The Flying V: EP 38 - The Odyssey

0:00Every game day you show up for your team. Now it's your time. We go, we go, we go, we go. Ask your prescriber about Wigovie, some Maglatide Injection 2.4 mg, a GLP1. Call 1-8-3-3-4 Wigovie or visit Wigovie.com to view the Medication Guide and to learn more about Wigovie. Why wait? We go, we go. Music Hello, hello, New York Rangers fans and welcome back. This is the season 2 premiere of the Flying V Podcast Episode 38 overall. I am your host Vincent Mercogliano of the athletic

1:06back after a long, I'd like to say relaxing and refreshing summer. It certainly was at times, but those of you with children probably know that isn't usually the case and especially when you come back from vacation on Labor Day and everybody luckily somehow except for me in my house got sick, but then a lot of juggling while I'm also simultaneously trying to get ready for a new season going to Chicago for our annual NHL Summit with the athletic which is a blast of really good time with so so many talented writers and editors and people that I now have the pleasure of working with so that really got me amped up and excited for the new season. Unfortunately, well a lot of people back at my house were kind of sick, but now we are officially back because the Rangers are about to be back. Training camp is about to open, we're going to have plenty to talk about in that regard on this week's episode. I hope everybody all of you had an amazing summer.

2:09Again, it felt long, it was long, it's like essentially five months off for teams that missed the playoffs which the Rangers have for the last two years, so like for me thinking back to the last game that I covered in mid-April that feels like ages ago, but at the same time, I don't know, it also feels like it flies by, you know, I love the summertime, got some beach vacation in, music festival with my wife, a couple golf trips with my buddies, a lot of quality time with the kids at the pool on the golf course. I mean, I just love summers, probably my favorite time of year, so I guess that makes it feel like it flies by. I always get kind of the end of summer blues, but then what always revives me is remembering that this is in my opinion the best time of year for sports fans. The NFL is back. How about those jets? All right, I shouldn't get too far ahead

3:15of myself. It's one week against a really bad team, but it was fun as a lifelong jets fan to watch a win in week one. We do not usually get the pleasure of doing that. So that was enjoyable on Sunday. I do love my Sunday football. Also MLB playoffs baseball right around the corner. I can tell you Vincent Jr. is very happy to have Aaron Judge back in time for the playoffs. And of course, hockey season is getting underway. And that for me is when the adrenaline really starts pumping. At first, it's like, oh, man, back to work. But then you get to the ring. You start thinking about the different stories you want to write and all the different interesting things going on around this team and this team never falls short in that category. And so that to me, that gets me going. And now I'm feeling it. I'm ready. I'm excited. Was at the rank last week, only for one day for rookie camp. Everything is condensed this year. We're going to talk about that

4:18in just a minute. Did go to Allentown, Pennsylvania for one of the Rangers rookie games on Saturday against the rookies from the Philadelphia Flyers. Maybe we'll work in a few impressions from that throughout this episode. And then today, Wednesday, the day of this recording, we were at the training center face to face with not only Mike Sullivan, but Chris jury, both of them came out together for about 20 minutes to answer our questions to begin camp. Obviously, Sullivan, we're going to have a lot of time to talk to him. He's kind of stuck with us every single day for the foreseeable future probably for at least the next what is it seven months? If not longer, I know they're hoping it's longer if they make the playoffs. But it's happening, folks. It's starting. The players are reporting. They're all in and healthy except for a couple likely a gel guys, but the main NHL guys from Christianries mouth are all healthy and ready to go. And they will be on the ice at the

5:20MSG training center for the first day of camp tomorrow, which is Thursday, which is probably the day that you will be hearing this recording. So make sure you stay locked in myself, Peter Boah, we're going to be on hand for everything from here on out. It'll be both of us most of the time. There might be moments like the preseason games, we might split up a little bit, but we're going to have you covered for literally everything from now until pretty much the end of the season. And we're going to try to do it as best we can. The extension of the NHL season to 84 games. Remember, it's always been 82. So we're adding two games to the schedule this year. That means that a, the real games will start earlier this year. The Rangers are set to open on September 29th in Boston against the Bruins. But because training camp is starting at the same time it always has, it's always been right smack dab in the middle of September. I want to say it's always on like

6:25a Wednesday is the press conference and Thursday is the first day on ice if memory serves. But training camp is really going to fly by this time because while camp is starting at the same time it always does. The season as we just touched on is starting like a week and a half close to two weeks earlier than usual. So that means that everything is condensed in terms of the training camp. I think the players would rather not have to come in earlier because of the extended season. Right, fully so no arguing with them there on my part. But from a coach's perspective and Sullivan talked about this a bunch today that means there's less time to evaluate less time to implement systems less time to do everything. There are going to be fewer preseason games. It's going from six to four this year. Again, that's another thing you will not hear me complaining about. And it also means fewer practices. I actually just got back again from the first press conference of the year. And Sullivan was

7:30pointing out that they really only have six camp days like full camp days where all you're focusing on is practice. If you take away the preseason game days and they also have a couple off days worked in during this camp. So again, that is not a lot of time for them to be working with this group and making the types of decisions that coach is usually rely on training camp to make the smaller roster that they have at camp this year reflects that. The Rangers invited 48 players to camp this year, which is significantly less than last year. I went back and looked last year they had 61 players at the start of camp. So instead of having three different groups to start out, who all practice in their own individual sessions, now they're split into two groups. So I'm assuming that means 24 and 24. And those groups each day will have a practice session on their own.

8:34And then they'll come together in the middle for daily scrimmages like they want to hit the ground running. This is not just going to be getting your feet weight and conditioning and different drills for a couple days. There's going to be some of that for sure. But they're also going to be getting in real live action right out of the gate because they have the three days of training camp Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday's going to be an off day. And then Monday, they have their first preseason game in New Jersey against the Devils. They also have a preseason game Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday next week. So you're going to have four preseason games in five days, rapid fire. And then we're basically gearing up for the start of the season because that opener against Boston is two Tuesdays from now. So we're talking less than two weeks from today. It's again, folks. It's going to happen really fast. So here's Ron coming at you in terms of plans for the podcast,

9:37plans for coverage, all that kind of stuff. I wanted to wait today to hear from Sullivan and jury before recording this. You never know what they might say. I didn't want to record and then have to circle back because something newsworthy came out of it. So came home, got a little writing, done, still have to finish up some writing. But I want to get this podcast in especially before I have to go pick up the kids, probably finish my writing later on tonight. So instead of as much as, you know, season premiere, we maybe like to have this this big long episode for you. I mean, I still think you guys know me. I'll talk plenty here. But what I'm going to do right now, what I decided to do was just come in here, turn on the mic, shoot from the hip this week. I missed you guys didn't want to wait any longer. And then next week we'll get back to our usual format with a guest and listener submitted questions and all that stuff. And to be honest now, I did wait until after the presser. I don't think that there was any major news to come out of it,

10:42but still as always, plenty of topics to chew on. Honestly, for me, going into this, my bigger focus just to pull back the curtain a little bit was, Chris, Jury, just knowing this will probably be the only time we get to ask him questions until the trade deadline. Sullivan, as I mentioned earlier, that poor guy is stuck with us probably six days a week, moving forward, maybe some weeks, even more some weeks a little bit less. So we'll have plenty of time to get all of our questions to him. Jury today definitely asked him a handful of things that I want to ask him about. I mean, you guys know how he likes to play these things. He's not going to reveal a whole lot. The biggest topic that I think is at the forefront of my mind and many of the fans and readers and listeners that I hear from is the level of pressure and the level of expectations for this team going into the season. It probably goes without saying, although I'm sure

11:47we're going to talk about it plenty in the next, however many months, is that this is a really big season, not just for the Rangers, but for Jury specifically. Comes in in 2021 has a lot of success right out of the gate. We know that that roster was largely a roster that he inherited. Few little tweaks, but the key players on those teams all came from the previous regime. Now, Jury was here for a lot of the acquisitions of those players as assistant GM. But basically those first three years, there weren't a whole lot of changes. And the team had a lot of success. Two conference finals runs, a president's trophy. Then as time went on, and I think Jury realized the team had kind of hit its ceiling and that changes were going to need to be made to push them forward. It seemed like the more they tried to change the worst things got. And now you've got back-to-back seasons where the team missed the playoffs. Two years ago, they were kind of consumed by

12:54all this off-Eistrama and bad culture and all that kind of stuff that we've reported on extensively. Last year, I think there was less of that going on. But you had a team that on ice was even worse. They finished with the worst record in the Eastern Conference, third worst record in the entire league. And it just really felt like a lot of the flaws came to the forefront. And it became difficult to see an easy way out. I think in a lot of people's opinions, including a lot of you that I've heard from, it felt like it might be time to tear it down and build toward the future. Call it a rebuild, call it whatever you want. But basically, the prospect pool is barren. The players that they rely on specifically at forward and even more specifically at center are getting up there in age. And to really feel like you're going to have a sustainable winner, you're going to need some young players

13:58and a long-term vision that can carry this thing forward. And there's not enough of those that we see internally right now. But we know what Chris Jury's preference was. And from his seat, again, we go back to the pressure. You missed the playoffs two years in a row in a market like this, where things are kind of crumbling all around you. There has to be some urgency, I think, to show progress and turn things around. Otherwise, what's your status? You know, it could end up being somebody else who executes a rebuild if things don't go right. So Jury, instead of going full rebuild, we all know ops to retool. Very publicly stated that in that letter that he sent out to the fans and seasoned ticket holders last January and given credit for this true to his word, he went out and retooled this off season. The Rangers made a flurry of moves. I actually quickly did the math before recording this while I was writing of the 48 players the Rangers have coming into camp. 17 of them are new additions and

15:07or first year pros. So certainly getting younger and certainly bringing in some new players. Some of them being more veteran like a Marcus Patterson, but you've also got Pavel Doraphayev, who clearly is on the younger side. You've got some new prospects that they've been able to infuse into this system headlined by Albert Smith's the number five pick from the draft. And so there's certainly been changed. I mean, this is by far, Chris Jury's most active off season, most aggressive off season. And it seems both from the outside looking in, along with what I've really been hearing for months now that there's a high level of motivation and a big push to get the Rangers right back into, I think realistically, they know that being a Stanley Cup contender this season is a long shot, but they do seem to firmly believe that they will be back in the playoff mix and have a real

16:11chance of getting it. And I think if that happens, if that kind of progress is shown and all of a sudden, especially some of those young players, the gay perot, the Albert Smiths will go on down the line, continue to make more of an impact and inspire more hope for the future. Then the likelihood is that Chris Jury will be able to continue on this path and try to keep building something. We're still going to have the conversation over and over again. I'm sure that something big is going to need to happen, whether it's a big free agent, a big trade, like, especially when we talk about that center position and trying to figure out how they move forward there, I don't think what they have internally right now is going to be enough. Something creative or something major is going to have to happen here in order for you to feel like the Rangers have the high end talent at the top of their lineup to compete with the best teams in the league. That's a theme that I

17:11harped on last year, and I'm sure we're going to continue to talk about it. But what I'm curious about is from Chris Jury's seat, how much better do you think that this roster is? How much improvement do you think you made over the summer to wear fans like yourselves? Should feel hopeful. Should feel like this thing is heading in the right direction. I'm still sensing quite a bit of skepticism on that front. So I kind of asked Jury this question, and he basically said that he feels like they checked the way he phrased it was a lot of boxes. Pretty much all the boxes it sounded like, at least from what he said, they wanted to check this summer. Now I still believe they are very, very much on the hunt, whether it's sometime this season, sometime next summer, even further down the line for that top end talent that we keep talking about, especially at forward. But they did make a flurry of moves

18:19that we all kind of believe have raised the floor of this team. We just keep continuing a question how high the ceiling is. But I asked him to pinpoint exactly what those boxes are. What did he see as the biggest priorities? His answer was kind of interesting. He said depth. He wanted to improve the overall depth of the roster. This is a good time to mention that on top of Doraphay of Empetterson and Dursy, who those two are expected to be a new second pair on defense, on top of signing Oliver Bjorks strand, who they had signed on July 1. We talked about that earlier in the summer. Likely going to be in the top six could be top nine. I guess we'll see how that plays out in camp. They also in the last couple of weeks, a player that I told you previously, they had been sniffing around on when free agency opened in July 1. And then I think they backed off a little because they prioritized Bjorks strand and got him. But circled back to him later in the

19:21summer is Ellie Tolvenin, who was a 20 goal score a couple of years ago with the Seattle Kraken. And the Rangers got him on a very modest one year, $1.5 million contract. I mean, for them, we talked about this previously as well. Those one year contracts, like those are the biggest no-brainer for me for where the Rangers are at right now because they came into this off season with ample cap space. So you didn't want to lock things up, I think, super long term. Obviously, they did with Doraphayev and with Patterson. But beyond that, Bjorks strand short term, Tolvenin short term, even Dersy only has two years left on his deal. So that's not a super long term commitment. And I think what that does is A, it gives you a chance to have better depth, as Jerry said, and be a more complete team this season. They are, again, hopeful and very much

20:26trying to make the playoffs. But if that doesn't work out, those also become flippable assets for you at the trade deadline. So Tolvenin to me is a no-brainer. I mean, well, we can pick a part of his game. We don't have to do that all on this episode. There's a little scoring upside in there. You really have the one season. I think last year he dropped down to 12 goals. And you look at the underlying stuff, not pretty in Seattle. He's a fairly physical player. I was actually surprised to see how high he ranked in terms of hits in the league last year. I mean, you know, that's debatable how important that is in today's game. Like not all hits are made the same. A hit because you're trailing the play isn't the same as a hit where you remove a guy from the puck and create a turnover. So you can take that with a little grain of salt. But it is a real established NHL player who does provide them with more depth. I know some people are concerned that he could be taking away an opportunity for a young guy. And that may work itself out to be true.

21:29But I also think in the immediate future, like coming out of the gate out of camp for opening night, it's likely he's taking Taylor radish' spot. Not one of the young guys. I think Tollvin and most likely slots in as the third line right winger. And the guy who was kind of penciled into that spot previously was Taylor radish. So I still think Yaro Himelosh in particular, but also maybe in time Adam Sakura or others. You know, I know people are excited to see Liam Greenshree who I got his chance to see up close a couple times in the last week. But I think he's certainly going to Hartford. I would be very surprised if anything different happens. I think he's more of a long term priority. A guy you want to develop properly and maybe give himself a chance to play higher up in the lineup after he gets the proper seasoning with Hartford. But I still think that Himelosh or one of these young bottom six type of guys is going to have a chance to not only

22:29break camp with the team, but be in the lineup on opening night. I don't think Tollvin and changes that. But jury emphasized improving the depth. I think we all can agree he has done that. It's just a matter of keep coming back to this theme. But how high does is the ceiling of that improved depth will find out soon. He did also mention that having that depth he feels gives them better protection from injuries. He specifically mentioned the time that Adam Fox and Igor Shasturken missed last year. And we know those are the Rangers two best two most important players. Hands down bar none. Having those two pillars gives the Rangers a chance at least to keep this window open, especially having arguably the best goalie in the league. But even Adam Fox, we've talked about him so many times in the over the top

23:29kind of it's become almost trendy. I think to criticize him in the last couple of years. And I think people yes, I'll agree with those who say he's not on the McCar Hughes or Rensky level. But he's not far behind and he's still very, very much one of the best defenseman in the league. In my opinion, probably top 10, but no worse than top 15. And that's a great guy to have on your team. That's a great guy to build around. So keeping them in the lineup will be critical. But jury also feels like they're in a better position to withstand injuries. I mean, Igor would be devastating no matter what. Foxo with the improved depth of this decore. They probably at least in a short term thing are a little more equipped to handle that. Peter and I went and checked. Rangers record with both guys in the lineup last year, 19 16 and five. So to me, that's solid, not great. You know, you're still not even winning half the games, but your points percentage is

24:32above 500 with those guys in the lineup, which is respectable with one or neither in the lineup last year. They were 15, 23 and four. So that's flat out bad. So this might not be breaking news or standout analysis here, but they need both Fox and Shasturkin, in my opinion, to be a team that can be taken seriously for the playoffs. But jury emphasize that he feels like the infrastructure of the depth is in a better spot today than it was at the beginning of the summer. The other thing that jury touched on that I know a lot of people are interested in the last week, but honestly from what I heard, I don't think there is ever anything close at all. Those who follow these things are probably aware, but new CBA rules came into effect as of midnight Tuesday going into

25:36Wednesday that basically changed the way that you can structure contracts. The big thing that a lot of people took notice of is no longer as of now. Can you go to eight years on a contract with the player? The max is now seven. There were other things involved there as well as terms of payout structures and all that. But what that created was a bit of a mad rush for a lot of teams, especially with young players of restricted free agency type ages, to try to get those deals done, to guarantee them the eight years or guarantee them other structural things in terms of the contract that they would want. And so we saw quite a few deals get done on Tuesday. The Rangers did not get any deals done on Tuesday. And my understanding is that they weren't particularly close on anything. The big one that I think a lot of fans were wondering about was Gabe Perot. Jury pretty much refused to

26:39comment on that. Anytime you ask him about any kind of contract negotiation, future of a player with the organization, he always says, I'm not going to talk about contract stuff, which is what he said again today when he was asked specifically about Perot. But I know Peter is reported this and I've heard the same. And we will have more on this coming. I believe at some point in the next week or so. But I don't sense that there was really much movement at all with the Rangers trying to get something done with Perot. And I wouldn't assume, I'm hoping to have a little more for you this on this soon. But I wouldn't assume just based on the initial things I'm hearing that that means the Rangers didn't want to do something with Perot right now. I think if you're a player sitting in Perot's position and you finish less season strong and you believe in your own talent and feel

27:39that better things are to come, especially better numbers that lead to better contracts. Why wouldn't you want to bet on yourself and wait a little more time to get yourself a higher value on your contract? You know, I don't think it's as easy as the team just going to the player and saying, Hey, we want to resign you for eight years at a team friendly number. Like the player has to want to do that as well. And I'm not sure that that was really in the cards. In this case, other guys like Will Koolie and Noah Lava didn't really get the sense that anything was close on those fronts either. So those are kind of problems for another day. Right now the focus is very much on this upcoming season. There's a few more topics I want to hit on regarding that. And also talk about some of the nuggets that came out of that press conference with Jury and Sullivan. We're going to take a really quick break right here. And then I'll be back in a few minutes with plenty more that I'd like to discuss before the end of this episode. So hang in tight for just a

28:41second here. Every game day you show up for your team. Now it's your time. Ask your prescriber about Wigovie, some Maglatide injection 2.4 milligrams, a GLP one. Call 1-8-3-3-4 Wigovie or visit Wigovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wigovie. Why wait? College football is back. So Hilton called to me the superstition concierge to make your fan rituals a reality. Need a room to match your lucky number? We got you. Want to make sure our team doesn't wash your lucky jersey? Oh that smells lucky. Hilton's unmatched hospitality can keep up with any superstition. Even a marching bandwink up call at 555 and 55 seconds. Hit it! When you need a team that will do whatever it takes on game day, it matters where you stay. Hilton for

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30:45This episode is brought to you by State Farm. No two football players are exactly alike. And the same is true off the field. That's why State Farm gifts to know you so they can help personalize coverage for your life and budget. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. All right, we're back. And I'm just trying to rack my brain here a little bit in terms of what we heard from Chris Drury. He was asked specifically about the changes to the player development staff promoting Tanner Glass, who had been the number two for Jed Ortmeier, who left the organization earlier in the off season, expressed confidence in him. Didn't want to go too deep. I tried to press a little bit about specifics on what do they feel that they can do better. After the years that he's had of being around the organization and seeing some of the missteps they've had with player development,

31:46didn't get a whole lot there. But he did say that Tanner Glass is hard working and has earned it and expressed a lot of confidence in him. He also expressed a lot of confidence in J.T. Miller, who we know, I mean, for very different reasons. But Tanner Glass, because the Rangers need to turn out some contributing young players in the near future. And they've also added quite a few prospects into the system now that need to be handled properly and maximized. So Tanner Glass, for that reason, is critically important to the future of this organization. And J.T. Miller is critically important because this is a player that the Rangers have for better or worse hitch their rag into. This is like the big bet that Chris Dury has made. If you look at pretty much any transaction, I mean, I guess we could say Doraphayev and Patterson and some of the deals he made this summer now. You know, there's certainly risk involved in that. There's certainly upside. There's certainly downside. But J.T. Miller at the point when the Rangers made that deal,

32:50they were sort of at a crossroads. And that was the moment when Dury really seemed to double down on, we're not going to rebuild. We're going to find a way out of this. And this is a player who I think can lead us there. And obviously last year did not go according to plan. It was his worst points per game production in seven years. There was a lot of play that did not look like the tenacious play driving in your face presence that the Rangers thought that they were getting with J.T. Miller. I do think in some ways, considering team context, considering we know he was dealing with multiple injuries throughout the year, considering the difficult matchups. I mean, the Rangers used him as their matchup center for the most part of last year. Sometimes he was on the wing, but a lot of times he was going head to head with the best center on the opposing team. And clearly did not have

33:53a lot of help in a lot of those situations. So I'm not trying to make excuses for the guy. He had a lackluster season. I think he's been pretty open about that. I mean, he has talked about it from like a personal emotional side of things. He's proud of the way that he handled all the frustrations and the losing and all that from last year. But on the ice, he did not deliver. Like there's really no disputing that. And you know, you could talk about the defensive stuff. And I do think that that was in some ways better than I anticipated. And you respect playing through injuries and you respect the guy taking the tough matchups. But at the end of the day, he's got to produce. And especially now that the Rangers have traded Vincent Trocheck and really slashed their center depth. At least as far as guys that you feel comfortable playing in your top six, it's really Zabana.jad Miller. And that is it at the center position. So if one of those guys gets injured or one of those guys falls off, they're both entering their age 33 seasons. Mika's coming off of his best season in a few years.

34:59Miller's coming off of his worst season in probably seven years. So they're kind of trending in different directions right now. But you need both of them to be good if you want to be a legitimate team this year. And if whether it's performance based or injury based, anything happens to either one of those guys this year. What's the fallback plan? Is it Noah Lava? Probably. And listen, Lava had an encouraging rookie season in a lot of respects. Like I'm not trying to say anything negative about Noah Lava here. I think he has a very real future in the NHL. I think he could be end up being a really solid third line center. I'm not sure. Maybe he'll prove this to be the opposite or he'll prove this to be wrong. But from what we saw last year. And from people I've talked to, you know, one of the things I do a lot in the summer is I talk to a lot of different scouts and people around the league. It's a good time to make those calls. I think a lot of people

36:00feel like ads speed that they need to the lot of. I think he was like 99th percentile on skating speed according to NHL edge last year. Really impressive and responsible defensively already a key player on the penalty kill getting better on face offs, a solid four checker. Like again, there's a lot to like when you're talking about a guy who you're going to play in your bottom six. But if you're going to need him in the top six, you're going to need a guy that can brew some offense. And he had 24 points last year. So we would need a significant jump to feel comfortable playing him in the top six. And then after that, you've got unproven prospects. You've got Joe Valino who certainly I don't think the Rangers have any intention kind of, I don't know, journeyman's the right way to put it. But this is a guy who played for the Canadian's last year. Again, has some of those speed and defensive elements that we talk about with lava. But I think he had five points for the whole season last year. So things are precarious at the center

37:05position. And jury is really putting a lot of his eggs in the JT Miller basket. And he needs him to bounce back in a big way. And he also expressed confidence, which you would figure he would, but expressed confidence in him at that press conference today. He also mentioned Hartford as being an important area where they want to show improvement. And I can tell you, you know, I mentioned talking to people around the league this summer. Probably the most popular move that the Rangers made this summer was hiring Jay Leach as their new coach for their age, Elephiliate in Hartford. I mean, at least a few people that I talk to think that that is a home run higher. They think that he's great at working with young players. And they think he's exactly what the Rangers need. Because Hartford, I mean, you look at that line up, it is going to have a ton of young players, a ton of prospects. A lot of guys that are entering

38:06their first professional season. A lot of guys that the Rangers really need to be groomed properly. And I'm hoping to do a little more on this at some point. But the sense that I've gotten is that people feel like they're going to be in good hands with Jay Leach. I did get a chance to meet him for the first time on Saturday in Allentown for the rookie game. And pretty impressive guy. I mean, you know, we got to talk for 10 minutes or so. It's not like I know his whole life story or anything yet. But I was glad to get that chance. I was glad to get the chance to see some of the prospects up close. You know, it's hard to take too much from those rookie games. It's sloppy hockey, to be honest, at this time of year. I mean, maybe part of it is me shaking off the cobwebs. I haven't watched live hockey in a number of months. And so, you know, my eyes are dark. And I'm trying to, you know, get a feel for everything again as well. But like, it was just a lot of turnovers.

39:06A lot of guys who didn't look like they were particularly effective with the puck on their stick. Just, you know, guys chasing it around. It had that pond hockey, summer hockey kind of feel to it. And so, you don't want to draw any big conclusions from that. If anything would stood out to me and a few people that I talk to is that the flyers had a pretty clear advantage. Maybe that means that their guys are a little more ready for whatever reasons. I don't know if I really think it's that. I mean, both teams, I think had one practice day before they played for those games. I just think the flyers have a little bit more of that high end skill in their system, especially at the forward position, than what the Rangers were able to put on the ice. And that was evident. I mean, the flyers control possession, they both games, I believe, outshot them. It just felt like they were more in control, had more scoring chances. We're able to get a little bit more generated.

40:10The Raiders did it in spurts, like both games they had a period or so where I thought they showed some improvement. Leach specifically mentioned the puck management being an issue. I mean, that's something that stood out to me with a number of guys. I know the obvious player of interest for a lot of you is Albert Smith's. And having watched him up close for honestly two days. So like, you know, again, let's take these with a grain of salt. I'm not passing final judgment on the guy after this. But physically, he looked like a moose to me. And I mean, that in a complimentary way. Like at that practice on Friday, he was all over the place moving guys around, pinning guys on the wall, winning puck battles, removing guys from the front of the net. He's not maybe the fastest, fastest skater. But I think he's a damn good skater. And it just feels like fluid and smooth to me. Like he eats up a lot of ice without looking like he needs to like really go full bore in terms

41:15of effort. And so those, you know, from a defenseman standpoint, like that's what all these teams crave. He's Lanky, six foot three. He has the reach, but he also has the mobility to cover large portions of ice. And on top of that, he definitely doesn't seem like the kind of guy who's going to back down to anybody. And he seems like a like a big well-built, strong kid who knows how to engage people, who knows how to defend, who kind of has a feel for all of that already. So that is on the positive side. I think that's why you hear so many people talk about him being NHL ready. What I was less impressed with were the puck touches and the puck decisions. He turned the puck over multiple times that I saw at Friday's practice and multiple times in Saturday's game. They didn't play him on Sunday. From my understanding is that was always part of the plan. I think they're, you know, trying to be careful here. They're protecting their biggest asset in terms of prospects.

42:18But I do feel like just in terms of the decision making and the feel for what to do with the puck. I mean, the Rangers have talked so much about wanting puck moving defenseman and wanting guys that can get the puck out of their own zone. Like I just came away feeling like there's skills there for sure. I mean, the shot was clear. Definitely has a weapon with that left-handed shot. But those things could probably use a little refining. He's still 18 years old. It brought me back to thinking what I heard from a few people over the summer. Like what's the rush? Especially with this condensed training camp. The Rangers aren't going to have a lot of time to work with him or evaluate him before the season starts. So my feeling is that it might not be a bad thing. It would probably be a good thing for the kid to get some time in the A.H.L. Maybe it's a week or two. Maybe it's a couple of months. Whatever it ends up being. I think it's critical that they don't rush him

43:24and put him into a situation where he gets overwhelmed or he makes a lot of mistakes and he starts to lose confidence. I've seen that with many prospects in my eight seasons covering the team and that can have a cascading effect. Whereas if you let them go to the minors and let them build confidence and let them show up feeling like they're ready to roll and they've worked out the kinks. That is when I think you're putting yourself in a better position for success. And to be honest, based on the comments from Jury and Sullivan, I think they're thinking the same way. I don't want to say for sure. They're not going to reveal their full hand yet. But Sullivan said the same thing pretty much. He said, physically this guy looks like he's ready, but we also want to do the right thing by him. And Jury has said, I think the quote was, this is not a sprint for him. So those comments tell me that they are fully not expecting him to go to the A.H.L. like Sullivan said,

44:30he has a chance to make the team. Jury has made it sound similar. I absolutely believe that. I mean, if he blows a doors off in the next week and a half, doesn't have a lot of time to do it. But if he blows a doors off, he could make the team for sure. But I also think that there's an understanding that it probably wouldn't hurt him. And if anything, it more likely would help him to get a little time to marinate. And so I'm curious to see how that plays out. I think that's one of the more interesting storylines going into this camp. Another thing that Sullivan touched on. Maybe this is kind of the last topic that we'll talk about here before I end this episode. But that is Dora Faev, how he fits in. A lot of fans have asked me this summer about, is he going to play on the left side? Is he going to play on the right side? Well, I know he's played both in Vegas. He's a left-handed shooter, came up as a left wing, largely played left wing his first few seasons, did get some shifts on the right from what I understand last season.

45:32And I spoke to his coach who made the move initially before he got fired. But the coaches worked the most with him at the NHL level Bruce Cassidy over the summer to ask him some questions about Dora Faev. And he made the move to put him on the right kind of out of necessity. He did great there. And from what Cassidy told me and Sullivan echoed this as well today, Dora Faev has basically said, listen, I'm comfortable. I'm fine playing on either side. Sounds like a very low maintenance player from what I've heard. So, from that standpoint, I think the Rangers have flexibility. They have some options. He's very comfortable on the left. He's probably had more time over the course of his life on the left side. But he scored 37 goals last year, largely playing on the right. And from the right side, as a left-handed shooter, that puts you in a better position for one-timers. When you're in the offensive zone, when you're close to the net, you prefer to be on that right side because that's going to set up a left-hand shooter with better angles. So, these are all factors to consider. I certainly think on the power play,

46:38he's going to be on that right side. I think you can take that one to the bank. But at 5 on 5, the Rangers have a question of where are they going to play this guy. And to me, there's a lot of factors to consider and Sullivan hinted on this as well. I think first and foremost, everybody's wondering that top line that they finished last season with, with Perot, Zabanajad, and Lafernir. Largely, that was a very positive experiment. I mean, for the two wingers in particular, you look at their point production in the last 25 games, Lafernir was exactly a point per game player, and Perot wasn't too far off. So, clearly, and I saw this up close, I talked to all the players involved about it. They were energized by that opportunity. We talk about putting prospects in a position to succeed. Well, when you've got young skilled wingers who are used to playing with other skilled players, bearing them on the third or fourth line, doesn't usually

47:39produce the desired outcome. Well, letting them play up in the lineup, as long as they're ready for it, which those two guys looked like they were ready for it, especially Lafernir. I mean, he's going into a seventh season on the league now. I probably should stop calling him a young player. But we know for most of Lafernir's career, until the last couple of years, it's the last three years, really. He was buried on that third line most of the time. He's high at ups and downs. I mean, last season, first half or so of the season, one of the worst stretches we've seen from him, really discouraging the inconsistencies have become maddening with him at times. But he finished playing arguably the best hockey I've ever seen him play. See, either then or why am I I'm trying to remember which playoff run, one of the playoff runs is a 22 or 24. Wow, that's bad that I'm not pinpointing that. But one of those two, he was, I thought was the most confidence I've seen him play with as well. But it seemed like he got back to that now again,

48:42context matters here. Rangers were out of the playoff race. They weren't playing for anything. All that I understand. But you've got to, if you're the Rangers, try to capture that momentum in a bottle and roll it into the new season and and continue them down that path, both Perot and Lafernir. So from that standpoint, I think there's an argument to keep them playing with Zabana Jad. They thoroughly enjoyed and appreciated that. But if you peel back the layers, the underlying numbers for that line don't really jump off the page. They were like a 48, 49% expected goal line, under 50% for sure. And you know, that's not the be all end all. But it just shows they weren't exactly dominating in terms of scoring chances and possession and shots. So I think when you look at it in that context, it's not like it would be some grave mistake in my mind to break them up.

49:46I think there's a case to keep them together. But I also think that it's worth exploring other options. This is the time of year to experiment. And with that in mind, you'd have to think that in an ideal world, the Rangers would want their new biggest weapon. The guy that has the best track record of scoring goals, at least as far as their wingers are concerned. And they are very much counting on to be an offensive pillar for this team in Doraphayev. You'd have to think in an ideal world they would like him to play with Zabana Jad. And if you're going to do that, you're not going to be able to keep both Perot and Lafernir also with Zabana Jad. He can't have three wingers. The other thing that I think is kind of important to consider here, we'll see. I think five of the top six forward spots are pretty much accounted for with Lafernir, Perot, Doraphayev, Zabana Jad Miller. The six spot, I would lean just in terms of my best educated guess that Oliver Bjorkstrand will be

50:49that guy. He's a guy that scored over 20 goals six times in his career. The Rangers got him for a few reasons, but I think most importantly because they wanted shooters, they wanted scores. And so in Doraphayev and Bjorkstrand, you've got these guys that clearly throughout their career have a history of being shoot first players. Those are trigger men. In Lafernir and Perot, you've got guys that I think fall more into the playmaker bucket, especially Perot, but Lafernir has that in him. We've seen that. That's certainly what he was known for as a prospect. In terms of wingers in their hockey IQ offensively at least, their ability to see the ice, make plays, make rees, find the open man, Lafernir and Perot, you have the most confidence in. So you would think it makes sense just logically to have one of the playmakers with one of the shooters on each

51:50of the first two lines. I have to think Sullivan is probably going to experiment with combinations that achieve that and see how that looks. But then, as I touched on Peter and I have a new story going up on the athletic Thursday morning with a lot of our takeaways and analysis of what we heard from jury and Sullivan. But another thing that keeps coming up in my mind that I think could dictate the decision of all right, is Doraphay on the left or the right, is where do they prefer Lafernir? And for a lot of people, I've had fans say this to me right away, they're like, oh, well, he's a left-handed shooter. He came up as a left-winger. He played left-wing his whole life. They should put him at left-wing. And I don't disagree with that necessarily. But I would also point out that it's been three straight seasons now of Lafernir except for a game here and there, almost exclusively playing right-wing. The Rangers have devoted a lot of time

52:54and effort into getting him adjusted to that side. Now, maybe you could say they pushed it too far, it went too long, you got to pull the plug. That might be the case. Maybe Sullivan reaches that conclusion. But we just talked about how he finished last season on a high note. And I do think increasingly he's become comfortable in that spot. So that, to me, might be the crux of this decision. Between Doraphay and Lafernir, I think the the likeliest outcome, maybe I'm wrong, but the likeliest outcome is that they're on the top line with Savannah Judd and then Perot and Bjork's tram play with Miller on the second line. That would be my guess. Now, I'm not guaranteed this, but that would be my guess. Even if it doesn't work out that way, it still might come down to this decision. But if Lafernir and Doraphay have are on the same line, then it's really a matter of like which one of them do you think is better on the left and which one of them do think is better

53:57on the right? And if Doraphay of his equally comfortable in both spots, which is what he said, what Sullivan said, what Cassidy said, what does Lafernir prefer and what do they prefer for Lafernir? Maybe I'm over simplifying, but that might be what this decision comes down to. At the end of the day, it's probably not make a break. I mean, I think it would be cool and kind of creative. If like they're interchangeable, right? If they both have experienced playing both sides and they're playing on the same line, maybe from one shift to the next, maybe within one shift, they could switch sides. That could throw the defense off. Maybe that would be an interesting wrinkle. I mean, I'm certainly not a coach, but that seems like a fairly feasible thing to me, like within the zone, when you have the puck, you guys can switch sides, you guys can move around, the movement's going to be a key part of the offense. So we'll see how it plays out. It was an obvious topic. I think that people want to ask Sullivan about for good reason. On the first day, at the end of the day, it's probably not like a make or break decision for their season,

54:59but the whole alignment of the top six, how they're going to arrange that. I am very fascinated on that. That's one of the things. Obviously, we'll be reporting back to you guys. Thursday, once we see what the lines look like at practice, and especially during that scrimmage that we're going to see, we'll get a feel for where Sullivan's leaning early on, but I do expect over the course of this camp. You're going to see him try different things. He said as much today. So that was probably one of the other bigger topics I would say that came out of that press conference today. There's a lot more we're going to want to cover. I'm going to be back next week in the middle of training camp with a guest. My Pope Peter on for the first one, but we'll see. I got to figure out what his schedule looks like, too. He's also, I know he's doing some stuff with Devils and Islanders next week as well. So we'll see what he's looking like. But I will have, I promise some guests next week for sure. And we will dive deeper into a lot of these Rangers question. There is a ton of preview content up on the athletic already.

56:02We finished off our prospect rankings, which if you guys haven't had a chance to check those out, we pour so much work into those. It's kind of a labor love. It's a lot of fun. If you haven't read those yet, I hope you get a chance to do it. Full profile features on each of the top 10 prospects in the organization. And then I, at the end of it, went even deeper and ranked even more players by position. We've done depth charts for every position. So that includes the guys that we think are going to make the NHL roster and the guys that we think are going to be backing them up with Hartford. So we did that for all three forwards, both sides of defense and goalies in the last week. Peter wrote a piece all about the positional battles to watch at this training camp. Quite a few of those. I mean, I do think, listen, we'll talk about this more. Maybe 20 plus of the roster spots are kind of already solidified. But there's a few that are up for grabs. And there's also some, you know, as we talked about with the top six stuff, positional stuff, or we're not sure exactly who's going to play where that will bear itself out

57:07in the next couple of weeks at camp. And then I had my story on Wednesday morning go up with my 10. And it's hard to pinpoint 10. I honestly wrote out like 15. But I narrowed it down to 10 questions that I have about this team going into training camp and the new season and, you know, starting on Thursday. We're going to start talking to players and we're going to be cranking out a lot of stories. Probably multiple a day, a lot of these days for you guys to sink your teeth into. So if you don't already subscribe, please, please, please, we appreciate everybody who does. And I'm a little biased, but I don't think there's anybody that's going to have it covered as well, or as thoroughly as us. So please check out the athletic. When you get a chance, it's good to be back. I felt like maybe I would be a little rusty, but honestly, I'm growing. Once you turn on the mic and I'm talking, I mean, maybe, maybe you guys tell me maybe I do sound rusty, but I feel like picking up right where I left off feels good to be back out there feels good to be heading back to the ring tomorrow and especially feels good to be talking to all of you. So thank you all

58:08for your patience. This last month or so when we took a little time off, good to sort of refresh with kids waking me up at six and six thirty in the morning all the time is refreshed as you possibly can be, but it was a blast. I hope you guys really enjoyed your summer as well. And now it's time. The best sports time of the year is here. Hockey season is about to be back and we are ready to roll. Thank you all for listening and I will talk to you all next week. Every game day you show up for your team. Now it's your time. Ask your prescriber about Wigovie, some Maglatide injection 2.4 milligrams, a GLP 1. Call

59:12183-3-4 Wigovie or visit Wigovie.com to view the Medication Guide and to learn more about Wigovie. Why wait?