Nancy Guthrie Investigation: What the Case Actually Looks Like Right Now

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Here's what keeps showing up in a lot of your messages. We're going to be getting into the

Nancy Guthrie case a little bit more today on the latest with the the Nanos investigation.

Forget the board meetings. Forget the recall signatures. Forget the politics.

You want to know one thing with all of this happening. Is Nancy Guthrie still the priority?

Is somebody still fighting for her? You got a lot of questions about that. There's a lot of noise

as you've been hearing us talking about with with Sheriff Nanos. Robyn Drake retired FBI

Special Agent Chief of the Counter Intelligence Behavioral Analysis program is always my

coast with us as we're discussing this today. Let me ask you this, Robyn. Even if Nanos has changed

over at this point, let's say he steps down and you get somebody new in there.

It's a new position. Somebody's going to hit the ground running, but they're hitting the

ground running when somebody else has been in that position for quite some time. So it's all going

to be a bit new territory. How does that affect this investigation?

So that's a great question. I don't think it would affect the investigation and the investigators

and what they're doing in their day to day. I think they're locked in. I think they're doing

and I think they're working very, very well with what they have. Now what'll be very,

really interesting if that does happen is a fresh set of eyes looking at what they do have

and seeing what new decisions they make on what to share with the public. I think you need to,

so here's what the public would love. The public would love some transparency about what transpired,

what in congruencies meant what Nanos said. They looked for explanations behind. He says this and

he says this. He says this and he says this. And so someone with a new set of eyes looking at

what they have right now would then be able to hopefully put out some corrected information,

some more accurate information, consistent information, and hopefully a little more nuggets that

would help generate leads because that's what they still need more of. They still need more

information coming in because if we're not on someone, if we don't have an arrest, they obviously

aren't zeroing in close enough to be able to do that. So maybe with a fresh set of eyes at the top,

taking a little bit more of a concise angle on what to put out to the public would help that a lot.

Like, so for example, I don't know the impact on this yet, but Savannah, she just did this interview

as a recording of this earlier today or yesterday and she's talking about the back door being

propped open. I'm like, huh, that completely added some new data points to way eyes thinking

about this because remember, I'm like 60, 40, 60 on the home invasion for attempted burglary

gone sideways, but back door propped, you know, propped open. I got to do some more research now. I

got to take a look a second look at this because how does that affect just that one little nugget

that she put out there kind of shifts this whole thing. Now granted, is that going to help bring

Nancy home sooner or later? Don't know, but that kind of information might have helped early on.

And there's a psychology behind releasing some of that information or not and it's very

invested in it makes sense because you're going to get a lot of people that are going to claim they

have knowledge of this or that and there's certain details that need to be held close enough to

the best that you can determine whether that person actually knows what the hell they're talking

about or not or they're just making up a story. But sometimes revealing some of that information

earlier on gives you a better idea of who to be looking out for profile wise in the general public.

Now it's one thing, you know, the investigators to know who they should be looking out for,

but there's only so many of them and there's, you know, it's a gazillion to one when it comes to

the general population versus an investigator. There's a lot more eyeballs out there on the streets.

And it felt like this case with everything and we've seen so many cases where things get

held so close to the vest, a resource of the general public was not being used to help find

an answer. And then I get it can create a lot of noise and there's different, you know,

strategies depending on the investigator of how they're going to use a public if they're going

to use a public or not. But in so many cases, especially today, the information that is found

that the public comes out with because they're given enough to work with,

ends up solving so many more cases than not, then holding the information back, then just being like,

we're going to solve it based on our handful of people who hear who are investigating into the

information. Only we know. This seemed like there was a very large missed opportunity and there

could have been a lot more information maybe thrown out to the public that maybe would have

resulted in more valuable leads early on. I don't know. I mean, that seems to be true in a lot of

cases. What's your thoughts on Adam? This one. Yeah. And also the reverse of that, you know, not

just getting leads in for more information again, because again, as most of us in law enforcement

do, we don't really like second guessing what law enforcement is doing because we don't have

the full picture in their decision process. And he granted, he's as NANO as dumb as he's made

some of these things. He's got a lot more experience than I do, you know, about twice as much.

Really, I did 22 years with the FBI, but so I won't always discount everything they're doing because

there's some some thought going behind it. Who knows what the impact of it is, but to that ends,

when it's not just about the impact that that information has on the public for generating

leading leads, but also we've talked about a lot you and I about the pressure that information

then puts on the perpetrator or the people surrounding them. So, so imagine this, if NANO sat

again, just the thought experiment, who knows the difference would have made, but just a few more

nuggets of details like the door being propped open or maybe one or two others, what kind of message

that not just sends about who to look for for the public for leads, but also the perpetrator and

or their tight circle of people that might know about this. Oh my god, they actually saw that.

They paid attention to that. I didn't realize I did that. Oh my god, they're on to me. Again,

that pressure valve starts pushing on it because they think they're closing in and pops and someone leaks

and someone gives a tip. So, and so by by not again, I don't know their decision process on what to do

or not to do to kind of put that and apply that pressure publicly, but we've seen so little

for such a long time that why not try it? Why not do something more, but all that's that's how I

think and make it not just for the leads generated by the public, but also by putting pressure on

the perpetrator themselves and their very tight circle that may or may not know this, put that

pressure on their on me. I better, I, this is my only chance to save myself as it turned him in

and get the million dollars. Where do you think that's that? Because that certainly has been an

angle that we've talked about for for quite a while in this case is, is the how do you inspire

someone to come forward with information? If no one's been inspired by now, is anyone ever

going to be inspired? I think it diminishes every day over time, but what'll happen, so here's

what does happen over time. As the perpetrator of this gets more comfortable with the fact they

got away with it, their mouth starts running and they start leaking information, you know, and so

that could happen. He might get arrested for something else and so he'll start doing a jailhouse

kind of leaking, you know, about how I did this, this, this, and got away with it, so it could happen

that way. And also, but if, but if the people surrounding him don't feel the pressure that they're

getting close to them, why would they turn them in? Because they have more to lose than they

would to gain potentially. Because again, people fear jail more than if more than they want money

but the study shows anyway. Does someone like Nana seem to care about credibility? I mean, or is he

completely, is he tone deaf to it? You know, because the way that he's been acting, the statement

that he's made, he doesn't seem to be affected by the ridiculousness of some of his statements

and the criticism that comes after it. It's just kind of like, and it just brushes off his

shoulder. And I think we all know folks like that. It's, it seems to be a lot more dangerous when

you have someone who has this level of power that doesn't seem to care. But, but does credibility

matter to someone like this? Especially, you know, and I get like making forward thinking

statements about we're getting closer and bullshit like that. And they keep, you know, he said

that a thousand times, we're getting closer. Are we? Are we, I mean, are you just saying that allowed?

I mean, and is it wrong to say that, I guess, allowed in something like this? I mean, there's

people want to have hope, people want to have faith, but they also want facts and reality. And

when I, when I go to police, I kind of want facts and reality. I don't necessarily want, you know,

hope and conjecture. Yeah, I think he's more on the hope and conjecture. Credibility, it's

a, you know, I can't think of how we would even think of that. I don't think he thinks in terms

of credibility. I think he, his entire laurels, I imagine, are resting on the success of his

department. So credibility doesn't really come in to play that. And because, because he's been in

charge, I mean, also, he's got 42 years of being undoculated against public opinion. Yeah.

Hasn't bothered him for that long. So it's not going to bother him now. I mean, this, this,

just, this is just another day to him. This just, that's why you, that's why it's interesting

because people keep knocking him on going to the gym, going to basketball games,

doing and driving his sports car around, you know, because the image is putting out there is not

a good one, right? Well, he's an oculate against it because, you know, he does it every day.

He don't care. It's just another day. This is just another investigation for him. And it happens

to be that there's far more eyes on him than there ever have been. But that doesn't appear to

affect him in any way, shape or form. He doesn't care. No, we can know why because he knows the odds

of removing him from office. Yeah, when you have that kind, when, when you yield, I mean, is that,

I mean, is that something that really should be reviewed across departments, across, across

municipalities, across the country of what levers do we have in place to remove someone? Should

we get someone like this in power? And it's going to be interesting because, you know, some places,

you know, there already is leadership in there that is running and existing because this kind of

structure exists. So there's not going to be a whole lot of interest in changing that up. But

there will certainly be municipalities and jurisdictions where, where they, they're open and

they have the ability to make some change. But again, like I said in our other piece, it really

feels like these sort of considerations were not made when these sort of rules and laws were

put in place because the assumption is made that everybody is going to be really on the up and

up. And nobody's going to be in there that has some sort of a toxic personality or some sort of

narcissistic type personality. And I'm not diagnosing him. But that, that is, is incapable of seeing

their own flaws and, and just running the ship into a wall saying, there's no wall ahead. It's

like now they're clearly as he doesn't see it. He doesn't see it. He's going straight towards it.

Well, what levers can we pull? We don't have any to pull. That seems to be kind of where we're at.

Maybe we should get those in place to prevent the next nettles. It's really interesting. It's a

great question is I don't know. I have never, because you know, I know what I'm going to do after

it's going to deep dive in research, right? But I'm really curious, too, because so here you have,

he's elected official. And now if he's treated like every other elected official,

but he's in this position, that's an interesting dilemma because if you look at a politician,

like say the county supervisor, if the county supervisor there isn't elected official,

who really is the county supervisor leading? Or are they just managing? Are they managing resources,

are managing budgets? You know, they're really in a position where they're not leading. They're

managing the welfare, the structure, the infrastructure, all the things we need, water, power, all those

things. You know, that's what that that mechanisms set up for, you know, the small, you know,

local governments. But nanos, no, here's another person that's an elected position,

just like that. That's a more of a management role. Now you have someone who's actually elected

to lead hundreds of law enforcement, you know, sworn officers and protect public safety at a very

personal one-on-one level. That requires it. I would think a hugely different skill set and

different, I would think different level of accountability for their actions because it affects

many more people on a much more grander level. So you wouldn't think that the lever to remove

a town supervisor would necessarily should be the same as the ability to remove a sheriff who

is inept, corrupt or incapable of performing the function of their job, which is public safety.

Yeah. I mean, nanos, I mean, he's not striking me as someone who's like, you know,

malicely trying to do harm. Oh, he just incompetent, incompetent. You know, I mean,

exact. It's like, just go retire, just, you know, go enjoy your time, whatever. Definitely

incompetent messaging because it's messaging what it's come down to. Who knows behind the scenes,

but obviously behind the scenes, his, all his cops that sign the petition saying you're incompetent.

So it's one thing public opinion as well as internally. You got to choose.

What if he was? What if he, I mean, and I'm not saying he is, but like they, they essentially

the way it's structured right now, you could have somebody who's under doing a lot of nefarious

stuff. And there's really not a lever to get rid of them. I mean, I mean, I mean, there is the,

there's like, oh, there's the recall. Good luck with that. I mean, just good luck. I mean,

honestly, I think there's five to 10 person. I looked up, I did the research on how that would

happen. It's like five to 10% chance that that would be effective. And maybe that's a lever

where it's like maybe like the, because it's a set number. It says it has to be X amount. And

it's basically they need 120,000 signatures verified signatures. Not just let's go on a website and

click a box. Now we're talking like literally going door to door. What's your name? What's your

address? Can I see some ID? And then we got to find a way that we can actually back this up. So

they can't just go and, oh, you made up all of these. No, as I verify, as I remember it,

from the research I did, again, I'll probably get it wrong. So correct me. But it is,

it has to be 25% of those who actually can be verified that actually voted for him in the first

election or voting in the first election. You know, so they have to verify that they actually

voted in the election of him. And it has to be at least 25% of that voting population.

It's something like that. I don't know the exact stat. Yeah. But it is something where it's like,

I mean, can it be done? Yeah. I mean, in theory, I mean, I guess my microwave could also

power us to get to the moon too if it were like reprogrammed. But is it going to happen? No.

I mean, it's just, it's a feat that is almost impossible to reach with the amount of manpower

you would need to get there. And I think you'd almost need a sheriff in place that's really doing

absolutely horrible shit, not just incompetent to, I think, drive that level of turnout to sign

this thing to really, and I don't know that they have it. I know there's enough motivation here

to do it. Just being incompetent, I don't think drives that level of outrage.

So bad, the board suit. I mean, you're too bad that the boards, you know, like my town I live in here

in Virginia, you know, we have a board of supervisors and each of those board of supervisors are

elected by their districts and in our county. And I think we have like five or six of them

in my county that are on the board of supervisors for each of the districts in the county like

Nana's would cover like our sheriff. You would think that all right. So the recall won't work or

is an effective. How come the board of supervisors, you can make a simple rule like it has to be a

unanimous decision by the board of supervisors based on what the union says or based on what,

you know, that they could actually call for a vote of no confidence by the board of supervisors

to have a reelection. Now, granted, he could run again and maybe he wins. All right. But how not,

why not just trigger that if, in extreme cases, you know, and all it would do is to, and if they

could get the signatures, it doesn't remove him. It just triggers a new election. Yeah.

So easier. Yeah, I mean, I feel like maybe maybe the entry level, the point of entry should be a

little more realistic when you have a situation like this. Don't make it so like anybody can just

keep recalling back and forth. That gets to be a little monotonous and unproductive. But maybe

make it so it's not like end of the world type scenario where you need, if you need to pull this

lever, you can do it more like there's smoke and there's fire over here. We need to put it up

before it completely engulfs the whole building. We got to wait till the fire catches a majority

of the structure before we do that. Well, it's really bad right now. Why don't we do it?

We got to wait. That's the price. That's the criteria. And that's kind of where we're sitting.

Yeah. And the union's actions on this sort of ones that really kind of shifted shift in my

focus because until the union like voted unanimously, a vote and no confidence against him,

I was like, I was literally just, he was in the back of my mind. It's not the first time though.

I know. But I mean, it was one of those things I was like, I was disregarding him as just regular

noise and level level management because I'm so used to seeing it not just on this on cases

that we cover, but all over, all over. And that's why when you have, I always used to say, no

matter what job you had inside the bureau, it didn't matter. If you found a great boss,

that's who you hold on to and you never leave their side because it's because they're that rare.

And so when the analyst is totally dismissing them, but when you actually have such an outcry

internally, that's what really got my attention on this. Yeah, he needs to go.

And that's what I was surprised because when I saw the headline yesterday, I'm like, well,

I know this vote happened a while ago, one day. No, this is yes. This is like two days ago.

Like this is a brand new vote. So it's not the first time that they've gone through and done

this poll and gotten this response because you know, it's interesting because I mean,

so you put yourself in those union members shoes. This is them now saying, oh my god,

this might be our chance to finally get rid of him. And so that's what triggered it because

they see this as an opportunity to write their own ship as well. We'll see if it does anything.

Your thoughts in the comment section on sub-stack in YouTube, we will continue our conversation there.

Want more on this case and others? Then press subscribe now and don't miss a moment of true

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