Leafs Roller Coaster Ride w/ Sam McKee

0:00Welcome to the JDBunkers podcast. There were a lot of texts and a lot of takes with Sam McKee last night. What's up buddy? How are we doing? No Sammy yet. Tell me he was there. He told me. So no Sam. Different intro. What a roller coaster ride for the Toronto Maple Leafs last night. They start this game. It's three nothing in the blink of an eye. And I think it was impossible not to feel this massive feeling of just holy crap.

1:01I can't believe that this is happening. They have this comeback win against the Nashville Predators. They're absolutely flying. And now you're seeing them play a Vegas team on the road that let's be honest. We kind of expected that it was going to be at least for me. I'll speak for myself. I thought it was going to look a little bit closer to pockets of the second period and third period. More than it was going to be this team just going absolutely nuts out of the gate. Everybody scoring. I'm making jokes about Aden Hill and Team Canada. I'm feeling like maybe eventually tonight there's going to be a spot for a joke about Mitch Marner making a mistake. Leaving this team. Not knowing that it was going to be Chakas team. There was going to be Hillers team.

2:01And then yeah, the second period happens. And I think that this is kind of one of the difficulties that we're going to have with this season is the roller coaster ride, which there will be. Yeah, of course, there's always ups and downs with the team, but it does feel as though this is kind of going to be sustained for quite some time. Some really really high highs and some low, low, low, low, low, where you've got a, you've got a team that's going to be a lot more interesting offensively. There's no question about that. They've got a lot of fun players, exciting players in their top six. They've also got a lot of guys who it's going to be pretty suspects if they can defend. It's going to be pretty interesting to see if they can protect leads. And I think that it's going to be why we're just, we're having takes for the entire

3:02of the year. And again, there's also this balance of people want to give this team a runway. People want to give this team, hey, let's see who you are. Let's find out what this team actually is. Let's not just have everybody overreacting to every single game, every single night, the way that, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, the perception is of this fan base. But I do think it's, there's going to be some guys on this team that have basically really low levels of patience. And then some guys that have a ton of it. And it's going to be a weird dichotomy of these two things, especially if they continue to play this way. Anyways, the guy who said he was going to be there right away and was not standing. The key is here. What's up? What's up, brother? How are we doing? I don't know. I'm an, I'm old and tired, bro. I clicked the link and I was sitting there and then all of a sudden, I got kicked out and I got zero explanation. I threw to you. I threw to you. I was like, hey, say, okay. Oh, wait, not there. Oh, it's all you. Yeah, you were there. You were there. You were there. I was here. Yeah, I was literally sitting here at 850.

4:03Ready to rock. Like I came down here early, got a water filled out of going. Literally just like got to get it going early, got a new computer. Yeah, I'm sure this is going to work right? Oh, new computer. Fancy boy. Okay. You're all, you're all unexploded. So, Jackal, I started this by saying, you and I were letting the takes fly in the text messages last night. Like it was just, it was the dumb out the text. That's everything. That's every night though. Yeah, but this, this one in particular. And so it was a very Jackal and hide game, right? So they set themselves up for people to be, I would say overly optimistic. And then when you see it come crashing down like in the second period, I think it forces people into a spot where they're like, well, you got me all excited. And now I look like an idiot for being all happy. I was going on early. And so I think that normally a game where if you just fast forwarded for somebody who's listed this that didn't watch the game, right? You go, hey, the Leafs are on the road against the Vegas Golden Knights and they got a point. They lost in a shootout. They go, yes, pretty good. That's a, that's kind of what it's expected.

5:04And yet it's like, no, here's what actually happened in this hockey game. So the first period, they're unreal. The second period, they get absolutely caved in. The third is a little bit more measured between the two teams. I think that the last like eight minutes or so, both teams definitely started playing just for the point. Where do you think we are closer to the truth with this hockey team? Because you kind of got three examples through three different periods. I think we're a little closer to last year than we all want to admit at times. I think that second period, mostly because we were also scared from last year that it looked a lot like last year for that second period. But a lot of that had to do with officiating penalties. They got, you know, they were, they were killing penalties. And it just kind of got away from them. And momentum got away from them. But yeah, like, I think I heard you talking there when I was supposedly waiting, but I wasn't waiting. I don't know what was happening. But like, yeah, I think it's just going to be a lot of this. I think they're going to score a lot. I think there's going to be a lot of up and down games. They are decor is leaves you extremely wanting. But yeah, like, I think they're a little bit

6:10closer to the second period than the third period. But I don't think they stink. Like, I don't know. I just, I think they're going to be a really, really fascinating jekyll and hide team to watch all year. Like you said, like, I think you laid it out perfectly. Yeah. Just did. There's a lot of offense and there's a lot of skill and there's not a lot of skill on defense. And they have really slow. And guys are going to get by in behind them and they're going to get behind in games. And they're going to have to score the way out of problems. And it's going to be fun to watch. But, you know, it may not be a brand of hockey that you're expecting to win a stand like up with. So last year, how many exciting offensive highlights do you think we got outside of knee lander? Not many. Yeah. Right? Not many. Not many. It was a season where knives was beat up where Matthews didn't quite look himself and then missed a good chunk of the season at the very end when they were already kind of dead and buried. You had a bottom six that just did not inspire. You had Matthias Michele. We nicknamed the mixtape. Like, you know, there were a couple of Robertson moments in there, maybe, but ultimately it was like it was a season where the most positive story was

7:14Oliver Reckman Larson. And we spent like a full month and a half debating how much the least we're going to get from at the deadline only for him not to get traded. And possibly our worst fears we confirmed that the outside of this. If only they had a listen to the entire fan base, they would have it like was her who didn't have the trade Oliver Reckman Larson day. Every single fan was like, oh my god, we have to sell high on this guy. It was, oh my god, I know, but there were a couple people going like, hey, if you're trying to be good next year, then maybe you keep them and he should be good. And what else are you going to do on the back end? There was a, I'm just saying there was a touch of that. I'm not, I'm not disagreeing that the populist position was you got to move this guy. But where I was going with this is just people are just, a lot of people are just going to be pumped up that they're scoring goals and that they're going to have exciting play through the neutral zone that they're going to have these pretty zone entries that they're going to have games where Marcenko is flying and Nielanders flying and McKenna has a play like the one

8:15that he had last night where, you know, there's, there's probably, there's probably thought that he was back in Tampa Bay when he got that pass from get mechanics is like, oh, Kutcherov is exactly where you used to put it for me. That's exactly where you would go and how you would set me up. So if Matthews continues to play this way, like I think that the Ross Levic experience so far has been overwhelmingly positive and he's been a hit for this team so far. But yeah, when you're talking all that goes, yeah, I think that's true too. It's no, I don't think anybody's getting too high, but you got to give him his flowers while he's playing this way, right? Yeah, exactly, which is what he's done throughout his career. But the part that you mentioned about being closer to last year is the defending and they have Chris Tanaf this season and he and McCabe feel like a stabilizing force, but those other two pairings and then also having the exciting offensive guys you know, Gavin McKenna's not Winisselki. Marchenko went in a selkie, Nila, he's not Winisselki. Ross Levic's not Winisselki. Like they've got a lot of guys now that are going to

9:15be eating a lot of minutes up in the top six who aren't going to be exactly, yeah, prime John Taves. Yeah, they really, they really struggle to go back on Pox and get the Pox at other own zone. Like, I got to tell you, I've loved Raddish and since that first game, I think he's gotten better and he's got confidence now and he's a really good offensive defenseman. Like he just has good instincts, but he's not exactly, you know, shutting it down back there either. He's not killing plays where it's like, hey, Puck goes into a corner and Raddish is going in there with somebody else. I'm not feeling like, oh, yeah, this is ours now. When he turns up with the puck on his stick, I have confidence that something's going to happen. Same. Which is he's the only guy outside of Tanaf that I can say that that's, you know, that's on the D-Core that I really have confidence in saying that. Like, Riley is sketchy with the puck on his stick these days. Obviously, you know, McCabe's never been snapping passes out there, stedure, you know, Troy's boys, but God, I mean, we're all hoping for Blankenberg at this point and all of Wreckman Larson looks like he's a hundred years old and got

10:17body slammed to the ice last night and who knows what he's even going to look like or if he's even going to play in Colorado. So yeah, like, I think we all saw what Chica did to this forward, Corb. And like, keep riding a whole new group. It is a different group of guys. And that's awesome. And like, I liked a lot of what he's done up there, but he's yet to put his stamp on the D-Core outside of radish. Like, it's 25, 26 and radish. Like, that's what the D-Core is. Like, it's just all the same guys and a lot of the same problems that we saw last year. But like, I think they're good enough upfront to score their way out of a lot of problems against what's going to be a lot of bad teams and national hockey league, right? Like, they can be decent with the offensive talent they have. And what we saw from Sergey Burbrowski last night was incredibly encouraging. I thought he was awesome. As long as you men in black stick, the penalty shot attempt. Yeah. If you do the men in black stick for that, then it's like, wow, he was really, really good. But I just, yeah, like, I think they're going to be really fun. But the D-Core is going to leave you wanting pretty much every single night until Chica makes a trade or brings somebody in. Yeah. They can eat two guys,

11:20right? Well, first of all, they've got no depth. Like, if you're hoping and praying for Nick Blankenberg, I don't think that that's what I mean. It's like, oh, that shirt has a bit good. I'm like, what do we think Blankenberg? Yeah, for sure. No, it's the new thing. It's just like, hey, he's new and he moves the puck and so people are like, also wears number three, which is a choice. Yeah. I thought that was retired. Yeah. I didn't see that you the number one beyond defender. In the market to this day, the guy who loved him the most that I know was as soon as the broadcast was talking about clavras, they mentioned Tyson Berry over. I was sick to my mom. I knew that you were going to say something. Oh my god. And I immediately saw these snap that tweet from him. Give me a break. Dion used to, he had some of the most ferocious slap shot bar down. Yeah, dude. The density put in the boards. Like, they're always still there. I still reply. Someone replied to my tweet. Yeah. Yeah. Most of the shots went straight into Jeffrey Lupel's brittle.

12:26Yeah. It is true. Yeah. On the on the power play, just getting hit with clappers in the leg. I was going to say, like, what do you think the percentage was of these clappers that hit the net? Like below 30. Yeah. I was going to say 14%. That was going to be my final number. If we could break down the numbers, if we had like the NHL edge stats on when they actually hit. So yeah. Now, oh yeah, the blue line. So people are hoping to pray in for Nick Blankenberg. It's like, okay, yeah, I don't really think that's going to cure the else of this hockey team. Does it maybe help some break out? Sure. Will he have a couple of moments where people point to them and go, hey, see, he can snap it. Absolutely. But in terms of what we're talking about, yeah, it's not going to be the greatest thing. One is if we're doing the fear, OEL looks old and quick sidebar of ref talk here. That was absolutely, I know we don't talk about the refs, but that was clear blatant interference. And okay, yeah, the rough thing one 2026, roughing. Like, I mean, when I was

13:29a kid, that's nothing. But now that's roughing. It's been roughing for four years. I think it's more just he doesn't touch the puck. And just because he almost touched the puck is not an excuse to be able to clean a guy out like that and right in front of the officials and in a game where, and I've been annoyed by this in the past with hockey where it's a one team has X amount of penalties. That means you need to start to help the other team catch up. I'm not a big believer in that mentality, right? But they do that. Yeah, but that's what I'm saying. When the refs do that pretty consistently and it happens right in front of you guys and you all huddled together and OEL goes right to the dressing room at us because he got hit when he didn't touch the puck and it was a borderline roughing. Yeah, like maybe just that's a spot. Did you guys wonder what happened to him? Yeah, okay. I didn't have a meeting about that. Can I tell you what I thought they were saying in the meeting? Where are we going after? There's only a minute 36 left of this hockey game. We just can't do this. We just can't do it right now. It's too late. It's too late in the game. We got to let them settle it. Yeah, you're right. All right, no call. Yeah, you all saw his penalty. Oh,

14:32absolutely. We did. Okay, but who cares? Just let it go. Anyway, you got old OEL and I'm really feeling this 10F thing where I'm every shift I go, we the Leafs can't lose them. The Leafs can't lose them. The Leafs can't lose them. And you think about the depth behind these guys and yeah, we all made the Emil Andre jokes, right? Where okay, he's gone. He's gets traded out of town in the nice deal. But God, they're thin, dude. They're just they cannot sustain any injuries and they're leaning on a guy in his late 30s to still be and who didn't play last season to be kind of the defensive anchor of this unit. And then again, you combine that with this forward group full of guys now who just, it's it's it's old Tavares, it's Nielander, it's Marchenko who does a lot of Nielander impressions in the D zone. It's just it's hard for me to see a pathway where we ever look at this group and say, yeah, you know what? I trust them with a two goal leader, even a three goal lead. Yeah, I did. It's

15:33good. Like, yeah, it's going to be a turn style all year, unless they bring in, I don't know, I like, I've loved what Nick Paul and Sizzle have done defensively. Yeah, Sizzle is notable. I actually think that Nick Paul for me and you know, me going into this season, not really looking forward to cheering for him. And I was my favorite player. I've been really impressed by him. Yeah, I predicted this though. I know, but his the work ethic defensively and the willingness to block shots and just get in the scrum gets in like pokes, pokes long just gets in the way. He's been really good defensively and they've gotten a ton of offense defensive zone starts and I've liked it. Like that fourth line to me, I couldn't tell you one thing about them really. Like, Bluger is a pretty good penalty killer. Do Hayne just skates around really fast and like, Bowgrew, whatever took a brutal penalty last night. But after Bluger didn't get a puck deep. Yeah, I mean, it's like both those guys combined for that penalty in my opinion. So that was that that was both of them should be sitting in the box without. But yeah, like I think they have guys with a defensive conscience and Matthews, man. I mean, that's a big positive. Like he's

16:38working hard and he's looking twitchy again and he's he's pursuing guys from the backside with the stick lifts again. And he just he looks hungry. He looks. Looks like he maybe hated Craig Marouba in quit last year, quite frankly, but you know, that's his different story for a different day maybe. But like they have guys with defensive conscience. But most of their off that like, Devars is going to do it. You know the guys, they're just not going to do it. So hope you like high scoring games. Yeah. And boy, like thinking about just sitting here now, thinking about what this decors going to look like going into Colorado on Saturday night, just feels like the most overwhelming thing on earth, doesn't it? Like, yeah, it just, they've struggled to defend off the rush. And they have multiple guys that have the picture in McKinney and Nature's flying down the wings. And I'm even like, oh god, oh god, oh god, oh god. It's not going to be an enjoyable watch. I don't think. No, we find Nick Blankenberg. Oh, you know, say, Blanks, like this former team. Yeah, Blankenberg will save the day. Okay, I was actually going to save this for a little later because I wanted to do, you know, some, yeah, just some basically overreactions,

17:41both from a positive and negative standpoint. Now that, uh, yeah, we've reached the, the, this game mark. And it's the end of the week. But I will start with Matthews just as kind of a huge positive, which is, yeah. You're right about everything you said. But what I will also add is he seems to have added this, like little Sundine piece to his game all of a sudden where we, we all said, hey, he needs to have a guy who digs pucks out for him. Hey, he's got to have a player on his line who acts as the forechecker and can go and retrieve the puck for Austin Matthews. And I will say this, I actually think Roslovic has done a pretty good job of flying into the zone and forechecking and turning guys over like he's given little pokes, little pokes, but he's given, he's been given great effort. Yes, he's not running people over. But I do think in terms of what he is provided on the forecheck, it's been a real positive so far. That being said, Matthews is doing this thing where he's going and retrieving pucks on his own. And then he's using his size in a way that I think we've been dying for for years. He's never going to be someone who's just hammering

18:43a player. He's not going to look like a power forward. But he's bumping guys off pucks. And then when he's getting them, he's holding it behind the net and creating plays for other was with time and using his body as a shield. And I genuinely, like I don't think that this is outside the rubber possibility that Matt Sundine came in and had a chat with him and was like, use your body behind the net. That's how I became a superstar in the league. And Matthews like sat down with some tape of him or had some skates with him. Like I don't know what it is. But this part of his game does feel new and it feels incredibly effective. I love the Sundine comparison because the down low work has been really strong. And like I mean, even go back to setting up Gavin McKenna's first goal where he made Steven Stamco's look like a hundred year old man where he just could not handle the size and the strength of Matthews, pushes him off, makes a great pass. But yeah, like I think a lot of having Mariner on his line for all those years was that Mariner was the transporter. Mariner was the setup guy. And you know, Matthews was the shooter. But like I think

19:48Matthews that one time, remember when it was him, Bertuzzi and Domey, right? Yeah, of course. They got redhawks. That was the best, that was the best stretch of hockey. Maybe you've Matthews career where he was playing the center role, carrying the puck, facilitating, getting it in deep, winning puck battles, getting it back out to the front of the net. Like yeah, maybe Matt Sundine was just sat him down with a mirror in front of him. It was like, you realize how big you are and strong you are like, you know, and you're feeling better, you're healthy. You look like you've lost a few pounds in a good way. Like you can do this and he's been doing it. I've been impressed, man. Like that's the biggest, you know, that's what if you're looking for reasons that they can be above good or into the playoffs, it's just like, what if I'm Matthews just top five player again? Like that, that helps. I don't think there's a bigger positive to the start of the season than the way. Matt Sundine. No, he just looks, he looks like he kind of used to. And he looks different than he used to. He just looks more, he just looks bigger and like he's more willing to use his body like you laid out. He's looking like Matt Sundine out there. And it's nice. He's really. He's really good. He cares. And the thing that I texted you that makes me like him again because of after last

20:52year with the USA stuff and, you know, it was a tough year for Matthews and Leaf fans, I think. But he's just being really nice to McKenna. We both love that. Yeah, he's just he's really like being nice and you know, McKenna probably went over to his place to watch football on Sunday and they were probably hanging out and he's like, Hey, you want to stay over here at my massive palace and one of my beautiful rooms. He's like, yeah, I'll stay over and yeah, he's just taking care of McKenna. We both love McKenna. I care about that stuff. Yeah. Now he gets to be the Marlow. Yeah, he's now. No, no, no, hey, but it's just yeah, even even the stuff where they, they showed him like warming up together, doing pop battles in the corner. Yeah, and it does have this air of, hey, that's nice. This is nice. Yeah, I like it. It does work my heart. I have to admit that like, I'm such a softie and I love Gavin McKenna so much talking about eating cheese on his chicken parm and baguettes and like, I love this kid. Like, I'm just I'm so invested in him and he just he warms my heart. I don't need I'm preaching to the choir here. The McKenna, like, yeah, you're from,

21:53you guys, you went on CBC, you con like, I don't have to reach to you, but it's just, it's nice to see him kind of take this role. I never thought he really would. He just got the McKenna instilled a whole new life into these guys. Yeah. I agree. Change the trajectory and they feel different and they just look like they care again. They look like they're having fun again. They don't look like they're dreading it like they did last year. And even even the year they went deep with Mariner, it didn't feel like it was everybody was having a great time all the time. You know, like him leaving was hanging over the whole thing. I don't know. It just feels like there's a real new sense of life. Anyways, yeah, no, but that there's a lot of truth to that. And you and I talked about this a million different times. So when you keep bringing back the same group of guys at the very top, and you saw, I think you saw it at the very end when all the frustration boiled over and we got clips of, you know, stop crying, bro, and the dry hair that these guys were sick of watching the failures happen in front of them. And you know how this is, if you're really good at what you do and things

22:57aren't working, you know, you can look internally and of course you should. And I think that's what leaders do. But ultimately you do start to look around and go, like, hey, well, what hasn't changed? Well, this. And that starts to frustrate you a little bit more. And I think that the, I've done this already a bunch of times on the show, but the injection of McKenna didn't just refresh the fan base. I think that there's a lot of refreshing that happened with the team as well. For the first time in a long time, Matthews and Neilander got to look at this group and say, yeah, this actually is really different. Like this isn't the same guys. And now we get to take on a different level of leadership, which Matthews in particular seems to be, yeah, thriving with. Embracing. Yeah, totally. So yeah, since you brought up McKenna, got to mention too, it makes that past last night. And this is a overreaction two different ways. So you would agree that as of this moment, he's the like Matthews have been the best player. But McKenna is the guy that kind of gets you out of your seat the most in terms of when his shifts are happening. You're paying the most attention. I'm looking for I'm looking forward to the shifts the most, which is insane considering

24:00the skill that's on the steam. Yeah. Yeah. I really, I really invested in I just love the kid and I just want to see his shifts. So yes, yes. And I would say that last night was yet another example of it seems like the game is already slowing down for him that he's processing things properly and does not look out of place until he has to go into a corner with someone or win a battle. That's the only time where it's like, oh, wait, he's really young. He doesn't really look as age. I've been really encouraged by McKenna. I don't know what your position is on the ice time stuff. Like I didn't mind him getting bumped down on the third line. I actually predicted it with my heart. I was like, yeah, they're probably going to try to shelter him a little bit more on the road. That makes sense. Maybe he'll, he got a look with Matthews up on the first line for one shift in that game. The three on three thing I don't understand. Hiller gave a quote where he was like, we had him. We were trying to get him. I'm glad you brought it. I pulled it up in front of me from Luke Fox at the cell last night. He said, he'll get out. Oh, I lost it. Here it is. He'll get out there sooner or later. Trust me. He's been called. If you ask him, I've probably called him three

25:02different times. But for whatever reason, he hasn't been able to get out there. They played 10 minutes of overtime. Like it's the weirdest quote of all time. Is he like blaming like what the hell is that quote? That sounds like he's been like, I've called McKenna. I've said, you could go. And then he doesn't want to go. He throws. He doesn't want to go. He throws on the bench. So Neil Andrew, I'm back. We're all looking for the guy who did this. It is such a weird quote. Has got it. So you want the media guys to go up to McKenna now and say, why didn't you go out on three on three when Hillary said you were tapped? It doesn't make any sense. Here's my only thing is if you were going to design player types for three on three overtime, it's like you would take a lot of what Gavin McKenna is and you would decide that that's what you want on the ice. So I'm a little confused as to what the reasoning would be that he knows like he's a Gen Z hockey player. He's been playing three on three their whole lives. Right.

26:05He's sick, skilled, great, pass or good in space. Like he's the ideal spot. And like I understood, like you have great players on the Leafs. Yeah. Like they're, they're forwards are unbelievable. So like I understand him not getting out there for a while. Matthew's in New England. I got to go. Marcianco, I guess in Tavaris, if you want, but God, he grinds out there. Ross Levix, a good three on three player like they have guys, but if Cowan's getting a shift, McKenna deserves a shift. Yeah. Cowan's gotten two overtime shifts now in the two games. I actually think we're sure to have been McKenna. You know, Hillary, it's five games in or whatever. I'm not going to get on the coach. You know, my radar is up on him. I'm pretty interested in him and listen to what he has to say and kind of learn in this guy or whatever. But I actually think that they're deploying McKenna really well. And I think that third line has changed with him on it. That it's like there's actually a threat for offense on their top three lines now. Like they had chances that third line had chances last night with McKenna out there making great passes Nick Paul, Nick Paul sneaky good offensively like Sizzens is just a kind of a punt guy,

27:08but he's really good defensively and you can just see what they like about him. But there are two things that pissed me off is that he's not getting on the top power play unit that is screaming out for him. Like it's just it's desperate for him. They exactly what they need is him and he should get an overtime shifter too. But that would be my only complaint about the deployment. And even look at yesterday where they they do this move sometimes they've done this twice where they've done the stagger thing. Where he goes out with the top power play unit and it's still most of the same guys. And immediately they have the puck more and it's like just do it. I get like trying to pay his dues or whatever. But it's trying to win or you're trying to have five guys who don't pass out there still. Well, not exactly same thing as last year. Like just replace knives with Marchenko who doesn't pass either. Yeah. Like Tavares is every play the entries with Tavares are dying on his stick. Like if only there was a slippery guy who had great hands who was great at entries and great at passing and good at opening up seams. If only they had something but somebody like that. Like the only explanation is them trying to act tough. There's no other explanation.

28:10Well, it's not just that it's it's the same it is partially the same problem that they've had in years past, which is you've got five highly paid guys. Well, the March isn't highly paid anymore. Well, I get the share but yeah, that's fair. That's fair. But you've got five guys that he's already still playing second line. Sure. He's still getting nice time. Like at some point here, you got to make a tough decision and the decision time is coming close because it's not good. The top unit's not good. I agree. And it does seem painfully obvious. And my thing is, if you really want mechana to feel a measure of confidence, right? Like putting them in spots where you can succeed. That's the main thing of the handling. And that's why I think you and I both been fine with the deployment. I would only say that my only caveat to the Paul Sizzin's thing is there have been moments and I know I'm hypersensitive to this. Like I get it. Like I'm really rooting for the kid. But we're watching every pass. Exactly. And it's breaking down into these tiny little microcosms. And those ones stick out my brain more. But there are moments where those

29:11two guys I feel like because of some of the lack of offensive ability, don't get them the pockets in some of the areas that they should be getting them to pocket. Yeah, exactly. So whatever, in terms of transition place, that's a minor, minor, minor detail. But ultimately, yeah, the power play thing, you just have to try to get them going there and feeling himself and let him play like all those little dangles that he makes those little telephone plays, those those passes that he can float into the middle of the ice, those scoring opportunities that he can create for others. This is the time to do it. And this is sort of what we're talking about with the three on three stuff is though, if you were going to pick two scenarios that Gab McKenna should be playing in right now, like kind of almost unquestionably, it should be power play. And three on three. So figure out a way to push past the veteran piece of this and get him those spots. And it's you can get away with it now because it's so early in the season. And it's five games and this is their first road game. You're right. Like the earn it piece is fine. Sure. But

30:13the patience is going to get thinner and thinner if he continues to look like a capable player offensively. And he's not getting those opportunities and the power play stays stagnant. Alfie watch, bud. Yeah, Alfie watch on a fish on other positive thing. That game it starts off three nothing and you think, oh, this is going to be just an offensive. Wow, look at them go. They're just a completely different team. And it turns into a Bob night. Yeah. So know what I loved about it. And something that I've hated so much with Sarah Gaber Browski over the years of the Panthers is sure they get back into that game. And like the leaves have done this against them against the Panthers so many times where maybe the Panthers, go up early or with the other way. And he lets in three and you get back in it and you're like, oh, yeah, great. And then he just shuts it off. Then the valve gets turned off. How many playoff games did you see like that? Like think about think about even that game that they lost. Remember,

31:13the playoff game where they went up three one to have a chance to go through the game. I remember. I remember. Yeah, everyone remembers. Yeah. Do you remember? Do you remember? He just turned it off. They got three goals. And that was halfway through the second period, I think. And maybe they got one more. But like he just he just locks in in these games. And there's no better example of that than that cross-seamer where he just gets the glove off Rob's them. Pucks were getting deflected into his feet weird all night. Like it was just a fight for it night. And it just is why I love and hated Bob Rosski is that you can get a few by him early. But like when that gets to winning time, he locks in. And that's what happened last night. I just thought he locked in as long as you met him black stick the penalty shot. Yeah, the penalty shot was tough. But the rest of the game was pretty quality. I thought that early on there were a couple moments where he was having difficulty tracking the puck. And then he just started to battle. He was, he really did as you put it. He locked in. He made a bunch of crucial saves. It also feels like

32:17when there's moments where the other team is just kind of scrambling and the Leafs are scrambling in front of their own net. And it's these just stay battle plays. He just, he was able to track and he was able to find it. He was able to look kind of calm in those moments. Like he doesn't get overwhelmed by them. He doesn't seem to get himself to out of position. A couple of times where it's like he loses his stick. But it still feels like he's got his position. That was a really encouraging Bob Rosski game. Like almost more than anything else that you could have taken away from that game. Like again, we've done the math use thing and whatever to Bob Rosski hadn't really had a moment so far this season. And again, it had been two games. This is third. But that was a pretty calming effort. If you were like Matt Sundin and you're apparently the guy that really pushed to get this dude, you're pleased. And you can say, Hey, I think we got that point tonight because of the new goalie that we signed. 100%. He was unbelievable in that second period. And he had to be like there's power plays everywhere. The Leafs were stuck in mud. The long change got them. Like they couldn't do anything in that second period. And Bob just a common influence back there.

33:19I listen, like he's just a veteran high pedigree Stanley Cup caliber of Vezna goalie that may not be what he used to be clearly, but he still got it in there. And this is like nights like that. It's easy to say here. Nights like that are why I'm happy they signed them. Oh yeah, there you go, buddy. But you know, it's just like he's a really good NHL goalie who had a horrible year. And he just looked like a good NHL goalie in their last night that just shut it shut it down. Yeah, I'm stoked about him. I am. And like stole it. If they can keep both those guys healthy, I don't think you have to worry about the goal 10 and too much. Stole ours harder to keep healthy than Bavroski obviously. But if they can keep Stole ours healthy and get them to 30, 35 starts, maybe mixing a couple of actium of load management games or whatever with Bavroski. But like if those two guys are their main two goalies for the year, they should be okay in that. So yeah, I agree. So one of the interesting things with this team is some guys are going to get a lot of patience. And then some aren't right? Like you're seeing this, we've done it with the blue line. It's just not going to

34:23get a lot of patience. There's not going to be a ton of people that say, don't worry, give a time to coalesce. They're going to judge it accordingly game to game. It doesn't matter that it's five games the way that they're defending. You're going to look at that and say, yeah, that's that spooky scary stuff. You're going to look at Gav McKenna. And if he has bad nights, you're going to say, yeah, man, whatever. He's 18 years old and he's got three points and he's had some good moments. And that's what you expect from this guy. Give it some rope, give it some time. How do you feel about that when it comes to Marchenko? Because part of me goes, well, he's new to the team and he's got these new lines. I feel that. Yeah. Speaking of hot takes. But that's like extra. But then here's the thing though, man, is you make this trade with the idea that he's going to be way better than nice because you paid him a lot more than nice. So like that's the obvious thing that and you gave up a bunch of other assets to do so. So yeah, he's got to be, I would say an impact player, like pretty much every night. Yeah, much ask like Gary.

35:27Well, he's only making three something this year. So naturally, yeah, sure. This year, you can give him a little leeway. He's not making any money this year, but it's the idea of what he's going to make next year. Listen, I thought I just thought I'd be more born away on a night tonight basis. That's it. That's my that's my takeaway from it. It's early. He's still getting new teammates. It just feels like there was a little bit of chemistry in the first couple games where he came shot at a cannon, him and Matthews. But it feels like since then they haven't completed a pass to each other. I don't know. It's just they feel like kind of independent contractors out there together. And then they dropped him down the yesterday. He was playing with Tavares a little bit. Like I see it. I see things from him that I'm like, yeah, okay. He's big. He's strong. He's fast. That shootout goal was nasty. Like he discussed that look easy. Yeah, like that was sick. But I don't know. It just he's a different. He just flies in and rests in a lot. Like just a lot of flying out the wing and rested it and kind of shooting into the shin pads. Like is he pressing a bit? Because he's on a new team and trying to impress his teammates or whatever. Like it just, you know, it hasn't.

36:30He had a couple of chance. Less than he had that tip on the power play that ends up going out. And they, you know, if he scores, it could be a different story or whatever. But just maybe it's just at a point where I'm not sure what he is totally. And I'm still trying to figure him out as a thing. You know, I just they traded Matthew and I's for him. Yeah. Right. And we all liked Matthew. And the second and the meal on trade. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like they gave up a boat load for him. Yeah. And especially when you look at this team and Matthew and I is your best trade chip. And you don't trade him for a center or you don't trade him for a demon and you trade him for another winger. He's going to be measured against that. And like people can say it's early and like all typical Toronto media getting on guys like they needed a win last night. You know, they were in that game. He was on the ice like would have been a great opportunity for him to shoot one in the net and over time or in regulation or whatever. He's paid like a game breaker. He's got to break some games. Yeah. So that's it for me is. So you do get a measure of patience because you're new with the team. Yeah. And they're trying to figure out as among other guys, right? Like who fits where and who's going to be able to like we're doing it with McKenna. We've done it with Paul. We're

37:32doing it with Cowan, right? Like it's going to happen with Ross Levic. Go on down the line. Guys are going to be discussed as hey, they're still getting their feet underneath them. Hey, shortened preseason early in the year flew in. No one's going to just make a definition on what this trade is for a lot of like a long time to come. That's a that's a two three years from now thing, right? Where we look back at this trade and say who won? It's not happening this year. That being said hasn't been a great start. No. Outside of the first game where he was arguably the best player on the ice. It's been kind of underwhelming and you're right. It is a lot of wristers. But also, I would say that's actually not the most concerning thing to me because I think that he's creative offensive player who's going to make dynamic plays off the rush. And there's going to be a lot of moments this year where he just has highlight goals and you just say, whoa, that's what you pay the money for is there's only so many guys in the league that are true game breakers and he could be one of them. But I off the puck and in the D zone. Little spacey. There's a lot of knee lander.

38:42Oh, yeah. Well, this minus two off his 88 and put 86 out there. And yeah, it's just like he can be he's again, it's going to be frustrating because it's like Willie has all the skills to be a good defensive player and so does Mark Chancel. And they're just like they're offensive guys. It's not what they get paid the big box to do, I guess. But yeah, I see it. I agree with that. That's that's been the part where I go. All right, this is going to be a long runway. I think you're going to be good. I think you're going to be the better player. I think you're going to score a lot of nice goals. I think there's going to be a lot of nights where you elevate this team and you know, provide the offense that they sorely need, the speed that they sorely need. But I think you're going to you're going to piss me off a lot of games. I think I think there's going to be a lot of nights where I'm pissed off. And you do a thing that that people here are going to notice that they probably didn't notice in close. I mean, he made a horrible turnover along the boards that led to the penalty shop by Jack Ikel, right? Like poor, poor Morgan, who's, you know, his, his superpower was skating,

39:43who looked like he had cement boots on there. Yeah. Well, I mean, he's going up ice and that has to turn back against one of the, you know, pop five skater in the NHL, like he had no chance. By the way, penalty shots now, just like you have a step, it's a penalty shot. Like you get those optics. To me, like you have to be on a five step break away and hook down from behind. To be a penalty shot. Like he had one step there and they got in on him. And it's like penalty shot. I thought it was borderline, but yeah, I, all right. Yeah, he was honed up. He wanted to point the centerize horrible. I thought if I was doing ref talk, my two things would be OEL and then the gab McKenna was it hook in the enemy slashing? Yeah, it's like then, then Luzon assaults over at the Larsen, they're like, play on, but boy, that hook that grazed his glove is far too dangerous. That's an attraction. That was aggressive. Okay. I got two more topics for you. I'll probably only be able to fit this one in. Yeah. So obviously, I didn't want Mitch Martyr's score.

40:46And when the game's tied in the puck, it's on his stick. I felt a level of anxiety where I was like, not this, not this, anything but this. Bob got him an overtime when he shot that little muffin into his car. Yeah. Yeah. That was huge. Yeah. I don't know what he was thinking there, but yeah, it's like a little cute, whatever didn't work out. Yeah. But it does feel like a lot of Mariner closure. And yeah, it's just, it's already really not the same. Again, I will never root for the player. The deeper he goes and the Vegas Golden Knights will now be the team out west that I root against as long as he's there. Like it's just that's just the way it's going to be. And again, I really was hoping, man, if they lose this game fine, but just do not lose it where Mariner's the story because he walks this off. But in terms of like the flow of the game, I didn't think about it nearly as much as I thought I was going to. Yeah. I've said this before, but we all saw our own death. But like, you know how close to where it last year? Yeah. To the worst possible thing. Yeah, Bruins could have the fifth overall pick and Mitch Martyr could

41:49have won the Stanley Cup ring. Yeah. Yeah. And like, you could have brought it back to Toronto. Yeah. And like, like, and like Matthew Nies could have been traded. A lot of colleges and you spoke, it would have been on Airbnb that summer. I just mean, like we and Kipper famously yell at each other about Mariner all the time. We didn't even talk about Mariner yesterday. Like we mentioned it. Like, always playing back to playing wings, slow offensive start, a lot of defensive responsibilities. I don't know. I just I don't feel like when McCabe rocked them, leaves Twitter liked it. But I just I just think we were also close to the worst possible outcome that whatever man, like once it gets to playoffs, I think it'll be scary again because they're obviously good. But like, I don't think I'm going to play at home. It'll feel a little different. Yeah. It'll definitely when it comes here and he gets the questions again and that whole the whole circus will be around him again or whatever. And if he scores here and but like last year was just the least were so bad right away that we all just like needed to glom on to something to be mad about. And that was like the biggest thing we talked about. And

42:51now it's just the least of shiny new toys. Yeah. I just I don't I really don't think about it, which is nice. I think the toxic. It was a toxic earbud. Yeah, it really was. And I think that that's a big piece of it is that it reached such a high high that now a regular season game in Vegas five games in the season. And kind of like, yeah, whatever. It's just not a yeah, it was what he looked like last night though. Yeah, he did. And but but it's like last year there was the Olympics and he scores the big goals. Yeah. The narrative was beaten down over and over and over again. Now it's just and then cup run and this and how bad the Leafs looked and the looming of the pick going to Boston. It just it you're right. It's just you can't go from that type of rush to Friday or Thursday night at 10 o'clock and think about it to say. I'm lying on the couch with a blanket over me. I'm not really like that. It's like whatever. I'm just I'm gonna lax and I agree. I think it's the same. I think there is a real measure closure that part of it was that it was so extreme the first year that it's hard to replicate that moving forward. That's exactly it. Last thing. Yeah. This is quick because I go to I go to like I don't know 80% of the

43:54baseball games I go to or with you. And have gone to have been with you. Yeah. Have you seen the like baseball discourse that's been going around recently about kids and foul balls or home run balls? I have not. Okay. So I've really trained in my algorithm. I've kind of been off. I've trained it. I just I don't like I'm not liking baseball stuff. Yeah. I'm just you know me. I'm deep in the baseball. I just I love. Listen, like I watch it. Yeah. But I'm totally detached. Okay. So I can't really watch the Dodgers. It was the Braves game and a guy catches a foul ball and there's like someone breaks out the phone is like give it to the kid and the kids couple rows back and the guys like I've come to a million games and I I'm not giving that ball that kid and they're kind of like that. Yeah. Right. Like if you want to keep the ball you can keep the ball. I agree. But at the same time I would never. Yeah. Same. I actually think that for me part of catching the ball is the joy of being able to give it to a kid that being said I do have rules for the age of the kid. Of course.

44:57My own system of rules is I don't every guy who's ever got to a blue James game has worked out the scenario in the game. Okay. Good. All right. If one like you the ball comes here you grab it if you catch if you bear hand it and you put your hand on that's the greatest thing of all time. And you get everybody get the cheer. Yeah. And then you look for the closest kid and you flip it to him and you go there you go. You're all scab and then the prettiest girl in the stadium who happens to be sitting right there is like wow what a what a good guy you are. That's their Mickey from what's that what a great guy. Yeah. Yeah. For me the kids got to be over five like under five. Like if you're a kid with a ball if you're there with a glove you're the primary target. You came here trying to get this ball. 100% if you're a kid that is just like staring into space and has no idea where they are and it's just completely. Yeah. I got headphones on. It's like you're not getting my ball. It's not happening. It's just not going to happen. And that was the scenario this guy had and I just hate the the pressure now of like you've taken a thing

46:02that used to just be nice like a generous act and you've turned it into something that's coerced by phone culture and that part of it really bothers me. But yeah. I think this is what we're pulling it down to his ball lowers no. And that we need to take back the gesture as being something that is gracious. Not something that is just a given. Our Gannick. Yeah. You know like it's like oh there's a kid that looks like he wants a ball or she wants a ball there. I will say the best clip ever came from a Blue Jays game with that kid sitting front row. Yeah. And he had the he had the spare ball and he scooped up ball and he kept the gamer and he gave the other one to those two girls. Yeah. That was unreal. I thought you're going to mention the Yankees kid with judge. But yeah. That's that was a fucking fucking tabby like being like explaining it. That was the best. I just know time. He's got the gamer. Breaking it down like it's John Madden. That's so good. All right. We'll see you next week. Funny. Oh pleasure. But don't see you pal. All right. Quick break. The white socks blow it.

47:02All right. A lot of MLB news yesterday. One we get a new proposal about league changes to formats that the MLB owners proposed. Fewer regular season games, the longer DS, seven games, instead of five. And the teams can pick their opponents in the postseason, which I think is pretty compelling. The problem I have with it. And I'll probably discuss it next week a little bit more in detail. It's just such a smoke screen thing. It's like this is about the salary cap. People just want to know about the cap. Is there if you're really going to die in the hill of needing a salary cap, then we're going to miss games. And if you're not, then then let's talk about that stuff. So it's interesting. And there's a couple things in the proposal that I find to be compelling. And I'm personally like appears. I don't mind the DS being five games. I actually prefer it that way because you get exactly what has happened here with this white socks series,

48:03which is they've used up all the bullets in the gun. The guardians have done everything they possibly can from pitching standpoints are exhausted going into game five because everything is do or die. But whatever, that's what is going to sell to non baseball people more and they want to grow the game. So whatever, it's not going to be the biggest of deals to me. But yeah, I'm not really all the way forward. I love the picking opponents thing. But let's sort out the cap thing first. And then we can have discussions about what else is going to happen to the game moving forward. So white socks guardians, the only series that ends up going the full the full freight, the full five games. And it was weird game last night. It's back and forth. The white socks taken early lead. They haven't clinched since 1906 at home, which I'm sure everybody knows now has become basically a synonymous to 67 in terms of people knowing when a team did a thing. But they just they look like an inexperienced group. And I thought that Will Vanneble had a really tough game. You know, he got really cute with Fettie trying to bring him back out there for the

49:06fifth inning. Then he turns to Anthony K in a part of the lineup that didn't particularly make a ton of sense. And again, I know these teams have used up a lot of these arms, but I just didn't I didn't think it was great bullpen management from their coach. But the guardians, this is now a very interesting game five from the standpoint of we all thought Gavin Williams was going to start in game five that they were going to have their pitching lined up. And they got this big lead. And you think, okay, what an advantageous position. Not only is this young white socks team blown a series lead, but you've got a guardians group that's set up so much better from their starting pitching standpoint. And now, you know, Canadian, Kate Smith, somebody who viewed as one of the more reliable relievers in all baseball, he threw 31 pitches in game four. And he's thrown in every single game. Gavin Williams had to come in and give them 18 pitches because Kate wore down in that ballgame, gave up a bomb and then a walk and they went, all right, we got to go, go, got to go to the big dog.

50:10Foster Griffin through 53 pitches in game three. All their relievers have been taxed immensely. And the white socks, a team that also was in a similar position with their pitching, doesn't really have the depth of starting pitching, especially up at the top that the guardians have. And also their pen has been overworked over taxed. They had another game where it was an opener. They got a couple of innings from Fetty, but then they ended up using like their best reliever, Grant Taylor completely fell apart in this ballgame. It's going to be fascinating in game five. Who can just get over the finish line? But if you're that raised team, you're just looking in your chops. You're looking at what's happening here with these teams and going, yeah, you're in a blood bath and we just swept the Yankees. And everybody's going to be totally refreshed in the ALCS for our team. So this would be an all time blown opportunity if the race don't end up in a world series. Because yeah, whoever's getting in there, I just, I don't know how much of a fight they're going to be able to put up. They're going to be, they've emptied the tank and they're not even at the finish line yet. All right, quick break. Scott Turner 15 years as a pro football coach to set up week five.