Session 145: Carly Rae Jepsen

0:00For decades, a shadowy organization called the Aleminavi has kept lemon on top and lime in the shadows. Look around, lemon-forward sodas, even lemon-forward songs. We ran the tracks, slowed them down, reversed them, and squeezed out the truth. That's lemon propaganda right there. But now, 7 up is fighting back with their new lime lemon soda. Showing the 7 up rising, flip the set. Today on Therapus, we have... Well, you know what, Manny? Let me let you do the introduction. Oh my god. Okay. Hi, Pussies. Tonight on Therapus, we have the wonderful, the amazing, the wickedly talented Carly Ray Jepson.

1:04Whose new album, Day and Night, a double album, is out now. What does Carly Ray Jepson mean to you, Manny? Oh my god. She means everything to me. Like, her music is just one. It's like catchy as hell. It's so good. It's like, I dance for all the time. But also, like, I've gone through breakups. I've gone through friendship things, whatever. All her songs have something meaningful that, like, I relate to and they're fun. Most of them, some of them are sad. But like... Even the sad ones are fun. I know. I know. We are missing the writings on the wall. Your type. Oh, duh. Yeah, I know. And that's a type of girl for you. And I'm not going to pretend. That I'm the type of girl you call more than a friend. Oh my god. That song is one of the most perfect pop songs ever. I know. And it just so happens to also exist on the album with another perfect pop song, right away with me.

2:08Dù, di-hè, di-hè, du… Dù, di-hè, dù. Dù, di-hanó! Dù, di-hanó! Dù, di-hè, di-hè, du… Dù, di-hanó! Dù, di-hè, di-hanó. Dù, di-hanó. I wanna wave, I wanna wave with you. Ooh, this is the part everyone sees. I don't know that's fine. Think it's a night, and then sleep, and sleep, and I wanna wave. I wanna wave with you. Ooh, cause you make me feel like I could be driving you all night. And I'll find your lips in the street lights. I wanna be there with you.

3:10Ooh, oh baby, tell me to the feeling. I'll be your tonight's secret. Where the lights go out, run away with me. Run away with me, baby. I just can do all songs every single minute. I'll be your tonight's secret. Where the lights go out, run away with me. Run away with me. Ladies and gentlemen, Carly Ray Jopson, her new album, Day and Night, is out now. And if you haven't heard it, please listen to it. She is one of the greatest pop stars of our life. I agree. Plus, he's enjoyed the episode. I love you. Here to talk about her eighth studio album, Day and Night, Carly Ray Jopson.

4:13Hello. Hello. Thank you for being here. It's my pleasure. I'm so excited. I am so excited. Emotion is like seriously. I know we're here to talk about your new album, but I have to touch on emotion, which is my favorite album of all time. I die. I don't know. You've known to say that. Thank you so so much. And is it true that it was born? You wrote it while you were in Cinderella. It, yeah, that's how it started, at least. I was in the middle of singing really sweet soft songs. Being a princess, which was lovely. And then in the evening, I, like, late at night after that, or sometimes during the day, I needed some, I needed some percussion back in my life. And I was listening to a lot of, like, Prince albums, and I thought, the 80s, man, there's something about the 80s that is just so hard on your sleeve, like, cut to, like, all of the feelings. And I actually just said that, didn't I? Yeah. But I wanted, I wanted to go there. That's my favorite song.

5:13Is it really? That is my favorite song. Hey. Hers is a warm blood. Hey. I mean, yeah, no, I really wanted to do something different. I always wanted to do something different. Same with Day and Night. It's just, it's really exciting to kind of go explore a different sonic world than you've been in before. Right. Yeah. And because I read that you were initially wrote, like, a folk album, and then you scrapped it, and then it was kind of foky. It was a little, like, grungy. I don't know what it was. I, I think I was rebelling, call me maybe, when I went in the studio right away, which I think is a natural reaction to. Of course. I was like, oh, it was very, like, sweet and funny and cute with that song. But now I want to do something serious. I was looking for, you know, all the other things that I loved about music, which I came from a very folk-influenced family. Like, we grew up on Joni Mitchell and Leonard Cohen and Kat Stevens. And so it felt like my roots to find something a little foky grungy. And I remember writing a lot with Tegan and Sarah. I met some New York people who got what I was going for. And I felt like that was an important time for me to get something out of my system.

6:17And yet, I hadn't found it yet. And if you know me, I know. And I find it. And the first song that I wrote for my emotion where I actually was like, okay, I know what it is I want to do. And it's this was actually the song emotion. And I came home and I felt that sort of excitement of like, okay, I want to discover what this world feels like. And it's 80s pop. I want to live there. And I want to figure out what my spin of that looks like. And did you, when you talk about writing and creating music, do you start with a beat? Like a track? Yeah, like a track. Or do you start with lyrics? Usually I think there's no usually actually. I was going to start talking and then I realized I had no idea where I was going. It's always different. I think that's why it's going to be like an art form that I'll never really fully understand or completely be a master of. I think it's something you're constantly learning at. And what I love about approaching music from different angles is you'll get a completely

7:20different outcome. So when you're arriving with, or when I'm arriving with like collaborators that I've been in the room with for a long time that know me well that I feel intimate with, my favorite thing to do is just like play. And what that means is like someone grabs a guitar and I grab one of these and we just like riff and we sing and we talk about what's going on in each other's lives and something kind of just really naturally stands out to us. I more often than not love a kind of writing that I call almost like free form writing where you're just sort of singing without judging it too much. And then like an idea or two will come out from that. That feels really exciting to me. But every once in a while I'll get like a concept too, like a good old fashioned like LA concept where I'm like, I really want to write about like the dating scene in LA or I really want to talk about you know something quite specific. And then I'll like, I'll be talking with friends about it. But I'll be like almost like collecting intel for my song for like months. Is that how like LA hallucinations started? Oh my gosh. LA hallucinations just came from like my deep confusion and at the time hate of Los Angeles

8:24was just wild because I live here still now and I've grown to love it. But at the time I did not understand. It's somewhere you have to grow to love. Yes, it's a slow burn. Yeah, it is. And you know, I mean we were touching on this before in the other room but New York is like I'm in immediately. Whereas Los Angeles, I needed to find my people. I needed to understand the art of the like the poetry of the city. It's kind of hidden. Yeah, you have to like go digging. And it's also like you're at the mercy of a car. Whereas in New York, like you have this automatic like autonomy of just being able to like take your body anywhere you want without a vehicle. 100%. And I don't know about you. But I'm like, it's hard for me to go out and be social. Like I kind of am a little bit of like a home body. I like my comforts. And so with New York, I feel like I pushed into socialness. Like I just walk on the street and all of a sudden there's a bookstore and I have this opportunity to be like romance by a place and surprised by like the spontaneity of it.

9:27And it brings something out in my partner and I too where we're like more spontaneous together. Where like should we go get ice cream in the rain? Yes, yes, yes. I should like and like where else would I do that? Where in like last I'm just like should we go get ice cream in the rain? And you're like, for so long, it's like never raining. Actually today it is. But generally you're like, I mean, okay, like getting the car. It's like a whole journey. It's a whole journey. Yeah, exactly. Like in New York, I'm like, I'm walking down the street the other week and I'm like, oh my god, there's a record store. I don't even have a fucking record player. And I walk it. You don't have. Whoa. Well, now I do. Now I do. Now I do. Okay, but record players. They hit different. I was at my friend Will's house the other day and he like put on like, like, I think it was like a James Taylor record and it was just like really set the mood and the vibe. And like it was like, I was like, this is so different than just listening to music on TV. Well, in this day and age, I think it's a rare moment that you listen to an album and

10:28it's completion. You're generally skipping. We have access to it all. You're like, okay, James, it was a vibe. I want to jump to this. But if you put on an album, you're committed for a second until that needle pops and I feel like that is nice to slow life down a little bit and like live in the world that the artist has created for you. James Taylor, I think you must know, but he's one of the biggest inspirations of all time. Yeah, fire and raindrops, one of my favorite songs of all time. Think about how many times he's saying that song. That gave me some feel better about calling maybe. He's like, that's not so much. I'm like, him and I should start a support group and be like, how many times did you sing your song? Do you get tired of singing Call Me Maybe? I mean, no, because it takes on quite a different, I mean, the answer is no now. There was a definite time when the answer was yes, when that's like all I had made. But I think enough albums have come by and enough shows have happened where it's now it's just sort of like an nostalgic moment and it doesn't feel like my moment. It feels sort of like the crowd takes over and you kind of feel people like, I mean, go remember when and how this was a part of their life.

11:30So it feels celebratory and it feels like a quick kind of moment in the set that sort of passes by sweetly. Yeah. It's also like, I don't associate you as like with Call Me Maybe as I do with as much with run away with me or your type or like, you know, like all these like, it's like I there you are so much more of an artist than that just that one song. That's wild. And thank you. It's true. Like it really is true. Like talking about listening to an album in completion, a motion is one of those albums that I can literally listen to front to back without skipping a song because it just like takes me on this like masterful journey. It starts with run away with me and like, you know, and you're like basically asking the listener to run away with you and it works. But before you released a motion, did you feel like this pressure to follow up? Call me maybe or like frustration almost? You know, I felt a mixed bag of things that's hard to like totally go back there and remember.

12:33But I do remember a really clear moment of just like an epiphany that someone gave to me, my guitarist gave to me actually Tavish Crowe where we were walking in New York together. And he sort of like my main man in terms of like adopted brother in a weird way in my life. He's always been a support. And he sort of said, with this song, you now have a stage for the first time in your life to actually show the world what I already know about you, which is like all the other types of music that you have in you. And he's like, so if you stop thinking of like trying to follow that up, but instead just like know what you know and like now create what you want to, this could be an incredible opportunity. And it's just like, like I was thinking, how am I going to keep doing the same thing because they like this? And that's one element of what I do, but it's not all of it. And I think ultimately if I had tried to keep making Call Me Maybe, I would have been really deeply unsatisfied as an artist. So it was nice to honor that that's like one flavor of what I love. But he was right. It was a chance for me to kind of shake off any expectations and just do what I only know

13:37how to do, which is make music from a really honest place. But I wasn't able to go the right away. It's fine. I kind of took a detour and did like Cinderella. Right. I just needed a second to like get my bearings, figure out what it was next. And that's how emotion was born. Yeah. Do you, I must ask how the song run away with me was born? Because that, like that is one of the most cinematic songs of all time in my opinion. Did it start with the horns? Did it start with the lyrics? Yeah, it did. So this is the one I went to Sweden and the land of pop as we are now. Right. And I met with Matthias and Robin and Noony Bow. And I think their, the producers names were Matt Men and Robin. I was so excited to meet them. And it was our, it was our meet cute actually. And they showed me a couple different tracks that, I think they played me like eight different things. And when they played the riff for the day, day, day, day, day, I like stood up and I was like, this one, let's play it like this today. And we didn't really know what we were going to make yet.

14:38In fact, I think the beginning of the song that, that actually you hear today, that was our entry point was the, and it was to this line, Oh Dominica. Like it was a completely, really, like it just started there. And I went home with a song about a guy named Dominica. Yeah. And I was like, all right, there's something to it though. And like a couple months later, we call again. And I was like, I think we need to go back to Sweden and finish this song. And we went back and we, we worked it. They even challenged ideas of the song that I thought were right. And then we got them better. I think in that song, I learned about the art of reworking something. Because I think it took on four different forms or three different forms before we got it right. And it sounds quite simple, but doing simple pop is more complicated, I think, than people realize. Because it's a lot about what you take out as much as what you keep in. And once we landed on it, I don't think we, we knew exactly how the world would respond. But we knew how we felt. And we were all like dancing while we were making that song.

15:40I always think that's a really good sign. When you released emotion, were you anticipating a call me maybe quick fire success or were you, were you ready for it to be more of like a slow burn of people to find it and love it and make it theirs? You know, it's interesting having a partner now. And he's really offered some perspective on my personality of like little blind spots that I didn't know. And I've become aware that I've always existed as like a little bit of a worst case scenario person. Like I do actually find comfort by thinking like what's the worst possible thing that could happen here? Am I okay with it? I don't know if that's like a dark quality or it's just a quality. Or if it's just like how I've survived. It's just a quality. Yeah, okay, cool, cool, cool. For the same way. Oh, I'm the biggest catastrophess in the entire world. So when I say that I had no expectations, I had no expectations. Like I was pretty sure the world had forgotten that this was just going to be like some little pet project for me and that, you know, I would hope that if somebody got it, at least somebody got it. And so, yeah, no, I, if anything, I was just more delighted even at our first like little

16:44club show. I was like, they know the words. Like we put this out like four days ago and they know the words dead. Not just one song, but every song. And that to me was a victory and then what happened after that was sort of wild beyond my wildest dreams to be honest. Yeah. What do you love about pop music? Like what, what is your, like, because how much time do you have? I have all the time in the world. I mean, I just say that. I mean, the other thing is though there's so much that I hate about pop music. And like that's what I think is so interesting. And I've said this before, it's a genre that it's like a love hate genre for me. Like that when it's done well, I love it. And when it's done poorly, I cannot wait to turn it off. And I think just realizing, I think that we all have that reaction to pop music. I think that's why it's so like cutthroat. Like you know, like it's a hard genre to play in because you're going to, I think it's very rare you hear a pop song and you're like, I'm okay on it. People have like intense opinions about it. And so do I.

17:45I don't know. I think that what I love is its ability to like transport you to a feeling that maybe you've had before or that you want to feel that you haven't had yet, where you can kind of take on in a very cinematic way somebody else's emotion. I think its ability to connect people is very exciting. I love that part of it. I think that's the joy of my life of seeing the connections that happen and the way that it can kind of, I don't know, become somebody else's song and no longer yours. I think that that feels amazing to me when that happens. But when it's done badly, what do you think makes it bad? By the way, I have written a lot of bad pop songs myself. And when it happens, I'm like, oh God, and it haunts me to this day that I've like let some of those out. But it's just, I mean, you're swinging your mess. That's part of being in this too. I think when it's bad, to me when it's bad is you can tell. Even though when I say that the simplicity, almost like a jazz song, you only have so many

18:46lyrics that you can get in there. So each one counts. I think when you're not actually buying what you're selling, like if you're talking about an emotion and you're just doing it for like the jingle, sake of the jingle, but I don't know, I think there's a way to even do that well where it's like fun and playful and you know what you're doing. And you're like half-heartedly in it. I think sometimes that people are very intelligent and they can sniff that out really quickly. And you can't exactly put your finger on why, but it feels fake. I think that is when I don't like a pop song. Yeah, where it just feels, yeah, inauthentic. Yeah. Carbon copy. Like just sort of something about it feels cardboard. Yeah. And not like, yeah, there's no depth there. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, of course. I think that's why I resonate so much with your music. There is so much depth. It's so is, I keep saying it, but it's so cinematic. And like, you know, it's real. It's a tangible feeling. I think that's what's the beauty of pop music is like, it creates this like tangible like movie in your head.

19:46And I was thinking about being driven home by someone that I had to crush on and I was like, oh my god, yeah. I want to hear more about your crush. Oh my god. Well, I don't think he wants anything to fucking do with me. What do you mean? Like literally nothing to do with me. I'm just at this point. It's so past the point. I can't even, I can't. I love that I get to work with Seeky because so many of my guests are musicians who get to go on tour. And if you end up listening to them and loving them or if you already love them, you can use my code therapist for 10% off your order on Seeky. The reason Seeky is the best place to get tickets for any live event, whether it be comedy, Broadway, music, sporting is because it rates your tickets that you would buy on a scale from one to 10, one being not the best and 10 being the best. So you know if you're getting a good bang for your buck. Also if you click the link in the description and download the app, it will automatically apply the code therapist for 10% off your order. So you can see every concert, your heart desires or every comedy show or every Broadway show

20:49or every sporting event you wish to see. Thank you again Seeky for sponsoring tonight's episode. What pop artists are you listening to right now that excite you? Oh so many. There's so many. I mean, I think that speaking of perfect albums, I think Robin has been top of her game. I mean, she's so inspiring in the fact that I feel like she also kind of like took a break, figured out what it was that she had to say about pop and came back with such intention and then like blew the world away. But I feel like that's a cop that answered that everybody picks. However I'm going to go with it anyways. There's a reason for it. And I think she's brought an artfulness to pop that excites me too because it can be thought of as like a frivolous genre. But I think there's such a thing as intelligent pop music. That's what I'm interested in figuring out how to make, you know. And I think she's one of the first people who showed me a really cool flavor of how to do that in her own way. And I wanted to figure out my own as well. Yeah, I mean call your girlfriends one of my favorite songs of all time.

21:49Dancing on my own. One of my favorite songs of all time. Like all of them. It's just unbelievable. I mean that whole album is insane. But yeah, I actually she's coming to LA soon. I got to take it. So you wait. When is she coming to LA? Like soon. We have to. I've never seen Dancing on my own life. We all must go. Let's go. Your 10 year anniversary show of emotion. And you get you're wearing the merch man. Me and Manny are very cute. Manny we were like stuffed in a group of people and Manny said, excuse me. And she walks to the side because she had to dance so hard. I love it. It was what did that feel like for you to do that 10 year anniversary? I mean, people knew every single lyric to that to every single song. Like what did it feel like for you? It was a wild night. Well, first of all, I mean, I hadn't really announced it yet. But I was four months pregnant during that show. I know. Which is wild. Is that's why we just did the one show. I was like, all right, this is going to be kind of crazy. And I remember both my family came to town. So my mother and my stepmother and my father and my stepmother were all in the balcony

22:51at the back. And every time I would kind of like be in the moment because the crowd was like just just the best energy. So you're kind of getting lost in it. And I'd step on a speaker and my two mothers would be like, get down here and I yield. And I'm like, oh, yes. Sorry, sorry. But yeah, it was incredible. And I honestly, I don't I can't explain the pain of sometimes putting out a body of work and then you only get a short amount of time when you do a show. So you're kind of trying to like pick a couple from a motion. Right. You're kind of like, right. A couple from kiss and dedicated and lonely. And at this point, you're like, okay, well, I guess we can take like the hits off each one. But when you actually like get to like go in and take your time with one album, I mean, we've played songs that I've never played live before. I like never get to hold you. I've never really done that one before. And we're like, okay. So it was not only was it like lovely from my band and I to revisit a body of work that we cared so much about, but to really get to like go into like the deep cuts in a way with a room full of people who got it was just it was that was lovely. I mean, your type like, you know, do you know that I got a DM the other day because

23:57I was, I think I posted something about, oh, yeah, I posted like that. I was listening to a motion and someone swept up and said, your type is like the anthem for gay guys who are in love with straight men. Have you heard that before? I am. Yeah. It's true. I read that. I was like, damn. Yeah, it is true. And that is when I heard that live, do you remember? I nearly fell to the floor. Wow. You were screaming it. You were screaming every lyric. And then when you said, you introduced boy problems. Do you set what you were like? Does anyone have boy problems that I would scream? It was just. It was a very sweaty, fun night. I mean, I always leave a show feeling like I need a shower and I come home and there's like some new glitter somewhere on my body that I didn't find. And I'm like, that's how I want to leave that pressure. Yes. And so it was, it was really fun. You know who's doing their albums front to back right now is Lily Allen. She's on the way. I saw her. I saw her that she was. I wasn't.

24:57It was really good. It was like an art piece. I mean, I really, I read while I listened to that album because it was so salacious. It was so salacious. It was so salacious. No. And I loved it. I feel like it was bold and I almost think it played it like a musical. Yeah. And so I was just, I really, very chef's kiss. Good job, Lily. Well, speaking of musicals. Yes. And Lena Dunham are working on the 10 things. I'll make it one. You're making one. The 10 things I hate about you musical. Yes. How, what is the process of that looking like? It is incredible. It's incredible. It's been like the dream of all dream projects. I mean, you can't really think of a better script to get your hands on. Yeah. I mean, that story is iconic for a reason and I think has a cult following for a reason. And our whole team is really like from day one, it was good. And then it's just gotten more and more stacked. So Ethan Gresska is my writing partner. We're doing the music. Lena is working with Jessica Wong on the script. And we have Christopher Wielden who's like choreographer slash director, Valorina extraordinaire,

25:59Tom Kett who's like, you know, music director of my dream. So it's just, it just like keeps getting kind of like blow your mind wild. And I know I just like named off to a bunch of people, but these are like, the Wizard of Oz people to me. So I'm very, very proud. Well, you're a, you're a theater kid. I am a theater nerd for sure. You were Annie and Annie. I had to know that. You were Sandy and Grace. Oh my gosh. Yes. Because I love you. I guess the internet does exist. Yes, I was. Oh God. I mean, I joke because I was in a very small community theater in Mission BC, which is close to Vancouver and Canada. And on the night that Annie closed, I said to my parents, what if I'm just this child star? No. And where they like, they were like, no one knows who you are relaxed, but you know, right? But when you auditioned for Canadian Idol, was it, was Canadian Idol as big in Canada as American Idol was here?

26:59I mean, at the time it felt big to me, but I was in it. Like I felt, it felt all encompassing because it was my whole little wild world at the time. Yeah, what a, what a training and just like brutal takedowns publicly. You got to, you got to do a Canadian Idol or an American Idol run to see if you've got that like alligator skin for what the music business in. And I was happy to report that I kind of did. Yeah. I was like, this is wild, but I can like take it with a grain of salt. And then where was Call Me Maybe born after that? Well, it's actually an interesting like point to say to ask that question, because I really don't think Call Me Maybe would have had its life without Canadian Idol. And what I mean by that is it was like my first exposure on TV and I got third. So I, I actually had a pretty lucky run because I had like the notoriety, but no contract. Right. So it was like a beautiful place to start. And I was just looking for my way in and my way into a management deal to a label to

28:00anything that could kind of help me be able to get these songs I was writing heard. And even like on Canadian Idol, I think in the additions they had one role, which was just like sing a song, but not your own. And I was like, well, I'm going to sing my own because I was like, this is my one chance on TV. I was excited. But it ended up being really helpful in terms of securing those things. So I had a management team after that. I got signed to my first label deal. And there's just, you know, amazing thing that happened where I got to start making an album. And I met sort of like minded creators, Ryan Stewart, Josh Ramsey. And these producers helped me put together a body of work and coming maybe was born with Josh and Tavish. And yeah, I don't think anybody expected it to take off the way they did, but that was just one of those lucky lightning moments that happened in life where you look back and you're like, I don't think we could have curated all that magic. Had we tried our hardest, it was just sort of being hit with, you know, some lightning, really. And the beginning of what Twitter was.

29:01It was just the stars aligning in a beautiful way. Yeah. Do you have a favorite song off this upcoming album? I think I don't actually, which makes me happy because I feel like it's, it changes depending on my mood. That'll layman's answer. No. That's the sign of a great album. By the way, I always say the sign of a perfect album is one where everybody has a different answer for their favorite song. So I love that. I love that. Emotion, you will say, what's your favorite song? Someone will say your type. Someone will say, run away with me. Someone will say, I'll let hallucinations or like Norman fucking Rockwell was lying there and all right, everybody has a different favorite song. And that's the sign of like a ten out of ten album. Oh, well, here's hoping. I think my best answer is that right now for day, I like blue skies. It's sort of my like attempt to try and cheer on our mini-ripperton, like with some psychedelic

30:03folk. And then for nighttime right now, I'm going to say nearer far. And I say nearer far because it was the most like experimental track. And it almost didn't make the album because I got slightly in my head that it was too weird. And then I decided that that's exactly why I needed to make the album at the end of the day. I went for it and I'm really glad I did. Yeah. Where did the concept for this double album come to be? Quite simply, I couldn't decide what I wanted to do because I wanted to do two things so passionately. Like I really wanted to make like a synth based intense nighttime album that felt like you're in your emotions. You're okay to like go there. It's a little bit less like a story song and a bit more like an experience. So a lot of like freeform writing in there where you're like little poems put to music kind of thing. And I loved that idea. And then I really also felt like something was calling me maybe from a little bit of my childhood and my upbringing too about these like kind of good old fashioned story songs. But my spin on like what I loved about the James Taylor's and stuff was like how to like

31:05play with you know something that felt a little bit more psychedelic than that. Something that felt a little dreamy. Yeah. A little bit like what I'd want to listen to in my life moving through the house. And they didn't start with the title day and night. It was just these two kind of lanes I was writing in. And when I would put something like wild child which was like quite like a stripped down acoustic number next to something like don't leave me on the dance floor. It was looking like I was having an identity crisis. And so I was like I just need to like choose. And luckily it was again my guitarist, my little adopted brother to have who like came and to New York heard what I was making. Quite frankly was like why don't we make it like a house party like there's an upstairs as a downstairs. Oh I love that. It's going on. And I was like yes. And then later on when I was driving in Los Angeles I was like day and night. And as soon as I knew that that's what I was doing I kind of showed up with so much intention and excitement at every session after that. And and then 12 and 12 was quite simply because I was like 24 hours in a day.

32:10Get it? Ah day and night. Day and night. Do you are you planning on touring the album? Can you imagine if I made all of this body of art and then just like no. You know what? I could because Bonnie Verr just put out this whole thing and was like I'm not touring it. Wow. And I was like no touring is the most fun part. Are you kidding me? The whole reason I make the music is so I can go to it. Absolutely. I mean I haven't like officially announced anything yet and I don't know if I'm allowed to give this away but we will 100% go and celebrate the album for sure. Are you struggling right now with like picking up which tracks to do because it's there so many and then you also have stuff from emotion? You know it becomes quite clear in rehearsals which songs translate translate sorry in the cleanest like clearest way. And what I mean by that is sometimes like even a stripped down moment can be just as powerful as like a dancing moment but you can't like know it until you you put it on its feet and that's what rehearsals for is kind of figuring out how do these exist in real life

33:11outside from the studio because even the way you sing in a studio is a completely different thing in the way you sing live. Like it all changes. Well I mean with headphones in a small little box with your eyes closed feeling a thing in a soft way it's a very different thing than sharing it in a room even if it's the same song and so I feel like if you can't capture that same intimacy with something and there's some songs you can do that with and there's other songs where it becomes a little bit more challenging than it's best like keep that for the record and do something different on stage or change it up that's always an option too but I've come to really love this trip down moment it's like one of my favorite songs live actually has been collage which I would have thought it was only a studio song but actually translates really well to stage because I feel like by the time we played in the set where usually we've sweated enough and we need to come down together. Yes yes you know what do you mean? Do you ever like doing festival shows? Festivals are my favorite actually. I mean I really do love my own show as well because you get more to play with in terms

34:13of production and like really I mean with the loneliness and the last time I got very indulgent with my moon and I was like the moon will talk. Yeah yeah yeah yeah. And it will tell everyone to forget their worries and then we'll start to play you know and that's like you know that's part of the fun but I think a festival is fun because there's a lot of new energy I think everyone you come to a festival you're showing up to surrender your life for like a moment of being really present. Yeah. And I think when you show up with that energy it's like a contagious thing and so there's a lot of opportunity for really blissful moments to have been at festivals I think. I agree it's one of those things where it's just like everybody is like it's it's a real moment of like being present. No one comes to a festival to be like I'm in the mood to have a bad time. Right? Yeah. It's like drugs and the wind is in your hair and like it's just like yes you feel like you're watching like super stardom like you know what I mean like that's what it feels like a sunset set at like Coachella or something like the best I recently went to Daisy

35:15Chain and we saw a chapel. How was that? I heard good things. It was awesome and we saw Chapel Rhone and I was just like so enamored and the sun was setting and the wind was in her hair and I was like this it's a moment. It's a moment. And I think in my own history of like discovering other artists that's always the most magical place to discover a new artist. Yes. Like it's one thing to be like oh a friend sent me this link to Spotify or my friend sent me this like little I don't know YouTube video to watch but like when you're like walking around and then you're like who's playing that and you just gravitate to like I remember that's how I saw Fist for the first time in Vancouver and she was like in a little like white trench coat in her white guitar and she was just playing and I was like who is this and that's how I discovered her and I was like potent in my mind is like wow. I always say that's the best feeling on planet earth is discovering a song or an artist through a live performance because it will never be better. Absolutely. Tegan and Sarah too that's how I learned. Really?

36:15Well what are you watching on television right now or movie wise? It's anything. I'm watching a very long drawn out but interesting show called my brilliant friend and my getting it right. My brilliant friend. It's based off of the novel in Italy and Naples. I think it is my brilliant friend. My brilliant friend. My brilliant friend. Yeah. And when I say I'm slow watching it I have a six month old son so it's been years. Yeah. I actually just stopped watching it for a while and I just started again like two nights ago. I was like okay he's asleep let me give it a go. It's good. Do you have you ever written a song based off of something you've seen in a movie or a television show? Versailles. Really? Yeah. Versailles. That's why I gave her a song off the new album. I was so happy to hear that. So I was I was staying at the grand hotel in Sweden and Stockholm which is like my spot and they didn't really have like like movie rental spots.

37:15You're just watching whatever is like on the TV. Yeah. And Sofia Coppola's version of Versailles or Mary Antoinette was on. And I mean like the actual history of that is quite quite heavy but I was like this version, the spannicy version which is so indulgent on all about pleasure is really exciting to me. And I'm in this place with where when I write recently where I just am like kind of collecting whatever is being thrown at me in the day. So when I went into this session the next day I was like you know the idea of Versailles is like almost like a metaphor for what it is to like slow down and like live your best life. Like that's interesting to me. And we even like slow the music down the course. You do the course slows. Yeah. Yeah. And I was just about to embark on this like month long vacation maybe almost turned into two months with my partner at the time. He was my boyfriend and he proposed on this trip but we were about to like go venture into like a new era of like pleasure seeking the two of us. And Versailles was on the list of places we were going to go so it was like front of the brain but that is definitely a song that came from a movie.

38:17Wow. That's so cool. Yeah. Also do you prefer people call you Carly or Carly right? I think I neither I'll answer to both but Carly is totally fine. Right because when I was watching your because I watched your Canadian idol audition and you were Carly Jepsen. Yeah. To take fun fact do you want to know how Carly were was born? Yes please. I have never told this story. It is my full real name Carly way Jepsen and my mother's always called me Carly Ray. But no one else did. My like high school was just Carly Carly Carly and then on Canadian Idol they said right your full name and I took it very literally and I wrote Carly Ray Jepsen and then I say they said Carly Ray and I was like all right maybe it's more memorable because it's a competition maybe that will remember and then it stayed and it's been that way ever since. Wow. It's not that interesting but that's how it happens. No it isn't. It's a really big choice it was just kind of a coincidence. Wow. Well Shane isn't my last name. It's my middle name. There you go. And it came because I wasn't allowed to put my last name on Facebook and it's half

39:18of grade. Oh because your parents were being protected? Yeah. That's so sweet. And I wanted to make it my last name is Roscoe and I was like I wanted to make it Roscoe so bad and my mom was like no Shane. That's so sweet. Yeah. I love that you have protected parents like that. That's cute. Do you ever think about like what the world now that you have a kid like like social media phones and like how you deal with that with like choked big your kid? Oh my gosh it's terrifying. Yeah I mean I try not to stay up in the night thinking about it but it definitely it comes to mind it's something my husband and I consider. I mean we are wondering about this idea of just like taking him hiding away somewhere in a cabin in Canada and just like telling him that this little bubble we create is real life but probably not the best way to go at it. So I think we're just going to be careful about making sure that you know we're there for him and that we're being careful about how early he gets access to all of it.

40:21Yeah my parents made me wait. That's good. I agree with that. I think they did. Look at you now. Good kid. You did great. Good kid. It did great. Well Carly Rae. Hey. What? What are you therapist about today? Today specifically. Or it could be this week, this month. What are you angry about? Oh. What am I angry about? It could be something like for me. What I was angry about is I have a horrible deviated septum and it sucks and I need to get surgery. That does suck. And I know I have a deviated septum and I went to a doctor he said no you don't have one. I said no I do have one. Okay. Okay. Mine's very specific because I just had a child recently. Okay. But I was watching this Jesse wears a podcast actually about being pregnant and the whole time it's called is it normal and the whole time you read all of these sort of like or you hear all these women talk about all these crazy sort of things that happen during

41:23their pregnancy and at the end a doctor or a nurse comes on and says yes it is normal but we don't know why because it's woman's health and that pisses me off that there isn't more information and education about woman's health especially. Or I hear just pop it out baby's left right in center making the world go around. So that pisses me off. Yeah. It's a very valid thing to be pissed off about. Thank you. Thank you. Kiss me off not just today but all of the day. What are some of your favorite lyrics you've ever written? I know. Yeah. I don't know. I'm not sure. Oh, gosh. Maybe that you're most proud of on emotion. I think I liked from one away with me. I'll be your center and secret. I liked that moment. I think that there is something I'd like to play with in terms of like the coiness of like being sort of the person who's the pursuer. But also like being like I want to do however I'm not going to you know make it too aggressive. Right.

42:23You know it's trying to find that nice little balance. I think that's why I resonate with it so much because it's like it's almost like this like shyness of it. But it's like please pursue me. Like you know what I mean? It's like please just come with me and be in love with me. But like I'm not going to try too hard. Like you know what I mean. I actually I've been I've been like curious about what it is that makes you feel so alive when you are the person who is the pursuer. It's something that I've been talking about a little bit. Do you know what I mean when you put yourself out there and you tell the person that you want them and it's kind of a little scary and you don't know what the reaction is going to be. It's like one of the times to be alive. I'm like I'm actually like dealing with that right now. Talk about my crush. I'm so glad about that. I'm so glad about that. I'm so glad about it. It's really why I came. It's I just wanted to know. Because I'm like do I say to that because we're like having this back and forth. But then he is like but my friend will come to dinner and I'm like but I don't want your friend to come to dinner. Do I just ask him out or do I get to know him more like do you know what I mean?

43:25It's like it's I don't know. I definitely don't have all the answers but I do think that it's confident to know what you wanted to say it. Right. Yeah. I do. I think too. I also. Oh. Also another question. This sword thing. Oh yeah. How did this begin? For those that don't know, you were given a sword at almost every one of your shows now. Yeah. And it started. I mean, you're asking me but I also am just as confused as everybody. But basically I've been told that there was like campaign that was started by somebody online and it was like I want to give her a sword. And the answer was like just because I think she deserves one. And somehow it got signed by a couple of people or something. You're going to have to do a fact check on this but it caught wind. Yeah. And then lo and behold, I was like at a show and a couple of people decided to see it through and gave me like an inflatable sword or like a wooden sword or like concerned about how that got in. But still got a sword.

44:26And then I was handed one on stage and I was just as confused as everybody. I was like, oh, a sword. And then that caught wind. And now I've given swords left right inside. I can like make one of those little chairs from the Game of Thrones with like inflatable swords. Yeah. Yeah. I should. I totally should. What inspired you to start putting out like B sides of your records? I didn't want to. I knew I had overwritten for a motion and I was not the only person who was aware of that fact. So my A&R at the time was named John Eman and he was like, can we do something with these like other songs? I think that there's some potential here. And I was really nervous about it. I was like, I fluctuated. I was excited and then I was nervous. And then I think that night before the release, I called him and I was like, I want to bail. I don't want to do it. It's a bad idea. He was like, can you just trust me? I'm just a B-side. People will understand that it's like allowed to be a bit more experimental or songs that you're like a little less sure of. And I'm really glad that he talked me into it because it became this place where now I look forward to it where it's like, oh, the B-sides is where I go to play.

45:29It's like the time where I'm getting a little weirder and a little bit more experimental. And so with dedicated, I knew I was going to make one with the loneliest and the loveliest time. I kind of knew that was going to happen. And with this project, I would say that the whole thing is like a mix of just me playing and being weird. So it's like not really like a distinguishing A and B-sides. They're both kind of equally important to me and I wanted to show it all at once because I showed up with that kind of intention. Yeah. Yeah. Do you want to, I know this is a stupid question, but do you want to make music forever? I can't imagine a world where I don't create music in a part of my life, but I don't know. I think that it depends. I don't want to force it. I think what's been really lucky so far is it kind of just visits me in my day. I'll be playing with my son in the morning and I'm like, I'm not letting you welcome and I need to record it. And I hope that I can look at it later when I have time. Or a lot of times there are certain people who I just have that sort of spark with.

46:29And on this project, Nate Seifert and Kyle Scherer were two of those people where we'd get in a room and it was really effortless. And we'd have a week of that and we were like five songs for the album in five days. And it was easy and they were all very different. And I think when I have those connections and friendships, it would be hard to ever want to give it up because it really feels like magic. It's like the part of life that feels quite like my favorite part of it. And so yeah, I can't imagine, I can't imagine not, but I don't know that it always would be something that I would share in such a big way. It now feels like a really fun time to share because it's been a really prolific season, but we'll see. Yeah. Do you remember a studio session that you felt like just was like one of your favorite of all time, like one of your favorite memories in the studio? Well, it's funny that you talk about Runaway with me because that was a really a special day. And I was meeting like Noony who became like a lifelong friend and Matthias and Robin.

47:31We worked together on a few other things and so that was really special. But I would say for like this day and night album, what was really cool was getting to work on some of the songs with my partner. And it's a really strange thing to write with your partner because you have like no filters. So in other spaces where you would be like, like someone would say an idea and maybe you don't like it and you'd be like, yeah, okay, like that's interesting. Let's like, let's try it. And then you like try it and then you kind of try something else and you like gently get to like a place for your happy again. And you're like, okay, you know, sorry, with your partner, you're just like, I hate that so much. I hate it so. And you just like cut straight to it and you move on fast and it's like cut through it and real and like sexy and fun. And like, I don't know. I think him and I got to a place where like we know each other really, really well and we can write in a really honest way and actually have learned to carve out space for what each other does. So I know what he does and he knows what I do.

48:34And we kind of just like move around each other a little bit. Just a little walk on the moon is a good example of a song that we wrote together in the Philippines, actually in our hotel room. And I think I was in the bath and he was like in the living room and I was like singing it to him and he was playing it on the guitar. And like, I just, I'm like, I would have never thought that I wanted to date another musician. But now that I'm like married to one, I'm like, it's the best. It just allows for music to kind of throw like braid its way through our lives in a really natural way. And I think him and Tavish Crow, like I talked about are two of my like soulmate writers. And it's such a delight to be married to one of them. That's so beautiful. How did you guys meet? We were set up on a session. Oh no. Yeah. We were set up on a session. It was, it was an interesting little meet cute actually. I thought he was like a dance producer at first, but turns out no, he was, he was not. He was, I actually, yeah. It took me a second. We both had kind of a friendship brewing at the very beginning.

49:37We were, you were friends first. We were friends for like a year first. Fuck. Okay. I think I need to do that with my crush. But that's how I've always actually landed on relationships. That's fun fact is I will generally like watch them from a friendship distance for a year until I decide and realize that we might be in love. But it's like, it's like a nice vetting system because you get to know them a bit more honestly when they're not presenting as a date and they're just being your friend. Yeah. And I think that that's like a really cool way to observe somebody. Yeah. I don't know. No, it's patience, which I don't have. Yeah. Well, I mean, I have a lot of fear. So that's where my tactic comes from. As I'm scared to step into something until I know it's a good idea. Are you scared? Like, do you have like projection sensitivity? Are you like sensitive to rejection or? Not that. I would very happily get in a relationship for a wild experience knowing that it will be a fun time and a couple good songs. But I think that that's also maturity of realizing that that burns out pretty fast.

50:38I think it's more that I'm careful who I let into my circle. And I want to make sure that it's good people even if it's a for a brief encounter. Yeah. Yeah. Are you ready to tell me what's wrong? I'm excited. I'm happy. I'm happy. I'm happy. I'm happy. I'm happy. My boyfriend insisted on wearing shorts to my friend's wedding. He wouldn't budge either because of the heat wave. And he got word that some of the other men were doing it too. I'm so embarrassed and cannot get the image out of my head. That's true. Help. I don't know. I think it's kind of sweet. So maybe I'm just like romanticizing it. But I think it's sweet to be embarrassed of your partner sometimes. OK. Because if they're so themselves, am I wrong? I like it. It's a fun. I don't know if I agree. Really? I think it's sweet. It was so embarrassing. It's so dorky. I guess because then that means they care. No. My thing is just like, oh, so embarrassing. But I love him.

51:39Yeah. OK. If you land with that, if you circle back with, so embarrassed, but I love you, great. Yeah. And also, if other people are wearing shorts, then what's it's fine? If other people are wearing shorts, then whatever. And who cares? Yeah. Yeah. I got into business with my close friend. And it's a disaster. He is unorganized, does not hit deadlines, and leaves the majority of the work up to me. However, he has great ideas, and we build this together. I don't know how to proceed. I just wish I had it mixed business with friendship. Any advice? Ooh, that's tricky. I think except the guy is not going to change, and figure out what he's going to do, and give him more of those jobs. And if you need to bring in a third party because you feel overwhelmed by carrying the weight of the rest, then bring in a third so that it doesn't land all on you. Was it hard for, oh, I guess now? I guess you and your partner initially met via work. We did. So it's much different. We did meet. But he also is a very hard worker. So it's good.

52:41But also, yeah, do you believe that people change? If they want to, but not if you want them to. I think people are very capable of change, but it has to come from them. And now I'm realizing that I think people can. I think it's the whole point of life. I think that we're on a journey to change and grow. And hopefully, if we're doing it right, you get better. Right. I was thinking about another guy I work with while being intimate with my boyfriend of three years. I literally feel like the worst person ever. It only happened once before this, but what do I do? I'm so gross like I'd be sick if roles were reversed help. They were just thinking about them. Yeah. Oh, give yourself a break. Right? You're a human being. You're thinking about a person. You're allowed to do that. Yeah. I feel like people are much harsher on themselves these days than they used to be. I mean, I would say I agree if that's how everyone's feeling. You're allowed to have a little fantasy here and there. No, no. Yeah. What do you think, Manny?

53:42I always like to say, well, how do I phrase this? I don't know. Anytime I'm in love with someone else, like I have a huge crew. I just saw a movie last night. I was in love with a lead. Literally texted him. I'm in love with this person. What movie? Finding Emily. Okay. I'm in love with a lead. Okay. I went home to visit my parents. I was the last child to leave the house. And since I've been here, they've been low key slipping up, saying their lives are so great, and that they feel so refreshed lately. It's so clear that they needed me the fuck out of there. My feelings are really hurt by this. I thought we all got along great. I think that's amazing. I mean, explain more. So they're the last child to leave the house. And now their parents are empty nesters and the parents are like loving their lives. Okay. And now this kid is feeling bad that their parents are enjoying their life. But I think that's the point of life. Well, I would say that it's pretty amazing that the parents are like having this new life. And you should be happy for them.

54:43I would say that it also hurts a lot more to see your parents upset that you've gone and not have a fulfilled life without you. Is that what happened for you or your parents did they mourn your life? Like your name. All the time, my dad calls me like 10 times a day. I love him very much, but like I think he misses. He needs to move on. I think he misses having me home. He needs to move on. Oh, that's very sweet though. It's very sad. Like I wish that he was like, this is the best thing ever. Like, you know, like I would prefer my parents to be like, we are so happy that you're out of the house. Okay. I think that would make me feel good because I want to see them happy. You want to see them having a hobby. Yeah. A new lease on life. Yeah, I think my mom is happy. She's always like traveling, like doing whatever. But like my dad is definitely like misses having me. I think that's very sweet. Yeah. I feel like, I mean, that should give you a little confidence post. People are achieving so many things at such a young age. What am I doing wrong? Why did it become something negative to do the traditional way of life, you know, like school, then job, et cetera?

55:45Oh, I don't know. I think that the feeling I feel there is just don't compare. Keep your eye on the price. There's no wrong way at it. And it's very, yeah, social media does allow that. Even my, I think everyone is able to succumb to the comparison thing. Like my mother makes jewelry. And then everyone's been watching, like I saw this other woman was wearing really funky hats. I was like, the hats aren't help. First of all, why are we talking about another woman's hats? Like just do your thing. I think that's like the way to live a good life, to make a good art, is just kind of stick to the path that feels like yours. And don't worry about the outside noise what other people are doing. Did you ever find yourself comparing yourself to other acts when you first came out to the scene? I felt it was really important to define what it was that I was contributing. So I thought a lot about like, who am I? What am I doing? What does that mean in terms of what clothes I wear?

56:46And how I present myself? And I think I thought about it too hard where I was just sort of more open and sponging to anybody else who might have an idea. So I think when I was 26 and first came to Los Angeles, and everyone was like, we think it's like this in the market. OK, well, if you got an idea, because I don't yet. But once I started to realize that no one was going to have a better idea of what works for me rather than me, I kind of took the reins back on that. But I wasn't looking like, oh, that girl's doing this, and I should copy her. I was very actually uninterested in doing anything that felt like copycatting to me. That felt like if I didn't know what to do, I knew I didn't want to do that. And what made you from after calling me maybe want to go back to your theater roots? I, it sounds like I was smart and had a strategy. It wasn't like that. I just got a phone call and I just said, yes. Like it was just like, yes, that sounds like really right now. Yes, that sounds like the right choice. And sometimes I feel like the best decisions

57:47that I've made have been ones where I don't overthink it too much. And I just sort of try it on and feel it and jump. And I remember getting, I got the offer when I was on a plane, and I thought, I want to do this. And I feel really happy that I took that left turn. It's like actually brought so much, even with 10 things now. I'm like, I don't think 10 things would have happened had I not said yes to Cinderella back then. I'm so excited to see 10 things. That's going to be amazing. As well. I mean, you and Lena Dunham together just feels like pure magic. Thank you. Did you watch girls? Are you kidding me? I watched it recently after who that came out, because I was like kind of watching in tandem with Radiant and God, just like brilliant. That book is really, really incredible. Yeah, I mean, she's an incredible one. And so yeah, I think it is my, I think it's time that I rewatch girls again. I rewatched it when I was like 23 fresh out of college. And I think I need to watch it again with new eyes. So, so, so good. Yeah, so good.

58:48So good. My boyfriend uses Shazam in public constantly. And I've gotten the egg. I use Shazam every day. I use Shazam yesterday. I know this is silly, but it's like every time we're at the mall and it's playing the most generic music ever. He pulls out his phone, standing in the middle of everyone walking around him, holding it to the sky. Is this valid? No. Yeah, I think if you're getting the egg over something like that, there's deeper issues going on. Thousand percent. Yeah. I was watching Penn 15 yesterday and there was like a needle drop at the end. And I, Shazam did. And this is my favorite thing in the world is Shazam's song that I love. And be like, oh, this is my new favorite song. That's a, and they were talking about festivals earlier, but that's a beautiful way to discover music. I think, yeah. I agree. Yeah. Also like, that is a strain. Does one of the strangest eggs I've ever heard. It's a really strange one. Yeah. It's the right to call you out wherever you are. Before we end, it is Manny's birthday. Oh my goodness. Happy birthday. Yeah. And I was just wondering, we have a cupcake if you could sing Happy Birthday to her.

59:48Only if we all do it together. Of course. Okay. But this would, your favorite artist, and this would be her dream from Drew. Louise, do you have the cupcake? Are we starting? Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday dear Manny. Happy birthday to you. Make a wish. Yay. Happy birthday. Happy birthday. Oh my goodness. This is like the best birthday ever. This is one of the best moments of my life. Oh, Manny. I love you. Oh, I love you. I love you. Oh. Amazing. Amazing. Well, what are your birthday plans tonight? I'm getting a massage. And then I'm just hanging out with my family and getting tired. Well, Carly Rae, what did we learn today?

1:00:51We learned that Shazamine is controversial. Apparently so. So controversial. I said that. Why is that a hard word? Controversial. My brain is much at this point. What else did we learn? We learned. It's Manny's birthday. We learned that. We learned that it's Manny's birthday. And we learned that your new album, Day and Night, is out now. It's out now. It's out now. And it is your eighth studio album. We're counting the B-sides. We're counting the B-sides. Five plus eights.