"The press fires back"

0:00You just got back to your Toyota truck and you can't feel your fingers. You've been out here for 13 days. Now, 16, 15, you've lost track. You're eating something you wouldn't dare look in the eyes while taking directions from a phone that ran out of signal miles ago. Every bone and muscle in your body has filed a formal complaint. And the only gas you've got left is in the tank of your truck. But you know what? You're the happiest you've been in years. Toyota trucks outlast outlive. You know that feeling when too many things fall through the cracks? Monday.com was built for that gap. The AI work platform where people and agents work side by side to deliver more together. Create your first Monday agent today at Monday.com. Hi there, everyone. It's forecloth in New York Journalists, News Anchors, Correspondents. We all cover the news. We report on the news. We don't ever want to become the news.

1:01But today we're going to make an exception because our news organization, our company, our Correspondents, along with two others have sued the Trump administration today over Donald Trump banning our access to the White House, our ability to do our jobs. We're bringing this as our top story, not because our name is on the lawsuit because of what it means more broadly for you, for all voters. What it means for the future of a free press in our country, for the US Constitution, that enumerates the power of that press, the freedom of that press, and the American people who rely on us to get the truth about what their government is doing in our name. So the lawsuit filed today by MSNOW along with CNN and Politico argues that Trump's ban is a direct assault on the First Amendment, and that Trump did this, quote, expressly for the improper purpose of retaliating against plaintiffs for past news coverage, because he deemed it negative, and chilling future reporting about him and his administration's policies and actions.

2:02The suit goes on, quote, Trump has said in no uncertain terms that he would prefer only to be covered by news organizations and reporters, who praise his administration. But the Constitution does not allow a president or any other government official to deprive the press of their First Amendment rights and liberty and property interests with no notice or process based solely on his dislike of the content of their reporting. The ban is unconstitutional and should be immediately restrained. The lawsuit asks for Trump's ban to be blocked, and for our press credentials to be restored. The judge assigned to the case is Timothy Kelly, and he was appointed by Donald Trump. He set a virtual hearing for two days from now that's Wednesday in the afternoon. Judge Kelly actually ruled in favor of one of our first guests when he was banned by Donald Trump back in 2018 while he was serving as CNN's Chief White House correspondent. In response to Trump's latest move against these three networks, other networks have come together in solidarity.

3:05The White House press pool announced it is suspending today's televised coverage of Donald Trump that follows CNN being pulled from its assigned pool coverage duties for the week. Presidents before Donald Trump, and we like to think after Donald Trump, have disagreed with the coverage that they get, but it goes with the territories part of the job. An independent press holds America's leaders accountable. Here's what former President Barack Obama said when he made that very point. He addressed members of the White House press corps for the last time at the end of his presidency in the White House briefing room. I have enjoyed working with all of you. That does not, of course, mean that I've enjoyed every story that you have filed, but that's the point of this relationship. You're not supposed to be synchrofants, you're supposed to be skeptics, you're supposed to ask me tough questions. You're not supposed to be complimentary, but you're supposed to cast a critical eye on folks who hold enormous power and make sure that we are accountable to the people who sent us here.

4:11Holding truth to powers where we begin today was some of our favorite experts and friends, long time CNN correspondent, Nankar Jimicost is here. He's now the host of the Jimicost to show on Substag and he's taking up a lot of space in Trump's head today. We're so glad you're here. The former top DOJ official in Jimicost, so for the FBI, our legal analyst, Andrew Weisman is here. And joining us from outside the White House perimeter, we'll explain how that differs from where he usually is, our senior White House reporter von Hill, you're here. Von, just take us through what happened and how your job is different today than it was before Trump banned you Friday. Right, our colleague, Kayla Gardner, was at the White House on Saturday morning, attempted to enter in the Secret Service at that point confiscated her White House hard pass, which uses to get into the building every day. And that is when it was made clear that CNN, political and MSNOW and the reporting teams that are part of those networks had their passes revoked.

5:11And the rest of us, we have not gone and we have not surrendered our hard passes with the hope that this federal district judge on Wednesday who is set to hold this initial hearing to hear our legal team's case ultimately orders the White House and President Trump to give access back to the journalists here. This is for us. This is not just about the smell of the grass on the White House lawn and the nice backdrop of having the White House, let's be very clear. This is the First Amendment constitutional right that we as the American journalists have in holding the executive branch accountable. And I think that that is when you're talking about the access to cabinet members and staff as I felt the bug here outside on me, Nicole, you have this situation here where you have the ability as journalists to go and attempt to ask questions of the President and of members of the cabinet there in real time. And it was that John Solomon the night of that prime time address after the Donald Trump suggested that the 2020 election was unfairly rigged against him right I had a moment where I was able to ask John Solomon about the lack of evidence that showed the Joe Biden had actually lost the 2020 election.

6:21It's moments like that that are critical to our ability and right now because the decision of the White House we have lost that access. Jim Acosta I just I want to hear because you've traveled this path and this judge filled in your favor. I want to though share what Donald Trump says is behind this he's extremely agitated today more than usual it would appear and he says it's called the Oval Office it should be treated with decorum respect and dignity. This is a guy literally taping gold stuff all over the place I mean it's an incredible thing to say he's saying it should not be defiled by third break clowns which is oddly capitalized who purposefully distort twist and degrade everything they write or publish virtually every story about me or having to do with me is negative wrong and in many cases dangerous for the country. The truth is some of the worst press he's getting right now is it CBS which is owned by one of his closest allies he's about to prove an even bigger media grab I've Joe Rogan has turned on him almost completely said James

7:32Hillary go as a nice and good person deserves to run for president because America should have a good person main Kelly and Tucker Carlson or vicious critics of the war on Iran I mean this to me at this point where he's hit an unbelievable historic low and is pulling. This is just the tip of the iceberg I mean most of his negative press is among one time allies not people who've always been skeptical of him. Yeah Nicole I mean this is this is a desperate move on his part there's no question about I think he senses that the tide is turning in this country and that he is about to be on the receiving end of a voter revolt come these midterms that are coming up in November but what he is trying to do is test our institutions once again I think that he is going after the press in a way to perhaps soften up the coverage in the event that he decides he's not going to honor the election results or bully Mike Johnson and to not. Allowing a democratic Congress to be seated and so I do think that despite his declining faculties and wanting to put snipers on top of arches and things like that things that sound one flew over the kukus nest that there is a crafty side to him and he does want to stop what is coming and that is accountability on the party the American people and today over the White House with the pool banding together thank goodness we saw that Nicole because what what transpired look like an episode of a VEEP there was video clip.

8:55There was video clips coming out of the White House this afternoon with the audio because they had gotten rid of CNN in the pool and the other network said we're not going to be a part of the pool and so as my mother used to say you made your bad you lie in it after round and find out and Donald Trump is finding out right now he's not getting his media binky. He has his Natalie Harper binky and today he's not getting his press pool binky. I mean Vaughan on that point what what is your sense of what the I mean Natalie Harper Harper is now well documented to be the primary source or the gatekeeper of what he consumes so what put this in motion that it became particularly agitated by MS now CNN and Politico when as I mean we've been covering the most devastating coverage of the war in Iran comes from CBS and the Wall Street Journal. The most brutal polls about his economic standing are really the ones that Fox has been putting out week after week what made him mad on Friday at this network CNN in Politico.

9:55The reporting is suggested Natalie Harper in front of him some clips including from our own network that led him to ultimately make this decision to revoke our access here and I think this is why our reporting that we have been reporting let's be clear for years now dating back to the campaign on that more in the end of 2025 he that position was not filled he left the White House somebody that also had a relationship with myself and other members of this press core here and what you have seen here is Donald Trump believe these are conversations you and I had Nicole in New York back in 2023 2024 he has built people who know that it worked for him that will go and ultimately revoke that access it was on January 6 2023 I was in the small town in Iowa and I went and asked him at very specific

11:11question that did he have any regrets about how he handled January 6 on what was then the two year anniversary that was the last question I got to him for nine months the apparatus around Donald Trump kept him from me and that message was a clear message that was sent not to other people inside of our own new or was organization at the time but other news organizations that unless you are complicit if you put yourself out there in a what they would call antagonistic way what I as a journalist would say a very direct reporter way then you are going to suffer the consequences and you and I had conversations in your office I know Nicole in real time about what our coverage was the way in which I continued to try to make sure that I had access on behalf of our news organization while working for NBC and MSNBC knowing that my line of questioning was never going to get me an interview with the president of the United States with the candidate that never came to fruition and where do we find ourselves here in September 20 26 in a very unsurprising place but what do we have on our side now we have other news organizations standing in defense of our organization CNN and Politico and the reality is is that we here in the United States still have the ability to get our reporting out to the American public and he cannot take that away

12:29people are able to engage with us on a multitude of platforms and I know that the president will see very clearly that his efforts to restrict access are not to going to succeed especially here two months until these midterm elections. So Andrew Weissman take me through the legal platform word for the lawsuit that we filed along with CNN and Politico. You're going to win. It's that simple this is not a close case as you mentioned Jim had the same case in front of the same judge this is a due process violation it is a first amendment violation you know Nicole you know me well enough that I usually don't engage in predictions or I say words like it seems or there's a fair likelihood etc. This is a slam dunk and the president has to know it which is why so many people are focusing on the issue of like why is he doing this is it a distraction from other bad news is it is Jim said away to distract from you know what he's going to try to do or just soften the blow of the midterms.

13:38I wanted to just take a quick moment to point out something about the president reaching for something that is so blatantly unconstitutional and for people to understand it is not about CNN or MS now or Politico it is about the right of people to get the news and to hear the news and that they choose. In the 1930s in Germany Liam Shire and other foreign journalists were required by the German government when they were reporting on the growth of national socialism of the Nazi party they were required before they could report to their home countries to give their written statements to the government before the public in other countries could hear what was going on. That is what the president is trying to do is to whitewash history to whitewash the information that you get that's why it is bigger than just MS now saying oh we want this or CNN want this or Politico wants this this is what authoritarian regimes do William Shire reported this in real time in his diaries of what was going on in Berlin.

15:00The idea that the president of the United States who was supposed to be the leader of the free world has his go to. Something that is so blatantly unconstitutional and I'll just add and not a single known person in his administration said no they're all carrying it out and to Jim's point about worrying about the midterms that's what worries me is that this is so blatantly unconstitutional. And no one that we know of in the White House was saying we can't enforce this they've taken an oath you took the same oath to obey the constitution. I mean Andrew I hear more worry in your voice than I've actually heard in years and so that gives me some pause but let me just follow up with you I mean the. One of the I think challenges right and coming on every day is the use the expression boiling a frog or you know it's it's this slow erosion I mean I said a week ago like in 200 years they're going to look at this period and wonder why why didn't anyone do anything.

16:08Why didn't anyone do anything when ice was shooting and killing Americans on the streets I mean why is this happening and what is it distracting from I think is is the right question. But my question for you is what legal exposure to the accomplices have when they're doing things that I mean for us in our industry known falsity is the standard right that's why Fox paid a bill or nearly a billion dollars to the money because they knowingly we know from their emails they knowingly published false information you're talking about an entire White House apparatus including a White House council and an attorney general in Todd Lynch who are knowingly doing things that are illegal what is in the legal system to hold people accountable who do things that they know are unconstitutional. And a legal precious little and it's it's almost by design so on the one hand you could say if that there's potential federal liability but remember the president has the pardon power and so you can be sure that when he leaves office there's going to be a flurry of pardons he's already talked about that and he obviously has issued already more pardons than any president that we've ever seen.

17:17And in connection with January 6 and others the one thing that holds lawyers to account is that lawyers can be sanctioned and they can be disbarred it is one reason that Todd Blanche has taken the position that is currently being litigated that independent bar associations should not be able to act on DOJ lawyers until DOJ itself has done its own investigation. Meaning they could put it off forever. So Todd Blanche is sort of the question that you have is one that DOJ has actually sort of figured out oh let's see what's one lever that could be used to prevent us from doing things that are improper. We have the presidential pardon power to deal with criminal liability but we can actually deal with our livelihood and sort of independent professional organizations that have for instance disbarred really Giuliani just as one example. And the current position which I don't think will succeed is that they're trying to remove that as well.

18:23This is a long way of saying that for people who are really upset and shocked by this for this kind of blatant and constitutional activity it is a reason to vote and I'm not saying Democratic or Republican I'm just saying vote for somebody who believes in the rule of law. Which is only the Democratic Party as we meet here today. I want to not follow Trump's distraction and deflection campaign I want to show you all the stories. They doesn't want you to hear about I'll do that with Andrew and Jim and Bonn on the other side of the break also had more from former president Barack Obama on all of this on how our state of democracy is unimaginable from what he encountered when he was president. If you short years ago talk about how the country can write this ship if they choose to do that plus the story lines Trump and his White House are keeping will will show you why will show you how devastating everything he has touched has become for him politically and how voters have completely rejected his approach to the economy.

19:25And later in the broadcast from the assault on the free press to brazen and public self enrichment and corruption as U.S. policy to his attempted takeover of all of Washington DC how the world is experiencing and taking in America's want to be strong man with his sinking and plunging approval ratings right now all those stories and much more when the White House continues after quick break don't go anywhere. And And for you to see it's made by angels soft and strong budget friendly. The choice is simple pick up a pack today angels after. Traditional home security only learned you after break in and that's too late simply safe is changing that stop this is simply safe police are on the way. We don't just alert we stop crime before it starts simply safe plans starting around a dollar a day say 50% on your new system with professional monitoring at simply safe dot com slash sxm or promo code sxm outdoor deterrence requires a simply safe active guard outdoor protection plan starting at $49.99 a month is it simply safe dot com slash licenses for alarm license information 10c2012.

20:43You know that feeling too many updates too many meetings too many things falling through the cracks Monday dot com was built for that gap. The AI work platform designed from the ground up for people and agents to work side by side and deliver more together drafting the brief flagging risks running a competitive scan your agent can do it all in the best part anyone can build one even you try it create your first Monday agent today at Monday dot com. All the different presidents at it and and I will grant you that I think maybe Republican presidents that it historically have had maybe a tougher time with mainstream media but you've got Fox News that it has been all over Democratic president I just don't I just don't think this is something we that will last in this country we don't do this in this country. Yeah, I again will see this president has been the most transparent president and he's answer more I think he likes to answer questions is that's why don't and I understand.

21:46Believe me that he feels that that he has been unfairly treated by the media but I think he finally got to a point where sometimes he just he just says okay enough but but I think there's got to be an offering that the administration is looking for. Yeah, we'll see maybe maybe it's it's a change in coverage at the White House you know because some of these reporters they they just don't do their job well with will have something and then that they'll ask some crazy question and I know. That'll forever be the clip where Joe Kernan tries to explain what democracy means to Scott Besson and Scott Besson's mask slips and he explains that it was always a mob move quote maybe there'll be a change in the coverage. Jim Acosta these people aren't good at being autocrats and Scott Besson is the person most responsible for Donald Trump having about a 2% approval rating on inflation if Trump fired Besson today for that appearance with Joe Kernan his approval rating would go up 20 points talk about enablers you talk about people excusing autocracy that guy gets you know he's in the running for first place for enablers.

22:55Yeah, you know Scott Besson maybe he'll be impeached third of the cabinet secretaries I don't know but. After hex up and plan after hex up and maybe RFK junior I don't know but you know I am this whole notion of softening the coverage you know I mean Donald Trump. Right now is mired in what the low 30s maybe upper 20s I saw poll today where is that maybe 29% he started a war of choice in the least that is resulted in high gas prices what does he expect the coverage to be like I mean I just don't understand that and I do think that what we heard from Scott Besson there and from Donald Trump and Donald Trump was asked last Friday is their particular story they have a problem with no I just don't like negative news I don't like fake news I mean getting back to what Andrew Weisman was saying a few moments ago. That is not going to fly with the federal judge in this case when I had my case they were upset about a press conference that happened right after the November 2018 midterms in this case he's not even pointing to anything in particular he's just saying negative coverage I this is going to get left out of court.

23:57And it just makes you wonder what is going on inside Donald Trump's head right now I will say you know perhaps the you know maybe it's not that clip I think the one clip that I'm going to be taking comfort and seeing later this evening is the clip that shows the that Donald Trump was out there doing some dog and pony show today and there was no audio in the video. The audio had been blown up and you know he needs to understand that this this is what the noise of a functioning democracy sounds like when the press is going in there and asking loud questions I mean that is the way it should be done and see my friends in the press a band together today apparently some of the newspapers are not going to be running some of the still pictures coming out of the press pool today in solidarity with the journalist it reminds me of the good old days of Peter Alexander standing next to me at the end of the day. And I think that press conference with Donald Trump in November 2018 and standing by my side and all of us standing together that is what we need in this moment Nicole we need key American institutions not bending the knee standing our ground because these next several weeks these next several months as we go through these elections and seating a new Congress this is going to be massive test for our country and our democracy and this is no time for anybody to get you know wobbly in the knees this is this is a time to really stand firm.

25:19I mean Jim let me I think I have that poll that has a 29% let me say that's our lawsuit I mean he is showing this is the American research group at 29% his approval is inching down to an average much closer to 30% he'd been averaging closer to the mid 30s this is what Sarah Longwell has called sort of the bush line under which I know because I was there for the bush line being reached. Stifical to land Air Force one anywhere because your own popular even in deep red parts of the country you've got his own voters revolting over the economy over inflation over gas prices you've got Trump under water and immigration which was the issue he wrote back to the White House and you've got him more and more popular with the more and more autocratic practices he was actually more popular ironically when bond was throwing him questions when you were throwing him questions what is it say to you about the people around him.

26:19And that Susie Wiles is presiding over this precipitous plunge in the polls and doing nothing. Yeah I think that you know one of the I think key features of that first term is that you saw people like John Kelly general Jim Mattis you know general McMaster I mean I think there were several people in that first administration who were willing to act as guardrails and tell Trump no you really shouldn't admire Hitler's generals remember that whole thing from the first administration you know. They they just don't what is Susie Wiles doing right now I mean what does this look like to her to to ban the press in this moment I mean to me it communicates to the rest of the country that Trump doesn't have a very good story to tell right now otherwise he would have the press they're talking to them on a daily basis. And I you know it just says to me that you know he is in a world of political trouble and he knows what's on the other side of all this he knows that there are democratic hearings and investigations I mean that not the Department of Justice but congressional investigations into what is his he and his family have been up to it has been a corruption bananza since he's come back.

27:26In the Oval Office all of that has to be investigated all of that has to be uncovered and you need a strong free press to do that job. Von the notion of sort of being on this the slip and slide where Trump is not known to sort of crawl off a ledge he's he's known to sort of double and triple down and again some of the most devastating coverage of the war in Iran is coming from journalists at the Wall Street Journal some of the revelations about the war dead have come from the Washington Post in the last week owned by his his friend and his inauguration you know stage making. Jeff Bezos some of the worst stories about the damage to the bases have been broadcast on CBS owned by people very sympathetic to him does this ban have the potential to expand to those outlets. I have no reason to believe it doesn't today on true social. No one's still existed.

28:29The one broadcast camera that is allowed to come in today to film the president bonnets arrival to New York City for the first time in the world. The one broadcast camera that is allowed to come in today to film the president bonnets arrival to New York City for the first day of the United General Assembly without the pool without CNN with CNN being barred to cover it on behalf of all the networks the one hand selected outlet is called real America's voice which is the mega prop prop propagating. Outlet that is host to Steve Bannon's show and Jack Basobick John Solomon before he entered the government to find the election fraud claims that's also the station that he was on and I just wanted to think Nicole real fast Scott Besson is an interesting voice in all of this because the Chinese secretary right if we want to play in a ballgame of facts president she of China is coming here on Thursday it's questionable what press coverage there is going to allow to be but this is the man who touted the.

29:40China was going to buy a record amount of soybeans they haven't even bought this year half of what the pre trade war amount that China for years had bought from the United States and so so much of not just what Donald Trump says should be called into question but also the other cabinet officials and because we have lost our access we have lost the opportunities to engage with people like him and well and that is why there is a reputable harm from us being kept out and the opportunity to ask people like Scott Besson those very direct questions. I mean Andrew just quickly the world is about to descend on America on New York for the United Nations General Assembly what an awful look to the world. There's no question there are standing in the world the intelligence harm to us this soft power that we have globally as you and Susan Rice talked about all of that has been has been devastated by this president but I'm not sure if you can see that.

30:40I do as somebody who is new to the journalism world I do want to say one heartwarming thing which is I'm on with three people who are steeped in what it means to be a journalist and it is heartening seeing law firms cave seeing businesses cave that there are so many news organizations of all sorts of political stripes who are standing together and that is something that was desperately needed. When the executive orders came out on law firms when when the universities were being attacked and so you know I think for people who are watching this they are seeing three people who are representative not that exclusive they're representative of a profession that believes in the first amendment and it's really an honor to be with people who stand for a principle. And then seeing people act together is is I think the heartening story here.

31:43Well I'll take all that praise and he put on to Von and Jim who are doing the work who are walking to that building and covering people that don't want to be covered they don't want the truth to come out so so thank you and thank you for being part of the conversation Andrew Weisman thank you all for starting us off today we'll stay on this coming up. More on what Trump doesn't want you to see the story she doesn't want us to cover how this all factors into the midterm elections which are now six weeks away. In the US there's a break in every twenty six seconds but when intruder step near simply safe home security steps up stop this is simply safe police are on the way using a alerts US based live agents help to turn break ins simply safe no long term con. Tracks save fifty percent on your new system with professional monitoring at simply safe dot com slash sxm or with promo code sxm outdoor deterrence requires a simply safe active guard outdoor protection plan starting at forty ninety nine a month is it simply safe dot com slash licenses for alarm license information Tennessee two zero one two.

32:44Hey before your q3 call I've got the campaign brief ready built from last quarters data and the competitive landscape great did you include the differentiation angle the CMO asked for already in there three angles no competitors using right now just need your approval approved thanks oh agents where would we be without you somewhere with a lot more tabs open create your first Monday agent in minutes at Monday dot com a better help add imagine carrying a backpack every day every conversation every mistake every expectation you probably would notice how heavy it was until someone asked if you wanted to put it down sometimes feeling better starts exactly like that better isn't one size fits all better is personal it's therapy tailored to you to help lighten what you've been carrying match with the therapist who truly gets you visit better help dot com

33:45can actually how beyond the farm just having to spend so much more in production costs on the farm is impacting your own pockets personally like you and your family and things that you don't do that you used to do it here night says uh... go to the movies with your kids on a Saturday Friday night something like that can't do that you know you know you can't go to okay if you do go to the movies we can't stop and get a get in the heat we got to come on home you know we gotta eat was it home you don't drink drinks no more you know you got a drink reward that was our colleague nom de iguanwu and Louisiana interviewing Americans directly impacted by what we're all living through economic crisis that Donald Trump has created and plunged our country into with his war of choice with Iran now Republicans all across our country have to answer to voters like Melissa Nelson there a farmer who's paying record high prices for diesel forcing him to worry about whether or not he can afford to take his kids to the movies and saying

34:53he goes to the movies can afford to eat out his senator is Louisiana senator John Kennedy told the Wall Street Journal this quote voters are not happy and we are in charge which could explain why Kennedy spent the weekend campaigning for candidates in Kansas and Nebraska and Iowa where voters are facing these brutal price increases and gas thanks to Donald Trump and the Republicans who as Kennedy said including Kennedy are in charge of everything and he served as a federal director for the Harris Walls campaign also joining us former advisor to both president George W. Bush and senator John McCain my friend Mark McKinnons here I'll ask both of you what are you seeing and hearing out there because I think now voters are about to have their say and it is a big deal of the opposite of how we've described the country it is not polarized is not divided everyone's mad and everyone's mad at Trump.

35:54They really are I mean the polling shows it in the generic ballot Nicole which is now at 8.5% for Democrats and that's approaching true wave numbers of it can stay there. I was looking at some data from from the last several midterm cycles and Republican pollster Pat Rafini who I respect he got a lot of stuff right for 2024 yeah and we miss some of the stuff that he got right. He was pointing out the sort of trend there wasn't a trend up that he had a lot of folks talking about the generic ballot but what I really saw in his data is that it was it's it's high at this level but in in 18 and even you know 22. It dipped a little bit against Democrats down the stretch I think the migrant care of and conversation Trump is able to pivot to in 18. Tighten a little bit and then they won races like Joe Donnelly and Claire McCaskill in that year. The challenge they have now is how are they going to pivot to something when there's nothing to pivot to and when the impact of these policies the warren ran the tariffs are not just still with us they're on the rise yet getting worse and worse and the conversation I think with voters is now in penitent for them. Yeah I mean the Washington Post is a story Mark saying that the gas prices are about to explode I mean what people are dealing with now they have rejected and are rejecting and nothing is about to get better it's all about to get worse.

37:04Yeah and politics Nicole you know if you're explaining your losing there's just there's nothing that Republicans have to campaign for. There's nothing that they can defend because it's defenseless. Yeah our job is communicators Nicole in campaigns of the White House is to kind of net things out and try really get the core of what people are feeling other than all these individual issues and it's increasingly seems to me like it's becoming chaos versus control. People just have a sense that they've lost control the Trump has lost control the government lost control the war is lost control the economy is lost control of inflation and and that's all affecting people because they feel a loss of control in our lives. There was a time when people said yeah I like a little chaos I think we need to shake it up a little bit going and break some stuff and now they're like we didn't mean everything and so I just think there's really just a sense of Democrats are being successful now because they're basic messages we're going to get the same. And then we're going to get some messages we're going to give you some control back in your lives.

38:04I want to ask both of you about sort of the soft bigotry of Trump's stupidity you know that there's so much it gets away with because no one expects more but he's literally like tacking gold up in the Oval Office as people are paying $6.7 for diesel. I want to ask both of you about some of these things sort of coming home to politically roost for him that have been brewing for a decade. We'll have that conversation on the other side. We're back with Dan and Mark. Mark let me come back to you with your point on chaos you know chaos is his brand and people seem to tolerate it when they weren't paying the price for his stupid human tricks the dumb things he did the dumb things he said. The grifting that he did and I've covered Trump's script way back when David Ferrenthal was at the Washington Post covering emoluments violations with the Trump hotel there to say that they've gone on for a really long time right now the word that most people used to describe Donald Trump 53% according to the economist is corrupt why do you think his corruption pisses people off in a way that it didn't eight years ago.

39:15Well because people are feeling the pain themselves and it's one thing and things are going on and I'm doing okay but this is why you know Bill Clinton was probably the best retail campaign or an our life times because he really understood that you can't spin your way out of economic pain and so is his message to voters was not what Trump is saying with Trump is saying. There is no pain things are fine Bill Clinton was very good at saying I feel your pain I feel it and recognizing and saying listen I know you're going through stuff and I'm going to do something about it Trump Trump just ignores the pain and suggests that nobody's feeling it and to your point about the ballroom and all these other things they're just perfect metaphors for voters is so easy to say wait a minute why is he concerned about a ball or what is he doing. Concerned about a ballroom when I'm really feeling things here in my own community he obviously doesn't care about what I care about or care about me he cares about himself what he's doing is building monuments to himself because he knows that after he leaves nobody else will do it for.

40:20Yeah I mean I I press John this one in my behavior men who report in the book that he spends I think up to 90% of his time we're worrying about or thinking about the renovation projects which I would make the folks at HGTV. I mean it's like it's like an obsession with renovations that is unprecedented there's an A wall to staff who's presiding over an historic plunge and support from the public from one's own coalition and see as it was there's just this feeling that like nobody's home and what he's doing is so crazy and detached what do you think the actual response from voters will be in November. I think they can see it as Mark said because they feel this chaos and they feel the pain around them and you know we we rang the bell in the Nicole in the campaign in 24 that you know the first term there were some credible folks general Kelly et cetera around him and then they were all banished and now it's like Mike Lindell to my pillow guy kind of folks around him all the time and and and people like Natalie Harp who are just feeding him whatever he wants to see which feeds his worst impulses and there's no one running the show that's obvious but I think voters you know some voters are very turned off by corruption.

41:26Others didn't care that much even in the first term was kind of clear he's been a bit of a shady businessmen even on taxes things like that because if he was cutting a good deal for the American people and for them they can they can tolerate that but the minute they see that his attention is elsewhere it's on himself and they can see that his interest is lining his own pockets and his family's pockets and then to Mark's point tell you that the sky isn't blue all day long when you're dealing with this and it's not just the economic pain is huge but it's not just that he's stacking pain on pain on pain that that huge look at Latino votes wing that came over because they want to cost and are control didn't get that and then they got targeted viciously and that you can't unwind in 43 days I don't think right because they're lived realities correct I mean anything you say people are filling up their cars today people are the grocery store today people are Walmart today the lived realities and people living in fear is happening every day thank you both to be continued please Mark McKinnon Dan Kennan and thank you both so much for being here after a break protest in Texas over the

42:28weekend after news of another ice office or shooting what we know about that incident and the man's condition is our next story we are learning more today from local officials about the man shot by ice in Austin Texas yesterday he has Wilbur Raphael Garces Perez he's a 28 year old Venezuelan man he was out making door dash deliveries before the confrontation with ice the Austin police chief said at a news conference that the shooting had occurred after a small foot pursuit but that they're still gathering facts about the confrontation itself as local officials call for independent investigations separate from ice press has now been released from the hospital he spoke at a press conference today from federal custody speaking on the phone he told reporters that he was rushed out of the hospital still has the bullet in his back and had to sleep on the floor at a detention center protests spring up almost

43:31immediately at the scene where the shooting happened that outrage was echoed by the mayor of Austin Texas who said quote while I'm angry about this I'm not surprised at all it's happened in other cities with the nature of ice and the way ice is doing its business these days and the chaos that we see it performing and fermenting we'll stay on top of this story after a break how the rest of the world views America's today especially our slide toward autocracy the next hour of dead end white house starts after a quick break stay with us it's made by angels soft and strong budget friendly the choice is simple the feels like paradise and knowing that a heavenly prize angel salt angel salt pick up a pack today angel safts