incredibly close with to this day. We go to his daughter's wedding. All of that because he made such a difference in our lives because you never got the ball out quick enough. Yeah, it always could be two inches in front of the guy. You always could lay it a little bit more. You always could, you know, all of that.

25:11He was always pushing you and never put in a ceiling on you. He always wanted to fight through that and be your best. And in house, you have to coach that position like that, just like you would any other position. Yeah, great answer there. That was a great answer. All right. So let's I want to go a little closer to your home. I don't know right now if you're in Dallas or not there for sure. But but we know and I got to ask you because you've been in that seat before and and been the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys. The way the game ended the other night. You know, I know you were getting ready for something at football and you're in the middle of the show. So I know you didn't get to watch it live. But you know, of course a big part of the talk is the way they handle the last play with Lamar hitting the big pass down the field. And then some of the clock management stuff there when Dallas had the ball inside the 10 yard line and leaving too much time for Lamar to make a play like that. You know, so you know, having a few days, you know, take us into what it's like to be the Dallas Cowboy head coach in those situations. And you know, how did you think shot and heimer handled that all together?

26:12Well, you know, all the stuff we're just talking about with the quarterback. That applies to coaching too. Yeah, right. You was a head coach or coordinators in all three areas or position coaches. So you have to just pull back and evaluate it. We used to do an after action report, a feedback report and that you know, regardless of when or loss on Monday, you'd say, what did we do well? What didn't we do well? What what critical mistakes did we make? If we play this team again, what we do differently, all of that. So you just have to go back unemotionally and say what was good? What wasn't good? And I think if you look at the end of the game in all three phases, you would say, huh, maybe that wasn't our best. You get the ball in the one yard line in the opportunity to end the game. You know, you think about the play calling sequence. What we're going to run there, whatever that miscommunication was between DAC and Brian about the fade throw all of that. I think you just have to pull back and say, boy, that was an opportunity to go ahead and score touchdown. They get the big break with the interference. You're right there. So you have to pull back on that. I definitely think if you have the special teams play over again, you don't kick a touch back and give the ball on the 35 yard line.

27:22You know, you try to kick it in the landing zone. You certainly get somebody to touch it and you'll wind the clock there and maybe you don't even have to play the next down. Or if you do, you certainly don't have enough time to throw a 30 yard in cut and bang a time out. And the last part for me is on defense. I was not a big fan of playing some version of cover one. Right. You know, mandamand coverage of single high defense in that situation. It just it just too hard to cover guys. You get a guy like Zay flowers, he runs up, he runs in, the defender has no chance. And Lamora was fantastic. He laid the ball over the underneath coverage. Zay was fantastic. It was a great route. He catches it goes down immediately. They bang a time out. Baltimore's execution was fantastic. What I would say what we talked about after the game is you play some sort of a picket fence type defense where you line the guys up. Yeah. Okay, where can you where can you make this kick from? Right. Okay, you line the guys up through four yards in front of that line. You play with them with eyeballs on the quarterback and anything that complete underneath it, you rally tackle.

28:26You know, you're going into overtime. So I think for me in that situation, that's what you want to play. But, but you know, Devon and I talked about it for a while. Devon McCordy, who was obviously with the Patriot teams through a lot of successful years, super bowl years. And nobody works on, you know, end of game situations more than Bill Bellichek's Patriots. And they did it better than anybody. But even a team like that, they had the Miami Miracle. Yeah, right. Right. Right. They had the situation in Vegas where they're throwing the ball and the guys running out of bounds. Yeah. That whole crazy ass play. Yeah. So, you know, as much as you work on it and coaches work on it at nauseam, you walk through this stuff. And then they talk about it. I can't tell you how much time and attention goes into it. Sometimes when you get in those situations, you know, you screw them up. Yeah. You don't handle them as well as you need to handle them. And nobody, nobody is immune to those situations. So the big thing for them is learn from it and move on. Yeah. No, I hear you. And that to me was the peculiar thing. You're right.

29:30Just a button up that subject was they cover one. And it's almost like they played it like they thought they were going to throw it short. They throw a hail Mary not thinking they could throw a deep in cut. And that was that was the backwards part of that situation. Yeah. Crazy. Yeah. All right. Last one I want to ask you here. You know, you were you were on the field. Rams Broncos Sunday night. Right. I'd love to just hear your kind of assessment of of both teams going forward. Did that game make you feel any better or worse about either one of them? They both got tough games this week. The Broncos got the 49ers. The Rams got the Eagles. Yeah. I still love the Rams team. Yeah. Let's go back. The Australia trip. However, that was handled. Let's let's throw that one away. They came back and really dominated the Giants. They were they were pretty dominant in the first half the other night. And then and then they just weren't able to sustain it offensively. And then certainly on the defensive side Denver started making some plays. You got to remember the Pukin to Koo is out. Yeah. So you know, they creatively have been using a lot of 13 personnel.

30:34But when Devon Tays out there and Pukas out there and those tight ends and those runners, you know, it's still September. I think they're they get better and better and better as they go. The quarterback is still playing great. Couple of tough throws the other night. But you know, I bet on that guy every day of the week. You know, the atmosphere was challenging for them. The past rushes challenging for them. I credit Denver for making some adjustments on offense to get themselves going. I think you and I both know that Bonix is best when he's moving and get him out of the pocket. A little bit like we've been talking about with all these quarterbacks. Give him some easy throws. We saw that in the game the week before against Jacksonville. The second half they did more of that. I think whenever you get him a chance to get out of the pocket, get him moving. I think he's going to be better and whether that happens spontaneously or you design those things. And so then they start to get a little momentum. The crowd starts to get into it. And they start making a lot of plays. And you know, when you go to that stadium and the crowd gets going.

31:36It's past rush. They got their hand on the ground. It becomes hard on those offensive linemen. And they can make some disruptive plays. And that's what they're able to do in the game. I still think they're finding their way on offense in Denver. Yeah. I still think it's, you know, what is this? And, you know, I've talked to Sean Payton a lot through the years. And one of the things that he always talks about is, you know, it can't be a high wire act for the quarterback. You can't go to the line of scrimmage every time and have to make the IDs and change the play and then do this and do that. Sometimes you got to get under center, call a play and run it. And I think giving him some chances to take a breath and kind of use his physical skills. Not always his, his, his mental skills at the line of scrimmage trying to get into the right thing will help him going forward. I think when they've had most success this year, they've done that. Yeah. Yeah. It's going to be interesting to see where that goes because I think that's going to be one of those, you know, microscope situations Davis Web, Sean Payton, where that continues.

32:37But hey, we're talking about the other day that, you know, sometimes if you look at them on the sidelines, Sean's 20 feet away from them. And then what's not going so well is 15. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of feels it. Yeah. That's right. Well, we got to, we got to watch for that one day where Davis is like this. And Sean comes in and goes, give me that. I'm going to call the boys. Sean's got that big Sean got that big call sheet too. So, you know, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I know he needs the reading glasses now. He's got to have it all going there. Hey, you the man Sunday night lions at Panthers. You can see JG there on football night in America. That starts at 7 p.m. Also been loving your coach to coach with Jason Garrett. I mean, that's been pretty damn cool. I mean, really great idea by you. You got a new, new episode every week YouTube.com. It's at coach to coach podcast, wherever you download your podcast. Check out JG. Everybody loves JG. He's the man. Right. You're the man. You're, you're greatness. I still up doing is it? Has he spent in the wrong? He's doing all right. He got, he got a little banged up in his first.

33:40Two games, but he's playing some varsity football and learning that, you know, hey quarterback ain't that easy all the time. You're going to hit some bumps in the road. Here's one thing. It's a lock. I'm bet not. I appreciate that. I'll tell him that I'll let him know. Please do. All right. You're the man. All right, Jason. I'll talk to you. All right, everybody. When we come back after the break here, we'll go to break. And oh, yeah, we want sat. We want sat number 99, the QB killer coming to Chris Sins unbutton right after this break. Someone's moving on. Someone's going home. The MLB wild card series presented by FV again September 29th on NBC and P. Cock.

34:46Oh, there he is. Hey, it's Wednesdays with Warren, which means we don't know where the hell he's at today. What he's doing one week. He's outside a restaurant or an amusement park. Another time he's in the car and here he is today. The cock, the crocodile killer. He went from QB killer to crocodile killer right there. No, you know what you up north boys? Oh, no, that's a Florida. That's a Florida. K. The baby. You're right. I'm in the, you're exactly right. I just took the only thing you could tell me. So I got it. So we're right when we want to be baby. So we're right. We want to be with one thing with Warren. You know what time it is. I know. So when did you get into this? I didn't really realize this was something that you did from time to time. I did not know that about you. You know what me? You mean you better part from each other too long. I got away from the game. It got some real free time. I do like the hunt fishing. Do all the things that are affordable outside really likes to do. I mean, just I'm just gonna do this for you. Yeah, do it. I don't have to like it. Oh man. Wow. All right. So what, what will you do? What will you do with that crocodile? I'll get the alligator now. What will you do? I just told you I just took the only thing out of Lake Okeech, Ochovi that you will eat. I'm gonna get the cheeks, the tail and the arms and legs. Yes, we're gonna have a sabbathe to you as I know. Okay. All right. That's good. You know, it's funny that you're on this because I was going to start the show with asking you about the time.

36:12My parents dog bitch you right when you came in the house. I was gonna start with that. And then of course you got an animal right next to you that would bite you too. So I think that fits perfectly. I'm telling you. I'm telling you he was still breathing. Okay. All right. All right. Well, that's cool. All right. So let's get into some detacletalk. Um, because you you're passionate about it. You've sent me a few things over the last two weeks. About just little ideas with guys and what you're watching. I think the first one to hit on a little bit because a lot of people are talking about how poorly the defense is playing in Dallas right now. Quinn and Williams got traded from the Jets got there. They gave him the big new contract. It ain't been good so far. I know that. So what what are we looking at? You can see it. Yeah. And they gave me a teammate that I think I heard of Anthony McFarlane say might be the best tackle combination in the league at one point. No. Quinn Richardson is out of his cab. I mean almost a place for play. You can just watch the one from this week. Yeah. First play the game is on the ground. Right.

37:20Third play on the game. They don't even block him. He's looking around like where's the ball in any season and then dives and Mr. Tacolines on the ground. I'm like two out of the first three plays you on the ground. And one of them didn't even block him and you don't make a play and then the thing that kills me on the goal line. So all D line is moving to the left. You know how you just take the next gap. So they take the next gap and the guy reaches him and then he tries to fight and crosses his face. Any cuts his line back off who I mean, me and Brooks had a rule. If I go a I'm standing you take me. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Since how it goes is a jigsaw puzzle. And he's trying to make too many plays. I think that's what it's problem is he trying to make too many plays. And I got to miss it for all defensive tackles out there because I'm watching a bunch of yeah, I'm trying to make $30 million players that aren't doing nothing for the football team. Right. Get in your gap. Be gap responsible and then rush to pass. Yeah, because you cannot rush the pass and teach to stop the ring game. Right. And William and Phil teams are realizing no one wants to tackle right. We go ahead and stay off. Yeah, you're right about that. You know, so I want to ask

38:23you your assessment on this with Quinn and Williams because he's never he came from the jets, which ran that, you know, Robert Salas, Seattle three and they just kind of want a one gap. Shoot the gap. Now he's playing for Christian Parker who came from Philadelphia with Vic Fangio. We don't know what the hell he running. Yeah, either with his 34 year last. Okay, we know he can't cover the flats when he was in New York. So this is the working product. Yeah, but the thing you can do as a difference of tackle Chris. Yeah, it's called havoc within the system. Right. That's what I used to do because money keeping one let me just do whatever I want to do. And Tony Dongey was definitely not going to have it and rooting deaf. Oh my god, I would I wouldn't want to deal with him. You know, it's so I was going to cause havoc within the confines of my defense by getting three yards deep in the backfield, tripling the run on my way to the quarterback. That's never going to change about football. The quarterback is three, five, maybe not seven anymore, but when they get in the gun to go pretty deep. Yeah, yeah, and I'm watching quarterback just step up in the pocket, step up in the pocket, step up in the pocket, step up in the

39:28loop. People step up through deep balls. Oh my god, that's all on the defense attack. I'm watching Vita Vega in a three technique on third down. What the hell? Yeah, what's he going to do out there? He was widening hours in a three technique. All right. Where's he going? Is there is there some merit for a guy like Quinn and Williams who comes from like that one gap system and then maybe gets to ask like, is there a big adjustment when all the sudden, maybe you're asked a two gap at times and do that stuff. No, if you ask the two gap, you're still only one gap to make the tackle, because the back Yeah, yeah, that's just holding this gap shit and going across point Richardson is pretty strong enough to do that. What I'm telling you about on the go line, he was going across his face, but you can't do that on the go line. You want to penetrate and shoot bullets at him, where now I can't go that way, because someone's there right. I want to teach all of you out there in America, running backs do not run today like they like everywhere. We run to color. That's why it's a dark and like run the way your color is you're safe. That's true. That you're right. There is daylight everywhere. That's a very good. Look at you being

40:37Aristotle. I don't run a daylight. I like. All right. So I want to talk to you about Dexter Lawrence, because I feel like as a whole, he's been pretty good, but last week was maybe not as best, but I want to show before you comment. I want to show you some of these plays. I don't know if you saw this last week against the Steelers, where they have some screenshots here. And I know it's hard, because you're out in Lake Okeechobee next to some gators. Oh, no, no, no, no, I trust me. Trust me. Trust me. But I see it, but they've had some issues. The bucks week one. Yeah. Yeah. So in this one, though, they had some plays here, where I don't know if you could see Dexter in the middle there. The left guard is picking his leg up. And he did this a few times during the game. But this one was probably the most egregious one. I mean, this should be definitely holding. But have you ever seen that really to that extent right there where you lifting it up? Hold on, Chris. Hold on, Chris. When we consider holding is when you're restricting me from going somewhere. Yeah.

41:38You're lifting me and taking me where you want to go. We call that and lifting as Jack and cargo mail and all that good stuff. That is a good block by him. Dexter, big sexy. You want to do something about that boy? What's your leg doing up that height anyway? Well, I, so I'll push back against you. So these are some of them. He's getting double team. And the guard goes low and doesn't try to block him. He literally lifts the leg up, right? And and just so you know, we did check with Terry McCauley and send them our referee here at NBC. And he thought he says that's clearly should be holding. But so I'm going to tell you this. Yeah. Okay. Move the referee. Right. From the middle of the field to the backs. Well, we all speak back there with the referee. Yeah. I'm putting the referee back there. Trust me. When you're taking the fact that on his way and he's going to it. They can't see that. Yeah. That's the problem. I think you're exactly right. Yeah. He's taking him way one. He's not restricting him. Chris. If he had his leg and he was trying to go that way and he was pulling his leg the other way, now that's holding. Yeah.

42:43But I picked you up like jumping gathers. God bless you. So you support the guards. Pick them up and take them to the quarter back. What are you going to call defensive holding on that one? Did you ever have that? Did you ever try to do that to you? Where they were like a like a thing during the game. Yeah. Don't throw rocks at the front. I said it's wrong. I took on Larry Allen and random and Daniel every day of practicing. I have no problem with the best you have. I want the best you have. Yeah. I want both of them and I'm going to split them and go find and run them back and go get the quarter back. I think my resume speaks for itself. You got enough tape over there. Yeah. Jersey. You know what I said. Look at them. See if they got any of that. All right. I know it's a bad night with Ben Coleman and Jacksonville in 98. But other than that, I'm good. All right. Good. All right. But I call that night. I'm making it an excuse. But he woke me that night. That's good. That's good to hear it. I like that. You just own up to it. I mean, damn, even the great ones is to lose a battle. Sometimes the bad you.

43:45Yeah. So what was your assessment overall, the of Dexter, you know, through three games? Because like I said, I thought the first two games are pretty good. I want to know what the fascination is. What a man that had a half a second 17 games. I just don't know. Yeah. What is the dance in the dance section? I mean, I know you'll be got with a little bit of, you know, hip movement or whatever. But I don't see it on Sunday. Yeah. They clays on Sunday. Right. Yuck. New York will beat you up in a great way. New York will break you down in a great way. Yeah. That's true. Now Cincinnati will definitely break you in a whole different way. All right. Well, I feel like right now you're you're our resident Aaron Donald expert too. I mean, the two greatest 99s, maybe in the history of the sport. No, no, no, don't leave JJ White and Mark Casano. You're right. You're right. That's what I'm saying. Hampton another hall of fame. Yeah. Okay. I love it. Yeah. You're right. I won't leave him now. I know they're great. I was. Gregg Skis still living. I mean, come on. Oh, yeah. You're right. Look at you.

44:45I know. I know. I know. Bad ass. No, no, no. Apparently, many many remebered. It's worth a little bit too. So trust me, it's a bad. Yeah. You're right. Yeah. Look at it. But Aaron Donald. Yeah. Getting a little looser, but the thing I have an issue with Aaron, it was 16 nothing. Yeah. You didn't start the second half of that football game. Didn't got the third down. You entered yourself in the game. Had a little okay rush with a little spin and whatever. But the next five, the next five plays when the uh, yeah, Franco's. Yeah. After fall on the plus 42 yard line. Right. I'm looking right. Wait a minute. They're on the plus territory. You got a two-score game right here. Big boy. Where you at? And that's played 25 26 27 28 29 and 30. He was nowhere to be found on football field with your team up. And then when he got in, it was a third and one where he couldn't help him. And then it was gold lining. He was out again. Yeah. Listen, when you build a 16 point lead on the football team on the road, you need your defenders in that turn in the back.

45:45Back over the Sean Payton and that, I mean, uh, Sean McFan in that office because I promise you Sean Payton's got a plan and we watched it. Touchdown two-point conversions. Yeah. Eight to 16. You just cut your lead half. And now he's coming with momentum and you're not even in the game, but on your own plan, 52% of the plays, you might want to play when you were hit when they trying to come back and then put a foot on the neck and then you can sit out the fourth quarter. And when you up 20, something like that for the other night, you know, you make a great point there because I, I, I, I, you brought it up to me and I was kind of like, damn wait. Yeah, 16, nothing. That kind of seems like the time that you definitely would want them in. You feel like they're going to throw the ball. You know, you just get out the rocket. Right. Do you think that's a him thing or the Rams though? Do you know what I mean? Hey, listen, they play Hollywood. You know how they do out there? You know, say this fool food, all glorious. Then the second half showed up and everybody wanted to sit around and watch. Yeah. No, it's from a work to be done. It's a 30-month-old minute football. And I found that a little strange that he was out of the game that long.

46:45Yeah. Especially when he came on the plus side of the field. I mean, it's time for you big dogs to go to work. But he ain't big dog in the mode. He just spot. He spot playing. We're going to call him spot until we do. Since we actually know how to. Oh, you're crazy. You're crazy. You are crazy. Yeah. That's true. Oh, you did that long time ago, but we're going to call him spot because that's what he's doing. He spot playing right now. Look for spots that he can make a play. No, you got to get in the meat grinder, young man. And go. If you got it, you got it. And guess what? It doesn't get any easier as the season gets longer. Yeah. It gets tougher because he come to division games. Here come your place in the playoffs. And hey, first three weeks, you ain't put yourself in a good position anyway. So now you got to play from behind the eight ball and hope Miles Garrett come back with something left. Yeah. Or something that they thought he had. Right. Right. Yeah. No, they go to Philly this week. That'll be a big game as we know because the Eagles are going to. Yeah. Eagles are going to be pissed off with the way they played for sure. They're going to run the ball. They go get back to that run game. We got to wait. And why does they want to have a cowboy column? I don't know either. That's a good

47:49question. 2026. What are we doing? I think he had a stinger before that. I think that's what it was. I think the week before he got a stinger. And no help. Yeah. That'll help. Look at you. You're playing doctor. You're playing coach today. You're doing it all. Oh, no, no, no. This is all between the 120 by 53 and a third. I know exactly what helps you on that football. And that cowboy column has been going a long time. All right. All right. All right. Doctor. Sap. He has spoken. It's Wednesdays with Warren. He's in Lake Okeechobee. He's killing Gators and doing his thing. You the man. Seriously. I love you. I love you. You the man. Thanks for Wednesdays and Warren as always. You the man. We'll talk to you next week. And again, we'll go to break here. Warren's Sap. Always awesome. Always passionate. And you could tell again, Warren's watches sports all the time. We'll take one last break. We're going to come back and talk about the Texans defense a little bit. We'll see you here in a few minutes on Christmas.

49:05To prove it all over again. Someones moving on. Someones going home. The MLB Wild Card Series presented by Fee begins September 29th on NBC and Peacock. As much as you may want it to be each year is never the same. So we're still building like who will the 2026 Texans be become right in. So a little adversity that we're going through but adversity is going to build that character. It's that strength that you need. The resolve that you need to continue to push through the season. This is where we are right now. But that's not who we're becoming. Like we are becoming a good team. We just got to go out and show it. We got to go out and finish and we have the right guys to do it. All right. We're back here at Christensen Button. I love that first off that background there behind Demiko Ryan's. But but you know, the problem is there is yeah, they got a team and what they're

50:07becoming. It just might be too late to get you know back into the picture here while you're trying to become the team. You think you're trying to become. It's been strugglesville as we know. That's why I want to break this down a little bit here. There's there's some stuff to talk about. You know, and I we got a comment here right off the bat from it's at three Lank SP underscore CE at blank space. Right. I guess it is that that I'm reading it verbatim there. And he makes the very witty joke of the Houston Texans offense can lose the game completely by themselves. But what about their defense? And that's what we're here about. But yes, he's saying that because he's heard me say for the last two years, the Houston Texas defense can win a game almost by themselves. And right now, listen, I think there's a lot of things we can we can break down. First off, the offense is part of the problem. There's no doubt about that. This is a complete team full game. So I think just at a basic level when the you know, you can't ever get this defense in a position of power. And you're off the field basically every three or four plays and they got to go back in

51:12there. One, they're going to wear down. They're never in a position where they have the lead to where they can go. Ooh, let's unleash the past rush and really play the style we want to play. And then I also think on top of that, there's a there's pressure on the Texans defense. I feel like in all three games, I've seen some play calls on the defensive side where I'd go. They're trying to make a play to get a turnover and help the team out rather than just playing the situation and playing the right defense. They know their offense isn't going to create something. So they're trying to get the defense to create something. And that of course can be an issue, right? So here's some of the things I think that jump out to us. One, you know, they can pressure the quarterback. We know that. They can do that. And as we sit here right now, they got more sacks, right? As far as their sack rate compared to last year, but the pressure rate is down. And you see completion percentages way up. And yards per attempt is way up. And that's why I'm a little scared that this is not the same thing we saw last year. One, I think the offense is worse than it was through the first three weeks

52:15this year compared to last year. And the defense is that as well, right? There's been plays to be had in all three games where they could have created turnovers. They dropped in interception late to win the game against the Buffalo Bills. Josh Allen. There's a touchdown pass a player to later. There's been a lot of that even in the games this past weekend. There was probably two or three plays where they could add interceptions on Danny Dimes. They hit the ball, ball popped in the air and they couldn't make the play. So there has been that. Now one of my things here that I when I break them down and let's go right to the screenshots here. One thing I don't like, I think they rush five too much. All right. I do. They got the greatest bass rush duo in football right now. There's no need to rush five as much as they do. The other thing they do, I think a little too much is they rush four or maybe rush five. And then if the guys that are covering them, the covering certain like tight ends or backs, they see them blocking. They add on and it becomes more people rushing. But to me, it's like pointless because I go, wait, he's going to rush two seconds after the snap. And now

53:16he's not even going to get there to the quarterback. And yet now there's a bigger void down the field to throw the football. Like don't waste your time. Keep them in coverage. But here's the big thing. You see here, this is an interception. Okay. By Daniel Jones. And what did they do? They rushed four and they played seven in coverage. So they got basically guys unlocked down with two guys free roaming in the middle of the field. But here's my point is the pass rush gets there. It hits Daniel Jones as he's throwing. It's an easy interception. We don't need to rush five and six as much as the Houston Texans do. You go to the strip sack. Later on in the football game. I'm going to show you once again here again. It's another one. You see the screenshot here? Go ahead, Pete. Let's go to the next picture. You'll see it's rushing four and making the quarterback go, wait, hold on. Nobody's open. There's a lot of people in coverage. What do I do here? That little extra pat of the ball allows Will Anderson and Daniel Hunter to get there. So that to me has been two things that just definitely jump out to me. The other thing I'll say, and I said this a little bit about the

54:19sense of that he bangles yesterday. But I don't think they're making the quarterback think too much. That would be another problem. It's pretty basic. The coverage is they line up in it. There's not much disguise. So even though the defense is awesome, the cubie kind of knows what he's facing pre snap and in 2026. That's a great advantage. All right. So that's the Houston Texas and the X's and those file. That was a Sims breeder film. But tomorrow we're back Thursday. Connor Rogers is here 11 a.m. YouTube NBC sports YouTube page. My man to white Smith. You guys have been asking for one of my best buddies to pick six in the Super Bowl. He'll be joining us tomorrow. See you next time on Christmas on Bud. Six months 162 games and entire season earning your place. Then the wild card arrives. Just when you proved you belong, you have three days to prove it all over again.

55:20Someone's moving on. Someone's going home. The MLB wild card series presented by Fee begins September 29th on NBC and Peacock.