Gay, Networked Serial Killers with Patrick from Programmed to Kill. (2019)

0:00If you like YouTube, you'll love YouTube Premium. Hi, I'm Sean Evans from Hot Ones and I want to tell you about YouTube Premium. It has offline downloads, so you can watch without Wi-Fi. Background Play. So you can lock your phone and it still plays, baby. Oh, and it is completely ad-free. Yes, I said it ad-free. Try YouTube Premium for two months free at youtube.com slash premium. Trial eligibility varies, terms apply, cancel anytime. Meet the Red Bull Dragonberry Emergizer. It's one of the many new drinks out now. Who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire? Try them all only at McDonald's. All right, 3, 2, 1. Hi, this is William Ramsey. Welcome to William Ramsey Investigates. On tonight's show, I have a great guest, somebody who's videos I've watched over and over. There's about 143 at this point. He makes them under the name of program to kill referencing the great late Dave McGown's

1:06book program to kill the politics of serial murder. And he's done just so much work. These are about 10 minutes each. So there's tons of information on so many serial killers. His name is Patrick. I've heard him on Ed Opperman and many other places as well. But tonight we're going to talk about a specific subject. He said to me, his specific research on this kind of theme I've been pursuing, which is the gay serial killer. So he sent me stuff on John Wayne's, Gacy. You're going to talk about it and some other pretty dark subject matters. So I would not want to have the audio of this in the purview or in the close to anybody you might be sensitive. So anyway, Patrick, are you there? I'm here, William. Thank you for having me. Awesome. Thanks for agreeing to the interview. So you sent to me one, this one article that I read. It's an article from September 28, 2018 titled was John Wayne, Gacy, connected to a ring of homosexual, sadist and murders.

2:08And it was remarkable in a lot of ways. It's a great article. It shows that there's a lot more nuance to the John Wayne, Gacy, murders. But they also brought up something that I wrote, I made the documentary about, which is the smiley face killings and how these do overlap. So Patrick, for people who don't know you, maybe the best thing to do is just talk a little bit about your background. How you became interested in these subjects. And then we can just kind of get into the general information. Yes, sure. My first name is Patrick. I'm now 29 years old. I came from Europe at the age of 15. I became fascinated by the topic of serial killers and also psychology, criminology, sociology. So I read a lot of books with a lot of different serial killers going to the library. That's also the early stage of YouTube. So there's only more information available. And a few couple, I think three years later, I also found the book Program to Kill, the

3:12politics of serial murder, the author Dave McGowan. And actually thought of us just like another serial killer book, just to gain more knowledge about them. Despite reading the background, of course, the back of her. But still, after a few chapters, the information was just only mind blowing with all the unanswered questions that I have with all the serial killers. And he really demonstrates that all those serial killers and mass murders have connections with the military, the intelligence agencies, Satanism, your cult and secret societies. And I think all those topics are we going to discuss, which all combined with the serial killers. And often left out in the general narratives, the lone serial killer, not killers, it's always this individual. And a lot of that backstory is either negligently or intentionally deleted it from the stories of these guys. But yeah, last week I talked about one of the more prolific serial killers here in California's

4:13name was Randy Kraft, also known as the scoreboard killer, maybe killed 100 people. But the remarkable thing about him too was that he was politically active, he, a lot like Gacy. And you see these overlapping elements between crafting Gacy where there's a lot more to the story. Yeah, this certainly is just remarkable. He also got letter and letter from the Senate, Robert Kennedy. And despite this intelligence, he was also a pretty well student, a drinking, taking drugs and regularly attending all night gambling and poker sessions with other students. So he was a pretty bright person, but yeah, something went wrong. Yeah, and he got into the very good private schools, excellent schools, the Pomona, I think it was like went to Pomona College. So he was definitely a higher tiered individual, probably one of the reasons why he got away with the murder for so long.

5:15But Gacy was a lot like him, also politically active picture of him with Rosalind Carter or whatever her name was, Jimmy Carter's wife. Yeah, also that Bundy, his connection with the Rockefeller, so yeah, it's, yeah. So Bundy worked on the Nelson Rockefeller campaign, right? Yeah, great. And he also was kind of, he was politically active, but also a law student, you know, so he was very intelligent. Yeah, I mean, it's Bundy's an incredible story as well. And there are other stories about whether he was part of a satanic group, which would make a lot of sense considering his sensibilities. He also like had no guilty. He actually, you know, I was watching this documentary about him on Netflix and it was like Bundy intentionally desired not to have any regrets. Yeah, I think that Bundy was probably guilty of a few murders, totally on his own, but

6:17the majority was done, I think, but other perpetrators were completely different motives. And why do you, why do you say that? According to all the research that McGon provides and also my own personal and also George from CAFDAF.org. You can really see the, like, almost like the law enforcement connections with the different victims that were connected to them, also with drug trafficking, things like that. Well, it would make sense of why he was like, he got out of jail, escaped, he was let go many times. And saying same with Gacy, Gacy himself, I think there was one situation I read that he was, he was, you know, somebody was, oh, and if somebody made a complaint to the police and they just said, don't worry about it, it's not going to be a charge, you know, somebody who was abused by Gacy. So he was probably, Gacy himself was probably a networked and had, was obtaining favors, right? Yeah, yeah, most definitely.

7:17It's also more disturbing that I think even the own news reports. There were like three serial killers that were operating, abducting young male victims in California in the 70s and 80s. I talked to Dennis McDougal about one last week where Andy crapped, but there were two others, Patrick Kerney, William Bonan, what, he talked a little bit more about them. Yeah, yeah, for the character named Patrick Kerney, his IQ was estimated between 140, 180. So it's a really a bright guy. He was also called the trashback killer. He was born in East Los Angeles, California. And according to one book that I read, his parents locked him up in a basement onto the age of five. And to me, that's very reminiscent of Edmund Camper, the co-act killer from Santa Cruz. So that's pretty interesting that he is somewhat of the similar backgrounds.

8:19And his father was also a police officer and described as a strict disciplinarian. And he was a pretty thin, sick child, always. He got bullied at school and he became rich, were on and fantasizing about the killing people. And so these guys, he was also kind of like in the same kind of ambit of Dave McGowan's serial killers and the fact that he was involved with the military, right? Yeah, actually, all three of them were a minute there connected through the army or air force, yeah. Gotcha. And Kerney worked at Hughes Aircraft back in the day, defense contractor, building satellites, things like that, or that's what Hughes did. But he had a security clearance, correct? Yeah, he also had a security clearance, yeah. And so he was down here in Los Angeles.

9:20But he, I mean, I think they were in Redondo Beach pretty close to where I am actually, not about three cities away. The also, no large bitiker in Roy Norse. Bitiker, no, I'm not familiar with that name. Okay. Who was he? He was, he was called the toolbox killer with Roy Norse, abducting girls in vans in his van, murder mac. And just torturing them in audio recording everything. Gotcha. Bitiker in Norse. Were they the ones who drove around in a bus throughout LA as well? Yes, I know the toolbox killers. Yes, I'm familiar with that. John Deoglis said he was the most disturbing individual we ever created a criminal profile as the Lawrence Bitiker. Yeah, they still have the tape recording at Quantico and use it to desensitize agents. Wow, because they're just so cold-blooded, Norse and Bitiker were.

10:20It's weird too, because right there there's all these people, you know, killing people on freeways. It wasn't just gay killers. It was these guys too. There was the hillside stranglers. You know, all these guys just, it was, it was terrifying, I can those days. Yeah, so, Kerney kind of moved around, but how many people did he say he ended up killing? I think he confessed initially to 15, but other people say 21. And he was networked. I mean, people think that he was networked as well. He was traveling to Canada. He knew how to fly, correct? Yeah, yeah, and I think that's very interesting, because maybe he was also engaged with human trafficking or drug trafficking or moving around to snuff movies, things like that. If you own an old private airplane, it's a blame. Sure. I mean, it's for a purpose. I mean, those small private airplanes move a lot of things. The people don't know that, but the real, yeah.

11:23The real drug trade is, yeah, it's smaller airports. You know, those smaller airports are where a lot of sketchy things stay place. And he, Kerney was said that he knew Lee Harvey Oswald, too, correct? Yeah, yeah, that's true. And I mean, so you just see how, and he said that Oswald was said he was a spy back then, that there was a military language school, that there's references to Mexico City where there was supposedly Lee Harvey Oswald's double or himself were there. So Kerney was probably operating in that same kind of underground environment and also killing people. And his victims were all young males, is that correct? Yeah, I think the majority was above 25, yeah. And 30, 35, yeah. Gotcha. And he, what's he working, did they say he had a boyfriend, too, right? So it was kind of like the same thing as some of these other killers where there might

12:25be, you know, somebody else might have been involved. Yeah, they initially brought him also to the station. We actually charged, but they released him for lack of evidence. But, yeah, I don't know. It's fairly uncertain that he didn't know anything that Patrick Kerney was up to. Wow. All right. However likely that is, you know, but the other one, yeah. So that, uh, listening to your podcast with Adder about the book of a Randy Creeft, that uh, of, uh, he said something about Patrick Kerney, uh, that if it wasn't for his, uh, motivation to kill Patrick Kerney, you could be otherwise a millionaire in Silicon Valley because it was like a real electronic, so whisk it. Right. So that's also interesting. Yeah. So I mean, these guys are smart. Like why are they doing these evil things? Like craft Kerney, very intelligent.

13:26And I mean, even, uh, you mentioned the guy up in Northern California, he had like a 150 IQ. Uh, yeah, Lars Bittaker is also highly intelligent. Yeah, it's really crazy. So just because your intelligent doesn't mean that you're a good person. Um, and then the other one was William Bonin, who was kind of another one just on the same thing like these guys where, um, you know, it's the same background talking about William Bonin. Uh, yeah, and a few things about Patrick Kerney. It's interesting to know that he was also employed at the use Ake aircraft, uh, defense contractor, yeah. Right. And it's also, of course, associated with Lockheed Martin, uh, and Skunk Works, which is actually a different name for Lockheed Martin. Yeah. Right. So I mean, he had a security clearance. He's probably working on high tech stuff back then, you know, all kinds of weaponry, geosynchronous, satellites, who knows? I don't know exactly what his special specifications were or specialty Kerney was, but, uh, I'm sure

14:27he's within that environment. Yeah. And that's his own environment that also large, the bit of goes employed at the use, employed at the Skunk Works yet, uh, some kind of an aircraft, uh, also an aircraft manufacturer company. I didn't know that. That's interesting. I think, uh, fascinating. It's really amazing. These guys all operate right around the same time. And, uh, so Bonin was, uh, Bonin himself was also associated with the military as well, too. Yeah. All three of them, uh, but Bonin has had a really, uh, harsh life. His father was a copulsive gambler and the physically abusive. His grandfather was a convicted child molester. He was severely neglected as a child, uh, probably also sexually. And he joined the Air Force, so, yeah. So, and he also was in a state hospital where all these other, all these other guys worked, right? So a task at Darrow State Hospital. Yeah. A lot of, uh, uh, Syracuse actually went there, uh, in a camper, Roy Norris, Lawrence

15:33Bidaker. It's just amazing. And also about, uh, what, uh, what, uh, Edmund Campbell, I was telling you about behavior modifications, like, he knew all these, all these kind of things already. Interesting. So they're learning stuff while they're at these hospitals? Yeah. It's just incredible. I mean, uh, they get to this, uh, to these hospitals, get treatments, getting released, killing people, and getting sent back to that same hospital. Wow. Incredible. Or not, I was. A facility. And bone in himself was not alone when he was committing these, it's kind of like the John Wayne Gacy model, where there's all these other, um, all these other accomplices, right? Yeah, exactly right. Even, uh, John Wayne Gacy, before his execution, uh, told them many names of other people or, uh, associatives of them and, uh, work, uh, complicity in the crimes, but, uh, no, everybody wants to believe the official narrative.

16:34There's just one guy, one perpetrator and, uh, right. And he has done his job good and made some money. Right. And Gacy himself, when he was arrested, said he told the cops who else to do arrest, right? And I think that's in your video for a program to kill on Gacy, is like he's saying, who else you got, right? Yeah, yeah. That's really McGowan's investigations. Uh, the first 20 parts of the video series is all practically, uh, McGowan's work directly from the book. Yeah, exactly the first 10, what happened? consciousness treatment that was a result of a crash? eight, nine minutes at a time, fab poder that they were probably on this claim again? Uh, I push going, uh, let's change that question. He was associated with a detected detected bearing, uh, you know, ward to check the watching Bonan abuse and torture fictims, but he was also quite terrified of him, so it's

17:36pretty interesting. Conflicted person. And then he met, sorry. Yeah. Excuse me. He also committed suicide, yeah. Well, that's, yeah, probably the weight of his conscience. How many people did Bonan end up committing murder on, do you know? No, not the top of the map. Gotcha. But he also had other people. There was another guy, Miley Pugh. Can you talk about them? Gregory Matys, Miley, yeah. He has a literate Texas native with IQ of only 65, so that's like really low. I mean, that's almost like worse than mentally retarded. I think all this to an IQ of 75. He was just a support himself with a casual work and participated in many of the murders. Yeah. Bonan's killed death was somewhere between 21 and 36 victims.

18:39So. Yeah. I attribute you to him. Yeah. He's a guilty to every single one of them, man. Yeah. It's scary. Same with craft. He could have been over 100, which is really terrifying. A number of people get away with killing. Nobody, you know, nobody ever caught him until the end, which is really scary. So Gregory, Miley, IQ 56, and then there was another, was William Ray Pugh was involved? Yeah. Yeah. He had an intense conversation in his van with him and later made incriminating statements against Bonan in court for unrelated out of theft. So you get the god of some mugs, some charges. All right. That's also similar thing that is also happening with court cases that you can buy actually every one and just follow the complaint to them on the road. I see.

19:40And so one, so another guy testified against Bonan at the court, right, to avoid the death penalty Bonan was put to death, right? Yeah. I think he was executed in 1996 yet when he was 33. Wow. Oh, no, it was 33 when he was caught. No, no, no, no, I don't know what. Let's see, Bonan. He died at 49. He was convicted in 1983. So yeah, he was about 35. I mean, when he got busted. But yeah, I mean, just, it's just incredible that there are that many young, boys in California in that area just to be a predator upon. You think that somebody would key into it? Yeah, but it's, it's very interesting that the many of the victims of especially Bonan and craft were actually military related. Many of them were from the United States Marine Corps and other,

20:44other sections of the military. So yeah, did you ever read about anything, about them drugging their victims? Was there a lot of drugs involved? Yeah, yeah. So I never, all from, I think it was Randy Krift was doing that a lot. And also a little bit bonan, yeah. And also, of course, the family in Australia. The family. Let's talk about the family in Australia because that is an interesting case. It happened in Adelaide and the guy that they arrested, his name was, Benven Spencer von Einem was like this supposed ringleader, but it's a lot like the gasey case because there were other people that were supposedly involved. They were never arrested or tried. I think Spencer von Einem is still in jail. These murders happened between 73 and 83, but they fit the profile exactly of craft bonan and Keirney, young men out. And the same thing, and some of these bodies are dumped in strange places.

21:47And a lot of them had very severe anal injury. So there's a lot of torture. And then they found out that like there might be tons of people involved, more than 12 people involved that were never charged. So pretty remarkable case. Yeah, it's truly unbelievable that you have the same M.O.s just globally being a character. Yeah, right. And there's guys are in cars, right? So Spencer von Einem is just like Eiler, this other serial killer in the Midwest. I was, I researched about or talked to her name was Colerick who wrote a book about him, but like just trolling around, driving around, looking for victims. And that was the same thing that looks like Spencer von Einem and his cohorts. And they know that there were other people involved because people saw him together with other people. It's just an incredible case. And that also involved drugs. He was drugging people with something called man-dracks and knock tech. And there was one victim that fits right into the smiley face,

22:48killer paradigm, who was held for five weeks before he murdered. So you can see that same thing happening here in the States. It's incredible. Yeah, it's just more incredible that they all always want to have the official narrative. This is all one guy or maybe two guys, but it's never being discussed as like a group of people. And it's also just incredible how many of these killers are photographing or videotaping their exploits. Right. Did you come across any of these people, Gacy or any of these killers who took videos or videotapes? Well, at least Gacy confessed that a character named Philip Aske, who was associated with John the Norman, worked for him. And he was into a videotaping sex with children and being outgirls and things like that. And that Bundy claimed that he had polo-art pictures of some of the murders and laid a burn them because he was hooked out to a police

23:50for investigating or writing a search warrant in his apartment. So yeah. Wow. Yeah, that's amazing. I wouldn't be surprised if those are somewhere underground that those there are tapes of some of these smiley face killings being filmed or something like that dark web. I don't know. But it's incredible. Yeah. Even reports from the family in Australia, there are people who are calling to the hotline channels and saying clearly from I can say, where is it? But I saw a snuff movie of one of those victims. Wow. Really? I didn't know that. That's incredible. Oh. And that case was still ongoing. I think the case was, I think Von Inam got convicted in the 90s, but they went and did a full cold case review and reinvestigated a lot of people who were associated with him. And they were never brought charges, but like there was a doctor involved. There was a couple prominent people who were associated with Von Inam,

24:53but they didn't have enough evidence to convict. Yeah. So the family in Adelaide, really incredible. There's a good documentary. There's a really good documentary on your program to kill. But also your program to kill, by the way, if people want to see the full series, it is at LOL Field and Love on YouTube right now as far as it's still up. So I wouldn't be surprised if it disappeared. So I would highly recommend people go check that out. But yeah, there's a, there you have a segment on the family in Adelaide. Yeah. Let's not hope so. But I'm currently also making a website. So, you have a URL. Do you have a, I'm thinking about program to kill.net. Okay. Cool. So people can look for that there. I mean, it's just a great research. It's such a, you know, the subject still ongoing. I mean, as far as I'm concerned in the Smiley Face killers, there's a couple. At least groups or teams predating on young men in the United States that nobody's

25:56putting the warning out. So, you know, they haven't been caught yet. So, maybe they've been caught, but maybe only got one charge for one thing. But there's so many victims. It's just incredible. Yeah. You also have the Oakland County Killer with the North Fox Islands. It's also just incredible. All those places. What was the Oakland County Killer? I can't recall now which states. Maybe to us Las Chicago, all those children were disappearing and later five murderers. And there was also some kind of a secretive island called North Fox Island. And there were all these pedophiles just luring those children there with planes and just taking advantage of them. Oh, that's incredible. Yeah. And you have the Franklin conspiracy. You have Jeffrey Epstein. So, you know, these things are happening. I don't know if there are any murders associated with Epstein, but there's a lot of sketchy stuff happening right now. So, yeah. It's pretty incredible. What about, maybe we can talk a little bit more about craft.

27:01I mean, or some of these other ones you mentioned, some other names that pop up like her Balmyster, Melisandum. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting that Randy Kraft actually stated that he said, I didn't get a fair trial. The government turned into a serial killer trial. So, that's pretty interesting that he didn't talk to get a fair trial. What do you think he meant by that? Well, that is probably on his own guilty of a few murders, but not as a serial killer. That's just on the shelf every single victim on his name. Just declared the books. Why? Oh, good point. Yes. Yeah. And there was a, he did the same thing where he abducted somebody for five days and then killed them. So, he would keep people alive. Yeah. Yeah. Even more interesting. I also found many polar word pictures of many of his victims and police authorities actually stated that he didn't have any darkroom expertise or didn't receive any kind of employer at

28:05the Photoshop store saying what the hell is this, what kind of photographs are these. So he did have an associate processing all these pictures. I mean, yeah, it's also pretty interesting. Right. So, it's not about it being even been selling those or trafficking those back in that day before Polaroid. Yeah, it's incredible. Incredible. After all my research in the video series, I've researched now like 50 different cases. So it's also sometimes hard to figure everything out and memorize everything. But like every murder case, like 80% or 85% of them, every different, every single serial killer mass murder, does deal in snuff movies or some kind of photographs or videotape thing or some kind of some forward abuse. So, it's just really mind blowing over all those videotapes and for what purpose exactly. I mean, after all my research, I think it's like dealing and trafficking and these networks with each other. Yeah.

29:05I think you're right. It's like a currency for them. I would say so. There's probably is a more underground market for that. You know, I hear that there's an underground market. There was what was the guy Richard Eng and they were abducting people and taking them up into the California hills. Is that like a Chelsea? Yeah. So, that was another one. They know that they were making snuff films, you know. Slide out. Terrible. I mean, horrible. That's a horror show of a case. But yeah, so craft, I mean, it's just incredible. He had this guy Jeff Graves. I mean, they know that somebody helped him move the bodies around, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think one of his former board friends was definitely in on the murders at some point level in time. But he died of H.I. And when he was asked by the police, he bluntly stated, listen, I'm not going to take the fall for this. Right. Like, he knew it's just incredible. And these guys are moving around too.

30:07This is another guy kind of like Kierney who's traveling between jurisdiction. So very sinister, very sinister stuff. We can talk about her bomb master because this guy was also a videotape, everything around him. And you can't believe it because when the police first came to his huge estate, there's all the film equipment, like different lenses, tripods, different cameras. And when they later came back for another search, everything was just gone. All the videotapes, like 100 videotapes, all the camera lenses, everything. So I really, I know it's a little bit speculation, but I always had to hunch that her bomb mice were some kind of organized parties at the state. And there was also probably some kind of blackmail, just some kind of blackmail filming, filming of activities at Inlet Pool. Now, wouldn't be surprised at all. Didn't he find his victims at gay bars kind of like Dahmer?

31:10Yeah. And they had like, they found human remains on his property. I think his kids found it. And they're like, he tried to rationalize it like Balmeister was something else. And they called him the Interstate 70 killer, something like that. How's in the 90s? Yeah, the I-70 killer. And also Larry Eiler was also a probably associated directly with it. You think that Eiler and Balmeister probably knew each other? I think directly, indirectly, I can say directly because I don't have any substantiated evidence or anything, but yeah. I mean, they're dealing with the same criminal enterprises. And geographically, it will make perfect sense. Right. Yeah, I mean, they're in the same geographic area, no doubt. Probably saw some more things amongst themselves. Like, I'm worried, yeah. I mean, it's just incredible. When you look at all these, and what was the whole story? Do you know the story of Dean Coral out of Texas and how John Wayne, Gacy, knew him?

32:14Do you know about that story? Yeah, that's also just completely unbelievable that you have to Dean Coral murder. He was also by L.A.R.E. and Henry Jr. and David Brooks. Early 1970s, Texas. And actually, this guy was also associated with a boring, with a deal of John DeNormon. And John DeNormon was also very connected with John Wayne Gacy at the later stadium. Wow. Yes. So that's the connection. Is Norman is the connection between Gacy and Coral? Yeah, yeah. It's just amazing. And then Gacy himself, the latter parts of his murders, he started dumping the victims in rivers and water, right? Yeah, and that's also maybe, is it comparison with the smiley face cuters? Yes. It seems like, yeah, like this, yeah, it is. I mean, it's kind of the same thing that happened there. They landed child murders. Yeah.

33:14The ability to, or somebody figured out that that's where you can destroy evidence, confused police, something like that, just put him in water. You know, it's just incredible that these guys kind of cross over that Gacy and Coral, even then you get into Gacy and the connection to Robin Gect and the, the Ripper, the Ripper trial because Gect supposedly new Gacy. Is that correct? Yeah, apparently he was employed at the BDM consdirector. So yeah, they're all connected with each other. It's like not really coincidence since, yeah. Yeah. And they still, the Ripper crew in Chicago, one of the guys just got paroled. One of the guys with the Greek last name, one of them just got paroled. So, you know, they're still around. And he, the guy Gect still denies everything and there's all kinds of occultism, satism. I talked about him when I was on that occult crime show that's on Netflix right now.

34:16I referenced the Ripper crew. So yeah, it's just incredible that these guys are, and you know, you got wonder how many people know these guys are killing, right? How many people know Gacy's are killing? In the video you did, you had these guys Rossi and all these other people that, God, they had to have known what was going on. Yeah, they were living in the same house and the Gacy described the house not really as like a real house, but like someone that's always like moving, moving out and like just like in a, like in a living place, like in a restaurant. Right. So people are coming and going. The big people who survived Gacy said they saw lights going on in other rooms. So they knew that Gacy wasn't there alone. I mean, it just gets really creepy and Sky Rossi and these other people, Rossi dug some of the graves, but Clancy didn't know what was going on. You know, it's just off the charts. Yeah, I speculated with some other people and we probably came to the conclusion that the PDM contract was probably like in the front for like a meal prostitution ring.

35:23Oh, interesting. That's fascinating. Do you know what PDM stands for? Bates decorating and maintenance. And was that something that Gacy started? Was he the president? Yeah, he was. Oh, Cassie. So Geck worked basically for Gacy through his company. Wow. It's just amazing how much information there is and how similar these guys operate. It's really something else. Yeah, it's incredible that almost all of them accept the Gacy now. I have to admit that every background is all minute that we background. Yeah, always like some kind of intelligence. Yeah. Wow. Well, where can people reach out? You're all your information is again at LOL field and love and you're still putting out something. You just put out a video within the last two weeks about the Hollywood rapper, this guy, Michael, Garzulo, which is going on to the trial is going on right now in LA and they're covering it. And some of the pictures that you had on that video, he has like a cult tattoo.

36:25He's got like a pyramid with the sun, all kinds of stuff. Do you know of any of a cult connection to this Garzulo guy? No, not any of cult connections, but it was certainly interesting that he had the all-seeing eye tattoo on his shoulder. Yeah. And yeah, so and those were the crimes were incredibly vicious, really overkill like I said. Like I said, he was very violent. So I think he's still denying all this that he committed any kind of crimes to. And that was an unsolved, the death of, I can't remember, a name right now, but that was like an unsolved murder. Nobody really knew who did it until he got, Garzulo got caught trying to kill somebody else. And then he said, told the police, hey, just because my DNA is at 10 crime scenes doesn't mean I'm involved. So they only have him for four. So where are the other six victims, right? Yeah, but it is a fair statement for he says. But it's just interesting, or he is the unlucky person on the face of Europe, or it was just like, he was living at the close proximity to all of these victims.

37:31So yeah. So he must have seen him or something like that. Yeah, most definitely was compromised in some way and other. And that's why he is in prison right now. Is there anything we missed, anything you want to share, any contact information? Your website will be programmed to kill.net, anything else before we're at 40 minutes. Yeah, well, maybe one small thing. It's interesting to know that Jeffrey Dahmer, 02 books, one of them was called Free to Kill about Larry Eilor. And the other was Killing for Company about Dennis Nilsen, which actually called the British Jeffrey Dahmer. Wow, I didn't know that. So he had Colerick's book that lady I talked to. Yeah, did you ever figure out why Dahmer liked Exorcist 3? Did you ever do research on that? I saw the movie by myself and I know the director or writer was a former CIA agent. And it was a really disturbing movie with really where it's simply a little imagery and things and also the storyline.

38:33But I don't know, I have always suspected that that movie was some kind of trigger that mechanism to some kind of a behavior. Wow. There's also another serial killer called Danny Rowling. Yes. Yeah, great. We're from Florida. Yeah. And he was also heavily influenced by that movie at the Gemini. Really? Yeah. So Gemini came from that movie. Yeah. Wow, I didn't know that. Because that was, because that's what the God used to survive Dahmer said he would put it on and start chanting. And that movie was actually directed by Peter Blattie, the writer of the Exorcist. Yeah. So there's another time, I mean, that the Exorcist has found that the West Memphis 3 deaths, you know, like all kinds of stuff. But I did not know that Dahmer had free to kill that cholera book. Wow. Yeah, you have a book called The Collector by John Fals and two serial killers, at least two series that we know of, had it in a procession.

39:35Leonard Lake was heavily obsessed by that book and also Bob Bordella from Kansas City. Right. Bordella was also kind of, he preferred men to women, is that correct? Yeah, correct. And he was also heavily into a satanic ritual abuse. He was like really like in a coffin, a local coffin, yeah. So he would sleep in a coffin or something like that? No, in a local coffin, in like witch coffin. A coffin, so he was in a COVN, gotcha. Wow, I didn't know that about Bordella. That's incredible. But those were like kind of like a Dutch in torture, as the name type murders to Bordella. Yeah, yeah, it was definitely, and also a pharmaceutical, yet a lot of drugs. This guy is completely connected with some kind of entity that provided him with all those drugs. Wow, that's incredible. It's just when you start studying him, you just see these similarities connections. It's just an incredible work that you've done there on a core program to kill.

40:35So I commend you for that. People got to check it out. I mean, because these things are still happening today. Smiley face killers are still going on. So, you know, it's a tragedy. So again, Patrick, program to kill. Thank you very much for the interview. I appreciate it. Thank you very much, William. All right. Absolutely. You as well. Take care. Okay.