Does Trump's Energy Ceasefire Actually Exist?

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1:02saving you time, headaches and serious money. Stop paying for missing pieces. Go to Odo.com. That's oddo.com to learn more. Hello, I wasn't as plugged into the news as normal over the weekend. And so on Sunday night, I was really quite bamboozled about this so-called energy ceasefire between Ukraine and Russia that had potentially been brokered by Donald Trump. Or at least announced by Donald Trump on his social media. So I thought I would gather together some wise people in London, Kiev and Washington DC who could inform and educate me about what it is and crucially what it isn't and whether it even exists. So that is what you will get on this episode of Newscast. Newscast. Newscast from the BBC. Humanity's next great voyage begins. I don't know the prime minister is my dear. I'm Andy and I'm not looking my best right now. I see that he was just a miracle down. Oh, no, no. Thinking about it like a pan-toe helped. And what will you do? Stir it all up.

2:02Do we play music now? What will we do? Hello, it's Adam in the Newscast studio. And over the weekend, Donald Trump announced on social media that he had negotiated a ceasefire between Ukraine and Russia. But it wasn't a total cessation of all hostilities. It was just attacks by each other on each side's energy infrastructure. This came as news to the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelensky, who said he hadn't signed up to it. And it also seemed like news to the Russians too. And there is no text or details or footnotes or printout of this so-called ceasefire. Because it doesn't seem to exist. So what actually is going on? We're joined down the line by Dan Johnson, who's our correspondent in Kiev. Hi, Dan. Hello. I'm just explaining the environment you're in because it's quite noisy. Yeah, I'm just on one of the streets in a cave, suburb, and that noise is the soundtrack to winter here, really. And it tells you that Ukraine's power problems have already started, even before the temperatures have dropped. And they are ongoing, despite what Donald Trump announced yesterday.

3:05That noise is diesel generators, which are supplying some of the shops here during one of the pre-planned power outages. So different neighborhoods have had a rolling program for the last week or 10 days of about three or four hours a day without electricity. Some of the shops and businesses are fortunate. They've got the generators so that they can keep the lights on. Business can keep happening. The homeowners, those who are living in the apartment above the shops, they're not so lucky. They've got nowhere to put a generator or they can't afford to fuel one. So they are in the cold, they are in darkness. And some of them are having to cope without water as well, because they need electricity to pump water up the many floors of that building. So that's what people have been enduring already. They knew it was going to get worse through this winter, because Russia would keep hammering the power network here. So that's why people are hopeful that what Donald Trump announced yesterday, even though it came about in very strange circumstances, maybe a positive move that's going to help them get through winter. Okay, lots to discuss. And also with us here in the studio is James Landale, diplomatic correspondent. Hello, James.

4:05Hello, Adam. You've got to keep quite regularly. Does this winter and that picture that Dan was painting there sound like just that's what winter is like in Ukraine these last few years or do you think we're in new territory? When you're in Kiev and even outside, there's a sort of constant debate about how pessimistic or optimistic you're going to be about the winter, because as you say, this is the fifth winter of this war, they've all been pretty terrible. The concern this time is on several levels. One is that Ukraine was hit really hard last time, last winter, has Ukraine done enough to repair, to fix, to prepare for this time round. So there's a sort of practical question. There's also a sort of psychological question. If you talk to people in Kiev, they'll admit openly that they're still traumatized by last war. And there's a sort of lingering fear of, you know, have we got enough strength, mental strength to see it through this time. And then there's just this third fear, which is, you know, what exactly the Russians are going to do with or without the Americans help this time

5:09in terms of not just hitting energy facilities, but actually, as we've seen since the end of August, throughout September, the direct targeting of Kiev itself, the trains, the buses, the bridges, the tubes, the border positions, all of that coming together. And the question is, what impact is that going to have? Some people will say, look, Ukraine will be tough, but they'll soldier on. Others, if you talk to some diplomats, they will say, look, the worst case scenario is population flight that actually some of the cities become unlivable, because there's no electricity, there's no heating, there's no suit. And it's not just a few people leaving, but large numbers. And then it becomes a substantial problem. That point you made about the strikes on Kiev is so interesting, because I hadn't quite clocked it for the last few months actually, are the geography of the conflict in our language has changed. We're talking about different places. We used to talk about the fortress bell in the east and the front line.

6:12And actually we've not been talking about that for a while. We've been talking about places like Kiev, which used to seem a bit not untouchable, but less touched by the conflict. Also joining us on the line, my podcasting partner from the global story is Asma Khalid. Hello. Hi there. Asma, can you just tell us how Donald Trump then rolled out this idea of a so-called energy ceasefire over the weekend? Yes, well, I mean, there's a lot he's announced over the last couple of days, but to your point, he announced this as he does many things over true social. And the backdrop to all of this atom is that on Friday, he announced something that surprised a number of folks here in Washington. He announced this agreement with Russians to release a sizeable amount of diesel. I believe it's 300,000 tons of diesel. Immediately, he said to the global market place, followed by another several hundred thousand tons. And the reason Adam that caught so many people by surprise here is that it came on the heels of a Russia sanctions bill that was passed on a bipartisan basis by Congress, a bill that was signed into law just a few weeks ago by President Trump

7:15to try to put restrictions on Russian oil and increase sort of pressure on Russians, essentially, to come to the table for some sort of ceasefire. Then we see that Donald Trump announced this deal with the Russians for diesel. And that to me is sort of what happened. That was the precursor to all this. That was on Friday. We see a number of Republican and Democratic senators over the weekend put pressure on this White House to say, hey, hey, why are you doing this? Isn't this in contradiction to the very Russia sanctions law? You just passed, Mr. President, a couple of weeks ago, we then see him announce also this plan, as we say, for an energy ceasefire, also telling reporters that he wants to possibly see another leader in charge of Ukraine. It's a comment he has made many times, suggesting that Volodymyr Zelensky ought to be ousted as the leader of their new Ukraine. So a lot has transpired in just the last 72 hours. Yeah, and Dan, I know you don't have a lot of time in this episode, so I will do a quick fire around with you then. So the Ukrainian reaction, first of all, to the deal on diesel that was announced first.

8:17Oh, they were furious. They felt they'd been betrayed once again by Donald Trump. Frankly, a lot of Ukrainians have given up any hope of Donald Trump treating them fairly. They're beyond disappointment with the sort of move he makes. The number of times that he favors Vladimir Putin over Vladimir Zelensky and the sort of slapdowns that he's given to their president, tend to unite them behind their president, actually. And I think we've seen that again. I've been questions about Zelensky's decisions and strategy at times, but in this they will support him. And they are now hoping that, however, this deal came about, this ceasefire, that it can have a positive impact, because they desperately need that relief on their energy network. They already know how desperate that could be. So if there is to be a ceasefire deal that is workable, at least in terms of the energy infrastructure, then that will be welcomed. But certainly there's a huge amount of skepticism about whether the Russians will stick by it. And Dan, I was going to say Zelensky seems to be in two minds about this. On the one hand, he is quite up for an energy ceasefire,

9:20but on the other hand, he doesn't seem to think one exists or will ever exist. No, I mean, he's made clear that he was taken totally by surprise when Donald Trump announced this. I think it must have been in discussion in the background, because we're told over the weekend that the Americans were actually putting pressure on the Ukrainians to sign up to this, threatening that their weapons and their access to intelligence would be caught if they didn't. But clearly, Zelensky hadn't agreed at the point Donald Trump announced it, but he seems to have taken the high ground. He wants to be the good guy. He's going to be the honest broker and says, well, this is what I wanted. I will go along with it. I will respect it. I hope that Russia will do the same. And I hope that America will apply pressure on Vladimir Putin to ensure that those attacks on the energy network do now stop, so that my people can get through the winter without freezing. But the early signs are not great. They already saw attacks on power stations again last night. And that's why we've still got regions of the country that are without power. It's why these generators are continuing to run right now. Dan, thank you very much. I know you've got to go off and do some other things.

10:20So stay safe. And James, each side has got a different view of what energy means. What we talk about in energy ceasefire. Oh, absolutely. Because for Russia, energy is about providing enough cheap fuel for its own population. It's about revenues of foreign currency. Whereas in Kiev, energy is about survival. It's existential. It's about whether or not the heating is going to be on. You've got to remember that in Kiev, still vast amounts of the heating is centralized. In other words, the heating gets... If you live in a tower block, as many people do, your heating gets turned on at a certain date of the year, and they vary. And at that the point that the heat is physically pumped into your building, and then it goes around your building. And if suddenly the generators go down, and there is no heat provided, that means the entire building is shut down. It's cold. And that means you can't sort of go into a neighbor's house

11:20to get warm or you can't sort of, you know, localize some kind of heat. And so it matters immensely to the Ukrainians, in a way that it's less existential for the Russian side. But to the Ukrainians, energy means their energy infrastructure like power plants, power lines, other forms of energy generation. But to Russia, it means ceasing Ukrainian attacks on their oil refineries, basically, doesn't it? So we're talking about different things here. Correct. Correct. But do we know if the energy ceasefire would cover all of those things, or just some of that? I mean, I think... I mean, as I'm putting you on the spot here... Yeah, no, no, you're putting me on the spot, and I quite rightly. I think we should stop using the word phrase, energy ceasefire, because we are imputing too much worth into a source of news that in the past has proved unreliable. Donald Trump. And so I think that, you know, ceasefires are processes and they are proved by actuality, rather than just declarations. You know, I had no actual text has been provided

12:25about who's agreed to do what over what period of time and how it's going to be assessed, and who's going to check it, and things like that. And so at that point, I think, you know, all the evidence is that the Russian side at the moment will continue to put pressure on the Ukrainians because they believe this is a moment of leverage over Ukraine. They believe that not only is Ukraine on the back foot domestically within, you know, Kiev and elsewhere because of the Russian attacks, but also now politically. In a way, it hasn't been for a long time, because Donald Trump has suddenly gone for the Lensky again, in a way that we haven't. And so when you talk to diplomats in the last few months, they would say, well, look, at least we haven't got the Americans pushing the Ukrainians to capitulate. Well, we're back into that space now. Although maybe not quite as bad as the Oval Office showdown, at the last year. But I do want to echo James on what he said around the sort of veracity of a Donald Trump true social post online,

13:26because, you know, as we were just having this conversation, I went back to look, because I was like, I know there was another ceasefire, similarly announced to this just a few weeks ago. And indeed it was September 14th, 2026. And Donald Trump posted, Ukraine has agreed not to hit Russian energy targets. Russia has agreed to do likewise. So if indeed that was the case, and if both parties had signed up to it, why are we here just what about a month later, having a very similar conversation? The impetus for President Trump is that this is all happening in the context of less than a month away from the American midterms. And so I think that's just worth really, really keeping in mind, we can talk more about why that matter so much. But essentially what you are seeing from this administration is a desire to allow greater oil supply, globally greater diesel supply. And so they want to ensure that Russian diesel is not hit in any way. That's the sort of backdrop and impetus for this. And one thing I will say, Adam, though, is that it was interesting to hear Dan talk about the sort of skepticism of whether there will be a deal

14:29because we've heard similar claims from this White House before about an energy ceasefire. And they haven't actually, both parties haven't actually signed up to it. And so I think that is the big question of, like does energy ceasefire mean just ensuring that Russian oil is not touched? Does it mean ensuring that the power grid in Ukraine is not hit? And that is unclear to me. But when it comes to diesel and ensuring that, you know, diesel is available on the market that oil supply continues on, the reason that is so critical for President Trump is that he ran on this message of affordability, of bringing prices down. And ultimately, here we are, as I said, less than a month away from the US midterms. And you look at survey after survey and the number one issue for most American voters remains affordability. And he is being pressured to show that he is doing something to address those concerns. And in his view, this is part of showing that he's doing something. He believes that if he can sort of open up the supply of diesel that perhaps it might help bring the price of gas down

15:30in the next few weeks. Asma, James made this point about Trump going for Zalansky again. Just explain how that played out. So we heard the President say to reporters over the weekend that he ought to be outstead, essentially. Zalansky could have settled this war many times, many, many times. And he chooses not to. It's very difficult. It's a war that should have never been started. If I were president of the election, where it rigged, I would have been president. And that war would have never started. But he could have settled it many times, and he chose not to. And this is something that I think we've seen from Trump over the last couple of years. He's rather mercurial when it comes to his support for Zalansky. I, in fact, was at the White House. It was a White House reporter for NPR during those days in February of 2025, when I'm sure so many listeners, viewers will remember this really sort of volatile oval office meeting that was unlike anything I had ever seen,

16:31in which the Vice President accused the Ukrainian President of being ungrateful, not saying thank youed and sufficiently to the Americans. And he was rather unceremoniously sort of dismissed from the White House. Since that moment, which I would describe is just one of the lowest moments in U.S. Ukraine, the U.S. Ukraine relationship, it has been repaired. It's ebbed and flowed. But in many ways, Adam, I'm not particularly surprised when I heard what the President had to say over the weekend. Because I remember hearing the countless times when he was running for President in 2024, in which he promised to voters that he would wrap up this war, that he would end it essentially within a day. And now here we are, inching closer to the midterms, and he has been unable to resolve this conflict. I mean, one last thing, and I'm sure we'll probably talk about this a bit, Adam, that I think is so fascinating, is the way in which this energy crisis and the way in which, in particular, hideeasal costs here in the United States are being framed as a problem that exists because of Russian Ukraine.

17:33A number of energy analysts would probably point to the war in Iran. We saw a surge in gas prices here in the United States after the United States and Israel decided to go to war in Iran. And in fact, that is, in many ways, why we have seen sustained prices. I mean, I have this little game with one of my kids. We live close to a gas station, and my son watches the way in which the gas prices have just been going up and up. Maybe this sounds perhaps not so severe to European ears, but here in the US, if you're seeing gas, which we do now, of over $5 a gallon, that is really rather unprecedentedly expensive gasoline prices for most Americans. Well, good to hear. There's at least one benefit to all of this chaos in the world. I-spies become slightly more numbers-based. And James, talking about Trump and Zelensky, this kind of reminds me of another moment, which was last summer, when all- not all the EU leaders, a load of EU leaders, including Starmar, went to Washington to sit down with Trump. And that was to try him to get to be a bit less unilateral

18:36and a bit more multilateral. And this seems to be going back to the days of Trump just doing whatever he wants when it comes to the war, rather than listening to Europe, and at least sort of acting a bit with them. Yeah, and that is, you know, I think the proximity to the midterm elections means that that's the focus of what he's doing at the moment. He's not thinking about a collective action with the Europeans. As we've seen from the European response, which has been pretty robust, and saying, well, that might be the American position, but we maintain our sanctions, and we're going to carry on supporting Ukraine. There's some more EU money that's going to be announced later this month, later this week, rather. So, you know, I think the Europeans at the moment are carrying on saying, well, you know, we continue. And then in terms of this little subplot about Ukrainian elections, which has rumbled on for years and years, because Zelensky would have faced an election in peacetime, we've got Donald Trump saying, repeating that there should be an election, and a new leader, we've got the Ukrainians asking for another ceasefire, but then for that to be to hold a presidential election,

19:38and then the Russians saying, yeah, but would you only do that for one day? What's going on there? So, look, obviously, the bottom line principle is that you're ain't going to get an election in the middle of a war, because you cannot guarantee the safety of people who are voting, you cannot guarantee the safety of people who are campaigning, campaigning vast numbers of electors are all over the place, they're on the front line there, they're overseas. You know, logistically, it's just not impossible. Some people will say it is just possible, but very, very difficult. The Ukrainian position always been well looked, you know, if you're going to give a ceasefire, and a proper ceasefire that's meaningful and sustains, and is provable and goes on for many, many months, in that context, then suddenly, an election becomes more feasible, right? The problem is, is that the Russians are not in favour of a ceasefire. They are only in favour of what they call a long-term peace. In other words, a long-term peace on their terms. The Russians, at the moment, say they will not agree to any kind of short-term ceasefire, if it doesn't lock in Russian gains and red lines further down the road.

20:43So, in other words, there's a sort of cap 22 there. Everybody is in favour of a ceasefire to have an election, but they're not in favour to have the same type of ceasefire. Okay. Asma, you talked about high diesel prices. Just give us a sense of, and obviously, we know the thing about the prices on the forecourt, but can you just give us a sense of how that filters down to the rest of American society and the American economy? One of the things that I think helps understand how significant this is to American voters is that diesel is really critical for the trucking industry. It's really critical for agriculture, for farming. And initially, when these sort of mid-term campaigns began, many political analysts that I talked to said, well, look, Republicans have a pretty good chance of keeping control of Congress, in particular, keeping control of the Senate. As this election has inched closer and closer, that map has really, really widened. And to the point where I'm hearing possible democratic victories in places like, let's say Iowa, maybe a place like even Nebraska and Kansas,

21:46Republicans aren't looking as strong as they traditionally would. And the number one reason I keep hearing from folks of why that comes down to affordability. And in America, I don't know how we've had to explain this enough, but one of the biggest symbols of affordability is usually gas and diesel prices. It is what people see. We see the stamp of gas prices when we drive around the country. And it is oftentimes, I remember hearing this during Joe Biden's tenure, when people were upset with inflation, they would often point to gas prices as their number one signifier of their frustration. And so, yes, I mean, right now, there is just tremendous amount of pressure on President Trump to show that he is doing something to address affordability and doing something in particular to address those gas and diesel prices. And that's why we saw him make that announcement on Friday when it comes to Russia. But, you know, look, I think I cannot overstate enough Adam how much domestic pressure there is on this issue. It's why we saw someone like the Republican who's running for Senate in Michigan

22:50and in Iowa recently called for a temporary export of US diesel, a sort of temporary diesel ban, which I know the Europeans were not a fan of, the Americans doing, but that is how much domestic pressure there is on the President to act like he is doing something to address voters concerns around affordability. Now, look, we can talk more about this, but I think ultimately, no matter what you do on the Russia front, if this war with Iran is going on and the situation with the Houthis just continues to get more unpredictable, right, with controlling stripping boards. I don't know that any of this, when in terms of what the President is or is not able to do with Russia, will have a monumental effect on fuel prices. Asma, thank you very much and good luck with the next episode of the Global Story. Thank you. A pleasure joining all. So, James, asma mentioned there, the situation with the Houthis, really dramatic footage over the weekend of the Houthi rebels based in Yemen striking the airport in Riyadh, in Saudi Arabia, a long way from Yemen and with massive consequences for the Saudi economy in

23:51Saudi life. Yeah, I think it's almost like a forgotten conflict that there's been so much focused on Ukraine, so much focus on the Israeli-US war on Iran, that the Houthi conflict has slightly got sort of side-lined. It sort of flared up a bit when they started having a crack at Saudi shipping through the Red Sea a month or two a back. But now, as you say, it is suddenly exploded into the open. This is a war, I mean, let's remember, this is a war that's been going on for over 10 years. A civil war that the Saudis joined on the side of the officially internationally recognized government against these Houthi rebels. We call them rebels, but I heard one analyst described them as possibly the most organized, dangerous non-state actor in the world at the moment. They're not really rebels. They are highly trained, highly organized in a way they weren't 10 years. They're a force. Yeah. And they are, so basically they have, there was a cease-fire

24:51assaults that broke down in part because of the war with Iran and it became a sort of hot war again. So they've been fighting for some months and in recent months, the Houthis made gains, taking territory to the south, getting control of the crucial strait, the Babel Mandab straight, which means they have some kind of control over the shipping that passes through them. And obviously this is the Suez Canal bit. Yeah. hugely significant. Well, yeah, because once you go around the Babel Mandab up to the north, you then get to the Suez Canal. Yeah, exactly. And the thing is, is that in recent weeks, the Saudis and the internationally recognized government in Yemen have pushed back. There's been a force to try and take some territory further north. So that's fighting on another big city called Tais. So it really is a very, very fluid situation at the moment. And do we know why the Houthis are being able to do such a good job from their point of view of attacking really important, you would think, quite well-secured things like the airport in Riyadh?

25:54It's a really good question, because the Saudis have invested billions in their defences. I think there are a variety of factors. One is Saudi Arabia is just enormous. There's critical infrastructure everywhere. You can't protect everything. That doesn't necessarily explain why you're not protecting your main capital's airport, but it is one factor. There is a lot of infrastructure that potentially could be a target. So you have to spread your defences thinly. Secondly, as we've seen in over the last sort of, you know, 19 months since the Iran war began, a huge number of their defences have been fired. And let off, there is a global shortage. The Iranians are going, the Ukrainians are going around big-boring stealing what they can. But the Saudis also have fewer than they would want. The countries that produce them mainly, the Americans are struggling to get jack production up because it takes a long time to make these patriots and fad missiles. So there's that.

26:54There is, I suppose, would be, and a military expert would have to say more of this, a basic sort of competence question of, you know, should there be a better detection system? Should there be a better, you know, have the Saudis learnt enough from Ukraine? Because since February, when the Iranian war began, the Americans and the Israelis started attacking Iran and Iran then attacked many targets around the Gulf. Including Saudi Arabia. Including Saudi Arabia. There has been a lot of sort of intellectual property traffic between Ukraine and those countries. Many of them say, right, how do we defend ourselves against these drones and missiles? And do we think the US might be tempted to get more involved in the defense of Saudi as a result of this? Or do they feel that their job is to provide the missile interceptors, which are now, they're running out of anyway? I imagine the Saudis are very, very keen for the Americans to get in. The Americans have every so often, you know, pitched in. They certainly did at one stage, briefly last year, with some air strikes. However, there is also a counter-argument, which is, if Donald Trump is

27:57going into the midterm elections, being criticized for one war he started. He might be reluctant to intervene in a second, even if they are too conflicts that are beginning to blur and bleed into one another. So he might be reluctant to do that. Not least because a lot of analysts would say that this is not a conflict that can be resolved militarily unless you're willing to invade. And that's, I think, very, very unlikely. And so therefore, my expectation is that, you know, Saudi Arabia will respond. If you're international airport has been attacked as much as this, they have to respond just to reinforce and try to rediscover deterrence. But then eventually, at some point, there will have to be some kind of discussion because that's the only way I think this conflict is likely to end. And just to end on a philosophical note, as you know I like to do with a big, almost unanswerable question every day, I mean, just listening to the stuff that we've been discussing today, just wondering how it feels doing your job this week. Like, does it seem more intense than many other week? In fact, someone's just calling you now, probably telling you to

29:00go and do something else. But I'm just trying to get, it feels, the world feels particularly unsettled this week compared to previous weeks. It does feel unsettled, but look, yeah, and I sometimes think, crikey, you know, where's the hope? Where's the positive thing? Look, there are, there's a lot of statistics out there that show that it is better to be alive in 2026 than it has been at any time in history in terms of birth rates, death rates, education, the rights of education, rights of women around the world, number of people being, you know, the fewer people actually dying from disease, all of these kinds of things. You can look at those kind of metrics. As ever, we in the media are slightly coupleable because we always struggle to report trends rather than actual events. But yes, it is sometimes slightly depressing, but then I, on my social media feed last night, and you asked for this, so I'm going to give this. Please do. Somebody up popped up a poem by Wendell Berry called The Peace of Wild Things.

30:01It's very short, I'm just going to read it. I know, go ahead. Yeah, yeah. You can edit it as you wish later. When despair for the world grows in me, and I wake in the nights at the least sound, in fear of what my life and my children's lives may be, I go and lie down where the wood drake rests in his beauty on the water, and the great heron feeds. I come into the peace of wild things who do not tax their lives with forethought of grief. I come into the presence of still water, and I feel above me the day blind stars waiting with their light. For a time, I rest in the grace of the world, and I'm free. Now, the point I would make about that. Can I just say excellent, dramatic pause there, just the right amount. Thank you. Yeah, but I gave it to you. Yeah. The key point about that is what a brilliant poem for today, but that poem was written in 1968. Yero was born. In other words, we've been here before. The world goes round. So that was the height of

31:07Vietnam. Yeah, the unrested. A passive student unrest, cold war. This is a time when people feared for nuclear Armageddon, lots of other conflicts around the world. And civil rights, there's a lot of stuff going on. And when I go to seminars, seminars where earnest people discuss the future of democracy, and I'll be seeing a return to democratically legitimate autocracies around the world. And people just sometimes forget, well, remember what happened in the 1930s? We thought communism and fascism was on the rise, and poor old democracy was struggling withering on the vine, and yet it had another game. So that I think is in our long way of answering a question of why I try not to get too depressed by just discussing things going wrong. I think three things, and you know, I love a numbered list, and you did do a numbered list earlier on. So

32:09this is kind of like the mirror image of that. Number one, we sort of think of things as being like total wars like World War II, but actually you go back to the Ukraine situation and even the situation with the Houthis. Lots of these things are a little bit modular, and that both sides can agree to turn off one bit of the war if it's in both of their interests. For example, a 30-day ceasefire to do this. And so we sometimes forget that wars are a bit kind of like Lego bricks maybe, rather than one big thing. Two, isn't it weird that the global economy still seems actually quite resilient, and actually all the really, really, really apocalyptic warnings, I accept the price of gas in America and inflation being higher here and all that stuff, but you'd feel that the economy would be in sort of crisis mode. It doesn't feel like it is, maybe it will be soon. And third of all, my social media this weekend was full of things about Kelly Clarkson, the singer, going into a shop in Brooklyn and complaining that she couldn't buy a wind-up bird that was attached to the wall. And your social media was giving you that poem. So different strokes, different folks.

33:12James, thank you very much. Thank you, Adam. And that's all for this episode of newscast. Although I want to hear how you're getting on with your 100-days challenges. Remember, we're marking Andy Brunham's first 100 days in office, a milestone that is coming around rapidly, in fact, in about 15 days' time. I'm running 500K, but what are you doing? And how are you getting on with your challenges you've already told us about? Email us, newscast at BBC.co.uk, or you can watch tapas on 0-3-3-0-1-2-3-9-4-8-0. And in case you were wondering, I have run 369.45 kilometers, and I've got 15 days to go on my spreadsheet, which I think works out as about, 8K per day. Which seems so much more than just the five on average, which is what it was when it started. Anyway, there'll be another episode of newscast coming your way very soon. Bye-bye. Newscast. Newscast from the BBC. Well, thank you for making it to the end of another newscast. You clearly ooze stamina. Can I gently encourage you to subscribe to us on BBC Sounds, and then, without

34:16having to do anything else, our meandering chats will miraculously make its way to your phone.